tv France 24 LINKTV August 1, 2022 5:30am-6:01am PDT
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with it. russian forces withdrew from the already months ago after failing to capture it to the u.s. economy has contracted for the second straight quarter, but the u.s. administration says it is not in recession. gdp fell in the three months from april to june. the family of a murdered al jazeera journalist has demanded countability during talks with the u.s. secretary of state in washington. as a antony blinken promised transparency and to keep them informed, but did not make further guarantees. >> annually in estimation. this is the least the biden administration can do. they cannot rely on israel's word. were criminals cannot investigate their own crimes. too many palestinian families suffer every day, as our family is suffering now. they all deserve to live in safety with their families. they all deserve justice.
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they all deserve freedom. >> they had of the west african block says guinea's rulers have scaled back the transition to civilian rule from three years to do this, but there is no confirmation from the top. demonstrators in the capital called for an end to military rule. one person died in those demonstrations. opposition mps have heckled peru 's president, calling him corrupt as he delivered a speech marking his first year in office. pedro castillo has survived impeachment and allegations of corruption. protesters have been calling for castillo to sign. those are the headlines. i will have an update for you here on al jazeera after "inside story." stay with us. ♪
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♪ >> p stern -- people in the eastern democratic republic of congo want the u.n. to leave. they say the mission has failed to keep them safe. peacekeepers have been killed after days of unrest. if you and peacekeepers cannot keep the peace, who can? this is "inside story." ♪ hello and welcome to the program. i'm imran khan. imran: people in the democratic republic -- democratic republic of congo say they have had enough of you and peacekeepers. in days of protests, people have been killed and doesn't wounded -- dozens wounded.
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demonstrators attacked u.n. bases in at least four cities. they say you and troops failed to protect them from armed groups. some protesters say the peacekeepers opened fire on them. the u.n. denies this and accused protesters of snatching weapons from congolese police. at the u.n. children's agency said kids up and manipulated into joining the unrest. >> congo is our heritage. congo is for the congolese. since unesco came here, they have done nothing. people have their throats slit every day. the population is being massacred, killed like sheep in the presence of unesco. >> when they go home, we are about to take care of things ourselves. they say they don't have the means to combat am 23 rebels. so we are going to defend ourselves on our own. if they don't leave today, we are going to keep demonstrating
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until they do. imran: the u.n. says attacks on his troops may constitute work crimes. the yuan chief is due to arrive friday. -- the u.n. chief is due to arrive friday. >> the situation today is the normal fragility, if you wish. since monday, the prime minister, there have been reinforcements of national security forces on the ground, securing our bases and installations. we also reinforced troops to ensure security is restored. we still have certain pockets that i would call insecure. imran: u.n. peacekeepers have been in the democratic republic of congo for more than 22 years. more than 16,000 military personnel and police have been protecting civilians and supporting government these efforts treat most of the forces
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come from pakistan, india and bangladesh. the mandate was extended for another year last december, but troops struggled to contain violence. in may 2021, the congolese government placed provinces under what it called a state of siege. since then, the number of civilian deaths has risen sharply. ♪ let's ring in our guests, in brussels, a researcher from the democratic republic of congo -- mr. international. in goma, the founder and executive director of the exit development initiative for the protection of women and children joining us on skype. and from the netherlands, a researcher focusing on conflict, peace and justice in the great lakes region of africa. a warm welcome to you all. i would like to begin in the netherlands with felix.
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after 22 years, this is now a failure of the u.n. peacekeeping mission, and they need to leave. >> i guess much of the failure has to do with what expectations you have about you enforces in the drc -- about you and -- united nations forces in the drc. the united nations went in as a peacekeeping mission. the u.n. rarely makes peace, it tries to keep peace, but the idea of making peace has to do with the actors and diplomats and many other channels. yes, there is a lot to say about what the leader has done, but the expectation that he will go
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there in a country of 100 million people, two plus million square kilometers and make peace was naive, i would say. that being said, there has been damage in terms of unesco getting involved with local actors in taking that road toward peace. imran: we make an interesting point. the peacekeeping forces are about peacekeeping, not peacemaking. but it seems to me, if you lost the support of the population, you are encouraging violence, which is what has been happening in the eastern democratic republic of the congo. is the peacekeeping mission a failure in your eyes? >> i concur with most of what
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the other discussion has said. i think it is a mixed result when you see what the situation was 22 years ago, when the u.sn. interceded between the belligerents to try to make sure the peace agreement was suspected -- agreement was respected. today, the u.n. has played an important role in ensuring the protocols are implemented and that the congo is reunited. in 1999 when the u.n. mission to congo was created, congo was split into three parts, with two or three big rebellions, and the government.
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and the you and has helped -- the united nations has helped to an extent to reunite the country. it has also helped with electoral and democratic processes. the first democratic election is in 2026 and is largely supported by the international community, including the u.n. when it comes to peacemaking or peacekeeping, it is true that the u.n. does not make peace but actually in the drc, it was the first time the u.n. was trying to make peace. the un security council created the force intervention brigade with the mandate of fighting and dismantling armed groups. it had an offense of mandate. it was the first time in u.n. peacekeeping history that a u.n.
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operation was given an offense if toward -- inoffensive -- an offensive role and it defeated the mr 13. the answer to your question is that it is a mixed result. there have been successes and there are many failures. we can explain the frustration expressed by people in the streets in recent days, but this is not the first on their is an uprising against the u.n. there have been many uprisings against the u.n. and this is just the last one. imran: that's ring in patsy from
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goma. as the you and -- u.n. mission failed? >> jimmy, the -- to may, the mission has failed. -- to me, the mission has failed. in the democratic republic of congo, people are still killed every day. people in the streets have been calling for peace and security and want the departure of unesco because they have been in the country for more than 22 years. and we think that this is too much time and they should be -- and there should be impacts on the ground.
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this is a mission of the united nations, by what we have been seeing on the ground is that civilians are still killed, women are still raped, and we can see the situation in the same sense 22 years now. and for me, if they can't do their mission, yeah, i think it is time for them to go, and keep the congolese government to protect the congolese citizens, that is the role of the congolese government. imran: patsy just said women and children are being failed by this peak -- by this
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peacekeeping force, she works with women and children, that it is a failure and it is time to try something else. is there something else? >> that is an important question to raise, my easy answer would be probably not. the fact is, any u.n. intervention, we don't have many interventions in countries because authorities in those countries are able to perform the basic functions better. that being said, unesco, first because of the broken nature of congolese politics and the armed groups in the country, this is an area that reportedly has more than 100 different armed groups. many reports that the u.n. has
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documented human rights violations by the congolese army. many reports of documented those reports. the complicity of some drc army commanders, for example in the hostilities, being on the front, the army is a source of income. they have become a business. these are stats that have been recorded. we are relying on this existing structure all of a sudden after the departure of unesco perform certain functions that unesco has been protecting over the years, would be a bit naive. it is very important to look at
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the factor that frustrations around unesco mirror the bigger failures of congolese politics. at the national, local and regional level, if you will. it would be presumptuous to say that, all of a sudden, the congolese apparatus will be capable. imran: let's put that point to our guest. there is no other option, is there? there has to be a u.n. peacekeeping force because the eastern congo is not ready to protect itself. >> there have to be options, and these are not necessarily military options. because when we are talking about the u.n. peacekeeping or
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peacemaking mission, there have been proposals by the east african community to deploy a regional force. there is an ongoing joint operation between the congolese and the uganda army. there is a state of emergency that has been in place for over one year. so, the response to the conflict has been largely military. and i think what has failed, whether it is the u.n. or the congolese military approach to resolve that conflict, this has led to the root causes of this conflict, which include the impunity enjoyed by perpetrators over more than 28 years in this region, drc, but also in
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neighboring countries such as rwanda and ghana and others who have committed serious crimes on drc soil. there has been almost no accountability for those crimes. and this has allowed them to commit them over and over again. when you see what is happening with m 23, that is one of the reasons. 10 years ago, they were militarily defeated, but nobody was held to account. now, they are back again, they can again raped and killed because they know that there will be no consequences. they have been around these officers that are involved in the war in drc, they have not been held to account, there are congolese officials that still have not been held to account.
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and the causes include economic and social and all the issues around management of national root -- natural resources, but also political issues, the legitimacy of power. imran: what he seems to be saying is that actually, it is a failure of politics, not just of peacekeeping. but this is the bed bad -- this is the best bad option, isn't it? politics are not going to change overnight, so a peacekeeping force is the way to keep the peace? >> yeah. i think there is bad politics, but i still think the congolese government has the duty to protect the population. but when we are seeing that they have the big support of the u.n.
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mission, i think everything should be different because mont esko -- unesco has a big logistic. they have money. they have a lot of people, the soldiers, and they should put all of that to try to support the government to fight different armed groups we have within the region. actually come the drc counts more than 100 armed rebel groups in the region. sometimes, we can count only one armed rebel that has been kept awake by the u.n. mission. and that is civilians where those armed rebels are actually
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responsible for so many human rights violations. what they want to see is, you know, they just need peace, they need to be able to go and work on their lives, and try to find something to eat. and if the u.n. and congolese government are not able to do that, there is a huge problem for us as citizens. imran: felix, why are these attacks taking place today? >> the speaker just mentioned issues that have been going on. there is fatigue, rightly so, just off five dad's rightly so, justified by the population whose needs have not been net and -- not been met and who have been victimized by the congolese
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authorities. they have the power to be able to solve the issue but keep in mind, the congolese armed groups in the region can be very dangerous. we know this latest spark of violence occurred on july 50 -- july 15. the head of the senate hills from this region and pronounced speeches on campaign boards in goma where he said the u.n. has to leave. he did it in a very congolese way, raise your hands, and so on. that kind of populism in itself, academically, you can look at how much that speeches correlated with the violence that we see today.
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that it is difficult not to read the two together. the climate today, which criticizes the u.n., which is seen as not doing enough, we view that is one of the broader structural issues. imran: do you agree that some congolese politicians are bashing monusco and that is leading to more tax? >> absolutely. the u.n. is the victim of the knockoff leadership in drc. but it has its own shortcomings, for sure. most important now is to know
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what needs to be done, as the international community seems to be paying more attention. secretary blinken is apparently traveling to the region next week. they should now be addressing the root causes of that conflict and not just continue to invest in a military response, which has shown its limitations and failures over the last decades. there has to be accountability for those who committed crimes. and other issues have to be resolved through dialogue and political processes. imran: what are these root causes then? if we change the root causes of this, it is not about monusco being in the country. it is about the root causes, what are those root causes? >> monusco being in the country
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can be good if they can realize their mission. of course, sometimes, there are different politicians who try to manipulate youth in the country, but remember, this is not the first time that people are claiming the departure of mo nusco in the democratic republic of congo because most of the time, we can see people killed not far from monusco, and this is unacceptable. it is very important that people can continue, because it is a right for people to think that they are not doing their mission, and they strongly condemn what happened in goma
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the last two days, where people used huge violence to proclaim the departure of monusco, because even the idea that we have to proclaim the departure, we have to do this in a balanced way, especially talking with our government to make this happen. imran: felix, you just heard what our said to say, is there anything you think is positive about monsusco involvement in congo? >> within the context we talked about, it is well recorded that monusco keeps certain individuals alive in the drc. so, it is a force that is still needed. it should always be tied to fixing congolese politics
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including institutions, the army, and the governments of the country. imran: i thank all our guests, and thank you for watching. you can see the program again any time our website is al jazeera.com or go to our facebook page. you can also join the conversation on twitter. our mandalas -- our handle is c ♪
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