10/10/17 10/10/17 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from pacifica, this is democracy now! >> i ask you to immediately of thethe intervention catalan institution until we withdraw the extra police deployed in catalonia. these are indispensable steps to open a dialogue and recover ininstitutional formalities. amy: barcelona's mayor ada colau calls for saint remove thousands of state police who have been deployed to catalonia at of tonight's expected declaration

of independence, possibly triggering intervention by spanish forces. we will l speak with wikileaks founder and editor-in-chief julian assange who is been advising thosese pushing to sece on how to communicate securely even as s the state pushes baca. security ---h state r the catalolonia populationon. make e itasy fofor them to understand the structure of cacatalonia in socociety. who's important, who isn't important, etc.. you protect yourself. you protect your friends. amy: as calls for gun control in the aftermath of the las vegas massacre, we will speak with about gunliam barber violence and violence policy. >> what is this commitment that we have two guns? psychosisis strange that when these things happen we want to blame everything but the guns? what kind of stranglehold does

the nra, what kind of blood thirst, commitment do we have? and this culture, american culture, we have to own the violence. amy: all that and more, coming up. welcome e to democracy now!, dedemocracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. in california, powerful winds and bone-dry conditions fueled massive wildfifires throughout much of the state, leaving at least 10 people dead, destroying whole neighborhoods, and forcing 20,000 people to evacuate their homes. state fire officials say they're battling at least 14 major fires in eight counties. one of the worst blazezes was in the city of santa rosa in northern california's sonoma county, wherere fire ripped throrough a trailer r park, destroyed homes,s, restataurantd hohotels, and forced medical tes at the kaiser permanente hospital to evacuate 130 patients as flames approached.

this is santa rosa resident dave rollans. -- david rollans. >> this is apocalyptic it seems. this is so far out of the norm. i'm from southern california. i've never seen anytythi like this in an urban area. amy: northern california hospitals report at least 170 people have sought medical treatment, mostly for smoke inhalation but also for burns. meanwhile another massive fire in southern california's orange county spread across the anaheim hills monday, forcing the evacuation of 5000 homes. that blaze has scorched over 6000 acres and is only about 5% containened. the wildfires come after the u.s. forest service warned last year that an unprecedented fifive-year drought led to the deaths of more than 100 million trees in california, setting the stage for massive fires.s. climate scientists believe human-cacaused global warmrming played a major role e in the drought. in washington, d.c., the trump administration said tuesday it

will end the clean powerer plan, president obama's landmark rule on greenhouse gas emissions from power plants. epa administrator scott pruitt made the announcement standing alongside senate republican leader mitch mcconnell during a visit to a coal mining and construction firm in hazard, kentucky. >> any regulatory body can kentucky. pick winners andnd losers. the cast of administration was unapologetic. they were using every bit of power come every bit of authority to use the epa to pick winners and users and how we generate electricity in this country. amy: obama's clean power plan would have reduced greenhoususe gas emissions in part by decommissioning coal-fired power plants. the plan would have helped the u.s. partly meet its obligations under the paris climate accord, though critics say it didn't go nearly far enough. cancellation of the clean power plan move drew condemnation from environmentalists, including author and activist bill

mckibben who tweeted -- "neither flood nor hurricane nor wildfire can keep these men from their task of dismantling environmental protections." in puerto rico, the trump administration has allowed a 10-day waver of the jones act to lapse, restricting shipments of food, fuel, and medicine from foreign-flagged ships as nearly half of the island still lacks clean water and nearly 90% lacks electricity more than two weeks after hurricane maria a struck. the expiration of the jones act waiver came over the fierce opposition of san juan mayor carmen yulin cruz, who on sunday blasted the trump administration's slow response to the hurricane, tweeting -- "power collapses in san juan hospital with 4 patients now being transferred out. have requested support from fema. nothing." federal emergency management agency chief brock long on monday dismissed mayor cruz's comments, telling reporters --

"we don't have time for r the political noise." in bangladesh, at least 23 people are dead and dozens more missing after a boat overloadedd with desperate rohingya refugees capsized off the coastst near te country's border with burma. the migrants were attempting to join more than half a million rohingya refugees who've fled an ethnic cleansing campaign backed by burma's military. this is sayed hossain, one of the survivors. >> we were seven. my three kids, my wife, my father-in-law, my elderly mother, and me. among them, , i alone survived. we all faced some of typical to use e searchining for food and surviving. they killed people and burn down the villages and houses. we came here to save our lives. amy: the latest dedeaths came as drone footage e released by the disasters emergency committee showed the scale of the rohingya refugee crisis. the video shows a massive, sprawling camp of makeshift tents anand shacksks stretchingo

ththe horizon. the internrnational commititteef the red cross said monday it's pulling most of its staff out of afghanistan after a string of attacks on its employees there. the move follows more than three decades of medical work by the icrc in afghanistan, and as the trump administration has increased the number of u.s. troops there. this is monica zanarelli, head of the icrc's delegation in afghanistan. >> exposure has become our greatest challenge in concern. we know there is no zero riskskn afghanistan and we are not aiming at that. we don't want to build differently our security than we have always done. our security is built on acceptance and dialogue. fromcceptance comes meaningful services that can be divided -- vulnerable people.

amy: two people were killed after a strike in italy. --idlib. amend and shop were pulled from a collapsed holding. regimeroups i'm certain or plans for the attack. in france, all nine unions representing the country's public employees are on strike today protesting government plans to lay off 120,000 people and rollback sick leave while cutting take-home pay. the strike by some 5.4 million workers shuttered public schools in paris and led airlines to cancel about a third of all flights across the country. back in the united states, google said monday suspected russian agents paid for tens of thousands of dollars worth of political advertisements last year aimed at swaying the 2016 presidential election. "the washington post" reports the ads were aimed at spreading disinformation across google's many platforms, including its search results, gmail service,

and youtube. managers at microsoft said momonday they, too, were investigating whether russian operatives paid for inappropriate pro-trump ads on its bing search engine and other platforms. social media giant facebook has said a russian company placed thousands of ads on their network at a cost of more than $100,000, while twitter reported last month it discovered about 200 accounts linked to a russian campaign to influence the election. erik prince, founder of the now-defunct private mercenary firm blackwater, is preparing a challenge against wyoming republican senator john barrasso in next year's primary election. prince was reportedly urged to run by steve bannon, donald trump's former chief strategist and editor of the far-right news site breitbart. prince has financial support from new york hedge fund manager and billionaire robert mercer and his daughter rebekah, who are heavily invested in breitbart and funded donald trump's campaign. erik prince recently made

headlines when the white house indicated it was considering his plan to appoint a u.s. viceroy in afghanistan while privatizing much of the war effort. in charlottesville, virginia, police have issued an n arrest warrant for 20-year-old deandre harris, a black man who was brutally beaten by white supremacists in a parking garage last summer. police say harris is wanted on a felony charge of unlawful wounding for allegedly assaulting one of the far-right protesters who gathered in the city on august 12 in a rally that turned deadly when 20-year-old nazi sympathizer james fields plowed into a crowd of counter-protesters, killing heather heyer and injuring 19 others. deandre harris's beating was captured on video. he later recounted his ordeal to photojournalist zach roberts. >> i was trying to get up and run, but i can't. every time i got up, i just lose consciousness and fall back out. the last time i got to open my eyes and i feel my friends. they pick me up and take me over

there so i could get out. gash in the head, broke my ribs, chipped my tooth. busted my lip. got a bunch of cuts on my knees and outpost. i got eight staples in my head. amy: while photos and video show at least six white supremacists punching, kicking, and beating harris with large metal poles, only two of his assailants have been charged. espn has suspended sportscenter anchor jemele hill for two weeks after she criticized dallas cowboys owner jerry jones for threatening to bench any player who participates in protests during the national anthem. espn said hill violated the sports network's social media policy after she tweeted that fans should boycott the team's advertisers, writing -- "if you strongly reject what jerry jones said, the key is his advertisers. don't place the burden squarely on the players." hill, who is african-american, was publicly reprimanded by espn

last month after she tweeted that president trump is a white supremacist. white house press secretary sarah huckabee sanders responded by calling hill's tweet a fireable offense. more than 50 u.s. cities, including los angeles, phoenix, select city, austin, texas, celebrated indigenous peoples day monday in place of the federal holiday honoring christopher columbus. the italian explorer who massacred and enslaved indigenous people while opening the door to the european colonization of the americas. in new york city, protesters rallied at a 115-year-old statue of christopher columbus near central park monday calling for its removal and for the city to make the second monday of each october indigenous peoples day. the protests came as the new itk police department said was providing around the clock surveillance of the monument. this is loaiza rivera, a student activist at the city university of new york. >> i am a junior student.

my professors say how crist for columbus was a hero, how he should be honored. in 2017, i can't believe that is still going on. that is ridiculous. that is why this is a big deal. it is not just a statue. it is not just a day. it is a message we are constantly putting out that we are ok with this kind of behavior, ok with the crisis in puerto rico and we are not. amy: and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. we begin today's show spain, where thousands are expected to gather outside catalonia's parliament in barcelona this evening when regional president carles puigdemont is expected to declare independence from spain. this is his first address to parliament following an october 1 referendum produduced an overwhelming vote for secession and provoked a stand-off with the spanish government, which ruled the vote illegal. tonight's announcement could

trigger intervention by spanish forces. puigdemont originally promised to declare independence within 48 hours of a victory for the secessionist campaign, but has instead called for negotiations. barcelona's mayor ada colau said monday the results of the referendum are not enough to declare independence, but also urged spain's prime minister mariano rajoy to help decrease tension by removing state police who have been deployed to the region. immediately to reverse the intervention on the catalan institutions and to withdraw the extra police deployed and catalonia. these are indidispensable stepso open a dialogue and recover institutional nonormality is. amy: this comes after hundreds of thousands rallied i in barcelona on sunday in a massive unity rally opposing independence for the country's catalonia region. pro-unity organizers said their slogan "let's recover our common sense" is aimed at generating dialogue with the rest of us pain. their supporters include nobel prize-winning novelist and the

former president of the european parliament. organizers said nearly a million people attended the rally, while catalan police put the number at 350,000. in either case, the rally was larger than a mass pro-independence mobilization last week. the rally came as catalan leaders claimed about 90% of those who voted in a banned referendum a week ago supported independence. spain's government called the independence drive unconstitutional and ordered a policece crackdown on the vote which left about 900 people injured. on monday, a spokesman for spain's governing people's party compared catalan's president puigdemont to the former catalan president lluis companys, who was jailed after declaring a catalan republic in 1934. he was exiled in france after the spanish civil war and later extradited by nazi authorities, and killed by a firing squad in 1940 under the franco dictatorship.

>> lasast october 6, the 83rd anniversrsy of companies declaration of independence passed almost unnotiticed. i believe history should notot e repeated. let's hope tomorrow, nothingng will be declared because m maybe the one who declares it wilill d as the one who declared it 83 years ago. amy: catalogs who support the independence referendum -- catalonians who support the independence referendum have had help from wikileaks founder julian assange, who tweeted hundreds of times in the days leading up the referendum, including a video that advised catalonians how to communicate and organize through secure channels. this is a clip. >> the spanish state securititys repressive for the catalalonian pupulation. they m make it easy fofor theheo understand the structurere of catalonian society. who is important, who is not importanant, etc. you u otect yoururself. you u protect yourur friends.

you protect youour frienends, yu prototect your community. if you protect your commununity, youu prorotect the whohole soci. in a suauation like this where there is serio repressioion developiping against people who are tryrying to communicate e tr political d desires, t then actuallyly, we have a responsibility, a burden uponon usus, ose people who understand, justst to t try to teach everyoe else. amy: that's wikileaks founder and editor-in-chief julian assange in a video he posted to twitter. for more assange joins us now , from the ecuadorean embassy in london. welcome back to democracy now! talk about w what is happeningnn catalonia and why you are so interested in it and the kind of aid that you provided, technical aid.d. >> good morning,g, amy. i don't have a position on independencece itself. theheink thats a a matter

catalonians. that is precisely t the point. they are 7.5 m million people. under thathe people definition, thererefore, never right to self-determination. that can either be provided for by the spanish state or within e e spanish state, then a have right to make their waway outsie the spanish state. i wantnt to speak ababout significan because mosost americans wiwill think, s sin is some r regionall issueuenvolving spain, why doeoes it matter?r? this i is the most s significant change of relationship between populatition and state e westen europe since the fall ofof the berlinin war. europects all of wewestern and into thehe united states. because it is spain, also substantially in the latin america, spanish-speaking latin america. amy: why do you elel that wa >> ok. thee conflict ththat i is occurn

-- let's at ground a little bit. barcelelonis the capital of catatania. people will b be perhaps momore familiar with that city than the region that is interesting. in some sense, a reflects what is been happppening in catalonia over the many y years. there e has been a s struggle fr lan to maintatain their culture e over 300 years of spanish colonialism, various --ms, and t this reaeally b bee it has been happening over a long queue of time. the language being bad -- the catalan language being banned. the printingn press became to an accessible, then. with a telephone injured in the late 19th century to spain speaking catalan on the telephone was banned.

speaking catalan in public was banned. teaching and school, likewise band. pushing spaniards from other provinces into the catalan population to try -- they've had a struggle for a long period of time. they are a distinct culture. somewhere perhaps between france and spanish, the languages perhaps the closest to french. ok. so that is the ground of the long-term struggle trying to gain self realization. looked at it correctly, world war ii began in spain. it did. it began as a proxy war in

spain. that was the spanish civil war. now we have a perception, theish speaking western, fascist lost world war ii. that is false. they won world war ii in frame. franco won in spain. he continued on with u.s. backing intellect and 75 when he died peacefully in his bed. revolution ina spain. there was not an occupation that set the reset button on the existing families institutions and class structure in spain. franco died peacefully in his bed. an example of the rollover that then occurred is seven of his ministers went on to found the party that would become what is now the ruling party in spain, which is headed up by prime minister rajoy. facets of and out with

franco -- undealt with francoism blood into the bureaucracy and significantly, into the culture. this are what have led to conflict, this impasse. you have got a population that is becoming more powerful in catalonia for one reason or another, relative to the state of spain. now, that would normally mean the state of spain has to engage in some kind of negotiation process. it has to be nicer to catalonians, make the film more comfortable, make them feel less scared, give them kind of concession, etc. beenad, the response has to reaeact to this political condition over the last 10 years

with judicial is asianan -- judicialization of politics. , therefores illegal it is not going to happen. from, intleness comes theiew, the remnants of how regime was formed the transition from franco with the u.s. ushering in that process with the king. so it has now led to this impasse. there is another factor as well, which is the right-wing government of rajoy is in a very position. it was only elected on 20% of the vote. 20% of the population. it is a minority government. it is being wracked by a corruption scandal. rajoy was forced

to testify about a month ago in relatition to one of those corruption scandals. it is very serious. amy: i want to turn -- >> the government is instead o f trtrying to negotiate o or coconciliate wh the struggle for cacatalonian indepependence is stead taking a hard-liline and instead p provoking news towowds catalonian dependents, including, as you mentionened jt yeererday,threatatenin too arret the prprident of catalonia and perhaps hahave him killed. end d up like thee previous president who declared independence who was shot by franco. amy: i want to turn to spain saidce minister who

europe's center-right finance ministers support spain's central government in dismissing catalonia'a's independencece rereferendum. >> everyone has supported the position of the spanish government. this is not about independence. this is about a rebellion against the rule of law. the law is the basis of generally daily life in spain, but in all of europe. -- not only daily life in spain, but in all of europe. the filmmaker told the guardian the debate about nationonal identity has drorownd out all other issues. she said but i'm still waiting for someone to tell me what the new catalan republic is going to be like. frankly, i find it hard to tell a difference between a right-wing centralist party and another one that is catalan

nationalist. she was quoted saying this before police attacked the referendum vote and hurt ovover 900 oplele. julilian? >> it is pretty y tiresome. you sesee the so-calalled lefefn turkey. do they support k kurdish independence or do they oppose it? they oppose it. easy the so-o-called lefeft in e socicialist pararty. do tyy suppoport catalan somee determination or oppose e it? ththey oppose it.t. the same thing happens everywhere.. lefeft, if youu like, equivalent to the democrat partyty in the uniteded states. - -- personalal group por r is mostltlyueled by merging with the statate itself. ththerefore theyey become part f the state appaparatus.

bubut the only wayay to keep t e atate honest is thateople hahave the rightht to say they'y've had enouou as i iividuals to leave andd as pepeoples or an area too pupush toward d secessioion or e kikind o of new deal. a bit, frankly, distastefuful. amy: l let me just -- i want to read another quote, but in terms of the film director isabel, i don't think you could describe her as equivalent to the mainstream democratic party in the united states. people who are deeply anti-fascist of course, or anti-franco, also are concerned, but again, this was before the violent attack by the spanish police. but let me read to you from the washinington post what anne applebaum wrote describing you. she wrote -- "with the aim of dividing people, julian assange of wikileaks, who had showed no

prior interest in spanish constitutional politics, suddenly threw himself into the catalan referendum campaign. beginning on sept. 9, he began tweeting his demands for a referendum and his attacks on the spanish government, rapidly becoming the most quoted international commentator on the subject on twitter. similar to the tactics used in the u.s. election, he was helped in this effort by russian state media as well as a network of internet trolls and automated bots, which spread his comments further. the spanish-language edition of sputnik, a russian state news website, has mentioned and quoted assange in headlines more often that it did either the spanish prime minister or the president of the catalan assembly. the motives are clear enough: anything that divides a european country is good for russia." cacan you respond to what she wrotin "the washington post" julian assssange? of a lolong she is a neocon, the wifefe of a former polish foreign minister.r. herer traititorous

later. it is all false. i suppose itit is a posititive n in some ways that someme people see e there's s some impact.t. the russiaian state has formally opposed it. the russian media was nowhere on the sisituation.n. i ththink ththere probably they are probably concncerns that a fairly ccessful indepenendence push b y talonia will lead to o similar pushes e elsewhere. ininterestinglgly, the u.s.s. mainstream pressss and the u.k. mainstream press is substaially s supportive of the catalan efffforts. th is s either bececause there s no u.s. oror u.k. interest in te matter and never journalists are simply free to write what is most appealing and interesting

to their readers, or because there is a slight u.k.-u.s. interest, a new state will need new friends, new arms, will need new intelligence, the u.k. is in its brexit negotiations and so the e.u. having another thing to -- listen the capacity of the eu to believe the u.k. during its negotiations. amy: we're going to go to break and come back to our discussion. we're talking to julian assange, founder and ededitor-in-chieieff wiwikileaks. has taken refuge in ecuadorian embassy for well over four years now for fear of being arrested by the british police. we will talk to you about that, julian, your status and embassy right now given that sweden is no longer seeking your extradition, why you have to remain in the embassy. this is democracy now! we will be back with julian assange in a minute.

♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. to julian assange , who is taken refuge, that political asylum in the ecuadorian embassy in london for the last 5.5 years. has lived in this tiny embassy in london. julian, talk about the status of your case. in fact, you were holed up there so you would not be extradited to sweden, hearing you would then be extradited to the united states. it sweden has dropped its case agagainst you. >> yes, of c crse, it nenever hd a case. there was never a charge.. it was "parlrliamentary investigation"n" which hadlready been closed. -- "preliminary investigion,"

whicich had already been closos. thee cia directotor pompeo in ne l least in their ststatements, some internal matters, pursuing that aggressively. amy: baidu they want you here in the united states and what role is britain playing right now. they don't have to respond. there is not a known arrest .arned for you >> the u.k. refuses to confifirm or deny and so does the u.s. to mikeant to turn pompeo in his s first public address as cia director, speaking at a washington, d.c., think tank earlier this year, blasted wikileaks as a hostile intelligence service in a stark reversal from his previous

praise for the group. this is what he said. >> it is time to call out wikileaks for what it is, a nonstate, hostile intelligence service often abetted by state actors like russia. in reality, a champion nothing but their own celebrity. there currently is quick break. their moral compass, nonexistent. their mission, personal of aggrandidizement through t the destruruction ofof western valu. mike pompeo, cia director, addresst major takes on wikileaks and you, julian. wehis saying esseseially are a nonstatentntelligence agency. those are e his words, which of course, is completely absurd. o organizations, cultivate sources, protect their identitities if they're doing their job well, and publish their material. the central intelelligencee agey

collects i informaon foror a differenent reason -- to exploit , its ownterstate power power, then doesn't publish h i. thee intentionality i in obtaing information n is to publishh itn the case of a media organization. and then it is publishsh, hopepelly. intelligence agencies cocollect information with a different intentntioand ththey don't publish. it is absurd. i think itit is kind of funny. it comes f from ourr incrediblea .ublication it is very, very rare that a to bet cia document released in full. in fact, i'm not aware of it ever having occccurred -- at least, in the last decade. excecept for our publications.. this year,s p prior to

a few. and this year as well. it is deeeeply emily getting for the cia - -- humiliating for the cia and other intelligence agencies to be perceived as incompetent in that way. amy: were you surprised to hear that the trump administration is attacking you? trump also attacked his own people that have d different pointsts of view on n issues lie rex tillerson, w he isis pposedly having luncnch with that s suppodly cacalled him a momore on. atateastst tlerson d did not dey he had done this. do y you think thahat pompeo and trump disagree? trump talked about loving wikileaks when he was on the campaign trail as he was talking about t calling for r e rereleef ail. >> welelcome everyone loves wikileaks will we're publishshig inrmatioion out thosose a oppose. that is inevitable.

releasing information about trumps cia, of course, the attitude changes. amy: du understand i is there is still a grand jury open that is weighing your case in the united states? for people that have not followed the case for 5.5 years, with you being inside the embassy, what you understand is an arrest wararrant or what you understand is out therere as a a result of a grand jury, a secret grand jury? >> t the u.s. government and the u.k.k. governmenent behave asasf ththere is a fldld indictmenentn terms of the refusal talk abouout it, their interactctions with our lawyers, and so one. soso they either have one or thy have a virtual o one. amy: do you see yourself -- >> the grand jury has been expandeded now from our workrors publicatioions about raqqaqa, afghanistan, those alleged, to now include the cia

publications. amy: i want to get your opinion isall of the news that breaking right now. on monday, google said suspected russian agents paid for tens of thousands of dollars for the political advertisement. last her and that's when the 2016 presidential election. managers at microsoft said monday they, too, were investigating whether russian operatives paper inappropriate pro-trump as on its being search engine and other platforms. social media giant facebook has set a russian company placed thousands of ads on their network at a cost of more than $100,000. cnn reports a number of ants specifically targeted michigan and wisconsin, two states crucial to trump's victory in novembmber. and twititter reporteded last mh discovered abobout 200 accounts linkeded to a russian campaign o influence e the electition. this comes as the head of the u.s. senate intelligence committee said last week it has reached the conclusion that russia did interfere in the 2016

u.s. presidential election. republican senator richard burr said his committee is still examining evidence to determine if there is anany collusion between moscow and the trump campaign. your response to all of this, wikileaks s editor-in-n-chief jn assange? well, i think there's a very goodod article rececently publid in "the e nation" that goeses rough all l of that and turn to n nearly all fiction. thparts you u could determine, were you can compare witith showsdiorory statements it is nearly all fiction. whether there is any truth to it, i don'n't know. wewe havnot r researched d that. thinki would say that i i it is very concerning to see this hysteriria, very, verery dangerous in geopoliticacalerms. ofof course,e, is attttempt to e ththe demoatatic pararty, the ca struructure together and thee ma

in their assault agagainst the trump regime. think ththeris plentyy of important tngs to c criticize the e trump administration abou, for emple, ththe promiseses to help the wororking class thahatn waward taxd to pushh for cuts for the rich. these are things that should be concentrated on, not leaping into an insane bout of anti-russian hysteria. i would askassange, about roger stone. in march 2016, he posted on facebook that he "never denied that assange and i had a mutual friend who told me wikileaks had the goods on hrc and would begin disclosures in october. he did and they did. i did not admit it. i announced it." heries ofof tweets, which later deleted, roger stone also attacked a woman who challenged him on twitter writing -- [bleep."pid, stupid p[b

i now want to talk about the latest roger stone going to stify thehe senate intelligence committee and what came out of that. your response to that? >> roger stone has centrally democrats s all of his life and eastern exactly the e me thing in ordrder to elevate hihielf. that is all. you look at our statatement that thee time, he e did not say anything that i had not been saying in public at the time. amy: the me turn to democratic harassment adam schiff speaking at the hearing -- >> i w would like toto s say the effectiveness of that trolng, just shohows you how mad the u.. legal culture has become.e. as roger stone presentnted as a

critical -- credible person in a statement? >> i think his issue is that justice to trump and whether you ththink trump p or roger stotons crediblele -- if heas someththing to wryry about, whwy would he be deliberately plplayg it off constantly? he doesn't have anything to worry about. amamy:hat do you memean? he e doesn't have anynything to worry about because there is s o back chahannel. therere was never a baback chan. he proroced no evidence. he i is simply trolling g the absolu -- thehey want to be trolled. they d don't carere what thtrtrh is at all.l. all theyey want, s some little propaganda point t that they can ususe to sehowow sisfy thehe ridiculousus fantasies aboutut taking dowown trump in n retiono russia.

if r roger stone i going to o hp with thahat, they llll give hima platform. ththat is what they have done. you saw what happened as s a result. yoyou haveo a admire the e foott -- j just a andnd guess the cleverness in whwhh he has donoe it i in some sense.e. whwhat is not honorable, , even thought t is really y tated us, reactction knowow, the of those -- he just throwsws a ball like that. p peopledldless mobs of flying to thee democrats in the democratically aligned media run after i it. amy: let me turn to democratic congressman adam schiff speaking at the house intelligence committee earlier this year. >> on august 8, roger stone, a longtime trump political advisor and self-proclaimed political dirty trickster, boasted a

speech he is communicated with assange and that more documents would be coming, including an october surprise. he also communicate with the russian cut out gucifer 2.0. stone doesgust, something truly remarkable when he protects john podesta's personal enough will soon be published. trust me, he says, it will soon be the best time in the barrel #crookedhillary. in the weeks to follow, he shows repressions. i have total confidence that wikileaks and my hero julian assange will educate the american people he says, #locker up. payload coming, he predicts. in two days later, he does. wikileaks releases the first batch of podesta you mouse. it would then continue on a daily basis up untilil the election. amy: your response, julian

assange, to adam schiff, ranankg democratat? is not a credible person.. he i just lying in orderer to score polititical points. i have beeeen saying allll of ts things publiclcly, that we w wee going toto publish inforormation hillary clinton befefore the elecection. amam so this is -- got intnto its stidid head in fafact that we w wergoig to publish it on n october r 4 p that spread evererywhere. roger r stone's comomments are responding to that kd ofof thing. -- i't want to feed into mean, ii understd there is a weird p pchologicalal phenomena happening in the united statates presently.. i don't wa to feed intnto it presently y because i think it s esntially inconsequentntial in

historicical circutances, unless it leads to o a war with russia. i i n't knknow what the trumump caaiaign conctionsns arere with russia. i n only speaeak about us. it had no coconnections withth . we havave no connectioions wit russssia is the russians haveve done anythingng else, as far as i can see, i it is notot consequenial natuture. amy: this is ---- d determine i c can there is nothing of any scale or significance. amy: but this is the anniversary of the female being released, the john podesta emails. i think it is important because what is happening in these cocongressional investitigation, roger stone is a key figure, whether you think he i is credie or not, to have you respond, to make your r point. i want to play -- >> l let me --

amy: let me play and then you respond d to roger stone. let me just play two quick clips. august 8, this is him speaking in florida. >> with regard to the october surprise, whatat would be your forecast o on that? julian assange has intimated what he is going to do? >> it cocould be any n number of thgs.. i tuallyly have commununicated with a aange. bebelieve thee nexext documents pertaiain to t the clintonon foundation. but there is no telling what the october surprise may be. amy: was he l lying? said, he jujust said they would pertain to the clinton foundation, which he was wrong. he is repeating what i said in the press. amy: more recently, let's turn to roger stone speaking to reporters following his appepearance a and is closed heg of the house intntelligence committee. his interview with lawmakers was part of the investigation into russia's meddling in the 2016 election.

>> i made the casese that the accusation that i know about john podesta's enough hack in advance was false, that i knew about the content and source of the wikileaks disclosures regarding hillary clinton was falls and that my exchange with guciferclaiming to be 2.0 benign and binoculars. amy: stone also told reporters he declined to name his we could weeks intermediary during the interview. >> the reason i am not submitting the name was because we intimated as a journalist in our conversation was off the record. i am an opinion journalist. i'm not going to burn somebody who i spoke to. if you releases it, if he allows

me t to release it, i willll be happy to [indiscernible] roger stone isn't a journalist, but what is your response to what he is saying right here, that there was an intermediary between you and him , who was a jojournalist? >> the united states politicall culture has gogone madad. roger r stone is trolling g as likely b b-- ethalally the democrcraticolitical c class in ororder t televate hihis profil. it is saidid that democracacy n! is buying into it. amy: presenting the news is not buying into it. it is having you respond to what he is saying because you are the center off this -- i in this particular case. it is importanant to hear yourur voice. >> look, amy. i amam getting annoyoyed. there is a histororic event occurring this afternoon involvining cataloniaia that cod whatthange the e nature off

forms of repepression ar acceptable in the western world and what news s pulations can take in order too resist represeson and cee together to secucure their selelf-determina. thisis has b bn the greateses gandhian project thatt has occurred.. millllions of catalonians turnig out to vote in the streets, begg beatete aggressively by spananissecurity forces, being hacked by security forces, hahaving a telephone exchange occupied, having their political leleadershship arrested, being threatened as saw today with rebellion a and put in prison fr a mininimum of 25 years. that is s going to spread throughoutut the western w worl. the lessons of this arare goingo reread throughghout the westeren world two, , s, secessiononist movementnts, but also totohe ststates trying to repressss thm and try y to repress peoplpl

struggles for self-detererminatn in generalal. the discipline with which t the catalan population has carried out the refererendum isis astounding. astounding. millions o of people going to te polls, beinbeaten b by the policece, and not t one inch ofm fighting back -- not one e image of tm fifighting bacack. th is incncredible didiipline. similar in theheir marches if the u.s. left is s not absolutetely obsbsessed with w s happening there, then the definitition that is o occurrinf the nature of the relationship betweeeen populatitionnd state, well, i mean, i have no time for you. amy: will we certaininly had tie for you today, jillion potter stop i thinknk you make some really critical points and they are important. i want to and on an issue i also think you carare about, and that is the issue of, well, chelsea manning isis out of jail.. chelsea manning was a very poor in figure for you and you campaigned for her release. i want to end by asking you

about reality winner. lalast thuhuday, federal judge dedenied a second rerequest forl for reality winnerer, the former national security advisor contractor who is accused of violating the espionage act. winner allegedly passed a top-secretet document to the intercept that claimed that russian military intelligence conducted a cyberattack on at least one u.s. voting software company just days before the 2016 election. federal judge brian epps of augusta, g georgia, said his decision to deny bail was based in part on social media comommes by winner that she "admires edward snowden and julian assange." we have just lost the video of julian, but i think we still have audio. julian, i was wondering if you could respond to the judge? we have your audio. >> see your question was about bail was denied to reality

winner, partly under the basis that she is alleged to have said that center or sister -- said to her sister on facebook that she supported edward snowden, me, and wikileaks. is that correct? >> the judge talking about her admiration of edward snowden and julian assange. >> yeah, i mean, it is a political decision by the judge. i think she is been treated absolutely appallingly. her r alleged act is very minim. one alleged document, which she unfortunately sent to the distrust worthy or incompetent --rnalist at the intercept the intercept is a great publication. i admire them very much. but if they don't fire the person responsible, and brings enormous discredit on them.

working-class whistleblower. she is not a whistleblower. she is not a weaker or a whistleblower who has access to power. as a result, we see what happened to her. she goes to prison, where even in pretrial detention, clearly not a harm to anyone. it has come out the fbi faked a transcript of hers where she said she had acquired more than one document. it turns out that was fake. they have used that to keep her in prison. well, julian assange, i want to thank you very much for being with us, , founder and editor-in-chief of wiwikileaks. more than -- i want to thahank u so much fofor joinining us. julian assange joins us from the ecuadorian embassy where he is taken asylum, political asylum

in ecuador for the last 5.5 years. how he gets out of the embassy remains to be seen. as we turn riright now, we end wiwith a protetest that happenen new york on columbus day on indigenous peoples day come a was so many want the u.s. to start calling columbus day in new yorork and cities around the country, the holiday has changed . los angeles, phoenix salt lake , city and austin, texas -- have indigenous peoples day. we turn to a piece by andre louis who went out to the protest near columbus circle in new york. >> i am representing the oscar amendola committee for legalization. we're here in support of the

colonized this place and their anti-columbus day support. cuny christopher columbus discovered us, how he should be honored. in 2017, i can't believe that is still going on. that is why this is such a big deal because it is not just a statue. it is not just a day. it is a message we're constantly putting out that we are ok with this behavior, ok with the colonial crisis in puerto rico will stop and we are not. i am a member [indiscernible] it is a crook artists. artists.a crew of about 400 or 500 strong. we were moving together, choreographed together to the

museum. at each stop would be someone station who collectively work on the text that was read aloud. the pamlet. we want to rename the day to indigenous peoples day, remove the statue outside the museum, which is president teddy roosevelt on a horse, flanked below him to the left is the slavesafrican-american -- unclothed african-american slaves and to the right, mostly uncloaked indian chiefs. we want to respect the ancestors. i am from brooklyn, new york. we want to talk about some of what columbus day truly means.

we realize columbus day, the meaning is trying to keep us from the truth. and knowing it is actually a horrible day, i think the support of rest to show up. meaningshowing how we can spreae truth to others and they won't be deceived. think about this museum a look at the statute the other statues, i'm thinking of the little brak and brown indigenous kids who are walking around the city who are being told visually over and over again that their lives do not matter. we are, quite frankly, not here for it. we have never been here for it. what we're trying to do is get people across struggles to stand together, not just this is a statue i want taken down, but these are the statues we want taken down. it means a lot for our youth and

having them grow up in a place where they can see themselves, accurate representations of something l like in the s statue behind me.e. amamy: special thanks to andre louis. democracy now!

[instrumental music] (lucy irving) in britain today, what were once luxuries are fast becoming everyday items.