12/14/22 12/14/22 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from new york, this is democracy now! >> i am willing to face prosecution right now. [indiscernible]

amy: as president biden faces growing pressure to drop charges against wikileaks founder julian assange, we will speak to pentagon papers whistleblower daniel ellsberg and john young, the founder of cryptome.org, who have both asked the department of justice to indict them with -- for processing or publishing the same documents at the center of the case against julian assange. this comes as supporters of assange fear his extradition to the united states could be just weeks away. then after 41 years in prison, most of it on death row, mumia abu-jamal faces what could be his last chance this friday for a trial. we will speak to a state judge in arkansas, wendell griffen, who is probably calling for the release of the imprisoned journalist and former black panther in pennsylvania and directly appealed to the judge here in mumia abu-jamal's appeal. >> often you hear judges talking

about following proceeded. but as the judge mentioned, mumia abu-jamal has been dend the opportuni of court proceedings. amy: all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. president biden signed the respect for marriage act into law tuesday, enshrining federal protections for same-sex and interracial marriages. biden spoke at the celebratory event, which featured musical performers and a white house illuminated in rainbow colors. pres. biden: racism, anti-semitism, homophobia, transphobia are all connected. the antidote to hate is love.

amy: the new law would not prevent states from banning same-sex marriage if the conservative-led supreme court overturns obergefell v. hodges, but it would force those states to recognize marriages from another state. it also repeals the 1996 defense of marriage act. among the speakers at the white house ceremony were gina and heidi nortonsmith, plaintiffs in the lawsuit that led to marriage equality in massachutts. this is heidi nortonsmith. >> it takes the efforts of many to advance the arc of history toward justice. even now there are so many places whe people in our community are under attack. the work will continue, but look at how far we have come. amy: in iran, at least 400 people have been sentenced to up to 10 years in prison for their involvement in anti-government protests according to officials. human rights groups say over 14,000 people have been arrested across iran since mobilizations began in mid-september, sparked

by the death of 22-year-old mahsa amini in the custody of the so-called morality police. meanwhile, 26-year-old iranian soccer player amir nasr-azadani has reportedly been sentenced to death for his involvement in the protests. at least two protesters have already been executed. the u.n. warns somalia could be facing famine withinonths and as many as half a million childe as many as half a milln childree as many as half a million childe -- children under the age of five could die by mid- hunger 2023. has already claimed many lives as over 200,000 people are facing catastrophic food shortages due to a protracted drought, rising food costs and violent insurgent attacks. 3 million people have been displaced. some analysts say somalia is alreadexperiencing famine and are urging an official declaration to help garner urgently needed aid and attention. in the democratic republic of congo, at least 120 people have been killed and dozens of others injured by floods and landslides caused by torrential rains in the capital kinshasa.

major roads were submerged in muddy water or destroyed by sinkholeshile homes collapsed as rescue efforts for any survivors continue. local residents blamed government neglect. >> we have elected government unable to give its people what they need. this road has been an threat of collapse for a long time. we alerted the situation to the authority's for a long time. amy: in south africalawmakers have voted against impeaching president cyril ramaphosa over a report that says he hid undeclared, stolen money at his game farm. the report prompted calls by opponents for ramaphosa to resign, but lawmakers from the ruling african national congress party mostly supported the president in their vote. itomes as ramaphosa will seek reelection as leader of the anc at its national conference starting friday. a new unicef report finds that over 11,000 children have been killed or injured in the u.s.-backed, saudi-led war in yemen since 2015. a six-month ceasefire between

warring parties expired in october. meanwhile, u.s. senator bernie sanders thdrew an expected vote on his yemen war powers resolution tuesday evening, saying he is in talks with the biden administration. sanders said he would bring the resolution back if they could not reach an agreement on ending u.s. support for thear. in ukraine, officials say their air defenses shot down 13 russian drones earlier today targeting the capital kyiv. meanwhile, the u.s. is reportedly finalizing plans to send its long-range patriot air defense system to ukraine. the eastern city of bakhmut has been nearly decimated as russian forces have continued to ramp up its attacks. this is a 70-year old resident who this week decided to flee her hometown after months of intense shelling. >> i do not think the situation would go this far. i thought it would not be that

terrifying. i could not imagine the whole city would be destroyed. amy: a french court convicted eight people over the 2016 terror attack in nice when a man plowed a truck through a crowd celebrating bastille day, killing 86 people and injuring hundreds. the driver, mohamed lahouaiej-bouhlel, was shot dead on the scene by police. the other men convicted tuesday for helping the mass killer received prison terms ranging from 2 to 18 years. another boat carrying me 40 -- appearing dozens of asylum -- boat carrying dozens of asylum seekers has capsized in the english channel, with reports early today of at least three people dead in the freezing temperatures. the tragedy comes a day after british prime minister rishi sunak vowed to enact even harsher policies to block asylum seekers from entering britain through the channel. new zealand passed the world's first lifetime tobacco ban, barring anyone born after 2008 from ever buying cigarettes and

dramatically reducing the availability of tobacco. the percentage of the population that cannot buy tobacco will increase each year, with the goal of a smoke-free future. this is associate health minister ayesha verrall. >> there is no goodeason for product to be sold that kills half the people that use it. i can tell you we will end this to the future as we pass this legislation. amy: back in the united states, outgoing democratic oregon governor kate brown has commuted the sentences of all 17 people on death row to life in prison without the possibility of parole. governor brown called the death penalty "dysfunctional and immoral." in kentucky, the city of louisville has agreed to pay $2 million to settle two lawsuits filed by kenneth walker, the boyfriend of breonna taylor, who was shot and killed and her own home during a 2020 police raid. walker was with taylor the night

of the fatal shooting and fired a shot at police as they burst into taylor's home while serving a no-knock warrant. walker had said the officers never identified themselves before entering the home and never attempted to save taylor as she lay dying after she was struck by a hail of gunfire. charges against walker stemming from that night were dropped. in dimock, pennsylvania, residents expressed outrage after the department of environmental protection lifted its drilling moratorium on coterra energy just weeks after the fracking company pleaded "no contest" to polluting the community's water. coterra, formerly known as cabot oil & gas, also agreed to pay $16 million to build a new public water system and pay local water bills for 75 years. food & water watch said allowing coterra to drill again was an unconscionable betrayal of suffering communities and urged incoming governor josh shapiro to undo the deal when he takes office. scientists and u.s. officials have hailed a major milestone in nuclear fusion technology,

igniting theopes breaktough could ld to a cleaenergy fure. resechers califora' lawrence livermo nationa laborary last ek ccessful achievenet ener gain through fion ignion, neratingore powethan is used to eate theeaction. like fison, whicis cuently us by nuclr power ants, fuon does t produc long-lasting nuclear waste or carbon emissions. however, scientists say it will likely be decades before the technology is perfected enough to begin producing energy at scale. the experiment is likely to mo imdiately benefit thu.s. litary a its nucar wpons arsena this is secretary of energy jennifer granholm. >> simply put, this is one of the most impressive scientific feats of the 21st century. this milestone moves us one significant step closer to the possibility of zero carbon

abundant fusion energy powering our society. amy: and today marks 10 years since the 2012 sandy hook massacre which claimed the lives of 20 schoolchildren and six educators. the children would have been high school juniors today. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. pressure is growing on president biden to drop charges against wikileaks founder julian assange, who has been jailed in britain since his arrest in april of 2019. the biden administration is asking the u.k. government to extradite him to the u.s., where he faces up to 175 years in prison on espionage and hacking charges. wikileaks says assange could be extradited within weeks. assange was first arrested 12 years ago this month on december 7, 2010.

after a period under house arrest, he lived in the ecuadorian embassy in london where he had political asylum from 2012 until 2019. five major news organizations, including "the new york times," which once partnered with wikileaks, recently called on the biden administration to drop charges against assange writing -- "this indictment sets a dangerous precedent, and threatens to undermine america's first amendment and the freedom of the press." the letter goes on to say, "publishing is not a crime." the letter was signed by "the new york times," "the guardian" in britain, "le monde" in france, "der spiegel" in germany, and "el país" in spain. meanwhile, pentagon papers whistleblower daniel ellsberg recently revealed he was in possession of confidential documents containing evidence of u.s. war crimes leaked by former military analyst chelsea manning and given to him as backup by wikileaks. in a recent message to president

biden and the justice department, ellsberg wrote on twitter, "i am as indictable as he is on the exact same charges." the founder of the website cryptome.org has also written to the justice department asking to be indicted as well. cryptome's founder john young says he should be added as a co-defendant in the prosecution of assange because he published some of the same leaked government documents at the center of the u.s. case against assange. cryptome is a website that began in 1996 and is seen by many as a precursor to wikileaks. young also helped assange start wikileaks in 2006. while assange faces 175 years in u.s. prison if he is extradited, and convicted, the u.s. government has never moved to prosecute young, who says he published the unredacted state department cables two days prior to wikileaks.

the u.s. government has never even asked young to remove the documents. well, today in a democracy now! exclusive, we are joined by both pentagon papers whistleblower daniel ellsberg and cryptome's john young. we welcome you both to democracy now! dan ellsberg, let's begin with you. why don't you lay out what you are asking the justice department to do. >> i am asking them to look closely at the charges they have brought against actually past whistleblowers and chelsea manning and julian assange, potentially against me and john young, because as lawyers said at the time of my first trial back in 1971, leading scholar of love information at that point said that if the espionage act

were used against someone who had done what i had admittedly done, copy and distribute 7000 pages of top-secret documents, that law was unconstitutional. and that has been true ever since. it was unconstitutional against sources as it has been done several dozen times, especially in this century under president obama and trump and now biden. it is also unconstitutional against journalists. they never tried it, even under president obama when biden was vice president, they backed up because of the clear unconstitutionalality of the first amendment. by raising this constitutional issue that i focused on particular, i am showing a law can used absurdly against

someone like me who admittedly retained and failed to deliver -- these are the words of 18 ufc 793 paragraph e. i know that so well because i was the first person charged with that forgiving information to the public. i am as guilty in their eyes as assange, how come they haven't come after me for this? i published the same a year ago and raised this challenge. the media who have been derelict in informing on the law which was always potentially there to indict them, if they do this and really raise the issue of a necessity to abandon or strongly amend the espionage act so as to exclude whistleblowers who are trying to inform the american

public, if they want to continue where they are, they can come after me -- which means anyone who retains a copy of "the new york times" which has the word "classified" in it and fails to turn over that copy to authorities authorized to receive it is as guilty as i am under the plain language of that act. i british type official is barred from america after a revolution by the first amendment in the united states, freedom of the press. they don't havehat. since my prosecution, the justice department has been using the espionage act intended obviously for entirely different reasons -- spies securely give infoation to america's enemies , especially in wartime -- they have been using it as if it was an official secrets act. if they succeed with julian sange, with extraditing them

-- which biden could stop tomorrow -- we will not have a first amendment as if we did not fight a war of independence with respect anything they regarded as related to national defense. free speech is pretty much out the door. i want to raise the issue the act even promotes the possibility of prosecuting people like me who do not even published -- i was a backup for julian assge -- did not have to publish, in who handles that information, and any reader of "the new york times." amy: john young, dan ellsberg is perhaps the most famous whistleblower in the world and releasing the pentagon papers. you are not as well known. you founded cryptome.org back in

the 1990's. explain why you are saying if julian assange is guilty, you should be jailed asell. >> looking at the indictment of julian assange in the 18 citations of his charge, as far as i could tell those all apply to me and cryptome that we have been doing this now since 1996. we published classified information, secret information from other countries, the united states. i am unclear why they never charged someone like as. we are one odozens of people who are putting out this kind of information. this has been going on quite a long while. our sense is they are trying to use assange as an example.

that to me is vindication -- he should not face this alone. all of us who are in similar workho serve the pubc rather than the government should do more than just protest. i thinke have to raise more hell. we have to publish more. as our obligation as citizens [indiscernible] national security people are complete out of control. calling assange a threat against everyone else. not only in the u.s., but around the world. anti-democratic. help combat that sharing the responsibility that mr. ellsberg and julian assange is facing. we hope others will step up as

well. i the way, we're not publishers. we are private citizens. we are not doing anything more than security our constitutional right to the first amendment -- inserting our constitutional right to the fit amendment. this against assange woulde illegal against an american citizen. we think it is select prosecution and it should cease. amy: on monday, you file this motion against u.s. government for violating your constitutional rights to provide unlimited documents to the public. specifically in the case of julian assange, say you published at cryptome.org two days before wikileaks did, state department cables. you say the same thing that wikileaks revealed. so you are guilty of the same crime. >> yes, exactly. it is not a crime, a revelation of privileged information.

we do not see it crimina we see it as ee speech. it is all a citizen has to work with. it is available and worthwhile for the public to know. it is been there now for 12 yes. no complaint by the u.s. government against us. amy: i want to ask you, john young, u.k. prosecution responded to your request to be included as a codefendant. what did they say? >> they said the prosecution -- they said it is u.s. government handling this.

basically, resnsibility -- [indiscernible] is what they are saying. amy: dan ellsberg, if julian assange were extradited, he would go to trial here. if convicted, he faces up to 100 75 years in prison. talk about what you think that trial would look like. >> i presume his lawyers would begin, would raise the constitutional issue right at the beginning. here is something i think that has never gone public but i have been well aware of it, the legal aid facing the same charges 50 years ago told me many years later thahis recommendation was to the judge that our

defense brief this prosecution was manifestly unconstitutional and the espionage act should be rescinded as unconstitutional -- should be followed. it wasis understanding the judge understood with that but it was the judge's first case and to rule a major piece of legislation like the espionage act unconstitutional in the first days of his first case was something he did not want to take on. so he tookhat under advisement. the judge ordered at the end of the trial -- the trial ended just before it went to the jury -- crimes, by the way, that have been revealed to be committed exactly against julian assange. these were crimes that led to charges against me, as they should have. assange, like me, was illegally

surveilled. even his lawyers and doctors' discussions. efforts made of kidnapping and killing him, just as a dozen cia assets were brought up from miami on may 3, 19 73, by president nixon with orders to incapacitate daniel ellsberg totally, whatever that means. obviously, assange should be let out for that. lawyers were undoubtedly moved to introduce that evidence as well. if there constitutional argument still being under advisement. that argument has, by the way, never been addressed by the supreme court. the classification system rests on the legislation. it is an executive branch set of regulations a corporation or union or whatever private group

-- no legislation. but the first amendment does keep the government from enacting acts that would limit speech to that extreme except then while -- perhaps this is pending. under advisement, the acts that should end his prosecution of listening in his bathroom in case he went in there for private discussions with his lawyers and all that went to the cia. if it continues, then i presume he will -- i'm certain he will plead not guilty -- not with respect to the facts which i stipulate entirely, i did what i did, but the very point john young made a moment ago, we were not admitting -- julian would not be admitting to any crime

anymore than i did. he had violated regulations which put into criminal law constitute a constitutional violation of his rights and of the possibility of democracy. so we were pleading not guilty on the grounds we had violated no constitutional law. amy: i want to -- dan, i want to read from the joint open letter from "the new york times," "the guardian" in britain, "le monde" in france, "der spiegel" in germany, and "el país" in spain. they said "it saves a dangerous precedent that threatens to undermine the first amendment, the freedom of the press, "obtaining and disclosing sensitive information when necessary in the public interest is a core part of the daily work of journalists. if that work is criminalize, public discourse and are democracies are made significantly weaker. holding governments accountable as part of a core mission of a free press and a democracy."

can you talk about having the pentagon papers published by "the new york times" decades ago, dan ellsberg, what it means to have "the times" and these other major papers in the world demanding the biden administration drop this case and whether you have heard from the biden administration? >> well, i am very happy that "the times" and "the guardian" and -- i missing somebody. they have finally realized, the foreign ones, they could be extradited just like julian, an australian, who is being should for this. anyone of those editors is as indictable as he is for exactly

the same charges. charges that could be brought against me, holding material, not delivery it up, not telling the fbi, etc. so they finally realize what i've been telling them for 50 years, literally, since my trial , without success. that is the plain language of this act apprised to them as well as to their sources and to their leaders or tingling who handles this information. they paid no attention for 50 years. to my knowledge, none of those papers have lifted a finger for any of their sources are legal processes for anything. they don't seem to regard sources as in responsibility of theirs, even if they have gotten a pulitzer prize for those efforts. no effort to their defense, nor have they informed themselves about the law. for decades, probably saw me as crying wolf.

there had not yet been a case against a journalist. the language was right there to do it. if a president came along and a justice department that was prepared to experiment with using it more broadly against a journalist. well, finally, that happened under trump and they have suddenly come to realize he is right against out extradition and a court case which will raise these issues. i am trying to point out for them to go even further. i had all of the material that julian assange had from chelsea manning. i did not publish it because i was have backup and t newspapers ended up publishing it, except, by the way, amy, for a particularly atrocious -- video report in the middle east for that killed over 100 women and children. although it was don't it

happened, the court -- the report in the video of that in a rack was held. it may not have even been classified as the collateral murder wasn't classified, but that does not mean it was not held closely. chelsea got it only under -- she saw it initially. was very moved by it. she says in her wonderful book i just read, describes the impact of seeing that. much more than just reading words about it. but i had that at that time but i did not know it. i was merely retaining the documents and any discussion of what to do about them would wait. i did not know about the video. heather is our freedom of information act request for 12 years that has not gotten anywhere. you and i discussed that when we

heard about the attack had not been released for reasons we did not know. trump the same, biden the same. we have discussed it here on democracy now! amy: before we end this segment, john young, founder of cryptome .org, you still have these documents up on cryptome.org that julian assange has been charged for at wikileaks? >> yes. amy: are you going to take them down? >> no. amy: has a government asyou to? >> i think this whole thing might be called espionage theater.

i think the justices are looking for a spectacle in the field of cybersecity, cybersecurity theater whh is trade threats. if you read these charges, their retitious -- they are repetitious. i think they want th tri for their own rposes. there is a hearing days ago where they were patting each other onhe back at assange's expense. i think they want this spectacle to feather their own desks. amy: i want to thank you, john young, for joining us, founder of cryptome.org. dan ellsberg, pentagon papers whistleblower, if you could stay with us. i want to ask you a question about the growing threat of nuclear war. stay with us. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: "true colors" at the white house tuesday during the celebration of president biden signing into law the respect for marriage act, which protects same-sex and interracial marriage rights at the federal level. she founded the nonprofit true colors find to expand education on lgbtq issues and he to end homelessness for lgbtq youth. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. we continue with daniel ellsberg, turning to another issue, growing threat of nuclear war beginning in the late 1950's before he became known for leaking the pentagon papers, daniel worked as a government consultant wre he drafted plans for nuclear war. he writes about this in his 2017 book " "the doomsday machine: confessions of a nuclear war planner." >> since the end of the cold

war, people have been focused on the possibility of a terrorist nuclear attack or an accident or some rogue nation using nuclear weapons. they are not focused and worried about the possibility of an all-out nuclear war between the u.s. and russia. with the end of the cold war, people have not thought about that very much. those who do follow it, they know it would be catastrophic. chance of an all-out war, the use of most of our missiles, strategic on both sides, is possible.

amy: the voice of daniel ellsberg in a video made for rootsaction. dan ellsberg is still with us. as tension rises between the united states and russia over ukraine, can you talk about not only the growing threat of nuclear war but how we can work against that? >> there was pressure a few years ago in congress, even adam smith, the chairman of the house armed services committee proposed abolishing icbm's which would actually if we did that come even unilaterally, we would be safer, the world would be safer from that possibility of escalation which exists right now. when biden says this is the most

dangerous moments is the cuban missile crisis -- which i was involved in in 1962 at a high staff level -- he is absolutely right. it is above all because of existence on both sides, which is even worse than having one side wh these hairtrigger icbm 's. putin talks about applying a small tactical use of small nuclear weapons. almost sure to escalate and the reason that has the possibility of destroying most human life on earth by nuclear winter, killing all harvests, is because from the moment a single small nuclear weapon if you hundred kilotons only, smaller than hiroshima, from the moment that was used, each side will be asking of its own icbm commanders, are they coming? might they be coming shortly? not in day but as this

escalates, should we wait or should we go first? that is because of the existence of these totally redundant hairtrigger weapons. so the first thing could be done is to get the armed services committee back from their having fatalistic leigh said, ok, northrop grumman needs the money , thousands of jobs. there is a revolving door between northrup and general lockheed -- general dynamics and lockheed. general austin comes from raytheon, for example, after he retired before him, bowing. they have a great investment and continuing things as they are. amy: 30 seconds. how do you reverse course? >> ok. the defense budget should be cut more than in half rather than

being increased right now. starting with the most dangerous weapons, the icbm's. no first use case which we should be using against putin right now and saying hifirst use threats like ours in the past are outrageous and illegal. let me say in connection with my past talk here, amy, i said i would plead not guilty if i were charged with possessing the classified documents from chelsea manning for the last 12 years. if i were charged with having participated in by nuclear war planning phase for years and construction of the doomsday machine here and there provocation of a doomsday machine later in the soviet union, i would not plead not guilty. i would plead guilty to having participated in the crime against hanity. and the same is true if i were to be tried on -- if i were to

be tried along with my colleagues, i presume, of a crime against humanity and aggressive war in vietnam. again, i could not plead not guilty to that. that is the difference. one of those threaten all life on earth. the secrecy system which i am trying to expose proposed here is part of that system. the threat is not only on our democracy but protecting these outrageous criminal, and moral plans -- immoral plans as part of a crime that not at all without victims. it would make victims of nearly every human on earth. amy: dan ellsberg, thank you for being with us, pentagon papers whistleblower, author of "the doomsday machine: confessions of a nuclear war planner." also the book "secrets: a memoir of vietnam and the pentagon papers." after 41 years in prison, mumia abu-jamal faces what could be

his last chance this friday for a new trial. we will speak with a state judge in arkansas who is calling on the philadelphia judge to hear new evidence that could exonerate mumia to lead to his release. stay with us. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: "give us justice" by thee sacred souls. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. after 41 years in prison, most of it on death row, the journalist and former black panther mumia abu-jamal faces what could be his last chance for new trial to consider newly discovered evidence in his conviction for the murder of police officer daniel faulkner. mumia abu-jamal, c evidence discovered in the philadelphia district attorney's office by the new da at the time, very

krasner in 2019, shows his try was chained ash tainted by misconduct like withholding of evidence and driving or coercing witnesses to lie. evidence in the boxes included notes from one of two key witnesses to prosecutors requesting "the money owed to me." on tuesday, united nations working group submitted an amicus brief for new trial to consider the evidence and also cited evidence of racial bias, quoting the statement by mumia abu-jamal's original trial judge overheard by a court stenographer when he said, "i am going to help them, the jury, fry that [beep]" the crucial clemens intended she plans to dismiss but would announce her final decision this

friday, december 16. judge clemons is a member of the archdiocese of philadelphia's commission on racial during -- healing. she spoke last year in a video by catholic philly about how catholics can address racial division by seeking the truth, justice, and reconciliation. i took one of the most important things to focus on his truth and reconciliation. a familiar cry in the street to the social justice protest was to no justice, no peace. while i know many people want peace, they really want quiet. peace requires justice and justice requires truth. therefore, i believe we start this with some truth and reconciliation, with some understanding of where we have come from, the historical

implications of that, how it is impacting people today, and how do we reconcile that history with where we are and where we want to go. amy: that is philadelphia county court of common judge lucretia clements will issue a decision on mumia abu-jamal's case friday. for more on this closely watched case, we are joined by another trial court judge from a prominent voice calling for a new trial in the release of mumia abu-jamal. that is wendell griffen, judge of the sixth judicial circuit of arkansas fifth division. he spent more than 10 years as a judge on the state court of appeals. he is retiring this month after almost a order of a century on the bench in a career that has included speaking out against the death penalty as well as the war in iraq. judge griffen is the pastor of new millennium church and author of "the fierce urgency of prophetic hope."

welcome back to democracy now! he wrote an essay last month headlined "finding justice for both maureen faulkner and mumia abu-jamal," referring tthe widow of the slain philadelphia police officer daniel faulkner. can you talk about that and why you're calling for the release of mumia abu-jamal in this critical week where it could be the last chance he has for a new trial? >> thank you, amy. it is good to talk with you again. mumia abu-jamal is a black american political activist and journalist who has been incarcerated since he was convicted in 1982 and sentenced to death for the 1981 murder of daniel faulkner, philadelphia pennsylvania police officer. his death sentence was overturned by federal judge in

2001 to sentencing irregularities. at that time, the question w why wasn't the whole conviction overturned? but in 2019, the philadelphia district attorney's office disclosed for the first time that there were six boxes of materials that had been concealed and not delivered before mumia was tried. under a 1963 decision that every law student knows about and every lawyer knows about, brady versus maryland. the supreme court of united states held that to process of law is violated when the prosecution conceals evidence relevant to guilt or punishment from defense.

in this country, that should have required mumia to be released and the commonwealth decide whether or not to prosecute him based upon having revealed the right evidence. that has not been done. so the question is, why is mumia abu-jamal not being given the benefit of the precedence? this is 50 years. that he should be getting? because the commonwealth attorneys violated due process laws. he had a pretense of a trial. that is what the supreme court of the united states did earlier than that in 1935.

so we have to ask ourselves the question, why is this journalist, why is this black activist not free? and why is it so hard for a judge to say, hey, we have got the law that requires him to be free, i'm going to follow the law and to clear him free. if the commonwealth wants to retry him, they can do so. if the commonwealth decides they can't retry him because the evidence is no longer there, people have passed away, witnesses have forgotten information, then that is not on mumia. that is the fault of prosecutors and mumia should not be imprisoned because, a, he had a pretense of a trial in the first place and, b, for some reasons

bloodlust or the desire to keep a black activist journalist imprisoned means that we don't want to do what is right. amy: if you could talk specifically as a judge around the law when it comes to, for example, finding a handwritten note in this evidence box that was just found in the offices of now the da larry krasner, one of the two key witnesses requesting "the money you owed me," writing that to the prosecution. and then of course the well-known comment of the judge himself -- human rights groups have decried the racism in the original trial. but the judge being heard by the court stenographer saying, "i'm going to help them fry that bleep" but use the word.

>> he used the n-i-g-g-e-r word. that should have been sufficient to disqualify at judge point-blank. beyond that, there was proof that there were for entry challenges that were exercised by the psecution based on racial, racist inclinations which violates the supreme court decision in bassey versus kentucky. that should've been enough to disqualify the trial. but then you refer to this note that was found where a witness for the prosecution that allegedly fingered mumi writes the prosecutor wants to know, where is my money? now you are defense lawyer, that is powerful information because

it indicates that this witness has been bribed or has an incentive to lie. that is a reason to disqualify -- that is a reason to overturn the conviction in and of itself. this is the kind of due process violation that any law student woul recognize on a criminal law or constitutional law exam. so this is not hard stuff. this is not hard stuff for any trial jue. and so the issue is not whether or not this is a tou legal question, the issue is whether or not a judge -- in this case judge clemons -- has the strength, the courage, the compassion, and the commitment to follow the law to do what the law requires, which is basically, declare the man that had a pretense of a trial,

declare him free until the commonwealth, if you want to try him again, have at it, but you can't keep him in prison because you simply messed up and don't want to confess. amy: the daughter of the novel is, the same is -- they missed novelist richard wright, julia wright wrote to the judge -- "we, black women, who carry such intergenerational trauma have in common the gift of 'wounded healers' in the words of the late archbishop tutu who called for mumia's release in 2011 on behalf of peace and reconciliation. i trust you will judge righteously." julia wright is so interesting in that she was recently involved with the case in elaine, arkansas, five black men who were tried and convicted of murder in less than 30 minutes in a mob rule trial.

it was 1919 in your state of arkansas. can you talk about what you see as the parallels? >> you refer to the landmark case of moore versus dempsey, 1923 case oliver wendell holmes wrote that where there has been a mob trial, violates due process and in that case again, the supreme court invalidated the murder conviction. the first-degree murder convictions of five black men who were sentenced to death. that again is precedent. that is again a connection. and julia wright, bless her heart, has connected the dots between the elaine race massacre, the massacre of black people in southeast arkansas by white vigilantes and by federal troops, by the way, and the

incarceration and the refusal to release mumia abu-jamal. mumia abu-jam is now in prison because -- let's be clear, because of bloodst. there is a notion that a police officer was ordered. daniel faulkner was murdered. and prosecution messed up investigation -- the investigation messed up. and mumia abu-jamal was wrongfully prosecuted, wrongfully convicted, wrongfully sentence, and now wrongfully carcerat. but our bloodlust prevents us from acknowledging that. and i understand that as a state court trial judge who has tried murder cases. i understand that the pain of victims, i understand the desire

of colleagues to get revenge. however, justice is never about revenge. we do not allow victimsr their friends or partners of the murdered to decide what justic is. justice is doing right, not getting revenge. we need to understand the difference between the two. amy: judge wendell griffen, there's so much more to talk about. judge griffen wrote the essay "finding justice for both maureen faulkner and mumia abu-jamal," referring to the widow of the slain police officer daniel faulkner. we will link to your peace and we will also do part two conversation with you as you come to the end of your judicial career. you will be retiring at the end of december after 24 years on the bench. you are also the pastor of the

new millennium church and author of "the fierce urgency of prophetic hope." in part two, we will talk about your illustrious career on the bench. people should check it out at democracynow.org. that does it for our show. democracy now! is looking for feedback from people who appreciate

hello, welcome back to nhk newsline. i am takao minori in new york. americans have seen prices easier go up and up. they have seen central bankers try to coax them down but prices keep rising. still, officials of the federal reserve will ease up in their fight against inflation. policymakers had already raised interest rates six times this year, the last four