for things to do. perfect time for a game night with friends. but what type of games? the understood dominance of video games would suggest siting in front of a screen. but that trend is changing. millennials are starting to turn their attention to board games. we will play with this issue, on this edition of equal time. the big question is why are board games becoming more popular with millennials? the board game trend is impacting players and the distributors of the games.

george tanner has that story. millennials are starting to transition from pushing buttons on a video game controller to to rolling dice instead. edward lehto owns ronin gamesand hobbies in castro valley. he is witnessing a rise in the popularity of board games. we do board game night every saturday night. night. i noticed there is actually a lot of 20 something couples come in and hang out and play board games. lehto says he has more board games out for sale than he did back in the 90's. the trend is affecting video game retailers as well. i defiently ring up a lot more parents or older people that are still playing games on the ps3 or on the new generations. so, this segway is happening with the new generation of kids coming in and parents buying games for their kids and buying new consoles. gamestop is selling board games as well. classical games with a nerdy twist. one example of a game in stock is the legend of zelda monopoly game.

i have actually preordered a pokemon monopoly board game and i am super excited for it. but not everyone agrees the sales numbers tell the whole story. angelica cabanlit is the president of the game dev club at san jose state university. which meets here in the library. the club aims to give students the tools to create their own digital games. cabanlit acknowledges that the video game sales are going down, while board game sales are going up. and suddenly it seems board games are cool. as much as there is an indy scene in video games there is now an indy scene in board games. so now with the indy scene of board games more people are getting involved in the development of board games." indy game developers sometimes use crowd fudinding websites to fund their games. kickstaer is one such site. the platform raised 52.1 million dollars in 2013 in investments to towards board games. that is roughly 15% more than video game developers recieved in the same period.

but video games on mobile phones are more popular than ever, according to jesse taylor go and ask someone in the mobile phones industry and they will tell you it is booming and there is tremendous growth. will the future of video games be on mobile phones? the big question is why are board games becoming more popular with millennials? and what are board games doing to combat the video game market? george tanner picks up our story. millennials are returning to board games for many possible reasons. nostalgia for me is cyclical, so that every few years there is a desire for the old. and you

can see that in fashion for example. nowadays fashion you see 80's styles, 90's styles. other game professionals feel that entertainment is constantly evolving. i think we have come almost full circle at this point where board games a novel entertainment in and of themselves. the amount of screen time millenials face for school and work is what is driving the nostalgia factor. i like to play board games because it's a great way to pass time. also for the family aspect of it. when my friend s come over i think it's a great way to have everyone socialize and have fun and get a little crazy. and now have to worry about having to switch controllers or waiting for someone to die in the game or something. we all can be apart of the game, socialize and have a great time. but the nostalgia does not necessarily mean mellennials want the same games from their childhood.

as an instructor at a university and a community college i find that students are often anticipating the next thing they are going to do, as a way to distract them from what they are doing at that on moment. a more popular type of ame is european board games. they have more options in their play than classic games players throughout the entire game. lehto argues these types of board games and involve interacting with other are borrowing from the video game model. nowadays, much like video games that keep offering downloadable content to change the game, many games offer expansion packs now expansions now to actually improve the game. lehto's store sells many european board games. some of them have expansion packs to keep them alive. even the old classics like settlers of catan is a staple game, it has been out for 40 years and it is still my number one best sellers. lehto says board games score big with players when they are customizable, have expansion packs and allow players to create house rules.

another way board games are borrowing from the video game model is by embracing darkand mature themes. betrayal on house on the hill involves exploring a haunted house. dead of winter is a zombie survival game. in termsofthe attraction to more adult themes i think there is kind of incorporation process in which more subterranian cultural genres that we can describe as adult themes get sort of integrated into the mainstream little by little. video games are borrowing from the board game model as well. i am seeing concepts from modern board games, the newest of the new board games, which are much more story driven, much more almost invent your own fiction and that is feeding back into video games as well. creating a video game doesn't always involve a computer. the game dev club at sjsu meets once a week to prototype concepts for digital games. paper is cut. pen and pencil label items and write rules on note cards.

and maps are drawn. this is done so that, first of all no one will have to code an actual map. you can just get it done in 10 seconds. it is really fast. altough board games a re enjoying a resurgence. will they ultimately win over video? board games and video games are more like a balancing act between two types of gaming. and not really one or other, right? but there is defiently this interplay. when we come back a panel of millennials and a sociologist will discuss their thoughts on the board game trend.

welcome back to what should be a fun edition of this discussion of equal time today. our focus is on game night, the video versus board games. lets meet our guests. hi, i am winston gregory. i am a third year animation/illustration fourth year radio television and film major. in my free time i like to play pc games and console gaming. hi, i am dr. steve nava i am a sociology professor here at san jose state university and i teach a media course. hi my name is angelica cabanlit. i am the president of the sjsu game dev club. hi my name is george tanner. i am the correspondent for this story. i like the idea that you all are here because you are going to help educate the host of the show. because quite frankly i only grew up in a time where there were no video games and we played board games it was fun. it was stimulating. and i think it was good for the mind. it excited the mind, critical thinking possibilities; you learn how to use money. then video games came along when i started out in the

world. now they have become the most popular thing. so, i am hearing millennials are going back to board games? what's up with that?i think it is really in part to video games. they are making board games more but the board games are actually changing, right george? yes. the games like monopoly are getting very little sales increase, but the european style games are getting a larger increase. and european style games are getting more complicated, like they force you to pay attention during the whole game. which is something you don't get with a board game necessarily. like for monopoly for example, yes you need to pay attention if they land on your space or whatever but for the large part you can kind of zone out between your turns. maybe that's the difference between our generations. because i have had friends in college and went on to be business tycoons. so don't fold out. you might get something out of it. but even if you don't, i am kind of surprised doctor, that board games are taking over the interest of millennials? i would say that there is a, the opposition between video games and board

games is probably the wrong thing happening. maybe there is something where because of our time compression, organization of labor, we are constantly busy. perhaps that is effecting our concentration as generations right, the new generation. and perhaps board games are taking cues from video games in terms of how to capture attention in a sense. does that make senese? it makes sense, but is it a trend. can we say that is happening now more and more? or is it related or is it isolated? well the trend is clear because you can see the numbers growing in terms of the numbers of people buying board games. the people that are producing them are making lots of money from that. maybe marketing is getting better. they are knowing what the millennials like. millennials don't like to wait for their turn like george said. you see what i am saying, but not in a negative way. you get kind of distracted when you are in the middle of a game when the other person is going and you are waiting and you are going to grab a bag of chips

or something you know. go ahead. sorry, i just want to say that we are in a generation where technology is everywhere around us. millennials, we are blessed with all of this technology that's why you see a lot of lets play videos online, youtube or lets play board games, geek & sundry tabletop are just examples of people talking about board games. we have to understand the underlying mechanic factor of what makes board games and video games. there's just a lot of underlying mechanics. there is just a lot of, there is dressing, narrative, stories that are put on top of it, on top of all of the underlying technology that we are given. but the underlying mechanics are what transposes throughout the generations. and do you understand exactly what she meant by that? well not entirely, but personally i don't play a lot of board games. like it was a surprise to me knowing that board games are having a rise in sales cause usually i see more people playing pc games or like console gaming.

i feel like yeah, it surprised me because millennials usually like to do things on their own. we have our phones and we are always just like, our faces are always down in our phones. and pc gaming and console gaming is like really solitary, experience, at least for me. because usually i don't like playing with other people because i play it more for the story, the narrative and that's what gets me, i think.doesn't that concern you though? i have no disrespect when i say this. doesn't it concern you that your generation is turning more internal as opposed to external and inclusive? why aren't you communicating more, put all of the games down, and just interact with each other? we're communicating in different ways. like i said we are blessed with all of the technology and different resources out there. we are communicating differently through games. not just face to face interactions as what board games provide, but through that interpersonal, interconnectivity, internet space. and that's what we are doing now. we are just seeing communication transpose from what was

normal, talking like you and me here, to an interconnected world, like the internet. the bay area audience watching right now is going to say, "that's great now at this point in your life, but 20, 30 years from now when you are running this country, running this valley, you are the leaders, that's not going to work." that does concern me, i think. i have seen that. i have seen people that actually struggle, have social anxiety because that are used to being so internal, so to themselves. and its really driven them to insane points where i have seen them become really depressed, really deprived and they just don't leave their rooms. they don't leave their computers. i think it really is a big problem, honestly. and also we are so connected now with like facebook. you can see all of your friends online, you can chat with people. i actually got off facebook personally. for personal reasons. i think i like that face to face interaction. i need, i am starting to get used to it.

back in high school i was a very, i had a lot social anxiety, like approaching people. and i have been trying to get over over that by getting away from technology. that's kind where, it's such a, its such an advancement, all of this connection, but its also very stressful. i have heard facebook can cause depressions. we should go back to board games and stuff this is a little bit of a tangent. and then video games they are very interactive and stuff, but they could also be very isolating. i can see why that is because i notice like, now video games have become way more cinematic. its like, you are in a movie. it's games like especially with games like the walking dead series or the wolf among us series where basically, these games, you get choose the decisions the characters make. i feel like in some ways people can pretend they are the

actual character and things can get a little messy. but for me, no i am not going to think i am the actual character. but i feel like it is way more immersive and i kind of get lost. i think that is the concern some people might have. it's okay for entertainment. it's okay to do this,there is nothing wrong with it, but do we go too far and do we miss out on the world around us as a result. what would you say about that? i'd say that all of these forms of entertainment get us kind of in this individualistic mode where we kind of cut people off in our lives. and we kind of get immersed. sometimes people obsessively get into the facebook and then start looking into other people's lives. and then if other people's lives look better then theirs, they are going to feel a little bit, their self esteem might fall a little bit. so what board games to do for people is give them a place where they can actually have a direct interaction that makes you feel good about yourself, you get to express yourself and you might actually get to win. which is hard in life these days.

you know the economy is tough. tapping into that competitive spirit, i want to win this game, i want to do that. that was a part of the learning experience of a board game. do you get that from video? absolutely. absolutley. like there is definitely moments in games where you just are like, 'yes!' i grew up, i grew up with, like you were saying, in your generation you never grew up with video games. i grew up watching my father play the original doom series. the eight bit monsters coming after you. you have to shoot them and i know there is a lot of concern, people are like, 'oh, its going to be in the back of your mind. you're going to be violent.' i am the most passive person. i have never been in a fight, but i can see. i think the bigger concern is people aren't going out and having doing exercise, if they are playing too much games. and it's not natural for the human body to sit down for six hours playing world of warcraft or a mmo rgp. i think that's maybe why you see a little more aggression. i mean that's a theory. i am not basing this off any factual information. i think i have noticed if i am sitting down for a

really long time. i am not getting any exercise i get antsy. i get more irritable, you know. you make a good point and i will even use myself as an example. when i was your age and i was going through college we didn't have video games we had to get out and do things. and when i became a tv reporter going all over the country learning different communities i stayed in great shape. i looked like you. now i sit behind a desk and i don't do that very much and i look like me. the point is you might just want to do more than just play these games. but george you have done more about these, , the combination of video versus board what else do you want to share. well i feel like it is important to get face-to-face interaction. that's why i like board games because. even when i played minecraft i would like to sit in the same room as the person because, even though you could do it without it i just liked the face to face interaction. but how could you afford video games these days? i mean look at the price tags

and i mean my goodness. yeah, i don't know. you could go on a date and have a lot more fun with that money. that's what the sjsu game dev club, we make out own games. we are an acedemic club that we try to teach people you can make your own games now with the resources and technology that's availale to us. you can actually program and write your own narratives, write your own stories. very good. and you are an illustrator, so this is right down your alley. i have always wanted to make, to create a video game. i mean, i have no excuse at this point. i should really join your guy's club. becasue i have seen the work coming out of it is fantastic. yeah i think the technology is getting so much more accessible to actually make that stuff. and it is exciting because there are these games, called indy games, coming out and they are basically being produced by smaller groups of people. like my cousin was playing a game where you build and manage your own city, , made by eleven people. like are you kidding me. like yeah, eleven people made, like this game, you have programmers, you have animators. and i don't know the industry excites me so much, like the making of the games.

that does sound exciting. if they had had it in my day i would have been interested in that as well. what's coming next though? and a little bit about these games, you and i were talking about these war games, these video games. and they are teaching people about guns, violence and war and all of that. at the same time board games are getting these adult themes, like zombie apocoloypse or cards against humanity which is very, is very inappropriate. a messed up version of it? a messed up version of apples to apples. might be attracting more millennials to. i think what you are trying to say is there this sense of diversity that is happening or is going on and i think so, yes. in the indy direction, in the indy game development direction, yes. right now with the whole issues of gamer gate and the atmosphere of the gaming industry right now, there have been talks about diversity, but we are getting there i believe. do you see it as a big business though,

trying to take advantage of millenials and want to make money? because lets face it, that's what a lot of businesses do. well, millennials nowadays what, we are not even getting married, delaying buying houses and cars. we are a target market. i'm sorry, maybe some of our parents don't think we are doing the basic. we are living our life. i think this is living the life. wait i don't think big business is trying to take advantage of people with video games because you have to know how to make, we are not dumb. we have to know how to make a game for us to want to play. i think an example of this is when et was made. like et the extra terrestrial which is known as the worst game ever made. it's kind of where video games were still at their birth. it was kind of this eight bit, stupid looking et walking around and it was the worst game ever made. and it was made by, i don't know the names. it was made by this business guy who was like, "oh this movie is coming out. you guys need to make a game about this so everyone will buy it." so they did that and it ended up being a huge flop and apparently there is cartridges of the et game buried out,

like a graveyard of et games. and so, that's kind of an example of big businesses like that can't really take like the call of duty games. they are milking that. they are milking that way too much. they are milking that way too much? yeah because there have been like 5 of them already. it's the same thing. yeah it's the same thing every time. the one change in one game was, which my brother bought the new one, which this was like 60 dollars. and he bought it and he was like, "oh my god. call of duty, seven billion." he bough tit and the only thing you could do is you could kind of change there was two sites on it and you could switch it. that was it. oter than that it was the same game. i think it is great, the public seeing your excitement. it means something to you. it is valuable. so we can't just dismiss it that you are addicted to video games right? no. cause i am not addicted to video games. like i still have my priorities in life. i am a college student, i go to class still, i don't . just stay at home and play games all day. like i am responsible enough tot set aside time to have recreational activity.

play video games or something. in terms of businesses taking advantage of millenials and in that way, i think as millennials we still have control of what we consume. because i am not going to go out and play a game just because there is a commercial about it, like, "oh, it looks so awesome." and milleneials are good at doing research because we have google now. be advised silicon valley they are studying what they are going to buy. but once you have done that. once you have studied what you want to buy, how about leading the industry and giving them ideas on what you want? what you need next? and that's what the industry, the indy industry, the game dev club as well as smaller groups that are making games are trying to do. we know that there needs to be this sense of diversity in games. and we are seeing with examples of companies like retracting their work so they can show more diverse characters, the lgbt community. as well as people of color of certain descents. going back to big companies trying to attack millenials, they know what works already, especially

these big triple a companies. they know what makes money, big boobied girls or guys with big machines. but the indy scene, we are taking that, we are taking video games and seeing them as an art form. we want people to see it as a academia critique, as a place for creativity. so we are taking it in that direction. but if businesses are doing what you just suggested, it sounds like they might be inadvertently reinforcing stereotypes. and that's a problem wouldn't you say? yes. yes, seriously. a serious problem. violence against women in video games. violence against people of color we see that. even the very premise of a zombie game if you read into it you see images of people in urban settings, people that are houseless. if you superimpose zombies with the people who are disconnected in society it seems like there is a strange

perverted catharsis to kill zombies. and so if you read into it, but i am not sure if all of the millennials are reading into the stuff. well it is going to take more decades of your lifetime to just what has been the the impact on millennials. it is going to take education as well. meaning? education like what is happening here at san jose state. we are one of the leading schools of teaching game studies designs and actually bringing up the topics of diversity in art and this collective work, such as in my club. we are one of those leading schools and other schools, like lsu, like some usc even our sister school in uc santa cruz. they are incorporating game studies while teaching millennials like us all of those new topics like diversity which wasn't present before in the 1980's when games were coming out. so we are not saying to the general public, in the short time we have left, that you are getting more and more hooked and this is an addiction. but it has value purpose it excites the mind, moves you forward and gets to engage your talents and abilities,

but when will it stop, some people may wonder, when is it going to stop and you are going to get out in the real world and get a job? is there a connection there? or anything that will help you in the future for you r job market pursuits? for you, any of you. for you, yeah, you're doing animation. playing video games? go ahead. how will it work in the work place? how will playing video games help me in the work place? will it engage critical thinking? for me it is definitely a thing where i am going into the industry, so i need to know what makes a good game. if i am going to be developing, what makes a good character? what makes compelling, enemy, people to fight? what makes a good story? you know. and that's what i am going into. sounds like journalism. what motivates people? for me there is kind of a direct connection in term of the industry i want to go into. veryquick lets go over here. over here. what were you going to say? i already have a couple internships lined up with sony and ubisoft.

i am a com major, so i can't really program or do art, but what being in the game dev club and what playing video games has taught me is a sense o f motivation to work with others. how to work with others? an intrinsic feeling of being creative. and other life skills, just other life skills i can use because i have worked with other people making games, hitting bench marks, hitting project dates. being a part of something special. yes. that feels good. that always feels good. all of our career paths. you all have been wonderful, i thank you for bringing this topic. you have educated the guy. you're welcome. very good. thank you all for joining us. we hope you come back for another edition of equal time.

>> hollar: tonight, on "revolutionaries"... >> and we launched it on april 1 of 2001, and for, you know, a good 20, 25 seconds, the site was up. well, then we went down. yeah, that was sad. [laughter] and then we went back up, and then we went down, and it was a pretty brutal first day. >> major league baseball is pioneering one of the most advanced digital systems in the world. from video streaming to instant replay, mlb advanced media has changed not just baseball, but all of digital sports. we talked with ceo bob bowman and learned why baseball has moved to the front of thck