06/11/15 06/11/15 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from pacifica this is democracy now! >> the truth is, the only people we know or i know who would benefit from a decision by the united states not to purchase a paid in the tpp would be international competitors -- participate in the tpp would be international competitors. amy: as the obama administration praises the benefits of the tpp, the trans-pacific partnership, backlash continues to grow against the deal.

wikileaks has just published another section of the secret text -- this one about public healthcare and the pharmaceutical industry. we will speak to public citizen and human rights watch about their concerns. then we look at a new guardian investigation into how isis is crippling al qaeda. and we will go to texas where a federal appeals court upheld harsh anti-choice provisions in texas, threatening to leave the state with fewer than 10 abortion clinics. all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. the white house has confirmed plans to increase the u.s. military presence in iraq. on wednesday, the obama administration announced the deployment of up to 450 u.s. troops to train and back iraqi forces in the fight against the self-proclaimed islamic state. the new u.s. contingent will operate out of a military base in anbar province. white house press secretary josh earnest announced the move.

>> i think what it represents is a conclusion by the president and his national security team that the situation on the ground in iraq would benefit from more trained iraqi security forces and more sunni tribal fighters that are operating under the command and control of the iraqi central government who are -- who have received advice and assistance and equipment from the u.s. military. there is no environment in which i would downplay the risk that these military -- that these military service members will face in iraq. we of been direct about the fact the security situation in iraq is tenuous. securely, in the anbar province. amy: the u.s. will also speed weapons deliveries to iraqi forces, including tribal fighters under iraqi command. efforts are expected to focus on recapturing ramadi which fell to isil last month. the new deployment brings the

official count of u.s. soldiers in iraq to 3550. deadly clashes have escalated between isis and the lebanese group hezbollah along lebanon's border with syria. dozens of devices -- isis fighters were killed in violence on wednesday. in a speech, hezbollah leader hassan nasrallah vowed to uproot isil from the lebanon border saying -- "the fight with isil has begun." pope francis has authorized a new vatican panel to judge bishops accused of concealing or not preventing child sexual abuse within the church. a vatican spokesperson unveiled the new mandate. >> the thing that is new is a specific procedure is indicated to these questions that may have to do with the bishops abuse of office. this certainly was not before in ordinary and clear path. this is the new aspect. amy: the tribunal's

establishment marks pope francis' most forceful action to date in confronting child sexual abuse by clergy, and meets a key demand sought for years by victims and advocates. fifa has suspended the bidding contest for who will host the 2026 world cup following the corruption scandal that's thrown the world soccer body into turmoil. fifa secretary general jérôme valcke announced the decision. >> it was a decision to locate the world cup 2017 and start the bidding process sooner. due to the situation, i think it is nonsense to stop the bidding process for the time being and will be postponed the meeting process begin the time being. amy: probes are underway into where bribes influenced the awarding of the next two tournaments to russia and qatar. the news comes as the women's world cup is underway in canada. despite protests, concerns over potential injury, and a lawsuit

withdrawn earlier this year, the women are being forced to play on artificial turf, not on grass, as the men do. just before kickoff at the opening games saturday, the artificial turf measured 120 degrees fahrenheit on a 75 degree day. a level just two degrees under the level studies have shown is unsafe because skin can burn within seconds. talks have resumed in berlin on reaching a peace deal between libya's two rival factions. the country has been torn apart since the nato intervention four years ago, with two government claiming authority and scores of militant groups controlling territory in between. u.n. envoy bernardino leon said after months of talks, libya is out of time to avoid a resolution. >> it has no more time. this is my first message. and for all of those were listening from libya, it is very important to understand and to translate these in concrete actions, and saying very clearly

enough is enough and the time has come to make a deal. amy: the texas police officer who resigned over his aggressive response to african-american teens at a pool party has blamed emotional duress for his behavior. eric casebolt stepped down after being caught on video wrestling a 14-year-old african-american girl in a bikini to the ground pulling her hair, and sitting on top of her. casebolt also pulled his gun on other teens. on wednesday, casebolt's attorney said the officer had been distraught after responding to two suicide-related incidents earlier in the day. while offering an apology, casebolt also put part of the blame on teens whom he said were being disorderly. >> he is apologizing, he recognizes -- and i think i said

this -- he does recognize his emotions got the best of him and that the prior suicide calls put him in an emotional place that he would prefer to not have been in when responding to this call. amy: georgia authorities have dropped murder charges against a woman whose labor was induced after taking an abortion pill. 23-year-old kenlissa jones was arrested for allegedly self-inducing an abortion with the pill cytotec, which she apparently bought from a canadian source. she gave birth to a live fetus who died shortly after. jones was initially charged with malice murder, but the charge was dropped after a public outcry. she is still accused of possessing a dangerous drug. advocates say jones' case exemplifies women's limited options as abortion access is restricted and health funding is slashed. lynn paltrow of the national advocates for pregnant women said -- "it is shocking each and every time we see an attempt to deny pregnant women their human rights and to treat them and the fact that they are pregnant as a

crime rather than a public health issue." florida governor rick scott has signed a bill into law forcing women to wait at least 24 hours to have an abortion. exceptions will be made in cases women can document rape, incest, domestic violence, or human trafficking. opponents argue such measures burden women who have already made their decision or who live too far away from clinics to make repeated visits affordable. we'll have more on abortion rights later in the broadcast. new york authorities have expanded a manhunt for two prisoners to neighboring vermont, six days after their escape. the two convicted murderers used powertel stooge real through the walls and break out of the clinton correctional facility in upstate new york. police say a prison employee may have helped them. the new york state police say an extensive search continues. >> we won't stop until we have these convicts captured. today we received or than 500

leads, and we're thoroughly investigating each and every one. that means looking behind every tree, under every rock, and inside every structure until we find these men. today the public will have noticed an increase police presence both in the village of dannemora and wellsboro in essex county. we continue to go door-to-door checking homes and seasonal residences, and we continue to do vehicle checks at a number of roadblocks in the area. amy: the jailbreak is now the longest in new york history. two have been arrested for the 2012 beating death of prisoner ronald spear. a federal indictment alleges one of the guards repeatedly kicked spear in the head while two others held him down. the coroner found spear died from blunt force trauma. new york paid $2.75 million to settle a lawsuit brought over his death last year.

a retrial is underway for a u.s. marine in the 2006 killing of an iraqi civilian. the victim, hashim ibrahim awad, was dragged from his home, shot, and then planted with a weapon to make it appear he was planning an attack. sergeant lawrence hutchins had been the only one of seven u.s. servicemembers involved in the killing to receive a murder conviction. but his conviction was overturned in 2010 on the grounds his attorneys were improperly dismissed before trial. juan felipe herrer is named the first latino poet laureate of the united states. he writes about english and spanish. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now! democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. nermeen: welcome to all our listeners and viewers from around the country and around the world. house republicans are set to push for a vote as soon as

friday on approving a measure to give president obama fast-track authority to negotiate the trans-pacific partnership deal. the secretive tpp deal involves 12 countries and nearly 40% of the global economy. on wednesday, wikileaks released a leaked draft of another chapter of the secret negotiating text -- this time the tpp's so-called "healthcare annex." newly revealed details of the draft show it would give majornonexistent

tribunal to compel vietnam to improve its rights. no. the only possibility is an outside group maybe an international labor federation could compel another country act united states to bling -- to bring a complaint in the abstract, and maybe after many years of tribunal litigation, that would result in some kind of penalty being imposed on vietnam. that is not in force ability. that is merely a process which might pretension to dish potentially impact been him on the grand scale. there's nothing like the rights that investors have to compel governments to change their rules. and that at the end of the day is what is wrong with the tpp. it creates rights for companies and investors but he doesn't create new rights for workers or civil society. it basically gives corporations more rights than people. amy: some are saying even if you can't negotiate these things

after the tpp, you can use the tpp to change things. some openly gay lawmakers have called for halting tpp negotiations with malaysia and brunei because of their laws targeting lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender citizens. the colorado congress member jared polis, whose openly gay has called on the obama administration to use the trade agreement to push for reform. he wrote a letter earlier this year saying -- "as negotiations over the tpp proceed, i hope you will seize the occasion by expressing to the governments of brunei and malaysia in no uncertain terms that their violations of basic human rights must end." john sifton, if you could respond to that, using the negotiations to change these countries, but also than the two of you disagree over what should be done with tvp. john, you're with the reform tpp crowd. peter, you're with the stop it and if.

i would like to hear your views on this. john? >> first off, the problem with the idea of compelling the government of malaysia and vietnam to improve through the negotiation process is that has already been going on for four or five years, and they have been pushing these reform agendas in these countries have not shown any willingness to make meaningful steps. the real question for the administration, how is having fast-track authority going to make it any better? at the end of the day, it is our position that if the administration is compelled to reach certain benchmarks on human rights, not just labor rights, but human rights political prisoners in vietnam lgbt issues in malaysia, that their compelled by law to meet those benchmarks as part of the agreement to allow fast-track authority or allow the government to present the tpp back once it is finalized then it will be a necessity -- these

countries will have to reform, otherwise, they cannot be part of the agreement. that would be an incentive that would not exist otherwise. essentially, what we're saying is, yes, the tpp could be used for leverage, but you have to actually use it for leverage. and if you don't, it is going to be a huge disappointment. and when you come back with a negotiated agreement, then you're going to see human rights groups and other saying, no we are against this agreement. for now, our position is, yes, let's compel the administration to write the agreement and a way that actually protects human rights and actually promotes human rights, that actually abandons the ridiculous unconscionable limits on property that will lead to higher drug costs. if you make those changes and then negotiate that compels vietnam to records, great. if you can't do it, you're going to be out of luck when you bring this agreement back to congress when it is done. amy: peter maybarduk, you're with the stop tb crowd, not

reform it. why? >> there's no such thing as a good tpp. there have been some very brave negotiators from some of the developing countries who have been standing up to some of the most powerful industries on earth. in defense of their countries various public interest, including help. at the end of the day the multinational corporations involved are not going to accept a text that reduces their rights. so we're not going to see a tpp that has positive effects for society the way many of us would. the predicted benefits in gains in terms of trade flows are very small. the predicted costs are very large. so i don't know why congress would want to cede its constitutional authority to the executive, to the president giving the president fast-track authority to rimadyl through congress on an up or down vote without possibility for amendment when the whole thing has been negotiated in secret

all this time. as i say, only a few chapters have leaked. that is unofficial. what is in the other 25 plus chapters of the agreement that we don't all about, what unfortunate surprises that could have real consequences for human beings? we invite your viewers to go to stop no our website and call the congress today ahead of this very close and very important vote. say no to fast-track. >> we don't disagree at the end of the day about these issues, because the substantive underlying issues are the same. if people want to call their member of congress and say they're uncomfortable with this agreement, they should do that. we work on syria and north korea and we have to be optimistic about the idea in theory the obama administration could do better. if peter is right and they can't, then there's the such thing as a tpp, then so be it. in the time will come when it is time to oppose it.

-- then the time will come when it is time to oppose it. the vote is tomorrow. nermeen: peter, could you just explain specifically what you think the impact of this deal would be on drugs that are used over the long-term? for instance, cancer or hiv drugs? >> there's accommodation of provisions in the intellectual process -- chapter and other chapters, affected in terms of negotiation powers in this leak such as cannot yesterday published by wikileaks, that show us the generic competition the affordable medicines in which people around the world in many tpp countries depend would be blocked through the monopoly powers of the industry under this agreement including the evergreening rules you mentioned in your run up. for example if we look at cancer, there's a role proposed

that was tucked into a massive lobbying effort by the pharmaceutical industry, tucked into obamacare for 12 your automatic monopolies on biologics, which include great many cancer drugs, 11 of 12 that cost more than 100 thousand dollars. that is a leading driver of bankruptcy for american families. the devastating consequences, and death, for those in third world countries. the governments are not even going to be offering the streets. >> it is amazing that one part of this government, the presidents agenda for combating hiv/aids worldwide, they will see higher costs to their budget as they try to help countryside hiv/aids because for a second stage antivirals, the kind you have to use once the initial ones where off after a certain number of years of use are going to be more expensive. not to mention all of these

groups, humanitarian groups on the ground, are obliged to use up our generic antivirals, even though they are -- there are better drugs coming on the market. simply because of this expansion in the patent protections. it is really unconscionable. amy: john sifton, thank you for being with us. i know you have to run off to your news conference. it is over at -- you're holding it at the national press club. john sifton will be speaking out against the tpp. thank you very much to peter maybarduk, director of outlook citizens global access to medicines program. when we come back, has isis front al qaeda -- trumped? we go to london to talk with a journalist from the guardian. stay with us. ♪ [music break]

amy: "tpp = corporate power tool of the 1%," a remix of the classic "abc" by the jackson five, produced by public

citizen. this is democracy now! democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. nermeen: a year ago this month fighters from the islamic state declared they had established a caliphate in the territories it controlled in iraq and syria. since then, the islamic state has continued to grow, building affiliates from afghanistan to west africa, while recruiting new members from across the globe. in response, president obama has sent thousands of u.s. troops back to iraq. the deployment of another 450 troops was announced on wednesday. meanwhile, the rise of the islamic state has reshaped the jihadist movement in the region essentially bringing al qaeda to , the brink of collapse. amy: according to a new investigation by the guardian, the islamic state has successfully launched a coup against al-qaida to destroy it from within. the islamic state began as al-qaida's branch in the heart of the middle east, but was excommunicated in 2014 after disobeying commands from

al-qaida leader, ayman al-zawahiri. while the islamic state has since flourished, the guardian reports al-zawahiri is now largely cut off from his commanders and keeping the group afloat through little more than appeals to loyalty. the guardian also reports the united states has been slow to grasp the implications of al qaeda's to klein and possible collapse. joining us now from london is shiv malik, lead author on the guardian investigation. the report "how isis crippled , al-qaida: the inside story of the coup that has brought the world's most feared terrorist network to the brink of collapse." if you could talk about that in your meeting in jordan with the al qaeda terrorists. >> this is been going on for a while, for a couple of years at least. from the outside, to get little pictures.

you hear the skirmishes going on, you hear that sort of isis has killed a few other members of al qaeda, the syrian branch of al qaeda -- there's a big conversation in january in 2014 in which thousands died. the real inside story of this comes from -- actually a few players. thankfully, we were able to interview two men. he is a british man, quite famous, home secretary here. they try to deport him to jordan to face terrorism charges. he was acquitted of those eventually. yes been described as -- he has been described as al qaeda spiritual leader. what they have been doing is

behind-the-scenes, negotiating things. between al qaeda and crisis, trying to bring these people back to the table. and they finally gave up about six month ago or thereabouts. they all used to be one family. he used to be if you wanted -- that is the story we got from them. which is this process of over two years of how isis risen to take the mantle of the leadership of the global jihad if you will, from al qaeda. nermeen: shiv malik, can you explain how you came to research this story and you went to jordan to speak to these two figures? could you talk a little about that? >> yeah. maqdisi and qatada, they're in and out of prison all the time. as you can imagine. maqdisi without charge.

he was released in february and so we went to visit him then, sort of soon afterwards. and then we carried on interviewing him. there was a big team of investigators on this piece will stop we continue to investigate -- interview him. when you meet him, he don't really know what you're going to get. this guy is the spiritual godfather of al qaeda and the count him as a personal friend. he is the mentor. he was the mentor of the founder of isis. going on to create havoc by having people massacring she is by the thousands. so you don't know what to expect. but when you meet him he is a

very interesting guy. he is completely energetic enthusiastic almost childlike in his enthusiasm talking about almost anything. his hands foil over the place. he is thin. he is a sense of humor, which sort of throws you. qatada is this very large lumbering man and very tall. it is quite intimidating. it is hard to grasp just how big this guy is. he speaks very quietly and all must has like marlon brando in "the godfather" but slightly higher pitched. and he pauses a lot. they make an odd pair. when we went to speak with them they were both very upset. based in their lives work, basically, bringing to hotties under one banner. and for that, that was al qaeda. al qaeda is not just an organization, which we know has

been incredibly ruthless and bloody and plotting away around the globe, there are also an idea. first, and we often look at this from the western perspective, but these guys have their own agency. the first part of this, al qaeda was created as a failure response to the failures of local list jihadist issues going back to the 1980's and 1990's in algeria, for example, being a failure in afghanistan. the idea is that would all come together under one banner and they would attack -- with their focus on america. because they said, this is a theory. look, attack the snakes head, if you would. coming to fruition must bishops for you in september 11. the scholars said, -- the second part is, there also a vanguard for revolutionary idea of setting up the caliphate.

those who -- the idea is that educate the people to accepting the notion of islamic state and one day, set it up. this is what al qaeda is meant for these two scholars. prices have been partly bubbling away. they have been a branch -- an al qaeda branch in iraq. they have it for a very long time. the most troublesome branch as well. don't listen to orders, don't take criticism very well, what listen to anyone -- won't listen to anyone. bin laden had problems with them and we know them from the documents that of come out, the documents seized when americans went in and killed bin laden in 2011 in may, but we also know this from subsequently what has happened and what has been said publicly. they have been very troublesome. at one point, the piece was

broken -- peace was broken when isis -- when the syrian civil war started. they sent people into syria. they said, we will grab some turf and start a branch there. and the people who then went on to lead that bunch of rebels, fighting against asadsad, when on to become incredibly powerful. and they say, we will create a merger. it is at that point, it was a bit of a power play over territory and patches of land and he would control what. zawahiri steps in and says, let's put things back to where they were. and they said we don't need you in waziristan anymore. if you tell us otherwise, we're not going to listen to you. that is what started the giants of the war and eventually gets to the point where in january

2014, just all hell breaks loose. and to heidi's -- to heidi -- jihadis are killed. it is impossible to keep track of them. they spent a very long time trying to piece together bit by bit he was getting killed when, who was saying what. at one point, they even killed --isis ended up killing zawahiri 's peacemaker. it was incredibly vicious and bloody. nermeen: shiv malik soon after the 2003 u.s. invasion of iraq there was already a split, i falling out between maqdisi and the so-called precursor to isis. so could you talk about the ideological divisions are between these two groups and in

particular, whether focus became to be on the recruitment of former leaders within this movement, the position of isis forces the position of al qaeda what it had been and what it became? >> in terms of -- the big division came when isis set up this caliphate. they declare this caliphate. they said al qaeda is was to be the vanguard organization and know they are, isis setting up a caliphate and saying, the revolution is complete. we have got there finally. that has also made, al qaeda bit redundant. isis managed old aunt of the caliphate for almost a year. -- to hold onto this caliphate promise to your. that is one difference. with that, isis has been able to capture the imagination of young radicals and also the funders.

the money and the men and the prestige is all going to isis at this point in time. al qaeda has been drained of all of that. so they been left on the back burner. these scholars are saying, maqdisi and qatada that we spoke to said, these guys are not the real deal. they said, we are the elite scholarship. if you're more than gangsters then you have to listen to us because we are the ones who wrote the books. they stepped in and isis basically -- there was a long time where they thought maybe there could be some reconciliation. baghdad he wrote a letter to maqdisi and said, please come join us. come see what it is like, judge for yourself. there was some suggestion from these two that if they went, they might get killed and never make it back. they're also frightened as well.

there was a situation in jordan where again, these two might get pumped off because they are beings of political of dust critical of isis. someone may just appear and gunned them down. but ultimately, they want the same thing in the end and very petty ideological differences. amy: shiv malik, this may sound like a pharrell question, but could you see any scenario which the u.s. would side with al qaeda against isis? >> not really. and they shouldn't. it is not like al qaeda are friends of america by any means. in fact, they are still very much focused on attacking america. and that is how -- this is where they find their niche. if their marketplace is being closed down for them by isis some of it, anyway then, again they reform in late themselves

on doubling on what they did before, which is to attack the west and game, if you want, prestige from that, appeal to their own base. and that should be very worrying for the west. that doesn't mean that america should simply carry on focusing on al qaeda and not re-gear its military machine toward isis. if you're wondering what the greater threat is, isis certainly is. and the reason is, as i mentioned before, they have a patch of land. it is actually a very sizable territory with the massive city of a couple million people in mosul and iraq which they are in charge of. this is very worrying. this idea is now real. they managed to say to the world, actually, we have held it for a year and expanded it by taking ramadi, another major city in iraq, and look, clearly, god is on our side. these people are are also innocence of faith and religion. if the caliphate carry-ons --

carries on, so america should re-gear. sending over extra to advise the iraqi army. i'm not sure if it will be enough to my but we will see. nermeen: before we conclude, shiv malik can you talk about the significance of the civil war in precipitating the self proclaimed islamic rights and the near collapse of al qaeda ? >> the civil war has allowed for chaos and in that sense -- these people are sort of like gangsters or drug dealers. they need turf, and they need turf so they can get money and recruits. it is like a business in that sense, it has to keep itself

going. syria provided that field once the revolution broke out assad been brutally put people down and slaughtered them. and people decided to are the missiles -- arm themselves and that led to chaos. isi, as they were known then, sent people over to take advantage of this. in that sense, they have taken advantage completely of what has been going on, but that is not to say that people should not want to resist assad. they should. he is been using chemical weapons and chlorine bombs on his population. he is a despicable dictator. it is a complete mess. someone at some point is going to have to step in whether it is european or american forces or something else. and sort that out. but until then, as i said, isis

will take advantage of it. and they're doing well out of it financially. amy: thank you, shiv malik, for joining us, investigative reporter at the guardian, and lead author of their new in-depth report, "how isis crippled al-qaida: the inside story of the coup that has brought the world's most feared terrorist network to the brink of collapse." shiv was speaking to us in london. we will link to that piece at democracynow.org. when we come back, we go to texas. major anti-choice actions are taking place. stay with us. ♪ [music break]

amy: democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. nermeen: we look at the latest

restrictions on reproductive rights in the united states. on tuesday upholding antichoice provision which friendly texas with just 10 or fewer abortion clinics. in 2013 when the sweeping antitrust law passed despite popular protest and not been our filibuster by texas state senator wendy davis, texas had more than 40 clinics. since then, more than half of them have closed as a battle over access has raged in the courts. now decision by a panel of the fifth circuit court of appeals friends to shutter about half of the remaining 18 clinics. the ruling upholds restrictions forcing abortion facilities to meet the standards of hospital style surgery centers and forcing providers to obtain admitting privileges at a nearby hospital. it provides narrow exemptions for a single doctor at a clinic in the south texas city of mcallen on the grounds that forcing women to travel 235 miles or more to the nearest clinic would be an undue burden. but it remains unclear if the

clinic can stay open. when it came to the plight of women in the far west city of el paso, the appeals court said they could travel to new mexico, rather than take the estimated 1000 mile round-trip journey to the nearest open abortion clinic in texas. amy: if the decision goes in to effect in about 20 days attorneys for the decision say about 900,000 reproductive-age women will live more than 150 miles from the nearest open abortion facility. the clinics planned to take a pill to the supreme court. in a statement, nancy northup of the center for reproductive rights said -- "not since before roe v. wade has a law or court decision had the potential to devastate access to reproductive health care on such a sweeping scale." meanwhile in florida, governor rick scott has signed a bill into law forcing women to wait at least 24 hours to happen abortion and the wisconsin state senate just approved a bill that would ban non-emergency

abortions after 20 weeks of pregnancy. like many others passed last month, the bill is based on the medically debunked claim fetuses can feel pain after 20 weeks. it does not provide exceptions for rape or insist. to find out more about the impact of these restrictions, we go to austin, texas, to speak with heather busby. welcome to democracy now! star in texas. what has taken place there? >> over the past two years, we're seen a couple of things happen. i want to backup first to 2011 when the legislature cut funding for family planning by nearly two thirds and we have lost over 80. that is eight zero family planning clinics. you cannot prevent pregnancy, and then you have an unintended pregnancy, and the state has devastated that access as well. like you said, we have lost more than half the clinics in the state and looking at going down to only eight to 10 clinics. for a state that has 27 million

people, that is just unacceptable. we are reducing long wait times women were forced further along into the pregnancy, which further jeopardizes the health and safety -- the exact opposite of the purported intent of this law. we all know that was a farce that this is really about making abortion completely unacceptable. we know that most impacts those who are most vulnerable in the state, low income people, young woman, those who live in rural areas are so hard hit by this law. nermeen: heather, if you could lay out, what to these restrictions now mean for someone wanting to get an abortion in texas? could you lay out what she would have to do? >> i can speak to my experience and talking to people who are struggling to access abortion care. first of all, there is getting the money together. that can often take weeks. you have to go twice to a clinic

-- once for the mandatory state written materials where the doctors basically have to lie to their patients. and the forced sonogram. then 24 hours later, if you can get an apartment 24 hours later you're after then go back to the clinic for your procedure. for some people, that can often mean multiple trips multiple overnight trips if they have a two-day procedure, for example. so it is really a burden on folks because you are losing time from work, time away from our children and family trying to get transportation, and in texas, this is the second largest state. if you are in west texas where there is no public transportation infrastructure, if you don't have reliable transportation, if you can't get a ride, you have no access at all. this abortion may as well be illegal for you. amy: i want to ask about one of the responses to the recent legislation on hb 2 in texas.

the advocacy group texas right to life wrote -- "although unpredictable, the supreme court could solidify texas' pro-life protections while concomitantly strengthening pro-life laws for every state by defining clearer standards of the notion of "undue burden" -- the vague term upon which the abortion industry founded their legal opposition to hb 2." could you respond and also explain the concept of undue burden? >> right. i find that statement particularly cruel. they want to define undue burden as no burden is too great. what i've seen is the exact opposite of that for people who are struggling to put food in their children's malice of a struggling to access the reproductive health care -- or just health care in general. texas has refused to expand medicaid and we have the highest uninsured rate in the country. to say that they want the supreme court to basically

define undue burden as no burden is too great the one thing i will agree to is, i would like to see a little more judicial clarity when it comes to undue burden. that standard is quite unclear. it is definitely an exception when you look at constitutional jurisprudence to have such a nebulous concept as undue burden. unfortunately, the fifth circuit is one of those courts that is very conservative, very ideologically conservative, and makes their decisions fit that mindset. and for them -- i was asked lisa prized that 235 miles they considered undue burden. i think 100 miles is too far. especially if you don't have access to transportation, you don't have money, can't miss work, you have children at home. the burdens of all of these laws cumulatively are insurmountable for so many people in this state

and across the country. i really wish the courts would have a little more compassion for the struggles of everyday people's lives. nermeen: i want to turn to comments made by wisconsin governor scott walker. earlier this month, he said he would sign wisconsin's proposed bill banning abortions after 20 weeks. when asked about the reporters for the exception of rape walker said women who become pregnant from rape and insist are most concerned about it in the "initial months." could you respond to that? >> well, i think that is just incredibly cruel. to put himself in the place of a rape survivor and try to make assumptions about what that person is going through is just -- i can't -- it floors me. it is completely opposite of

what we know about trauma and ptsd and what survivors go through. it assumes you go through this traumatic experience and you're just on top of your game, taking care of things, just getting it done. that is not the way it works. you have to process that trauma. that can take months. amy: we have to break and i want to thank you for being with us. heather busby, executive director of naral-pro choice texas. governor walker, governor of wisconsin, is believed to be planning a run for the presidency. that does it for our show. democracy now! is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed captioning. e-mail your comments to outreach@democracynow.org or mail them to democracy now! p.o. box 693 new york, new york 10013. [captioning made possible by democracy now!]