from washington, the mclaughlin group, the american original. for over three decades, the sharpest minds, best sources, hardest talk. issue one. old europe still with us. >> standing together and using our freedom to improve the lives of not only our citizens but people around the world is what makes france not only america's oldest ally but also one of our closest allies. >> france and the united states are two countries which, due to their history, their place in history, but also do to their seat as permanent numbers of the u.n. security councils, can act on security throughout the

world for freedom, democracy, the rule of law. >> president obama hosted french president francois hollande this week. the two leaders stressed the vital points of the franco- american relationship. what are they? one, iran. both france and the u.s. are vigorously pushing iran to limit its nuclear program. >> we agree that next week's talks will be an opportunity for iran to show it's serious about a -- that it's nuclear program is for peaceful purposes only. >> two. syria. president hollande was the most vocal supporter of the president's plan to strike with aircraft launch missiles to destroy the al-assad's regime's chemical weapons stockpile. but it worried the u.s. congress, including the brits, who backed away from it. but hollande supported the

strategy. three. africa. french troops are on the ground in countries like mali and the central african republic, fighting islamists and backed by u.s. intelligence and airlift support. four. trade ties. as part of the eu, the european union, france is negotiating with the u.s. on a trans- atlantic trade deal. if this deal would come to fruition, it would establish the largest free trade zone in the world, as the president of the european commission tells us, calling it a, quote/unquote, game changer. while he was in town, he visited monticello, home of the u.s.'s third president and author of the declaration of independence, the multitalented thomas jefferson. and on tuesday night, president

hollande received the treatment royal. he was without his longtime partner and without his latest squeeze, the french actress. >> question. what is driving this between president's hollande and obama? >> both of them want a deal in foreign policy. obama, because he's pretty much blocked here in d.c. but hollande, he's about 20% popularity. unemployment is over 10% in france. he's really losing the battle against germany for preeminence. but for more than that, john, the european union is in very serious trouble. this may, they're going to have parliamentary elections and these populist sovereignty parties, the front, marine front in france, the party in holland, they're going to have a sweeping victory and a very dramatic effect because they want to destroy the european union. the whole institution is very

much in shape. you've got the north-south battle. they're tired of bailing folks out. in england, they've not only got the independence party, in september, they got a vote in scotland where they want to get out of great britain. what's happening, tribalism, if you will, is touching over transnationalism in the continent of europe. >> in england, they don't like the eu currency. they want their own currency. >> the rise of the right in france has more to do with the lack of jobs and the sluggish economy than it does with the drive to dismantle the eu. and while he was here, president hollande visited silicon valley, trying to get some ideas and trying to recruit some businesses, because his 75% tax on the wealthy has back fired. and i think he's trying to rethink some of his economic policies. he's at 19% popularity, which is pretty pathetic.

but the president appreciates him and in part, the french press is portraying this visit and this elaborate state dinner as a consolation prize for not going ahead with missile strikes in syria, because hollande had said he would do that, and he didn't seek permission from his parliament. and then the president backed away from it. and it was an embarrassing moment for the french president. but these two leaders are clinging to each other, in part, because they're both going through hard times. and they need each other. and obama appreciates the muscular approach that hollande has towards foreign policy. >> do you think this between hollande and obama is partially motivated by the fact that his relationships, our relationships with germany, are strained due to a number of reasons, including the listing on the telephone of what the head of germany was saying? >> entirely possible, john. however, i think really what's

happening here is not necessarily a long-term change. i think that ideologically, the obama administration is pretty close to hollande. hollande is a social democrat. obama is a social democrat. they both like foreign policy that has teeth to it, and going after islamists. so the two have kind of come together on this, and the timing was right for hollande to come now, because he's trying to escape this domestic scandal where he had an affair and it's blown up in his face in france. and coming to the united states, the french public, regardless of their own domestic political situation, obama is pretty popular there, because if you want to make references back to old europe and donald rumsfeld complaining about how france and germany would not support american military adventurism, obama has ended that.

obama in the last five years got the united states out of iraq. the french are happy about that. so it's a safe bet for hollande to come to washington and be seen as close to this intellectual groundbreaking forward-thinking american president. the extent to which it trumps germany's relationship with the united states, i don't think so. >> was merkel annoyed, vexed at the unfortunate adjective that she used to describe the european union? >> i think that was not well received by merkel, to put it mildly, because obviously she is, as you say, the leader of that whole constituency in europe. so i don't think she was very happy about that. i also don't think she's very happy about the obama administration and she has not been for quite a while, whereas hollande, who has unique

problems in france, this was a perfect escape for him. it's, as you say, the kind of public reaction that he got, both here and in europe and in france in particular, helped him. >> do you recall what the attitude towards france was on the outskirts of our move towards iraq? we described -- we wouldn't use the word french fries, would we? >> freedom fries. it was contemptuous. she was very hostile to him. >> according to a gallop poll, 78% view france favorably. >> let's not forget, america's top diplomat in john kerry, one of the few languages he speaks fluently is french. he's always seen out and about speaking french. we may not see that very much in the united states, and it

doesn't play well domestically here, but the french love that. to speak the french language to the french is a sign of respect. i think there's an intellectual elite in washington that also loves that and thinks, here we are showing the french that we're sophisticated. >> is that complimentary to the elite in washington? the striped suit set? >> same thing. >> as a presidential candidate, kerry was marked for being able to speak french. >> he shouldn't have gone -- >> americans had to be reminded that the french stood with us in our revolution against the british. stalwart friends. >> have you seen how kerry has gone east now, in several countries? is he trying to stay away from that situation? >> he's trying to stay away from any situation. >> the israeli-palestinian -- >> you're a big fan? >> i will say he is taking tremendous risks, trying to do

an awful lot. there's a really potential for a lot of it to blow up. but there's a possibility some of it could succeed. >> he has enormous energy. >> you agree with him, to negotiate now on the arab- israeli problem? >> absolutely. i supported him the first time he ran. but i will say, the guy's got enormous energy, very smart, very committed. i don't know that i'm going to agree with all of his policies but i do agree with the efforts he's putting in. >> don't forget, the mclaughlin group has its own website and you can watch this program or earlier programs on the web at any time, from anywhere from the world, at mclaughlin.com. issue two. death row. the governor of washington state, jay inslee, announced this week that he is suspending all executions in his state as long as he, inslee, remains in office. currently there are nine

prisoners in washington state who are on death row. they will not go free. but they will not be executed. at least as long as governor inslee, a first-term governor, is in office. in making his decision, the governor cited problems. the capital punishment system, including the inconsistency as to how it is applied. he pointed out that washington's state capital punishment system was put in place in 1981, 32 years ago. since then, more than one half of the state's 32 imposed death sentences have been overturned. governor inslee says this. quote, when the ultimate decision is death, there is too much at stake to accept an inperfect system, unquote. the governor's action does not sit well with everyone, including jay rodney, the ranking republican on washington state's house judiciary committee, who

disagrees with the governor. quote, i think this is cruel to families of victims. justice should not be basically put on hiatus, unquote. governor inslee now joins other governors who have issued stays of execution. the number of executions overall has also dropped in the u.s. by 60% nationwide, since highs in the 1990's. nevertheless, a majority of viewer states, 32, do have capital. ment. as compared to 18 states where it is outlawed. question. if governor inslee feels so negatively about capital. punishment -- >> it's a lot easier to order a reprieve than it is to go through the mechanics of passing a law.

this notion was begun by a republican governor in 2000, george ryan in illinois. most of them are just issuing these reprieves. and maryland did change their law, so it can be done. seems to me that people are really waking up to the fact that, one, there are too many mistakes made, and that's been documented. it's incredibly expensive to have the capital punishment because you go through years and years of appeals and you might as well just incarcerate people. it's a lot cheaper. and i think there's really a moral basis to this. people are sickened by what they see as a barbaric act. and the fact that some of the medications they use haven't worked properly, have really added to the public's discomfort with this. so i think the trend is definitely to do away with capital punishment. >> shouldn't the only criterion be, in cases of capital punishment or the kind of

punishment that's inflicted on the field of war, be your own security? and it has to be free of what can be interpreted to be reprisal against the criminal? >> it's such an interesting issue, john, because capital punishment here is politicized at this level where the governor can get a bump with his liberal base by saying we won't do this. but it's not used, in a political sense, as if we're going to show that an execution of somebody is to deter people from using crimes. if you look around the world, the united states has done a relatively tiny number of executions compared to some of our adversaries. there were more than 300 in china in the last year. in iran, there's some sources that say there were more than 600 executions. and these are executions that are public hangings of people. >> i don't think we look to

those countries for -- >> we don't look to those countries -- >> for advice. >> i think eleanor made a good point about the expense of going through this appeals process, which has now been exacerbated by science and dna testing, which shows that -- >> but you leave it to the individual states. i agree with eleanor. you ought to be absolutely sure you've got the right person. but john, to your point, do you think the people that we captured, the nazis we put on trial for neurburg, what is the proper punishment there? and why is the godfather the safest man in the yard in prison? of course, it is a deterrent. some cases -- holder is going after this fellow that did the boston marathon bombing. what is the right punishment for a guy who blows people apart, little children?

>> it's in the constitution. excessive bail shall not be required nor cruel and unusual punishment inflicted. when you take someone's life, that's -- >> why do you say it's cruel and unusual when they have the death penalty in every state, when the constitution was ratified? >> unusual means you're taking a person's life? >> i mean, look -- >> we've evolved. >> it's not altogether rare. texas has it. >> i'm attacking the premise that the state can do it in any instance. >> well, why don't you protect innocent human life? how do you punish people that take innocent human life? >> jail 'em. >> and so the victims pay for this guy's room, board, medication? >> that's right. >> for the rest of his life? the victim of the crime? >> that's a curious way of putting it. >> it's a truthful way of putting it. >> i get the feeling pat

supports capital punishment. >> in some cases. look, i saw two guys executed in missouri. and neither of them was -- the crimes they committed, they deserved it. >> well, individual feelings about individual cases are certainly understood. and i have great sympathy with the victims of these crimes. but as a state policy, i just don't think that we're moving in the direction of expanding capital punishment. >> i think it ought to be rare and you ought to be sure. but you've gotta have it. >> we're putting him right down to the level of the criminal, are we not? no question about it. >> ha ha! >> and here's what's behind it. political chief executives at all levels of government are likely to emulate obama's strategy of governing without the city council. they will be emboldened to stretch executive authority to its limits. and the governor was doing it too, in this instance.

>> obama is watching drone strikes and killing people. >> yes, he is. >> and they're not in the field of battle, are they? he was just going along in the car. >> i'm only analogizing one element. >> well, loki -- >> i think in that case, i agree with obama. >> even though we didn't have a court that decided he was guilty, and -- >> i will say this. you should know for sure. >> you're also skirting around, putting the facts where you want them. >> you're stating a lot of different issues. >> we always be sure, because then you'll be dead. >> we were in wartime at yemen, war and terror. >> you know what the countries of the world feel about abolishing capital punishment? 140. the retentionists, those who want to keep it, 58. so the number of countries that want to -- >> you got the u.n. that's gonna decide what we hear in the united states? >> i didn't say the u.n. the

catalog of the countries, the number of countries that want to abolish. think about it some more, pat. issue three. >> this we believe will be a historic lawsuit. we think it may well be the largest class action lawsuit ever filed on behalf of the bill of rights. >> republican seminar rand paul served up president obama a valentine's day present this week, mainly papers naming mr. obama and the national security agency or nsa as codefendants in a lawsuit. the class action lawsuit, which is being litigated by former virginia attorney general ken, seeks to expunge the phone records and data collected by the nsa's domestic surveillance program on some 386,000 plaintiffs. question. the essence of rand paul's lawsuit holds that the nsa

searches violate the u.s. constitution's fourth amendment that protects against arbitrary search and seizure. i want to know whether rand paul is on solid ground. >> well, we're going to find out. i don't want to insert myself in that particular part of it. but i will say this about this. okay. there are situations, it seems to me, where this is valid. if we are to believe people who really know about this, they said we stopped a number of major terrorist attacks against the united states as a result of the information we gleaned from all of this, shall we say, eavesdropping. i believe that. i think the consequences for this country, if we had had two or three more terrorist attacks, would have been disastrous. so in one sense, i think it was to protect the united states, and i support it to that extent. >> some of his arguments make a lot of sense. his lawsuit will never reach the supreme court. it's a joke. totally partisan. he stepped all over whatever credibility it has. and guy knows a lot more about

it than i do. >> there have already been two cases, one involving verizon, the other involving the aclu, that were decided different ways. why rand paul is jumping in on this, trying to create a class action suit -- >> here's what i'll say about rand paul. he is one of the most refreshing and interesting voices in the u.s. senate right now. >> also tough. tough. >> however, a move like this, to create a class action, as a libertarian activists that he is -- he is not a political leader. >> let's eliminate all the flattery about him. issue four. washington's regulation tsunami. it's a new year. in washington, that means now federal regulation. and new federal regs means battles royale. here are the big regulatory

fights. item. obamacare birth control mandate. it's rankling religious groups. the supreme court has agreed to rule on whether contraception should be offered to workers under employer health insurance plans. item. power plant emissions. standards are due from the environmental protection agency that will limit carbon emissions from existing power plants. the coal industry, for one, is crying foul. item. e--cigarettes and e-cigars, regulations on both, courtesy of the food and drug administration. item. cell phone calls on planes. originally banned for safety reasons, but that ban may be lifted, even though the public likes the ban. polling shows that plane passengers don't want to sit and listen to loud phone calls during the flights that they take.

item. water, water, everywhere. the epa, the environmental protection agency, wants the power to regulate small bodies of water. ponds. streams. brooks. item. smog. standards to ease ozone levels are expected from the epa. item. restaurant menu item calorie counts. chain restaurants and vending machines will be required to supply them. calorie counts on items. item. rear view cameras. not mirrors. cameras on cars to alert drivers to movement at the rear of their vehicles when backing up so that passer-byes won't be hit. such rearview cameras may be required on all automobiles. item. executive pay transparency. a rule that would compel companies to disclose the pay gap between ceos and average workers. question. will president obama try to

push his agenda through a massive expansion of federal regulations and federal oversight in 2014? >> i think without question he's going to do this. he's already stated this. since he doesn't seem to be able to get much through congress, he's going to do whatever he can through executive action. we have a political system that seems to be more or less paralyzed and i can understand why the president wants to do it. >> and i'm for every one of those regulations that you just cited. i suspect that there's public approval behind every one. maybe the coal industry doesn't like the fact that coal emissions should be regulated. >> the things that were brought up there were absurd. >> which ones? >> putting calories on vending machines, cameras behind cars. we can't drive cars without mirrors? >> i'd be happy to have that mirror. and i'd like to know what i'm buying. >> should the company that makes the cars require that all cars have that? that's ridiculous.

there are a couple of issues, just to finish, that were very important, such as environmental regulations on smog. and i think this is where obama will use executive powers on one or two key issues that he knows democrats want and will support. and all the power to him on the environment, i think. >> but this is usurping the authority of the democrats. it's very important, xcel pipeline, a lot of these things -- these things should be made by legislators. they should be held accountable, not by bureaucrats and judges -- >> we don't have time in the legislature to address some of these things. >> because they need to try and overturn obamacare again. >> you served two presidents, and they did plenty of regulations on their side two. >> that's the second mistake he made. >> barack obama likes this stuff. he want to have the imperial

presidency. >> he has signed fewer executive orders than any of his predecessors. >> he has become increasingly weaker. focusing on 50 attempts to overturn a health care law is -- >> they grabbed the decision on homosexuality, on abortion, on racial integration. these things should be decided by legislators. i don't think it's on the ropes. i think he's in tough shape. he's got a very tough three years coming up and i think there's a lot of things the president can do. >> predictions, pat. >> tremendous blow to the ue and these may votes for parliament. >> uaw efforts to unionize the volkswagen plant in tennessee. results of that vote will tell the story of the union fight in this country, for decades to come. >> families divided on the korean peninsula for 60 years

get to reunit for the first time in the coming week. >> the increasing weakness of the economy this year and the unpopularity of the president means that the rebublicans will gain control of the senate in the elections coming up. this frigid winter of 2014 will cause public opinion to switch dramatically against climate change. those theorists who persist in saying that the planet is being heated by carbon emissions in a doomsday scenario. happy valentine's day! love is in the air!

next on "kqed news room." president obama visits california's central valley pledging to help farmers affected by the drought. plus a look at how the endangered coho salmon are faring. >> the drought means low flows, low water levels in the creek. pedestrian fatalities on the rise. why are bay area streets so dangerous? a look back on ten years of the same-sex marriage debate in san francisco and beyond. >> and look where we are ten years from now, we could have never imagined we would be where we are now.