card with no forest. that is the question this special city of counselors. twelvehousand hundred and some books in which explores what he calls the destructive still separation. read an essay asking whether we should try to back to as soon as. the 5% humidity with the

next opportunity for transformation. early or growth nineteen you murder wrong. what. this is your message it was a long **** and had many messages. our it started i felt to disturbed by the social and risk to their ninety and i work. i saw that. we were doing is assist. what is yeah w in a this transaction a lon time in the making. nothing in the w are seeing is new. our not not this distance people less and less. ourhysically over my as long as is my gray into. yeah

online. all my education you know that's not in the either. zero balance tracking everybody whereabouts in everybody's act that's new the control of inrmation instead that's not new. ofeibea germ. and end general fear of the out and fear yeah one of the is new i get where it's to me is over. and your and you about flattening the- i couldn't agai that hospitals beingver. but one that became no longer true. hi and questionable how to ever outside her sir few play. what downs in quarantine and justin can to on my before wasn't reason to the curve. me because to be told something else. i started a quest. why does. besides know very

concerts theory. i'm what else could. the yes she to. control and what is answer is ian't the actually are since is quite come with kind crisis. because there's a bad guy that canhere attack via. whereas most bigger. much bigger you handed. that e all. donald is it anything like this kind of a so as the auto immune update. that is more suffering and afflicting more people by far in corona virus has or will. was considered normal. i can give you manyany others that did. something like one six adults depressed. bob my- you know but we don't kw to do with that but now if i comes. and out

customary so template for something to control to keep out where to kill. that is available to us. invalidates those in power hi it makes their powers useful mmhm it's kind of reassuring in a way because because because our society has been indicated for a long time and it is troubli to us. we sure want there to be something to do about it. the end. result yeah indeed. the make an attack so right y'll run it in s. that you always felt that doubles christ around corner and we'll check the world we have a in. so can you talk about feeling and what nd of a is that you just.

yeah that's the feeling. of the of the world has been it the world that many of us trapped in. in a way that is moved in the right direction. if you look the ecological sits othe social situation with a pote so. we feel stuck in. so ere's a- been part of that's like this. go on for a- something will have to bring. and then all of a sudden it breaks. wow we're no longer catch of this endeavor. yeah that doesn't mean that we are delivered from this inevitability. in fact the default. path will be to continue on the path that we've been on. but at least we have this pause now where we can say is this really the path that we want to continue down. where do we want to. make this. look at the huge changes. it is interesting of course is when start come and in golden goal is see this is a very to me

pictures right. service ones are. entitled to are you know our good. these other common goals but always you at the minute many comes to. leasing the role for the. in addition to go to the moon you know to go into space was part of a bigger less conscious mythology. that said human beings are the humanity is to bri about through scien and

and techlogy utopia. an we had these visions of the future when i was growing up okay a paradise of robot servants rvants you know in food in appeal and the cure of every disease and infinite lifespans and all kinds of stuff like that flying cars here you you remember it too. yes yes good morning the septic there wasn't anything alive in this future. so we so we had. us myth cl. congre mlas our system the problem of arts. that has grown more thirty or forty years. the failure of this death. no longer have a unified neff so i won't have. to coordinate our efforts and to sacrifice to. this is actually good it's part of the transition ocess. what we need is a mythology i was

just thinking about what you're saying describing this wld that i actually like you remember you know these claims things in that regard we will be absolutely yeah- hi. how do see that. almost right yes this is the world's createn is that person has. to become and- yes there are some version o. yeah we're- wee yeah the just part othe year was that you can. the whole world into a data. yeah come you rationally efficiently in minutes at the set. yes that god. the like. last add on to that v. and so yeah we have the internet of things. which what five g. is really all about you know it's a- about collecting data. entered in you are brought into

that. the is of course a fit. you don't need a buy of you world controlling. public mass. to pursue. a of. i intensifying control. when the mythology needs to it so we are seeing an extra version of it in a y that a plus because it puts starkly front of us what we actually been choosing. is that the worldhat we want really. our well here it is. and if we- what will miss you we're actually with been and we can choose something. i know you were going to use respond. to essay wrote which is a beautiful as and is by by along at the same time when made is in the know on the phone going because is about.ot ready. hi

i don't have any guarantees for you b i do see tt seems like the last couple weeks the tide has begun to shift. are people who are questioning a couple weeks ago are now starting to doubt. the dental by the authorities. just because of the- articular echo chambers that i frequent but it does seethat. is a growing skepticism and the santander. hardening the polarization relaxing lockdown questioning our official narratives and so forth is being associated with. i'll be enough with right wing politics. this is confusing to me i am i have been a lifelong leftist. i thought it was the

left that is defined by questioning authority and resisting the ageas of pharmaceutical companies and. and governme incorporation and there is some of surveillance and- i. centralized of informationnd censorship of michael. i can left in his right here. nose getting all mixed up this. charles obviously because we want to chan something we want ttry to control. media they basically want to get rid of fear. the thing is. i d't think it leads to less fear what do you think. the root of our fear is our separation. from the rest of life. from community. are from all of these lost parts of ourselves. we're not being fully human right now we're not in intimate close relationship with my foot places around us with the plants and animals and the- just the land the serial we

don't have that therefore. we walked into these nero separate selves. this is us existentially insecure a especially afraid of death. because of our experience of self and so dependent on distant anonymous institutions and strangers. then then yeah th separate self is the deathof of all things but if you're in bednd you experience yourself as including being included by. a web of relationships. then yes he's on a different meaning health is not a matter of protecting the separate self from any invasion health is a matter of hing bust lationshs. looting the internal ecology the body ecologythe viral virus. are

which are on a continuum with all kinds of other particles. hey there necessary for life yeah that's how that's how both communicates with wife and shares genetic information to cut off all communication here is the yeah. suit took usa box in theory can you explain what you what that is. the minimum that extended quite well said john three your fish is sick. daphne the fish. ur your fishes sic clean the tank. yes so is that says that that infection. is a symptom of opportunistic r. o. a bacteria or virus that's taking advaage of the disease just you or can even be body

inviting in this condion in order to clear up the diseased tissuehere to meet environmental challenge this is such a richer way to look at viruses then these. pathogens th's not to say that they are not dangerous like sometimes there's morenformation comes to you it kills you. too much information your body can't handle that like that is obviously happening and i'm really. wary of any totalizing discourse. that was someone said here's what's happening. and tries to explain everything. because every single one of those that i've seen leave us some data ints out. there are more people in the past decade started to meditate going to yoga studios barbara you saying this moralistic lifestyle we're embracing certain spiritual values that are universal. so i'm not saying ma'am thank that in this. like this that you

know the help at the same time it seems that many the students had to close. down most. people for example. there people when wonders they run back to. what's familiar and able to authority. to protect them especially if they are immature people. our civilization has delivered us a lot of immature people and infantilizing us a lot of ways your. remember if it doesn't happens to be a daddy right it was in the white house and that person is not it's just probably fhting as the authority figuret seems so that leader that we now need to people for does exist- boxes back to ourselves again. yeah this is the flux find some protective authorities saw strong not a lot of people

still look to him. the two. institutional authority figures but you know the cdc the whl or just the doctors over the doctors say yeah. people are. starting to lose their patience. withou but may that's just wishful thinking. it is it when you were facing challenges in your life you know how did you deal with them in into or maybe your health or whatever it might be and then have you seen this larger perspective tt you're not trying to help us see. m. it says something that that you know you've tried to be helping your online one. i need tbroaden for. nine years of my life i had experiences there that were categorically impossible. from the perspective of the edation that i received a the acculturation that i had

receivedrom from my home culture. and so i was like whoa. if what i have been told is true isn't true what else have i been told is true that isn't true. soe sent moff on the star decades long journey. dot that just with a question that i've been holding ever since i was a teenager which is what's wrong in the world. what's the origin of the obvious wrongness. of our society the normal answers to that in radical political fought like say capitalis colonialism. white supremacy or whatever. these didn't go deep enough for me because they also took for granted. that's a reality those

ins installations of reality that tha i have personally experienced is not actually being true. well that'll kind of dissolving of the certainty. it is a necessary initiation if anything's going to change in this world. and that has been happening for a lot of people over. you know a span of many decades and maybe it is with. does. the cts this tolimbty all the more time to it yeah maybe that's one reason why. despite decades and decades of. well surgeon popping. of mr kalifat natural health and so forth that it's all gone yeah. you know. it's just not part of the conversation at least in the mainstream media once the articles about how to. the pharmacy cwhl about how to improve your immunity. thank

it's all intact the. the competition has been shut down yeah so do you just think pointed out just to clarify that indeed- doctors rollout to stay open as essential service services medical doctors and ballistic health conditions. senses services absolute lock box which indeed bchure points completely. where do you seein what one of the ways to diagnose a civilization is to look at what it. it. how devoted surplus. our society mostly devoted to work for. into mindless consumption i would have preferred a surplus to having.asing performances and parties and festivals and art instaltions. at scei

burning man which is quite it for not stopping the arts. wake a similar lesser point about any. the festitival. celebration is extravagant compared to one bomber. extravagant compared to your craft group. the total aunt of money spent on armaments in this world is that controlling dollars a minute divorced yet not spent on inspiration and art. if we turned the entire military budget. toward celebration. he maybe half of it toward celebration on the other half toward ecological regeneration thank. in a paradise one the message of this for you. i've heard some people say it is and it's true for needed to- that message i slow down. i'm curious so if tomorrow everything is fine again one one thing you want to

do that you cano now. is that one should such thing. what's most important to me is it would be four point one my son can do he's my younger son seven. and he's basically been living without playmates for two months. not because we're trying to keep them safe but because- it's socially verboten ye. you know this is really hard after. the firm did. hav an opportunity to play with somebody. it's not just about hanging out together it's not about consuming together for sociology most people today they get togetr and consume something. yr restaurant you go have drinks you go watch a sportsan you you watch something orou need something you drink something. but to really know somebody and to relate to them on a more than superficial level you can't just consumedogether that doesn't bring out any of your true qualities. you have to create together you have to

strive together you have to suffer together you have to overcome challenges together mmhm if you. want a sports team. there are musical ban or theater troupe or something like that you know what i'm talking about yes the bonds that you have withhose people is much stronger and your drinking bdies. so right now we're seeing just like the icg on the cake. the final phase of- loneliness that has much deeper roots. in goes down we could also talk about disconnection from nature that's another form of loneliness to feel like an alien. on the on the place where you live. the cabinet for. of course can change in a separate. i'm which word will seem to keep us safer and protect the separate self. and the oer paths to drop some of tho cards. hello our

relational selves to expands to come back into multi layered relationships with other people and with the natural world. and to trust in the world the opposite of controls trust. so to trust in the intelligence of nature and thereby in our participation in nature. i'm too trusting each other rather than in a central authority. that tells us what to do and what to think. in a drug or- where do you draw back soon- yeah it's not that we never. he uses. technological media set the controls bad actuay no instead it's become totally. it's beyond its proper bounds so i do think that that there's

a place for drugs it's much smaller than e place we've given it. sure and there's a place for certain words for plant medicine. for all kinds of other. body working and better better that's why. and moved out he said are really powerful. shows in these days of our fears and i'm sure that you know even with your dot mind in the way you think about these things even if you if it's not for yourself or your family are figures that come with this. and through those fears and dreams. what. what kind of change a you havin. i had a dream last night of. the day friend. very very wise person. i'm having a panic attack. maybe maybe jim is telling me that that the most useful thing i can do. is to offer a counterpoint to the panic. to be peaceful to not

freak out about the virus and not freak out about the freak out. you're not freaking out about the- totalitarian agenda and so forth.eah end to end because words that peacefulness come from. it comes from. the trend recognition. others who who i am and who we are. and that. the tendency of the univer's toward more life. i want to spend a lot of strength to control our biggest fears or did we want to explore discover. a world together again. the statue that eisenstn presents to eh of us remember this crisis is also jim. this was kind. stay well see you next time. solutions is presented by

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host: welcome to “global 3000.” an insecure future -- the survival of penguins in the antarctic is under threat. dangerous dependency -- how russia's war in ukraine is worsening hunger around the world. and far from home -- ukrainians fleeing the war are searching for a new life in peace. russia's invasn has