tavis: good evening. from los angeles, i am tavis smiley. tonight, conversation with wendell pierce. he is currently costarring in the new nbc comedy series "the michael j. fox show" and is reprising his role as antoine batiste on the emmy-winning "tremé." he returns to hbo this sunday for his final five episodes. a conversation with wendell pierce coming up right now. ♪ ♪

>> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. tavis: wendell pierce, a successful career means taking on a wide array -- wide array of diverse characters. he is on "the michael j. fox show." essedays a ratings-obs producer. he also plays in "tremé." it's final season on hbo.

before we start our conversation, a look at a scene from "tremé." >> i love it when dan comes in on the vocals. they used to do that a lot in the old days. it always cracked me up. >> call and response? >> yeah, that's right. the guys in back go, we love all. ♪ ♪ [laughter] says: i said a moment ago, it ain't so, but as it turns out, this has been a pretty good run for a series that come if you looked at it on paper a few years ago, given the katrina

evenue, it might not have gotten off the ground, let alone lasted this long. >> it is one of those things that you realize that come in a disaster, the greatest thing that you have is the will of the people. a lot of times, people saw katrina is just an event that dealt with not people's hearts but social issues and the politics of the time. the thing that we wanted to tap for was the culture, that one thing, the thing that was so clear, in spite of everything, the will of the people was going to be what brought it back. it was going to be brought back 12 at a time -- back in 12 at a time. people, as albert murray said in all of his great novels and books. that is what we wanted to do. to have the four years that we have had on hbo has been pretty

wonderful. now we leave a cultural document that kind of marks this period of time to say, this is how we survived to this, and this is what is of value to us. that is the role of art, the forum where we reflect on who we are as a people, as a community and decide what our values are. that is why we try to leave his cultural document for the people of new orleans. tavis: what do you expect folks are going to read when they read his cultural document that is "tremé" down the road? corruption,pite of in spite of violence, crime, that there is something of greater value that you have to fight, with all of your spirit and effort, to maintain. a lot of people wanted to give up on new orleans, to let it go. they didn't see the value of it. how many times have we heard, why are you guys living on their? you would never say that about new york. unfortunately, you were to

later, it was hit by sandy, and everybody realized -- nobody called into question whether we should bring back the jersey shore or new york city or staten island. this cultural document is saying that we are of value, that we have importance, and that what you bring together as a people, exercising the right of self- determination is the most important essence of surviving a disaster. tavis: i have been blessed to be a friend of yours for some years now. i have done a number of documentaries and specials about new orleans prior to katrina, since katrina. one of those documentaries, i spent some time with you. some wonderful folks were working on a project to bring back the neighborhood. i will let you tell the story. i'm curious as to what is happening with the part. >> it is like holding a tiger by its tail. we are thriving. we are back.

the neighborhood that was post- world war ii the only place where african-americans, jim crow new orleans could purchase a home then, and then in the middle of it was a golf course designed by joseph bartholomew. he couldn't play on most courses in new orleans because he was a black man. mayberry, ablack blue care -- a blue-collar place to grow up. it became an incubator of black talent. morreale, mark morreale, the national urban league president, we all came from this neighborhood. lisa jackson. it was annika binder -- an incubator of talents. if it wasn't for us, we knew people would give up on it. moses generation that has done so much to make sure that we have this wonderful neighborhood, what sweet auburn is to atlanta, that is what potter train park was in new orleans.

this generation work so hard to give us the opportunity to grow up with a great foundation. it is on us, the joshua generation, to bring it back. we reconstituted ourselves, put together our own corporation. we have a couple of dozen homes with solar and geothermal. we brought the neighborhood back. tavis: i want to ask you what a blessing it has been or how therapeutic -- you will fill in the blank -- to express your artistry in a series like "treée " that is based in your hometown. before i do that, every time i hear the story of joseph bartholomew when designing courses on which he could not play, as was the case in new orleans, i think of paul williams out in l.a. if you go to a paul williams home these days, you are all that. i was going to tell the story. i love it. it is a great story. for those who don't know the story of paul williams, whenever you fly into los angeles, that

spider at the center of the airport, the revolving restaurant, he designed a spider. he designed some of the most beautiful homes in los angeles. he designed the polo lounge, the world-famous polo lounge, to beverly hills hotel. he designed it. i was going to tell the story about how paul williams, in meetings with white people, used to have to draw. >> first of all, there was a moment where they were considering, is he african- american? [laughter] is he a brother or not? while they would consider that, he always knew he had this very brief window to do his work. he would draw and design upside down so they would have the perspective before they could say, wait a minute, you were a black man. get out. as anld show his ability architect and designer before they even had any chance to kick them out. i think that is amazing. tavis: you are a bad man, sitting across the table with white folk, and drawn upside down to show them your brilliance. they didn't want to sit that close to him anyways. >> that just points to the

resilience of the human spirit, that in the most difficult of times, we rise to a certain level of resilience and brilliance that we find in ourselves to fight those battles, those confrontations, that seemlenges insurmountable lead times. that is a legacy that was passed on to us from a generation that shed blood on the ballot box, that made sure we would have access to green space. because came about black folks could only use parks on wednesdays. it was a battle to make sure we had access to green space. that is how this neighborhood came up out -- came about. you can think of paul williams, joseph bartholomew, men and women who fought that battle. it would be a sin for me not to step up to the plate in new orleans darkest hour into say,

we will not let our parent's generation down. just: you stepped up not as an advocate, but you stepped up as an artist, which takes me back to my question as to how out ofte you feel that this tragedy comes this kind of artistic expression called "tremé." i will get to "the michael j. fox show" in a moment. out of this tragedy comes as opportunity for you to express yourself in "tremé." how fortunate do you feel in that regard? >> it is one of the greatest blessings of my life. first of all, on a personal note, my mother passed away right before the final season. to know that i was home for the past four years to spend time ish her in her final years cherished time that i will forever be grateful for. - what "treméwhat - " is a true representation of

the meaning of art. we have lost the sense of art as a society. when you lie awake at night and say, what kind of man am i, where have i gone, where do i hope to go, what are my strengths, what are my inadequacies, those reflections you have is a personal individual is reflected in the form of art for the community as a whole. that is why the greeks came together. even though they knew the stories at the beginning, they knew there was a moral lesson they had to learn over and over again to kind of declare their values. that is what the form of art is. what is important to us? where have we failed? where do we hope to go? where do we want to be as a society? that forum of art serves that purpose for the collective, for the whole. that is what "tremé" has done. on sunday nights, for the people of new orleans who have gone to that experience, to sit back and reflect on where they are going, what they have gone through, the

tragedy that they have experienced, how they are going to get through it, and the best way to bring to a better place, a positive experience -- that is the role of art. you saw when woody guthrie sing about, this land is your land, this land is my land, and the great depression. ann ronald reagan saying, actor being able to tap into the communicative spirit of the community and lead them towards his agenda, you know? werel remember where we when we heard a pop sing, do you know what it means to miss new orleans, right back to the flood of katrina. that emotive form of art serves the community like those and thoughtsments

that influence individual. that is what "tremé" has done for new orleans. at this time, this is who we are. this is how we were resilient and how we got through it. let this be a lesson for all of those who will come after us. this is our answer to that question, what did you do in new orleans' darkest hour? this is our response to neglect, corruption, violence. our response is the beauty of our music, the resilience of our spirit, the creativity of our cuisine, and that is the humanity in it. that is what i'm proudest of about "tremé." tavis: you said a number of things i want to go back and ask extrapolate for me, but there is one thing in particular that you said i want to go back to. i resonate with at for obvious reasons. you talked about lying in bed at

night with these wanderings -- wonderings. thathat you wrestle with expresses itself ultimately in your artistic choices are your own inadequacies as a man, inadequacies as a black man. that hit me profoundly. any one of us who is being authentic, being honest with ourselves, no matter what color or gender we are, if we are being honest, wasn't socrates who said that the unexamined life is not worth living? if you are living a life worth living, you've got to examine yourself. you got to wrestle with those inadequacies. as to how a black man -- i wonder how you wrestle with it -- i have my own answer -- as one black man, how do you wrestle with those inadequacies in this world, in this business, and come up with answers that allow you to address those

inadequacies in a way that allows you to pursue your craft? does that make sense? thingst of all, the one that i always come back to is, to thine own self be true. there will be choices i make in may turn people within my own community away. why did you do that? for instance, i have a movie out that i was nominated for, and independent spirit award. this man is living a clandestine life. he is gay. he has aseted, but family. people come up to me and say, why did you do that? i go out with this young kid i meet on the internet. he is a teenager. is ad, because that manlicted, awful, troubled

who was destroying lives in his wake. we have to be aware of that. they are not some just outward monster. it happens everyday. there has to be that examination. it is a troubling and disturbing role. people say, why would he do that? i say, the role of the actor is not to entertain. it is a byproduct of acting. it is the examination of human humanor, even abhorrent behavior. we have to know about that so we won't fall victim to it ourselves. choices and deal with your own inadequacies is about trying to find truth and be as authentic as possible. the study of about human behavior. it is something that is going to be of value in that study of

human behavior, or is it just sensationalized an arbitrary? i wouldn't have done that role if it were just arbitrary, if it were sensationalized, a pedophile. this was something that was on a slippery slope, you know, that some people may not even realize that they are actually a part of something important -- ab horrent. is barometer for me approaching roles like a psychologist. it is the closest thing to being an actor, trying to understand the psychological impact of why people behave a certain way, and the impact it has on others. when they come together in a particular journey of story, what enlightenment will that bring to all of us as we reflect on that? the only reason you go to the theater, tavis, and turned on the lights is to see some emulation of our own experience, to learn from it.

for everyone in that room, to have some connection with it. it is not just the entertainment. the entertainment is the byproduct. greeks, back to the they knew the story going into it. he is going to kill his brother and sleep with his mother. what can we learn from this journey he is about to take that we don't want to forget that gives a foundation to our value system? with that approach, you have to say, as a black man, what is of value to me? what is of impact to the community that i want to change and be impactful towards? what is my contribution to this dynamic? that is the one thing i control. my contribution to a dysfunctional dynamic or paradigm is the one thing that i control. don't think i'm detached from the violence that some young men in our community are part of.

what is going to be my contribution to that? how will i change that? how will i impact it and bring ofue to it instead contributing to the dysfunction of their lives? tavis: as always, when we have these conversations, the stuff you say opens up so many other doors i want to go into. i recognize that art is subjective. there is no necessarily right or wrong answer to the question i now want to ask based on what you just said. i recognize that every actor has to make his or her own choices. that,lked about the fact obviously, those of us who are your fans get a chance to critique your work once it is done, and that oftentimes put you in a situation where you have to explain your work, why you made certain choices. the question i want to ask is whether or not the audience itself, your fan base, ever factors into the decisions that

you make on the front side. it is one thing to explain on the backside. do they impact decisions on the front side? i love harry lennox print i adore harry lennox. everybody loves the butler. it has made tons of money. some have called it "historical porn." i respect kerry's point of view on everything. you've got people celebrating on the one hand, but a great, saystted person like harry "it is historical porn." i'm try to get a sense of whether the audience or how the work might be this -- might be perceived on the front side. -- i willy time is that ar it as a variable multitude of people are going to see it. fox" andmichael j

doing a one camera comedy, the total opposite of what i was doing before for the past 10 but one of the things was that it was broadcast television, that so many people are going to see me on "the michael j. fox show" than those who saw me on "the wire" or "tremé." i think the true barometer is the truth of the work and your greatesthip -- the relationship you're going to have is your relationship with the work. you must consider the fact that years from now you will be able to look back and look at a body of work, and you want to be able to look back at that with pride and say, those are great choices print i know what i did that. 80 people enjoy me and my appreciation of that -- maybe people enjoy me and my role. that happened with "the wire." i meet more people today that watch the -- that watch "the wire" than there were when we

were on the air. i consider the audience and my families as friends who i would hope understand the choices that i make. i try to make them more authentically, and maybe they will come for the ride. tavis: how fun is it then to do a show like "the michael j. fox show" where you are playing his boss? you have done "the wire." it is a radical departure. >> i always wanted to be a journeyman actor. that is the reason i went to juilliard. i wanted to be able to do comedy and drama. classical and contemporary. i like to do film and theater. on thatmyself diversity, of being a journeyman actor. edwards, youmes know, roscoe lee brown, ossie davis, they did everything. those are the men that i saw as

a young kid who was thinking about acting. if i become an actor, that is who i want to be. they did everything. james earl jones. i've seen them in a multitude of things. al freeman junior, really journeyman actors -- journeymen actors. i remember all the different plays that they have done. did the -- jones godfrey cambridge. i think of men like that. i kind of base my career on being the journeyman actor, as being as diverse as possible. to go from "the wire" to "tremé" "the michael j. fox show to --

to "the michael j. fox show," all while still producing -- we won a tony -- it is that diversity a pride myself on. tavis: how does comedy tester chops? >> comedy tests your chops, especially in children when you are doing comedy on stage, it's great. you have the audience to read they are like another actor in the scene. you feed off of them. quiet,, when everyone is it is all about timing. the key to that is to be authentic. once again, be in the moment. if you play the moment truthfully, the humor will be there. tavis: i've got 45 seconds. speaking of plain truthfully, everybody knows michael j fox's condition. how has that pictured -- factored into the storyline? >> just like his life. it doesn't take over his entire life. it is just a part of his life. as he says, everybody has their

bag of hammers they have to deal with. that just happens to be his. he is still a family man. he is still a craftsman. that shows his entire life. we try to show the humor and fun in his whole life, not just that one aspect. -- i can'tell pierce say that on tv -- he never left. from "the wire" to "tremé" and to "the michael j. fox show," he plays michael j fox's boss on network television. happy to have you on this program. >> i'm honored. tavis: your conversations are so inspiring. that is our show for tonight. thanks for joining us. as always, keep the faith. >> for more information on today's show, visit tavis smiley at pbs.org. tavis: hi, i'm tavis smiley. join me next time for a conversation with chris bodie and booker t jones .

that is next time. we will see you then. ♪ ♪ >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. >> be more. pbs.

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