[captioning made possible by democracy now!] 02/22/22 02/22/22 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from new york, this is democracy now! >> i consider it necessary to make a long-overdue decision to immediately recognize the independence of the sovereignty of the donetsk and luhansk people's republic. amy: russian president vladimir putin has sent troops into two separatist regions in eastern ukraine shortly after recognizing them as independent states.

the united nations condemned the move. the biden administration issued new sanctions and germany is moving to halt the approval of russia's nord stream 2 gas pipeline. we will get the latest. then we remember dr. paul farmer, the pioneering public health icon. he died unexpectedly monday at the age of 62. he spent decades building community health networks helping millions of poor people in haiti, rwanda, sierra leone, the u.s., and around the world. >> the system we built in the 80's, confronting tuberculosis, reviled light heavily -- relied heavily, do we expropriate the labor of the poor or do we pay them. i would get paid a fortune to do work like this consulting. we said, no, no, it is clear they have to be our employees and coworkers.

amy: we will hear dr. paul farmer in his own words and speak to one of his longtime colleagues at partners in health. all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. russian troops have deployed to two separatist regions in eastern ukraine after russian president vladimir putin on monday declared them independent states. putin made the announcement from the kremlin during a lengthy speech in which he questioned the legitimacy of ukraine as an independent, sovereign state. >> we demand from those who captured and hold the power in kiev to immediately end the meback activity. otherwise, the possibility of the continuation of the budget will be entirely at the resume

ruling the territory of ukraine. amy: on monday, not a nation secretary-general -- the united nations secretary general condemned putin's decision as a violation of ukraine's territorial integrity and sovereignty, and inconsistent with the principles of the u.n. charter. the u.s. ambassador to the united nations, linda thomas-greenfield, also criticized putin's move during an emergency meeting of the security council. >> he calls them peacekeepers. this is nonsense. we know what they really are. in doing so, he has put before the world we must meet the moment and we must not look away. history tells us that looking the other way in the face of such hostility will be far more costly path. amy: ukrainian president volodymyr zelensky accused russia of violating the minsk agreement and undermining diplomatic efforts to resolve the conflict in eastern ukraine. on monday, the biden administration issued limited new sanctions targeting

investors in the russian-backed separatist regions. meanwhile, germany has announced it is halting the permitting process of russia's massive nord stream 2 gas pipeline. we'll have more on tensions over tensions with ukraine with nina khrushcheva after headlines. in florida, a state senate committee has passed a republican-led bill that would ban almost all abortions after 15 weeks of pregnancy. the legislation now heads to the full florida senate for a vote. the bill makes no exceptions for pregnancies that result from rape or incest and would require two physicians to certify an abortion is necessary to save the pregnant person's life. florida's republican governor ron desantis has called the bill reasonable and supportive of protecting life. he is expected to sign the legislation if it reaches his desk. in an historic victory for reproductive rights, colombia has legalized abortion during

the first 24 weeks of pregnancy. abortion rights advocates gathered outside the colombian constitutional court in the capital bogotá monday evening celebrating as the decision was delivered. >> this is a big achievement, but we want a greater recognition of our full citizenship, more security over our bodies and sexuaand reproductive rights. amy: the dominican republic has begun construction of a wall along the border with haiti. the nearly 13-foot barrier will cover about half of the 244-mile dominican-haitian border. other border enforcement infrastructure will include fiber optics, movement sensors, cameras, radars, drones and over 70 watchtowers. the wall posture yes construction comes as haitian migrants continue to flee extreme poverty, political instability and violence. dominican president luis abinader speaking at the groundbreaking sunday. >> the construction of this

fence will help protect our nation, safeguard the interest of our country, respect our dignity, our freedom, and defend our sovereignty. amy: dr. paul farmer, the world-renowned infectious disease doctor and medical anthropologist, died unexpectedly monday at the age of 62 in rwanda on the grounds of a hospital and university that he helped establish. as a medical student in 1987, paul farmer co-founded the group partners in health to deliver free, quality healthcare to people in haiti. over time, the organization grew into an international network serving patients in many of the poorest parts of the world in dealing with crises from aids to ebola to tuberculosis. later in the broadcast, we'll look back at our interviews with dr. paul farmer over the years and will speak with one of his longtime colleagues at partners for health. mali's parliament has approved a plan that will allow the west african nation's military rulers to remain in power for at least

five more years. all but one member of mali's 121-seat army-dominated legislature approved of the plan monday, which fails to set a date for future elections. mali's military had initially promised elections would be held is month aer it seiz power in an august 2020 coup. a german whistleblower has leaked data on 18,000 accounts showing swiss banking giant credit suisse held hundreds of millions of dollars for dictators, human rights abusers, drug traffickers, arms traders, and others accused of serious crimes. among those named in the msive data late is sa'ad kheir, a former head of the jordanian intelligence service and a key u.s. ally who participated in the cia's extraordinary rendition program. also exposed were former egyptian spy chief omar suleiman, who's been linked to the widespread torture of political dissidents, as well as alaa and gamal mubarak -- sons of former egyptian dictator hosni mubarak.

in argentina, eight separate wildfires in the northeastern corrientes province have scorched nearly 2 million acres destroying farms, pastures, and wildlife. the fires started last month, fueled by strong winds, low humidity, and searing heat and severe drought in a region that normally receives abundant rainfall. the biden administration has paused the sale of oil and gas leases on public lands after a federal judge in louisiana blocked the government from considering the cost of future damage from the climate crisis in its decision making. earlier this month, u.s. district judge james cain, a trump appointee, blocked federal agencies from using a higher value of the social cost of carbon -- a metric that assigns a dollar value to each ton of greenhouse gasses emitted. the justice department has promised to appeal the ruling, which is preventing at least four different agencies from finalizing at least 38 pending environmental rules. in portland, oregon, a

43-year-old man is under investigation for a saturday night shooting that left one person dead and five others wounded at a protest against police killings. witnesses say benjamin jeffrey smith confronted black lives matter terrorists before opening fire within 90 seconds of arriving at the scene. his bullets struck 60-year-old june knightly in the head, killing her. knightly was known as "t-rex" to her friends and was a beloved fixture of portland's lgbtq+ community and racial justice protests. four others were injured by smith's handgun before someone returned fire and injured smith, sending him to the hospital in critical condition. portland's police have not said whether they will charge smith with a crime. the police initially described the killing as a confrontation between an armed homeowner and armed protesters. and long island university has announced the 2021 george polk awards in journalism. the award for national television reporting goes to

"american insurrection," hosted by a.c. thompson and directed by rick rowley. the frontline pbs film documents how the trump presidency has emboldened far-right movements across the u.s. so winng polk awd is ian urbana o"the neworker" f his instigativreportthe secrete prisonthat kee migrantsut of eupe." urbana tls the sry of alu candé, a 28-yr-old faer of threwho fledis faili farm in guinea-bissau trying to reach europe by boat from libya. he was captured at sea by the european union-backed libyan coast guard and jailed at a notorious migrant prison known as al mabani. democracy now! recently spoke with ian urbina about his reporting. >> western and non-western aid groups able to get into these

facilities, what is routinely documented is extortion, rape, torture, and sometimes murder. what we were investigating was a particularly egregious murder in which guards opened fire on migrants and our main character was killed. amy: you can link to our interviews with the polk award winning journalists at our website democracynow.org. you can watch all the interviews and see the transcripts. those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. when we come back, russian president vladimir putin has said troops to two separatist regions in eastern ukraine after recognizing them as independent states. we will speak with the great-granddaughter of soviet premier khrushchev, nina khrushcheva, in a moment. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman in new york, joined by my co-host juan gonzález in new brunswick, new jersey. hi, juan. juan: hi, amy. welcome to all of our listeners and viewers from around the country and around the world. amy: russian president vladimir putin has sent troops into two separatist regions in eastern ukraine shortly after recognizing them as independent states. putin made the announcement on monday during a speech where he questioned the legitimacy of ukraine as a state. >> i consider it necessary to make a long-overdue decision to immediately recognize the independence of sovereignty of donetsk people's republic and luhansk people's republic. amy: the two russian-backed regions had broken away from ukraine in 2014 leading to a conflict that has left 14,000

people dead. while russia supported the separatists eight years ago, moscow did not recognize the self-proclaimed donetsk people's republic and luhansk people's republic as independent states until monday. in recent days, the ukrainian government and russian-backed separatists in the region have accused each other of violating a ceasefire agreement. on monday, a spokesperson for the united nations secretary general condemned putin's decision. >> the secretary-general considers the decision of the russian federation to be a violation of the territorial integrity and sovereignty of ukraine and inconsistent with the principles of the charter of the united nations. amy: during an emergency meeting of the u.n. security council, u.s. ambassador linda thomas-greenfield also criticized putin's move. >> russia's clear attack on territorial integrity is provoked. it is an attack on ukrainian

status u.n. as a number state. ewald is the basic principle of international law and defies our charter. what's more, this move by president putin is clearly the basis for russia's attempt to create a pretext for a further invasion of ukraine. the consequences of this action will be felt far beyond ukraine's borders. amy: russia's u.n. ambassador claimed russia was forced to take action in the donbas region. >> remain open to diplomacy, for a solution. however, allowing a new bloodbath in donbas is something we do not intend to do. the negative role played in all of this by western colleagues led by the united states. instead of forcing kiev to implement its obligations, they had really been openly egging ukraine on, repeating the

meaningless mantra that the obligations under the minsk agreement are not being limited by russia, which he repeatedly underscored is not even a party to the minsk agreement. amy: ukrainian president volodymyr zelensky accused russia of violating the minsk agreement and undermining diplomatic efforts to resolve the conflict in eaern ukraine. on monday, the biden administration issued limited new sanctions targeting investors in the russian-backed separatist regions. more sanctions are expected to be announced today. meanwhile, germany has announced it is halting the permitting process of russia's massive nord stream 2 gas pipeline. the big question is now, what will putin do next? russia has as many as 190,000 troops near the ukrainian border. meanwhile, the united states has sent troops to eastern europe while other nato allies have sent armed shipment ukraine in recent weeks. we are joined by nina khrushcheva, professor of international affairs at the new school. co-author of "in putin's

footsteps: searching for the soul of an empire across russia's eleven time zones" and "the lost khrushchev: journey into the gulag of the russian mind." she is the great-granddaughter of the farmer soviet premier nikita khrushchev. her latest piece for project syndicate is headlined "putin is no nixon." professor, welcome back to democracy now! spoke to you just over a month ago. you are in moscow at the time. can you first respond to the latest developments? the significance of putin's hour-long address yesterday, and declaring the separatist areas of ukraine independent states? >> thank you. a lot has changed in a month. we are still waiting for the big invasion. i want to correct -- not correct, but amend a little bit the statements about the russian

troops going or peacekeepers going into donetsk and luhansk. it hasn't happen yet. the ministry of foign affairs said prominently that there holding on this decision and the separatist leaders said it is their decision when they're going to ask for peacekeing. so in some ways, it does look today that the decision wamade to recognize the republics as independent states, but putin at this point stopped here and could be a sign he is slightly blinking and waiting for further developments on ukrainian side, on the russian side to move forward. so this is something that i find especially important, steps that are being made.

yes, his speech was remarkable in many revisionist versions of history. what is clear in the speech and all the rhetoric was between put forward is that -- ukrainians were not even russians. that is how we see our situation. we are looking at ukraine as a crime state and y deal with your crime state [indiscernible] he did not say these words, but basically -- [indiscernible] a test depend on your kind of diplomacy, political decisions, and so on and so forth. the rhetic was tremendous.

it was a knife at the russians throat, that they were victims. th russia was a victim of ukraine manipulation step ukraine did not exist -- only ists only because they may do so, otherwise -- [indiscernible] so threats could be thatf oracle butlso turn into something -- metaphorical but also turn into something and become military. what i know from moscow- everybody in europe is on edge. oncegain, when we spoke a

month ago, i still don't see the big invasion. i could be washing myouth with soap tomorrow, but uff i think that is what putin's message to the west is that i made my point to this giant rhetoric -- i had to show my prowess but at this point, we still not where joe biden says we are, the next few weeks, putin -- juan: professor, i wanted to ask you, i listened to putin's on c-span, and it seemed to me he was attempting come as you say, revisionist history, but also

raising significant criticisms. he basically blamed lennon for creating this idea that republics of the soviet union had the right of self-determination to secede and that somehow stalin had a much re controlled orientation toward a creation of the soviet union. i am wondering in terms of your great grandfather for decades was the leader of the communist party in ukraine. in fact, it was under khrushchev that the soviet union turned over crimeto ukraine. isn't there some truth to the fact during the soviet period, more territory was added to what is currently the state of ukraine? clearly, the ukrainian people have always existed, but there was a period where ukraine grew as a result of political decision made after world war ii and by the soviet government to increase its size.

what are your thoughts on that? >> thank you. yes, putin is n -- we know he does not like revolution so he does not like the revolion of 1917. he always things rusa c under thesars had more gold and palaces, so that visit given. -- so that is a given. as far as khrushchev, chris jeff was in love with ukraine. he was russian born but he snt a lot of years in donbas, self-proclaimed republic, loved ukraine. you have this wonderful song at the beginning of the program and he would have cried. he was a great fan.

it is a little mythology but became ukrainian was transferred it was 1954. he was the head of the communist party but not the state or the government. there is no signature under any of this documents that transferred ukrainian to the russian federation. it was a mutual decision with his recommendation -- and a jury of purposes. it is much mor [indiscernible] as a villain. one of those reformist leaders

who shed the russian land while people like stalin and now putin , they are putting them together. i think that is important to clarify. regaless of how [indiscernible] legally, ukraine was an independent state. in intertional law, crimea is ukrainian territory so it is donetsk and luhansk. for now, i think putin is willing to stop here. juan: i'm wondering, there was an interesting op-ed piece by thomas friedman in "the new york times" and i'm usually not a fan of his, but he did -- he is one of the few american journalists who has raised in the commercial media what he believes was the grave error of nato to expand

into the former soviet republics in the 1990's. he actually quotes under the column an interview he did back in 1998 with george keenan, the longtime ambassador to russia and who was one of the architects of the containment policy. he says in that interview in 1998 that keenan told him, "i think this is the beginning of a new cold war. i think the russians will gradually react quite adversely and it will affect their policies. i think it is a tragic mistake. there was no reason for this whatsoever. no one was threatening anybody else." that was george keenan back in 1998 about nato's expansion into eastern europe. to what degree do you think this piece is accurate about the

roots of what we are seeing right now? >> thank you. i have met home george keenan, so i don't need friedman to know that. in fact, when keenan was writing that in 199 -- i know this point of view of george keenan firsthand because we spoke about it endlessly many, ny times, what a mistake it is, he was and he knows the russian psyche most of for now they're willing to surrender to united states and western leadership were western policies, but what of the things he said, and he was absolutely right, he acknowledged russian psychology was tremendous. he said russians never follow anybody. so it is a mistake to think when they get stronger, they just go to follow united states and whatever united states does most of russians don't follow.

that is going to be a problem head on. consider it a violation [indiscernible] one of the things american russia shares is the idea that we are benefiting the world. russia, course, most notable quality, russian so equates the measures that man. keenan was. clear of this -- critical of this. explained gorbachev promised not to move an inch. yeltsin promised not to move an inch to the east. th he was told, well, we probably have to move an inch

but it won't be in your lifetime. that is when the meeting [indiscernible] one of the reasons putin is acting up politically, he is the story of land. he would need to go with history, like science. [indiscernible] after the collap of the soviet union in 1991. keenan was very productive of that. -- predictive of th.

[indiscernible] say we are allowed to act the way we act because the west is critical of how we behave. amy: nina khshcheva, 50 years ago yesterday, chinese leader met richard nixon. your latest piece is "putin is no nixon." as we wrap up, if you could briefly comment on the putin -china relationship, the putin -xielationship and how that bears on what is happening now? >> i am not a fan of nixon. soviet union and china have been sort of the bill work against the west together and this relationship first with stalin

was very shaky. back in with khrushchev, it completely fell apart. now we have seen during the olympics that just finished, putin went to beijing. he was posing with xi. they have been signing all sorts of cooperative agreements. so it does seem once again, we are reliving that formula of russia and chi agast the hypocritical west. what i was writing about is while the soviet union was richer and slightly more flaky, cap the upper hand. and now the inese a calling the shots and putin is there to provide political interew -- i think putin will lose in this relationship because china is not going to make up for all the losses the upcoming sanctions

will bring on russia. amy: we want to thank you for being with us and we will continue to cover what is happening in the region. nina khrushcheva, professor of international affairs at the new school. co-author of "in putin's footsteps: searching for the soul of an empire across russia's eleven time zones" and great-granddaughter of former soviet premier nikita khrushchev. we will link to your piece "putin is no nixon." when we come back, we spend the rest of the r remember a dr. paul farmer, the pioneering public health icon has died unexpectedly at the age of 62 in rwanda. we will hear him in his own words and to one of his longtime colleagues. stay with us. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: "haiti" by arcade fire. there has been a big supporter partners in health, having donated a portion of their ticket sales to the group for years. i was at paul farmer's 50th

birthday party wn they cam out and played for the celebration. this is democracy now! i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. we spend the rest of the hour remembering dr. paul farmer, the world-renowned infectious disease doctor and medical anthropologist. he died unexpectedly monday at the age of in rwanda on the 62 grounds of a hospital and university that he helped establish. paul farmer was a professor at harvard medical school and co-founder of partners in health. as a medical student in 1987, he co-founded thgroup to deliver free, quality healthcare to people in haiti. over tim the grouprew into an intertional nwork serng millns of paents in ny of e pooresparts ofhe world dr. faer tirelsly foht for his paents to ceive thsame ce to lifeaving ugs as patien in wealy countrs. dr. paul farmer once said -- "the idea that some lives matter less is the root of all that is wrong with the world."

farmer's work helped change how healthcare was delivered throughout the world. partners in health ceo sheila davis said in a statement -- "paul farmer's loss is devastating, but his vision for the world will live on through partners in health. paul taught all those around him the power of accompaniment, love for one another, and solidarity." former president bill clinton said on monday -- "paul farmer changed the way health care is delivered in the most impoverished places on earth. he saw every day as a new opportunity to teach, learn, give, and serve -- and it was impossible to spend any time with him and not feel the same." the writer tracy kidder wrote about farmer's work in his 2003 book "mountains beyond mountains: the quest of dr. paul farmer, a man who would cure the world." paul farmer appeared on democracy now! numerous times over the past 20 years. later in the show, we will speak with one of his longtime colleagues at partners for health. but first, let's turn to paul in his own words speaking in 2008 on democracy now about his

early work in haiti. >> for me it was an epiphany to go -- 25 years ago to go to haiti and i was lucky enough to end up in a squatter setement. the choices were stark. either health was a commodity that was bought and sold by the people that i went there to serve, naïve but well-meaning young person or out of the picture. that began a lifelong fascination with rights not just of the right to vote or other civil and political rights but also the right to eat and have access to health care. amy: talk about how you decided on this place called cange and a central haiti. how you found it, how you began to build the hospital system you have there. >> as is often the case, and i

try to encourage students -- i teach students. i tell them, "look, you never know what's going to happen." and it was really a series of serendipitous accidents. i met a haitian priest, and he was working in a nearby town. and he told me about this squatter settlement where people were living in lean-tos. and he was focused on education and said, "look, you're going to be a doctor. why don't you come and be part of this?" and so that was 25 years ago. we started with a small group of young people my age going from village to village asking people in their home, so what is it that you would see as an appropriate health care system? and some people kind of laughed at us, saying, "well, what do you" -- you know, and a little but archly -- "well, what do you think?" they would usually say "a , hospital. we want a hospital." and we had in mind, you know, a system of a small community health clinic and a system of

satellites. and they wanted a hospital. they wanted a good hospital, a hospital -- someone said to me in 1984, where if you have trouble having a baby, you could actually have someone save your life. i knew just what that mean, of course -- meant, of course. and, you know, over the years, with a lot of help from people, mostly in haiti, but north america, we built a hospital, and it's a big hospital now. amy: primarily treating what? >> well, you know, we primarily do not treat infectious diseases, although i think we have a reputation of taking on aids, tb, malaria. we treat whatever comes in -- a broken arm, obstructed labor, you know, the things that you see out in the rural countryside in africa or haiti. but in the mid-1990's, i must say, just shortly after we built -- finished -- we built the hospital in a very difficult time, during a coup, and those were very hard years, 1991 to 1994. you were already involved in reporting on that.

but we did get the hospital done. and by the mid-1990's, we once looked to see, ok, how many people in this hospital have aids or hiv infection? and it was up to 40% at one point. so we said, at that time -- i was going between harvard and haiti. i was being trained as an infectious disease specialist at harvard and, you know, it is right around the corner to haiti. so i'd get off the plane on one side and i'd be begging my american patients, "you've got to take these pills, these aids cocktails," and i'd get off on the other side and they'd be begging meor the same medicines. so we spent a couple of years saying there's got to be a way to deliver the same services to people living in haiti. and, you know, it took a long time to get that support. we started in 1998. and we actually called it, somewhat sassily, the hiv equity program because we knew it would be a fight for equity from the beginning and we knew it would be a fight for basic rights, as well.

amy: and yet you say that in some places in haiti, they're getting better health care than the united states? >> i know it is true. it is not really an assertion. ronic disease -- aids is a good example, you need to take -- diabetes, insulin diabetes. to take medicine every day. whether that be a nitro -- and try -- retroviral, but in the 1980's coming confronting tuberculosis, relied heavily on community health workers. and more to the point, we paid. you know, we thought, you know, do we expropriate the labor of the poor, or do we actually pay them, like someone like i would get paid a fortune to do consulting work like this. and we said no, no, no, it's clear they have to be our employees and coworkers. so it worked great. and it worked great for tuberculosis.

it worked great for other chronic diseases. and when aids came along, what we did was to say, well, clearly, we need to take the same system, wch is free diagnosis and free care to the patient because this is a public health problem, and they have a community health worker, you know, visiting them. and so what i see in this city, for example in new york, i'm told they're contemplating adopting ts model. i hope it happens. what we did was to bring the haiti model up to boston. you know, and i got in a little bit of trouble with some of my colleagues. they were saying, "well, all we're trying to do is raise harvard levels of care up to haiti levels," because the outcomes were much better because they weren't lost to follow-up. that's medical jargon. in the united states, you get someone who's really sick with a chronic disease -- either of those two diseases i mentioned, for example, would be true -- and then they're sent home, but they don't have the appropriate support in, as they say here, in the community.

and so then they get sick again. they go back to the emergency room. maybe they don't ha insurance, maybe they don't speak english, maybe they have housing insecurity -- this is the united states -- but like haitians, they have social problems and our medical system doesn't deal with those problems well. and so the care can be better in rwanda and haiti than what we're seeing here. amy: i want to come back here because your analysis is not just a medical diagnosis, but it is an analysis of the healthcare system -- and that's ultimately what you're challenging. >> well, my diagnosis of our healthcare system's problems is that it's very expensive to give bad medical care to poor people in rich country. very expensive to give bad medical care to poor people in a rich country. and i can give example after example from my own clinical experience working in, you know, the best hospitals i've ever seen in the world. and like i said, when they're in the hospital, things go ok.

but we do not have a good safety net. we don't have a good primary healthcare system. and to get into the hospital, the uninsured -- 47 million people, maybe 50 million -- they have to pass through an emergency room, waste time, and things happen to them there that probably shouldn't because they're primary healthcare problems, they're in an emergency room. and top of that 47 million, probably just as many americans are poorly insured and can be thrown into destitution by serious illness. so, you know, there's 100 million americans who are in -- are not -- they don't have health security. they don't know that a devastating illness could not wipe out their savings or make them lose their home. they may know that. i hope they do. amy: that is paul farmer speaking in 2008 on democracy now! he died unexpectedly on monday

at the age of 62. today we are remembering his life and legacy asset pioneering public health icon who spent decades building community health networks and helping millions of people in haiti, rwanda, sierra leone, and other countries. joined now by one of his longtime friends and colleagues dr. joia mukherjee infectious , disease specialist and chief medical officer for partners in health where she worked with dr. paul farmer for 23 years. she is also an associate professor of global health at harvard medical school. i want to start off, our deepest condolences to you and to the partners in help family and paul's family extended well beyond that stuff i mean, his nuclear family, but to the world, whichs who he considered his family. can you talk more about how he died? what you understand happened on the hospital grounds in rwanda? and then talk about his

significance. >> first of all, amy, thank you, and the whole democracy now! staff for your coverage of the important issues that paul cared about for such a long period of time and for all the condolences and wishes and of course we are guided by this loss --gutted by this loss. i can speak too much about how paul died. we are trying to be respectful of the family and he died peacefully. we know that. he did have some heart trouble, which we know about. what it means to us is just a deep, deep sorrow. a sorrow for the whole world. people who did not know the extraordinary mean that he was, he , frs is with --

re'guest with enthusiasm d jofor svice aellowsp that w uaralled. at the same time, he had impossibly high standards. we all learned to live with that , high standards for medicine that everyone should get a first world care, that there is no first, second, and third world. high standards for dignity. all of the hospitals that paul was part of constructing our beautiful. they have gardens and fish ponds. he felt there should not be squalor in healing, which is so often the case in poor communities that the health centers and hospitals are just in deplorable condition.

what we are remembering today, and we will remember, is that the two things that paul gave us were this enormous community of people that he brought to this large table that is now global health social medicine, social justice. young people around the world who have joined this mission, wealthy contributors, incredibly dedicated hospital staff, cleaners, drivers the doctors, nurses -- he gave us this great community, expansive community. the second thing you gave us, and your clip is testament to that, amy, he gave us a roadmap. he was prolific in writing and speaking. incredibly clear in the idea of equity and justice for everyone.

so i do feel grateful that we know what to do to honor his legacy, to love one another, to care for the sick, to fight for higher, fair standards. it is a very radical notion but he has broken it down for us play-by-play, if you will. and i think we will honor that vision and that work by following that great roadmap. juan: doctor, could you talk about how you first met him and how you came to work with him? also, about partners in heah, which now has about8,000 people around the world. how did that grow to such an extent? >> i came to the work in the late 1990's as a very frustrated aids activist and doctor, having

seen what paul sought, a miracle of therapy and the absolute disinterest from powerful people -- from the development complex -- to make that treatment available to the 95% of people who were living with aids in the rest of the world i'm of large majority in africa. everyone said it was too hard, too costly. racist things like africans can't tell time, just ridiculous set of narratives that i had heard in my work in africa before joining partners in health as a young doctor, over and over again, but it wasn't what i saw on the ground. ahead incredibly intelligent friends whose lives had great meaning in their families and communities. so i met paul because they were

treating a handful of patients in haiti with and try -- antiretroviral therapy that was donated from patients who were changing medicine, unexpired drugs. sing at least we can do this. i did not have the vision that paul had that this pragmatic solidarity, as he called it, could also be world changing. now i do. aids activists around the world from act up in new york to the treatment action campaign in south africa to uganda, they saw what we were doing in haiti as a roadmap. we started to join forces together to really call for this universal access to aids treatment, even though there was no funers -- universal access dell care at all. i met him in this way. it was the only place that haiti

was one of the only places in the world that was offering treatment for free to the destitute sick. so that was 23 years ago. amy: doctor, i want to go paul in his own words. he worked in rwanda for many years. in 2013, he appeared on democracy now! spoke about his work. >> the work in rwanda has been uplifting for parts and health, for me and our partners from harvard in part because we made a bet 10 years ago that if we could as a collective take this model -- i will call it accompaniment, talking about rebuild system that has hospitals, clinics -- if we could go to a place with great need, especially infectious diseases that we know a lot about on our team, post-conflict setting, maybe one even written

off as hopeless, but with a government committed to rolling out basic services in health and education to poor people in rural areas. if we could find all that, we would see something miraculous happened in the course of a decade. and we did. that is why we went to rwanda. we went with the clinton foundation and other partners and work with the ministry of health in rwanda. it is been the most rewarding decade in my life as a doctor just to see first lafortune, how quickly it can happen. just to give you some numbers, the life expectancy in rwanda probably has doubled over the last 10 years. the declines in mortality, especially among children, women in childbirth, among those who already have tuberculosis, malaria, and aids, these are the steepest declines ever recorded in human history. amy: explain what you did. >> we worked with the rwandans

come as too many other people -- i'm not suggesting -- there are many other groups but the key is working with the public sector the people have the right dell care, they will be -- we were to build a system and the system stretches from community health workers to clinics when the majority of care is given is run by nurses . we help with three of the hospitals, including even starting a cancer center, probably the first cancer center in rural africa anywhere. but it all fit into a system. there called vertical programs stop aids program or family-planning program. those are vertical programs. what the authorities in rwanda said, we want this vertical programs to strengthen our

health system, are rwanda national health system. and we did do that and we were pushed to do that. the result -- i think that is why that decline is more stupor in rwanda and other places and why it is the only country in sub-saharan africa on track to be all of the health-related millennium develop goals. and because that was dr. paul farmer in 2013. i last interviewed him in the midst of the pandemic, december 2020 when his new book "fevers, feuds, and diamonds" had just come out. we talked about the pandemic, how is possible at the time for the united states to have nearly 20% of the world's infections and deaths, while having less than 5% of the world's population. this was his response. we are facing the consequences of decades and decades of underinvestment in public heal

and of centuries of misallocion of funds away from those who need that help most. and, you know, all the social pathologies of our nation come to the fore during epidemics. and during a pandemic like this one, we're going to be showing the rest of the world, warts and all, how -- we have shown the rest of the world how badly we can do. and now we have to rally, use new tools that are coming online, but address some of the older pathologies of our care delivery system and of our country. i think that's where we are right now. juan: that was paul farmer speaking about the pandemic just a couple of years ago. he always referred to partners in health as the house of yes. what did he mean by that? >> i think we all know that poor people face so many barriers to

having good health. starting withdequate housing, lack of sanitation, water. but even getng to the hospitals being in deplorable conditions, not having access to modern medicine. if we are to follow paul's radical vision for health as a human right, which we will, the house of yes saying "yes, we can do this" and then figuring out how and designing a system that can do it for others. i'll just talk briefly about one young man that came to an ebola treatment unit in sierra leone with a giant cancer in his neck. normal response would be, no, we are treating ebola here, go somewhere else. but we know there is no somewhere else, so we said, yes,

we will try to take care of you. by hook or crook through providing chemotherapy, waiting it out, transferring him to other places, he now has graduated from high school and is completely cured of his cancer. that house of yes is to say, we are here care for one another on this earth and we are going to try talways say yes and trying to figure it out. amy: where you go from here, dr. joia mukherjee? what are the projects? and will there be a memorial service for paul? >> we are still waiting for details on the memorial service from his family. we are in very close touch with his wife didi and his children and we will be working on that together. where we go, follow a roadmap that paul gave us. he died in a place that he loved and adod, which was rwanda,

but particularly having spent time with medical students there, the new medical school that we built, the university of global health equity. we are starting a second university of go health equity in haiti. i think building this vanguard of social justice and human dignity and health around the world is what -- continue to do but expand the trning and invocation of these important principles. amy: dr. joia mukherjee, thank you for being with us. again, our deepest condolences. dr. mukherjee is an infectious disease specialist and chief medical officer for partners in health where she worked with dr. paul farmer for 23 years. she is also an associate professor of global health at harvard medical school. see all of our interviews with paul farmer, you can go to democracynow.org to read about

him. there's a netflix film "bending the arc." democracy now! is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed captioning. e-mail your comments to outreach@democracynow.org or ma