10/12/18 10/12/18 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from pacifica this is democracy now! pres. trump: i don't like the concept of stoppining an investment off $110 bibillion io the unitited states.s. because you know whahat they're going to do? ththey're going to takeke that y and spinach in russia or china or s someplace else. so i think therere are other was if it turnss out as bad as it might be, there are other ways of handling the situation. amy: presidentnt trump is

rejecting calls to c cut off ars sales s to saudi arabia followig ththe disappearance, and possise murder, of "washington post" columnist jamal khashoggi. the turkish government says it has audio and video evidence that he was tortured and murdered inside the saudi consulate in istanbul last week. we will speak with democratic congressmember ro khanna of california, a leading critic of the u.s.-backed saudi-led war in yemen who is calling for congressional hearings into khashoggi's disappearance. then to the incredible story of henrietta lacks, the african american woman whose "immortal cells" changed modern medicine. nearly 70 years after stealing henrietta lacks' cells for science, johns hopkins university nameses a building in heher honor. >> just the fact that 65 yea later, sample our grandmhersrs cells still exists in the world today is almost

superhuman. amy: we speak with henrietta's granddaughter, jeri, and rebecca skloot, author of a best-selling book "the immortal life of henrietta lacks." it spent six years on "the new york times" best seller list. all that and more,e, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. "this one just looks like a bomb dropped." that's how one search and rescue worker described the catastrophic devastation wrought by hurricane michael, the category 4 storm that has killed at least six people and has devastated communities across the florida panhandle. michael is the third most powerful storm to ever hit the u.s. mainland. meteorologists say it is supercharged by warmer-than-usual water in the gulf of mexico. some of florida's seaside communities, like mexico beach, are completely flattened, with homes destroyed and fishing boats flung ashore by the

155-mile-an-hour winds. this is emilyy and elizabeth hansen, residents of mexico beach. >> everybody we know lost their house. and our jobs. close evacuate? , we stayed in her home. it was terrible. it was scary. we lost our chimney, so we have some -- one >> flooding damage. amy:y: on thursday, michael was downgraded to a tropical storm as it barreled through the carolinas. states of emergency have been declared in alabama, georgia, the carolinas, and virginia. to see our full coverage of hurricane michael and its link to climate change, go toto democracynow.org. "the washington post" isis reporting turkish government has told u.s. officials it has audio and video evidence that "washingtoton post" columnist jamal khashoggi i was killed ininside the s saudi consulate n istanbul.

officials say the recordings show a saudi security team snatching khashoggi as he walked into the consulate on ococtober2 and then killing him and dismsmembering his body.y. the full audio and vidideo recordings have not yet been released. he had written critically about the saudi government and the saudi crown prince mohammed bin salman. "the w washington post" has also reported that based on u.s. intelligence intercepts, that mohammed bin salman had directly ordered an operation to lure khashoggi back to saudi arabia. his alleged murder has sparked a diplomatic crisis for the trump administration, particularly trump's son-in-law and senior white house adviser jared kushnener, who has cultivated an exextremely close relationshipip with t the saudi crown prince in washington, a growing number of lawmakers are demanding the united states halt weapons sales to saudi arabia over the incident. but t on thursday, trumpmp rejed the idea. pres. trump: i don't likeke stopping massive amounts of money that is being poported to

our countryry. i know they're talkiking about different kinds of sanctioions, bubut they're spending $110 billion on military eququipment ananon things that creatate job, likeobobs and others for this country. i don't like the concept of stopping an investment of $110 billllion into the united state. because yoyou know w what they'e going to do? therefore to take that money and spend it in russia or china or someplace else. amy: even before jamal khashoggi's suspected death, the trump administration had been under pressure to halt arms sales to saudi arabia over its catastrophic war on yemen, which has killed thousands of people, pushed millions to the brink of famine, and sparked the world's worst cholera outbreak, with as many as 10,000 new cases of cholera appearing every week. we'll have more on khashoggi's suspected death and u.s.-saudi relations after headlines with california democratic congressmember ro khanna.

in immigration news, a new report by amnesty international says the trump administration forcibly separated 6000 families at the u.s.-mexico border between april and august, a far higher number of children and parents torn apart by immigration officials than previously thought. the report says the administration "is waging a deliberate campaign of human rights violations against asylum-seekers, in order to broadcast globally that the united states no longer welcomes refugees." to see our full coverage of the trump administration's family separation policy, including our report from the u.s.-mexico border, go to democracynow.org. in more immigration news, the associated press is reporting that the u.s. army discharged over 500 immigrant enlistees. they were recruited for their language and medical expertise, and were initially promised a fast track to citizenship for

military. the u.s. after their discharge, many of the recruits now say they were deliberately targeted for their immigration status. they also say the army's reason for their discharge, which include refusing to enlist and failing secure declarant says, were not accurate or fair. kanye west launched into a 10 m minute expletive-riddled rt at the white house thursday during a meeting with president trump, during what was ostensibly an oval office meeting to discuss employment and work force training programs. this is a clip of kanye west. >> there are times where, you know, talking about -- i love hillary. i love everyone, right? but the campaign "i'm with her," do not make me feel as a guy, that did not get to see my dad all the time, like a guy that could play chess with his son. there was something about when i put this had on it made me feel like superman. you make a superman. amy: kanye west has come under intense criticism over the last year for praising president

trump and for claiming during a tmz interview that "slavery was a choice." meanwhile, in more celebrity news, taylor swift delivered a political plea to vote in the midterm elections during her "artist of the year" acceptance speech at the american music awards tuesday. >> i just want to make a mention of the fact that this award and every single award given out tonight or voted on by the people. you know what else is voted on by the people? the midterm elections on november 6. get out and vote. i love you g guys. amy: taylor swift also posted on instagram endorsing two tennessee democratic candidates, phil bredesen for senate and jim cooper for house of representatives. her social media post apappearso have sparked a surge in voter registration, particularly in tennessee. pope francis accepted the resignation of washington , d c, archbishop cardinal

donald wuerl, over his role in two clergy sexual abuse scandals. one of these was detailed in the explosive report released in august by a pennsylvania grand jury, which accused wuerl of covering up for his predecessor, a known sexual abuser. last week, pope francis kicked off a month-long international gathering of bishops to discuss the ongoing sexual abuse crisis in the catholic church. in news on syria, aid workers say thousands of syrian refugees stranded near the jordanian border arere running out of foo, as the s syrian army hasas tighd its sisiege of thehe camp in rb. about refugees live in the camp, 50,000 most are women and children. jordan has also blocked aid delivers to the camp through its border. the siege comes as, inin the northwest syrian provivince of idlib, al jaerera reports rebel groups a pulling heavy weapons out of parts of the province, under a deal brokered between turkey and russia aimed at staving off a full-fledged ground offensive i in idlib. the u.n. has warned a russian-backed syrian army offensive against the province, the last major opposition-held

territory in syria, could cause a massive humanitarian crisis. human rights watch says an egyptian-american limo driver from new york has been subjected to torture and rape at the hands of egyptian security forces. khaled hassan was reportedly arrested in january as he was visiting his wife and children in the egyptian port city of alexandria. egyptian authorities are accusing hassan of joining the islamic state, a charge he has denied. in colombia, human rights groups are denouncing the assassination of yet another human rights activist otto valenzuela, one of , the leaders of an environmental community group in the colombian amazon. the activist was found shot to death on october 8. human rights groups say over 100 colombian activists have been murdered so far this year. back in the united states, supreme court chief justice john roberts has referred misconduct cocomplaints against new suprere court jujustice e brett kavanauo a circuit appeals court in colorado. the 15 misconduct complaints

reportedly center on whether kavanaugh lacked his judicial temperament during his testimony. legal experts say it is unprecedented for a newly confirmed supreme court justice to be facing misconduct blades in a lower court, which could rule if it does not have jurisdiction now that kavanaugh 's on the nation's highest court. in financial news, the stock market continued to fall thursday with the dow jones industrial average dropping over 1000 point since wednesday morning. as investors speculated on a range of reasons for the recent meltdown, including the trump administration trade war with outa, the president lashehed atat the federal r reserve a ans dedecision t to raise interest rates. is fari thinknk the fed too stringent and thehey're makg a mistake. and it is not right. we are- despitite that, doing very well but it is not necessary, in my opinion, and i think i know about it betterer than they do. bebelieve me. amy: the state of washington has

become the 20th state to ban the death penalty, with washington's supreme court ruling it is unconstitutional "because it is imposed in an arbitrary and racially biased manner." thursday's ruling commutes the sentences of eight men currently under throw in washington state. a new york judge has dismissed one of the charges against six disgraced movie mogul harvey weinstein. the case involved the alleged sexual assault of aspiring actor lucia evans in 2004. weinstein, who is currently out on $1 million bail, was arrested in may on chararges of sexual assaulult and rape. he has pleaded not guilty to all charges. in election news, georgia's democratic gubernatorial candidate stacey abrams is calling g for secretary of state brbrian kemp to step dowown following an assssociad d press report alleging voter suppressioion ahead ofof the upcoming november election. the state's "exact match" system, where even a minor discrepancy in a voter's registration and their official

id could bar them frfrom castina ballot, has resulted in 53,000 voter applications being put on hold. the highghly anticipated race ps progressivive african-american democratic candidate stacey abrams against the republican secretary of state kemp. kemp's office oversees key aspects of voting in the state, including the controversial verification law. seven out of ten of the stalled applications are for african american v voters in a state whe less than one third of the population is black. in arkansas, a sheriff's department is facing widespread outrage after being accused of forcing prisoners to pose for buckshot and neck t-shirts to mock former san francisco 49ers quarterback colin kaepernick, who sparked nfl-wide protests against racism and police brutality, and recently became a spokesman for nike. the sheriff's office removed the photos of the prisoners wearing

the t-shirts after journalist shaun kind tweeted a photo of them. last night, harvard university awarded colin kaepernick the web to was metal which is awarded to individuals who have made significant contributions to african and african-american history and culture. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goododman. we begin today's show with the shocking disappearance, and possible murder, of the saudi-born "washington post" journalist jamal khashoggi. "the washington post" is reporting turkish government has told u.s. officials it has audio and video evidence that khashoggi was killed last week inside the saudi consulate in istanbul. officicials say the recordings confirm saudi securirity team detained khashoggi after he walked into the consulate on october 2 before killing him and

dismemembering his body. the full audio and videoeo recordings have not yet been released. one e person with knowleledge oe audio recording told the "washington post" -- "you can hear his voice and the voices of memen speaking arabic you can hear h how he was interrogated, torturured, and tn murdered." khkhashoggi had written criticay about the saudi government and the saudi crown prince mohammed bin salman. he had fled saudi arabia last year and had been living in virginia. "the washington post" has also reported that based on u.s. intelligence intercepts, that the crown prince had directly ordered an operation to lure khashoggi back to saudi arabia. the turkish government has accused saudi arabia of flying two planes into the country during a 15 man assassination squad to carry out the murder. one of the saudi men was reportedly a forensic expert known for pioneering rapid and

mobile autopsies. turkish officials say that men used a b bone saw to dismember o khanna -- khashoggi's body before smuggling his body out of the consulate. according to "the washington post," at least seven of the other 15 saudi men have ties to the saudi military. both planes then left istanbul within eight hours of khashoggi entering the consulate. khashoggi had entered the saudi arabian consulate in istanbul seeking a document he needed to get married. his fianancee waited for him outside the buildingng, but he never came b back out. they were supposed to get married the next day. in washington, a growing number of lawmakers are demanding the united states halt weapons sales to saudi arabia over the incident. but on thursday, trump rejected the idea. preses. trump: i would not be in favor of stoppining a country fm spending $110 bibillion, which s

an all-time record, and letting russia have that money and letting china have that money because all they're going to do is say, that's okokwe don't have don't it from boeing, we have to buy it from lockheed, we don't have to buy it from raytheon and all of these great companies, we will buy a f from russia and chihi will stop so what g good does that do us? there are other things we can do. >> [indiscernible] there is something that has to take place. first, have to find out what happened. and we're looking. again, this took place in turkey. to the best of our knowledge, khashoggi is not a uniteded stas citizen. >> he is a permanent r resident. pres. trump: ok. we don't like it. we don't like it t even a little bit. but as to whether or not we should stop $110 billion from being spent in this country? knowing g they have four or five very goodes, two

alternatives, that would not be acceptable. amy: we go now to washington, d.c., where we are joined by democratic congressman ro khanna of california, calling for congressional hearings into possible saudi complicity to the disappearance of possible murder of journalist jamal khashoggi. has beenmember khanna one of the most vocal critics on capitol hill of the u.s.-backed saudi-led war in yemen. welcome back to democracy now! what is the latest you understand has happened to "the washington post" columnist jamal khashoggi? >> it is appalling. i don't think there is any -- been any precedent for a journalist being taken to a consulate, going to a consulate and being murdered. and we don't know all of the facts. we need to find out all of the facts. but this is a pattern with saudi arabia of barbarity. they have been doing this in yemen, where almost 16,000

civilians have been killed. many of those civilians have been killed with lockheed martin and raytheon bombs. this is why many of us on capitol hill want to stop any arms sales to saudi arabia. amy: i want to talk about the yemen war in a minute, the u.s.-backed yemen war. khashoggi, issue of jim mattis, the defense on hisry, when pushed pentagon investigating this, he said something like, "intellectually." donald trump, obvious the, the not treateder, had almost anything on his the days after khashoggi's disappearance. can you talk about exactly what the u.s. relationship is with saudi arabia? also, of course, it implicates jared kushner, very close to mohammad bin salman.

"washington post" put out they had already wanted to get khashoggi to her him back to saudi arabia for, well, who knows what they wanted to do him from saudire arabia. also this information he had gone to the saudi consulate, the embassy in washington, but they told him he had to go to istanbul. he goes to the symbol to the consulate there, and they tell him, fine, they will give him the marriage document he needed, but he had to come back in a week. so he goes to london, participates in a meeting last week, and goes back -- which presumably is for them to prepare and bring these two p lanes and with the military and intelligence people. at least, according to the latest reports, if this is true, with the video and audio evidence, he was murdered and dismembered within a few hours, and in the planes flew out. >> it is brutal. what we also know our reports

that u.s. intelligence agencies may have been aware that khashoggi's life was going to be at risk. and we have written him a calling for the declassification of information that ouour intelligenence agencieies had at any threat to khashoggi''s life. it is against the law for us to not have warned d a resident, a permanent resident of the united states them about a possible threat to his life. and there are many unanswered questions about what the uninitd states government k knew, why we did not give advanced warning -- if we didid have any information -- and of f course, as you allud to, kushner has been pushing sisince he is been in the administration f for a closer re to the saudis, lalargely because easy's the saudis as facilitating a still, from his perspective, w with israel. there realally had carte blanche under the trump p administration toto do what theyy want in yemen

and now i think the administration is embarrassed when they see the brutality that in saudis are capable of this casase. amy: i w want to goo back to president trump p speaking first about calls to cut off saudi arms sales. pres. trump: stopping massive amounts of money that is being poured into our country. i know they're talking about differerent kinds of sanctions, but they are spending $110 billion on military equipment j jobs.hingngs that -- i i don't lilike stopping an invevestment of $110 billilion o the uniteded statates. bebecause you knowow what thth'e going to do? they are going to take that money and spend itit in russia r china or someplace else. i thinkk there are other ways. if it turns out to be e as bad s it might be, there are certainly other ways of handling the situation. amy: ro khanna, your democratic

member of the house of representatives. top says they are not cutting off military weapons sales. of course, the military weapons contractors in the united states benefit enormously. and if you could maybe name some of those that do. but what does the house of representatives have the power to do? canell, we in the senate cut off his arm sales. it is important to president is peddling falsehoods and to correct the record. it is not as of saudi arabia can go and suddenly buy aircraft or tanks from russia. it would take decades for them to switch. they are so dependent on u.s. technology. it would be as if you had an iphone and an apple computer, sadly, you could not switch to windows. are notings transferable. the president knows this. he knows if we were to cut off the arm sales, the saudis would not feel the quickly switch toto russiaia or china and it w would really hurt their efforts in yemen. and the reality is, it is lockheed martin, raytheon, their

bombs that are being found in yemen, responsible for the deaths of children and women. first, the president is wrong the saudis could swiwitch. second, $100 billion in the context of a $20 trillion economy is not a significant detriment to the united states. i don't think there's a single american citizen who would say we should be aiding the saudis and killing women and children for $100 billion, that that is a price worth paying. amy: in august, the twitter account for canada's foreign ministry tweeted -- within s six hours of between, canada's former ambassador to saudi arabia was barred from returning to saudi arabia. the saudi ambassador to canada

was recalled, new trade with canada was halted. it was ordered to withdraw saudi investment in canada, more than 8300 saudi post secondary students were told to pull out of canada, flights to canada by the saudi owned airline were canceled. this is for one tweet urging the saudi arabian government to release some of the women driver activists. >> this is a pattern of brutality. it is a pattern of no concern for human rights. and my concern representing silicon valley is the saudis has had a huge influence in silicon valley. they are try to put a foothold, they are invested in uber and have this davos in the desert conference where they invite tech leaders. the tech community needs to be very clear that they are not going to take saudi money and saudi investment, and this has to be not just congress stopping arms sales, but the united

states technology and investment community cutting off ties with the saudis. i am pleased that uber has said they're not going to participate in the conference. and sam altman rizzoli said that. i hope others will follow the lead. amy: if people have not heard of it, maybe people have, but many journalists and media organizations are beginning to pull out of this high profile conference in saudi arabia that is scheduled for next week following the disappearance of jamal khashoggi. future investment initiative conference, which is scheduled for the 23rd two the 25th of october, still has a long roster of high-level attendees, including executive thomasf colony capital barrett, global markets editor for foxbusiness rib arch aroma, united states general davavid petraeus, president of the world of treasuryecretary steven mnuchin, blackstone ceo stephen schwarzman, black roxio

larry ththink, raytheon company seo thomas kennedy. i think "the new york times" has pulled out. there are others who are going. what about even the government officials? can congress say no to government officials going like steven mnuchin? >> i don't know if congress has the authority to prevent the secretary treasury from going. we can certainly write to him and urge not to go. and i think common sense on his part should leave him to cancel the trip. look, it is not a controversial statement for the united states to stand up for an american thedent who is engaged in freedom of press, the freedom of expression, and is being brutally murdered at a consulate, a place that is supposed to be safe. this should not be a partisan issue. i was encouraged that even senator bob corker raise the question that are on so many

minds, why do we need saudi arabia? saudi arabia is overestimating the strategic importance for the united states. i think this incident has forced a re-examination. and will we look deeper, we're going to see the extraordinary barbarity and the killing of civilians the saudi government has been engaged in an yemen. amy: trump just said "the king needs us." but you have this growing number of republicans, like lindsey graham is that if this is proven, what happened to khashoggi, there would be held to pay. as you mentioned, there is corker, rand paul had said some things. i think even marco rubio. so what would this take to get a vote in congress in both houses? >> i think we are building toward that. i think you have seen bipartisan support growing. several things, one, we need to get more of the facts. i think it is an encouraging development that turkey has what and audio evidence of

took place. and i think that will be very compelling if there is evidence that clearly links the killing to the saudi government. second, we need to look at what the u.s. government knew. as i raised earlier, because if there is evidence that we were somehow sitting on information and did not share it, that is a bombshell and that will influence people's opinion. but you see a growing sense among my colleagues that the relationship with the saudis is not consistent with our values and isn't in interest. that if you hundred billion dollars is not worth an entanglement and further wars and complicity in human rights abuses. amy: i want to go quickly to yemen. last month you are to boost a resolution invoking the 1973 war powers act declaring congress never authorized your support for the coalition in yemen. even during the obama years with u.s. was providing weapons

saudi-uae attack on yemen that has caused the greatest monetary crisis in the world. but presidenent trump went a stp further, pulled back any restrictions on these weapons and refueling. what happened to your resolution and will you be reintroducing it? >> we had introduce this resolution about a year and a half ago and very few people had gotten on board will step you were ahead of the curve and really have been sounding the alarm in yemen, one of the greatest to managing catastrophes. i am encouraged we reintroduced this about four weeks ago and we now have steny hoyer, the number two person in the house, and the chair of the ranking member of the armed services committee, the ranking member of the foreign affairs committee, the ranking member of the rules committee, the ranking member of the judiciary committee all on board with the resolution to stop any aid in the saudi bombing of yemen.

the reason is they have seen the same reports, the bus bombings killing children and women, the fact that lockheed martin and raytheon's bombs have been found in yemen, responsible for the deaths off children. this is something that has ststirred the conscience of the united states congress. and i am quitete optimisistic tt certainly if we take back the house of representatives, we will be able to pass this and we may even be of the past this in the lame-duck given the khashoggi casase and the changig opinion among republicans. stayro khanna, i waved to with us. i want to ask you about amazon, facebook, and your internet bill of rights. rochon is a democratic congress member from california, called for congressional hearings into possible saudi complicity with the disappearance and probable murder of journalist jamal khashoggi. he has been a leading critic off u.s. support for the saudi-led war in yemen. we will be back with him in 30 seconds. ♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. we continue our conversation with democratic c congressmember ro k khanna.

i want to switch gears from yemen and saudi arabia, the disappearance of jamal khashoggi, to talk about amazon, which recently became the country's second $1 trillion company. on video went viral showing october 2, a amazon senior vice president telling hundreds of amazon workers that the company's minimum wage w was beg increaeased to $15 an hour. >> [indiscernible] [cheers] amy: amazon's embrace of a $15 an hour minimum made headlines and was praised by many in washington and all over the country. but it turns out amazon's new pay structure might result in lower take home compensation for many workers because the company is removing some incentive-based

bonuses and stock options. congressman ro khanna, you're the author of the stop these us act in congress. can you talk about this latest news? >> senator bernie sanders and i about four weeks ago introduced zos act. be we said if you're working in a billion dollar and you're not making enough to be up to afford food and you're reliant on public benefits like food stamps, then the taxpayers should not be paying for that, the company should be paying for that. we publicly called on jeff bezos to raise wages to $15, to look to the model of henry ford who did that in 1914. jeff bezos, through our surprise and to his credit, responded. he raised wages to $15. i think you saw all of these amazon workers who courageously were testifying. our bill, by the way, was panned by all of the beltway economist. it did put pressure on bezos and

i do think 350,000 people are going to get a raise. now you are correct that they have taken away some of the grants to stock options. i don't think they s should have done that. i do think that is going to hurt a small number of workers. i hope they will read and -- will reconsider that. but in the aggregate, this is a huge raise for many, many workers. my hope is walmart, mcdonald's, and others will follow. amy: the salary change will not apply to contract workers. to salary woworkers. the majority of amazon workers are contract. >> that is correct. it applies to part-time workers , butbout 350,000 workers it does not apply to contract workers. you raise an excellent point, contract workers are being underpaid not just at amazon, but many places in my district in silicon valley where they are not being able to unionize and they're not getting benefits, and that is a huge issue for our society.

amy: i also want to ask you about the fallout from last week's facebook data breach announcement, which continues as the company is rushing to reassure users that there is no evidence that hackers were able to access third-party apps such as instagram, spotify, or the new york times, which many people access via their facebook accounts.. it may have affected up toto 50 million users. we should point out you are a cocongressman from california to fromom silicon v valley. i have called for internet bill ofof rights. the fofounder of the w world wie web, i spoke with about very simple puzzlzlesf people shouldd know what is happening to their data. people should be notified if there is a breach. pepeople could have the right to consent before their data is collected. it has been a year since the cambridge analytical or six months is the cambridge analytic a scandal and now there are new breaches with facebook, google. it is time the congress do

something. we have laid out a temper principle for rights for folks online and i believe this has to be a top or for the next congress. amy: "the wall street journal" is reporting that google will shut down google plus after revelations of a data breach that exposed the private data of hundreds of thousands of users. the breach discovered in march, but was s not disclosed toto the public. an internal google memo showed officials worry they faced new relations if the data breach word got out. >> that is unacceptable. that is what we need an internet bill of rights. one of the bill of rights is you have to be notified in a timely manner, within 24 to 48 hours. if the breach were discovered in march, people would have, by law, been r required to be notified in march. they would have been known weather data was sent and what that data was used for. right now there are no laws.

honestly, google should have acted more responsibly. but i also blame the united states congress because we have not required these laws -- europe has with the gdpr, and it is time the u.s. congress act to protect people online. amy: ro khanna, they get for being with us, democratic congressmember from california. he has called for congressional hearings into possible saudi complicity in the disappearance and probable murder of journalist jamal khashoggi. he has been a leading critic of u.s. support for the saudi-led war in yemen. he has also introduced the internet bill of rights. when we come back, the remarkable story of henrietta lacks. john hopkin university has just named a building for her. we will speak with her grandson and with the woman -- her granddaughter, and the woman who made her story known around the world, rebecca skloot, who wrote the book "the immortal life of

henrietta lacks." stay w with us. ♪ [muc break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. this week johns hopkins university in baltimore, maryland, announced plans to name a new research building after henrietta lacks, a former patienent of the univeversityy hospital who has become known for her "immortal cells." an africanacks was american woman, who changed modern medicine nearly 70 years ago when it was discovered that her cells could live forever. these "immortal cells" have helped scientists produce remedies for numerous diseases, including the first polio vaccine, that have saved hundreds of thousands of lives. this is johns hopkins university president ronald daniels speaking at the ninth annual henrietta lacks memorial lecture

shortly before announcing the naming of a new building after henrietta lacks. > each yeyear this day has of coururse been an opportunity afforded us an opportunity to celebrate and acknowledge henrietta lacks, who through her life and through her immortal cells not only made an immeasurable impact on medical science, but contributed to a profound transformation at our approach to scientific inquiry and ethics and integrity that must, of course, undergird the entire scientific research enterprise. amy: johns hopkins said the new henrietta lacks campus building will feature courses and activities that promote research ethics and community engagement. some members of lacks' family, however, have e criticized johns hopkins' use of lacks' cells, raising questions about privacy and patients' rights, as well as whether the family should receive compensation for their use.

researchers at hopkins tk lacks' cells without her consent when she was a patient there in 1951. she died of cervical cancer the same year. but her cells were soon being duplicated in labs across the globe. for decades, the woman whose cells would save countless lives was not known by name. instead she was just known as "hela" -- the first two letters of henrietta lack's first anlalast ne. even heramily had no clue abouher lega until me than 20ears aft her dea. last yea hbo mada movie out henrtta lackand her family's joury to disver her tr history ittars opr as deboh lacks, henrietta's ughtererand rose

byrnas rebec skloot,he author othe groubreaking ok on heietta's life tled he immorl life ohenriett lack" this is the mov's aileler. >> for years, it seemelilike a dream. about myother, cld this true wh you don't understa is, we didn't t knowothihingbout thing.g. >> sentists have beetrtrying toto g cellsls to grow outside o the maman by, but they woul alalys done. come henrietta' cells along. i wa to writa book aut your mothe >> g hela. go hela. tha's myother. i hope i don't t regr thihis. >> everye is saying henrietta lalacks donated tse cells

she di't donate nothing. ththey tk ththemnd didi't ask. guilty,omebody going t pay. >> i don't know, bebecca. >> i don't ntnt to anynythg hind youback. aidietta help develothe cotail. chemotherapy tremements. hardot to gecaught uin ho when you have bn porless for so lon i know i am a part of you and you are a part of me. and ago that was the trailer for the movie "the immortal life of henrietta lacks." i watched it last night after midnight on the train up from washington, d.c. an astonishing film. we are now joined by two guests.

in berkeley, california rebecca , skloot, author of the best-selling book "t"the immortl life of f henrietttta lacks." and in baltimore, maryland, we are joined by jeri lacks whye, the granddaughter of henrietta lacks. we welcome you both to democracy now! i want to start with rebecca. before we talk about the building, talk about this story -- for people to understand how significant henrietta lacks'cells are to the contribution of science, contribution she did not know she was making at the time. mean there isn't a person out there who hasn't benefited in numerous ways from the cells. the vaccines that we all get were developed using her cells. her genes were some of the first ever sequenced. they went up into space to see what would happen to human cells in zero o gravity. .n vitro f ftilizationon

the list goes on and on. amy: what was it about cells' cells, the hella line? she had cervical cancer. close these are her cancer cells. she had incredibly aggressive cancer that grew sort of like many cancers, a whiff a tiny tumor on her cervix to with the nephew months, tumors covevering every desk to within a few months, tumors covering every organ of her body. what is amazing about her cells as they were first, b but they grow this intensity that was really never seen in labs a kind of hasn't been seen since. amy: so what do johns hopkins do? how to they realize this? how didid they start -- how do they take the cells and what happened to them? >> they did not realize anything. she just happened to walk in the hopkins in the 1950's at a time when scientists all around the world or trying to grow human

cells outside the body and needed never worked. at hopkins, there was one of the leading tissue culture researchers at the head of the field. he was taking samples from anyone who could -- he could get his hands on. himself, wife, kids. he was try to grow any cells he could. there was this chance conference of a visit henrietta witith his incredible cancer arrived at the location where this man had been trying to do this for so long. it wasn't that they targeted her, that they said, oh, hers are interesting. biopsy and for a they took a next her piece of put it in it dish and that became the cells line. amy: but they did and they knew how valuable it was. they did not tell her. she died. they did not tell her family -- is that right? they understood they wanted information from her family asas well. there -- their genes as well. >> at the time, we did not know

anything about cells. there are like, if we can grow cancer cells outside of the body, maybe we can figure out why it is so powerful. there was no industry connected to any of this or biology in general. they had -- dna had not been discovered yet. they could not know someday they would be able to look in these cells and learn about her family. it is important to look at this in the context of history that way, that they had no idea what they were potentially discovering. or that there was potentially any gain in it. they did not have any sense they wanted anything from her family until 25 years later in the 19 evidence post-of is that point, genome sequence the was -- sequencing was starting. they wanted to look at some of her family members cells t andheir genes. it was no financial interest at that point. it wasn't, we can take a bunch of money if we take samples. but they went back to her gets. at that point because there were

things they needed to know about hela cells that they wanted to learn about her genes in n order to do that. amy: today's explain this to the fafamily -- did they expxplain s to the family as they were doing expert mentation? >> note. there are big ethical moments in the story. the first is in the 1950's they took this without her knowledge. that was the 1950's. in the 70's, when it went back to her family, it was -- it raises other questions about what -- should people have to be told when researchers are going back to them asking for more samples. in the 1950's, we did not have any practice related to that. there were no laws saying they need to ask. it was not standard procedure. in the 1970's, it was. the law had been written saying you have to ask in a situation like this, but had not been quantified in a law. atat the time, most people would have asked. and they didn't.

the family thought they were being tested to see if they have the same canancer that henrietta had, which was not the case. so they thought they were receiving medical care when in fact they werere being used in research. there was no personal gains to them at all. her daughter debra asked a lot of questions in a moment about what was going on and nobody explained it to her. to me, that is the heart of the ethical story is that moment when her family got drawn into research without their knowledge, without the consent. the continue to happen over generations after that. amy: in using her cells without their consent, your book is published. helacientists sequence the genome posted online. what was the impact for the lacks family ended you feel that constituted an ethical breach? in 2013, 3 years after the book came out, a group of five to sequence the genome.

you can learn a lot a about the cells that way. but t they also contain henrietta's personal genes. they posted it online. these days, people take swabs of your cheek and send it off and you can report that says everything from you may get early onset alzheimer's to you have no pattern baldness genes or whatever. people often go to genetic they wantto decide if information. they don't usually publish it online or have it without their knowledge. that is what happened in this moment. the genome sequence was posted on in dust on online and you learn a lot about her family from that. it was a big moment and also there were no laws saying that could not happen. in fact, there are just been a had hison -- obama bioethics commission look at the question of whether we were in danger, sort o of, the way the regulations were now come of this b being able to happen to

people. it was just a couple of months later it happened to the lacks family, which is what sort of happens with bioethical questions. if it is going to apply to you or me or anyone watching this show, it is probably going to happen to them first. that is one of the things the family in that moment once they found out it had happened they said, ok, we want to be part of this from here on out. we don't want future generations to have this happen to them again. longng story short, they ended p taking the sequence offline in the and i each created essentially a committee with a few members of the lacks family and some scientists were now if you want to do research using the genome of the hela cells, you have to put in an application and it is reviewed by a few members of the lacks they feel liket it is warranted. amy: i want to bring jeri lacks whye into this discussion, the granddaughter of henrietta lacks . henrietta lacks, known around

the world. her contributions to medicine are immeasurable. but not known is henrietta lacks , known as hela and the hela cells taken from her name. jeriri, when did you understand what happened to your grandmother's cells? >> it was when the book actually came out. that is when i found out a lot of information about my grandmother, about her tremendous contributions to science. we knew when we were growing up that she helped with the polio vaccine. we knew she died from cancer, but we did not know what type of cancer she died from. so when the book came out, a gave us so much information that we did not know, that our parents did not know. so it was like a generational thing where one generation did not know, so they could not tell the next generation. so now the grandchildren know.

henrietta's children know. so we make sure our children know so we can carry on, so they can carry the legacy and bring awareness to henrietta's tremendous and huge contributions to science. amy: you were involved in the decision of johns hopkins to name the buiuilding after your grandmother, henrietta lacks? can you talk about the evolving relationship between you, the family, and johns hopkins? >> well, we had a discussion last year about naming a building after henrietta lacks. some family members agreed and some family members didn't agree about naming a building. we have a large family. a lot of people are opinionated. we were grateful they actually moved forward with naming the building. it was just amazing because i know at one point last year when

we were talking about, you know, what we wanted johns hopkins to do to honor our grandmother, one of the family members said, ok, maybe they should name a wing after henrietta lacks or maybe they should put a bench near johns hopkins with her name or name henenetta lacks reading room inside johohn hopkins. whenen ty said, ok, , we're goig to name a building, and entire buildingng after your grandmoth, we were excited and grateful that actually johns hopkins is honoring our grandmother in such a fulfilling and tremendous s w. amy: you and two other family members serve on a panel at the nationonal institute of health o approve who gets to use the hela cells in the research, jeri lacks whye? >> yes. it is three family members. committee. the what we do is we review

applications from researchers just to make sure they meet the criteria that has been formulated to make sure they meet what is required of them -- i'm in, it has been exciting just to actually look at -- even though i am not a science type of person, but to look at what researchers are using the hela cells for and what they're hoping to accomplish. i mean, it is these really big words so i have to google some of the words to kind of get an understanding. but the main part is that the family is directly involved. we are not the last to know. we are the first to know. i think i gives us an advantage in taking control of our grandmother's data. amy: was any financial deal ever worked out between the university, researchers, and our family, the lacks familily? >> no. no compensation. we were not asking.

amy: how did you feel about the hbo film with oprah winfrey, portray your family, and what happened with your grandmother's cells? >> i think the movie did a very good job. it deftly got the story out there for people -- it deftly got the story out there for people who are nonreaders or don't like reading a lot. portraits ofted -- family members very well. the only thing i kind of -- like, ok, some of the dialogue, it was like a little country. but other than that, everyone portrayed each family member very well. i think they did a nice job and doing a story. i wish it was a little longer, like a miniseries or they could .ave did a two-part it in all, it was a great movie. i think it was a great movie. so many people came up to us and say, we are happy and glad that this movie has been done.

we are happy and glad the book has been written because so many people don't know her story. ththey don't eveven know her or. amy: rebecca skloot writes, one scientist said if you couould compmpile all l hela onto us go, they would weigh more than 50 million metric tons, inconceivable number given that an individual cell was a must nothing." if you lay them into an, they would wrap around the earth at least three times, spanning more than 350 million feet. in her prime, henrietta or self stood only a bit over five feet tall. 10i lacks whye, we just have seconds come how proud are you of your grandmother? >> oh, words can't -- words can't describe how proud i am of my grandmother. i mean, just knknowing her story and what she has done, not just -- she justn group

did so much for the world. i am so proud that i had the chance were in getting the chance to know my grandmother, to know her contributions and actually go out and advocate -- on amy: we have to leave it there. jeri lacks whye, thank you so much. much. we will de

>> they say beauty is in the eye of the beholder. and in fact, what we consider to be beautiful in nature, art, or music often differs from culture to culture, nationality to nationality, even generation to