>> o'donnell: this is "face the nation." breaking news overnight as terror group isis continues its sweep through iraq. plus sect of state john kerry arrives on diplomatic solution to the crisis. over the weekend tens of thousands of shia militia marched in cities in show of force against isis. is the civil war inevitable. i sat down with president obama asked him about threat posed. >> what we can't do think that we're going to play whack-a-mole send u.s. troops occupying. >> o'donnell: we'll have that plus hear from marco rubio. the chairman of the house intelligence committee mike rogers and california democratic senator barbara boxer.

60 years of use because this is "face the nation." captioning sponsored by cbs good morning go bob is off today there is breaking news this morning as al qaeda splinter group isis has sieged lead more towns. that is in to the town on syrian board cher they took yesterday mutt fighting continues at major oil refinery in baji, cbs news clarissa ward is in baghdad, what is the latest there? >> that's right. isis militants have taken three towns along the euphrates river in the west of the country as well as that keyboarder station, that will allow them toe move weapons and fighters easily and quickly back and forth from their base of operations in syria to here in iraq. now what we're seeing is that isis is expanding its territory and actually beating the iraqi army on multiple fronts that gives you sense of how fierce a

fighting force isis and how weak the iraqi army is. >> given the territorial gains what is the government plan to take that territory back? >> well, at this stage iraqi army isn't in position to take back any territory. their focus to try to defend baghdad, the capital and also city of somara which is home to very say credit shrine. government strategy to try to woo some of the other sunni hill grant groups that have been fighting along side isis which don't share their extremist ideology. that could be very complex and very time consuming process, quite frankly not clear whether prime minister malaki will be able to pull that off. and time really is of the essence here. for two reasons. firstly longer isis holds that territory the but secondly with every victory that isis has on the battlefield is pro file being raised on the jihaddist

circuit you have now fighters flooding in as isis continues to gain momentum. >> meantime malaki government is relying on shia militia, what's their role? >> that's right. just yesterday we saw tens of thousands of members of the army militia marching with heavy weaponry in massive display of force. their stated goal to destroy ices but their remobilization opens up a lot of old sectarian wounds especially here in baghdad. everybody here remembers the sectarian violence of 2006 and 2007 where death squads were terrifying this city. nobody wants to see turn to that bloody time. >> o'donnell: indeed. great reporting clark russ seaward from baghdad. thank you. on diplomatic front arrived in the mid east, margaret brennan is with the secretary in cairo, good morning.

>> good morning. cairo is secretary kerry's first stop on week long diplomatic push to try to stabilize iraq. in his meetings with newly elected president and form army chief, kerry said, isis poses threat to this entire region. and asked egypt to use its influence in baghdad to quickly form a new iraqi government. one that gets support from local tribal leaders. expect to make this same pitch to other arab leaders from saudi arabia and emirates this week, u.s. officials tell me kerry will lien on them to help cut off funding to isis, private donations from the gulf along with extortion and robbery is how isis remains so well funded. those meeting will be intense, largely sunni gulf states are deeply step particular call. many think that mall key should leave offers so u.s. has

publicly stopped short of saying so. consider re's next stop is jordan, where long warned that spilloffer from the syrian ward can lead to the rise of terror groups that can threaten to destabilize the entire middle east. >> o'donnell: margaret brennan traveling with the secretary. thank you. on friday i sat down with president obama in the blue room at the white house, in an interview for cbs this morning. we talked about the situation in iraq. isis is a group that is so extreme it has been disavowed by al qaeda as being too violent. how urgent of a threat to the american people is isis? >> i think it's fairest to say that their extreme ideology poses a medium and long-term threat. there are a lot of groups out there that probably have more advanced, immediate plans directed against the united states that we have to be constant guard for. the thing organization like this

typically when they control territory because they're so violent because they're so extreme over time the local populations reject them. we've seen that time and time again. we saw it during the iraq war in places like onbar province where the tribes turn turned against them because of their extreme ideology. we have to be vigilant generally. right now the problem with isis is the fact that they are destabilizing a country that could spill over in to some of our allies like jordan. and that they are engaged in wars in syria where in that vacuum that's been created they could amass more arms, more resources but i think it's important for us to recognize that isis is just one of a number of organizations that we have to stay focused on,

al qaeda and yemen is still very active we're staying focused on that. in north africa organizations including boka ahram that kidnapped those young women that is extreme and violent. this is going to be a global challenge and one that the united states will have to address but not be able to address it alone. as i said yesterday what we can't do is think we're going to play whack-a-mole send u.s. troops occupying wherever they are. a more folk ised, more targeted strategy have to partner and train local law enforcement and military to do their jobs as well. >> o'donnell: with that vacuum exist had we backed moderate rebel forces in syria? >> yes. i think this notion that somehow there is ready made, moderate syrian force that was able to defeat assad is simply not true.

the notion that they were in a position suddenly to overturn not only sea sad but also ruthless highly trained jihaddists if we just sent few arms is a fantasy. >> o'donnell: there will be more of my interview with the president tomorrow on "cbs this morning." i also spoke with florida republican senator marco rubio asked him about the threat posed by isis militants? >> more dangerous today than al qaeda. they are extremely radical group with increasing capabilities and very clear design they want to establish islamic state and sections of both syria and iraq, potentially jordan is next. then they want to launch attacks in the exterior. external operations including targeting our homeland. a serious risk for the country if they were to establish that safe haven of operation. >> o'donnell: i know you had said that what is happening in

iraq has a direct bear can on the future security of every american. how so? >> well, if you look at what happened before known the reason why al qaeda was able to carry out they had safe operating space inversion that the taliban had given them. now history is trying to repeat itself here. isis is trying to establish the exact same thing in the iraq-syria region that they're controlling. then will continue to recruit and train and plot and plan eventually carry out external operations in europe and potentially even here in the united states. this is a very serious national security risk for the immediate and long term. >> o'donnell: do you believe our future involvement in iraq is direct threat to our national security? >> without a doubt. this is an urgent counter terrorism matter. a lot has been talked about the future of iraq as country that is very legitimate issue. this is note bout nation

building or imposing democracy this is towner terrorism -- counter terrorism risk. we'll deal with isis now or deal with them later. later they're going to be stronger and harder toe reach. >> o'donnell: given this is direct throat to u.s. national security and urgent threat what should this administration be doing? >> i do not believe, i certainly hope that what he's announced with the 300 additional special forces and trainers going in is not symbolic measure, i hope first step in multi-step process that i think we need to figure out way to cut to have those fly lines from syria in to iraq, we may have to target their command and control structure that they have established including portions of syria in the meantime this also calls for us to continue to empower those moderate rebel forces in syria who are engaged in conflict against is six, not just assad we need to provide more assistance for security and their border because i think this poses risk to jordan down the road, one that we should

take very seriously. >> o'donnell: i've been talking to a number of u.s. officials and foreign officials who say that there is a danger in launching airstrikes before a political solution is reached. essentially new government without prime minister malaki. would you agree with that 1234 pgh (by mr. 123 ) i think has to be balanced. airstrikes don't leave chaos to be even worse. on the other hand you have to keep close eye on the situation because if it continues on the trends we've seen there may be no reason to launch strike. this point they controlled the whole country. the danger of baghdad now is in different oil refineries are in. capture weapons that the iraqis had. make these gains on the pace it's going to require urgent action to prevent them from establishing control over large sectors of this country. >> o'donnell: trying to clarify -- >> what they seek. >> o'donnell: what is the

urgent action that you're suggesting? >> the urgent action to draw up plans that allow us to begin to degrade their supply line, their ability to continue to move forward. >> o'donnell: with airstrikes. >> that border between iraq and syria is quite porous. they're coming right across bringing equipment through there, personnel through there it's not the only border that they're utilizing but primary one. go to figure out way to isolate isis from syria and iraq then i'd leave rest toe military tactics. >> o'donnell: your come league rand paul raised the question, what would airstrikes accomplish that in essence they would become iran's air force by aiding them. your take? >> i don't agree with that statement. the truth of the matter is, we do nothing iran will still be involved. if you think about it imagine if iran goes in there becomes involved somehow helps the iraqis turn back isis you can

rest assured future iraqi government will be completely, 100% under the influence and in the pocket of iran. they will have expanded their strategic reach to include practical controls not just over syria if assad survives but over iraq. increasingly positioning themselves as a power. the united states has different pope for iraqis future it belongs to them but out hope as country that includes kurds and sunni and shia even christians and inclusive countries, that is not iran's goal here. to do nothing allow isis to establish a base of operation like what al qaeda had before afghanistan places us in a very dangerous position from a counter terrorism point of view and pits americans' lives on the line down the road. >> o'donnell: i hear you saying that we can't do nothing. but what i'm not hearing from you is what we should be doing, have more boots on the ground, whether we should do airstrikes, i'm hear cutting off supply lines, what else? >> i think that we should cut off isis' access to their

command and control structure in sear california i think primarily that involves air power. i don't think the president should do unilaterally announce these are the things i'm not going to do. he may in fact conclude, i think many people would agree that the introduction of ground troops and cam bat operations on the ground are not wise or necessary. i happen to share that view based on the information that i have today. but i don't necessarily think you need to go out and announce that and limit your options. >> o'donnell: do you think prime minister malaki should step down? >> that's a tough question. the question is what replaces him. i don't think he's been a good prime minister. i believe that many of the problems that now faces are direct result of failure of his leadership. and i think that is the time may very well be arriving when she step aside allow someone whole can help unify the country to take hold there. i think if you start to extrapolate this out further you alluded to one of your earlier questions, imagine for a moment able to push isis back given

combination of air power and what the iraqis do on the ground you need government that can govern and bring the country together. i don't believe malaki can do that. >> o'donnell: good to see you, thank you for joining us. >> thank you. >> o'donnell: another key republican is house intelligence committee chairman mike rogers. congressman, good to see you. >> thanks for having me. >> o'donnell: would have haired this morning breaking news that now four towns have fallen in two days to isis. hue troublesome is this? >> it's incredibly trouble? an interesting trend you have al qaeda-minded isis group joined biformer saddam soldiers and leaders and disenfranchised sunni tribal leaders, that is the combination that allowed them to be so successful. and it is troubling because they have safe haven both in southeastern -- eastern syrian where they pooled up for months and years, to get ready for this. before they launched this attack now they're holding large parts

of land that gives them that opportunity for safe haven to continue to recruit, to continue to finance. >> o'donnell: you heard senator rubio talk about cutting offer the supply lines. but one of the cities that they seized, right there on the border they now control most of the iraq-syria border. the supply lines are open. >> we saw this happening, that is what was so frustrating we saw them pool in eastern syria in a way we've never seen before. thousands and thousands of al qaeda affiliated individuals, there has been some scaping between the isis or isil they want to have everything from lebanon, jordan, iraq and syria, by the way, which is important to understand. we saw that happening, they are using that as base of operations, they also have opportunities to do that around iraq that's what makes them so dangerous. >> o'donnell: secretary ever state john kerry has just landed in egypt. his next stop is jordan.

what is his goal on this trip? what must he do? >> well, we've got to reestablish our relationship with our arab partners. it's damaged as i've ever seen it. no decision is a decision, they have watched what's happened in syria been talking to us and u.s. government for months and months about please help us do something effective in syria or we're going to have much bigger problem. >> he's meeting with the leaders of jordan and the uaa and saudi arabia, sunni-led government. that can be perhaps influential do they have any influence over isis? >> remember, isis is as much a threat to their governments as it is to the shia-led malaki government. that is why they have been calling -- remember the decision not to be more robust in syria is easy to do because i don't think people understood the sheer size of pooling of the al qaeda elements in the east. so when we walked away from that, our arab league partners

are as frustrated and nervous about what happens next. remember, not making a decision to deal with them earlier has got us a bigger problem. hold land about the size of indiana. we can reengage them to help us. i think they can do both. >> o'donnell: you are chairman of the house intelligence commit tie what the president said to me when i asked how big of threat is isis to america's national security. he said it's a need yum and long-term threat. we can't just play whack-a-mole with all these different terrorist groups. >> unfortunately, it's easy to diminish the threat. what we know happens as we watched happened in afghanistan think don't safe haven, they tray, recruit, plan operations that led to 9/11 to killing of 3,000 americans. they have already expressed this is what got them in trouble with the leader of al qaeda and replacement for osama bin laden not only brutal but talking taking people with western

passports sending them back home for terrorist operations from eastern syria. that is what got him worked up over this group. they weren't taking direction very well. not that their goals were any different, here you have a group, think of this, a billion dollars in cash and bouillon, well armed, well financed, they have lots of free space which to operate, train, we know that they have intentions to send people who have shown up with western passports back to the united states and back to europe. that is as dangerous as it gets. now is it six months, three months or a year we're not sure. but i wouldn't wait. it's not whack-a-mole this is in our national security interests. bumper sticker phrases aren't going to win this thing. we got to be dug in for the long haul because they're dug in for the long haul. >> o'donnell: chairman rogers you'll be back later. up next, we'll hear from top democrat. stay with us. i make a lot of purchases for my business.

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h. >> o'donnell: bark now with barbara boxer from california one of the most vocal opponent of the war in iraq. senator, thank you for joining us. you have heard the reports this morning that isis is on the move capturing more towns, is sending 300 military advisors going to be enough? >> i agree with the president. we're not going to go back in to that war again. ever. the fact is what we're seeing now is an out growth -- on false pretense that said, go in there. and as a result isis was born. let's face that fact. then in '07 when vice president biden then senator biden i was on the foreign relations committee he was my chairman suggest we have three autonomous regions, bush administration and others said, absolutely not. even had more than 70 votes for that. as a result we have malaki who

hasn't included the sunni, isis moved in to fill the void. let's be clear on this. now they're turning in to a religious civil war. as far as i'm concerned, the advisors there as far as i know are there to really give an assessment of what's happening on the ground. that's very important for us. and also they have counter terrorism mission which i voted for after 9/11 we need to go after the terrorists who are a threat to us. >> o'donnell: critics argue that the president has helped isis by omission. but by not acting in syria, that is six, was strong enough then to cross the border in to iraq this is the result. >> it's the opposite. the hawks are saying, arm syria, the president knew that isis was in syria didn't want them to get control of the weapons that's just completely false. will say the big surprise that the president would admit to, i think is a fact is, the iraqi

army that we spent $23 billion training just melted away in the face of just hundreds of isis. we have a national security interest here i agree with senator rubio i agree with -- and president of the united states, no combat counter terrorism mission is critical to us. and therefore, as long is as those advisors are not in harm's way, and they are not in harm's way, they can assess the situation and we can conduct counter terrorism that's the key. the iraqi people have chance of a lifetime, i didn't vote to send those -- for that war, one of my proudest moments only 23 of us in the united states senate it was based on false pretense. we unleashed horror that we're seeing today, but the bottom line is we do have counter terrorism mix i support that mission. >> o'donnell: vice president cheney said, where we have

president been so wrong about so much at the expense ever so many. >> that is sick when you really look back at the record. it was vice president cheney and condi rice working for george w. bush and rumsfeld all those folks just like, you know, a nightmare come back to haunt me gist frankly who are basically telling us, get right back in there again. the american people don't want it, the president doesn't want it, the same in the senate and house. we do have a national security interest in preventing another 9/11. iraqis had their chance. they blew it i think right now they have got to figure out if they can form an inclusive government. >> o'donnell: good to have you here, senator barbara boxer. we'll be right back.

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>> o'donnell: some of our stations are leaving us now most of you we'll be right back with a lot more "face the nation."

>> o'donnell: well kelp back to "face the nation." john kerry has justinished news conference in cairo and he, too, talked about the danger of isis or isil as secretary kerry refers toot terror group. >> united states would like to see the iraqi people find leadership that is prepared toe represent all of the people of iraq. that is prepared to be inclusive and share power in a way that will maximize the ability of iraq to focus on the real danger at this moment for external source which is isil. isil is a threat to all of the countries in the region. even today in our conversation with the foreign minister both expressed deep concerns about

the impact of a group like isil and what it means to the region. no country is safe for that kind of spread of terror. >> o'donnell: house intelligence committee mike wrongers is back along with mike morell who is also the former deputy director of the cia it's great to have both of you who are so much involved in intelligence to talk about this. mike, first talk about the breaking news this morning that now isis or isil has captured four towns in the last two days. they're on the move. >> i think we're in a new phase here. i think that blitzkrieg that we saw towards bag cad has stopped and consolidating their position back in the west. that's what we're seeing now. just as worrisome, i don't want to down play that, i think on different focus than they were when they were heading towards

baghdad. >> o'donnell: dive in to who isis or isil is. the leader, earl baghdadi which became isis i keep -- this man right here, is so violent, so extreme that he was essentially ex communicated by al zawari. >> real briefly, when they're consolidating that is a very thoughtful can for an army on the move that they're conconsolidating their gains without extending themselves too far. that is a thoughtful approach to what they're doing, very, very concerning that is evolution we haven't seen before with forces this large that are al qaeda minded. >> o'donnell: so extreme. >> he is. the fight with zawahiri think of

two fronts. they're going to fight for control, at the end of the day somebody is going to win they're still going to be organized crime family. al qaeda-minded, baghdadi wants more territory wants to move on he wants lebanon and jordan. they talk about israel. they want to expand their islamic state, they believe that because they have piece of syria and huge piece of iraq now that they are well underway to do that. that makes him one of the leaders of al qaeda in his mind. >> and norah, long history here of tension between al qaeda and iraq. and al qaeda and pakistan. relationships goes up and down. it's down right now but it doesn't need to stay down. just re-familiar files, their goals are the same. their goals of attacking the united states are exactly the same. >> i have a question, there are reports that he was held, we had him captured, american base for several years then we let him go. and when he walked out he told a

bunch of reservists who were from long island, knock, he said this, quote, i'll see you guys in new york. that was an intelligence, failure by our government to let him go? >> very difficult time trying to find the right amount of evidence. he was someone on the rise then. obviously this is a good lesson for us about letting people go who want to return to the fight right away, obviously. a little easier monday morning quarterbacking, that particular decision. but i can tell you this is something that we're going to have to deal with in the days, months ahead there are lot of individuals who are being held we'll have some reconsideration about what fight -- where their going to part in the fight. >> o'donnell: who are the fighters that are joining them? there are reports that there are hundreds if not thousands of these isis militants from

western countries, they had european passports. >> to even think of isis as three groups. original al qaeda and largely iraqis then group of syrians who joined isis when isis first showed up in syria. then you've got this group of westerners. a significant percentage of the westerners who have gone to fight ended up with isis. and some of them are from the united states, yes, some of them have u.s. passports. >> o'donnell: do we know who they are? >> not all of them. obviously working over time to try to figure out and working with european allies trying to determine -- if you have european -- >> o'donnell: are they -- when you say they went americans, in syria that are now up with this group; do we know who they are going to be able to get back on plane to the united states? >> some cases yes, some cases

no. how easy it is to ghetto sear california all you have to do is fly to turkey cross that border nobody knows you're in syria. it's difficult to track these people. i'm absolutely certain that my former colleagues are working as hard as they can to do that it's not easy. >> these are u.s. persons, u.s. citizens. higher standard for our ability to try to find them and track them and look for them in way that we don't have toy is -- when it's terrorist from a foreign country. >> o'donnell: one of the other concerns we're looking at territorial gains and the goals of what he wants to do. but also they're funding. everything that i'm reading, u.s. officials quoted in the "new york times" saying isis is, he among the weltiest terrorist groups on the planet. where are they getting their money? >> two sources. one is from wealthy arabs who have long supported alcid d. >> o'donnell: which

countries? >> all of the gulf countries. >> o'donnell: uae, saudi arabia? >> absolutely. jordan. these are people who have been supporting al qaeda all along they give their money to the most successful group. the success that we're seeing on the ground today is drawing in more money. the other place they're getting money is from iraq when they over run a city, they gather all the money that happens to be available in that city. they are a very wealthy terrorist organization. >> o'donnell: also have very sophisticated social media campaign they have used twit other and outwings to recruit other jihaddists they have this sweet using dark humor that went viral where they included reportedly this image of first lady michelle obama where she had held up that sign that said "bring back our girls" they said "bring back our humvees." why are they able to operate, they can do social media like that, why can't we get them? >> this is what happens when you

have safe haven. this is what al qaeda did prior to 9/11, what al qaeda did have freedom of movement. you're able to do those kind of things. when i have that safe haven, when you control that territory. >> o'donnell: this is very scary because they do seem to not only have safe haven that they already established as you pointed out in western iraq and gaining ground. but they may have designs on jordan, we keep hearing about jordan. secretary is going to be headed there on this trip as well. what is the concern there? >> it's not that they may have designs on jordan, they do have designs on jordan. think of the government of jordan now has hundreds of thousands of refugees that are acting as a destabilizing factor for the government of jordan, hard to keep them, had to build housing for them. image fin hundreds of thousands of people showed up on your border and you have to take care of them. that is a destabilizing factor. and you have al qaeda sympathizers in jordan who don't

support the kingdom and now you've got on the border these al qaeda-minded individuals who are now on the border between jordan and syria that they have never had to face before. that border has opportunities for crossing, too, that is what so concerning. >> i'm concerned about jordan, too. i'm also concerned about lebanon. where isis has been quite active over last several months just in the last couple of days conducted a bombing there. they are also focused on lebanon which is fragile. >> o'donnell: what steps now in the united states take? "wall street journal" had great piece yesterday that the u.s. government has been aware of the threat of isis for some time. going to do something about it but didn't really provide a large enough back in january in wintertime to do something. did we miss the ball on this? were we slow to act prevent this growth of isis? >> let me just jump in with the intelligence piece of this. i can deal with the policy piece. but i've read several times that

this is intelligence. absolutely not. al qaeda and iraq was defeated when u.s. military left at the end of 2011. the intelligence community monitored the growth of al qaeda post 2011 in great detail with intelligence reporting with analysis, we made very clear that this group is becoming more and more dangerous. >> o'donnell: why didn't we take action? >> again, i agree it was not intelligence failure we watched them pool up in the east of syria in way that we've never seen before. thousands of them, saw the westerners starting to pour in. >> o'donnell: was there a policy failure to work on that? >> that i have to agree was a policy failure because i remember, not taking action is a decision. and many of us who were calling for a more robust engagement in syria, again this isn't 101st airborne, not boots on the ground we have lots of other

systems, our argument if we don't do something to disrupt their growth in eastern syria we are going to be in serious trouble. we watched them grow, we watched them launch an attack from eastern syria, a safe haven in to iraq. that is why this has been so concerning. intelligence was there. we didn't do anything in seary we didn't do anything when they took fallujah, we didn't do anything when they took mosil, got to tikrit, this is a problem. >> o'donnell: chairman mike rogers, mike morell. great to have both of you. interesting discussion, thank you so much. we'll be right back. i make a lot of purchases for my business. and i get a lot in return with ink plus from chase. like 50,000 bonus points when i spent $5,000 in the first 3 months after i opened my account. and i earn 5 times the rewards on internet, phone services and at office supply stores. with ink plus i can choose how to redeem my points.

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the shelter iraq brings sunnis and shia together to some extent and allow a pushback against isis. second umbrella to bring

countries in the region in particular if possible, saudi arabia and iran, under the same umbrella so that the basic driver of this sunni shia war can be reduced then third umbrella some kind of international support. kerry will have to go back to the united nations security council if he's got serious ideas for a way forward. i think he's trying to do all three. >> o'donnell: is sect kerry's goal to continue malaki to step down and can he even do that? >> that's a great challenge. prime minister malaki now arguing that his ouster would amount to success streets for isis for the extremist, is that resonates among many of the shiites in iraq they are the largest sector of the population. there is a movement among some including some of the key clerics to try to get hem out. the challenge really is, in creating new government.

last time they went through an election it took them nine months to form a new government. they broke a world record. they don't have this kind of time this time. they also don't have 80,000 american troops inside iraq to prop them up they have 300 military advisorse there is a tremendous urgency. trying to get the iraq keys together and also to bring back sunnis, how do you do that? moderate sunnis are side can with the extremists they are angered and alienated by the government. that is biggest challenge as trying to find a political solution. and a new government. >> o'donnell: i keep thinking about this because this is calculus that the president is making which is that no airstrikes or military action until you get political stuff done first you don't want to pop up mol key in some ways. it could take so long to form a new government. >> i think in truth he's hoping that iran will do this for the united states. iran will do the dirty work. there's some signs that the iranians have gotten fed up with

malaki. i have a report that i can't confirm says that the head of the kutz force, most powerful person in iraq met with malaki and dressed him down in front of his staff in a humiliating way which people in baghdad who were reporting to me said was a sign that the 'irannians want mall see out. another sign that sudden surge of the army which has strong connections to tehran which is in the street, that's as much anti-malaki force as anything else. >> how big of problem is this for president -- ending the war in iraq. this is not is what is happening. >> it's a huge problem for him, he would do well to remember ala john kerry that he was against this war before he was for it. troubling to are me, i've

been -- american people talk to every day citizens which talking about this. schizophrenic nature of our u.s. foreign policy to begin with. david was just talking about iran how interesting -- ironic is it that just few years ago iran was part of that axis of evil now they may be our ally with regard to iraq? the president says there's no military solution to this crisis, read on the front page of the "washington post" and "new york times" what our military options are they what the possibilities might be. the reality is that -- policy all over map you can take that literally or figuratively but it's troubling for me i think because of the american people clearly politics is part of all of these decisions. but to watch these neoi don't know serve tiffs this week with this revisionist history how he got in this mess, got mired in this in the first place is troubling. beyond troubling to consider. the president clearly has made mistakes since he's been

president on number of foreign policy fronts. to lay all of this at his feet as if the clock started this week on iraq is sickening. >> the possible is also of two minds on this kind of thing. that foreign policy makers are schizophrenic, the public likes what the president is doing, if you ask them, do we -- 52% say the united states should mind its own business that's up from 30% in 200. 1% to 17 say we as country are doing too much to solve the problems. we're in a deeply isolationist mood. on the other hand when you talk to people about america's posture in the world they think the president is weak. they -- his numbers on toughness have gotten worse as these foreign policy crises have escalated. people don't like to see the country look like it is at the mercy of other events, there's kind of push and pull here. >> o'donnell: you pointed out there was new nbc news-"wall street journal" poll says that

the president can't lead and some suggest his presidency was over. did do polls matter, this is a president with a foreign policy crisis who has got to prevent terrorist group with designs on the united states f. the brink. >> mattered to democrats trying to keep their jobs. i think for the president, this question of is his presidency over i think he clearly feels the upper range of the constraints of a presidency right now. we're in election year, republicans are not in great mood to work with him. but as you quite rightly point out in the foreign policy crises emerge president has great deal of power, presidency is not over at all. on the domestic front if republicans win the senate then in charge of all of congress they have to show that they can lead and president will easter be able to make a deal with them or he will block whatever they're doing which means he'll have quite a roll to play. >> if i could add, quick -- polls i think matter principally

because i has to have the support of the american people on whatever decision. clearly at that level they matter this is the same president just few weeks ago told us that was the dividing issue of our time. remind us this morning the words of dr. king that the enemy of the poor. here we are 50 years after lbj's war on poverty about to make the same mistake we declare one thing but do another thing. the more money we pour down this drain the less we have to make eradication of offer see in this country a priority. >> o'donnell: this would be the third war we would engage in iraq in 25 years. the first war you had the saudis, japanese, germans who paid $80 billion tab. next is 1.7 trillion. we still feel the drain on our treasury and we don't have the same will whether it's the financial will or the political will. the challenge for the republicans as much as democrats to figure out strategy that actually will work. there's a lot of talk, the

problem is when you use air power you can kill fanatics but can't it kill fanaticism. that is the long haul. now, presidents in second term traditionally get involved in foreign policy because that's area which they have the greatest ability to leave a legacy particularly as they get in to that lame duck last two years. this crisis has underscored the need for the president to get even more deeply involved but there are no easy options on this one harder than last two put together. >> can we address the criticism that the this is, that isis' growth is result of president's failure to act in syria or inaction on number of fronts. is there any truth to that? how do you see that? >> i think there is some truth to it. several times recently, big problems in life are not the ones that sneak up on you but the ones that you see coming at you. this has been coming at us

clearly. >> o'donnell: you just heard mike morell and mike rogers say that was intelligence failure we've known about it. >> it's been a policy failure, president has been given various options, to try to fill these vacuums they exist, smartest thing that was said over this weekend was our former am bags door in baghdad who said, yes, withdrawal is dangerous but this engagement, leaving a vacuum can be even more dangerous than intervention. i think that's what we've seen in both iraq and syria. with the vacuum, with the sectarian leadership in iraq that space was filled with the worst, most dangerous people. president does not want to do whack-a-mole strategy bit have strategy because at the end of the day that is commander in chief's first job. >> o'donnell: who do you support? that's the problem.

>> the leader -- the sunni libel leaders who i promise you, because i've met with them are begging united states for help in standing up against these people. these people scare them almost as much as they scare us. >> o'donnell: another potential prime minister waiting in the wings to replace malaki who has a support of some sunnis? >> well, i think -- chalabi. >> he was one who pushed hardest to have the sunnis and ruling party eliminated from the process. also names out there, i think there will be lot of serious discussion about that over the next file weeks. but you have to basically -- prevent country from falling apart. basically moving out on their own. they deploy their forces along that border, once kurds will protect themselves then you have questions about preserving the other two-thirds of iraq. >> their decision to make, not ours. make the mistake all the time of

trying to put people where we think they belong. >> o'donnell: we'll be right back.

>> o'donnell: be sure to tune in tomorrow to "cbs this

morning. for more of my interview with president obama all the latest news on crisis in iraq and secretary kerry's trip to the region. bob will be back next week. thanks to all of our guests and thanks to you for watching "face the nation." creates something else as well: jobs all over america. engineering and innovation jobs. advanced safety systems & technology. shipping and manufacturing. across the united states, bp supports more than a quarter million jobs. when we set up operation in one part of the country, people in other parts go to work. that's not a coincidence. it's one more part of our commitment to america.

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