tavis: good evening. from los angeles, i am tavis smiley. tonight a conversation with mel brooks. film director. . on the 40ther anniversary of the release of the film many consider to be one of the funniest ever made, "blazing saddles." a conversation with a true legend, mel brooks, coming up right now. ♪

>> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. ♪ tavis: i am laughing already. mel brooks is what the industry calls an egot. emmy, and acar, an tony. some sublime and sublimely funny films. released ondles" is its 40th anniversary.

offensive language to make its point. as the sheriff is writing to the rescue of an all-white town. >> he is not bluffing. >> he is crazy enough to do it. >> i swear i will blow this nigger's head all over this town. >> do what he said. isn't anyone going to help that poor man? >> that is a sure way to get him killed. >> help me, somebody help me. >> shut up. >> oh, baby.

you are so talented. and they are so dumb. tavis: doesn't seem like 40 years since you did that masterpiece? >> it seems like 40 minutes. it is amazing. there is no time. it is good things and bad things. good things are always around and thank god, bad things drift. tavis: i have just taken great delight in reading all of the of the misgivings, the questions you had about whether or not you could pull this off am a whether or not it was too politically incorrect, your conversation with richard pryor and as you look back on this 40 years later what do you make of the fact that you got it done? >> i could not do it today. they would not let me.

it is amazing. there was just that little window. just that little window when they let you do things that were , i call them brave but the world would call them stupid. crazy,t me do this magnificently insane movies. thee was a guy who ran movie part of warner bros.. not the whole production. i went up to his office and i said, can i actually punch a little old lady, i mean, you know. can i really make the sounds of farts around you? screeninghere was a and he was the only one who

laughed. they were all quiet. field got up and he was the distributor for them. -- and domestic distribution. he said i have never asked warner bros. to eat the movie. i want them to bury this one. i do not want to release it. it is not disgusting -- it is disgusting. 2,400,000 in those days. no.ey said let's open it in three cities and see if anybody likes it. i like it, let's see. we have a screening on wiltshire. i put a little wooden rails and they got cowboys to type their horses in the got cattle in the inby -- and i got cattle

the lobby. a lot of mud pies and a lot of pee-pee. thing to handle, i was raised in that. they showed the movie, and people ran up and down the aisles screaming with laughter. andi mean, there was the word, there was everything. at the end of the movie, the head of warner bros. at that time who shall be nameless, he grabbed me, i think it was ted daschle he -- ashley. the collarme by and he said write, no farting. no horse, you can't punch a horse. the n-word, you can see that

word. 22 notes. if i took all of that out i would have a 13 minute movie. there would be nothing left. i promised him i would do it and the minute he left, i took the page and i threw it all the way across the managers office into the waste paper basket. filing, and we never touched a thing. that movie was a big success and never stopped, it never stopped working. i saw the other night at the chinese theater on a big screen. that is the way you should see that. it is a big western, on a big screen. aople leaving their chairs am rolling on the ground. i have never seen anything, laughing. it was -- brought tears to my

eyes because they did not pay. they got it for nothing. but otherwise. tavis: for those of us who know this back story, the real hard-core fans know that cleavon little did a spectacular job but he was not the guy. >> the true story is i got a real great actor from "they ,"oot horses, don't they< really in. kind of a leathery faced, old texas kind of guy who is recovering from alcohol. he was perfect so i hire gig young. he is playing the waco kid and he is recovering from a night of drinking. he is leaning over in the jail

cell and cleveland little -- cleavon little is supposed to see are we weak and he is supposed to say, i don't know, are we black? the rehearsal was pretty good. i say action. awake and hewe and, are we -- are we -- green stuff, coming out of gig young. said, is he dead? he was ok and he was alive and we got an ambulance and took him away. i said no more reality. black or jewish comics.

no actors. no more actors. give me comics. wilder, who is a great actor, too. i told him about it and he flew out the next day. he leaned over and i said action. cleavon said, are we awake and gene said, i don't know, are we black? off and, we were running. gene wilder saved my life. >> richard pryor. there is a back story to this project. >> i begged warner bros., i wanted to be the black sheriff. i knew he was a genius and he was helping write the thing and i knew what a great actor he was. maybe the funniest stand up comedian who ever lived. i am not just saying that. tavis: a lot of comedian say that. >> he may be the funniest.

bros., if youer do not let me hire richard pryor to be the black sheriff, black bart, i am not going to do it. they said he can't. we found out he takes drugs. i quit. quit, i did, don't not get my last payment. i said ok, richard. we looked at a-- lot of different actors and every african who ever was an actor came and auditioned. richard really when we got heavon little, and cleavon, is handsome, he is black. i said what do you mean? i said i could be cuban. café au lait.

scare the west. there is no one darker or more handsome or classy. it makes me cry to think about it. i thinkere is what about what might have been. we all know that wilder and p ryor went on to do stuff together. that would have been it. >> i would have collected every penny. but anyway, it worked out because i took a good bounce in beautiful talent like cleavon little. tavis: for all the protestations of certain people at warner bros., when this thing hit the theaters, how did do? -- it do? well, not

spectacular. it came out in fury. 1975.ruary it did ok. and in the summer, the theater owners heard about it and they asked for it. only hit 30 or 40 theaters. it opened six or 700. that was a lot of theaters in those days in the summer in june. bang! it was hand over fist. i used to go to warner bros. and said who is counting, where's the money? like record numbers. tavis: who was the audience? >> mixed. and a couple of jews in the balcony. jews.aid and everybody liked it. gonna do, this ain't

well in texas. it is a pretty sophisticated kind of pro-black movie. they loved it. they believed it. n0 y time they called the -word, they said write. they went with that side of it. tavis: let's circle back to the beginning of this conversation. >> before i came out someone said do you want to go to the bathroom because you have been dragging a lot of water and i said on every show i do i wear depends. right now. that is a joke. me go back to the beginning of this conversation when you said that there was something that was happening in that moment in hollywood that allowed you, what was that?

in 1974, 1975 allowed me to make -- use those words. it's like -- thes: that was blacksploitation then. it tex-ex.d to call with a simple title, "black bart." he said no, blacksploitation. then we came up with "blazing saddles." emphasizing that you're making fun of the west. not just blacksploitation. we had to be very careful. ideank they bought the

ast there was such a thing fairness, goodness, somewhere out there there was a thing like goodness and fairness create and enough people would sign on and enjoy it. not necessarily afro-americans. every buddy. and there was. -- everybody. in that year, i won the nato award. equality andbout people you never want that award. that is the national association of theater owners. gold award. you make the most money, we love you and we give you a crown and we give you some of it. i won because i had "young

frankenstein" and "blazing saddles" in the same year and the theater owners had never been happier. i had never been happier because i had made two different crazy, brief movies and the people loved it. they went for it. tavis: was that part of your deal with gene wilder? >> he was in the corner somewhere curled up writing something on a yellow paper. i said what are you doing and he said i have an idea for a movie. i said tell me about it. he said it is not ready yet. i said tell me about it. he said well, what if the grandson of frankenstein, dr. he was fighting for his dignity. dead tissue, making monsters and all. he wants to put that straight. thato the movie would be

he has to go back to transylvania for some reason to sell the estate and he realizes, my god, it could work. he reads the note and the things that he is in the laboratory and he is infused with this feeling. my god, yes, we could actually bring this dead creature back to life. reanimate dead tissue. and so he gets -- i said, i love it. let's write it together and we did. while we were making "blazing saddles" we were writing "young frankenstein." every night. tavis: i know you had to ask, what did richard pryor say to you when you asked him about the n-word. what did he say question mark >> the great thing about richard pryor is i would say, can i use

the n-word, he he said if you must. if you have to. ok. there was not one so i asked him that he said -- ad infinitum. use it every way. richard's blessing. when they would ask me i would say blame it on richard. i would never use that. tavis: i assume what you meant earlier when you said out the gate that you could never do this movie now is that we live in an era that is too politically correct, is that what you meant? >> that is what it meant. it is a good thing and it is a bad thing. correctnesstically, restricts and restraints humor. humor has to be very crazy and very free and very liberated. and dangerous. you have to walk that line. you have to say things.

what i did the production number, i tell you, it is a preview. we are at the st. james theatre. on stage they are singing and dancing "springtime for hitler." there are 100,000 jews in the audience. he -- a guy come stomping down the aisle, where as mel brooks and he finds man grabs me. how could you do such a thing, holocaust, how could you do such a thing, i was in world war ii create and i said to him, i was there, i did not see you there. that was brave, too. jews did not think -- i must've on the i got more producers.

soapboxt get on the with hitler, he is an orator. make fun, you can beat him. i wrote letters to everyone trying to explain why i would do such a thing. get -- how did you did you get the fortitude, the thatpah, oy vey do you get -- where did you get that to advance these ideas knowing that you will catch hell on the other and? >> i came from or going. we did not know better. my mother was very brave. she came over from the other side when she was a little kid and

the only thing she asked for, my mother said, i would like to , the apartment in the front of the tenement became available and my mother said i am sick and tired of looking at cats and wet wash hanging from the lines. i would like to see the world. but the world -- by the world she meant the street in front of our house. had three older brothers, we had a family meeting. we got to let mom see the world. ce man.ld was tony the i ain't much of a world but to her it was the world. it was $16 a month rent in the back and in the front it was $18 a month. we were just little kids, nobody was really going to school. but we hustled and we ran blum,one calls, and mrs. a phone call at the drugstore

for you. here is a nickel. my aunt sadie who worked as a floor lady, she gave her salary -- half of her salary over to her. my father died and she was raising four boys. she was a same. we moved to the front and it was great. my mother could see the world in one night, this is a true story, terrible story. i have to pee. i knock on the bathroom door and bernie is there. bernie says go away, i am naked. -- making. the sink. to i am too little. i cannot even get on the chair. indow that faces the world is open, so i go back a little bit and i do an arc, i and inht out the window

a little while i hear a lot of consternation below. coming from your apartment. all these jewish lady sitting on the step, they all got peed on. i hear a rhinoceros coming up the stairs, it is my mother. i jumped into the bed and pulled the cover over my bed. bernie comes out, hi, mom. she decks him. .e never knew w have -- 65 and i told him, i peed out the window. -- tavis: i asked if he had so much

-- more time because i wanted to do this for another show. "blazing saddles" is out. will talk about this and this and a lot more stuff to talk to mel brooks about. you did not forget that point. tomorrow night, part two with mel brooks. ask for watching and is always, keep the faith. -- thanks for watching and as always, keep the faith. >> for more information on today's show, visit tavis smiley at pbs.org. tavis: hi, i'm tavis smiley. join me next time for a conversation with mel brooks on the 40th anniversary of "blazing saddles ." that is next time. we will see you then.

♪ >> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. pbs station from viewers like you. thank you.

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