08/09/18 08/09/18 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from pacifica, this is democracy now! >> obviously, there are going to be more fires. the soil is drying. the vegetation is drying. that makes for perfect kindling. then these wind events, wind storms, tornadoes-type behavior are occurring. some of this is unprecedented. we are learning as we go. but we are in the new normal. amy: california is on fire. 17 major fires are continuing to

burn, including the largest wildfire in the state's history. what is the connection between the fires and climate change? we will speak to the sierra club's michael brune and leading climate scientist t michael man. then would look k at the thousas of prisone a are on the e front lines battling the fireses. >> fire pay is typically about one dollar an hour while you are in fire camp training. some folks are paid zero for $18 araining or up to month. then once you get to the classroom and you are part of the field training, then that papay escalates to a whopping $8 a month. amy: then to nanagasaki. 73 years ago today, the u.s. dropped an atomic bomb on the japanese city just three days after the u.s. bombed hiroshoma. we will speak to a woman who

survived the nagasaki bombing. >> it would be the last place that nuclear weapons are ever used. amy: all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. in yemen, a u.s.-backed saudi-led airstrike has bombed a bus carrying a group of children, killing dozens of civilians, mostly children under the age of 10. the head of the health department in saada province, where the attack occurred, said at least 43 people were killed, and dozens more injured. the u.s.-backed saudi-led bombing campaign has repeatedly been accused of committing war crimes by targeting civilians. meanwhile, an explosive new associated press investigation says the saudi-led coalition has repeatedly cut secret deals with al-qaeda, paying its fighters to retreat from towns or join the u.s.-backed coalition. the ap investigation accuses the united states of being essentially aligned with al qaeda in the fight against yemen's houthi rebels, even as

the u.s. says its fighting al qaeda in yemen. a u.s. airstrike has killed at least a dozen afghan security forces in logar province. afghan officials say the u.s. airstrike hit an afghan police outpost by mistake. the united states has sharply increased bombing in afghanistan, dropping nearly 3000 bombs in the first six months of this year -- almost twice as many as during the same period last year. in gaza, the israeli military launched a barrage of airstrikes and artillery shelling overnight, killing three people, including a palestinian woman and her 18-month-old child. the israeli bombing came after hamas fired rockets into southern israel, injuring six israelis. the hamas attack came after the israeli military killed two hamas members one day earlier. columbia has recognize palestine as a free independent and soverereign state. the announcement by the palestinian embassy in bogota came on the same day as u.s. ambassador to the united nations

thei haley visited cocolumbia-venezuela border, escalating the trump administration's rhetoric to manning the ouster of venezuelan president nicolas maduro. >> this is a crisis where the region has not been as loud and active as we would like to see. we think they need to do more but the international community, the world in general, needs to realize we have a dictator in venezuela. he is doing every thing to protect himself and sacrificing all of the venezuelan people to do it. amy: the united states has announced it will impose new sections against russia over russia's alleged poisoning of russian spy sergei skripal and his daughter in salisbury, britain, in march. the sanctions are slated to take effect august 22. russia has slammed the u.s. sanctions and vowed to retaliate. the u.s. senate intelligence committee has asked julian assange to testify about russian interference in the 2016 u.s. election. his legal team says he is considering the request. virginia governor ralph northam

and the city of charlottesville have declared states of emergency ahead of this weekend's one-year anniversary of the deadly white supremacist rally. white supremacists are planning to hold rallies in both charlottesville and washington, d.c., this weekend. antiracist, anti-fascist, demonstrators are planning counter-protests. in the democratic republic of congo, longtime leader joseph kabila has announced he will not run for reelection. kabila's term ended in 2016, but he has so far refused to step down, even as violence and insecurity has increased in the drc. kabila is now backing his close ally, interior minister emmanuel ramazani shadary, to run as his successor. he is under european union sanctions for alleged human rights violations, including overseeing a deadly military crackdown against protesters. in argentina, the senate has rejected legislation to legalize abortion, dealing a blow to women's health and reproductive rights groups. the powerful catholic church had

lobbied heavily against legalizing abortion. currently, abortion in argentina is banned except in cases of rape or when the mother's life is at risk. dozens of argentine women die every year as a result of unsafe illegal abortions. federal prosecutors have charged new york republican congressman chris collins with more than a -- with insider trading. prosecutors say he received and enough from the head of a drug company which he was the largest shareholder, telling him the companies only drug i just failed scientific trial. they say he immediately called his son, who thence -- then sold the stock. board of the the austrian company. if convicted, he faces up to 150 years in prison. he was the first member of congress to endorse donald trump's presidential bidid. collins' son and his son's fiancee's father have also been charged in the insider trading scheme. collins says he will still run for reelection in november.

tribune media has pulled out of the proposed $3.9 billion merger with the right-wing sinclair broadcast group. fcc chairman ajit pai said last month he had serious concerns about the merger, which would have combined two of the nation's largest broadcasters. free press groups are celebrating the collapse of the merger. in pennsylvania, south whitehall township police officer jonathan roselle has been charged with manslaughter for fatally shooting an unarmed 44-year-old man named joseph santos two weeks ago. the rookie cop previously served in the army into the tour in afghanistan. new york has become the first major u.s. city to crack down on wall street-backed ride-hailing apps like uber and lyft. the nenew york city council l vd overwhelelminglyly wednesdayay t new w vehicle licenses foror ride-hail services and set a miminimum pay rate for d driver. in japan, residents of nagasaki

gathered today to mark the 73rd anniversary of the u.s. atomic bombings nagasaki, which killed 74,000 people and forever changed the lives of those who survived the nuclear attack. this is the nagasaki mayor tomihisa taue speaking at today's ceremony. demand the japanese government agree with the u.n. treaty on the prohibition of nuclear weapons. it is the only country to have suffered from an atomic as well as to bear its moral responsibility to lead the nuclear-free world. amy: we will stick with the nagasaki atomic arming survivor later in the broadcast. and also in japan, the governor of okinawa, takeshi onaga, has died at the age of 67. onaga has waged a fierce campaign against the construction of a new u.s. military base on the island, part of a decades-long japanese peace movement demanding the expulsion of u.s. troops from okinawa. this is governor onaga testifying to the united nations human rights council in geneva in 2015.

>> the question is, why the issue of bases on national security of the human rights issue? this, under the u.s. military administration. we were in neither japanese or in americans. many things happened, including a jet crashing into the ground for primary school, hit and run deaths by use soldier who was acquitted and sent home. after the return, we found out there's a lot of pollution from toxins and there is a number mental issue. and even to investigate that, we cannot do it because it is not possible during the u.s.-japan agreement. amy: okinawa governor takeshi onaga has died at the age of 67 in a hospital in urasoe, japan. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. nermeen: and i'm nermeen shaikh. welcome to all of our listeners and viewers from around the country and around the world. we begin today's show in california, where 17 wildfires are raging across the state.

the mendocino complex fire is now the largest wildfire ever recorded in the state's history. it has already scorched more than a quarter of a million square acres and is still burning. firefighters say it is expected to burn uncontrollably for the rest of this month and is currently the size of los angles. fires have also forced the indefinite closure of much of yosemite national park. meanwhile, the carr fire near redding california has destroyed more than 1000 homes and taken at least six lives. amy: of the 20 largest wildfires in california history, 15 have occurred since 2000. since 2012, there has not been a single month without a wildfire. the three biggest fires currently burning in california all started in july, which was the state's hottest month on record. experts say climate change has increased the length of fire season. this year's fires have already

burnrned nearlrly three times ss many acres aththe same time e lt year. this is califofornia governor jerry brown. >> we are being surprised. every yeyear it is teaching the fire authorities knew less than. territory,ncharted since civilization emerged to does musical we're not have this kind of heat condition and it is going to continue getting worse. and that is what it is. some people do not want to accept that and some people just outright deny it, but i don't sing it with any great joy here. we are in for a really rough ride and it is going to get expensive, going to get dangerous, and we have to apply all of our creativity to making the best out of what is going to be an increasingly bad situation. but for for california, people all over america and all over the world. nermeen: meanwhile on tuesday, six youth activists were arrested after holding a sit-in

protest at governor brown's office to demand action on climatate change.. >> we need clean air! new oil extension! no new gas extension! jerry brown, this is your last chance! amy: this comes as smoke from the massive california wildfires continues to move north into washington and east to the central part of the united states. for more, we go to oakland, california, where we're joined by sierra club d director michal brune. this week you wrote a piece headlined "jerry brown's last challenge." also joining us is michael mann, distinguished professor of atmospheric science at penn state university and author of "the madhouse effect: how climate change denial is threatening our planet, destroying our politics, and driving us crazy." we welcome you both to democracy now!

mediann, the corporate is covering the fires in california constantly, and that is very important. but what is rarely mentioned in any of these reports is the connection between the fires and climate change. can you explain what that connection is, what is happening right now in california? >> sure thing. in fact, some of the networks have started to connect the dots when it comes to climate change and the role it is play with these wildfires. nbc nightly news did have a segment where they did make that connection. it is not rocket science, ok? you warm up the planet, you're going to get more intense and longer heat waves. you're going to get broyles -- drier soils because that he is breaking the surface of the earth. you have hotter temperatures, drier soils, less winter snowpack, less snow falling in the winter in the sierra mountains, and the storms are getting diverted north of

california. we think that jet stream behavior is self may have a climate change connnnection. sosoou put thahat all together d we sort of have a perfect storm of consequences when it comes to wildfires. you have all of the ingredients coming together. it is not a surprise that we are seeing these record wildfires in california, in the arctic, around the nororthern hemimisphe the s summer, as a consequence f heat and drought caused by human caused climate change. nermeen: on sunday, just hours after the trump administration declared the california wildfires a major disaster, president trump tweeted -- "california wildfires are being magnified & made so much worse by the bad environmental laws which aren't allowing massive amount of readily available water to be properly utilized. it is being diverted into the pacific ocean. must also tree clear to stop fire spreading!"

then on monday, trump tweeted -- "governor jerry brown must allow the free flow of the vast amounts of water coming from the north and foolishly being diverted into the pacific ocean. can be used for fires, farming and everything else. think of california with plenty of waterer -- nice! fast federal govt. approvals." trump's tweets. dr. mann, could you respond to that? >> this is, unfortunately, the sort of diversion that we've seen from the president's misdirection. the irony here is what we're seeing is nothing to do with environmental regulations. in fact, it is trump's effort to eliminate environmental regulations and policies to act on climate change, which are -- which are putting us in a precarious position. these wildfires will only get

worse as we continue to warm a the planet by burning the fossil fuels and increasing the concentration of these warming greenhouse gases in the atmosphere. the trump administration is doing everything it can to scuttle international effortsts and domestic efforts to act on climate. couldn: michael brune, you talk about the state level response to these wildfires? what has governor jerry brown's responsese been? and what do you think can happen at the state level, given the trump administration's response? >> there is really two parts to that question first, what is the state doining doubt conontrol te wildfires -- t to help control these wildfires in a lifefe-threatening situations across the state? the response has been impressive. more than 15,000 firefighters putting their lives on the line. there are thousands of families and homes and schools and businesses that are under threat, and the responses been

impressive. the firefighters have all of the water they need. what they need is some support and they need respect coming from the president and people in the administration. but the response has been heroic, very brave, and frankly, it has been impressive to see the way in which people have comeme together to f fight this challelenge. in this fire season n in the lat -- and the last several fire seasons as well, these fires are happening in the context of a big debate here in california about climate policy. there are two policies that are being debated. one is the fact you highlighted at the beginning of the show, which is that governor brown, even though he is been a great leader on promoting energy efficiency and solar power and beginnining to take cars off the road and moved to electric vehicles, under his watch, more than 20,000 new wells and filling permits have been issued. the state is expanding oil production in the state, even as

they are scaling up clean energy. so the sierra club and hundreds of other organizations and scientists are calling for jerry brown to begin a managaged phaseout of fossil fuels, reasonably, thoughtfully, over time, to respond to the climate crisis. and at the samame time, there is also a debate in the state legislature to move the entire state, which is the fifth-largest economy in the world, all the way to 100% clean energy. san diego has committed to going to 100% clean energy. san jose, sann francisco, oakland, large parts of the state at the city level have committed to move to 100% clean energy. we're looking to see the whole state get off of all coal and gas and fossil fuels and moved to 100% clean energy as quickly as possible over the coming years. amy: michael brune, you began -- let me by saying just find it all stop well, you can tell us how you began your

piece. if donald trump could take carbon dioxide out of the atmosphere as officially as he sucks oxygen out of the news cycle, the, crisis would be solved faster than you can say "mexico will pay for that wall." you go on to say, for sure, even as we deal with the trump administration's daily cascade of corruption, crudeness, and cruelty, the clock keeps ticking and climate keeps rising. if we don't accelerate a phaseout of also feels, than the wildfires, droughts, and extreme weather events currently plaguing the planet will see mild comparison to what is coming. yet you have come as the fires intensity, in california, the environmental protection agency now under the former coal lobbyist andrew wheeler, who has replace the corrupt scott pruitt who you really helped to tank, certainly, your organization, the sierra club, by exposing a lot of what he was doing, the epa announced last week it will freeze obama euro fuel efficiency standards at 2020

levels in the latest blow by the trump administration against efforts to curb catastrophic climate change. can you talk about what it is wheeler is doing? >> many add one were to what you said. freeze thel try to u.s. auto efficiency at current levels or at 20200 levels. we will fight them. and dozens of other groups will fight them as well both in the courts and in the market -- marketplace. one of the best things the obama administration did on climate change, probably the best thing the admininistration did on climate change, was to work with the auto industry, work with states across the country, to work with unions to increase the fuel efficiencncy and increase n acceleration toward electric vehicles so that we could save money at the pop, same a lot of oil, could import a lot less oil, and reduce climate

prediction -- pollution. the trump administration is opposed to that in seeking that only to roll that those protections, though savings, but to crucially eliminate the ability for the state of california and then other states to fight for clean air and to work with the auto industry directly in order to reduce the emissions from cars and truckss and suvs. so thihis is something that is being challenged by states attorney general across the country. it is being challenged by groups like sierra club and many others. we're going to prevail. we're going to make sure these rules are protected. it'd is one more fight we have with the trump administration, which is taking us backwards one will you need to be moving very quickly in the opposite direction. nermeen: michael mann, one of the causes that you pointed to for these extreme weather events that we're seeing today, are changes in the jet stream. could you explain what the jet stream is and how it is changing and why?

sure thing. the basic factors are easy to understand, hotter temperatures, , lesssoil, less runoff water running off from the sierra mountains -- obviously, those create the conditions conducive to these wildfires. but there is this other ingredient we think is involved here and in this whole array of unprecedented extreme summer weather events that we are seeing over the past months around the entire northern hemisphere. unprecedented floods, droughts, heat waves, wildfires. and what is happening here is that these weather systems are theyoving along the way normally do. the jet stream is this band of strong winds that blows from west to east. if you're flying a jet, it is faster flying from west to east across the u.s. than the other direction because you have the tailwind.

that is the just ring. the jet stream also pushes weather systems from west to east. what is happening as we melt the sea ice in the arctic, believe it or not, what happens in the arctic does not stay in the arctic. that warming in the arctic is changing temperature patterns in the atmosphere in a way that slows down the jet stream. the jet stream is driven by the contrast in temperature from the warm equator to the cold pull or regions. when you decrease that contrast by warming the polls more than the rest of the planet, you slow down the jet stream. another physical process involved -- that is really the key process here. you have these large meanders in the jet stream. you see the jet stream wiggling vigorously north and south, and that gives you extreme weather events. is theed ingredient here jet stream is not moving along. it is not pushing those weather systems along, so the same locations get rained on day after day or get baked by the sunday after day. that is when you see unprecedented extreme events

like what we're seeing around the northern hemisphere this summer. the impacts of climate change are no longer subtle. we are seeing them play out this summer in real time on our television screens. amy: can you talk about the hothouse state? yesterday a group of leading scientists warning the cascading effects of melting ice warming seas the shifting currents and dying forests could push the planet into a hothouse state. michael mann? >> that article is more of a commentary than an original research article. that isc science discussed there is science we have understood for some time. james hansen, the former director of the nasa goddard institute for space studies made this point a number of years ago that if we keep levels elevated even at current levels and we allow the climate system to equilibrate to those high levels of co2, then over many

centuries, we lose the ice sheets. for us start to migrate. we fundamentally remake the planet and it turns out that gun at a whole lot of extra warming. that is not always taken into account in these projections you see of the warming we can expect over the next century or so. there's is longer-term commitment. much of that co2 w we put into e atmosphere is when remain in the atmosphere for thousands of years. if we keep that co2 elevated at levels they are now or even higher than they are now, then we could see major disruptions in t the clilimate. notn, the science therere is new, but it is important. what it t tells us is n not onlo have to cut our emissisions dramatically to avoid warming the planet whwhere they catastrophic two degree celsius, 3.5 degrgree fahrerenheit, wee n still do that, paris will get us halfway there.e. we have to improve to get all the way there. we can do that. and it is not enough jusust to

level off the co2 concentration. themately, we have to pull co2 back out of the atmosphere. if we leave it at current levels or centuries, we will commit potentially the catastrophic changes in our climate. michael mann, you said that if emissions are not reduced, we will witness major disruptions in the climate. would you not describe what is happening now is a major disruption? if not, what do you anticipate happening? often, we allow the problem of climate change to be framed as if there some tipping point. there's a certain amount of warming that we go beyond and suddenly have, we a calamity on our hands. it is much more like a minefield. we're walking out under this minefield already. we are starting to set off some of those mines. what we know is the further we walk out onto that minefield, the more those mines we're going to set off. so the only visible strategy is to stop moving forward out onto the minefield.

we have to go back to where we came from. with the bring those carbon emissions down. again, the paris accord gets us about halfway to where we need most to stay of off the catastrophic impacts of climate change. it we are already y seeing dangngerous climate e change no. ifif you talk to people in califofornia, talk to peoplele f puerto rico, peoplple in eururo, world, inll around the many respects, dangerous climate change is already starting to arrive. we're on this carbon highway and we have to get off at the next available exit. amy: as we wrap up, michael brune, governor brown is going to be holding this global climate action summit in september in san francisco, and there's going to be a counter summit as well. what are you demanding? what are you saying is most important he do right now? what about these protests, for example, the six young people arrested at his office doing a

sit-in? >> the summit is well-titimed. cacalling in from open this morning, you can see the fires here in the bay area. you can see the smoke from the fires and the bay area, even off the fires are a couple of hours to thehe north and east of the city. what we need from jerry brown here in the state and leaders across the country and around the worlrld, but what we partrticularlyly need time jerry brown is a managed phaseout, a thoughtful and reasonable managed phaseout of fossil fuel production here in the state. the first thing you want to do when you solve a problem is stop making it worse. we need to make sure we need to make sure we're focusing both on the demand for clean energy, increasing that as quickly as we possibly can, but also focus on the supply of fossil fuels and reducing that as quickly as we can. here in the state, we need to make sure we're protecting community's, families, homes, businesses, many of them live within 300, 400, 1000 feet of an

oil well. we should be phasing those sites out the quickest. any site that is within 2500 feet of an oil well we should be able to phaseout the production of oil from those sites as quickly as possible. from a large scale perspective across the state, let's think carefully of how to help the communities that are currently depending on producing oil in the state. how do we make sure the transition away from oil is one that is good for workers and good for the communities that are economically dependent on fossil fuel production? we aredo this if thoughtful, reasonable, if we make sure we are taking care of the communities and the workers who economically depend on fossil fuels. but it takes leadership. it will take leadership from jerry brown. so far he has been absent on this issue. and around the world, what we need to see much more of is an aggressive replacement of fossil fuels with clean energy. if the republican mayor of georgetown, texas, can do it come and it through public and

city council in louisiana or in san diego, california, can say we are moving to 100% clean energy, then we should be able to see heads of state and leaders of corporations and governors across the country and people around the world saying, we're going to get also -- off of fossil fuel entirely. we will save money as well as saving lives in the process. amy: michael brune, thank you for being with us, executive director of the sierra club, speaking to us from oakland, california. and michael mann, professor of atmospheric science at penn state university. coming up, we will look at the thousands of california prisoners who are on the frontlines battling the fires. they make one e dollar a day. stay with us. ♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. nermeen: we continue our coverage of the california

wildfires with a look at who's actually fighting the fires, and it may just surprise you. in addition to roughly 7000 full-time and seasonal california firefighters, the ststate relies on about 3500 prisoners, including many women , to battle the blazes. at least 2000 prisoners are curly fighting the wildfires, burning acrossss the state, offenders.8 youth earlier this month, california governor jerry brown thanked the firefighters on the front lines, including those who are incarcerated. >> you have heard there is a tremendous effort fighting these fires, and i want to personally thank all of the firefighters who are on the lines. the members of calfire and the national guard and the thousands of inmates who are also on the line fighting to protect lives and bring these fires to a quick close to the extent that is at

alall possible. amy: prisoner firefighters live in one of 43 low security field camps throughout the state and are routinely called upon to fight fires. prison firefighters earn time off of their sentences for good behavior, typically two days off for each day served. but critics of the program say the state is exploiting prisoners' eagerness to earn time for early release. while salaried firefighters earn an annual mean wage of $74,000 prisonerss benefits, earn just $2 per day with an additional $1 per hour when fighting an active fire. according to some estimates, california saves about $80 million-$100 million a a year using prison labor to fight its biggest environmental problem. for more, we're joined by romarilyn ralston, a member of the california coalition for women prisoners-l.a. chapter, program coordinator for project rebound at cal state university. romarilyn was in jail for 23 years.

and while she was in prison, she was a fire camp trainer and a clerk for the california department of forestry and fire protection. autho also with us is deirdre wilson, former program coordinator for the california coalition for women prisoners. she was imprisoned for 3.5 years. she spent a year of her time behind bars as a landscaper at puerta la cruz, a women's fire camp in san diego. welcome both of you to democracy now! romaririlyn, letet's begin with. explain what these fire camps are. people were watching or listening might be completely shocked to hear that prisoners are on the frontlines of fighting these fires. explain what the program is. way forrogram is a incarcerated people to get trained in firefighting. while firefighting is something that we hope incarcerated people can use on the outside post release, people join the firefighting crew, sometimes

voluntarily when they are incarcerated, sometimes they are assigned to the fire camp training program because of their low level offenses. especially for women, it is a way to earn two days off your sentence. it is a way to give back to your community. it is a way to get closer to her family, to your children. and it is a way to get out of the normal prison -- amy: when you say get closer to your children, kids can come to the fire camp to see you? >> the visiting process is very different at the fire camp's. it is more open. it is a more relaxed environment . it is more conducive for family visiting, yes. --meen: can you explain why you just mentioned the fact that incarcerated prisoners who have worked as firefighters, once they're released, they can't actually be employed as firefighters.

could you explain why? >> yes. the firefighter training that you receive while you are incarcerated, you don't get enough of the training needed to .pply to calfire because of licensing, incarcerated firefighters or folks with a criminal record once they're released, are not able to get in emt license. and that is one of the critical pieces to applying for these jobs post-release. you need to have in emt certification and you need to have fire science training -- yoyou get a lilittle bit of that when y you're going t to the classroom trainining. but there is college credits. there are other things that help you rate higher in the application processes. so you don't get a a lot of the training that is needed to get these jojobs post-release. you have the experience, the

front-line experience. you have placed your life on the line. you have protected california. you have saved lives and property. but they don't take into consideration all of that experience that you have on the front line. they are still looking for a certain degree of training and licensing in order to employ you. .e think that is wrong the state of california in their training of incarcerated firefighters should provide the same training that they provide for folks on the outside. if they don't want to do that, then they should give credit for the work that folks do on these fires and consider that training as enough for them to get jobs post-release. because it is. if it is enough to fight while you are incarcerated, if it is enough for you to fight the fire while you are incarcerated on the training that you received inside the prison, it should be enough once you are released. amy: deirdre wilson, i want to

bring you into this conversation. how much do prisoner firefighters make? camps,people in the fire it is two dollars a day. when you're out fighting a fire, it is one dollar per hour. amy: some have criticized this as slave labor. your thoughts? >> yeah. the contradiction in what romarilyn was speaking about in terms of people getting positions when they are released, if the intention was rehabilitate and set people up for success once they are released, they would have a program, say, or people have the training have some kind of continued interim training where they were supported specifically in the situations to go out and have a career all-star but that does not exist. people fall through the cracks

because the intention is to make use of this labor with the state saving $100 million. nermeen: it is interesting to know the state of arizona also uses incarcerated firefighters, but in arizona they are allowed once out ofareer prison. of course, california does not permit that. do you know of any attempts in the california legislature to alter this? >> that would be romarilyn's -- amy: romarilyn, go ahead. >> governor brown did propose approximately $26 million to create a training and certification program that would help support incarcerated firefighters in receiving the training they need post-release. we don't know where that is or how that will all washed out in the end. but that is part of the budget

proposal for this year. so we hope that knowing what we know about california -- and you have heard governor brown earlier speaking about these fires are just going to continue . warming, they will continue to get worse. if we're going to use incarcerated firefighter labor to fight fires, we need to respect their warming, they will continue to get worse. expertise once they are released and give them jobs. because the collateral consequences of not doing that is california going up in smoke. we can't afford that. there are a lot of ways that incarcerated firefighters can get that training expertise once they inside. they have the means to do it. amy: the director of the a's are use national pridgen project told the atlantic last year yet understand that uniquely coercive prison environment were few things are clearly voluntary

a lot of the vast power inequality between prisoners and those who employ them, there is a real potential for exploitation abuse. there's a real potential here in addition to exploitation abuse. we're talking about life-and-death situations. can you explain what life is like on the front lines for prisoner firefighter? >> it is exhausting. was inside theob camp i was a landscaper. i was supposed to work as a clerk because i have administrative experience, but i had spent -- i knew too many people and they did not trust me in the office. that is why are sent up to pastor, as i call it, to do landscaping. i was not actually on the fire line come also because i was vulnerable to poison oak. when you breathe poison oak in the air if you are allergic to your throat can close up and you can die. so that was a concern. my whole purpose was to get back

to my children, as it is for so many people who go to fire camp, to reduce your time to get out and be with your families. when they say it is volunteers, that makes me kind of -- i mean, we did not volunteer to go to prison. we did not enter prison in order to fight fires. so it is really not truthfully volunteers. amy: this is a critical point. romarilyn, have people died on the front lines fighting fires? >> there are reports that incarcerated people have lost their lives fighting fires. but back to the point on volunteering, you have to fit the criteria to be assigned to fire camp. it is a little different for folks who are sentenced with serious offenses or a life term. as she said, the volunteer part -- folkses not hold

volunteer or get assigned to these positions because of the credit you can earn. you want to get that day for a day or that halftime or one third time. you want to get back to her family and your children. nermeen: romarilyn, very quickly, some have expressed concerns that opposition to the program may actually lead toits end, which would ultimately be worse for prisoners. would you agree with that? >> i would kind of agree with that. i think if we could get the certification and the training that governor brown is proposing in his budget so that when folks are released that they are able to be hired by calfire and work for that $74,000 a year that other firefighters make, it

calls -- it costs the state of california must $80,000 to incarcerate a person he year. released, there are so many barriers to employment because you have a criminal record. experience use the of incarcerated firefighters to get those jobs on the outside -- it is just good governance for california. we want to reduce the prison population. governor brown has been under mandates to do that for a while now. we want folks to have access to good employment so that they don't recidivate. and they are able to take care of the families of the country meeting members to society. people say they believe in second chances. here is an opportunity for thousands of people to have that second chance, the have the ability to take care of themselves and their families and to become contributing members to the california economy, which is the fifth-largest economy in the -- d, and yet we have

and so we have to leave it there, romarilyn, but we will come back to this issue. romarilyn ralston, california coalition for women prisoners-l.a. chapter, and deirdre wilson is a former program coordinator for the california coalition for women prisoners. when we come back, today is the 73rd anniversary of the u.s. dropping an atomic bomb on nagasaki. a will speak with survivor. stay with us. ♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh.. nermeen: 73 years ago today on august 9, 1945, the u.s. dropped an atomic bomb on the japanese city of nagasaki, killing 74,000 people and forever changing the lives of thohose who survived te nunuclear attack.. the destruction was massive, as shock waves, radiation,, and het rays coursed throughout the city. this came just three days after the u.s. dropped the world's fifirst atomic bomb on the japanese city of hiroshima, killing some 140,000 peoeople. amy: well, just a few weeks ago we were joined in studio by two guests who travelled to new york city on the peace boat -- an international boat that sails around the world campaigning for nuclear disarmament and world peace. the cofounder and director of the peace boboat tatsuya yoshioa and terumi kuramori, a hibakusha -- that's the japanese word for a survivor of the atomic bomb --

joined us in the democracy now! studios to discuss the bombings in hiroshima and nagasaki. i started by asking terumi kuramori to describe what happened when the second atomic bomb was dropped on nagasaki and -- 73 years ago today. >> that was the year when i was one year old am a so i don't have direct memory of that day. however, after surviving the atomic bomb, i was with my mother and my older brother and sister into a bomb shelter, which was under the city, so we were able to survive so i'm somehow able to be here today. memory have any direct of that day, however, my carrots -- my parents, for my whole life, did not speak out ababout the fact t that we survived the bombing. the reason for that, the reason

they did not speak out is because at t the time,e, there s so much discrimination and prejudice against the survivors. and at that time, it was difficult for us to obtain jobs, to get married. there was severe discrimination against us because of what we had been through. when i was young, i was 5.8 kilometers from the high percent or when we experienced the bomb. everybody was a hibakusha.. everybody experienceced this. whwhen we were in school, t thee were somome people with severe diseases, people who were affected directly by the radiation, but we were all hibakusha. there was no discrimination within thatt community. but t when there wasas a time wi wawas to get married, because ef the fact i have beenen exposed o radiation, the person who i wanted to marry, when we tried

-- his family was against that, so we were not able to be merry. amy: so you grew up in a community of hibakusha, of survivors of the nuclear bomb? >> that is right. peoplelk about what suffered who did not die immediately upon impact, and now many people in nagasaki did die and how many people, together with the people of hiroshoma where the bomb was dropped three days before, did die? i -- i don't remember the exact day, but the people around me in the community come in our village, the hibakusha survivors, they told me of their experiences. on august 9, 1945. so the end of that year, 70,000 people died in nagasaki, more than 70,000.

and the results of more than 100,000 people who died in hiroshima. and my village, there was actually mountains surrounding and a river, therefore the direct blast of the bomb did not affect our village so intensely. however, the people who survived the bomb -- and nagasaki there's a large port as well. people who work shortly to survive with great ones were taken by these ships. , i heard from the people in our village. they could see these people lined up with people covered in blood. people crying out for water and people dying in this way, corpses in the way. the next day, their wins --

wounds being covered in maggots even while they were still alive. people really struggling. it was the scenes of living hell i hear from people in my community and our neighbors that shared the stories with us about what happened in our city y of nagasaki. havewhat are the fears you for your children, for their health? impacts, of and its course, not only the immediate impacts. some people do die mediately. it for decades even after that, radiation continues to impact, continuetoto even affect people's cells their dna d destred.. therefor for those people who arexposed r radiaon internally as well thrghgh foo and waterthrough things they rere ieresting, even throuough -- thr or fourears later even givg breastmk to the

children, ev decadesater geing leukia. ere are ry s stories i ve concern. radiatiois sometng which contins to affect genations. it is rrifying amy:our thought terumi kuramo, on the 's seetary-geral gutirez sayinghat he will be there on the commemoration day on august 9. he will be the first un's secretary-general to go to nagasaki to note the anniversary of the atomic bombing. ban ki-moon went to her hiroshima. is a city which is maybe very different from corruption in the sense that are in this is that are less. people coming to learn the stories of the hibakusha for the

survivors, who are now more than 80 years old on average, is so important. there are so many -- so few of us now so coming directly to hear the stories of those who are still surviving -- even after -- the people who are still suffering very much, even after last year, the awarding of the nobel prize to the international campaign against nuclear weapons, though survivors who are still there trying to share their message -- so coming to nagasaki to hear this directly, firsthand, is so important. nagasaki andme to bring this story back to people around the world, it is very important. nagasaki will be the last place that nuclear weapons are ever used. amy: we're speaking to terumi kuramori, a hibakusha of nagasaki, ththat is the japanese word for survivor. she was one year old when the u.s. dropppped the atomic bomb n

nagasaki on august 9, 1945. the droppedfter bomb on hiroroshima. we're also joined by the man who organized the peace boat that brought terumi kuramori here to new york. tatsuya yoshioka's cofounder and director of the peace boat. can you talk about what this peace boat is ththat looks so unusual in the hudson river 90re at your 90 --pier right next to the uss intrepid? >> i started this organization 35 years ago. we are also the long time sufferer by the cold war in asia. that is why when i was a student, i really would like to do something to make a friendship among the asians.

is try to gobition to neighborhood countries and start a dialogue with them. boat crut, the peace ise, the voyage is growing. now we are three times around and visiteduise more than 80 countries to form a dialogue and friendship promotion. and also we are really concerned about a sustainable development issue and also climate change. amy: so the peace boat, which is right now a regular crew ship that came into the h harbor xm d the others, but it is so different from so many others, has signs on the outside. can" it"peace boat: i

has the symbol of thee sustainable development goals. can in your partnership with us organization dedicated to the abolition of new or weapons in the world. >> i believe one of the most important activities to abolish the nuclear weapon is to try to bring the voice of the hibakusha , the survivors. their experience is terrible. at the same time, they themselves -- it is a very, very powerful to convince even the political leaders to think about that. what would happen if the next nuclear weapons were? i think that is -- our mission is to try to bring the survivors, the hibakusha, as much as possible to all over the world. up the negotiatation with h the issuee

makers or political leaders or even a business leader or professor intellectuals to understand that. what is happen in her hiroshima and nagasaki. amy: the nuclear ban treaty. if you could explain what this is, each of you. let's begin with terumi kuramori . the treaty ththat both japan, promised her a, who seems rather close to president trump, and president trump refused to sign on to. of course president trump did not sign on to it, either. the nuclear ban treaty is something which we have been appealing about around the world, calling on countries to sign and rectify. some of the countries we met with our in support however, there is still many countries which do need to sign on. we believe all of the citizens around the world and of the power to vote, have the power to impact their politicians. to sign on to this nuclear ban

treaty is important. and also for countries like japan to come out o of under the nuclear umbrella. japan, and for some is not making any move. it is still set under that united states nuclear a relative. the nuclear ban treaty is going to come into law soon. that means we have under legally around the world, nuclear weapons, we cannot be used. this is a what have countries all around the world recognize this and make this new norm a legal norm. i'm not sure about the united states, but perhaps it is a difficult situation, but really looking at these countries, it is import. amy: terumi kuramori is a hibakusha, survivor of the atomic bomb and nagasaki 73 years ago today, august 9, 1945. tatsuya yoshioka is cofounder and director of the peace boat. that does it for our show.

democracy now! has a job opening for a broadcast engineer here in new york city. find out more and apply at democracynow.org democracy now! is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed captioning. e-mail your comments to outreach@democracynow.org or mail them to democracy now!çç??

narrator: on this episode of "earth focus," the most basic human need is also its most precious commodity. in california's central valley, home to 19% of the food producti in e wword, manan live witutut cle dririnkg wawater hilele the e ee of rocco's saha regio harvting water from g g has the potential toeeeeply pactct a cultu.. [camera cus ringnglicking] [shutter cliing]