stay right where you are. >> we are back. [ applause ] and we're, uh, here with us tonight is, uh, charles finley, owner of the oakland a's. we have george peppard, charles callas, and dr. jeffrey bourne. charles, let's get into this controversy a little bit. uh, what's going on in baseball. now, you have three ball players, uh, joe rudi, and rollie fingers, which you sold, and as i understand, they are-- they are working out their option on the time. this is their last year, right? >> well, supposedly, yeah. >> supposedly, yeah, and under the-- under the-- >> as a matter of fact, they haven't signed. >> right, and under the rules of that, if a ball player exercises

he becomes a free agent, and is able to sell his services to the highest bidder. >> right, right. >> now, what you did is that you sold them to the new york yankees, or to different teams, right? these three players, for a total of one point-- whatever-- >> a total-- for a total of three and a half million. >> three and a half million dollars. now, the commissioner of baseball calls you into his office, and i understand you had a meeting, and he says, uh, he was going to veto that in the best interest of baseball, and protect the honor of the game, right? >> that's what he told me. >> i may be paraphrasing his words, but-- >> no, no, that's what he told me. >> now, why did he-- why did he stop the sale? >> well, you know, john, uh, it's pretty hard for me to, uh, figure that out. as a matter of fact, uh, i'm just anxious-- anxiously awaiting the time when he will tell it to the judge why he stopped it. >> oh, i see. that's right. you did file a ten million dollar lawsuit. now-- [ applause ] i think what concerns a lot of people, and some of this has been in the press,

that the professional team owners can buy and sale baseball players like-like cattle or chattel slaves, or so forth, and that the players should be free to, uh, to make their own deals, and should not be held-- in other words, bartered like cattle. how do you-- how do you feel about that? >> well, johnny, you know, ever since the history of the game, uh, players have been bought and sold. you go back to the days when babe ruth was sold from boston to the yankees. uh, uh, i recall dean, when he sold to the cubs, uh, for 185 thousand dollars. uh, 1934, joe cronin was sold to the boston red sox from washington. >> right. >> and at that time, he was sold for 250 thousand dollars. that 250 thousand dollars in 1954-- i mean, 1934 is worth one million, forty thousand dollars today. >> right. >> and there's, uh, ferguson chickens was sold for two hundred thousand dollars, uh, recently. november, 1975, commissioner

a little later on, minnesota twins sold, uh, another player to texas for two hundred and fifty thousand dollars, uh, and just last year, the, uh, uh, the san francisco giants sold dave kindman to the new york mets, who, incidentally-- for 160 thousand dollars. >> right. >> who incidentally is leading the major leagues with 26 home runs today. did the commissioner say anything about that? nothing at all. at let me take you one step further. in 1971, the oakland a's, if you please, paid the then washington senators three hundred thousand dollars for darold knowles and mike epstein. did the commissioner do anything about that? no. but when i sell three players myself, and, uh, for business reasons, plus the fact that i was gonna take that money and end up with a much stronger team by purchasing these some 52 ball players who are playing out their options right now.

team in 1977 than i had start in 1976. as it stands right now, i'm gonna have nothing. >> so these players are not playing for anyone right now, right? >> well, they're playing for the a's, but i-i don't think that it's my property. the commissioner forced me to use these players after i sold them. >> so they are playing for-- >> yes, sir. >> now, what will happen at the end of the, uh, the end of the season? now is the up to they, uh, up to the courts, is it? >> well, it's-it's in the hands of the court, the federal court, uh, in chicago, and, uh, uh, we're very optimistic over our chances of winning this lawsuit. i might say that bowie kuhn is been the fifth commissioner in baseball, and never in the history of the game of baseball has a commissioner ever stepped in to stop a sale of a ball player. and why he stopped this one, as i say, let him tell it to the judge. >> yeah, you think it could be a personal vendetta? >> well, uh, yes, i really do. i'm sorry to say, john.

>> and it's quite unfortunate. uh, we had, uh-- i was fined one time in the world series in 1973, when we were playing the new york, uh, mets. we took a player that the doctor said, "don't play him," by the name of mike andrews. >> i remember that. >> and the only thing i did was give the letter to the commissioner of baseball. where the doctor said, "don't play mike andrews." he's physically unable to play anymore in the series. >> i remember that. >> "if you use him, you'll hurt him." i handed him that letter, and would you believe it, he fined me five thousand dollars, just because a doctor examined mike andrews and said that he was physically unable to play. and during that same world series, i was fined another two thousand dollars because it got so dark out there the, uh, empire forgot to turn the lights on, and i-i totally-- sent word up to the electrician to turn the lights on, and when i did, the umpire jumped up like he'd been shocked. when the light's back off again. so i was fined $2,000 for that,

of the season, baseball changed their rules to where the lights can be turned on at any time, not at the end of an inning. so i got fined $2,000 for that. and in the same world series, get fined another $1,000 because-- we only used 24 players, and i wanted to make an announcement to the fans that we were playing with 24, and the mets had 25. so i got fined $1,000 for making the announcement. >> you know, you better-- [ laughter ] you better-- charles, you better win this lawsuit, just to pay your fines. [ laughter ] i mean, it just keeps up like this. >> well, let me-- >> how do you-- go ahead now. >> i'd just like to add one other thing, too. talking about the commissioner having a personal vendetta. i don't like to sit here and make these accusations, but you asked me a question, johnny, and, uh-- i'm a little forthright, you know? >> yup. [ laughter ] >> at one time, reggie jackson, several years back in his career, when he was having trouble with his timing, i was gonna send him down to triple-a, just for ten days.

commissioner kuhn gets in touch with me, and he says "hey, you can't send him down." he said he read it in the paper that i was possibly gonna send him down. he says, "you can't send him down. it won't be in the best interests of baseball." so i told him off, and after telling him off, >> fined $500. [ laughter ] make a guess that you were fined for that. i don't know why. how do you answer some of the questions-- and then the press brings it up occasionally, they say that, uh-- only the very rich-- in other words, you could buy a pennant. one town could go out, or an owner who's very, very wealthy, and buy all of the best players, and therefore, because of their-- better financial position, could cripple the other teams. is there any validity to that at all? >> no john, i don't think so. i think that's all here say, because tom yawkey, who has-- i don't know of anyone who's more wealthy in baseball than tom yawkey. he's been in there about 40 years, and he's been trying to buy a world championship for all

successful in doing it. uh-- this is a commercial, saying that i was breaking up my team. in reality, all i was doing was making it stronger, for the start of 1977. it's awfully hard to go out and buy ballplayers. the competition is just too tough. >> you think that the salaries are getting exorbitant, or out of line? because it's really not the players that set the salaries, is it? when you come right down to it. it's the law of supply and demand. i suppose the superstars, they can command x number of dollars, and if they bring those people into the ballpark, um-- >> johnny, really, the reason for these-- in my opinion-- astronomical, unjustified salaries for athletes today-- it's not-- it's not the athletes, believe me. [ chuckling ] that go out and offer that kind of money. >> well, you're an owner. >> yes i am, but i don't go out throwing my money down the drain like some of the others do, because in the first place, i can't afford it. in the second place, if i did have the money, i think i'd be

down the drain that way. >> are the oakland a's making money? >> uh, well let me put it this way-- >> how long have you had the a's now? >> uh, this is my 16th year, and i'm happy to tell you that in the 16 years that i've owned the club, we spend a lot of money to produce championship teams. we haven't made any big money, but by spending our money wisely, if i may put it that way, we've been able to stay in the black. not very much, but we're in the black, and we hope we can stay in the black. >> good. all right, we have a couple more questions. we'll do this first,

[ applause ] [ applause ] >> we are back. i always wanna-- before we bring george peppard out, i just wanna get one thing clear in my mind. at the end of the year, these ballplayers could leave your club and be open to open bidding anyway, right? in other words, you could lose them if you did not pay the salary that they requested. >> that is correct. >> in other words, if rollie fingers said, "i want a million dollars," you would say,

to another club, right? >> it's that simple. he can go out and sell his services to another club. >> so really, what you're doing, in effect, is-- selling him before-- not knowing whether you'll have him or not, right? >> that's-- it's that simple. >> right. so, this-- you hope this goes to court, i assume, so that there will be a definite decision made on whether the owners have that right? or-- >> johnny, we're going to court, and it's scheduled to-- in federal court to-- first week in august. >> well, i-- i hope you come back and report, and we'll probably read it-- but i'd like to get your version anyway. incidentally, can you be fined for being on this show tonight? [ laughter ] i'd like you to do something where you wouldn't be fined. >> johnny, i probably will be. [ laughter ] >> we'll take it to court, and i'll fight it. it's fascinating. stay with us tonight, will ya? i'd like you to meet the rest of the people. george peppard is here tonight. currently he's working on a film called damnation alley. and i think he just was-- wound up on the set to be with us tonight. would you welcome george peppard. george? [ applause ]

[ applause ] >> hello, george. >> we have our birthday boy with us. >> yeah, doc-doc's birthday today. >> yes-yes. >> you a baseball fan? >> uh, yes-yes. >> you follow this, uh, you follow this discussion at all? >> i'm, um-- yes, indeed. i was watching very carefully, and, uh-uh, there were temptations when you were getting to the, uh, red balls there. >> orange. orange. >> orange, uh, but i resisted them. >> i-i-i'm glad you did. >> because we haven't used those in show business in years. >> what do you mean? >> well, it actually, in the kind of picture i'm working on now, it's kind of a science fiction thing. >> right. >> and, uh-- >> you use orange baseballs in the picture? >> well, no, but orange-- different kind of colors. it's just kind of obvious that your eye shoots right to the, uh, dif-different color-colored object, and yeah, i think it's a great idea. >> thank you, thank you, thank you. [ applause ] >> you didn't have this little,

were here, did ya? >> no-no-no, actually-- >> is that for the-- i assume that's for the picture. i can't imagine you growing that to-to look good. [ laughter ] oh, i do this to him all the time. >> no-no, i do know john, and it's nice to be back on a quality show. [ laughter ] but sometimes i wake up at night and i think, "somebody's been putting hair on my upper lip." i-i g-grew it for a part in a picture, and personally it's not, uh, something i enjoy, but the character enjoys it. >> well, why don't you-you put on the pasty? >> well, because every time you smile it goes "pop", you know, and it looks funny. >> it take away from the legitimacy of the picture, doesn't it, when you smile and it curls up? [ laughter ] >> well, they can always re shoot it, but you know, if-if you put on a-on a regular paste on mustache and you go like this, the whole thing goes... you can't do it. >> i was just recalling now, i did for a brief time on broadway, "tunnel of love", years ago, replacing tom yule.

first scene, and then later on he pretended to shave it off, and as you did it with an electric razor you peeled it off. and i remember once during the first half of the thing, it started-- the perspiration got under the glue and it started to curl. and it's the worst feeling in the world because at least in a movie you can stop and paste it back, but in a live show you feel like an idiot going around and you see this thing and it's going flick, and you hear the little titters from the audience going... [ snickering ] and there's nothing you can do, and you're going, "my dear!" and it's-- so, that's why you grow the real one? >> i guess you kind of find ways to push it and-- >> what do you play in this picture to have to have the mustache? >> well, um-- >> you almost look like a storm trooper a little bit. >> thanks. thanks, john. i thought i looked more like william faulkner, or something. >> well, that's true. >> um, but, uh, well, the character is a military man. yeah, and he's, uh, a major. >> on our side? >> yes. >> okay, good. >> oh, absolutely. he's a-- as a matter of fact, he's a major in, uh, the missile silo when the picture starts. from there on it goes into science fiction.

fella that just does everything straight down the line. >> have you ever been in one of those missile silos? >> no, i saw some film on it. >> they're fascinating, i guess. >> have you? >> no, i haven't. i guess they don't take civilians through them, but i've seen pictures of them. >> well, actually our-our people did get down, uh, to see a lot of it, and it's, uh, it's very interesting because you have to have two people and they are both armed. >> yeah, they did a documentary one night, and if one goes bananas they have instruction to shoot the other person, do they not? >> yeah, they both carry pistols. >> that's gotta be a wonderful tour of duty. sitting down there looking at each other for eight hours a day wondering if the other guy's gonna do ya in. >> well, that-- what they is they run ya in through these-- they run through these drills all the time. they run them right down to where they have to-- they go up and take the keys out of a box and put them in locks, and they both have to turn them at the same time. >> they each have a different key, right? >> yeah, and they have to double check everything. and that's just to see-- nobody can go bananas. >> what was the movie though where something did go bananas though? "7 days"? no, that was another one. >> well, as a matter of fact, that's in our picture--

>> well, it was a very-- damn near impossible to do. at any rate, the picture starts there and from there on we go across country through this alley from new mexico to albany. do you ever play albany? >> what do you mean, did i-- did i ever work there? >> did you ever work in albany? >> no. >> no? well, neither did i. [ laughter ] but the whole idea of going to albany in show business. >> would i like albany? i mean... >> i don't know, john, but in our picture we're starting in new mexico and-- >> have you ever played in mexico? >> yes-yes, i've played in new mexico. no, not mexico. >> i see. >> anyway, uh, major denton, i figured had a mustache. >> oh, major denton? >> that is my character, and i-i made him a southern, uh, officer. >> did you do the southern, uh-- >> do i do a southern accent, john? yes, i do. and, uh, jan-michael vincent plays the other officer and we disagree-- >> what's-what's the southern accent like? >> john, i just did the southern

you weren't listening yet. >> oh, i didn't hear it. >> i see, well, you're not listening again. >> if i said, "major denton, are the silos ready?" how would you-- how would you answer that? >> yes, sir. [ laughter ] [ applause ] >> four years in acting class for, "yes, sir." [ laughter ] "yes, sir," i mean... >> and another three years at strausberg. [ laughter ] >> okay-okay, well, anyway, you're on the way-- >> you do a southern accent. >> "yes, sir." [ laughter ] >> you know what? no, it's a little heavy on the "sir." >> "welcome to our little plantation here." >> yeah? >> "the magnolia-- >> "oh, my god, they are." >> "do the name ruby begonia mean anything to ya?" no, uh, getting off the subject now. >> no, this is a little more subtle than that, john. >> all right. don't tell me how the picture comes out. >> i won't, no. >> i have to sell something, i'm getting a message from brenda. >> that's a victory message. [ laughter ] >> excuse me.

but first a message from johnson wax, makers of fine products

[ cheering ] [ music ] [ applause ] >> we are back. it wasn't my idea to hit you in the head with a baseball. >> no, that's quite all right, john. i'm much better now. [ laughter ] no, you know, every time i come on your show, i'm getting ready and i'm in the dressing room and i put on my clothes and i look in the mirror, and i think, "boy, you look weird. you really look weird." the last time i was on here i had long hair. >> yeah, but you dropped some weight since the last time you were here. >> 22 pounds, but that doesn't really matter because, you know, i'm used to going on a stage as somebody else. >> i see what you mean, as a character. >> i don't-i don't sing or dance, or whatever, and about the only time i ever do anything is on your show or somebody else's, and that's not that often. >> aren't you happy when you look in the mirror with what you see? >> no, i look in the mirror and i think, "boy, he looks weird. who is that?" and i think, "oh, that's george peppard." and i think, "oh"-- >> can i have your autograph?

>> no, but it's different because, you know, i'm looking-i'm looking at a character mustache that i wouldn't wear. if i had a mustached i'd have a little-- kind of a-- i'd spruce it up a little bit. >> one of those jobs? >> well, not necessarily, but something. uh, and i'm looking at the character, except now that i'm not the character and there i am just kind of standing there. so, i always kind of feel a little weird. >> wouldn't he look great in movies? >> yes, i was looking at him, you know, he-he's almost as gray as we are. >> he looks like a dressed extra. one of those distinguished gentlemen you see, uh, at the p-parties always. right? >> well, i don't know. do you come from the south? >> i was born and raised in the south, george. i-i caught that when i was listening to you. >> that's right. >> i don't know anything worse than an irishman from the south. [ laughter ] no wonder he's so famous a-a-as a rebel. >> yeah. h-how'd you drop 22 pounds? did you want to? >> uh, yes, i wanted to. >> you went on some diet, or... >> what? well, i did the best i could. two steps forward, one step back. a lot of jogging. i played a lot of tennis for a while.

carson. oh, i was a tiger, ha-ha. i haven't played in weeks now. now you'll call me. >> yeah. but did you just-- did you cut back on the calories? >> yeah, vegetables and meat, and finally i got into a fish diet. i found that fish is really a-- >> everyday you mean? >> yeah, everyday. and you feel a lot better. i mean, i'm not a food faddist. i mean, the people that say they went to vegetarian i really can't understand it. without a piece of steak or chicken, or something. but-- >> you can go to extremes. >> yeah, but when people say they went on to a vegetable diet, their whole vibration, or whatever, changes, and, uh, i found that eating fish, which i like. i mean, shrimp and all kinds >> well, you're lookin' super. >> thank you. >> is the picture soon to be over so you can shave that off? >> well, listen, i would like to say one thing about this picture because it's an unusual occurrence. >> oh, i get it, i interrupted you. you were on your way to new mexico and i-- >> no, it's not that, it's not to tell a story of the picture. it's just that most the time

>> either the dishes, or what? [ laughter ] >> it's hot in here. i'm hot. >> oh, goodness. i thought maybe you thought your-- i thought maybe you thought you were on your o-old show and they were gonna operate or something. you know how you get caught up in the character? >> no, but you know, when you're-when you're-when you're on a picture, normally, you either make a good picture, or you have a good time. it seems like you get one or the other. >> yeah. >> and this is one of those rare occurrences which i think we're doing both. >> having a good time and making a good picture? >> yeah, but it's a-it's an entertaining, fun picture and things are working out right. we've got jack smight, who dir-just directed, um, "midway" and "airport 2" and several others. i have known him for a long time. a wonderful man who keeps a happy set. >> yes, happy set is a-- >> oh, well. >> happy times. >> well... now, are you still awake, john? >> sure. sure, i'm awake. >> okay. >> when-when-when would one if one wants to see this picture, when would one might see it? >> oh, god knows, i don't know when they're gonna put it out. i mean-- >> well, he gets in for nothing,

[ laughter ] [ applause ] whenever it comes out. okay. we'll, uh-- you're a cute devil with that mustache, really. we'll, uh-- >> no more baseball. >> well, yes, sir. yes, sir. four years in strausberg. can you juggle? >> no, not really. do you do it? >> sure. >> go 'head. >> oh, sure. you ever learn to juggle? >> there's two. >> two? anybody can do two. every actor should learn how to juggle. you see, because it's-- >> hey-hey! [ cheering ] [ applause ]

long, but you should juggle. [ music ] >> you were speaking of science fiction and speaking of science fiction brings to mind charlie callas. if-- charlie definitely comes from some other planet. he's a very funny man. he's in the new mel brooks film called "silent movie". he's a regular on the tv series

the 17th. he opens at the hilton hotel in las vegas. would you welcome crazy charles callas? [ music ] [ applause ] >> good evening, and welcome. [ laughter ] i'd like to sing a little song if i may. collin. [ music ] straighten up and fly right-- eh, that's enough. good evening. [ applause ] the, uh, the olympics are going to be held in montreal, canada. this is some-- ah, canada. and i'm going to enter. i am going as a dot. [ laughter ] i am going to enter the, uh, the decathlon. decathlon are ten events,