>> rose: welcome to the program. we begin tonight with phillip rucker of "the washington post" and the story in the newspaper about how president trump coached his son in how to respond to a meeting he'd had with a russian businesswoman and others. >> president trump personally overruled the advice of his attorneys and his advisors to dictate a statement that would be issued in the name of his son donald trump, jr. to mislead the public, to intentionally conceal key fact about that meeting in an attempt to spin the story in sort of a less damaging way. >> rose: we continue this evening with "indecent," the tony-award winning play. we talk to director rebecca taichman, one of the stars of the play richard topol and producer daryl roth. >> the story of the play is one that kind of calls out for

courage and speaking out in times of hatred and in times of real sort of danger and creating art against all odds and, as you see in "indecent," the odds sort of keep increasing and they keep telling their story over and over and over again. >> rose: we conclude with a remembrance and appreciation of the actor jeanne moreau. she died monday in paris age 89. >> i don't think about my life based with a career and a life separated. >> rose: yeah. everything goes together, and i think i'm growing. some people would say grow old, but i'm growing. >> rose: you don't fear age at all? >> no, no, not at all. i'm growing, and i try to improve, and i discover new interests, and it's curiosity. >> rose: phillip rucker of "the washington post,"

"indecent," and remembering jeanne moreau when we continue. >> rose: funding for "charlie rose" has been provided by the following: >> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide. captioning sponsored by rose communications from our studios in new york city, this is charlie rose. >> rose: "the washington post" reported on monday night that president trump personally dictated a statement about a june 2016 meeting between his son and a russian lawyer. that statement claimed the meeting had primarily been a russian adoption program subject. this was later shown to be misleading.

joining me from washington is philip rucker, white house bureau chief at "the washington post" also political analyst for ncb news and msnbc. phil, tell me for those who did not read the story, who did not get their daily briefing from "the washington post" how this story has developed. >> well, so we're talking about the meeting that donald trump, jr. had with the russian lawyer during the summer of 2016 during the campaign. the news of the meeting broke in the "new york times" a few weeks ago at the beginning of july. the story we detailed in "the post" yesterday is president trump personally overruled the advice of his attorneys and advisors to dictate a statement that would be issued in the name of his son donald trump, jr. to mislead the public and conceal facts about the meeting to spin the story in a less damaging way, and that's

a new revelation. >> rose: is it illegal or otherwise to do that? >> no, it's not illegal to deceive the public, it's not illegal to lie to a newspaper, but it raises some problems because this is all happening in the context of robert mueller's special counsel investigation into the russian matter. so you have the president taking action to try to influence the public statement of his son in the midst of this investigation. one of the things mueller is looking into is potential obstruction of justice. so some of the president's advisors are quite concerned that this incident of crafting the statement himself is going to draw the interest of the special counsel. >> rose: i think the president's spokeperson said that he was simply doing what any father would do for his son. >> that's right but not any father is the president of the

united states. we're dealing with the criminal investigation here. the rules start to change a bit and that's why people have lawyers, why they have publicists who can do this work for them but donald trump is increasingly acting like his own lawyer, publicist, strategist, trying to shape these events, trying to manage the russia story from a p.r. perspective without being sensitive to the legal ramifications. >> rose: his lawyers advised him not to do this, did they not? >> his advisors concluded ahead of time that they thought the best course of action for this don, jr. meeting would be to get as much information out there to the public at once, rip the band-aid off. they knew this would be a damaging story and the information would eventually come out. the information we're talking about is the meeting was set up from e-mails in order for a russian lawyer to provide negative information on hillary clinton obtained by the russian

as part of their effort to help in the campaign. donald trump's lawyers knew it would come out and suggested the course of action but the president overruled them, thought it would be better to talk about adoptions and try to cover it up. >> rose: do we know the president knew about the time of the meeting at the time he was coaching his son or writing the statement? >> that's a good question. the answer is not totally sure. we don't know yet if president trump had actually read ethe email chain before he dictated the statement, but i know from my and my colleagues' reporting at "the post" that the president was fully aware the meeting was more than just the adoption issue and he was intentionally deceptive and misleading and concealing of information when he put together the statement for his son. >> rose: the president of the united states knew when he put together the statement for his son he was intentionally

deceptive, misleading and what else? >> and just not providing the complete picture. you know, this was a strategic p.r. move by the president and, charlie, as you know, it's in keeping with the way he's behaved over many years including in his business life where he likes to manage these things himself. he had a history in new york of calling the new york tabloids, even posing as a spokesman under a false name. so this is in keeping with donald trump's past. it's just highly unusual for the president of the united states to act this way and overrule the advice of his advise,. >> rose: it was his own hue hubs that led him not to follow his advisors' advice in this case. what is the implication today? >> the president's credibility. it's another example of him misleading the public. there's a long history of falsehoods he's uttered as

president and certainly presidential candidate running for the office and it just muddies the water. the other problem is the president's attorney jay sekulow was on television on "meet the press" shortly before the statement came out and said emphatically president trump had nothing to do with the crafting of that statement. it's possible s sekulow and oths didn't know about it until after the fact, but the story in the "the washington post" exposes that as not true. >> rose: what was the subject head of the e-mails. >> it had something to do with clinton and russia and of course the email enticing don, jr. to arrange and agree to the meeting was the promise of information that would be incriminating

about hillary clinton. campaign popo, dirt, if you will, provided that was uncovered by the russians as part of their effort to shape the election in trump's favor, they were going to present it to donald trump, jr. at this meeting and that's why trump, jr. agreed to the meeting. >> rose: and why jared kushner and others agreed to it? >> don, jr. arranged the meeting and invited kushner to attend. he said it was about adoption issues but it was ostensibly to provide incriminating information. >> rose: what can we say about at a two of the chief of staffdom of john kelly? >> john kelly made it clear there is a new sheriff in town.

there is a new sense of order and rigor in the west wing. kelly is making all the staff report to him. he's trying to cut off the breezy, free-flow access in the oval office and trying to instill discipline around the president. it's unclear if he can instill discipline in the president himself but the staff and aides and senior staff are getting in line to try to give kelly a chance to make things right. >> rose: including the family? as far as i know. ivanka trump tweeted a picture yesterday on kelly's first day saying she was pleased to be working alongside him, that's very different than working for him. the reporting structure, the formal structure has her and jared kushner, the son-in-law, reporting to the chief of staff, but, of course, they're going to have their own unique individual access to the president just being family. >> rose: what do we know about the understanding between the

president and general kelly? >> that's a good question. neither has spoken too much yet in public about what agreements they reached in setting up the staff this way, but i do know that president trump recognizes things are not going great right now at the six-month mark. he wants to be focusing on the economy and get tax cuts through the congress. he's had no major legislative achievement and i think he's expecting that kelly is going to come in here and try to instill more order, discipline and try to create more tangible achievements that the president can call wins. >> rose: any information on who is likely to be the new head of the department of communications, succeeding scaramucci? >> that's a great question. i think there are a number of people in the mix for that. for the moment, sean spicer who resigned as press secretary a little over a week ago, he remains coming to the white house. he's still there and i think functioning to some degree as the communications director at

the moment helping get organized and keeping the trains running on time, but ultly they will need a replacement and i'm not sure who they will hire. >> rose: is it fair to say for all intense and purposes they've moved from health care to focus on tax reform? >> i think that's right. the president may still comment and tweet about health care but there is no active negotiation really underway right now. i think the white house concedes privately, at least they do when i that you can to officials, that health care is not going anywhere right now and mitch mcconnell, the senate republican leader, is very eager to get going on taxes and other issues and turn the page on this whole healthcare situation. >> rose: i mentioned to you before we started a "vanity fair" article about the editor of the "new york times" and the who's. >> yeah. >> rose: is there just so -- explain to me the competition that exists today for this story.

>> it's a 24-7 competition, i think, between both of our news rooms but also between a number of other competitors doing great journalism out there. i'm friends with the folks at the "new york times" but we're also competitors. we're competing for schools, investigative inclusive and ultimately it's good pore the public. we're all trying to find truth and bring light to what's happening here in washington and around the country. >> rose: is it an overstatement to say this is a story of a lifetime? >> i think that's an understatement, charlie. i'm not that old but i've never experienced a story quite like this one. >> rose: phil rucker, thank you for joining us. pleasure. >> thank you. >> rose: we'll be right back. stay with us. >> rose: "indecent" is the new play from paula vogel, the tony award winner for best direction and lighting tells the true story of the controversial 1923 broadway debut of god of vengeance and actors who risked

their careers to perform it. the "new york times" writes "indecent" is above all decent in the most complete sense of the word. virtuous, informeddive and brimming with good faith. >> we have a story we want to tell you about a play -- a play that changed my life. ♪ ♪ ♪ of all the boys i've known and i've known some ♪ ♪ until i first met you i was lonesome ♪ ♪ and then you came inside and this old world seemed new to me ♪ ♪ i have to admit you deserve expressions that really fit you ♪ ♪ so i've really racked my brain hoping to explain ♪ ♪ all the things you do to me

♪ please help me explain ♪ ♪ >> rose: joining me is director rebecca taichman, one of the stars of the play, richard topol and ten-time tony-award producer daryl roth. in the interest of full disclosure, she and her husband are supporters of this program which i am very proud of. let me begin with this. this is about two plays, a play written that opened back in 1923, gods of ven vision. paula vogel read the play and liked it very much. then there is rebecca who directed the play as a young yale dramatist and all that, and then they come to you. how did you end up producing this? >> well, it went, actually, where i saw it at the vineyard theater in new york, and it was a relationship i had with paula for many years because 20 years

ago i produced how i learned to driveway is her beautiful play. so i was the natural person they would call and say daryl, come see this play. i think it has the sensibilities you were attracted to. they were right. in the process of my loving the play and figuring out how to move it to prodway was the step that was the most exciting for me because i love the play very much. it stands for so many things i care about. also, paula had never been produced on broadway. a woman who worked in theater, wonderful writer, teacher, mentor in her 60s, and i felt it would be important on so many levels to bring this play to broadway. >> rose: did you call paula and say i want to talk to you about this play? how did this happen? >> 20 years ago i'm a graduate student at yale and i happen on this play gods of vengeance.

the night it opened, they were tossed in jail. i tried to find a transcript that interwove the trial with the text of the play. didn't work but it was clear there was a very important story to tell and i was determined to be a caretaker of this memory. so fast forward about a decade, i'm sort of trying to find the right home, the right partner, have the audacity to call paula vogel, who basically before i finished the sentence would you want to make a play with me about the god of -- yes! ( laughter ) >> rose: so i'm all in? she was in. she said, the only thing i want to say, i think, firm correctly, it's about more than a moment in 1923. it's a play that spans a much larger period, and i said yes, yes, yes, god, yes.

>> rose: what's it about in your eyes? >> so "indecent" is about -- so it tells the story of the life of this one piece of art, this play, god of vengeance, as sort of an optic through which to look at this plan of turbulent history. it goes from the moment it was written in 1907 to the early '50s when the playwright himself forbids the production of the play. so it's a way to look at the swath of american and jewish history through one piece of art and how does this one piece of art articulate this huge period in time. ultimately, i think the story of the play is one that kind of calls out for courage and speaking out in times of hatred and in times of sort of real sort of danger and creating art against all odds.

as you see in "indecent," the odds sort of keep increasing and they keep telling their story over and over and over again. you know, it comes to new york at a time of enormous immigration reform, a real cut down on immigrants in the u.s. you know, it was a pretty audacious move and it's a real -- eng the play calls out as a reminder to love in times of hatred. >> rose: someone said it's about immigration, history, homophobia, misogyny, history, art -- and all that in 94 minutes. >> it's exactly why it's such a pertinent play today because the subjects are subjects we're dealing with as we speak around this table. >> rose: immigration. immigration, censorship, homophobia, religious persecution, love, the freedom to love who you choose to love, all of those are subjects that we care deeply about. >> rose: and this place speaks

to all of them. one historical point. what happened at the trial? was it reversed? >> eventually. it's defended by this wild guy harry weinberger who also produced the play on broadway. he also couldn't find anybody else to defend it. so he himself takes it to court, and they're found guilty, but he fights and fights and fights and fights and eventually it's overturned on appeal. >> rose: richard, what's your role? >> i play lemml, the stage manager, he's a little indent tailor from a schteddel and he shows up at the first play and falls in love with the play. he's never seen a play. he follows the journey of the play. he becomes the stage manager and

follows sholem asch throughout it's history and comes to america and travels with the play. he's our way into the story. >> rose: right. he's the one. the audiences weigh in to understanding the turbulent journey of the play. >> rose: i saw singing and dancing. is it a musical? >> i'm so glad you picked up on that. ( laughter ) i would say it's a truly unique form. i had never quite seen anything like this before which is part of why it was such an amazing thing to create and develop. it has enormous amount of music andance in it and sort of, you know, profound what we consider straight theater. so it's a mix, and it's a real mmelange. the music propels us through time in a kind of wonderful and surreal way. so we start in 1907 and it's somewhat music that sort of propels us all the way through.

>> also it's the joy. >> rose: yeah. people always say, well, you know, it's a play that has serious subjects but the music infuses and weaves joy true it that keeps you kind of guessing. >> and the dancing, too, the movement. >> yeah. the scenes sort of happen and then there's a swirling kind of choreograph. sometimes it's a dance, a song, and all of a sudden you're in a different place, in a different country and another scene happens. >> and there's a score by lisa gut:and aaron halva that really brings this production to this soaring life. it is celebrating the love at the center of god of vengeance and the music does it in this extraordinary way. >> rose: what are you looking for when you're looking at a property that you may want to produce? >> i look for a story that resonates with me personally in the hope that it will then

resonate with others. i look for a story that would enlighten people and maybe give us a different view of the world. i'm a very cautious person in my real life but somehow in theater i'm just not afraid to take risks, not afraid to try something that is, you know, exciting or different or shakes things up a little bit. i mean, i feel it's almost my mission, in a way, to bring things to people to change their minds about the world as they see it. >> rose: and their lives. and open their minds, open their eyes and have them think about things that are tough to take, maybe, or things that are against their grain and say, ah, there is another way to see this. >> rose: how did she put so much in such a small amount of time? 94 minutes, you said? >> when our pace is right, it's 95. >> rose: yeah.

i think hat the play moves in this extraordinary and exquisite way and within three lines paula is able to communicate tremendous complication and depth. because she's created this character of this stage manager whose heart we track through the play as well as the playwright sholem asch and the love story between these two girls, we're holding on to people we deeply care about. this story swirls around them. it's communicated with tremendous dexterity and depth and you move. sort of like life. you blink and it's ten minutes later, you blink and suddenly it's 25 years later. it has that feeling of the strangeness of the passage of time as well. >> rose: did you say he did not want -- that sholem did not want it produced for a while? >> i think he realized it was inflammatory and it was very divisive within the jewish

community, and i think he -- >> in the '50s. yeah, after all this happened. from when he wrote it to when it was produced all over the world and in new york and ran in the yiddish theater downtown for years before it was translated into english and then, when it moved uptown, i think he realized, oh, wait a second -- or he began to realize because of it getting shut down that there was something about it that was very inflammatory and divisive. >> it's really after the holocaust that asch in the '50s is approached by a young theater company asking for the rights, and he says, i wrote it in one time, and the times have changed on me, and i don't want this play produced anymore. and i think that, you know, he had written this as this wild young man in 1907. the world had radically changed, and i think, really, he felt very protective, and it felt

like exactly the wrong time to put this play on. so there was sort of a -- the play was silent for many, many decades after that, for a long time. and it then suddenly sort of had a resurgence in the late '90s, kind of rediscovered. but it was really, i think, after the holocaust where he decided he just didn't feel it was the right thing. >> rose: did you love it when you first read it? >> it took my breath away. i couldn't believe it. how is this young man writing this gorgeous love story between these two women? it's like romeo and juliet in the rain. how did he know how to do it? there's a brothel downstairs and this pure family upstairs. it's so inherently theatrical. so i was totally turned on by it and found as a way to peer through history, it was also an incredible, incredible piece of art on many levels. >> rose: and why did you call

paula? >> paula was the perfect person. i mean, in so many ways, i didn't expect she would say yes, but, you know, her -- >> you have to tell the story about when she was in college. >> she read this play when she was a young girl. someone suggested it to her in college. >> one of her drama teachers in cornell suggested he read the play, and this was, you know, however many years ago, and when she was a young woman, she was, like, how could this man, you know, have such insight into this love? >> and prostitutes, too. lso, it's a love letter to theater, let us just say. so for rebecca and paula and rich and the entire company and speaking for myself, it is a love letter to theater. >> rose: it's what theater is about and about the moral courage of the actors at the time. >> and their passion to not give up under all these circumstances through the years, they were a

troupe of actors who believed in what they were doing and at the end of the play, everyone the teary, because you can picture the way you need it to end and that car res you through. >> rose: you extended the play. >> yes. >> rose: but now it has a closing date. >> this sunday. but we've had six weeks of extra joy and it's been miraculous, in fact, because we had posted a closing notice, which killed me to do because i love this play so dearly, but we weren't being fiscally responsible because word of mouth was wonderful but people weren't telling others quickly enough. >> rose: i read good reviews as well. >> wonderful reviews. everyone who saw the play adored it, it was never about that, but we weren't getting close to our numbers. so that's the business of theater. i would like to say in my world theater deals in different

currency, it's not always about money. >> rose: the joy is when the book comes together. >> and it can happen. kinky boots, it's happened in other things, but for this, it was a regret i couldn't live with. you know, i would come to the theater and i was in tears because we had posted this closing notice. and there is a rule that, if you're going to post the notice, you have to post it at a certain time, and if you're going to change your mind, you have to take it down by a certain time. so the time had passed and two days before we were meant to close, i just went to the theater and pulled down the closing notice. i just did. and i felt that i couldn't -- i couldn't not do that. i saw the audiences, once we announced we were closing, the house was full every night. people were standing on their feet. people would walk out of the theater and say, i can't believe this play is closing, and neither could i. so we had this period of time

that i felt i could continue, you know, take the risk and not have a regret in my life, and i asked rich on the night we were supposed to close, i said, could you go out and say to the audience that we're not closing and would they please tell their friends, could you empower them to tell their friends to come see this show? we had no tickets sold that week because we were off sale and going into the fourth of july holiday which traditionally is a lousy time for theater. never mind. he spoke brilliantly, empowered the audience, they stood and cheered. the following week, the fourth of july week, we had done better than in our entire run before. we went from zero to $300,000 in a week. >> rose: wow. it was something like a miracle. and then rich started telling the story of the miracle of hanukkah.

>> yeah, it was a little like the hanukkah story. rebecca who said to me said it is a little like the hanukkah story. we thought we with respect going to go anymore and all of a sudden the miracle happened, the joy, beauty and power of the play inspired people to tell people you have to run and see this thing. so many people said this changed their life, it's the most meaningful theatrical experience they've had. so they told people you have to see this and we were doing show after show. >> rose: it changes lives in terms of how you see the world. >> yeah. >> rose: roll tape. one clip. >> my name the lemml. you can also call me lou, i am the stage manager tonight. usually you can find me backstage. we have a story we want to tell you about a play, a play that changed my life. every night, we tell this story, but, somehow, i can never remember the end.

no matter. i can remember how it begins. ♪ it all starts with this moment. ( laughter ) remember this -- ♪ ♪ ( singing ) >> rose: there you go. what to you like most about the directing process? >> the collaboration, i think, really. i mean, you know, it's an art form that you choose because you don't like to work solitaire, and because you feed so much off sort of the energy and inspiration and ideas and talents of so many people.

so i think -- and it just sort of felt like theater was always my vocabulary. then when i discovered also the potential of having a real point of view and articulating that through a piece of theater in collaboration with this kind of huge family, it just felt exactly right. so i was sort of blessed to have figured that out. >> rose: that is the story of theater, collaboration and joy and figuring out things. >> yeah, sometimes it's difficult to. >> but you're a very good collaborator because you listen well and are open to people's ideas. i think designers enjoy the process, and i think actors enjoy the process, if i may speak for you. >> rose: yeah. while this is a sweep of 94 years of history, it is also very modern. the appeal to modern audiences is because it deals with the themes that confront them today in politics and cultures and relationships. >> partly that and, also, it is

a love story that never goes out of style. >> rose: love is love is love. love is love is love, and it's magnificently acted, so if you just come to the theater to see a good play well done, you can be satisfied on that level because it's just beautiful. >> rose: congratulations to all of you. >> thank you. >> rose: much success. it ends august 6. so you have this week to go to the theater. >> rose: jeann >> rose: jeanne moreau died at her home monday in paris. she was 89. moreau made over 130 movies in a seven-decade career. orson wells once called her the greatest actress in the world. jeanne moreau reagan her world in france. she captured attention in late '50s when she starred in two

louie mall films elevated to the gallows and the lovers. but best known for "katherine" in 962 landmark jules and jim. that would become a defining work of the french new wave. it is still considered one of the greatest movies ever made. mmoreau's final appearance was n 2012 age 84. it was once said jeanne moreau was a queen of intellect and an idea of culture that enriched experience, envisioned progress and looked ardently at the times. jeanne moreau visited this table several times over the years. one of the great pleasures of doing this program for 25 years is the opportunities to talk to

and get to know remarkable people. jeanne moreau is one of them. when at dinner in paris or this table, she was not only talented, soulful, spirited and delightful, she is one of a kind. here is a look at her and the conversations that we've done over the years. ( singing in french ) >> rose: why did you become an actor? >> i had to. i had to. i would lie if i said that i did it by reaction because, at one point, i did say that because i didn't like the life of the grownups, and sometimes the life of the grownups didn't make sense to me, it still doesn't make sense to me. but that's not enough. i really had to.

i'm sure, that's it. i'm sure that once you are given something, when you have a gift, a piece of land, you have to take care of it. and i had to take care of it. >> rose: and cultivate it. yeah, that's it. when we were talking about something else. >> rose: no, no, stay with this. what's the gift? the gift is to what? to do what? ( speaking french ) >> it's to choose to expose oneself and forget oneself and give life, the true meaning of life, inside an inventive character.

and it is, for me, to accept any mysterious, unknown, provocative reactions without trying to understand. you see, the work is not in a construction in the mind. of course, you have to know your lines, you have to know about the script, you have to know about the story. you have to know about the desire of the film director. you have to have a sort of complicity with his world, but then it goes out of control. it comes out. >> rose: of all the characters you have played -- >> yeah. >> rose: -- who are truest to

you? >> none. >> rose: none? no. >> rose: no? not one? how about this one? >> no. >> rose: 100 films and you can't find a character -- >> well, it's a good thing. i'm lucky. can you imagine? i'm not an actress just to look at my navel and try to find out who i am. ( laughter ) who are you, jeanne? wait a minute, i'll find out who i am and give that to the public. i would never allow myself to do a thing like that, no. when you are very young, you start, you burn the stage and it's you, you, you, it's me, me, me, my ego, and i go there, and you have to kick me out of the stage. then the second period, you say, oh, god, what am i doing? all these people watching me. am i good enough?

what i give them, is the food i give them tasty and good? big question. and then there's the third stage. then you let things go through you. it's not you. you discover human nature. it's like i'm a traveler, not on the surface of the earth sometimes, but deep, deep, deep inside human beings i discover the am bi -- am big youty, i act the daggerness and the light. i accept anything. i have to go inside and dig to find pure gold. we use the word "work" so people don't think we're just idle. ( laughter ) >> rose: but is work different for you than it was for picasso?

is work different for you than anyone who does what they do well? >> usually actors and actresses and artists in general are very modest and we say -- >> rose: very modest? yes. >> rose: you think? big egos but very modest. ( laughter ) >> rose: explain that to me. that goes together. >> rose: big egos. and modesty. >> rose: i don't get it. huhue mill -- humility and pride. >> rose: ego is the pride and modesty is the humilitiy. >> when you say ego, the word sounds disgusting. ego the beautiful. you have to have a little just to face the world. it's difficult to live. and you have to have belief in yourself, otherwise you wouldn't be as crazy as to decide that all your life you are going to

portray people that were born in the mind of somebody else. >> rose: and you forgot to go and give -- and you've got to go give life to it in the si cinem. >> yes, you have to be crazy somewhere, but that's what actors and artists are about. we're not just acting. we feed ourselves from everything that happens around us. we feed ourselves with everything. >> rose: you take in from everywhere. >> no, we don't take. we are given. >> rose: but you receive it. we receive. that's it, we receive. >> rose: you look at art and it influences you. >> yeah. >> rose: you have conversations, you see things. >> yes. >> rose: you read, you talk. you know, i'm amazed sometimes, just being an actress -- and not only an actress, i'm a woman who's an actress -- people have conversations with me and they think i only enjoy conversations

about cinema and it bores me to death. >> rose: conversations about cinema? >> but when we talk october, it's different. i know they do that because they think that, you know -- >> rose: actors are one-dimensional. >> exactly. but some actors know a lot about economy, about architecture, about -- i don't know, how to grow oak trees and -- ( speaking french ) >> i work a lot. >> rose: you constantly work. yeah, it's just that these french films are not distributed as they were in the states. there is one i made that has been bought by sony that is going to open here next june, i think, and another french film i

made is going to be shown next fall, yeah. no, i work a lot. >> rose: good for you. you once said that the great grt success you had was your ability to live without any protection. do you know what you meant by that? >> yes. >> rose: what dead you mean by it? >> well, i mean -- >> rose: without a safety net, without security, without what? >> yes. well, i mean, a marriage doesn't suit me, i've never been -- >> rose: why not? i don't know. i've never lived on anybody's money. i've always been responsible for my family, for my close friends. i didn't follow the usual path, you know, trying to stay close to my what is called image. >> rose: yes. your images of rebelliousness,

your images of independence, your images of you, to use an american cliche, you march to your own drummer. >> that's it. >> rose: that is true. i'm the drummer and the drum. >> rose: you're the drummer and drum major. and, therefore, you have chosen to -- >> yes, instinctively, i've chosen to start anew all the time. >> rose: to constantly rejuvenate in a sense and to take risks. >> yeah. >> rose: probably you could have had more stardom if you had chosen to. >> well, my stardom is of a special sort. >> rose: how is it a special sort? >> well, i mean, i'm aside. >> rose: you're aside? yes. >> rose: wheeng i mea -- meanin? i don't belong to any group. i don't know how to explain that. >> rose: try. well, i'm not in the star system.

i have been working now for 45 years, and i have a very special relationship with people in this business, and i'm very lucky, being 65, to work as much as i do and doors are open to me. i'm going to direct any film next june. >> rose: i want to get to that experience and talk about directing. before i get to directing, any great regrets? would you do it pretty much the way you've done it? >> i never think about the past. no, i wouldn't change anything. i don't know. >> rose: yeah. i don't regret anything. >> rose: why directing for you? it gives you an opportunity for a different kind of creative expression? >> of course, and i love actors and actresses. >> and you understand them? i do understand them, and i worked with great people, and i know -- >> rose: what do you understand about actors and actresses that makes you a

better director? >> the secret needs, and i'm not frightened of them. the majority of directors are afraid of actors because they have -- very good directors have a very different image of the film they want to make, and then come the actors they've chosen. >> rose: right. and each actor comes with its own personality, and the director says, oh, god, what is he going to do? oh, she doesn't do it the way i wanted. oh, what am i going to tell her? you know, and there is a different approach, and this approach is to say, okay, i want that. >> rose: yeah. i want these characters to be like that. i want the film to look like that, but i leave the door open to something maybe richer, something new that may be

eschewed from the unexpected, and it can be the mood. it can be -- when you're close to actors, you know exactly when something is wrong. >> what are you making? it's a surprise decoration. it's for the wedding. >> the wedding. oh, lizy. as much as i don't want to see my son married to a woman who dislikes him, it's margaret i'm worried about. >> there won't be a wedding. it's so late. we left it so late. what can we do? >> some things happen only at the last minute. things don't happen before they happen, don't they? >> that makes no sense. but i almost believe you. >> twist. i've noticed all the greatest

directors i've worked with never spoke about the film or the characters on the set, never. >> rose: on the set, they would never talk about it? >> no. >> rose: they would never come over and whisper in your ear, i think -- >> no, i can't remember that. >> rose: of all the directors you have worked with -- >> yeah. >> rose: -- who were you closest to? who did you -- >> well, very funnily, i have been very close to all of them, but in a very different manner because i met at different moments in my life. >> rose: yeah. for example, orson, i met very, very early. >> rose: orson wells. i met him in 1950, and i was at the committee at that time. >> rose: you were the youngest and began there when you were, like, 20 or something, didn't you? >> yeah. i was in awe, and though we were very close, there was no real

intimacy. >> rose: no intimacy? no intimacy, in terms of we were friendly, but i felt like i was a child with orson. >> rose: how old was he, though? he was pretty young at that time. 50? >> i have no idea. >> rose: i don't either. but go ahead. >> and when i met francois, he was six years younger than i and louie was five years younger than i. so the relationship was different each time. and louie, we had a love affair that lasted more than three years. so that was another sort of relationship. >> rose: how does that work when he's directing you? is it good for -- >> it was very good. we loved one another because of our work, and working together we discovered that -- i mean, that we had talent, both of us, and that we were aiming towards

the same ambitions. >> rose: but does a personal intimacy, a sexual and emotional intimacy help as an actress to -- with a director, help an actress to make a difference in your performance, you think? >> well, to me, we never said anything to one another as anyone knew of our relationship. when we were on the set, it was totally different. i didn't use that personal relationship, and he didn't either. it's difficult to explain. but when i started with louie it was a little before the wave. and then francois. and then i worked with orson wells, joe losi. i was beyond the new wave. i was attracted and i attracted

the artists, the mavericks, and i still do. >> rose: if you were not an actress-director, what might you have been? >> a cook. >> rose: a cook. can you cook well? >> i am a very good cook. really. >> rose: really? yeah. >> rose: and you like to have lots of people over and cook for them. >> yes, every weekend. >> rose: is that food an erotic experience? >> it's spiritual. >> rose: spiritual. and erotic at the same time, you might say. it's a sort of alchemy. because you take things just as they are and then comes out something very, very special. >> rose: yeah. once it's cooked. >> rose: do you spend hours in the kitchen. >> i do on fridays and saturdays. >> rose: and sunday lunch maybe. >> no, because everything is ready. and i love to set the table and rose: now, take me to ahings

perfect -- if i was coming to paris -- >> yes. >> rose: -- and you wand to have dinner for me. >> yes. >> rose: let's assuming we were old friends and you wanted to have dinner, but you wanted to have a perfect dinner both in terms of the food and who you would want at the table -- >> oh, just you. ( laughter ) ♪ ♪ ( laughter ) ( singing in french ) ♪ ♪ ( speaking in (ch )

>> life is a lesson. >> rose: an ongoing lesson. an ongoing lesson. and once you've gone through the first obstacle, there's always another one afterwards. it's a drive, so many people to discover and so many things to do. i am in the beautiful period of harvest. >> rose: harvesting from all the life you have lived. >> yes. >> rose: all the seeds you've planted. >> yes, it's very enjoyable. this incredible devotion to youth, it's beautiful to be young, but life passes by. everybody can't kill themselves around 30, come on. ( laughter ) >> rose: is it beautiful to be old? >> it is. it is beautiful to be alive. stop talking about young and old. stop being afraid of death. that's the big problem. >> rose: stop being afraid of the process. >> yes. >> rose: of living.

of life. >> rose: of life. of life. >> rose: jeanne moreau, dead at 89. >> rose: for more about this program and earlier episodes, visit us online at pbs.org and charlierose.com. captioning sponsored by rose communications captioned by media access group at wgbh access.wgbh.org

>> rose: funding for "charlie rose" has been provided by: >> and by bloomberg, a provider of multimedia news and information services worldwide.

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