tavis: good evening. i'm tavis smiley. tonight, a conversation with marlo thomas. she launched her career with a groundbreaking television series and went on to become a champion of gender equality. her latest is called "it ain't over until it's over." it is never too late to reinvent yourself and realize your dreams, no matter your age. a conversation with arlo thomases going up right now. -- marlo thomas is coming up right now. ♪

>> the california endowment. learn more. > and, by contributions to pbs by viewers like you. thank you. ♪ tavis: there are so many, which meant from marlo thomas. accomplishments from marlo

thomas. she was a founding member of a foundation for women and letting kids the kids. i love what you and harry belafonte did together. sorry mr. d. -- mr. b. called "it ain't over until it's over." why this and why now? and ao around the country lot of people come to see me. they are all -- women over 40 have been laid off, lost their jobs. their husband died or got a divorce. they had a great dream to raise a family and now, they are 42 years old and their daughter has a drivers license and their son is going to college.

that dream runs out on them. there are so many reasons why women who are out of the job market have to come up with a new way to take care of themselves and their children. some of these women have hit bottom. one woman was homeless and started a company by inventing straws and party goods. she slept on friend's couches. one ran away from an abusive marriage. i had never thought about this before. the only thing she takes is her kids. another woman started a company to make close to get to their women who -- the women who run away with children. another is called come and no underwear. -- commando underwear. i will not ask you to

prove that. >> your panty line shows and it looks awful. this woman found a fabric because she could not stand it anymore. another found she was gluten intolerant. she created cookies and crackers. she thought that she would make a business out of it because she needed money. company "marie has gone crackers." she made millions. i love that these women have taken something that they have done well all their lives and made a living of it. what is great about the internet is that you do not need to have a storefront. you can create something and sell it on the internet. one woman was a graphic artist. she always want to go to med school and her father said to her, you know what, mary a dr.. -- marry a doctor.

she was 38 years old and working. she said to her college that working on this reminds her that she missed that she did not go to med school. her colleague said, you can still go. she said, by the time i go to med school, i will be 50. anyways.you will be 50 there is a great saying that i start off my book with. ruth gordon, the wonderful actress, said that -- that is my mantra. my computer.r you cannot face the facts. guys, often they do not confess these things, panty

lines are the worst. i'm glad she invented those. number two, one of my favorite raies has a line that of "what do you do when your life exceeds your dreams?" for some women, the dream runs out. i love that phrase that you use. the dream has run out. i want to turn that to a question. what do you advise to do when the dream runs out? >> look within yourself and what could be the second or third dream. the second could be something you do well, like making jewelry and selling it in a store near you. one of the women did that and sold it on etsy and ebay.

maybe it is getting together with a friend. maybe you and your sister or girlfriend can go into business and start together. maybe you may cookies, close, who knows? something. maybe you have to go and take a class and get a new skill set or become an intern. everyone would love to hire you for free. you might as well try that. the thing i like the most of all of the different areas that you learn about when you read these stories is that it is important to think big and work small. you have to take it one step at a time and think about what you need to do today. call somebody? take a loan? take a class? look into myself and say, what do i do well that i could make into a livelihood?

people do not stop to think. they see the overall picture of how they are going to do this and get scared. one woman told me that she invented something and took it to qvc. qvc turned it down. i said, qvc is the top of the mountain. come on. tavis: she wanted the best, i guess. >> taken it to the local store and build momentum. one woman created a wallet because she always lost her keys. her husband was always tooting the horn. she decided that she needed to make a little wallet to put her phone, her keys, her id, and some money with a little strap around her hand. her friend said, make me one. finally, as a business. she makes it and it is called cellfolio.

it is fabulous. this little thing lets you take everything with you. even if you put it in your purse. it is about my housekeeper. why didn't i think about that? millions of dollars with this thing. noticing what of you need and hopefully, everyone else needs it, as well. y> you are too bus thinking about the kids at saint jude. you talk about women over 40, more often than not. to your story earlier, just marry a doctor. how much of this is generational and women having there dreams being shunted? being told that they cannot do what they want to do because they are women of a particular age. >> i think it has to do with what is going on in the culture.

couldman said that she not get a job at a beauty parlor because they wanted something that someone in her 20's. something different about our mothers and us is that my mother and my aunt used to talk about how much time had gone by. "oh my god, 40 years have gone by." i have 40 more years. if i am 50 years old, i have 40 more years. if i'm 60 years old, i have 30 more years. there is plenty of time to do this and do not panic. what i am hoping the book does is, besides learning and reading about 60 women, i hope it is a map and you go through it and say, "i can take a little bit from her and her and do this." tavis: youe tavis: -- are the first to admit that for

journalism and sexism israel. -- is real. ageism ism, sexism, a reality they have to confront. >> it is a fact that they can change. another thing that women are good at -- and i will send it we are better at this than guys -- is networking. men will not ask for direction. women will tell each other when they need something and when a husband is having an affair. when the network. -- women network. get friends together and start a company. one woman ran a pr firm and was not doing so swell. they were in their 30's. , whatid to her friend can i do for you? she said, i would love a manicure and a pedicure.

ohio and she could not find anybody. she started a business called "nail taxi." she created a dispatch system and in is in 11 states. taxi."alled "nail girls and cars and miniatures. cures.agi tavis: the flip side to women talking to each other and sharing with each other is that women will take care of everybody else first and neglect themselves. >> yes. they do. when you hit your 40's, you have done that already. you have taking care of the kids and you have taken care of your husband. you are looking at your life and saying, ok, it is my turn. if i do not pay for myself -- if

i do not say for myself, it is my turn, who will? some women do not have a choice. they are single or divorced or widowed. some of them have been laid off and it is not about being a man or a woman. you are laid off and, in this economy, 20 were laid off. you have to make a living and you can do it, as i say, but taking it one step at a time. each thing. if you have a dream that you want, and you and i are both dreamers, you cannot get there by wishing it. not in the head. it is in the doing. if you do one thing for the dream that you have, in six months, you would be further along with the dream and it would be impossible not to be. an.ling people, taking a lo

getting to know somebody who can help you. in turning somewhere. going to a class. all of these things are doing. tavis: i want to get personal. you are an advocate or distinct groups -- for two distinct groups. children and women. i want to talk about the journey that you have been on that has allowed you to be a voice for both of these groups. referenced saint jude earlier and i wanted to talk about the work that you do. i would never talk you and not talk about the work at saint jude. i got a letter years ago inviting me to go to saint jude and visit. i went and it fundamentally changed my life, spending the day with the children. richard snow may be watching. he just got a job at saint jude and he was so excited that he

got the opportunity. richard snow at saint jude. he is there. how thean update on work at saint jude is coming along. i know you spent so much of your time focused on that. >> the most important thing that we do it the science. when a child comes to saint jude with the death sentence, i need fathers that tell me that they have picked funeral music for their child. the childpictures of so they have memories. we are able to save the children when others are not. it is not because they are bad hospitals. workingude's, we are with what nobody knows because we are a research center. one of the great things we have been working with in the last couple of years is the genome

map of 700 children. has 10y other place maps. we have 700 children and we are able to look at cancers and figure out why a blood cell turns into a leukemia cell. thisn study that with marker. will we have the right marker, we can create a drug. that is where it is. the genome is everything. tavis: in difficult times, like the recession, when the st. jude's experience with fundraising. >> when the bottom fell out in an electronichad board meeting on the phone, all of us, the members. we discussed cutting programs. everybody said, we cannot stop the programs. do we take much children -- less

children? what are we going to have to do? we are going to have to work harder. we've killed ourselves because we will not go back. thank god that we have 9 million constant donors and some of them are $25 a month. they are partners and help. -- in hope. family, yourour father, our longtime advocate for the children at st. jude's. frequentlyealize how you are contributing on women's issues. your iconic role on "that girl." is there something that happened that created an opportunity to become -- >> you are a good interviewer.

tavis: your husband is the best. marlo thomas is married to phil donahue. >> he is a good interviewer. link and iteresting will try to do it quickly. tavis: it is pbs, we have time. >> i was having a ball and i was receiving a tremendous amount of mail because i was the only single girl. the girls love my hair and all that. i was getting mail that said ,hings like, i am 16 years old i am pregnant, i cannot tell my father. where can i go? this is the mail i was getting. today the truth, i did not know what to do. i had no idea. i came from beverly hills and did not know anything about

girls getting pregnant and not knowing where to go. looked innt and i places for these girls and women to go. there was no place to go. that turned me in to the activist and feminist. up until then, i was a young woman who was happy to be a feminist on television and living a wonderful life. it was not until then that i realized that there are so many women who have no hope at all. of getting out of a decent marriage. terrified of being thrown out. i would get mail from gay kids. they were saying that they could not come out to their parents. i was getting a lot of mail from people who said that they had no one else to talk to. i was the youngest star on television at that time. there are some strong

endorsements on this book. it leads me to ask, given the fact that you have been gracious -- a long-distance runner in the what you make of the pace and rates of progress that women have or have not made? >> a lot has happened. the women today have a place to for safety and legal information and you do not have to be rich to get it. that is important. book and aberg has a movement for women to try to get him into their career -- get into their career. especially in the early years. when i was growing up, there were no women anchors on television and now, you cannot

turn on cable without seeing women as anchors, financial experts, diane sawyer. in my day, there were no women. i remember when my father was so proud to take his daughter to washington, d.c. was anot realize i feminist and i said, daddy, there are not any women. my father did not notice it. there were white guys with white shirts on. questionhat happened mark we had a president who is a man of color and we have people of color, gay people, in office. we should be 50% of everything. not only race. wages for all people. certainly, for women up to what men are getting paid. it is a constant struggle. you know, i do not get depressed

by it. i really do not. i think the women's movement is like democracy and you have to keep stoking it. everything is a right. tavis: does the reality scare you when you see what is happening to women's rights? >> absolutely. the spying. all of the things that are happening. we all have to be a part of the solution and pushed back. say, wait a minute. tavis: it tells the stories of about 60 women in this text. what have you learned? it occurs to me that i should ask you about what you have learned about reinventing your own life. you are still doing your thing. obviously, it ain't over. tell me about reinventing stuff. >> i really think that a lot of

people have ideas and they dream about them. reallyy difference is, i try to act on those ideas and i really do believe that i am a resource for myself. getn look forward to what i want out of life. i ask other people, if you know somebody who is part of what i want to get to, i am going to ask you. i am perfectly comfortable calling you up and saying, tavis, i want to meet this guy that you know. i will do that. i want to get to where i want to go. if you call me, i in there. tavis: i take your point and i agree. what is the difference between what you described and people acting opportunistically. thehey are not there for other side. i will hold any friend at all. difference.

if you're part of a community, my father always used to say, there are two types of people in the world. those who stop at the traffic accident to see who will help and those who drive five. if you stop at the traffic accident, you have to notice it. you have to notice when somebody is in trouble. thisave to say, i can do and loan you some money. i do that. my husband does that. i bet that you do it. people have done it for me through the years. i have made toward a lot of people. -- mentored a lot of people. tavis: as have i. a new book from marlo thomas is called "it ain't over until it's over." reinventing your life and realizing your dream at any time and any age. ives it every day.

that is our show for tonight. as always, keep the faith. captioned by the national captioning institute --www.ncicap.org-- information on the show, visit our website. >> join me next time for a conversation about food safety. that is next time. we will see you then.

>> the california endowment. health happens in neighborhoods. and, by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you.

>> welcome to "film school shorts," a showcase of the most exciting new talent from across the country. experience the future of film, next on "film school shorts." >> "film school shorts" is made possible by a grant from maurice kanbar, celebrating the vitality and power of the moving image. and by the members of kqed. >> [ man coughs ] >> woman: 10 more different tables, then uncle tim's table's like a mile away from the bar. but then they're both so far away from the bridal party. i just don't want to offend anybody, you know? [ cell phone rings, vibrates ]