good evening from los angeles, i'm tavis smiley. he'll weigh in on the g 20 summit in the latest allegations of another trump administration conn next to russia. then we'll speak with activist gail walker continuing her father use humanitarian efforts through a special pastors for peace. we're glad you joined us. our guests coming up in a molt. momenltlt. ♪ ♪. ♪ ♪

>> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. thank you. ♪ ♪ ryan is a fellow in global and comparative politics at the london school of economics. how the west is aiding and abetting the decline of democracy. good to have you on the program. >> thanks for having me. >> when i was going over the text during the weekend, i was struck by your suggestion the west is aiding and abetting the cloud democracy and president

trump shows up to a give a speech whether or not the west has a will to survive. what did you make of that question from the president? >> well, i think that he's misdiagnosed the problem. one is his definition for the rest took on an extremely cultural and religious over tone. made it about christianity. poland is one of the key culprits of what political scientists called backsliding from liberal democracy and he's splintering the west. he's alienating allies. which they try to figure the blueprint, it used to be america. washington, the city upon a hill and now it's not. and the countries in the developing world with looking much more to china as a viable model and much less to washington and i think that's something that's really sad to see that we're actually under cutting the allure of democracy because our system is broken.

>> that notion again that he advanced, president trump whether or not the west had the will to survive, was that hyperbole or something more dangerous and sinister about his raising that notion? >> i think it was dangerous in the way he characterized the west. he talked about values but tended to not be things like democracy absent from the speech. you think about past presidents. ronald reagan would be rolling in his grave to have a president in poland that transitioned because of the u.s.'s hole and had the president not mentioned democracy, that was the achievement of the west to turn eastern europe into a democratic alliance, part of the e.u. and west. talk about survival of the west, think about the idea that made the west special and democracy is the core of that. that's why i'm worried about it being put into a broader context about religious or cultural identity because one of the

foundational principles is under assault under president trump is the free press and poland has been attacking the free press so much on western groups. to hold this up as the ped stole of the west is an error that will alienate allies. >> as you talk more tonight, we understand why poland was just polling out the red carpet and they rolled out the red carpet for a hero's welcome to donald trump. >> he was. the ill remembliberal forces of world love donald trump. he's popular in russia and poland among supporters of the moving party sliding away. the countries that share the values the u.s. stood for for most of the existence, those countries are alienated by trump. we seen in surveys, confidence in the u.s. leader down in

germany and france and 57% in the u.k. and up in you sharussi because he's not emulated and actual actually put on a ped stole by how western democracies behaved. we used to be a force that had somewhat two-faced approach to the world. we used to have mostly support for democracy but blind spots. now it's consistent in the wrong way. it's consistent on the side. he's praised. he's congratulated him on a referendum. >> turkey. >> democracy in turkey and praised the president of the philippines running a death squad that killed 7,000 people and putin. the pattern is really alarming because the u.s. used to only turn a blind eye to some key relationships and now it's the principle of democracy doesn't seem to be factoring in.

>> do you regard what you laid out as some new trump doctrine? is this what the trump doctrine is going to be or ignore rant of the facts? >> the trump doctrine is short sided foreign policy. it's the transaction the view of the world and who pays what and when? the problem is one, democracy and values actually matter. when we invest in those, we get dividends down the road. maybe not immediately but pay off and the best example of this is the marshall plan after world war ii where the u.s. rebuilt europe. that is a waste of money. we're throwing billions of dollars at western europe. why would we do that? those countries became the countries we traded with and spilled blood in war. the people that we can count on and because we invested in a long-term vision of value oriented foreign policy that promoted democracy and now we're

thinking about just transactional dollars and cents. how many weapon wills saudi arabia buy and russia help us with this to give them a free pass on something else. do we like president dand this s why we have a problem. that's what the trump doctrine is trading vision and values for short-term transaction. >> how do you regard or maybe not regard his walking back of that just trying to find the right word and it was just bizarre that he would say, well, i asked putin whether he did that. did he hack. i asked him. he said no and because he asked him and he said no, he believed him and starts tweeting about the cybersecurity collaboration that we're going to engage in with russia and within 24 hours

he of course is walking that back. how did you read that bizarre sort of -- >> it's dangerous. it's like trying to form a counterterrorism initiative. it's a counterproductive approach and a way to form late security policy and had to walk it back because anybody that understands the basics of u.s. national security knew that was a non-starter. you can't possibly collaborate with the number one foreign adversary and attacks. we had a report this week russia may have been involved in attacking with cyberrussians again. if there are people who don't think the collusion narrative of 2016 was a big deal, our infrastructure is vulnerable and the question is what message does the united states send to russia to say you cannot do this again? and what came out of that meeting was almost an invitat n invitation. not only weak but it was saying let's just move on. if you said let's just move on

after a crime is committed, the criminal will do it again. that's what i worry about looking at 2018 is what is detouring putin from doing what he did in 2016 in 2018? >> how would you grade mr. trump's g-20 performance? >> unfortunately, i think it was an f. the only thing positive that came out of this is britain felt hopeful about the fact he talked about a trade agreement with him. so there was a little bit of plot in britain but beyond that, the rest of the world is alienated. this is the first time that the g-20 had to make a statement 19 plus one about climate. more we're the plus one, the side show, the more the u.s. has weakened because we can't dictate what other people need to do. you can't use foreign policy pressure when you're the problem. when you're advocating positions so out of step with the global

leaders, you are becoming a global leader. >> the trump show is making us a side show? >> unfortunately, i think so. >> early in this conversation brian, suggested you don't like the way president trump defined the west in remarks to poland. let me ask how you define the west and why and how is the west aiding and abeddingtting? >> ideas and values. the west stands for a really revolutionary idea, people should have the ability to have input how they are governed. that was the idea that created the west and why japan is referred to in the west, as well. it also has a value. right? so i think when i think about the idea, that was core. the west lost sight of that in the foreign policy. in the cold war, u.s. foreign policy basically picks sides whoever was our friend. right?

it was often not about democracy and coups. it was free to actually act on principle and a lot of the time, we actually did that. that's changed over time. and it started to become much more about hard-nosed foreign policy reality and short-term goals rather than a long-term vision. now, beyond that, you also have the problem that the west is not acting like a model. if you don't have this ped stole to put america on, then everyone looks at china to think that country is a thuthoritarian andt results. people say we don't need elections but the problem is china has some things that african countries don't like a functioning. it's the worst of both worlds where people gravitate away from washington and simply just

having no delivery for the people. there is a very simple core idea to the west as i said, governments should be responsive to people and democracy is at the pinnacle of the ambitions of a society. i was alarmed he didn't mention that in the speech to poland. >> at this point, what agency do the american people have to pull the president's coat tail as it were on not just the speech but the behavior? >> well, this is where i think the fundamental aspect needs to be fixed is jerry band gerryman >> we agree on that. >> the average margin of victory in the house in 2016 was 37%. right? everybody in congress is worried about a primary challenger, in the a general election opponent. the more that happens, the more sane people will behave in insane ways. a lot of the people behind

closed doors are appalled but won't do anything because the only consequence they can face is a primary challenger. they will win 80/20 in the general. all that does is funnel the extremes against them. that's the real danger. until we fix that problem with districting and create competitive problems in the united states, we'll have a dysfunctional democracy that will not deliver for the people. >> as we say in the black church, amen to that. [ laughter ] >> i've been saying that for years on this program, gerrymandering is the number one thing wrong. of course, the problem is the folk have to fix that on the folk in congress. the book is called how the west is aiding and abetting the democracy written by brian clause. up next, activist gail walker on her way to cuba. you'll want to hear about this. stay with us. h us.

please welcome gail walker for community organization, better known as ifco. she and seven others will embark to cuba as part of an annual special ministry part of the pastors for peace. good to have you before you take off to cuba. >> thanks for having me. >> tell me about it 50 years later. that's a long time to love and serve people. >> it truly is is. it was a brain child of progressive clergy and people finding ways to connect to social unrest and final solutions to social unrest and social justice projects. so anything from working with the children, issues around race, fighting the clan, supporting the efforts of farm workers, american indian movement is a real rich history

that's been rooted in the issue of social justice and my father was the founding director. the late reverend walker was really at the helm for so many years. i came about and got connected by birth. really is a result of my own interest in social justice and doing what i can do do what we can to make this a better world. >> how did it feel? how do you process continuing the kind of social justice work that your father and others started so many years ago and i ask because a lot of folk in this generation who were just coming in to their own fight for social justice. so many different fronts. and yet, you and others are the progre progity of those fighting the fight. >> literally being a young,

youngish black woman having witnessed not only the work my father did but others he sure rounded himself with saw the importance of utilizing the tool of ifco and the programs ifco is associated with as a way to push back against some of those forms of injustice. when we look at the current projects, black lives matters, just being one and seeing sort of the precursor to some of that. it's real important to maintain the use of these kinds of institutions as a way to educate people about the current struggle but to figure outweighs to use them to advance a struggle for justice moving down. >> broadly speaking, broadly speaking, gail, you think the faith community still -- i'm trying to be careful here so as not to offend anybody. not that i care. the faith community still has

the kind of interest in this kind of social justice work. i mean, let's be honest. we're not your daddy's generation. we're not dr. king's generation. not to say there aren't those fighting for social justice but i'm specifically asking about the role that the faith community plays now versus the role it played 50 years ago. when we think about the faith community, we're talking about christian consecutives and donald trump politics and this, that and the other but on this social justice front, where is the faith community, how do you sit wait them? >> that's a really important conversation and one we're continuingly engaged in. we've got thankfully we've got some members of the faith community that work with us as part of our board of direct tors, advisory, i'm here in l.a. and had the opportunity to worship at the holman united methodist church. >> the world renowned.

>> my goodness. >> he's there for years. >> yes, yes, yes, reverend kelvin is really holding it down and doing tremendous work in the community and very supportive of the work ifco is doing. we're trying to identify progressive pcongregations to find ways to keep this work going but there are, you know, i can list some of the names of the folks that are continuing to do this work in different parts of the u.s. so i believe they are there but it's a continuous challenge and i talked to them, particularly the clergy and say where are the young, you know, faith leaders? because it's real important think for us to continue to do this work head on and we continue to do the work we do as people of faith and people of conscience. >> quick footnote before i go on to continue our conversation about the trip to cuba. she said home, i get excited

quickly because to her point, it's a very, very well-known and popular church. very well-known and highly regarded church in the city. it is the church pastored for many years by james lawson. he was years ago in a place called memphis. he asked dr. king to come to memphis to lead the sanitation workers' strike. he convinced martin king to come to memphis to get on the front lines of the fight for the sanitation workers. james lawson thought he was the one that got martin king killed by getting him to come to memphis. he and james harding who wrote beyond vietnam -- i talked to them so many times across the years. i ran into him the other day in l.a. he retired now. he's part of a grand legacy. >> yes. >> of those who worked alongside dr. king in memphis and beyond and ironic in a matter of months will commemorate the 50th anniversary of king's assassination. past tored for a lot of years

and he's an icon to many people in the movement. >> yeah. >> that said, that's why holman gets us excited when you hear that name in this city. cuba, you guys have been doing this for a number of years. tell me about the kacaravan. you don't get involve in politics but how has the death of castro, the opening of our policy with cuba under the obama administration and trump threatening to do a 180, does any of that affect whatever it is you are going to do? >> you know, the caravans we've been organizing to cuba since 1992, they got the start back in '88 when my dad and i were leading ade delegation in nicaragua when there was a passenger ferry attacked. this was a different president. ronald regan talking about the freedom fighters and the bad guys. found out firsthand just what

that really was all about and my dad was one of 29 people wounded in the attack which lead to the formation of pastors. we began doing the kacaravans i central america and began organizing to cuba and lifting up information about the blo blockade or embargo. we have done the caravan in a different variety of ways. and lately focussing in on the educational component. there is so much people don't know. you just mentioned the president barack obama and the openings that he made which were wonderf wonderful. it was really -- he talked about the approach to cuba being a failed policy and needed to be reversed and very pleased that what he was able to do. and now we find ourselves faced

with donald trump there is a lot that can be done and that the why we continue to do this work. the death of fidel castro was a blow to the people of cuba but the reality is the revolution was about one man, it was about creating a society all could benefit so the things put into place about fidel castro presidency continues to be reflected across the country. we know that his brother raul will be moving on. cuba is making change and participating in a changed world

and won't forget the role fidel castro played but prepared to look to the future as we move forward. >> what are your -- two minutes i have left. what are your personal impressions of the cuban people? >> i love cuba. you know, i had an opportunity to go there since 1992 and they are generous people. really interested, you know. i tell you there are times when people might approach you here and you think, oh, boy, somebody is going to ask me for something. may not be the proper way to think about it. when that happens in cuba, it's often because wow, i want to practice my spanish or you live in new jersey? you know jose? my cousin jose? there are a lot of joe says. no, no, you know jose. it's fascinating. the other thing i wanted to say is cuba provides so much. that's why we continue to do this work. they opened up opportunities.

they got a med school there. elon, they provide all kinds of opportunities for young people to go to cuba to study to become physicians and ifco has the honor of being the facilitator of the program for u.s. candidates. 145 graduates this summer when we head to cuba, we'll be participating in the graduation of 27 new u.s. doctors only -- >> trained in cuba. >> train in cuba. >> only understanding being they will return and serve here and under served communities. >> that's beautiful. >> it's a great work and look forward to continuing to move this forward. it comes with some degree of push back. >> sure. >> the u.s. government decided to take away our 501 c 3 at the beginning of the year because of the work you've done with cuba. we continue to do the work. we think it's important that work move forward and we -- with

the support of folk like at holman and other churches and congregations across the country, we're continuing to move forward. >> that's how you know you're doing good work. you got the trump administration assisting you. that's the surest sign that you doing something good in the world. >> right. that's right. >> all the best on the trip. be safe. have a great time. >> thank you so much. >> thank you for 50 years of this on going struggle. >> thank you. >> that's our show for tonight. thanks for watching and as always, keep the faith. >> for more information on today's show, visit tavis smiley. >> more about her new book, no is not enough. that's next time. we'll see you then.

>> and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. pbs station from viewers like you. thank you.

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