headlines. the court upheld the conviction of genocide. he led forces responsible for the massacre of bosnian muslims. he now faces life in prison. a digital is being held for a terrorist attack. for members of the same family were killed by a driver. >> as canadians, we make a pact with one another that we will look out for each other.

take care of each other. respect each other. for the muslim canadian community, that pact has been broken too many times. it was broken st fall in quebec city. in far too many places across the country. islamophobia israel. -- is real. racism israel. >> the fbi says it developed a device to target criminal organizations. 800 people have been arrested. kamala harris has met with the mexican president to try and tackle poverty in an effort to reduce the number of people from central america migrating to the u.s.. the number of them has

accelerated. peru is still waiting to learn who will be there next president. the conservative rival has 49% of the vote. she is not conceding, alleging fraud with no proof. emmanuel macron has been slapped in the face while visiting a small town. two people have been arrested. you are up-to-date with the headlines. more news coming up right after inside story.

>> can fit corn be trusted? el salvador wants to make it legal tender. what is the future for digital money? this is inside story. welcome to the program. it is just over a decade bitcoin was turned from an idea into one of the most talked about financial assets. every day, more companies sign up to accept it, and say it is the future of money, free from governments and central banks.

the largest cryptocurrency conference in history took place last week in miami, and it was here that el salvador's president announced plans to make his country the first to accept bitcoin as legal tender. 70% of the population don't have access to a bank account. he says his plan will help salvadoreans abroad, particularly in the united states, to send money back on. >> in the short-term, this will generate jobs. in the medium and long-term, we hope this can help us push us in the right direction. >> while some are embracing bitcoin, it is a different story in china. the government has banned it in banks and black accounts promoting digital money. may be the environment. china is home to 70% of the machines that handle or mine cryptocurrency transactions.

it is estimated that use more energy per yeathan all of argentina. state media has accused criminals of using virtual currencies to launder money and trade weapons and drugs. in the u.s., the justice department announced it has recovered most of the bitcoin paid as ransom after hackers shut down oil pipelines last month. the equivalent of or $.4illion was sent to a group called darkside, believes to be based in russia. >> today, we turn the tables on darkside. by going after the entire ecosystem that feels ransomware and digital extortion attacks, including criminal proceeds in the form of digital currency, we will continue to use all of our tools and all of our resources to increase the costs and consequences of ransomware attack's and other cyber enabled attacks.

>> let's bring our guests, an assistant professor in economic law, in london, chair of cybersecurity in the department of computer science at the university of york. and in new york, a journalist and entrepreneur. welcome to you all on the program. i begin with you in new york. a theory for the disenfranchised to be included in a process that will make it easier for them to receive money from abroad without middlemen taking a huge cut. on the surface it seems like a game changer. >> absolutely. the ultimate dream for a lot of bitcoin fans, cryptocurrency fans, with the ability to do remittances. remittances via cryptocurrency are essentially free.

there are still associated fees, but deftly not 50% with a western union. for el salvador to accept bitcoin as its own fee at currency -- fiat currency is vitally important. i could sit here from iphone, not have to worry i'm going to you -- lose transfer fees. that is a game changer for anyone making a little bit of cash. >> why is he proposing it now? >> it was bitcoin miami. there was a conference going on. it is just now becoming more mainstream to be able to pull this off, it is probably cheaper now than ever to pull this off. they might as well do it now.

>> let's go over to amsterdam. while the president has touted this idea which likely will be ratified, how much of a move do you think this is to counter u.s. allegations of corruption, this widening rift between the u.s. to el salvador trying to flex its muscle, help its own people? >> in my opinion, that u.s. is right in the middle. you have one extreme which is to adopt cryptocurrency as they exist, the path el salvador is taking. the other extreme is two cryptocurrencies, which is what numerous countries are doing, and you have the western europe which are regulating existing cryptocurrencies, but at the same time try to grade their own

cryptocurrencies to create a digital euro or digital dollar. is not that extreme or different from el salvador. host: what is your opinion? >> i work mostly in science of cryptocurrencies and bitcoins. my perspective is towards the security, heavy can be legalized in countries. host: can bitcoin be security safe in el salvador? we might not think of it as being first world. >> that is a good question. some of the bitcoin companies

have their own security, and it is hard to know what they are using, because of the ip or other regulations. the point is perhaps el salvador wanted to catch up and be on the same page with. host: u.s. put any pressure on el salvador? the move will allow el salvador from move away from banking systems. will it? potential u.s. oversight. >> what we are talking about is the digital equivalent of filling a suitcase full of cash and sending it over a border. is it legal?

does it have any effect on the fee at economy, i would argue in many cases this is exactly what a poor country should be doing. currency controls are damaging to a lot of countries, a lot of the fears associated with cryptocurrency isn't really a big deal, u.s. about security, as i said, if you stick a bunch of cash in the box and send it to grandma, you are worried someone is going to intercept that could open it up. that means one's grandma gets the cash, she can be swindled out of it. the real question for el salvador -- how are they going to manage taxation of this? one would suspect that at this point, they don't have a good handle on that.

by breaking cryptocurrencies. host: there is not supposed to be one actor by breaking them. could feasibly have more control. i want to come to you in amsterdam. how much of this, the arrival of bitcoin, made established banks rethink the way they have to operate now and in the future? 10 years is a short space of time. >> we have to talk about the technique and of the structure behind the cryptocurrency. security. to some degree, you can say bitcoin is very secure. if you send money, you know that money has been sent to that person. on the other end, if you want to stop transactions, you can say bitcoin is not what you want,

and you may be looking for another type of cryptocurrency. i think this is what we are going to see when states develop their own cryptocurrencies. they will be public, everyone will be able to use it, but it will be permission. only the state or a handful of figures can track all transactions. the infrastructure behind block chain is very important. host: if you want to trust bitcoin as a currency, you have to buy into it as such. that is where the problem lies for the skeptics. successes for those that want to take a chance on it, and it is all about trust. >> that is a big debate. when the person wrote the bitcoin paper, they said bitcoin was a trust lists technology. that is saying it is that is saying it is act of the exact

opposite. you do not have to trust a single person to trust the entire system. but i very much agree with you, it is trust at the end of the day. the same is true for the dollar and euro. it is not that different at the end of the day in that regard. host: a little bit more context. you talk about trust. their different types of cryptocurrency. the cryptocurrencies we mentioned our virtual money that are exchange online. cryptocurrencies derive their value from being scarce. supporters say they are safe havens. than there's organizations like facebook. it's planning to launch digital pay later this year. than there are governments were looking at creating their own digital currencies. electronic cash that can be

used, instead of bank loans checks and credit cards. let me go to london. it is all about trust and the galley of cryptocurrency being a form of money. just to give an example, everyone at home can think of, when you buy a house. and my want to purchase a house in the u.k., when it comes to the bank asking me where my money come from's, they have to do due diligence, as does the lawyer who is organizing the paperwork around the house. they want to see where the money has come from and how long it is sitting in my bank, before they can say yes, it is not part of money laundering. that is where the problem lies, the security aspect. is that a problem in the way people can use bitcoin, security aspect surrounded? >> that's a great question.

one thing we have to pay attention is bitcoin started in 2008. usually, what we consider something secure, a lot of cryptographers have to really study it and do a lot of research. is going to take some time, but inevitably, i think digital currencies are going to replace classic currency as anything else. many years ago when we moved from paper to computer. it is certain. about verification and authentication, these are topics that have been worked on for a long time, and the security around bitcoin and cryptocurrency is not just trust and authentication, that is also

, how can you hack it or break it. so-called hash functions, it is a big open problem. the question about, i think mostly about governments are concerned about the illegal way of using cryptocurrencies, for example. something even without digital currency, this is still going on. it is possible they don't want to be surprised. also, taxation. host: you are nodding in agreement. >> i realize this might be confusing to some listeners.

we hear that everything that happens on the block chain is public, and then every dent -- that we here it is the dream for criminal. the two are truly the same time. what you see on the block chain is the metadata. you will see that one user is transacting with another user, that is public. the reason for the transaction, not necessarily shown on the block chain. for that reason -- at the same time, if you don't have enough information, it might be that bitcoin is more secret than using a credit card. host: these are the red flags being flown at the moment in new york. recent events in china, over the weekend, has bitcoin alert. the collection of bitcoin does

happen in server areas across china. what is your reaction to what is going on there? >> i think it is a ploy by the chinese government to reorganize the face of cryptocurrency. the bitcoin minds are hugely energy intensive. the fact is they run them next to a hydroelectric plant. you're essentially getting free energy to run these things. it making people who are off the radar fairly rich when it comes to that technology. that mission over there is to create a more earth friendly cryptocurrency that can be tracked in the same way we were just talking about. one of the other issues as we are waiting -- governments are trying to figure out a way to pave the road towards general adoption. right now, anyone on this call

can probably grab some bitcoin just by doing the things you need to do on a computer, but the vast majority of people who would really need this technology would not be able to do it. they might not have the technology, might not have the understanding, might not have the trust. i was working on a remittance system a couple of years ago, and the whole idea is based around, you go to a place, sign a piece of paper, if your money over to a clerk, you feel comfortable that that process is safe and secure. that is why you use a western union, money transfer station. this process is completely wild, completely alien, and it seems on its surface, implicitly dangerous. that sort of education is important, host: how difficult it is to track. sometimes the transactions. what has happened in the u.s.

over the colonial pipeline ransomware demands, the recovery of 4.4 -- half of the 4.4 million paid in ransom. certainly raises those red flags. how difficult is it to, you might say, tracked down those that are involved in criminal activity? what sort of expertise with the americans have pulled in to try and get some of this? ? bitcoin back? >> if you can track and trace such digital currencies, it would not satisfied the need or creation. what needs to be answered is there is many research around creating something new, or adding additional parameters or something like that to the whole cryptography part of it, to make

sure it will be adjusted to what governments are concerned of, perhaps prevent some actions taken, or concerns about the criminal aspect. host: in terms of the criminality, the u.s. seems to want to head off bitcoin mining. . examples of what is happened on their own territory alarms them when they're trying to tighten rules for other countries. >> you see clearly a race between some developers in the space. the state is trying to catch up and develop a new technique. at the end of the day, you might be able to track down. it will be more complex if you are an individual going after another user. that is one thing that is

happening in the field, and i very much agree that's not a very important topic, one of aspect. that is where companies taken. facebook will launch a cryptocurrency in a few weeks or months, and it seems the plan is if you download facebook on your phone, you magically get a wallet that will allow you to use the cryptocurrency. it raises lots of questions, especially antitrust questions, those are the two topics i think we should be discussing. host: in terms of countries banning cryptocurrency, do you think that is something that is just going to stay, you might say for the short-term? in the long term, they are going to have to join the party. >> it's a short-term solution. is a solution born of, you can say, frustration.

not understanding technology is often the fastest rd. understanding the implications, especially for currency control. trying to control the economics is wildly difficult. a lot of countries have given up. which is why you see a slow but steady acceptance of cryptocurrency. outright bands never work. they're not going to remain, and i'm 100% certain if we went to morocco right now we would find some bitcoin somewhere. in fact, i could -- host: security has been called

into question. we talk of quantum computers having a very book -- big impact. >> in 2015, the national security agencies in the u.s. made an announcement followed by the national institute standard and technology made a worldwide announcement for proposals. cryptosystems that are secure against the strunk compton computer will be invented. last july, the third round happened and they announced the

finalist of the competition. cryptography. bitcoin or cryptocurrencies are somehow, i kept mentioning about more research has to be done. to attract the trust of the governments, because it is inevitable. the word is out. host: very brief question. what do you say to the skeptics about elon musk. he was singing the praises, now he is pulling back. >> maybe it is not too bad after all, it is if you look at the state level, there is a tension

between trying to keep control and get lots of users which provide security. that potentially is being expressed by the european central bank, they are vocal that they are looking for the best way to design a digital euro. i want to make it clear that the endgame is not just to gain a cryptocurrency, but to only infrastructure for tomorrow. if a state manages a cryptocurrency that will be adopted, it must be the most important of economy power ever owned. host: we shall see. thank you so much for joining us on this edition of inside story. and thank you for watching as well. you can see all of our previous programs by visiting our website. for further discussion go to our facebook page. join the conversation on

twitter. from the inside story team, thanks very much for your time and company. ♪

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