tavis: good evening from los angeles. i am tavis smiley. first a discussion with rawn james junior. it is the anniversary of executive order 9981, which desegregated the military. a deep dive into the landmark decision, called "the double v." then a conversation with a time grammy nominee saxophonist dave koz. his brand of smooth jazz is on display in a new cd called "summer horns." we continue to introduce you to some of the folks who make the program possible every night. david, who has

been with me since the beginning. he runs one of our three cameras and captures every thing you see every night. i must say, it makes me feel good to see a familiar face every night behind the camera that i know will make me look my best. thanks, dave. [laughter] we have two things in common. prayingowerful, mothers. the thing that stands out about the past 10 years is when we meet every year here in the mother, over the phone or in person, we pray. she prays over you and staff and the show. i have to say, the prayers have worked. we have been here 10 wonderful years. i want to thank your director, jonathan, for having me as part of your team the past two years. it has been wonderful. tavis: congratulations.

your son just graduated law school. congratulations. who is coming up tonight? >> a conversation with rawn james and dave koz coming up right now. ♪ dr. kingis a saying had that there is always the right time to do the right thing. i just try to live my life every day by doing the right thing. we are only halfway to completely eliminating hunger, and we have a lot of work to do. walmart committed $2 billion to fighting hunger in the u.s. as we work together, we can stamp hunger out. >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. ♪

foughtafrican-americans to battle simultaneously in world war ii. the actual battles, and the battle to be treated the same as their white comrades. they called it the double v. resident truman signed executive order 9981, desegregating all branches of the u.s. military. it marked the commendation of 150 years of struggle. it is now thankfully captured in an important text by rawn james junior titled "the double v." good to have you on the program. >> thank you very much. for the book. important book. let me start with the truman issue. it is fascinating to consider that truman becomes an unlikely

hero. a fascinating phrase. it was unlikely how it happened. let's start there. >> president truman certainly would appear at first blush to be an unlikely president who would issue an order to desegregate the american military. he was raised in what he described as a violently prejudiced southern family. president truman had long been a stooge of the concerns of african-americans. astute civil rights -- to the concerns of african- americans. a great civil rights person said he was astute to this before others were. his political career in missouri was largely dependent on being responsive to african-american voters. about that. more >> >> when the president truman was a senator, he was elected pendergastthe

machine. he ran against former missouri governor loyde stark. the onlyst election -- election that mattered at that time, the democratic primary, the closest since 1822 in the state of missouri. president truman carried it by less than 5000 votes. lloyd stark was a widely known ardent segregationist. african-americans voted in kansas city and in st. louis. it is hard to think of any of them, any number that -- any of them casting their ballot for lloyd stark. his secondruman owed term as senator, without which he would not have been vice president, to black voters. tavis: it does not seem likely he came to the conclusion on his own or it was an altruistic gesture, the right thing to do. that is why i say unlikely hero. it did not happen like that. >> not all. years the result of 150

of political struggle and moral struggle. during the revolutionary war, african-americans fought in the revolutionary war and died by the thousands. they fought in an integrated military. it was not until after the revolutionary war that african- americans were expunged from the united states military because the newly formed united states of america was run largely by virginians. virginia at the time was more than 50% african-american. the prospect of training black man in large numbers in military bearing and the use of arms was anathema to the thinking of the founding fathers. tavis: how did 150 years later this become the moment truman becomes the president? how does all this perfect storm start to align? >> it begins first with world war i. during the great war, african- they would close

ranks and stand shoulder to shoulder. what african-americans did during the time, they put aside their grievances and by and large stopped much of the lobbying happening, thinking that when we fight in this war, prove our mettle, we will return home and we will have the rights that are rightfully ours. that did not happen. when african-americans returned from world war i in 1919 and, what is now known as the red summer with race riots that were really true be more race battles taking place in cities. african-american veterans being murdered and lynched well wearing their uniforms. in the wake of that, the drumbeat of world war ii coming on, all americans knew we would be entering into the war one way or another. african-americans said publicly, this time we will not set aside grievances. this time we will fight to defeat fascism abroad and racism at home.

with a phillip randall, who i think of is the first political douglassince frederick , who brought that to the attention of resident roosevelt and said, mr. president, you must desegregate the military. tavis: but we are talking about truman now. feeling between the two. >> mr. randolph brought it to roosevelt's attention and president roosevelt was not going to desegregate the military. he was a navy man. but mr. randolph stayed at it. the 1944ld war -- election, desegregating the military was the single most important issue to african- americans. it is difficult to over -- overstate how encompassing the concept of the double v was to the lives of our americans. they pageants at colleges, dances at colleges. went witheaders

walter white, executive director of the naacp, and brought that to president truman's attention, the buildup had been going on for many years. frankly, truman was simply more concerned about the plight of african-americans than president roosevelt. tavis: there have been so many comparisons to president obama and fdr. be mind boggling for some who really do not know the history to consider, when we think of how liberal fdr was, that this was something he would not do. something he did not do. tell me more about this. >> resident roosevelt was very concerned about maintaining the new deal. the legislation he had passed. without southern democrats -- , due tomocrats seniority rules in the senate, controlled the senate. he believed that if he began to push meaningfully for any civil rights legislation he would lose the backing of the southern

senators and his new deal legislation would crumble. that was his primary concern is president. tavis: fascinating. that he would not do it. for all he did do. as great a president as he was, he did not do this. >> he could've issued an executive order. it was philip randolph who asked him to issue an executive order. saying you you could do this without congress' approval. it was mr. randolph who predicted that when it does happen it will not be through congress. it will happen through a presidential executive order. that is what happened with president truman. tois: if there is a thesis the text, it is that the modern- day civil rights movement we think of, the movement we know as the movement for freedom in this country, really has its beginnings not in the king era. not even so much with emmett

till or rosa parks, with respect to all of them. that this movement really begins with the desegregation of the military. >> absolutely right. what we call the civil rights movement began with the struggle to desegregate america's military. this is the primary reason. military segregation was the first issue since slavery that united all african-americans. whether an individual was a harvard medical school graduate or a sharecropper with a fourth- grade education, he was drafted into the same partially segregated military. there was no way of saying it was a southern problem, a northern problem, or i live in new york so this does not bother me as much. this united all african- americans. tavis: earlier this week we saw the, depending on what perspective one has, the supreme punt and affirmative- action case and make the right decision on what was a bad case.

depending where you are on the clinical spectrum. in any event, we do not have a decision as of this moment. i'm sure we will in the coming months and years. they want to know the case. this week we got past that moments of thinking affirmative- action might be by gone. i raise that only because the military has been giving credit -- given credit for being so far ahead of the rest of the country when it comes to giving opportunities, equal opportunity for african-americans. if that is the case, and i'm not naïve asking this question, if that is the case i do believe -- why is it that the only black person's name we know the military is colin powell? >> there are others. tavis: but for a military given that much credit leading the country on the issue of desegregation and leading on the issue of race, for being a more level playing field, why are there not more colin powells?

>> i think there are. i certainly know there are other flag officers and senior executive service members on tme civilian side. i think you raise a very good question on why there is -- during the last major affirmative-action case before militaryme court, the had dozens of retired generals admirals of all races sign onto the military briefing. it is believed to to be the most successful amicus brief in the history of the supreme court. they argued forcefully for maintaining affirmative-action. that it is necessary for a number of military reasons that they put forth. the brief came as a surprise to many. again, you think of african- american military, colin powell, name someone --

else, and there is often a positive. he military is beginning to do a , particularly with gender. tavis: this is about the double to african-tes americans. tell me about the issue of gender and how it is playing out in the military. of late with all these cases the president has had to speak to, the defense secretary has had to speak to come about i do not want to say maltreatment, but the risk -- disrespect of women. >> i am a civilian trial attorney for the u.s. navy, so i am speaking only on my own. i have to be careful on -- about what i say. there are bills pending in congress and talk of increasing women to all combat roles, including special forces. you have congressmen and women saying on the record that if we allow servicewomen to do everything servicemen can do, that will cut back on some of this violence we are seeing and

some of this unacceptable behavior. that is exactly truman's point in the oval office meeting with his advisers and meeting with mr. randolph and mr. white, saying, we have to do something to not address each one of these cases of violence against african-americans -- we need to do something prospectively to give everybody an equal playing field. tavis: what is the lasting legacy of these soldiers, highlighted by what truman got to doing, that we need to appreciate today? >> the word that comes to mind is discipline. an extraordinary amount of discipline that it took. is synonymous with military service, but when you spokebout the anger he openly at the white house when he was awarded the medal of honor, the anger he had to live with that he was fighting for his country and being denied a glass of water at the red cross. cross for the colored is a mile down. to work with that angle and

still do his duty is an extraordinary testimony to those men. tavis: the book is called "the trumanv, how harry desegregated america's military." you want to add this to your collection, as i have. >> thank you very much. tavis: coming up, a conversation with musician dave koz. stay with us. nominee daveammy koz's latest cd brings together his most illustrious musical colleagues to re-create classic songs from the 60's and 70's. it features their take on fans like sly and the family stone, earth, wind, and fire, blood, sweat, and tears, and chicago. take a look at a cut, the beatles' "got to get you into my

life." ♪ ♪ tavis: if you grew up in the hood like i did, when you hear that you think earth, wind, and fire. say how brilliant lennon and mccartney were. when you hear it in my neighborhood you think earth, wind, and fire. >> first of all, you know i love you. tavis: i love you back, and there is nothing you can do about it.

>> great to see you. thank you for letting me talk about this project. i had it in my head for so many years. a matter of timing am a when we could do it. now seemed to be the right time. all the songs, whether it is that -- there are so many that are so attached to these bands who represent the golden era of music. every song you heard on the air had this kicking porn section -- horn section. tower ofd and fire, power, chicago, sly and the family stone. this is for a young horn player growing up, what i wanted to hear. why i became a musician. tavis: what was it about the 1970's and 1980's that made it such a fertile time for horn sections? >> a lot more time -- fellowship

and musicianship. nowadays, not to say that does not happen, but music is made a lot almost in a laboratory where you have one guy working in once uto to send a file to another to another guy in some other part of the world to send it back. , nothing musicianship wrong with that, in fact great music is made that way, but bands like chicago and earth wind and fire, tower of power, these bands played together nonstop. if they were not in the studio they were doing 250 shows a year. that kind of just being in that proximity with each other and knowing each other and knowing exactly what the horn section, i play theg, the way saxophone versus had gerald albright on this album plays the saxophone. playing together, we have to come up with a bland. -- playou will pay differently, but how do you know this will be something you want to hear when you get everyone on sax -- how do you know it will

work? >> you bring up a good point. we did not know. the first day in the studio was produced by a guy named paul brown, legendary jazz producer. we got in the studio the first andand looked at each other said, let's pray this works. we agreed to do a tour which we are run now. we agreed to do an album. the first track we worked on was a tower of power classic. we all put our horns up and hit record. tavis: go ahead and do it. ♪ great horn section parts on this album by the guys who did the originals. greg adams, the principal horn arranger for tower of power. tom scott, who did the arrangements for everybody from michael jackson to paul mccartney. go on and on. all the steely dan stuff. we had the greatest arrangers

doing the arrangements. when we put our horns to our mouths, we looked at each other and said, i think this is going to work. [laughter] tavis: you know i am a music lover. because there are so many great many greatns on so hits -- you could do earth wind and fire and have a great album of solos. there are some great vocals on here. michael mcdonald. jeffrey osborne. >> jonathan butler singing on that. tavis: not just the horns. >> i have a story to tell you about michael mcdonald. i love michael mcdonald stories. >> so very hard to go, tower of power song. i called him up. you are coming on the cruise, right? tavis: i'm going on the cruise. >> we will talk about that later. [laughter] mike, i want to talk you you

about this album we are making. he told me the story that he was -- i told him about the song and, this is not a joke, he said i was shopping at home depot two weeks ago. the image of michael mcdonald shopping at home depot kind of cracks me up. ok -- tommy the story. this song, the original from tower of power came on the loudspeaker and it -- he was that whatever i'll he was in, the paint or whatever. great song, someone should cover that song. call: and you happened to him and asking to cover the song. >> >> two weeks later. and i'm taking this as a sign from god i need to do this project. he turned in one of the great michael mcdonald vocals. cruise.ell me about the >> this will be our eighth annual. it starts in rome, september 22 through the 29th. it starts in rome and we are

freezing the mediterranean to sicily and then we go to athens and mykonos. tavis: what are the dates again? >> september 22 to september 29. tavis: i will be gone. find somebody else to do the show for a week. i will be on a ship hanging out with dave koz. >> it is like nothing else. i want to share it with you. it is like you are marinating in music. music is going on in every ship -- corner of the ship. we have michael mcdonald, kirk weiland, gerald albright, peter white, brian culbertson. we have 40 headline artists. larry graham. graham central station. it goes on and on. and incredible ports of call. there are no strangers on the ship. tavis: time goes too fast. we are out of time. you cannot come on and not pay me out with something. let me say goodbye.

>> i want to quiz you. tell me if you can recognize. ♪ [singing along] different one. ♪ [singing along] ♪ [laughter] tavis: i got it. one more? >> let's see. ♪ got it. [laughter] you did not stump me.

>> you are an encyclopedia. to hear allant these dave koz and more, the new project from dave koz -- the new project from dave koz is called summer horns. catch them sometime this summer. if you are on the cruise you may very well see me. i may come sing with you. >> you said that on television. invite myselfust on stage? >> yes you did. we will give you your own show. tavis: dave, i love you man. have a good night. thanks for watching. as always, keep the faith. onfor more information today's show, visit tavis smiley at pbs.org. join me next time with a conversation about the war on drugs being fought with the wrong weapons.

. we will see you then. saying dr. king has. he said there is always the right time to do the right thing. i just try to live my life every day by doing the right thing. we know we are only about halfway to completely eliminate hunger, and we have a lot of work to do. walmart committed $2 billion to fighting hunger in the u.s. as we work together, we can stamp hunger out. >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. >>

it's been a week of historic rulings by the u.s. supreme court. major victories for gay rights advocates with the striking down of the defense of marriage act. as well as california's ban on same-sex marriage. plus roominulings on affirmativ action and the voting rights act raised questions. president obama calls for sweeping action on climate change with mandatory restrictions on greenhouse gas emissions. >> i don't have much patience for anyone who denies that this challenge is real. we don't have time for a meeting of the flat earth society. >> and bay area commuters brace for transit