watching. al jazeera, miami, florida. >> let's have a quick check. the vice president, kamala harris has warned the u.s. kimberly has more from guatemala's capital. >> there is an acknowledgement that she spoke alongside the gat milan president that she believes the reason people are making the desperate journey is because they feel they need to flee harm or they can't satisfy basic needs.

that's why both leaders discussed how they believe that they could encourage people to stay where they are in their homelands. they announced that there would be an effort to combat not only human trafficking and smuggling but also the corruption that many are facing that is really hurting their economic opportunities. >> the colonel has been sworn in as the transitional president. they overthrew the transitional president. he promised to hold elections next february. the u.s. justice department says it's recovered millions of dollars paid by energy supply colonial pipeline in a ransomware last month. the cyber attack originated in russia by dark side. the result approves presidential election run-off remain unclear. the two candidates are neck and neck. pedro castillo is ahead of

fujimori. those votes tend to favor castillo. u.s. regulators have approved a new drug for people with alzheimer's. but a study says there's not enough evidence. it's the first alzheimer's drug to be approved in 20 years. and it will need be studied further. a plea to the canadian province of ontario. they're calling the death of a muslim family a hate crime. a 20-year-old man has been charged. you're up to date with the headlines. we've got another half hour of news coming up right after "inside story."

>> a century ago, german collinizer almost wiped out an indigenous people. germany has apologized. so how should countries deal with injustices committed in the past? this is "inside story." ♪ >> hello. welcome to the program. it's been called the first genocide of the 20th century. more than 100 years ago, german soldiers killed tens of thousands of indigenous people from two ethnic groups. last week, germany apologized and agreed to pay $1.3 billion

for intrastructure projects over the next 30 years. but their vice president says that's nowhere near enough and descendants say that's nowhere near enough. the case has reignited the dete with how countries should deal with past atrocities. reporter: while, it's taken more than a century, germany admitted it committed genocide over an in didgenouse group. >> we will call these events what they were, a genocide. in doing so, we are acknowledging our historical responsibility in the light of germany's historical and moral responsibility that will last nabibia and asked for forgiveness. >> community leaders had tried through courts to compel the german government to pay reparations for the

extermination for nearly 100,000 indigenous people. this took place during the 20th search colonization in may, germany agreed with the government to provide $1.3 billion in development aid for the next 30 years. >> germa has been dictating and for me, ■it waslikea case of, you have a murderer or a rapist and this person is the one to decide whether i have raped or not? and should i find myself guilty, what could be the best punishment or edict that i can give myself? that is how the whole process was not acceptable to us. >> there are other who is say the negotiations between the two governments excluded those directly affected by the genocide. we first meet eda hoffman, she's

been fighting if the direct compensation. she fierce it will never reach their people. >> they took our people. our resources. our people have become the poorest of the poor. >> during the genocide, these communities were robbed of their land and cattle. today, many say they continue to suffer the legacy of being displaced. and that this chapter in their history remains unresolved. anchor: several communities around the world have stepped up calls for reparations relating to historical atrocities. a group in canada has been suing. this is for the 1990 genocide. many algerians want reparations

for france' colonial rule. the u.n. human rights chief has urged countries to confront it and make amends for violence. well, let's bring in our guest for this edition of "inside story." in windhawck, we have two experts. and the senior researcher said that the nordic africa and member of the swpo and in london professor phil clara called the international politics and code director of the center of conflict. welcome tulle the program. -- welcome all to the program. ms. pana. apologies are a huge step for

those who want to say that they did something wrong. it's a bigger and more difficult step sometimes to accept when your ancestors have been the victims. and those apologizing weren't there at the time. i -- >> i think that's interesting, the apology aspect especially when it comes to reparations because the apology should be an outcome of a process that takes place before consistent engagement between the perpetrators and the victims or so to say the descendants of perpetrators and victims. the groups continue to identify as victims and not descendants of victims because they do feel that the process -- that the inherited injustices continue to make them victims. however, when it comes to apology from the german side, i

think maybe that's where it comes from, people feeling that i wasn't there or i didn't do it and ultimately, i think with reparations, the important symbolic nature of it is to really shift the debate, you know, about punishment or -- or anything. it's about an inherited responsibility. and we cannot start to go further on this. we start to think about the symbolic nature of reparations of acknowledgement of knowing our history, knowing the role or what we inherited. so it's not to feel that you're being slapped on the hand and being forced to apologize but that you actually mean it. >> ok. let's move on to hattie melbourne because if it's about the indignities a community has experienced and an apology is part of the way there from your understanding and your knowledge and your experience, what are

the main issues that these communities want addressed? >> i think first of all, it's about a full recognition of the genocide committed and the irreversible consequences both in terms of democracy and social economic structures which are part of the social reality of olympia today. i think there's a mismatch reflecting the asymmetric power relations because in germany at best it's considered a foot noter -- a footnote of german history. it's repress santa and it's very much a-- repressant, and it's very much oppressing. they were all victims of the genocide. and while it's important to

offer an unreversed apology, that should have been the first step in negotiating. let's keep in mind germany admitted in 2015 that, yes, what happened then is from today's perspective genocide and then they said now, let's open bilateral negotiations with the government how best to apologize. i think that's adding insult to injury. >> the debate will continue certainly for the weeks and months ahead. so we can put that slightly to one side and come over to professor clark in london. i mean, in northern europe where you are in london, much is taught in schools across the board about world war ii, colonialism and it's focused around the ents of northern europe and the colonies and taught from a northern european experience. and as mr. melbourne said there it's a footnote about what

happened in africa. but the colonies and events in those continents combarely get to mention and are barely understood by the public at large, doesn't namibia's experience have to be retaught to germans and the to look at the way they behaved when it was a nazi state during world war ii? i think -- >> i think that's right. before we talk about apologies and reparations, former colonial powers have to honestly and fully acknowledge the crimes of the past, their direct actions in various parts of africa. and i don't think we're seeing that from these european powers at the moment. i think we're seeing these piece meal form of acknowledge ideal that are of what britain did in its former colonies, and what germany did and its former colonies. part of that apologies is

expressed in places like namibia and rwanda and other areas. it's public museums and monuments. it's about having an honest, domestic debate about colonial crimes. most of these european states at the moment are incredibly reluctant to have that kind of conversation in africa and very reluck tonight have that conversation at home. >> indeed. i know he's nodding in agreement. before i go. professor clark, the terminology is difficult to accept when you mention genocide and certain countries who don't want to acknowledge that theyere perpetrators of genocide. it's an important term legally as well. so what sort of effect does that word have in this context with namibia and germany still talking about the tenuous relationship and historical

issues? >> i think something we have to recognize about their case is that germany was dragged kicking and screaming into this dialogue with this government. germany didn't want to be there. they didn't want to acknowledge the genocide. it was only because the activists had started taking legal cases into foreign jurisdictions that germany got a bit spooked and decided that they should look into this case. germany's first response was to offer a very poor sum. and the groups said that's not enough. you've committed genocide and we're dealing with it today. we need something that's much more substantial and meaningful. i think all of that raises some very serious questions about the sincerity and the honesty in which germany is engaging with the community. we could argue that with france

and the netherlands and belgium, exactly this same conversation. >> i'll be touching on those a little bit later. basically that voice about the reparations not being good enough, the situation not being good enough was initially accepted by the vice president. and now he urged his community to remain calm and think deeply about the response to the deal. we have made remarkable progress over the past five years of negotiations and there's an opportunity we should not waste. he's changed his tune, hasn't he? he's not very happy with the offer by germany. what seemed to change his mind? >> i can only speculate that it boiled down to the reaction of the namibian public at large. i'm sitting here and almost every day in the newspaper is about another chief who disagreed with it.

activist groups, speaking about about it. so i think it is correct to say it is -- it is a huge improvement to what's been happening especially when you look at the history of this process to get to this point. however, i think the way that the public is reacting is because it's been such a process,s the just getting more and more frustrating. and i think the vice president has to take into account the -- the views of the nabibian public. i guess that's the main issue, the main developments that's been happening here in the public. anchor: henny, is that the way you've seen it from where you are? because you've had years of being able to research and speak

to the people at the heart of the problem? >> well, as i pointed the perceptions are entirely different from those in germany. professor clark made reference to a very important point. actually, as the activist pointed out, if the german president is supposed to offer an apology, he should do so in germany to bring the message back home what happened in the german colony then to create a minimum awareness in german society today. what there was before the holocaust and then trying to close a chapter which is not closed by such an insufficient agreement. now, first of all, why material compensation and the germans

desperately avoid the reparations is an important part of an apology. we will never ever compensate for the loss of human lives. there is more to be done. and reconciliation, if there is a way for reconciliation needs to be between and among people and not governments. and that's already a flaw in the current negotiations. >> obviously, there are many examples around the world that we can look at that are similar and have this fine thread of apologies and reparations and understanding. phil clark, back to up. we've seen in south korea after world war ii that forgiving japan and its behavior towards korean comfort women has never been settled. despite agreements between the two governments, it still festers as an issue to this day.

and even if you do have financial, you might say, an ending, a finality to it, is this something that could fester for nabibians in the same situation that south koreans have found themselves for nearly 70 years? >> yes, i think that's the danger. but if issues of apology and reparations aren't handled well, its compounds the original crime. there's an opportunity now to acknowledge the past to do something constructive about it. but if that's handled in a piecemeal fashion, if that's handled poorly, it can make the situation much worse. i think the difficulty in the germany and namibia case is that germany has an experience of large scale reparations to the jewish people after the holocaust. but in that case, germanyt least did seem to fully try to

come to terms with crimes committed during the holocaust. and there was a systemic attempt at reparations for the jewish people. now, in this case it has been compare and contrasted with that. as penae and henry with emphasized the deal seems be falling short. germany has a history of engaging clearly and systematically in history of reparations. but we're seeing things differently in this namibian case and could fester for a long time. >> how difficult was it for the local communities to actually get their voice heard? we heard that it's been a decade to get to this point. can you talk about the people who had been victims? can you give us an example of the treatment of germans towards

native namibians? >> well, during my -- during my research, i -- i conducted some interviews, and there's also some work done by casper ericsson which is one of the few bodies of work that actually captures that -- histories of both of these communities. and a lot "on the fly" -- a lot "on the fly," a lot of these are shaped by these atrocities and issues around land and restorations. a lot of it are these shaped by theus atrocities and the issues around the land and restorations. the first attempt was well over a century ago where the chief at the time actuay asked for land

back so that the herero people can live as a nation once again that needs to be understood in the context of colonialism and the fact that then it was brought up again in the 1920's. it was brought up against at the u.n. in 1949 on wards. so we have to understand that the opportunity especially under colonialism and here he's talking about the holocaust and germany's attempt to make amds. very different contexts. at the end of day, germany has had a year -- has had over a century of protection based on their international politics at the time of decolon yization. they exercised their -- -- decolonization and they

exercised their rights. of course, it's late. but not late on our part. it's overdue justice. >> let me bring in heny melbourne here because we talk about the pressure put on germany kick and screaming to come to these talks in 2019 there was a report that was damning of belgium's past and i quote with a view to closing the dark chapter in reconciliation and healing there were several backed investigation about colonial rule and how those powers need to face their past sooner rather than later. is it up to bodies like the u.n. if you can deem them tipt to tell nation states you need to look at your colonial past? >> the u.n. might try to put more pressure on those colonial

powers but i'm afraid that our politics is different. let's remember that because in the 1980's adopted a report the war against the communities as the first genocide of the 20th century. so it's almost 20 years on record. let's remember that after world war i, the treatly of versailles took away the german colonies with the argument that german colonial policy has qualified them as civillizers, in terms of reparations are actually decided by those who have the power of definition. and not by those who were defeated meaning that over

herrero and the nama never had the chance. but at the versailles treaty, the other colonial powers dealt with germany as one of the colonial powers which was defeated. but for obvious reasons, they did not impose reparations on germany for the colonial atrocities despite the fact that they pointed to the colonial atrocities. >> you were nodding in agreement. i will bring you back on this whole issue of reparation and how colonial powers deal with each other and the issue of the u.n. and where it stands in a modern 21st century. >> i mean, i think one of the things that the u.n. has been emphasizing in the last 10 years or so is that especially in many parts of africa, colonialism didn't die. the neo colonialism of these european actors is very important. it's not not only about european states dealing with things that happened in the colonial period, it's also about how they relate

to african states today. are there development packages formulated according to the needs of local people as oppose tods power brokers in european capitals? that this whole issue about decolonizing isn't about that 20, 30, 50 years ago, it's about more equal opportunities today. many european states are still very reluctant to engage with. >> certainly a very interesting development for southern africa. we have to leave the program. but it's been fascinating speaking to all of you. i'm sure we'll be revisiting this subject in the not too distant future. two of my guests, thank you so much for joining me on this edition of "inside story." and thank you for watching as well. now, you can see all of our previous programs any time by visiting our website at al

jazeera.com. and for further discussion get into our facebook page. that's facebook/ajinsidestory. you can join our twitter at athanasiou ajinsidestory. thank you so much for your time and your company. note. -- ♪ ■x?x■x■x■ñ■o

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