10/13/15 10/13/15 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from pacifica, this is democracy now! >> the rules are these, there shall only be one debate and i want and only one in new hampshire and anybody that goes off script participate in other debates other than those sanctioned by the dnc will be for been from attending other states. it is a very undemocratic way to run the democratic party. amy: five all caps off tonight for the first of six debates, half of the republicans schedule. we will speak with bill curry

about who determines the rules for democratic debates and why. then, the refugees at our door. we are paying mexico to keep people from reaching our border, people who are fleeing central american violence. that is the headline of a startling new investigation published by "the new york times." we will speak with the author, sonia nazario. and it is been over 50 years since allen dulles resigned as director of the cia, but his legacy lives on. >> and no time is the cia engaged in any political activity or any intelligence activity that was not approved at the highest level. amy: author david talbot on his new book, "the devil's chessboard: allen dulles, the cia, and the rise of america's secret government." all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and

peace report. i'm amy goodman. five democratic presidential candidates will square off tonight in las vegas for the first of six debates in the 2016 campaign. the participants are former secretary of state hillary clinton, vermont senator bernie sanders, former maryland governor martin o'malley, former virginia senator jim webb and former rhode island governor lincoln chafee. democratic national committee vice chair tulsi gabbard, a congressmember from hawaii, will not be attending today's debate -- she says she was disinvited after publicly calling for more than six debates. we will bring you a preview of tonight's debate after the headlines. iran's parliament has backed the landmark nuclear deal between iran, the united states and five other world powers. the vote comes after republicans in the u.s. congress unsuccessfully tried to block the nuclear deal. iran is expected to begin curbing its nuclear program in the coming days, in exchange for sanctions relief. turkey's deputy prime minister says a "large number of people" have been detained as suspects

in the bombings of the peace rally in ankara saturday that killed as many as 128 people. the turkish government says the self-aggrandizement state is the crime suspect. -- crime suspect. in news from syria, members of the u.s.-backed rebel groups fighting syrian president was her al-assad reported receiving an influx of u.s. meat antitank missiles and what appears to be a response to russian airstrikes against groups fighting president bashar al-assad. the "new york times" reports, "the syrian conflict is edging closer to an all-out proxy war between the united states and russia." the u.s. supplies the rebel groups with us-made weapons through a covert cia program running court nation with saudi arabia. -- running coordination was saudi arabia. meanwhile, the u.s. has also begun dropping airdropping pallets of weapons and ammunition to a kurdish militia fighting against isil in northern syria. this comes as the amnesty international has accused another u.s.-backed kurdish militia operating in the region

of committing war crimes by forcefully displacing thousands of syrian civilians and demolishing their homes. european union officials are urging russia to halt its military intervention in syria, saying russia threatens to undermine the political process and the 4.5 year conflict. speaking monday, eu foreign policy chief federica mogherini described the intervention as dangerous but said russia has a , role to play in conflict's resolution. >> on the other side, i have to underline, as i've seen that especially this morning, very , have you, if any at all noted that reference, that the role that russia can play in, let's say, exercising a sort of pressure or involvement of the regime in the political play itself that is going to be very

significant role that russia can play. amy: violence is escalating in israel and the occupied territories. police say palestinians have killed three israelis this morning in separate attacks in jerusalem. this comes after israeli forces shot dead three palestinians monday, accusing them of stabbing israelis. in total, 27 palestinians and 7 israelis have died in the last two weeks. eight of the palestinians were children. the dutch safety board has concluded malaysia airlines flight 17 was down by russian-made missile. the plane was shot down over all 298in 2014, killing people on board. the long-awaited findings did not specify who launched the missile. two former cia prisoners who say they were tortured at a black site in afghanistan have filed a lawsuit against the architects of the cia's torture program, james mitchell and bruce jessen. the lawsuit was also joined by the family of a third person or -- prisoner who froze to death

at the black site. mitchell and jessen were psychologists who reaped more than $80 million overseeing the use untested torture techniques, including waterboarding. the lawsuit filed today accuses them of war crimes. in news from germany, the police union and human rights groups are warning of sexual abuse, violence, and rape inside refugee shelters. the police union chief, told reuters that authorities responsible for asylum seekers were not adequately addressing assaults on women in the shelters. this comes as thousands are fleeing, contending to make their way across europe. a field commissioner from the u.n. said more than 5000 people are crossing through the balkans every day. >> every day we have around 5500 people coming and we are trying to work with them for registration. the weather conditions are getting really difficult. it was raining for the last two days. but it is not stopping, and we're getting information that

their traveling by train for a day four times, so we're trying to get ready for when the numbers are here. so it is still an ongoing process. amy: the u.s. is facing accusations of outsourcing its crackdown refugees who are fleeing violence in central america by paying the mexican government to stop people from reaching the u.s. we will have more with sonia nazario later in the broadcast. in london, the police who have spent more than three years positioned outside the ecuadorean embassy to arrest wikileaks founder julian assange have been withdrawn. assange has been unable to leave the embassy after seeking refuge in 2012 amidst fears he can be arrested and extradited to sweden on sex crimes allegations for which he is never been charged. and he fears that sweden might then extradite him to the united states, where a secret grand jury has been investigating wikileaks disclosures. chilean assange has never been

charged with a crime. london's metropolitan police kept officers poised to arrest assange the moment he left the embassy, 24 hours a day, at a cost of about $19 million. while ending their 24-hour-watch the london police vowed to "deploy a number of overt and covert tactics to arrest him." in providence, rhode island, black lives matter protesters gathered outside a dunkin' donuts shop monday to show support for a dunkin' donuts worker who wrote the hashtag "black lives matter" on the coffee cup of a police officer. the providence fraternal order of police union accused the black lives matter movement of "creating a hostile environment" and dunkin' donuts said the franchise owner had apologized to the police officer for the employee's act of protest. former police officer tony lepore, known as the "dancing cop" in providence for directing traffic while performing his signature dance moves, has led calls for dunkin' donuts to fire the worker. sam muskelly was among those who gathered outside the dunkin' donuts to show support for the

worker. >> we can knock down every wall that is in front of us. black lives do matter every day. all of our lives matter today because we are fighting for what is going on in the streets and trying to help our young people find a way to get through. so us standing her today is big. it shows the diversity of everyone. it shows everyone here holding up their signs, screaming out loud that black lives do matter and we want people to know that every day, all day, and every time they wake up and walk outside. amy: in texas, police are defending their decision to use a taser on an african-american city councilman after he tried to vouch for a friend the police were questioning. police dashboard camera video of the incident last week shows police tasing councilman jonathan miller while he is on his knees with his back to officers. police say he was resisting arrest. the incident happened in prairie view, the same college city where sandra bland was arrested in july.

video of her arrest shows state trooper brian insignia forcibly removing her from her car and threatening to "light her up" after she refused to put out her refused to put out her cigarette. found dead in her jail cell of what authorities say was a suicide, although her family and protesters have raised questions about their account. police said one of the two officers involved in the arrest of the councilman thursday was also involved in sandra bland's arrest. a judge has ordered the state of arkansas to disclose its suppliers of lethal injection drugs to attorneys for death-row prisoners who are challenging the state's execution secrecy law. the move comes amid disclosures the pentobarbital texas uses in executions may be expired. an autopsy, meanwhile, has revealed oklahoma used the wrong drug during the january of charles warner, whose dying words were, "my body is on fire." on monday, the texas court of criminal appeals stayed the

execution of julius murphy after attorneys said prosecutors threatened key witnesses. a new investigation has revealed more information about exxon's decades-long bit to conceal what it knew about global warming. "the los angeles times" reports exxon predicted in the late 1980's and early the arctic 1990's would melt from climate change, reducing their operations costs by as much as 50%. a senior ice researcher for exxon's canadian subsidiary told an audience of academics and government researchers in 1992, "potential global warming can only help lower exploration and development costs" in the beaufort sea. in the atlanta suburb of douglasville, georgia, the district attorney has won indictments against 15 confederate flag supporters on charges of making terroristic threats and participating in criminal gang activity. the unusual move comes after a group of african american partygoers said members of the white group, which calls itself respect the flag, threatened them with a crowbar and other weapons and yelled racial slurs.

meanwhile, in texas, all of the more than 170 bikers rounded up and detained following a mass gang shooting in may outside a waco restaurant have been released. five months after nine people were killed in the shooting, none of the bikers has been charged with the murders and only 22 remain on ankle monitoring. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. five democratic presidential candidates will square off tonight in las vegas for the first of six debates in the 2016 campaign. yes, just six debates -- and that's precisely the sticking point for critics of the process, including some candidates and several party leaders. democratic national committee, vice chairwoman tulsi gabbard, a congresswoman from hawaii, said she was disinvited from tonight's event after she appeared on tv and called for more debates. speaking on cnn, gabbard explained what happened. >> i have been pretty vocal

about calling out for more debates. i have been calling for more debates to give the mac and people the opportunity -- american people to hear from these candidates, to hold them accountable for their views and positions because the differentiated from the decision of the chairwoman made from the dnc, i was told i was no longer welcome to come to the debate. amy: the participants are hillary clinton, bernie sanders, martin o'malley, jim webb, and lincoln chafee. one candidate who was not invited was harvard professor lawrence lessig who recently appeared on democracy now! and criticize the debate process. >> what i think we need to do is raise the level of the debate. this is not just about telling some people they can't speak or trying to silence the ability of certain interest to be in the political process. this is about achieving the fundamental equality of our democracy.

amy: for more on tonight's debate and democratic politics i'm joined by bill curry, weekly , political columnist at salon.com. his most recent article is called, "the dnc screwed hillary -- now get ready for a bernie sanders earthquake." curry was a white house counselor to president clinton and a two-time democratic nominee for governor of connecticut. he is now working on a book on president obama and the politics of populism. welcome to democracy now! talk about this debate. give us a preview. what are the roles? who determines them? who gets in and who gets out? how many debates overall? >> good to be with you. when the announcement came in chairwomant from the that there would only be six debates, all the coverage said, the dnc had announced, and i wondered at the time what that meant. who had made this decision? had there been a meeting of the entire committee or subcommittee , anyone keep minutes? was there a vote? so i called early last week to

ask -- i spoke to the communications erector. it took a while to figure out that there was never any meeting of any kind, that no elected official within the democratic party had taken part. there certainly have been no public event, no notice, no vote. the chairwoman scholz, who was the stones -- staunch supporter and ally of hillary clinton in 2008, hesitantly taken upon herself to make this decision. she was announcing her own decision to curtail the number of debates, to limit them to six. debates there were 26 him and not six. they began in april 2007, 6 months ahead of when their beginning now. and people were free, candidates, to participate in any kind of debate they wanted to. that being consistent with most people's notions of the first

amendment will stop this year, not only are there only six, but any candidate that appears in any debate that has happened sanctioned by the party is thus barred from participating in any more of the sanctioned official debates. i find -- when you realize, this is an organization that has the word "democratic" in its title, that to have a process that shuts down open discussion in such a direct -- draconian fashion, i think is pretty amazing. the vice chairwoman from florida has spoken up -- think about it, she is the vice chairwoman and she found out about it in the newspapers. i think it is a terrible idea. i have one more thing, to the question of the process itself, there are number of affected parties. the candidates have said they want more debates. the others are the voters who have a righteous the who the candidates are, who have a right to see the front runner tested,

who have a right to try to develop ideas the democratic party has been, i think, lacks in developing, questions of the globalization, pay to play part of ticks, and all these things -- pay to play politics, and all the things. have hardly been in a leadership fashion. we have been trailing the issues as the years have gone by in these last years, especially. there is a chance in these debates to do what debates can do to crack a process open, to bring people in. and they decided not to do that. i think it is fair to say when i say "they" i think the chairwoman has decided to do this because she thinks it is good for hillary clinton. that it is good to help the front runner, the party favorite, the establishment candidate wrap things up girly without too much of a mess and too much of a fight. shei'd all think -- i think is only enabling clinton, not really helping her.

i'd -- i think clinton needs to be in an authentic give-and-take, not in these type scripted situations. but above all, all of us need that to happen. i applied the congresswoman and anyone else who stood up and tried to open up this process. amy: your article suggests it is the previous losers of each party who are very much determining what happens with these debates. romney and hillary clinton. happenedook at what with romney in the last election and they think he is being out front -- the republicans on their side, they have this crazy rule in which starting on march 15, just six weeks after the all theirus in iowa, caucuses and primaries are what her take all -- nearly all of them. and the idea was to help someone like jeb bush or some jeb bush

doppelgänger, whoever the establishment guy that may be ahead, to close the process down, to stop a trump type before he can break too much crockery and cost to much trouble. they did nothat perceive work, one, trump, and two, a field the size of the boston marathon. what if gotten our 15 candidates. if seven are still there on super tuesday and trump is still leading with 26%, 20 7% of the vote, he could get 27% of the vote and 100% of the delegates, which is the only way he could be nominated, even by the republican party. a role that was set up to exclude him and to make light easier for whatever their party, the favorite wasoing to be has in fact given him his only prayer of being nominated. it is the same thing on the democratic side. i think to some degree, hillary clinton would have been a lot better off over the last few months if she had been out and open debate taking questions.

she would have at least had a chance that she has a chance -- had a chance to say that she stood for more than just the e-mails. in the party would of had time to push her further. it is amazing what sanders has accomplished 20 think about this. if you look at the last 50 years, you can find very few examples of her presidential candidate even in a general election really moving a debate. last few months without even being able to be on television, tonight is his first shot at reaching the centrist democrats. for most, the first time they've seen him. yet sanders has argument of the xl pipeline debate and the trans-civic partnership debate by forcing hillary's hand, he has brought from it is pressure on the democrats in congress. if in fact the pipeline goes down and is in fact the transpacific partnership goes down, sanders more than any other person should get the

credit. that is an amazing a conference went, even more than he has achieved in the polls of the donors and the packed stadiums. to be moving the debate this much without event benefit of the showcase of the debate, is really pretty incredible. amy: bill curry, the whole issue of whether joe biden will actually enter the debate and to las vegas, even have a podium ready. are they just trying to build the suspense? >> i would point out, as long as that the extra elector, they could probably say the lawrence lessig, if joe gets here, it's his. if not, as long as we have the extra lectern, why don't you come on in, having raised $1 million and being a legitimate candidate, with the most legitimate issue -- again, they think keeping him out help some. here's why they're so wrong. argument veryhe strongly the democratic party today and progressive issues

generally have the support of the majority of americans in a list every poll in every issue whether it is gun safety were the cuban embargo or gay marriage or immigration policy. you can go from hot issued a hot issue to hot issue and people by 60% to two thirds preferred the democratic position, but republicans control the house, the senate, the supreme court and the next election is a dead heat. how come? i think it is because people are so angry with the government. i think it is because this government has become so corrupt, that it is only as even in the eyes of patriots. i think bringing a lawrence lessig and divorce every candidate in this race does even bernie could talk more about this in my view, he is the best on it in the field, but we should pay more attention, the people we need to put into a governing coalition in this race, the people we need to get to that majority, they want to know the party of government is ready to fix the government. and then it's ready to curb this

extraordinary corporate interest, to take private money out of public policy, to get revolving door whistleblower ethics and open government rules to really have teeth rather than the fraudulent rules that we have on the books now. bringing someone like lawrence lessig into this debate could light that issue up in a way the party is totally filled to do, could draw the attention of the american people to solutions that they might begin to believe in, and make it more possible for a party that is supposed to be the party of progress and reform to actually win an election. amy: i want to thank you for being with us, bill curry. bill curry is a weekly political columnist at salon.com. we will ring -- link to your most recent piece, "the dnc screwed hillary -- now get ready for a bernie sanders earthquake." curry was a white house counselor to president clinton and a two-time democratic nominee for governor of connecticut. he is now working on a book on president obama and the politics of populism. we will be back in a moment. ♪ [music break]

amy: "american sueño" la excelencia. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. as democratic presidential candidates kick-off the first debate of the 2016 presidential race tonight, the issue of immigration has emerged on the campaign trail. on thursday, hillary clinton addressed the congressional hispanic caucus institute's 38th annual awards gala and called for a more humane immigration policy. she also denounced what she called the ugly anti-immigrant rhetoric coming from republican presidential candidates. >> it is a problem when the leading republican candidate for president says that immigrants from mexico are rapists and drug dealers. it is a problem when candidates "anchornsive terms like

babies" or even talk about changing the constitution to take citizenship away from those who were born here. we need people who will stand up to this ugly rhetoric in extreme inking, who will say -- [applause] who will say with our words and with our action, enough, and this. amy: earlier this year, democratic presidential hopeful bernie sanders called for comprehensive immigration reform. this is sanders addressing the national association of latino elected and appointed officials conference in las vegas, nevada. >> i think the growing majority of the american people, believe folks in this country are working [indiscernible] and that has got to end.

>[indiscernible] let me be very clear as to where i stand. it is time for this disgraceful situation to end. amy: well, we turn now to a startling new report that examines america's broken immigration system called, "the refugees at our door." it was just published in the "new york times" by pulitzer-prize winning journalist sonia nazario. the article suggests the obama administration is paying the mexican government to keep people from reaching the u.s. border, people who often have legitimate asylum claims and once deterred in their journey, often left to die. nazario writes, "essentially the -- "in the past 50 months of the request of president obama,

mexico is carried out a ferocious crackdown on refugees fleeing violence in central america. the us is given mexico tens of millions of dollars for the fiscal year that stops these migrants from reaching the united states border to claim asylum, essentially, the u.s. is outsourcing." for more we go to los angeles, california, where we're joined by sonia nazario. she is the author of, "enrique's journey: the story of a boy's dangerous odyssey to reunite with his mother." sonia nazario, welcome to democracy now! how is the u.s. and mexico to stop migrants from coming north? >> well, we are the exact opposite of what germany is doing. i should say, i think we can have a debate about what should be done about economic migrants, people who come here for a better life, but with refugees, that is someone who is being persecuted and they are fleeing for their lives.

and in germany, we have seen these emotional images of the german people and angela merkel opening their doors in the welcoming them adtran stations. and what we're doing as a country is we have paid mexico tens of millions of dollars to stop these refugees from arriving at our border and claiming, asking for refuge, asking for asylum, our state department is funding this and our congressional leaders, the department of state has said in a recent document they want to spend $90 million next fiscal this.n 2016 to do more of what we're saying is this is paying for this incredible crackdown where the immigration authorities have increased immensely the number of deportees. mexico and the first seven months deported 23,000 more central americans in the united states and plans to that amount by 70% this year while the rate is cut by the united states.

so we are asking mexico basically to do our dirty work. president obama, for political expedient reasons 50 months ago, one of this problem, as he saw it, these immigrant children coming to the united states to go away soarch he outsourced his problem to mexico. amy: can you tell us the story of julie elizabeth perez who you met in a migrant shelter in mexico? >> last month i spent seven or eight days in mexico. i felt not enough attention was being focused on this. and julie, first, sheila someone of the most deadly towns in honduras, which the homicide rate has recently declined some comment but for the last you and report worldwide had the highest homicide -- you and report worldwide had the highest homicide rate after syria. she lived in is very deadly town controlled largely by the 18th street gang, started here in los angeles, by the way, and first

her brother was abducted and he was killed. they stole his $91 in rent money he was taking to pay. they cut off his feet and his hands when they killed him. and then they abducted her 14-year-old son. they asked him to join the gang. they started doing this to children and very young ages, 9, 10, 12 years old. he was 14. he a gone on a short run. she frantically searched for him and found him a few hours later. yet been suffocated to death with a bag over his head and found in a garbage bag. she fled to another city three hours away and seven months later -- you know, the gangs are incredibly good at intelligence. they beat the cia by a mile and figuring out who is coming in and out of town and where the movement for escaping the gang violence. she got a warning, we know where you are now, so seven months later she fled to mexico, trying

to reach her mother, grandmother, who were legally in the u.s. she applied for a visa. they turned her down. her only choice to save her three remaining children was to try to get through mexico to the united states. it took her 20 days to travel 250 miles. these migrants are walking through mexico now because they cannot get on the trains -- two ride on top of freight trains as they used to do because of the crackdown. she encountered all sorts of obstacles, immigration officials shooting at her on top of the train with her children aboard, having to go around these enormous number of checkpoints. 20,000 raids on immigrants just in the past year as part of this southern border plan, as it is called, that was pushed by president obama. amy: is it fair to say the u.s. is bankrolling these mexican border guards who aim -- who in a number of cases are guilty of

her and does human rights abuses? ares absolutely true we bankrolling this. tens of billions of dollars last year and $90 million proposed by the department of state this year and that doesn't count what the department of defense has been kicking in, an unknown amount. many, many studies have shown mexican officials, but the federal police, the state police, and immigration officials are complicit in this robbery, rape, killing of immigrants as they try to travel north to the united states to safety. and we see -- children now walking the length of mexico ising to allude -- illude officials and people like julie putting her small children -- her six-year-old walking for days on end for 12 hours at a time, putting her three-year-old on her shoulders, trying to get

from mexico into the united states for safety. i think what we are doing is shameful. fleeing are people harm, and we should at least give them a chance of proving that they are refugees. if they aren't, then perhaps send them back. but we assigned protocols saying we will protect refugees. we have urged other countries like germany -- the countries surrounding syria who have taken in more than 4 million refugees. we get a few tens of thousands, and instead of trying to comprehend what they're going through and welcome them or at least put them through our judicial system and see if they qualify or not, we have paid mexico to send them back to their deaths. there's a study by our social researcher that shows in the , at 21 months, 90 people least, have been murdered shortly after being returned by the united states and mexico to their home countries in these

three very violent countries in central america, including a 14-year-old boy returned to honduras. within 24 hours of being returned home, he had two bullets in his head. this is what our policies are causing. and i think the american people need is say this must stop. i don't want this done in my name. i do not want my taxpayer money funding this. i have a letter on my website, if you agree to send your congressional leader saying that you want a fair policy toward refugee children, in particular. amy: last year democracy now! spoke to josé fled at the age of 13 in search of his mother. he traveled unaccompanied through central america and finally reached houston, texas, four months later. zelaya described his journey. >> honduras is a very dangerous country. once i was simply playing soccer and there was a drive-by shooting during the soccer game. i ended up being shot twice and

both my arms. it was that day and made a decision i needed to run away. i needed to leave honduras and come to the united states to find my mother. i did not know where she was, i knew was the area code 713, which was the houston area code. it took me 45 days to get to the united states. it was horrible. it is the worst experience i've ever witnessed, to be thirsty not have water. to be hungry and not have food. not even a trash can to find food was available in the desert . whenever you are riding the train nbc people lose their lives, you see little girls being physically abused by the coyotes, and you can't do anything because you are a child. i was 13 years old when i came. i was not trying to break the law, i was trying to fulfill the reunited with my mother and sister. when i came to the u.s., i was actually in a detention center as well in harlingen, texas. the experience was difficult. we were only allowed to see the

sunlight one hour a week. we were only allowed to take water three times a day. zelaya.t is josé luis your self road on top of seven trains a decade ago with child migrants. how is what they go through today compare? >> it was thoroughly difficult back then. i still have posttraumatic stress to indicate how hard it was. mentioned, it was difficult. many people are robbed, raped, beaten back then. but we've seen in the last year, and 81% increase in robberies. you're seeing brother time people got to the shelter, the margaret shelter -- which really has become a refugee camp, by the way, just 200 300 miles inside the southern border of mexico, 95% now are robbed by the time they get there.

some of them multiple times. the majority of the women are being raped. what you're seeing is an exponential increase in the harm in done to these migrants, both by the immigration authorities and by this whole army of delinquents that have taken the message from the mexican authorities. it is open season on migrants. you can do whatever you want because we need to get at the bidding, we need to get this flow to stop, to get these people not to reach the united states border. what we're seeing is instead of riding on top of that train come on top of the freight trains the length of mexico as i did, people are going in places that are morer, that there isolated. and that is where these delinquent's have all risen up that are robbing and raping and killing in extraordinary numbers. 20,000 central americans are

being disappeared every single year -- kidnapped. and many of these people resurface after someone in the united states has to pay ransom to release them. and if you cannot pay, they will kill you. they will cut you up in front of the others as a message. many are being enslaved to work the marijuana fields or digging tunnels, prostituted. their finding people -- 14 records woke up recently with wounds that have been sewn up. their kidneys have been harvested. it is another level and a higher number of robberies, rapes, killings that are happening today than when luis made the journey and i made the journey. yeah, you had to convince me that this was a lot tougher than before, but it is tougher than before. it is extraordinarily hard. that is why people are stopping 200 to 300 miles and at the shelter i was at and saying, i can't go back, they will kill me in my country. but i can't go forward, they

will kill me mexico. i'm going to try to get asylum. i'm going to try to get a humanitarian visa from mexico. either way, mexico makes it extremely difficult to get it. they try to put every barrier possible to apply for asylum. if you are detained, they basically don't inform you of your right to asylum, which they are supposed to do her mexican law. only one in 10 people are being informed. if you are informed, they try to dissuade you from applying. if you're able to apply, which only 2000 folks were able to do last year, they hold you in these jails that have rats roaming by day, worms in the food. they try to do everything possible to discourage you. and only 20% -- you stay there month or even a year if you appeal will stop only 20% of people who are able to apply when their asylum claims versus 50% in the united states. so mexico is putting every

potential obstacle they can in the course of people trying to reach our borders and say, help me. they're trying to kill me in my country, i cannot go back. and now i cannot move forward. i am stuck. amy: the man we just heard for -- heard from who traveled year yaen he was 13, josé luis zela with a group united weeks during, the same group that protested hillary clinton. we just played a clip. she was heckled by united we dream. a stable was issued saying -- what about the prisons here in the united states? >> we have managed to get a law passed in congress that 34,000 a portable immigrants will be locked up any night in our prison system, as we have locked

up fewer nonviolent drug offenders, we have the prison industry -- the prison industry has found a way to fill those jails with immigrants. that is absolutely true. it is gone from 800 million or so seven or eight years ago that they made off immigrants to more than $2 billion. this is a huge industry for them. and they sent a lot of money at this. passedget lost like that through congress, but when we try to get a law allocating $50 million to immigrant children so a four-year-old doesn't stand before our immigration judges being asked to present their asylum claim all by themselves -- we don't allocate immigration lawyers to immigrant children who come here alone. so you see these children shaking with utter fear before the judge. that law got shutdown by the senate. it is absolutely true that the prison industry wants to keep this going and companies like correction corp. of america and geo have made a lot of money off

of this. i think instead of what we're doing, we need to push our government to do what germany is doing, which is to establish a system, be a leader in terms of -- establish ast system to allow these refugees to arrive at our border and claim asylum and then redistribute these migrants to canada, latin america, and, yes, some to the u.s. so that they are safe while we address the root causes of this violence, help these countries address the root causes and latin america. we only take and 70,000 refugees a year. germany, that dinky country in europe, will take more than 10 times that amount this year. i think we can afford to go up to at least 130,000. that is what we took in pre-9/11, to allow, specially, these children to have safe harbor in this country. instead of paying mexico to turn them away, we should also pay them to make sure that they are

screened for asylum. mexico only has 20 asylum officers in the whole country. three offices. they have purposefully underfunded this. amy: you choose the word "migrant" and "refugee" rather than immigrant. >> a refugee is someone who is being persecuted in their home country, and their fling harm. this is what i saw 14 months ago when i went to honduras. i saw children -- you know, we spend billions of dollars to stop the flow of drugs coming from venezuela and colombia of the caribbean corridor to the dominican republic, jamaica, haiti. we spent all of this taxpayer money and want to the narco's do? they rerouted and are now landing four or five narco flights in honduras. they're trying to control that turf to move drugs north to us,

the largest consumer of illegal drugs on earth. we use one in four illegal drugs on earth. they are recruiting children to control that turf, to serve as lookouts, to sell drugs in those their rights, and to work to kill people, ultimately. i saw children as young as 11. i spoke to an 11-year-old boy interviews i did for "the new york times" and he said, i'm 11 years old and the six grade, and these narco's are telling me as i come out of my elementary school, which they control, you are going to start using crack. if you don't -- and get hooked on it. and if you don't insert working press, we're going to kill you. your options for a lot of these children are start working for the gangs, start working for the narco's the gangs often report to, or flee. those are the options. we're seeing the kids coming through mexico are younger and younger. half that are caught in mexico, 11 and younger, and more are

girls. the girls i saw in the neighborhood, they were 40% now of the girls -- of the children caught in mexico now are girls. they're being told, you will be my girlfriend, but the gang leaders, the narco leader, or i'm going to exterminate your whole family. i am seeing many more girls and women coming through mexico. at the shelter i was at, there is a 28-year-old woman who had been kidnapped by the gang come at the 18th street gang in her neighborhood, basically the lawn or neighborhood. there is no government to turn to in certain parts of honduras. she came out of her job, they grabbed her, four gangsters, took her to a house and there's a man tied up and they forced her to watch as they beat this man to death, stabbed him in his arms and legs, then cut him off in pieces. she doesn't know if you was alive or dead when that happened. then forced her to hold the garbage bag as they put his nieces into it. and told her, you're going to be my girlfriend tomorrow or this

is what will happen to you tomorrow. she fled without even saying goodbye to her four children, without giving them a hug because she thought they would have questions, and that might put them in greater danger. she fled to mexico where she is now at that shelter trying to get through mexico in trying to reach safety in the united states. this is what people are fleeing. this is very different from someone who is an immigrant coming in for a better life, like my parents came here from argentina. they wanted a better life for themselves, but they were not fleeing for their lives. amy: i want to thank you very much, sonia nazario, your piece is astounding in "the new york times." , "thel link to it called refugees at my jeweler -- door." we will also link to our own democracy now! rené felts plus award-winning report on the private immigrant detention

centers run by for-profit corporations on the border of the united states at democracynow.org. when we come back, "the devil's chessboard: allen dulles, the cia, and the rise of america's secret government." stay with us. ♪ [music break]

amy: "war," bob marley. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. it's been over 50 years since allen dulles resigned as director of the cia, but his legacy lives on. between 1953 and 1961, the cia overthrew the governments of iran and guatemala, attempted to invade cuba, and was tied to the killing of patrice lumumba -- congo's first democratically elected leader. a new biography of allen dulles looks at how his eight years at the cia helped shaped the current national security state. biographer david talbot writes -- "the allen dulles story continues to haunt the country. many of the practices that still provoke bouts of american soul-searching originated during dulles's formative rule at the

cia. he goes on to write -- " mind control experimentation, torture, political assassination, extraordinary rendition, mass surveillance of u.s. citizens and foreign allies -- these were all widely used tools of the dulles reign." david talbot joins us now to talk about his new book, "the devil's chessboard: allen dulles, the cia, and the rise of america's secret government." he is the founder and former ceo and editor-in-chief of salon. he is also author of the bestseller, "brothers: the hidden history of the kennedy years." it is great to have you with us. what an astounding book. snowdenmanning, edward -- how do they relate to allen dulles, the longest reigning cia director? >> as i write in the book and as you just pointed out, all the practices that we are wrestling with as a country now, the intelligence, security measures, including, i might add, the

legacy of killing fields in central america that your guest was just discussing in guatemala and so on -- that all had its roots, not after 9/11, but during the dulles era and the cold war. he felt he was above the law . he felt democracy should not be left in the hands of the american people or its representatives. he was part of the famous calledgist in the 1950's the power elite. he felt he and his brother and those types of people -- amy: john foster dulles, secretary state. >> exactly. they were a dynamic duo. his brother, foster, with secretary of state under eisenhower. he was the head of the cia. it was the one-two punch. amy: let's go to allen dulles in his own words. he's defending the actions of the cia. talks the idea that it is necessary -- nefarious to engage in overthrowing governments is

false. it is for the birds. now there are times -- there are times when the united states government feels that the development and another government such as in the vietnam situation is of a nature to imperil the safety and security, the peace of the world , and as the central intelligence agency to be its agent in that particular situation at no time has the cia engaged in any political activity or any intelligence activity. that was not approved at the highest level. amy: that is allen dulles in 1965. so talk about the history that is so intimately connected to us today, often countries -- their leaders have been overthrown, no this history in a way that americans don't know. >> allen dulles was a consummate

liar and very adept at manipulating the american media. that particular interview was one of the ones that he got post some of the tougher questions by john chancellor nbc news. he went on to say, i tried to let the congress know what i'm asked when chancellor him, his political oversight of the cia. but he said, when he would talk to congress they would say, no, no, we don't want to know. that was his cover. overthrowing governments, one of the more tragic stories i tell in the book is of patrice lumumba, the hope of african nationalism in the congo. by military town in the congo and later captured and brutally assassinated. the cia's story before the church committee in the 1970's,

oh, we try to kill him, we try to poison him, but we're the gang that can't shoot straight. they were far too modest. in fact, we now know the people who beat patrice lumumba to death once was captured were on the payroll of the cia. allen dulles cap that fact from john f. kennedy for over a month. john kennedy, when he was running for president, was known as the advocate, the supporter of african nationalism. they knew once john kennedy was inaugurated, the cia, and was in office, he would help lumumba who was in captivity at that point. i believe his execution, his murder, was rushed before kennedy could get in the white house. they then withheld that information from the president for over a month. so the cia was to find presidents all the time, particular in the case of kennedy who they felt was young, they committed relate, or did not really need to bring him to their confidence. amy: you have the cia running

international intelligence and they are keeping -- welcome me say keeping from -- what makes you believe that kennedy did not know? >> that he did know about the murder? well, there's a famous picture taken of him in the white house as he is getting the phone call not from the cia, but from the stephenson he finally tells him a month after lumumba has been buried and dead about this terrible murder and his face, as you can see from the famous photograph, the white house photographer, is crumpled in agony. i think this shows all the terrible sorrow that has become and the kennedy presidency. does peoplengs believe the war began after the bay of pigs. that is true, it became particularly aggravated after that, but you can see from day wine, even before he was inaugurated, the cia was defying him.

amy: 1953, go back a few years. what is the relevance of what the dulles brothers did in iran with what we're seeing today in the u.s.-iranian elections? >> this terrible historical rebel continues. iran was trying to throw off the yoke of british colonialism. oftish petroleum control all iran's oil resources. does thisleadership popular leader was elected by his people, he began to push back against british control and as a result, antagonized western oil interests, including the dulles brothers. the dulles brothers power originally came from their law law for the most powerful firm on wall street. they represented a number of oil companies. so once the western oil interests were in tech and eyes -- antagonized by the attempts to reclaim sovereignty over

these oil resources, his days were numbered. and so the task of overthrowing him was given to the cia, given to allen dulles. it was a very volatile situation. people supporting him in the streets versus the cia supporting forces. the shock, the puppet ruler of iran on the peacock throne, flees because he is not particular brave does particular really brave. dulles flights to rome. he is joined his exile with his glamorous wife. the cia exceeds an overthrowing the popular leader. after that, that begins a reign of horror in iran. democratic elements, the left, communist parties rounded up, tortured, and the shaw is installed in this terrible

autocratic regime that, of course, we know had a terrible downfall during the carter administration and we're still paying the price for the bitterness that the iranian people feel toward the united states for intervening in their sovereign interests. amy: and the u.s. would go on, the dulles brothers would go on to do the very same thing the next year, 1954 in guatemala? >> that's right. they thought they could do anything. a popular democratic leader elected in guatemala -- amy: will have 10 seconds in this portion. amy: the kennedy of guatemala is overthrown by the dulles brothers, partly because they were representatives of the united fruit which was a major power player in guatemala. amy: we're going to leave it there but do part two and we will post it online at democracynow.org. david talbot is author of the new book, "the devil's chessboard: allen dulles, the cia, and the rise of america's

secret government." david talbot is founder and former editor-in-chief at salon. [captioning made possible by democracy now!]

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