04/14/22 04/14/22 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from new york, this is democracy now! >> moments ago, frank robert james was stopped on the street and arrested by members of the new york city police department. he will be charged with committing yesterday's appalling crime. amy: in new york, a massive manhunt has ended with the arrest of a 62-year-old man accused of shooting 10 passengers on a subway car in brooklyn. he faces federal terrorism charges.

the suspect, frank james, has described himself as someone who was once locked up for mental health issues. we will speak to psychology professor andrew solomon. >> i think is a profound problem in the united states, that we continue to treat until help as a public safety issue rather than as a matter of providing equality and dignity to people who are experiencing a disability. amy: finland and sweden are considering joining nato move , a that was unthinkable to many before russia invaded ukraine. >> we have to analyze the situation to see what is best for sweden's security, for the swedish people in this new situation. you should think it very seriously. amy: we will speak with the swedish peace activist. plus, we go to lviv, ukraine, to look at how the war has

displaced more than 11 million people, including two-thirds of ukraine's children. all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. russia's military's as a captured more than 1000 ukrainian marines after they surrendered wednesday. video was broadcast on russian state tv and appeared to show ukrainian soldiers marching with their nds up. ukrainian officials have not verified russia's claim of the mass surrender. russian troops have moved into the city center of mariupol, where some 100,000 civilians remain trapped with no power, water, telephone, or internet access and whittling supplies of medicine and food. this is a resident who survived weeks of heavy assault. >> why are they killing us?

why are they destroying us? why do this to our houses? three 10 story buildings were burned completely. people are sitting in the basement. there is no sewer. plastic tubes started burning. 19 people are dead. and he can't thursday, that mayor of mariupol accused russian troops are bringing mobile crematoria to the city to burn the bodies of civilians killed during russia's assault. meanwhile, russia's black sea naval flagship has been heavily damaged in an explosion. russia claims a fire aboard the vessel caused ammunition to explode. ukraine says it launched a successful missile attack on the ship and the black sea. on thursday, the biden ministtion authorid another $800 million in new mitary aid to ukraine, including armored personnel carriers. the head of the world health organization says the world is

failing to treat humanitarian crises in countries like ethiopia and yemen with the same concern provided to the people of ukraine. dr. tedros anhanom ghebreyesus, spoke during wednesday's weekly who press briefing in geneva. >> the attention to ukraine is very important. of course, because it impacts the whole world. but even a fraction of it is not being given to yemen, afghanistan, syria, and the rest. a fraction. and i need to be blunt and honest that the world is not treating e human race the same way. amy: he's originally from ethiopia and said a three week old humanitarian cease-fire and at the country itgray region has failed to prevent widespread starvation. he sent 2000 trucks were needed to supply millions with food and medicine but only about 20

trucks have so far arrived. in south africa, the death toll from heavy flooding around the city of durban has risen to more than 300 in what south africa's president cyril ramaphosa called a "catastrophe of enormous proportions" and a "part of climate change." the disaster struck as parts of kwazulu-natal province received several months' worth of rain in a single day, triggering landslides that trapped people under buildings and floodwaters that swept away bridges and houses. this is a durban resident who managed to save his children but lost all his possessions to the floods. >> know where go now. i've got nothing. the situation is very, very bad. amy: in britain, more than two dozen scientists used superglue to attach research papers and their own hands to the windows of a government building in london on wednesday, the latest in a series of climate protests led by scientists and the group extinction rebellion.

the protest at the u.k. department for business, energy and industrial strategy came after the united nations warned countries must rapidly curb their use of fossil fuels to prevent average global temperatures from increasing by more than 1.5 degrees celsius. this is cardiff university ecologist dr. aaron thierry. >> i am having to do this because they are basically ignoring all the evidence. we have tried all the rational evidence-based approaches. the government is in saint i don't know what else to do other than this to try to get the attention we need to wake up the public. amy: in another protest on wednesday, extinction rebellion activists occupied the shell oil company's london headquarters, supergluing themselves to the building's entrances and reception desk to demand a meeting with shell's ceo. last week, the u.k. government unveiled a new energy strategy that calls for more north sea oil and gas development and a larger role for nuclear power.

the u.k. is also considering ending a moratorium on fracking that's been in place since 2019. in new york massive manhunt , a ended wednesday when authorities arrested a 62-year-old man who is accused of shooting 10 passengers on a subway car in brooklyn. at least 13 other people were injured in the attack, which began after the gunman released two smoke grenades in a crowded train during morning rush hour on tuesday. the suspect, frank james, was arrested shortly after calling a police tip line saying he was in a mcdonald's restaurant in manhattan. federal authorities have charged the 62 year old with carrying out a terrorist attack on a mass transit system. if convicted, he could face life in prison. police have not yet established a motive for the attack. in video posted online, james himself described himself as the person who was once locked up for middle health issues. more on this story after the headlines. the u.s. centers for disease

control has extended a mask mandate for all public transit passengers through may 3. the biden administration has come under increasing pressure from republicans, airline executives, and business leaders who want to allow the mask mandate to expire. on thursday, the biden administration formally extended the u.s. coronavirus public health emergency for another 90 days. despite the declaration, many people without health insurance report they're being charged $100 or more for coronavirus tests and may face hospital bills for covid treatment after congress allowed emergency pandemic aid to lapse. kentucky's republican-led legislature has voted to effectively outlaw abortion. on wednesday, kentucky's general assembly voted to override democratic governor andy beshear's veto of a bill that bans distribution of abortion pills by mail and creates onerous requirements for clinics that reproductive rights groups say will make it impossible to

access abortion services in kentucky. the law has no exceptions for people who become pregnant by rape or incest. separately, kentucky republicans overrode governor beshear's vote of a bill that bans trans girls from athletics in public schools. a warning to our audience, our next story contains graphic footage and descriptions of police violence. in michigan, the grand rapids police department has released video showing the fatal shooting of patrick lyoya, a 26-year-old man, african-american, killed by a white police officer during a traffic stop last week. lyoya died after the officer, who has not been named, wrestled him to the ground, kicked and hit him, attempted to taser him, pinned him on his stomach before pulling his pistol and firing a single round into lyoya's head.

attorney ben crump, who is representing lyoya's family, said the video shows unnecessary and excessive force. he called for the officer to be fired and prosecuted. police have said the officer will not be publicly identified unless prosecutors bring criminal charges. ahead of the video's release, activists took their protests to tuesday night's meeting of the grand rapids city commission, demanding all the officers involved in the killing be named and held accountable. >> i am ashamed, humiliated. the shame the city, my only home, brought death to this young man who came here with dreams for a future. you should be ashamed. you should be weeping. you should want to turn loose all of the association with the city government, the sham of a city government because you're supposed to preserve and improve the life of the residents of this place and instead the folks are obligated and under your responsibility allowed for the extinguishing of a life instead. you share the blame.

the blood is on your hands, too. amy: michigan governor gretchen whitmer has promised an independent investigation of the shooting by state police. the justice department has agreed to settle four cases brought by black lives matter activists who were brutally cleared from a peaceful protest outside the white house just days after the murder of george floyd. on june 1, 2020, then-attorney -- police beat and tear gassed peaceful protesters gathered in lafayette park after then attorney general william barr cleared a path for president trump to walk to the nearby st. john's episcopal church for an infamous photo op holding a bible. as part of a settlement announced wednesday, the u.s. park police will update policies requiring that officers wear visible identifiers and will require officers to attempt de-escalation tactics before any moves to deploy so-called less lethal weapons. texas governor greg abbott is facing mounting criticism over

his new policy ordering state authorities to inspect commercial vehicles crossing the state's border with mexico after the vehicles have already been checked by federal inspectors. abbott's plan for so-called enhanced inspections has caused massive gridlock at the border delaying shipments of food and other products. the governor of mexico's chihuahua state said the delays harmed the economies of both countries. >> texas received more than 3 llion cargo trucks each year from mexico. the delay delivers represents millions in losses in both perishable foods and serious damage to the supply chain for the u.s. and mexican industries. amy: on wednesday, governor abbott said he would ease inspections at one border crossing afterexican officials agreed to increase border security. meanwhile, in a political stunt, governor abbott bussed about

three dozen asylum seekers from texas to washington, d.c. the migrants were dropped off wednesday near the headquarters of fox news, which had live cameras on the scene to cover their arrival. one immigrant rights advocate described the governor's actions as "deliberate cruelty that treats human beings like pawns." and in breaking news, elon musk has made a $43 billion bid to buy the social media giant twitter. earlier this month, he disclosed he had taken a more than 9% take in twitter but this latest bid would make musk twitters primary owner and would take the company private. musk is the world's richest person with a net worth estimated at $265 billion. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i ammy goodman, joined by my co-host nermeen shaikh. hi, nermeen.

rmeen: hi, amy. welcome to all of our listeners and viewers from around the country and ound the world. amy: we begin today's show in new york, where police have arrested a man in connection to tuesday's subway shooting. 62-year-old frank james was apprehended after he himself called the city's crimestoppers line and told them his location at a manhattan mcdonald's. also, it was after bystanders said they saw james on the street and alerted officers. this is zack tahhan, a 21-year-old syrian immigrant and his cousin mo cheikh. he said they were repairing a camera system at a hardware store when they spotted james. >> we tell the police, this is the guy. this is the guy that was the problem -- >> we were like between 70% to 80% sure it was him. we pull up the picture on our phones and saw the picture. we confirmed between the three

of us, oh, that is the guy. 100% sure that is him. amy: police accuse frank james of shooting 10 passengers on a subway car in brooklyn. at least 13 other people were injured in the attack, which began after the gunman released two smoke grenades in a crowded train during morning rush hour tuesday. he is being charged in federal court with violating a law against terrorist and other violent attacks on mass transit. he faces life in prison. a motive behind the shooting is still unknown. james had a youtube channel where he posted videos railing about racism, violence, and his struggles with mental illness. including what he called the horror show of new york city's mental health services. youtube has since taken down the channel. this is a clip of frank james and opposed from when he said he was heading to new york. >> heading back to the danger

zone, so to speak. you know, triggering a lot of negative thoughts of course because i do have bad severe case of posttraumatic stress after the [beep] i've been through. amy: frank james also lashed out at new york city mayor erica adams in his videos. after tuesday's tack, mayor adams vowed to deploy more police patrols and expand mental health outreach programs to combat violence. this is mayor adams speaking on new york 1. >> first of all, being angry does not give you the right to enter our subway system, discharge 33 rounds, striking 10 people, answering 16 because of your actions. you don't have that right. i m not going to succumb to any person who believes they can attempt to harm neworkers beuse they are angry. if failure of those with mental

health, homelessness them the failure of our educational system did not start january 2022. we have abandoned and betrayed new yorkers for years. that betrayal is going to stop. i am committed to doing so. amy: for more, we're joined by andrew solomon, professor of clinical medical psychology at columbia university. award-winning author of several books on mental illness, including "far from the tree: parents, children and the search for identity" and his widely acclaimed memoir "the noonday demon: an atlas of depression." professor solomon, if you could start off by talking about your take away from the bar that took place over the last two days but also these videos that were posted by the suspect who repeatedly talked about the mental health hell that he confroed? >> i think it is difficult to

make a clear diagnosis of the perpetrator of these horrific crimes on the basis of what he has put forward, but he says he has been in the mental health system and has experience of it. there is no question you have to be at least unhinged debtor take the kind of attack that he did and what he is done represents a lapse inental-health. the misfortune is we seem to talk about mental health of though it were a mental health -- it were not a matter of assuaging the acute suffering of people who have delusions or hallucinations or an unclear leader grasp -- unclear grasp of reality, which it also is. nermeen: could you talk specifically about what the difficulties are of people accessing mental health care in general in new york city? >> access to mental health care in new york city is really

disgraceful. there were big institutions that were closed down in the 1970's and 1980's. those institutions were horrific. the best known is willowbrook. people saw the appalling footage taken that show people chained to beds and sitting in their own excrement and so on and so forth. those large institutions would be closed down and in their place, there would be community care. the community care was never established so now we have hospitals with people in a state of extreme illness and you have to check yourself in unless you are to be a harm to yourself or others. essentially, those hospitals warehouse people so they are not out on the streets dealing with these issues but they warehouse people temporarily. they are effective at preventing people from dying by suicide because that means to do so are confiscated. there is very little therapy. what does not seem to exist at all are adequate proams to

take people who have been in hospitals and reintegrate them into the general community. nermeen: also, andrew, what are the communities that are most vulnerable to mental illness and who have the most difficult time accessing treatment? you have talked about even in her most recent piece in "the new yorker" you have spoken of how difficult it often is even for the most affluent to access adequate health care. >> well, it certainly is difficult to adequately get health care for children, which is what i was writing about. but such care does exist tends to go to people who are privileged, not only economically but also an education and who know how to argue with doctors who do not want to treat their children and who know who to call to get the

best standard of mental health. the quality mental health care for people in poverty, particularly for people of color, has been terrible. representative coleman, leading member of the congressional black caucus, introduced a mental health equity act of 2020 which was to improve block access to mental health services across the country. installed in committee. amy: i want to read the beginning of the piece from the daily beast which says, "the man sought by the nypd on tuesday subway suiting recorded a video message to mayor adams in which he said he had been through the city's mental health system and experienced a kind of emotional violence that would make someone "go and get a gun mefers'." if you can talk about what this means and what needs to happen now, dr. solomon? particularly not in your across

the country -- i don't know if we can even say come out of this pandemic, but what is happened in the last few years? >> what has happened has exasperated underlying problems of mental health a done so through a number of mechanisms, the primary has been people getting sick and dying. the secondary one has been the isolation in which people have been operating. along with that isolation, the forced intimates with people with whom they have sheltered or quarantined during the pandemic. there is a sense of instability in the world which is to do with the pandemic and black lives matter and ukraine and other things going on -- all of these forms of instability are likely to exacerbe underlying mental health conditions. many mental health problems result from the conjunction of an underlying vulnerability to mental health problems and external circumstances that trigger those problems. that does not explain everything

but it explains many of these problems. at the moment, the stimuli are enormous and mental health services remain available only to a relatively small, elite. otherwise who have institutions that as i said, are really cruel places. somebody who is an expert in the field and was at the national institute of mental health said the worst place you can go if you're feeling suicidal is a public mental health facility. it will push you the rest of the way toward that feeling. of course, suicide and homicide are closely related. often the people who commit homicide are expressing their own despair, their own internal mental health problems, as well as expressing anger and hatred and bias. nermeen: andrew, could you explain what we know about -- you gestured at this in your response right now -- about what causes a mental illness, in particular, severe illness to what extent environmental

factors are responsible and to what extent unavoidable biological or chemical factors are? >> almost everyone has some degree of biological vulnerability to mental illness. the question is whether it is a low threshold in which they are extremely vulnerable to mental illness -- in which case the triggering sternal circumstances can be quite trivial -- or someone who is rigidly prone. almost always the result of a conjunction between external stimuli and internal vulnerability. that being said, there are some people who are just chemically or physically or biologically programmed, it was seen coming to mental illness. we don't yet understand the mechanisms of that programming that we do know it exists. nermeen: what are some of the misconceptions about people who are mentally ill? the coalition of the homeless has found the large majority of people, at least in the city,

new york city, have some form of mental illness. experts say rather than what people fear that those who are mentally ill are more likely to be prone to violence, that in fact, according to this coalition and experts, homeless people who are mentally ill are more likely to be subject to violence. >> only between 3% and 4% of violent crime in united states is committed by people who are suffering from mental illness. it is a very small proportion overall of crime. but people with the illness more likely to commit crimes that seem strange and inexplicable to onlookers because they're often guided by delusions rather than by greed or avarice or rage or any of the other qualities that motivate the rest of violent crime. to treat people who are mentally ill as criminals ahead of the

time that they actually do anything would be a gross injustice. most mentally ill people will never commit a crime in matter what the mental illness is that they have. but there are some people with mental illness w do commit crimes. and a lot of them would not commit those crimes if th were receiving adequate some art. if they were being treated as the amicus with this bill the act requires, if they were being treated for the illness and being treated as disabled people and experience rights and privileges that go along with disability as well as the liberation that has existed in the disability rights movement. amy: andrew solomon, i would ask about the clearing of homeless encampments here in new york city and across the country. do you see mental illness being transformed into a criminal problem, as something to be dealt with by police? for example, after this, the natural reaction after this

attack is to say, the money is just going to pour into police department across the country. your response to this? >> well, in the first place, it is important somebody be out there paying attention to what people are posting on youtube. there was a lot of evidence that thisan was going to be involved in something troubling and nobody was paying attention and nobody did anything. on a larger scale, criminalizing the mentally ill -- because somebody ill people commit crimes, is not so far away from criminalizing members of racial minorities because some people who are in racial minorities commit crimes. or people in the other category you would care to name. our primary focus has to be on helping people with mental illness function and providing context for them, medical context, ongoing context in which they can be helped to function as well as they would like to function rather than

abandoning them until something like this happened. there is an upsurge in calls for mental health services every time there is a major rapid crime come every time there is a school shooting, every time there is what appears to be a group suicide, every dutch there are people saying, we have to have better mental health services. we do but those can be provided by the police. at the moment, the institution in the unite states has seen a large number of mentally ill people as correctional system of the state of california. doesn't really seem like an appropriate setting for these people? the treatment you would have some complexity and expense would result in a sense not only a better public safety but of people entering the functioning economy in the functioning world are currently marginal to it. so trading these people make sense, not only primarily from a public safety standpoint but makes sense in terms of having a

functional system in a functional country in which people are able to contribute what they have to contribute. and go very quickly, we do not want to end before addressing the piece you wrote in "the new yorker, "mystifying rise of child suicide." summarize it for us. >> the age of suicide has been steadily coming down for the last at least 15 years and probably for much longer. the rate of suicide among young people has been going up. it was badly exacerbated by the pandemic. the number of suicide attempts among adolescents was roughly double in 2020 what it was in 2019. i talked to a number of families with lost children to suicide. the rate is going that must rapidlymong black children. there is a rate increase going on there. the stories are desperate and heartbreaking. there was one story i came across of a girl who was five years old who hanged herself with her jump rope, leaving

behind a note that said "i am sad for what i do." what has happened to our society that children are able to conceptualize suicide but were significantly has happened that has allowed them to be successful in attempting to follow through with it? a lot is access to means. we are more guns but more videos online that will show you how to kill yourself if you want to. when i was five, i would not have known how to tie a noose or hang myself. because we have a romanticized vision of childhood, we propose children cannot really get to the point of suicide, that children don't really do these things. but they do and they do and in greater numbers. the numbers have skyrocketed for adolescents where the problem is really an acute and cultured one. amy: andrew solomon, thank you for being with us, professor of clinical medical psychology at columbia university. author of several books on mental illness, including "far from the tree: parents, children and the search for identity" and

"the noonday demon: an atlas of depression." we will link to your piece "mystifying rise of child suicide." next up, we look at finland and sweden. they're considering joining nato, a move unthinkable to many before russia invaded ukraine. we will speak with the leading swedish peace activist. stay with us. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: "sleepless nights" by terrace martin, robert glasper, 9th wonder, and kamasi washington. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. the farmer russian president dmitry medvedev is warning russia may deploy nuclear weapons in the baltic region if sweden and finland join nato.

medvedev said -- "there can be no more talk of any nuclearfree status for the baltic, the balance must be restored." his comments come one day after the prime ministers of sweden and finland spoke together about the nationpossiblyoining nato, a move many thought was unthinkable before russia invaded ukraine. finland shares an 830 mile border with russia. this is finnish prime sanna -- prime minister sanna marin. >> we have deepened our nato partnership until now, hand-in-hand with sweden, ever since russia is legally annexed crimea post of the difference between being a partner and being a member is very clear and will remain so. there is no other way to have security guarantees and under nato's trends and, defense is guaranteed by nato's article 5. amy: the swedish prime minister magdalena andersson also spoke

wednesday in stockholm. she is sweden's first female prime minister. >> went analyze the situation to see what is best for sweden's security, for the swedish people in this new situation. we should not rush into that. we should make it very seriously. amy: it is the first time there is a swedish and finnish prime minister that are both women. we go now to sälen, sweden, where we are joined agnes hellström, president of the swedish peace and arbitration society. some say it is the oldest in the world, founded in 1883. welcome to democracy now! your response? this is incredible -- even sing these two women, which is historic, they are standing there saying they want to join this military alliance, nato. if you can respond? >> well, we are against the

swedish membership in nato and therefore as a feminist and extra sad the steps were taken so quickly noteworthy membership. the main reason we don't think it would make us safer or the world more secure, it would make us part of the nuclear doctrine and the possibly to be a voice would be decreased. nermeen: agnes, could you talk about whether since the russian invasion of ukraine, popular public support for joining nato has increased and swindling -- sweden as it has an finland, almost 70% of finns support joining nato. >> yes, the recent debate in sweden has been very narrow and prone nato i would say, but the polls -- they still don't show

support for a majority of the people of sweden. i think it has been growing, the support, but at the same time, and has been the only option presented to us by the media, more or less. and i think it is really important this kind of big decision that it has to be wise and it has to be -- the people must be included in this kind of really big change in our policy. amy: agnes hellström, for people who are not familiar with sweden's history, if you can talk about the history of neutrality and why it is so central to sweden' identity. >> i don't remember the exact year when we decided on the neutrality policy. it has also been abandoned for military. but it has been a country that

has peace for more than 200 years. a lot has been our choice to be more of a voice for democracy -- diplomacy and for disarmament and in the international form, represent those issues more than to take sides or to choose an ally and that kind of way as nato is. nermeen: as members of the eu, which does grant some kind of protection to both states in the event of any kind of military assault, in other words, they do already have some security guarantees. why then do you think there is this heightened discussion of nato? what would nato never ship enabled? -- membership enable?

>> sweden, as a many countries right now, has been a big amount of fear after the invasion of ukraine. therefore, it is likthe easiest -- the easy solution to joint and military alliance that would protect you in case of war. at the same time, where is always devastating so we have to do everything we can to prevent war, the war spreading or just starting and other parts of our surroundings. it is a reflex, but you choose that because it is the easiest way. at the same time, we have to use this wide pallet of choices right now or solutions to try to get a cease-fire, trying to de-escalate this conflict. that is why i think this analysis that sweden is going to make, it has to take a lot of time. it has been discussed for years.

sweden -- the majority of parliament have been opposed to nato membership, well, until recently. amy: agnes, it would take minimally a year for sweden or failing to be admitted to nato if things go as they have in the past, which certainly isn't happening these days. what do you fear might happen in the interim and what kinds of organizing is going on right now in sweden, in the peace movement? and when people think of sweden, this peaceful nation, it is significant that here you have the nobel peace prize that started in sweden but it is one of the largest per capita exporters of weapons in the world. >> yeah, that is true. my biggest fear right now is not what would happen if we joined, it would be that we joined. i think it would be a really bad

decision and it should definitely not be made now and it is really tense time. i think it would be much better for sweden not to join. as you said, we are big arms producer and we are also supplying the parties of the war in yemen with lots of arms at the moment. the image you have of sweden is not always what you expected. amy: agnes hellström, thank you for being with us. we will continue to follow the story. president of the swedish peace and arbitration society. speaking to us from sweden. next up, we go to lviv, ukraine, to look at how more than 11 million people have been displaced, including two thirds of ukraine's children. stay with us. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: "eepa gooden" by the swedish instrumental trio väsen. this is democracy now! i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. we look now at how the russian war on ukraine has displaced more than 11 million people, including two-thirds of ukraine's children. we often hear 4.5 million refugees have fled ukraine now over the border into poland, moldova, and other countries, but more than double that happened internally displaced. that is where that 11 million comes from. for more, we will go to lviv, ukraine, where we are joined b volodymyr dubovyk, professor of international relations at mechnikov national university in odesa, ukraine. welcome you to democry now! i can't believe you just finished a lecture, that there are even lectures going on in ukraine right now.

thank you so much for switching over to us right now, professor. if you can talk about this idp crisis, this internally displaced people crisis in ukraine? >> thank you for having me on your program. i have been watching for years. it is a big privilege for me. a huge problem for us, and we're doing lectures for online courses. o knows where my students are? some in odesa and some are elsewhere. we are doing our lectures, trying to be as fine as we can. ukraine issuing miracles these days. everyone expected it to be unraveling or falling apart. they thought it would fall apart within two or three days of invasion. on t contrary is happening. ukraine is the opposite of a failed nation. the government is showing up for

work, military string miracles. -- is doing miracles. i think about one third of the population of the country has been urgently uprooted. not some sll trickling out of populations to t west, but very quick movement of people. it is unprecedented, creating all sorts of problems because people left their housing, many businesses are not working anymore, planes an factories e razed to the ground. some have savings to get them through and some don't. they areaving difficulties with housi for themselves and theichildren. it is a huge problem. i am still getting my salary on time but don't know what will happen in the coming nuns. -- coming months. it depends on how long this will go on and what areas will be

taken by russian military. nermeen: tweeted recently that "the total destruction is not just a means to an end but actually one of the core objectives of the invasion." could you explain what you mean by that and if that is the case, what you anticipate happening in the coming weeks and possibly months? >> well, i think russians are wanting ukraine to be next door to them and not having -- if you're weak or poor or dirt poor come you don't have any ambition. you don't want to maintain the fight or keep the fight against russia. they're going to level down our economy. there sending muscles to every corner of -- missiles to every corner of ukraine. in addition to fighting the

combat, in addition t shelling civilians, which is a big deal, they want to inflict the maximum pain on ukraine. mostly shelling of civilians, certain buildings, and so on. the border of ukraine is convenient and never to russia. no one wants --ukraine cannot stand up from there knees. we are doomed to following in russia's track. right now we have the spirit, the fighting spirit of ukrainians. in suppo coming from various countries, mostly western allies. but not just western allies. various countries of the world are supplying us with certain systems, weapons, humanitarian

assistance. most of the assistance is directed -- idp's, many are in dire straits. critical need of receiving help. nermeen: can you speak specifically about the alleged use of chemical weapons by the russians in parts of ukraine, specifically, in mariupol? >> i don't know. there has not been investigated properly. maybe it was white phosphorus which is also a deadly weapon use and a city which is a big city and mariupol is -- such a tragedy. it quite well progressed in developing quickly in terms of culture, art, and so on.

right now something like 100 20,000 people are left, basically in shelters. i have two very good colleagues, professors, from variable university -- mariupol university. maybe white phosphorus, not chemical weapons, but getting ready -- not to mention the nuclear danger of when they took over nuclear power stations. [indiscernible] it is a problem. if you remember turn noble in 1986, a prop -- turn noble in 1986, a problem in all of europe. chernobyl in 1986, a problem in all of eure. could be a b problem not just for us here, but everyone

400,000 kilometers away. amy: and russian soldiers who left, i parent work digging trenches and the red forest which means they are going to get sick and they found food packages in the forbidden place. >> that's right. amy: we know about white phosphorus because the u.s. used it in fallujah and iraq, among other places. i wanted to ask about president biden describing for the first time russia's actions in ukraine as genocide. this is what he said. pres. biden: 70% of the increase in prices in march came from putin's price hike in gasoline. we need to address this challenge with an urgency of demand, family budget, filling up your tank, none of it should hinge on whether a dictator declares war and commits genocide half a world away. amy: that was tuesday on

wednesday, ned price said international lawyers have to determine whether russia's attack on ukraine comes to genocide. >> the president also as you heard emphasized it will be the task of international lawyers to determine whether what we are seeing meets that legal threshold of genocide. the president was facing his comments on the horrific atrocities that we have all seen in mariupoand bucha and kharkiv and you could go on. amy: the french presidentccraw responded saying he would be cautious in using the word "genocide" given ukraine and russia are "brother nations." >> genocide has the sense, the ukrainian people and the russian people are brother nations. it is madness what is happening right now, unbelievably brutal. but i look at the facts at the same time.

i want to try my best to continue to be able to stop this war and rebuild peace, so i'm not sure the escalation of war is something to cause right now. amy: professor dubovyk, could you weigh in on this issue of genocide? >> it is a tricky issue. we should tread lightly. to call something genocide. a good friend of mine and colleague, he has been thority on genocide. thinks what happens is genocide. what is also happening, they're stealing some populations from ukrainian occupied territories and bringing them to russia. 340,000 kids stolen from ukraine abroad to russi and they have now been adopted by russians. whiltheir parents are back in

ukraine. president biden is getting ahead in many ways, that is not new, i think he feels he has certain spots ability because he wanted to try to prevent the aggression, is trying to help ukrainians in any way he can. when he first mentioned war crimes cover the rest of the administration said, "oh, be not." we are also saying it is war crimes. the same is happening with genocide. if peoe don't see it that way, that's fine. the brotherly nation remark is upsetting because the way we see it, russia is not our brotherly nation. not now when they are killing and raping and killing our children. it would be anything but brotherly relations. a big brother doesn't do that. a big brother does not struggle to death his little brother.

i think mr. macron's remark is unfortunate. in terms of genocide, let's leave it to national lawyers. born here in the city of lviv, he went to the tragedyith his family situation here is suffered from the holocaust -- he set the bar high. i think we should probably get those definitions away from politicians and into the hands of capable and experienced experts in the field of international law, humanitarian law. nermeen: the international -- the prosecutor for the international criminal court visited bucha and set it was a crime scene that falls under the jurisdiction of the icc. >> right, he did and he was

there. and also other people. ukraine is trying to do what we can in terms of accommodating experts coming from other places to bucha and other towns and we know it is not just bucha, but many little towns and villages have suffered the same situation under the russian occupation. we are trying to get as many as they can get to ukraine as fast as they can because, obviously, you cannot drag it on. you need to give the proper burials to people at some point in time. there is a french group who are also working here in ukraine. we need to document it properly. take out of arguments from russian propaganda who are trying to say nothing happened, it is not us, it is just maybe actors who are acting and so on. it is very important for us to show to the world whatappened here.

galvanize more support for ukraine. while we see it is very important. it also given the proper due care to those people who suffer horrible death. amy: let me ask about the u.n. secretary-general's speech yesterday. he was talking about the global impact of the war in ukraine on food, energy, and finance systems around the world. >> war the war is supercharging, a three-dimensional crisis. food can energy, and finance, that is pummeling some of the world's most vulnerable people, countries, and economies. all of this comes at the time when developing countries are already struggling with the slight of challenges not of their making. e covid-19 pandemic, climate change, and the lack of access to adequate resources to finance

recovery in the context of persistence and growing inequalities. we are now facing a perfect storm that threatens to devastate the economies of many developing countries. amy: professor dubovyk, how do you see this war ending? >> it is going to end at some point, help not with the russian victory -- i basically refused to recognize that particular outcome. the stakes are too high. the cancellation of our nations is absolutely amazing. it's nothing short of miraculous what we are seeing here, people gathering together, helping each other in the times of need. we have to win this war or at least not lose it badly. not let them have an upper hand. that is very important.

the general secretary was emotional when saying the destruction and ukraine. speaking of hunger and finance in various places, one reason will happen more is because russian navy is blockading the ports -- there are 94 ships from various countrie blocking the black seaport. they he wheat, sunflower, oil, other things that are desperately needed in a number of places like egypt, yemen, and others. they're not going to get to those destinations because the blockade is still there. it is a huge problem. it is going to make more people start because ofalnutrition around the globe. russia should wake up from doing

these horrible things. it is not that they're just doing it to ukraine, they're doing to other people in the world. nermeen: quickly before we conclude, people are fearful now there is a massive russian offensive coming in donbas, which may be the most brutal of the war we have seen so far. your response? >> right stuff that is going to happen, i'm afraid. they're going to have the dominating numbers of course but in donbas we have some of our best forces that have been fighting since 2014. now we are better equipped. people in the west should understand by providing wpons, they're not escalating the war, ther helping ukrainians to defend ourselves. it is unfair fe -- it is a fair fight. we need to be able to defend ourselves. that is how you de-escala it,

think about peace and signing a peace deal. amy: volodymyr dubovyk is a professor of international relations in odesa, ukraine. joining us from lviv. democracy now! has an immediate

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