11/28/18 11/28/18 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from pacifica, thisis is democracy y now! >> they attacked m my house a at 5:30 in the morning. a group ofof at least 200 to 250 armed soldiers with goods and bulletproof vests and rifles aimed their guns at me, fired shots from used machine guns, kicked down the doors, and just as i was in pajamas, they put me on a plane and flew me to costa rica. amy: nearly a decade after a

u.s.-backed coup in honduras, ousted a democratically elected president, we look at how the political crisis in honduras has led to thousands fleeing to the u.s. border seeking asylum. this comes as the brother of the current honduran p president was just arrested on drug trafficking charges in miami. we will speak to dana frank author of the new book, "the long honduran night: resistance, terror, and the united states in the aftermath of the coup." then we look at u.s. border authorities tear gassing of asylum seekekers on the u.s.-mexexican border. pres. trump: the tear gas is a very minor form of the tear gas itself. it is very safe. once a suffering work people putting it out there, but it is very safe. amy: the head of u.s. border patrol said the pepper spray would go well on the migrants not chose. we will speak to a historian's studies how tear gas went from a

weapon of war used on vietnam to be deployed by law enforcement at home. all of that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. the united nations warns in a new report that humanity is doing far too little to limit global temperature rise to less than 1.5 degrees celsius, a target of the 2015 paris climate accord that would prevent thee worst t effects of c catastrophc climate e change. the.n. found the ratef global carbon dioxide emissions rose last year for the first time in four years, and is expected to climb again for 2018, with the world on pace to see a global rise of 3.2 degrees celsius, or nearly 6 degrees fahrenheit, by the end of the century. such a rise would see devastating drghghts, fldsds, extreme e weather, w witincreaed sea level ri, , cropailulure mass migtion, and global conflict. the u.n.s s callg onon n investmes in renewable ergrgy

and for vevernmes toto rlace subsidieonon fosl fufuelwith xes to dcourage eir use. the stark rnrning meme ahe of the u. clilima talks s f for katowice, poland nt month. democracy no wilill oadcast from thealks durg the we of decber 10. mexico,he goverent of presidenelect anes manue lopeobrador s signal it willold centl americ migrts on mecan soilhile theyait to hr whethetheir applications for political asylum are granted by the u.s. mexico's incoming foreign minister said tuesday the trump administration should, in return, pay at least $20 billion for a marshall plan-style program aimed at developing the economies of el salvador, honduras, and guatemala. it's not clear what services mexico would provide migrants hoping to win u.s. asylum. at the crossing between tijuana and san diego, u.s. officials are processing only about claims 100 per day, even as thousands

of migrants are living in squalid open-air camps near the , border while they await their turn to apply for asylum. customs and border patrol say the migrants may have to wait up to six weeks to hear their -- to have their appeals heard. this comes as the trump administration defended the border patrol for firing tear gas into crowds of migrants, including mothers and children, as they tried to cross the u.s. border from tijuana on sunday. this is ronald colburn, president of the border patrol foundation and former national deputy chief of u.s. customs and border protection, speaking on fox x & friendnds on mononday. >> t the typee o of detroioit bg ed is oc peppeper spray.y. it iss litererally watater, pep, with a a small a amountt of alcl for evevaporation purposeses. it is natutul. yoyou cod puput it on your nacas and eat it. it is a good way of the touring people withohout long-term harm. amy: democrats are blastining te trump p administrationon for its treatment of asylum-seekers. democratic national committee chair tom perez tweeted, "shooting tear gas at children is not who we are as americans."

but new findings reveal customs and border protection fired tear gas dozens of times under president obama. in a statement sent to newsweek on tuesday, cbp said it first acquired tear gas in 2010, and deployed the substance 126 times since 2012. the data show tear gas use has increased under president trump. we'll have more on the tear-gassing of migrants on the u.s.-mexico border later in the broadcast. in texas, a newly revealed memo shows the trump administration waived rigorous background checks for all staff at a sprawling tent camp where migrant children are imprisoned in the desert outside el paso. the memo from the health and human services department's inspector general shows the office of refugee resettlement approved a plan to sidestep requirements for fbi fingerprinting checks, along with child abuse and neglect checks, for 2100 staffers at the tornillo tent city. and the camp was allowed to sidestep mental health requirements, which require one mental health clinician for every 12 children.

tornillo has just one clinician for every 100 children. the trump administration established the tent camp in tornillo in june as a temporary shelter amid the administration's zero tolerance policy, which included forcibly separating children from their parents. it has since expanded to contain 3800 beds for migrant children, with officials saying they're unlikely to meet federal plans to close tornillo by new years' eve. in mississippi, republican senator cindy hyde-smith has won a runoff special e election for the u.s. senate seat vacated by thad cochran, who retired earlier this year for health reasons. hyde-smith's victory came after she joked about hangings on the campaign trail and after photos emerged showing her posing with a confederate army cap and rifle. she captioned "mississippi history at its best." hyde-smith beat her democratic challenger, mike espy, who's african-american, with 53.9% of the vote. the outcome gives republicans a 53-to-47 majority in the senate, while democrats will take control of the house after gaining at least 39 seats.

there is one more house in contention in california, house seat. russia is sending advanced surface-to-air missiles to the crimean peninsula amid mounting tensions with ukraine. the escalation comes after russia's navy captured three ukrainian ships sunday and ararrested sailors near a narrow waterway separating russia from crimea, which russia seized and illegally annexed in 2014. on tuesday, ukrainian president petro poroshenko said ukraine faces the prospect of an all-out wawar with russia. >> thesese russian tanks were nt withdrawn yet. they remain at the ukraine-russia border. that is why y i don't want anyoe to think it is enterertainment r is under theountry threat of a full-fledged war with the russian federation. amy: the trump administration said tuesday it may end subsidies to general motors, including for electric cars, after gm said monday it will close factories and cut up to 15,000 jobs across north america. the announcement came as

president trump blasted federal reserve chair jerome "jay" powell on tuesday, telling "the washington post" he blamed the fed for gm's job cuts, as well as a recent fall in stock market prices. trump told "the washington post" -- "i'm doing deals and i'm not being accommodated by the fed. they're making a mistake because i have a gut and my gut tells me more sometimes than anybody else's brain can ever tell me. so far, i'm not even a little bit happy with my selection of jay. not even a little bit." in the wide-ranging interview, trump also said he was considering canceling a planned meeting with russian leader vladimir putin in argentina later this week over russia's attack on three ukrainian ships off the coast of crimea. trump once again attacked his own administration's report on climate change, released last week, warning of dire consequences of inaction on curbing greenhouse gas emissions. trump said -- "we have very high levels of intelligence but we're not necessarily such believers. you look at our air and our water, and it's right now at a

record clean." and trump once again defended saudi crown prince mohammed bin salman, saying "maybe he did and maybe he didn't" order the killing of "the washington post" columnist jamal khashoggi. trump's comment came after the white house reportedly barred cia chief gina haspel and other intelligence officials from briefing u.s. senators about khashoggi's killing. today's briefing will instead be led by secretary of state mike pompeo, a staunch defender of the saudi royal family. the cia has concluded with high confidence that crown prince bin salman is directly implicated in ordering khashoggi's murder, and gina haspel was reportedly heard audio of the killing intercepted by turkish intelligence. at the white house, national security adviser john bolton told reporters tuesday he hasn't heard the tape and would not be listening to it. >> know, i haven't listened to it. you why youould ask

think i should. what do you think i will learn from a? >> [indiscernible] >> how many in this room speak arabic? you want me to listen to it?t? what am i going to listen to it. if they were speaking korean, i wouldn't learn anymore from it, either. pres. amy: president trump said he also would not listen to the tape. he called it a suffering tape. today's briefing of senators will come ahead ofof a crucial vote o on whether toto withdraw. support fofor the saudi-i-led wn yemen, wchch has creatated what ththe u.n. calls t the world's t humanitarian crisis in a halalfa cecentury, witith 14 million pee on the brink of famine. today's vote comes after cnn quoted two sources saying the u.s. slammed the brakes on a u.n.n. security council resolutn on a ceasefire in yemen, reportedly after the saudi crown prince threw a fit over a draft resolution. meanwhile, crown prince bin salman has arrived in argentina for the g20 summit in buenos aires, where prosecutors are considering whether to use the legal doctrine of universal jurisdiction to charge him with

war crimes and torture. meanwhile, thousands of argentines rallied tuesday near the site of the summit to protest austerity measures being imposed by the international monetary fund, and backed by g20 member nations, in exchange for a $57 billion bailout of the argentine economy. this is argentinean activist gaston harispe. >> the g2020 is hunger and legitimacy. this illegitimate and starving government once the summit to play a role in minor partntner f this conglomerate of imperial countries becomes a divide the world in the framework of the commercial war. amy: this comes as outgoing mexican president enrique peña nieto said it will bestow mexico's highest honor for foreigners on jared kushner, president trump's son-in-law and senior adviser, when kushner arrives for the g20 talks. the move drew scorn from prominent mexicans, including actor who called the decision to

award the aztec eagle tremendously shameful. previous winners include nelson mandela and the nobel prize-winning novelist ariel garcia marquez. syrian radio host and activist raed fares was shot dead in idlib friday, along with activist hamoud jneed. fares founded radio fresh, an independent radio station broadcasting from inside opposition-held syria. fares joined the popular protests against the government of president bashar al-assad in 2011. in the following years, he documented the human cost of the war in syria, exposing rights violations and the devastation of air strikes on civilians.s. fares was tatargeted by boboth e governmement and oppososition lilitants. s surviveprevevious asassassination attempts, a kidnapping, and torture. back in the united states, "the new york times" reports lawyers for donald trump's former campaign chair paul manafort briefed the president at the white housuse about mananafort's cooperatioion with federeral investigators working forr special counsel robert mueller. the briefings by manafort lawyer

kevin downing were confirmed by rudy giuliani, one of president trump's personal attorneys. the meetings were not illegal, but were highly unusual, and reportedly infuriated investigators with robert mueller's team. on monday, the special counsel's office said manafort violated his cooperation agreement with robert mueller by repeatedly lying to federal investigators. meanwhile, lawyers for julian assange said the wikileaks founder will sue the guardian newspaper for libel after it reported tuesday that paul manafort held secret talks with assange inside the ecuadoran embassy in london on three occasions. the alleged meetings occurred in 2013, 2015 -- and in march of 2016, around the time manafort joined donald trump's presidential campaign. author harding cited a "well-placed source" as the basis of the report. in a statement, manafort called the report "totally false and deliberately libelous".

wikileaks said in a tweet -- "wikileaks is willing to bet the guardian $1 million and its editor's head that manafort never met assange." former environmental protection agency administrator scott pruitt coordinated with the fox news channel ahead of multiple appearances on "fox & friends" where he was presented with pre-screened, non-confrontational questions. that's according to the daily beast, which obtained emails showing that fox news producers allowed pruitt's aides to dictate topics for interviews and even offered them script approval for pruitt's introduction. after the report circulated, fox news said in a statement -- "this is not standard practice whatsoever and the matter is being addressed internally with those involved." it's the latest example of fox news coordinating directly with republican politicians. earlier this month, fox news hosts jeanine pirro and sean hannity appeared on stage at a trump campaign rally ahead of the midterm elections. former fox news executive bill shine now works as deputy chief of staff for white h house communications. and former white house coms director hope hicks now works as head of public relations for fox news's parent company.

inin louisiana, a judgdge heard arguments tuesday in an eminent domain case that could help determine the fate of the 163-mile bayou bridge pipeline being built by energy transfer partners, the same company behind the controversial dakota access pipeline. property owners whose land was seized for pipeline construction are suing energy transfer partners, claiming it illegally stole e and damaged private lan. the bridge would carry a judge io issue a ruling today after more testimony. and nasa's insight mission has landed on mars. insight will explore the interior of the red planet with the most sensitive seismometer ever built into a space probe. nasa engineers erupted into applause monday as insight made its landing about seven minutes after shedding its 12 thighs its 12,000 mile-per-houour

velocity to reach the surface safely in just under seven minutes. it's the eighth successful landing on mars by a nasa spacecraft. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. juan: and i'm juan gonzalez. welcome to all of our listeners and viewers from around the country and around the world. as the united states continues to face criticism for tear gassing asylum seekers on the u.s.-mexico border, we turn now to look at the crisis in honduras and why so many hondurans are fleeing their homeland. honduras has become one of the most violent countries in the world because of the devastating drug war and a political crisis that stems in part from a u.s.-backed 2009 coup. in a major development, the brother of honduran president juan orlando hernandez was recently charged in the united states for drug trafficking and weapons offenses. tony hernandez was arrested in miami on friday. manhattan u.s. attorney geoffrey berman accuseded tony hernandezf being "involved in all stages of the trafficking through honduras

of multi-ton loads of cocaine that were destined for the u.s." hernandez is also accused of providing heavily armed security for cocaine shipments transported within honduras, including by members of the honduran national police and drug traffickers. tony hernandez reportedly ran cocaine labs in honduras and colombia where he stamped packets of drugs with his initials "th." the arrest of hernandez comes a year after u.s. judge sentenced the son of the former honduran to 24 years in prison for conspiring to import cocaine into the united states. amy: meanwhile, in other news, honduran police opened fire on protesters earlier this week marking the first anniversary of last year's disputed election that kept juan orlando hernandez in power despipite calls by thte organization of american states to redo the vote. honduras has been in a political crisis for nearly a decade following the u.s.-backed coup that ousted democratically

elected president manuel z zelaa in 2009. since then, right-wing forces have led a campaign targeting activists in honduras including the prominent activist berta caceres who was gunned down in 2016. in her home. eight men are currently on trial for involvement in her killing. a verdict could come as early as today. to talk more about honduras and why so many migrants are fleeing the country, we are joined by dana frank. professor emerita at the university of california, santa cruz. her new book is just out titled, "the long honduran night: resistance, terror, and the united states in the aftermath of the coup." she recently wrote a piece for jacobin headlined, "in honduras, "we're supporting the axe murderers." professor frank, welcome. talk about significance of the current president, a highly contested race that many considered fraught with

irregularities. the current president's brother arrested in miami for drug trafficking. >> we have known for two years now that juan orlando hernandez 's brother tony was involved in drug traffickingng. he was nameded in u.s. federal court two years ago. we know there are drug traffickers top to bottom in the honduran government. for hondurans, this is no surprise. what is important is he was arrested and will be presumably brought to justice. people signals is what call and outsourcing of the criminal justice system. why was he not brought to justice in the united states -- excuse me, why was he not brought to justice in honduras? it shows the complete breakup of the honduran criminal justice systemem that this man was notot brought to justice a long time ago in honduras. juan: according to the federal indictment, the authorities

actually have video tape and audio recordings of tony hernandez receiving a $50,000 payment from drug dealers for his work on their behalf. is it conceivable that all of brother ofed and the tony hernandndez, the current president, newew nothing aboutu? > no. there also testimony work pepeoe have s said that juan orlando hernandez himself is involved in drug trafficking. there's evidence about his sister, who died in a helicopter accident a year ago, was involved in drug trafficking. this is not just an isolated incident. we have evidence of drug traffickers top to bottom throughout the honduran government, including in the current congress. amy: do you think it is fair to say honduras is coming close to a narco state? state.think it is a narco i guess it depends on your definition.

certainly, it is not like you can say, here's the honduran government f fighting the good fighght against drug trafficker. ththat does not work. a lot of people say, poor this money into the honduran security forces and it will fight drug trafficking. because the honduran military is very m much involved in drug trafficking as w well. certainly infiltrated with drug traffickers from top to bottom. juan: dana frank, your book comes at it a particularly important time as clearly the whole nation has been seeing what is going on at the u.s.-mexico border with the caravan of migrants from central america. most of them from honduras. littlere is her discussion of what is fueling, forcing them to leave. if you could talk about what has been the night of terror that has descended on honduras, especially following the 2009 coup against -- bizarre, 2009 coup against president zelelaya. > when you read t the intervs

or the mainstream news reports about whether migrants are in a caravan fleeing, they will say, they are fleeing gangs a and violence and poverty.. and that is true. but what is missing from the narrative is where the gangs and poverty come from. it is not a natural disaster. it is the result of the deliberate policies of this government that came to the success of what we call the post regime government that came to power in the aftermath of the coup. most recently, the illegal government of juan orlando hernandez. those, where does the violence and making tear come from? it comes from the almost amply destruction of the rule of law. the coup itself was a criminal act. but it opened the doors for every kind of conceivable criminal activity in that context, the gangs proliferated, drug trafficking slur freighted -- proliferated. you have a situation in which the government itself is implicated in these gangs and in this military that people are

fleeing. so it is not jusust random violence. it is the u.s.-backed regime that is in cahoots with this. a lot of people are fleeing are beinginesses destroyed by gang texas will stop police have very much quapaw in a with the gangs and extracting those kinds of so-called war taxes the gang members charge. lawlessness that opens the door for this kind of terror that people are fleeing, and the government is very much part of that terror. the second factor is poverty. people are very much fleeing poverty, but it is not a natural disaster. it is a direct result of the post-coup policies. first of all, the state itself has been destroyed, both by neoliberal policies of multilateral develop meant banks like the international monetary fund, state services have been

destroyed because the elites that run the government arriving in blind. for example, the president and his parties still as many as $90 million from the health services to pay for their campaigns. there is no national health service that functions. but also, the sectors of the economy that are supposed to be the growth sectors, are the ones thatat are destroying the livelihoods. for example, palm oioil productn is being imposed at the point of a gun, killing -- the kills those who are trying to defend other forms of agriculture. extract of mining projects in hydroelectric dams are forcing indigenous people off their lands. famous leader berta caceres was killed in 2016. indigenousforcing people off their land at the point of a gun. the only sectors are agriculture and the sector that is

electronics factory for the export market. those are very, very destructive of people's bodies and really repressive working conditions. when we hear about economic development in honduras it is accelerating more this destruction, along with a gang activity that is destroying small businesses because it is not viable to have a small business. i know a lot of small business people, people that have been killed if they did not pay the taxes or reported it to the police. there are no other options here. the other piece of this is those who are trying to have an alternative economic future. these are the people that are getting tear gassed. these are the people getting assassinated. report onlists that this alternative divivision than the people who like some can of democratic alternative. these people are being rerepressed. that is the other piece of this. juan: i want to ask about the repression in the countryside.

i thought that was some of the most graphic material you have in your book, especially the escalation of the repression, not immediately after the coup after9, but in 2011 manuel zelaya comes back after a result of a brokered agreement between venezuela, the leaders of venezuela and colombia, the latin american countries, for him to come back to the country that actually in places like the valley, they were e subjected to even greater -- >> those who have these collectives that have been in place for a long time and werere being forced off their l land, started preoccucupying land they have been forced off of by these neoliberal policies, particularly members of the elite. as they start preoccupying their land and following legal

processes for reclaiming their land, and they start being killed one by 1, 2 by two. we could call a slow-moving massacrere. as many as 150 campesinos have been assassinated in the valley beginning in 2010. amy: we're going to go to break and come back to this discussion. dana frank professor emeritus at , the university of california, santa cruz. her new book "the long honduran , night: resistance, terror, and the united states in the aftermath of the coup." this is democracy now! back in a minute. ♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynowow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. we continue our conversation with dana frank, professor emeritus at the university of california, santa cruz. her new book "the long honduran , night: resistance, terror, and the united states in the aftermath of the coup." i wanted to go back to 200009 wn there was a a coup in honduras d the democratically elected leader for the hundred president manuel zelaya, spopoke on dedemocracy now! about what happened to him. >> t that attatacked my house at

5:30 in n the morning. a group ofof at least 200 to 250 armed soldiers witith goods and bullet-proof vest andd rifles aimed their r guns at me, firerd shots, used pushing guns, kick down the doors. just as i was, in pajamas, they put me on a plane and flew me to cocosta rica. this all happen in less than 45 minutes. amy: that was in roles ally on democracy now! we followed him back to honduras after he was flown back from nicaragua to honduras. the new regime was put in place. the coup regime. lobo, whose son has now been sentenced to well over 20 years in prison for drug trafficking. dana frank, i was wondering if you could talk about this history that went from the democrats -- juan, when you

interviewed hillary clinton when she was running for president when you're working at "the daily news," you asked her about the coup. she was not pleased. you asked her about her support, the u.s. support for the coop when she was secretary of state. it went from the democrats right through to president trump. if you can talk about the extent of the support and why youou see that linked to what we're seeing with the migrants today, as you say, these are refugees from u.s. policy. >> we don't have a smoking gun that shows the u.s. backed the coup from before it happened, but all of the evidence is very clear the u.u.s. wanted the cocp toto stabilizeze after it took e , that the u.s. recognize the bogus election of november 2019 that brought lobo to power, and that the u.s. has continued to recognize the ongoing coup regime, especially that of juaun orlando hernandez, although, he has come -- he stole it, we probably don't know, in 2013. he clearly ran for president last year in violation of the

constitution that band reelection and stole the election in november last year. go againinst salvadoran azzarer. >> which clearly one. the u.s. -- it is not just a question of the u.s. supporting the coup itself. clearly, hillary clinton was responsible for that but don't forget barack obama was her boss and he is responsible, too. it is not just that moment. the u.s. could have recognized castro's wife when she probably won the election in 2013. the u.s. could have intervened -- not intervene, the u.s. could have protested when juan orlando hernanandez overthrew the supree court in 2012 when he was president of congress. the u.s. could have protested when he ran for reelection. of course, it could have called for a new election last winter are recognized nasralla is the winner will s.

not just just obama, hillary clinton, it is also john kerry and now donald trump. his secretaries of state, john bolton, senator marco rubio who was reportedly the person advising, popompeo and u.s. poly in honduras right now. this is an ongoing policy. the hondurans will be quick to orlando's regime continues because of supportrt t just by police and military aid, which is pouring in, but this legitimization of the regime. if you want to see the continuity, the key figure is general john kelly, the head of the united states command out tf miami, before he was chief of staff for trump. he very much has supported juan orlando hernandez. he called him a good friend.

here is how we can see this continuity from one regime to the next. there is noy smoking gun in terms of the u.s. involvement, but your book has unusualut a highly meeting that happened the night before the coup between the key general who led the coup and a u.s. official? that is jeh j johnson's research for the intercept. he was meeting with general run the number four and leaving a party that night and coming back. hillary clinton says in her autobiography that she was at the pool in cape cod and was surprised by the phone call. she also famously says, we helped them with the election and make a return of celaya -- zelaya moot.

have now a situation where you have thousands of hondurans that are fleeing to the u.s. border. your response to the teargassing, which we're going to be talking about in our next segment of the migrants, and also mexico's incoming foreign minister, not the government of , sayingto, but amlo that they have agreed to wait, that the migrants should stay waiting on mexican soil as they wait to hear their appeals, but in return, the u.s. government should pay at least $20 billion for marshall plan-style programming for developing the country's? tear gas ise of the terrifying, as the presence of u.s. military at the border in violation of the 1878 posse, titus act. let's market as well as to guess

fired into a foreign country against people -- terrified, starving people trying to seek thel asylum applications in united states. this is a terrifying, militarized response to these refugees. think it i is so morallyly disturbing and illegal use of federal troops here, and that border patrol shooting -- this is a terrifying militarization of our own border. i want to make a parallel of that to the militarization u.s. funded militarization within honduras. sincee honduran military, 2014, with the so-called crisis of undocumented unaccompanied , the honduran military actively stops people from leaving their own country. these are u.s.-funded and trained forces that are doing that. i find this armed encirclement terrifying. in the tear gas, which is often manufactured in the u.s., is

used against peaceful protesters and bystanders for years and years. i have the story in a book about a friend of mine saying in the first couple of months after the coup, he was learning to taste all of the different players the flavors usedd against hondurans. this has been going on in the last week on the anniversary of the stolen election. i want to underscore there are these military's -- militarized parallels of what is going on in both countries. i don't know if people remember after the so-called crisis in a children coming to the u.s. in 2014, the administration's response is something promoteted by joe biden that wanted to give esebillion to th governments of the so-called triangle and order to stop migration and address root causes. if you look at that, and it was 750 million of that was

eventually funded by congress, if you looook at that, it is pouring precisely into the same security forces and sectors of the economy that are causing the very repressions, the very destruction of the economy that people are fleeing. when you start hearing -- of course we're all watching to see what lopez obobdor is going to do in mexico, but -- and of course the honduran economomy ds need to be rebuilt, but not according to a model run by the current u.s. government and run by the repressive regime of juan orlando hernandez and the honduran elites. that is what is so terrifying. you pour the kind of money in the same model -- we have in dallas model before -- and you're just handing money over to the e elites and really terrorize the people over and over again at a higher and higher level. juan: one of the most interesting parts of your book is your portrayal of this enormous and widespread popular

movement that develops after the coup against zelaya. contrasted, rightfully so, back in the 1980's, honduras was a relatively quiet place while el salvador, nicaragua, and guatemala were all embroiled a major civil conflicts and uprisings and government repression, but yet hundreds -- i remember being there in 1990 terrorizedthen a state. there were military all over the place, but there wasn't the kind of popular movement that somehow developed after the coup against zelaya. can you talk about that and how it inspired you and shoot your own thinking of your role as an academic? >> there certainly w was an acte the in the honduras in 1980's, but much smaller, and trim it is the repressed by some of the figures that are popping up again. is aonduran resistance

tremendously beautiful thing. in retrospect, you can see the social movements that were building at the grassroots, the women's movement, the campesino movement, indigenous movement, and human rights defenders. when the coup happened, people poured into the streets and formed this tremendous coalition called the national front of was an resistance, which amazing coalition, of the labor movement, the lgbt movement, but also people committed to the constitutional rule of law.. it wasn't about so-cacalled zela supporters as it was so often framed, but people committed to transformation of honduras. it resonates to philly in the u.s. today with trump threatening the constitutional rule of law all over the place. a beautifulnce was thing. the first chapter of my book, i wanted the reader to really feel the joy of it, both the tear and

the joy, of the creativity, of the music, of the humor for the bravery, the graffiti, and the way it changed honduran colter for good. and may people proud of their resistance and discovevering tis acrossss different social movements in a massive coalition that we fantasize of in the united states today. unfortununately, that resistance has been repressed and repressed and repressed. a lot of key figures are now in exile. people have been killed. journalists that have covered it are killeded or in exile. it has been terrifying to watch that repression, but also hondurans have that in their hearts that they know what to do and how they could feel beautiful sense of solidarity. amy: as you talk about the resiststance, i i want to askk t for the cancerous. a a man on trial right now accud of murdering the great environmentalist. she was gunned down her home in

2016. a verdict is expected any moment . her assassination came a year after she won the goldman environment apprise for her work protecting indigenous communities and her campaign against a massive hydroelectric dam progress. >> in our worldviews, we are beings who come from the air, water, from corn. the people are protected and turned by the spirits of young girlrls who teaeach us that givg our lives in very's ways for the protection of the rivers is giving our lives for the well-being o of humanity. >> that was for the cancerous -- bera caceras. , talk about the trial, who has been involved,

who is on trial and who isn't. looks the are eight men on trial. one was an active duty military officer in charge of military intelligence at ththe time. another one was a former military officer. have been theo material authors of the crime itself. underscore, one, they are not the only actors here. there other hondurane lites the evidence points toward. they're not being charged or when they are being charged, there are mounting some incredibly well-funded pr campaign saying there are victims of human rights abususe, which is really far-fetched. chargedrybody has been that is responsible for calling -- paying for an calling for her assassination. the second thing is the trial itself has been a tragedy -- excuse me, a travesty. the government prosecutors have not introduced or taken into

account a vast range of evidence of text messages, seized and peter messages, phone call records that implicate all kinds of people. they're not taking that into account. and honduran law says the family of the victim has the right to review all of the evidence, has the right to be there in court. and that has been violated over and over again. we're going to get some kindd of verdict, probably somebody will take the fall for this, but we should not in any way confuse that with justice for berta. the fact there is even a trial is mostly because of international pressure, including from the u.s. congress and people like yourselves. there is going to be a lot of pressure to act like somehow ththis -- justice has been done and we're going to put this under the rug -- what is the war? sweep it under the rug. it is important at this is not going to be justice for berta. it is when to be something for

show, they say, in honduras, and we still have to call for theice for berta and have true perpetrators brought to justice. juan: in your book come he also talk about your frustration in theing with congress and cost of a changing staff members who don't seem to have institutional memory but -- about what is going on in the lack of ability for people in congress to actually act and do something about what is going on there. could you talk about that?t? >> the middle paparts of the bok is about the solidarity movement in the north and my own efforts to try to do something. i talked about going into this morass, the united states congress come and try to get people to care. people did not believe as for many years. i also talk about the people that d did care and in ththe boi talk about particular staffers and commerce members and senators that did care. what do i say about congress in

washington, d.d.c. right now? it is a minefield. and easily corrupted minefield. i also want to tell you something that i think has disappeared from the mainstream media, there has been also tremendous and beautiful congressional interest on the democratic side in what has been going on in honduras. people may not know their 71 members of the house currently on record -- john amy: we just lost dana frank by satellite. we want to thank her for being dana frank professor , emeritus at the university of california, santa cruz. her book is just out titled, "the long honduran night: resistance, terror, and the united states in the aftermath of the coup." she will be speaking about her book in brooklyn on thursday night, inc. interviewed by one gonzalez. people can go there 7:00 to 9:00 p.m. ththat does it for that intervi. we will continue on the issue of .he use of the tear gas

tear gas being shot at women and children along the border. we will look at the use of tear gas by u.s. security. stay with us. ♪ [music break] amy: this is democracy now!,

democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. juan: as the trump administration continues to defend firing tear gas into crowds of asylum-seekers, at the u.s.-mexico border, we spend the rest of the hour looking at the history of tear gas, which is banned in warfare but legal for federal authorities and police to turn on civilians. border authorities use of tear gas has spiked under the trump administration with the agency's own data revealing it has deployed tear gas over two dozen times this year alone. cucustoms and bordrder protectin told "newsweek" tutuesday began using tear gas under the obama administration in 2010 and has released the substance 126 times since the year 2012. the agency's use of tear gas has now reached a seven-year record high under the trump administration. on monday, president trump was asked about the tear-gassing women and children migrants. >> how did you feel when he saw the images of women and children running from the tear gas?

pres. trump: i do say, what are they there? first of all, the tear gas is a very minor form of the tear gas itself. it is very safe. the was that were suffering to a certain extent or the people who are putting it out there. amy: p president trump claimed border agents used a minor form of tear gas, but customs and border protection later acknowledged there is only one form of the gas that is commonly used. ronald colburn, the president of the border p patrol foundationod former national deputy chief of u.s. c customs bororder proteten spoke onon fox andnd fendsds moy mornining. > the type e of t the currerg ed is oc pepepper spraray. is l literally watater, pepper,h a smsmall amouount of alcohoholr evaporatation purpoposes. it is nanatural. you cocould put t it on your nas and eat it. it is a good way of deterring people without long-term harm. amy: "you can actually put it on your nachos and eat it." isr gassed is -- your guess

banned by international law under the chemical weapons convention. the american academy of pediatrics said in a statement -- "the use of f tear gas on childn -- including infants and toddlers in diapers -- goes against evidence-based recommendations, and threatens their short and long-term health." well, for more, we go now to baltimore, maryland, where we're jojoined by stuart schrader, lecturer in sociology at johns hopkins university. his forthcoming book is titled "badges without borders: how global counterinsurgency transformed american policing."" stuart schrader, welcomeme to democracy now! first, respond to what president trump and head of the border patrol foundation said about the tear gas and the fact that it was shot at women and children on the border. >> both of these statements are misleading. in the case of president trump's statement, he isis trying g to m ththe tear gas is a mildld foro.

simplply simply untrue. the tear gas that was used is a chemical called. the government border patrol iss referring to pepepper spray. again, it was cs that was used. it is an extremely powerful chemical. the term tear gas, when s is misleading. it does not just make your eyes tear when it affects your body. it also makes all of your mucous membranes become inflamed. of expel large amounts mucus. you cough. you feel like you cannot breathe. you feel like you are choking. reallym tear gas doesn't describe the effects a are the result of this chemical. juan: what is the difference between pepper spray and tear

gas? >> theirir chemicacally diffffet substancnces. they are also the delivery methods are different. was deployed on the boborder camame out ofof grenadd it came -- most people saw images of these kindnd of clouds of smokeke. pepper spray is the morere directcted the last that is usually shot between one law enforcement officer and one person or a small crowd of people. instead, the cs grenades that were used, they diffuse a large cloud of the chemical that can basically and golf anyone who is within the vicinity. amy: yesterday, i quoted the editor for jamal khashoggi, the global news editor at the washington post, saying if american media were describing it does happen in a non-western

country, "american secretive forces under the trump regime chemical weapons at a cross border operation against unarmed asylum seekers, including children. my god." stuart schrader, can you talk about the history of the use of cs gas? i don't think people understand. this gas that was used on the women and children who are fleeing persecution and poverty isis considered illegal under te chemical weapons convention? >> that is correct. is a fairlyof cs long history. the first ban on chemical weapons ththat was put into plae was all the waway back in 1925. that did not cover cs because cs had d not yet been inveveed. the u.s. did not ratify that agreement way back w when. few yearsented a

lateter. it realllly came i into much moe widespread use and was adopted in the latetelitary 1950's, e early 1960's. until t that poinint, therere ws anotheher form o of tear g gas t was used, again, acknowledging the term "tear gas" is misleading. the u.s. faced that out. that is called cn. they face that out over the course of 1960's and replaced it with cs. wasas moren was cs severe and intense in itits effects. so begininning in the 1960's, te u.s. military started to use cs in its operations, predominantly in south vietnam. when this news hit newspapers in the uniteted stateses in 1965 tt the united states was using gas, the johnson a administration quickly tried to downplay the

use of the gasas. firsrst of all, they wanted to make sure everybybody knew it ws not violating any kind of international treaty, that it was not using mustard gas or something along those lines. but they also made the effort to downplay the severity of cs.. and in this way, there's a strange parallel between lyndon johnson and donald trump, probably the only one that can be drawn, which is they both have claimed that tear gas, cs, n not so babad. so lyndonn j johnson, his secrey of state, secretary of defense,, they all c claimed the usese ofs beginnining in 19 city five in vietnam was no big deal and nothing to b be concererned abo. but in fact, the effects of cs at the time were severe a and cs became to bebe used in really large e amounts,s, copiousus am, througughout thehe u.s. wawar in

vietnanam during the 1960's. juan: and how they did the use of cs then migrate to domestic police departments, especially after 1968? how was the logic then of that came about? used in w when it was vietnam, it was used in two hi merrrry ways. although it was often claimed it was being used in the settingngf riot control, that was that the cacase. inin fact, it was used in comba. one purpose was used to flush people out of hiding. so if people were hiding and bunkers or tunnels or even just cs s would beation, usused to try to forcrce them ot because e of course,e, the main problem for the united states military do in the war in vietnanam was finding the people that they wanted to target as the enemy. was used to force people

out because the response anybody would have to is basically to flee, as we saw in pictures just the other day. so once people revealed their location, then the u.s. military could target them with more conventional weapons from airstrikes to bullets. and another reason or another purpose of cs was to then contaminate the spaces, bunkers and tunnels. ,hey would be filled with cs thenen people could nonot go inm and hide after the us military left. now, these purposes were not be immemediate purposes that were the united1968 in states by law enforcement. rather, it was used in riot control starting inn 1 1968. in 1 17, there were large, well-known incidents o of urban unrest i in cities like newark d

detroit.t. inin the natational guard was deployed. in the national guard inin these incidents used bullets. they used bullets. they s shot and laudablele is. -- they shot a lot of bullets. julyuou fast-forward fromm 1960 seven to april of 1968 when there was unrest after the assassination of martin luther king in cities like washington, d.c., and baltimore, and others, the national guard fired less thanan 20 bullets, but they used something like almosost 6000 cs grenades. the reason for this really rapid and dramatic transformation in their tactics in riot control theaftfter the e experiencnce n summer of 1967, the johnson a administration appointed the kerner commission, which did an extensive investigation into the causes of the unrest and also into remedies for preventing it

in the future. of course, they recommended a racism andlleviating poverty, but that did not happen. instead, they had some recommendations about how to change policing. one of which was to use cs. and that recommendation mostly came from experts who were already working overseas in the setting of counterinsurgency and other types of -- - amy: we clearlrly need a part to on this. who m makes css? >> cs isisade by amemerican companies as wewell as otherr cocompanies s around the w worl. amy: i want to thank you for being with us. stuart schrader, lecturer in sociology at johns hopkins university. his forthcoming book "badges , without borders: how global counterinsurgency transformed american policing." democracy now! is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed captioning. e-mail your comments to outreach@democracynow.org or mail them to democracy now!

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