10/24/22 10/24/22 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from new york, this is democracy now! >> when it comes to diplomacy and the war, it depends entirely on whether russia gets to a place where it is actually trusted in stopping aggreion that it started. we have seen no evidence of that in this moment. amy: as the war in ukraine enters its ninth month, we look at the biden administration's

unprecedented military spending on ukraine as lawmakers consider a new $50 billion aid package. it would bring the total to over $115 billion. we will speak to the quincy institute's william hartung. author of the new report "promoting stability or fueling conflict? the impact of u.s. arms sales on national and global security." then to jackson, mississippi, to speak with the naacp about the environmental protection agency's civil rights investigation into the roots of jackson's water crisis. >> we will continue to highlight the egregious conditions of jackson's water system and how the action of state actors have called -- caused discriminatory actions but actions from this congress and the entire federal government is needed to ensure that there aren't crises in other communities. amy: andhe aclu issking th supreme urt to orturn an arkaas anti-s law th pelizes coanies th support

boycotts of israel. we will speak to the publisher of the "arkansas times" who sued e state overturthe law. >> i have thright to boycott in the state has no busiss gettininvolved in that. riod. amy: will also speak to the aclu and the director of the documentary "boycott." all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. in ukraine, thousands in and around the russian-occupied city of kherson have fled as they battle to retake control of the stratec region, located north of the crimean peninsula. ukrainian soldiers continue to advance as russia's military continued drone and missile attacks across ukraine, which

cut off electricity to over a million homes. russian attacks have downed some 40% of ukraine's power system as the winter is fast approaching. meanwhile, in the southern city of mykolaiv, residents have not had access to clean water for the past six months. officials there say russians closed off the city's freshwater source after occupying the adjacent kherson province and that the pipes have been destroyed in fighting. >> we would need to change hundreds of kilometers of pipes. we could assume, yes, it is some kind of revenge because even if this happened by accident, why don't the russians let us -- non-so-called torture by water. amy: earlier today, officials in france, u.k., and the u.s. rejected moscow's allegation that ukraine was preparing to use a radioactive device known as a dirty bomb within its borders. president volodymyr zelenskyy said russia likely made the charge because its forces were

planningn deploying such a weapon. on friday, zelenskyy accus russia of deliberately stalling passage of ships carrying grain 150 exports for around the world under a u.n. brokered-deal, which is set to expire next month. in washington, republican leadership has split over u.s. military support for ukraine. senate minority leader mitch mcconnell urged president biden on friday to send more military aid and vowed a republican senate would continue backing the funding. but house minority leader kevin mccarthy has said domestic issues should be prioritized and the u.s. should not deliver blank checks to ukraine. since the start of the war, the u.s. has sent over $60 billion in military and other assistance to ukraine. and planning to send more. xi jinping was named head of china's ruling communist party as the communist party congress wrapped up saturday, ushering in a third term for xi as china's leader. lawmakers abolished presidential term limits in 2018, meaning xi can remain in power

indefinitely. president xi also announced his top political team, stacked with loyalists. this is xi jinping as he introduced his appointees to the press sunday. >> in the face of new challenges and tests on the new journey, we must be highly vigilant, always maintain sobriety and prudence to catch up with these -- promo district governance of the party across the board without see so that the central party will take you to flirt itself revolution and always become the strongest backbone of the chinese people. amy: in a dramatic scene saturday, former president hu jintao was abruptly escorted out of the closing ceremony of the communist party congress, a move that some speculated was an assertion of xi's dominance. chinese state media later said it was because the former leader was not feeling well. despite xi's grip on power, protests against his rule have spread in china and beyond

following thdisplay earlier this month of a protest banner on a busy overpass in beijing. authorities have censored news of the protest from websites and social media, but the protester's words have since been scribbled on public restroom doors in china and on posters displayed in universities around the world. they read, in part, "dignity, not lies reform, not cultural revolution, votes, not dictatorship, citizens, not slaves." in the united kingdom, former finance minister rishi sunak is expected to become the next prime minister after boris johnson pulled out of the race over the weekend. sunak would be the first british prime minister of south asian descent. he previously worked for goldman sachs and believed to be the wealthiest in the parliament. he is largely favored to win against leader of the house of commons penny mordaunt, when members of the conservative party cast votes on who will replace liz truss, who resigned last week after just six weeks on the job.

in italy, far-right leader giorgia meloni was sworn in as prime minister saturday. meloni's government will be led by a coalition of right-wing parties and figures, including matteo salvini, the anti-immigrant populist and former interior minister and former prime minister silvio berlusconi, who has faced myriad charges of corruption, fraud, and sex offenses. meloni's own party brothers of italy is allied with spain's vox party and other right-wing and neo-fascist parties in europe. in iran, teachers are on a two-day strike as anti-government sentiment grows across the country. labor unions have also launched strikes in the food and oil industries. this comes as protests for women's rights have entered their second month following the september 16 death of mahsa amini while in custody of the so-called morality police. international solidarity demonstrations are also continuing. in berlin, some 80,000 people took to the streets on saturday.

>> we are here to say we are with you, the iranian people. mahsa amini's voice. in burkina faso,brahim traore was swn in as inrim president of burkina faso just weeks after he led a coup and overthrew the country's president. it was the second military coup in burkina faso in just eight months. the mounting political instability comes as burkina faso faces an ongoing jihadist insurgency and deteriorating humanitarian situation. the u.n. says some five million people in the country need emergency assistance. here in the united states, the white house is urging student loan borrowers to keep submitting applications for up to $20,000 in federal debt relief after an appeals court on friday temporarily blocked biden's student loan forgiveness plan. the move comes in response to a challenge by six republican-led states that argued biden overstepped his authority when he launched the initiative.

just hours before the court stayed the plan on friday, biden touted its success while speaking at delaware state university. pres. biden: now, less than a week, just close to 20 trillion people have already given us information to considethis life-changing relief. in total, 40 million americans, stand to benefit from this relief. amy: meanwhile, some 700,000 borrowers were left out of the student debt relief plan because their loans are overseeny prive lenders and not the u.s. department of education. ey're urging the biden administration to include them in the debt forgiveness plan. a federal judge has sentenced steve bannon to four months in prison and a $6500 fine for criminal contempt of congress after he refused last year to comply with a subpoena issued by the house january 6 committee. bannon vowed to appeal and will remain free for now. if his appeal fails, bannon would become the first person to be imprisoned for contempt of congress in more than half a century.

the house committee investigating the january 6 insurrection has delivered a subpoena to former president donald trump, seeking documents and calling on him to testify on november 14. in a letter accompanying the subpoena, the committee writes -- "we have assembled overwhelming evidence, including from dozens of your former appointees and staff, that you personally orchestrated and oversaw a multi-part effort to overturn the 2020 presidential election and to obstruct the peaceful transition of power." meanwhile, axios is reporting a senior white house lawyer warned trump's team against the president signing a sworn statement with false claims of voter fraud. on saturday, trump railed against the subpoena during a republican rally in texas. he also repeated his false claims about the 2020 election being stolen. pres. trump: the election was rigged in stolen and now our country is being destroyed.

i ran twice. i one twice. and now in order to make our country successful, safe, and glorious again, i will probably have to do it again. amy: on friday, president biden said during an interview it is his intention to run again in 2024. two judges dealt a blow last week to republican-led efforts to intimidate and suppress voters. a court in florida's miami-dade county friday dropped voter fraud charges against a man who was arrested in august by officers with republican governor ron desantis' office of election crimes and security. robert lee wood had a felony conviction but was unaware he was not allowed to vote under florida law. separately, a judge in texas dismissed a charge against hervis earl rogers, who was on parole when he waited over six hours on line to vote in the 2020 primaries in houston. in texas, casting a ballot while still serving a sentence, including parole, is punishable by up to 20 years in prison.

in other voting news, local law -- the sheriffs office and maricopa county, arizona, is investigating voter intimidation after at least two armed people wearing masks and tactical gear camped out near a ballot dropbox friday. and in philadelphia, at least 19 university of pennsylvania students were arrested after they stormed a football field and disrupted the school's homecoming game to demand upenn divest from fossil fuels. the group fossil free penn is also urging the university pay property taxes to support the funding of city public schools, and help save a low income housing complex located near the university. anthose are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. as the war in ukraine enters its ninth month, nbc is reporting a bipartisan group of u.s. lawmakers are planning a new aid package for ukraine that could be worth as much as $50 billion.

that would bring the total u.s. spending on ukraine to a staggering $115 billion. this comes as ukrainian officials are expressing fear u.s. aid may decrease next year if republicans regain power in congress. last week, house minority leader kevin mccarthy said he will not "write a blank check to ukraine" at a fundraiser on thursday night, president biden criticized the republican approach, saying -- "these guys don't get it. it's a lot bigger than ukraine. it's eastern europe. it's nato." for more, we take a deeper look at arms sales under president biden with william hartung of the quincy institute, author of a new report titled "promoting stability or fueling conflict? the impact of u.s. arms sales on national and global security." in it, william hartung writes -- "aid designed to help ukraine defend itself from russia has proceeded at the most rapid pace of any u.s. military assistance program since at least the peak of the vietnam war.

but the united states has failed to offer an accompanying diplomatic strategy aimed at ending the war before it evolves into a long, grinding conflict or escalates into a direct u.s.-russian confrontation." william hartung, welcome back to democracy now! why got you take it from there. talk about what you found with armed spending and a president biden and what this means when it comes to diplomacy. what is possible? >> well, biden seemed like he was going to take a different approach. he describes saudi arabia as a pariah regime, says the united states would not check its failures at the door when it came to arms sales, said there would be no blank checks for egypt and yet here we are a year and a half or so into the administration and we are back to business as usual. arms flowing to saudi arabia. congressional efforts to condition aid to egypt on human

rights concerns have been largely caddis -- cast aside. just mentioned huge flow of arms to ukraine to defend itself, which i think defensive arms are reasonable but without a diplomatic strategy, pouring weapons into and hoping for the best i think is a very dangerous approach. the question is, where are we now? i think the one flow of hope is congress. the recent saudi decision to collaborate with russia and oil prices has caused great anger in congress. there is a bill by ro khanna and blumenthal that would suspend our sales to saudi arabia and support for at least a year. there's a war powers resolution and the house and senate that would cut off all u.s. military support for saudi arabia and push it to finally end it's brutal war in yemen. while biden has fallen back from

the kinds of promises he made when he was being elected, there is still a strong core in congress for more restrained armed sales. i think saudi arabia and uae are sort of in the center of that but it is a larger issue. amy: so what caused president biden to change his position on egypt and saudi arabia, which he said he would be taking a very different approach on the beginning of his term? how powerful is the military-industrial complex? i mean, we sought the beginning president biden pulls out of afghanistan, nato looked nearly like it was possibly going to disband and now everything has turned around. >> there are two pieces. one is the outmoded ideology that the united states has to have global military dominance and in order to do that, need to

sell weapons, you need to make some unsavory alliances in order to be able to protect u.s. powers in various parts of the world. they have fallen back into that mode. but then of course the weapons industry. we found in our report that at the $100 billion in new major arms sales offers under biden, more than half involve weapons built by just four companies. lockheed martin, boeing, general dynamics, and raytheon. those companies are doing everything they can to make sure u.s. sales to us many countries as possible and wide array of systems as possible. they have 300 lobbyists just amongst those four companies. they employ former government employees, former heads of the pentagon arms sales agency. jobs related to arms sales as a way to get members of congress to support things they might otherwise oppose.

that is the military bedrock that every administration has to contend with. of course we have also seen foreign influence. most recently revealed "the washington post come from many military officials are on the payroll of saudi arabia and the uae another repression of -- repressive regimes help them shape their military. coming from the military knowing you're going to get a payoff, they also influence how they treat those regimes when you are in power in the military. there's a lot of money at stake. it shapes the policy and ways that are detrimental to human rights and peace and stability. very good for lockheed martin, raytheon, and their cohorts. amy: do you find when you question the massive u.s. military funding for ukraine that you are attacked by the establishment in united states for being pro-russia? >> well, i think -- there's a

lot of that going around. it has got a very cold war flavor to it, obviously. but i think the question is, how do you stop the killing? how do you in this war -- end this war where ukraine moves forward as a nation we don't have a long grinding work, where the pieces go on indefinitely? are you don't risk u.s.-russian confrontation, confrontation between nuclear powers that could escalate to a nuclear level? our organization supportive of supplying weapons to ukraine to defend itself, but that cannot be a one note policy is certainly not a policy that says we're going to crush putin that backed him into a corner. former of the joint chiefs, lead pointed out, that is what you least want to do. yet to look at in offramp is

even president biden said with respect his concerns about the nuclear issue. there has to be a offramp but they have not defined that. we don't know perhaps there is some sort of behind the scenes talks going on. there has to be a diplomatic strategy, diplomatic track. he can't just be about weapons and we're going to defeat putin. as satisfying as that might be, and nuclear power, don't want to make them think is survival is in the mix here because you don't know what that will lead to. it has got to be a discussion on the merits of what the balance of diplomacy versus support for defense of ukraine. it is been hard to have that conversation. it has to happen and i think it will happen. amy: bill, talk about your recommendations. for example, strengthening the ability of congress to block dangerous sales by requiring congressional approval for major

deals. >> well, when the act was passed in the 1970's, because the arms sales were going through the roof in the middle east and elsewhere, congress had very little oversight or even information about it, congress was given the right to vote down major deals. but as a result, various court cases, they had to have a veto-proof majority in both houses. never occurred. there was a devoted down under trump on saudi arabia, but he vetoed that congressional action and congress could not overcome the veto. this approach would say for major sales of consequence, congress has to actually approve it. it has to be a positive congressional vote of approval. so they don't need a vo-prepay geordie, puts power in the hands of congress over these sales that could get the u.s. involved

in major conflicts. very much what was intended decades ago terms of congress's role but has never truly been fulfilled, national security powers act, other avenues for this might come about but it would make a big difference -- the public would have a much stronger role because they could press congress some of these things like arming the saudi regime and congress would have the power to really do something about it. amy: yes right now group of democrats calling for the u.s. to cease selling arms. you're talking about multi multibillion dollars to saudi arabia after the kingdom joined russia in announcing it will cut oil production by as much as 2 million barrels a day, bill. >> yes. you have ro khanna and senator blumenthal of connecticut. yeah senator menendez who said we should cut off secured corporation, although he left a bit of a loophole of what might

be left over for defending u.s. personnel. hiis a less clear -- i think it will be growing support in congress for some sort of arms cut off because biden went to saudi arabia kind of hat in hand, begging bin salman to do something about oil prices and he did exactly the opposite. he did a collaboration with russia, which is a slap in the face to biden. just underscores the fact you can do business with this regime and these arms sales as a way to influence to do anything to benefit the united states is nonsense. it is a fools aaron. i think congress is recognize this and there may be some renewed b hi things like a war powers resolution or direct caught off the suspension of arms. we are at another turning point.

the question is, can this lead to real change? we had the murder of jamal khashoggi, huge upsurge of concern and congress, new attention to the role of saudi arabia and the war in yemen. at the saudis seem to have dodged that. now we have another chance to rethink that. congress and the public are going to have to push the administration has said there will be consequences for saudi arabia, but they have not specified what those consequences will be. there's a danger they will somehow once again keep the arms sales fun. amy: bill hartung, thank you for being with us, national security and or -- foreign policy expert at the quincy institute for responsible statecraft. we will link to your report "promoting stability or fueling conflict? the impact of u.s. arms sales on national and global security." he is author of a book titled "prophets of war: lockheed martin and the making of the military-industrial complex."

next up, we go to jackson, mississippi come to speak with the naacp about the epa civil rights investigation into the roots of jackson's water crisis. stay with us. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: "mississippi song" by dorothy moore. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. as we turn now to jackson, mississippi, where the environmental protection agency is launching a civil rights investigation into whether state officials discriminated against jackson's majority-black residents when it refused to use federal funds to address the city's dangerous water crisis. the epa said thursday it's probing mississippi's department of health and department of environmental quality over its role in the crisis that left tens of thousands of mostly black households without drinking water. jackson's main water treatment plant was damaged after flooding in august, and viral videos showed brown liquid flowing from taps. in 2021, residents lost access to drinking water for weeks

after a deep winter freeze. even when the water is running, residents have faced month's long boil water orders. a complaint filed by the naacp led to the epa's investigation. naacp president derrick johnson lives in jackson and called the state's record of divestment systemic neglect. mississippi has received federal funds to address drinking water needs since 1996 but gave jackson funds just three times. for more, we're joined from jackson, mississippi, by abre' conner, director of the naacp's center for environmental and climate justice. welcome to democracy now! it is great to have you with us. why don't you lay out the issue, including the governor mocking jackson for its water crisis and what congress allocated for jackson and yet it did not actually go there. >> to your point earlier about jackson only getting federal

funds, three of the last 25 years, that really kind of goes to the heart of what is the issue. the water in jackson has been weapized against them byhe governor, by the state. because often times, federal funding for water infrastructure flows to the state first. even though we have the promise of historically disadvantaged communities like jackson, mississippi, to be prioritized whenever it comes to federal funding, it is not necessarily always the case. amy: so last month, mississippi governor tate reeves came under criticism for disparaging his own capital city jackson. this is reeves speaking to the groundbreaking ceremony for jones capital llc headquarters. >> after take on this is a great day.

great day to not be in jackson. amy: "always a great day to not be in jackson." jackson is overwhelmingly african-american, over 80% of the city. talk about this. >> so governor reeves has mocked jackson residents. the governor thinks it is a joke. that was one of the reasons why we felt it was so important to file this title vi complaint with the epa because it is not fair that jackson residents for decades have seen the disinvestment in their cities, at the state capital, and also majority black. but you have a governor who is making comments like that and individuals don't even trust their tapwater, where they're spending their tax dollars with a should be able to have safe drinking water and that is not

the case. at this title vi complaint demonstrates we are not going to be criticized and allow for someone who is in an elected position in the state to be able to allocate federal funds to places like jackson to get away with discriminated against the largest black city. this is something governor reeves has been doing for a while. even as lieutenant, when he was treasure, he utilizes positions to try to harm jackson residents. this is been a long time coming. he have a number of black men who have asked for funding to fix the water infrastructure in jackson, mississippi, and because there been neglect, because there's been intentional disinvestment, quite frankly, for a number of years, the numbers keep growing for how much it will actually cost to fix the water infrastructure in

jackson. this is also -- again, there was supposed to have been a prioritization of funding, federal funding in places like jackson, mississippi, but because the money flows to the states first and they get the opportunity to, quite frankly, weaponize these funds that are supposed to be utilized jackson against them. amy: last month, you testified on the hearing of water infrastructure. in your prepared remarks, said "the effect of climate change on black people has finally come into national focus because black people experience the most horrific impacts from historic disinvestment in communities." can you elaborate on this? >> well, what we have now is for years black communities have faced intentional disinvestment. when you look at places like

allens were that tried to build in california come this into valley california nearly 100 years ago, the reason they were not able to actually [indiscernible] the company move the wells to neighboring cities, nonblack cities. we have seen the disinvestment in other black cooties. we have seen it in flint. [indiscernible] the governor fails to respond in a timely manner. now we're finally getting to a place where we see what is happening in jackson. we see congress opening up an investigation with homeland security as well. then we have the epa who is [indiscernible]

for years, and time where the epa was that even opening up title vi -- it got to a space were quite frankly groups felt they needed to actuay sue the epa to get them to do their jobs. it is a time we really havan opportunity to make right the wrongs that have happened to black cooties and other historically disadvantaged communities -- black communities and other historically disadvantaged communities. it also demonstrates to this complaint, it is going to prioritize groups who have been part of this effort and that we are able to actually get the resources to flow directly to jackson. amy: you have a letter that was

written to the governor by democratic representatives bennie thompson of mississippi and carolyn maloney of new york asking how jackson's water system is crumbling despite congress authorizing hundreds of millions of dollars last year to jackson. and compare that to the white suburbs right outside jackson. >> yeah. it is shameful that the governor has not prioritized funding the water infrastructure that is needed in jackson, mississippi. in my conversations, not only -- with former mayors as well, this is not something the governor did not have notice of. there's been a long history of black mayors actually asking the governor to fund the water infrastructure in jackson

mississii and just as recently as last year, the governor vetoed $47 million actually going to jackson mississippi. and the funding that jackson did getting end up having additional strings attached to it. the only city in this state that has two different approval processes that has to go to in order to get projects approved. it has to go to the department of environmental quality and also to hartman a finance and admin is -- partner finance and administration. the only city in the entire state that has to go through this process. there is no actual legislative history as to why specifically only jackson has to go through the number oprocesses but actually goes to the disinvestment that jackson has continued to see a number of hurdles that jackson has to go

through in order to try to rebuild. it is not on people at the local level are not trying. they have of millions of dollars with a bipartisan infrastructure law. hundreds of lines of dollars that were placed -- millions of dollars that were placed for places likjackson, mississippi, and that has not happened. knowing it is going to take a lot more -- [indiscernible] would completely remove jackson from even able to apply for the

money [indiscernible] when you see these games being played by the governor, by the state, when you have a black community in the middle of the water crisis -- by the way, the most recent plan was submitted during the midst of this water crisis. you know there's a level of intentionality to every single step governor reeves has taken. amy: obviously, this reeks of flint. it sounds so similar to flint. we did a democracy now! documentary called "thursday for democracy" looking at flint where we were saying this is not just environmental problem come the lack of access to clean water in flint, michigan, and other majority black cities, this is a problem of democracy. how will your complaint, how -- is it called a lawsuit?

how will it affect cities like flint? >> it is numinous trade of complaint that you're able -- administrative complaint that you're able to file directly with the agency. in this situation, the environmental protection agency. filed under title vi for purposes of regulatory, oversee what is happening in the state. this complaint actually is representative of the number of years that historically disadvantaged communities, number one, could not realize the epa to help with issues related to discrimination and environmental hazards and environmental racism. this was an opportunity for the epa to demonstrate to these communities that it has been silent for a number of years that there also going to prioritize historically

disadvantaged communities ke jason, that they're going to prioritize the communities it left behind for almost a decade, and that they're going to try to come up with a solution that is going to center jackson residents. we hope it not only helps the residents in jackson because they have been dealing with this for years, but that it also can serve as a model for other governors who, quite frankly, have also been slow to respond to historically disadvantaged, black communities across the country so they can understand there is a mechanism that we can use to hold them accountable and say we're not going to allow for black communities to be left behind when we understand say drinking water, that living in communities where we are bearing the brunt of all of the pollution, that there is going to be a mechanism that we can utilize and eure we are

prioritized for. amy: abre' conr, thank you for being with us director for the , center for environmental and climate justice. next up would go to little rock. we will look at how the aclu is asking the supreme court to overturn an arkansas anti-vds law that penalizes companies that support boycotts of israel. we will speak to the publisher of the arkansas times who sued the state to overturn the law. we will also be joined by the aclu attorney who appealed to the supreme court and the director of the documentary boycott. back in 30 seconds. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. the aclu has just asked u.s. supreme court to overturn an arkansas law that requires al state contractors to sign a pledge declaring a will t boycott israel. arkansas is one of 35 u.s. states that have passed legislation to criminalize or discourage bds, that ishe boycott, divtment,nd nctions movement which seeks to boycott israel and israeli goods prote violatis of palestinn rights thaclu originally su arkans on beha of alan leritt, the publisher of "the arkansas times."

he appears in theew cumentar"boyco." >> object governmt sayin weot big o wad of ney ov here bute -- wilgive it to yo we willdvertise with youut here is some conditio that you need t meet rst, suc as he's e political position you need to take regarding foreignolicy, for god sake. and we are in arksas. amy: the documentary also looks at the case o a palestinian-american speech pathologist in texas. she lost her job of nine years for refusing to sign a pledge that she would "not boytt israel ding the rm of th contra." >>ave a mily mber that stl resides the occied teitory. i knowhat i've seen firsthand, the injustice, the inequality that goes on there.

basicay, the wle idea to ma it hard for tm to funconnd to ha any livelihood aall. hoollosures,rrestingoung chdren. i cod not ay qet a go alg with m le while know this law is going to make the case to coinue this kind of oppression against palestinians. amy: an excerpt from "boycott." we are joined by julia bacha, director of the 2021 documentary "boycott" and creative director of just vision media. brian hauss is with this, senior staff attorney at the aclu which

is asking the supreme court to overturn arkansas's bds boycott. and with us is alan leveritt, publisher of the arkansas times. alan, explain why it is you decided to try to overturn this law that was passed in arkansas. >> for us, it is basically a free speech issue. the state of arkansas is requiring us to take a political position in return for advertising. we are taxpayers here in arkansas. we have as much right is anyone else to do business, to earn that on our marriage and we're being told, no, have to to take a political position. you have to pass a political litmus test in order to do business. when we refused to sign and the state started shutting down power advertising, our state advertising, we sued.

we not boycotting anyone. for us, it is purely a first amendment issue. amy: explain how you saw this clause. you are a free newspaper. you rely on advertising for your income. involves a lot of state on you. talk about what happened. you've been getting money for years. >> i started "the arkansas times" 48 years ago. we have always done businesses with the colleges, the health department, the hospitals. -- after this law wasassed we did not pay a attention to it. it was aays the other lture war exeise and we considered it meaningless. we started getting these notices, you need to sign ts. i ke drawinghem away there hundreds of thousands of transactions in the state of arkansas -- any state does eve day, everything from eet rock hangers school teachers

i just gured, how they had could ever enforce this? it is a stupid law to begin with. there was one purchasing manag at one clege that stayedn it untihe final overrode th marketin deptment -- amy: talk about -- let's talk about who brought this law forward, the republican majority leader of the arkansas state senate, senator hester, the sponsor of the law. we want to go now to a clip of what he had to say. he is a sponsor of the arkansas anti-boycott bill as he talked about his religiousotivatn inassing t bil >> t sta is not otective inhehurch th the church is protectefrom thetate. i would say if there 3 memrs the nate, is a third five memberwould say they're believers d follows of jus chri.

i was a probly half would identify as evangelal. to understand how important it is to support israel. >> the bill is passed. amy: state senator bart hester would later say he then hopes jews will believe in jesus christ. i want to bring julia bacha into the discussion. he directed the film. you also have two remarkable moments in the film. one with democratic senator who you caught up with an you ask him about whether he supported the bill austin he had an amazing response. talk about him. >> we started making this film, there is very little public conversation or debate about the anti-boycott laws and the consequences for everyday

americans who want to exercise their political rights. we decided we are going to ask questions. we went into the arkansas state capital and had the opportunity to interview senator bart hester . as part of our time and it to capitol, we also met with senator greg leaden, democrat, who voted for the bill, like that vast majority of democrats and arkansas and many other states across the country did post many of those democrats today, say they did not actually understand what this bill meant. they did not understand the consequences and how it violated the first amendment rights of americans. i think a lot of the reason why some of the democrats are beginning to shift their opinion now is due to the lawsuits at the aclu has brought around the country -- there have been several. in all of them except for the one by alan leveritt, the courts have decided the anti-boycott

bills are unconstitutional. at the same time, these bills have continued to proliferate, now targeting other areas. there now anti-boycott for the fossil fuel industry, anti-boycott bills targeting the ability to boycott weapons industry. i think it is critical to start asking our elected officials why they voted for these bills and if they understand what -- amy: in arkansas, the democrats said, listen, we vote on thousands of bills and said i would not support it now, i did not realize. then, julia, you interview the rabbi of the largest synagogue in arkansas based in little rock and he says he wasn't approached on this. he said, i consider myself a major supporter of israel but i don't like this bill. >> we found there is a

discrepancy between the motivation that some of the right wing conservative evangelical elected officials are saying it motivated them, which is based on a reading of the bible that leads them to believe they need to do everything they can possibly do to restore the biblical borders of israel, which ultimately, according to their reading of the bible, leading to the second coming of jesus christ when if senator hester speaks about that in the film, jews will have one less chance to convert to christianity or they will go to hell. they're bringing this to the policymaking. but when you actually look at how diverse the jewish community is on this issue and we got to talk with the rabbi at the largest in gog in arkansas who

says he is absolutely opposed anti-boycott bills and talks about how important first amendment rights and free speech is for all communit's in america. amy: "the new york times" did a piece on your case, alan leverett, the publisher of "arkansas times" with an interesting cover the picture of a typewriter and he says, "we are a small arkansas newspaper, why is the state making us sign a pledge about israel? if you can then take us through your legal challenges, your wins and losses so far, and then we are going to bring brian hauss into this conversation who is now appealing to the supreme court. >> this bill has been passed at some 30 odd legislatures throughout the country, basically the american legislative exchange council where these cookie-cutter bills

are done with the republican legislators around the country. and so we sued the state. we lost in federal court here in little rock and then also we appealed and we won in the eighth circuit, very conservative court. the state appealed that to the full circuit and we lost before the full circuit. so now we have appealed to the u.s. supreme court and we are awaiting to see if we will get a hearing. amy: garbo the publisher and a farmer -- you are but the publisher of "arkansas times" and a farmer? >> i am. i am very small. at about 1000 vines. i live on my great grandparents farm. we have been in arkansas forever. i inherited my great-grandfather's old log house where my grandmother was

raise. i have the most beautiful place on earth. a very lucky to live in arkansas . that is why we pubsh "the arkansas times." speaking of forms, can also speak about climate change in this issue of this bill, this anti-boycott bill being used as a template for so many others like not going after the fossil fuel industry. i want to turn to the president and the foundation for middle east peace, lara friedman, who is speaking in julia's film "boycott." >>ay not ce about palesti, but you ould care is bein used aa hook to legislate in your state at the federal level against free speech. how ny wds wou have to change in th llationo use it to contion and there quash ee speecof anyone who

is for, s, black ves matt or is involved in protesting for environmental reasons? itsike 10 rds. it is a tete. why people are not more worried about it is just baffling. amy: brian hauss, you're the aclu senior staff attorney and have appealed this case to the u.s. supreme court. just last week we did an hour on rosa parks, the rebellious life of misses rosa parks, new documentary out on peacock. of course she and dr. martin luther king led a boycott, a bus boycott of the camry transportation system to get it to integrate, which happened like a year later. can you put this in context and why you decided to take alan leveritt's case to the supreme court? >> sure thing. i think it is important to step back and realize boycotts have

always been a fundamental part of american politics. it is not for nothing we say people vote with their pocketbooks. this country was founded on british goods to protest parliament and boycotts have been part and parcel of american politics ever since from them mccamley boss boycott to the boycott of apartheid south africa to the boycott across the political spectrum today whether it is boycotts of businesses that support planned parenthood or businesses that support the national rifle association. what the eighth circuit held in alan's case is it my prote speech or association promoting a boycott, it does not protect the purchasing decision at the heart of the boycott itself. what that would mean is states have the power to selectively suppress, censor, and penalize boycott my favorite topics like boycotts of israel. that decision not only flies in the face of common sense, it also contradicts the supreme court's binding and unanimous

landmark president and naacp versus claiborne hardware. that is what we think they need to step into and correct this fundamental erro amy: can you talk about the other cases? julia talks about them in the film "boycott" using the example of an arizona law and also what happened in texas with the palestinian-american pediatric audio pathologist who could not believe one year when she was just signing off on her contract to have her job with the schools and then said, you will not support any kind of boycott of israel. she is this local pathologist. why she talking about israel in a local contract? she won? >> she won. we brought cases in kansas, arizona, texas, and other organization about the lawsuit in georgia, and in all of those cases, the federal courts held

that these laws violate the first amendment rights to participate in a politically motivated consumer boycott. i think what these cases show is how deep these laws reach into americans private lives. they're asking people from all different walks of life, whether a speech pathologist in texas, a lawyer in arizona, a substitute teacher who wanted to just participate in a teacher training program in kansas -- all of these people are being forced to go on record and say, i am not participating and boycotts of israel. they are essentially being asked to disavow the first to memorize as a condition of earning a living. that fundamentally violates -- amy: what does this mean for this to go to the supreme court? first they have to decide whether to take it come is that right? >> yes. first we are filing for the justices does sign if this is the case they will review this term. four votes are necessary to take it up for consideration. amy: what would this mean for you, alan leveritt, as we begin

to wrap up? you've been living with this case for several years. what kind of response have you gotten in little rock and around your beloved state of arkansas? >> julia pointed out most people are still unaware this is the law because it was passed through without any fanfare, without any real news coverage. so most people when i tell them or they asked me about it and i explained to them, they just kind of look at me blankly and said, what does that have to do with arkansas? it has nothing to do with arkansas and every thing to do with culture wars that are being waged in this country, particularly by the republican legislature. amy: that is alan leveritt, publisher of "the arkansas times" and tomato farmer. brian hauss, aclu senior staff attorney, and julia bacha,

director of the film "boycott." just had a film that just premiered at the film festival at the algerian refugee camps. that does it for our show. happy belated birthday to robby

pppxxxx■]■t■]■o linton besser: on the coast of west africa, the ships arrive day after day with an unrelenting cargo. in ghana, they call them "obroni wawu," or "the clothes of dead white men." emmanuel ajaab: take this bale from australia. linton: they're the charity shop castoffs from the western world. emmanuel: dirty. linton: it's sweat. emmanuel: see. yeah, rubbish. it's like a insult. linton: too many of them arrive in unwearable condition. while the trade in used clothes has created thousands of jobs,