05/04/23 05/04/23 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from new york, this is democracy now! >> israeli security forces thought u could take pictures of the palestinians to run to the database and seef they uld find aatchnd it ha been refred to as policy. dehumanizing to be treated as if you are part oof it again.

amy: we will talk to amnesty international about how israel is using an experiment of facial recognition program to track palestinians across the occupied territory. then to afghanistan. >> it is difficult to estimate the gravity of the situation in afghanistan. it is the largest humanitarian crisis in the world today. amy: we will speak to an afghan women's rights activist who served in the afghan parliament, as well as a greek refugee advocate who is trying to help 82 afghan families, including a group of afghan women parliamentarians who have been stuck in greece for the past 1 months. en in a victory f free speech, greenpeace usa has defeated a $100 million slapp lawsuit that threaten the future of greenpeace. >> we have to fight these lawsuits had on because the

voices of those protect our planet and our communities cannot be silenced. amy: all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. ukraine's has russian artillery fire killed at least 23 people and wounded dozens of others in the southern kherson region wednesday. the killings were part of a wave of russian attacks across ukraine overnight that came after officials in moscow accused ukraine of attempting a drone strike on the kremlin aimed at assassinating russian president vladimir putin. that's a charge ukraine's president volodymyr zelenskyy denied while speaking wednesday from helsinki. >> we don't attack putin or moscow. amy: zelenskyy spoke today from the netherlands during a

surprise trip to the hague where he called for the creation of a war crimes tribunal on russia's invasion that would be separate from the international criminal court. ukraine is not a party to the rome statute, which established the international criminal court. neither are russia nor the united states. israeli forced killed three palestinians during a raid in the occupied west bank city of nablus. hamas confirmed the three men belonged to their group, which governs the besieged gaza strip. israel said they were responsible for a fatal april shooting in jericho, which killed two settler sisters. a general strike has been called in nablus in response to the attack. in rwanda, at least 136 people are dead and thousands have been left homeless after torrential rains brought flash flooding and landslides to several parts of rwanda. this is flood survivor claire uwineza, whose home in western rwanda was destroyed. >> as you can see, i am left with nothing. no bed and no household.

i came here for a job. i am safe but all of my belongings are gone. amy: rwanda's meteorology agency has linked higher-than-average rainfall seen in recent years to global heating caused by human activity. egyptian authorities have freed al jazeera journalist hisham abdel aziz four years after he was arrested and accused of belonging to a terrorist group. al jazeera called the allegations baseless and said authorities targeted abdel aziz over the network's reporting, which has been critical of egypt's u.s.-backed authoritarian president abdel fattah al-sisi who took power in a 2013 coup. tens of thousands of people have since been arrested in a crackdown on dissent. among them are two other al jazeera journalists, bahaa eldin ibrahim and rabie el-sheikh. protesters have confronted secretary of state antony blinken over the biden administration's persecution of wikileaks founder julian assange and for failing to condemn the killing of palestinian-american journalist shireen abu akleh, who was killed by an israeli

military sniper last year while reporting from the occupied west bank. wednesday's protest was led by codepink's medea benjamin, who interrupted "washington post" columnist david ignatius as he interviewed blinken in a forum marking world press freedom day. >> excuse us. we can't view this day without calling for the freedom of julian assange. amy: at this point, the live stream went silent, as medea benjamin hooked her leg around secretary blinken's chair while security pulled her off the stage. >> we are here to celebrate freedom of expression and we just experienced it. amy: reporters without borders warns 2023 is among the worst years on record for journalists worldwide, with seven media workers killed since january 1 and 563 detained or in prison,

the federal reserve has voted to raise interest rates for the 10th consecutive occasion. fed chair jerome powell announced the latest increase on wednesday, which brings the benchmark interest rate to a 16-year high of more than 5%. >> reducing inflation is likely to require a period of low trend growth and some softening of labor market conditions. amy: labor organizations blasted the fed's move, saying it will drive unemployment higher and further risks plunging the u.s. economy into recession. massachusetts democratic senator elizabeth warren accused powell of "aiming to put people out of work." authorities in texas have arrested the wife of the suspect in last week's mass shooting which killed five people in the town of cleveland, including a nine-year-old boy. divimara nava is accused of helping her husband francisco oropesa as he evaded capture for four days during a state-wide manhunt. last year, she asked a judge for a restraining order against oropesa after reporting he was drunk and had physically

assaulted her. a 2021 study found more than two-thirds of mass shootings are perpetrated by people with a history of domestic violence. in georgia, police have arrested a 24-year-old suspect blamed for opening fire inside a midtown atlanta medical office building on wednesday, killing one person and injuring four others. the mass shooting prompted road closures and evacuations and led several schools to lock down during an hours-long manhunt. georgia democratic senator raphael rnock reonded tohe newsrom the nate flo demanding congress pass new legislation to prevent gun violence. >> it is not safe in our schools, we are not safe in our workplaces, we are not safe at the grocery store. we are not safe at movie theaters. we are not safe at spas for houses of worship. there is no sanctuary in the sanctuary.

we're not safe at concerts. we are not safe at banks. we are not safe at parades. we are not safe in our own yards and our own homes. and now today we can add medical facilities to that list. amy: oklahoma's republican attorney general gentner drummond filed a motion with the u.s. supreme court monday to stay the execution of richard glossip. glossip is scheduled to be executed on may 18 for a 1997 murder-for-hire despite major issues with the trial that resulted in his conviction. glossip has maintained his innocence for the past quarter century. to see our coverage of this case, go to democracynow.org. montana's republican governor has signed several bills severely curtailing the right to an abortion. one bill directly conflicts with a 1999 montana supreme court ruling that the constitutional right to privacy guarantees the right to an abortion. other legislation would require abortion providers to track more paperwork and requires pregnant people to submit to an

ultrasound before getting an abortion. planned parenthood of montana president martha fuller said in response -- "by adding unnecessary and burdensome red tape to a safe and legal medical procedure, these politicians have made it clear that it was never about our health and safety. it was always about undermining our personal freedom and shaming people who seek abortions." in tallahassee, florida, police arrested 14 protesters who staged a peaceful sit-in wednesday inside the office of republican governor ron desantis. florida's dream defenders organized the action to protest new legislation banning abortion after six weeks, denying gender-affirming care for youth, rolling back rent control, banning discussions of lgbtq issues in schools, and cracking down on immigrants and unions. dream defenders co-founder nailah summers said protests would continue until desantis agrees to a meeting. >> we are going to sit here until ron desantis comes back to

his office to meet with the people of florida who have been directly affected by his nonsense and his hate and his pain during and his petty b.s. amy: "the new york times" is reporting a text message sent by disgraced fox news star tucker carlson containing violent and racist content is what ultimately led to his firing by the far right network. in the text message to a fox producer, revealed as part of the dominion defamation suits against the network, carlson describes his thoughts while watching a video of at least three trump supporters beating an "antifa kid." it reads, in part -- "jumping a guy like that is dishonorable obviously. it's not how white men fight. yet suddenly i found myself rooting for the mob against the man, hoping they'd hit him harder, kill him." fox fired tucker carlson just days after it settled with

dominion voting systems for $787.5 million for promoting trump's lies about election fraud. fox was not required to apologize to its viewers or dominion as part of the deal. carlson and other fox hosts have for years attacked people of color, immigrants, and the lgbtq community on air. donald trump's legal team says they will not put on a defense case in his rape and defamation trial brought by writer e. jean carroll. carroll has accused trump of raping her in a dressing room at bergdorf goodman in the 1990's, then accusing her of lying about it. earlier this week, jessica leeds testified that trump repeatedly groped her during a flight in the 1970's. journalist natasha stoynoff also took the stand and recounted how trump allegedly attacked her and forcibly kissed her during a 2005 photoshoot and interview at mar-a-lago. the jury is expected to begin deliberating next tuesday. meanwhile, a judge dismissed trump's lawsuit against "the new york times" wednesday asserting

the newspaper's 2018 reporting on his finances, including the gathering of his tax records, is protected by the first amendment. "the wall street journal" has obtained a trove of personal documents of convicted sexual predator and child sex trafficker jeffrey epstein, including his schedules from 2013 to 2017. it shows he met with a number of prominent figures following his 2008 florida conviction for procuring a child for prostitution. the list includes now-cia director william burns, former israeli prime minister ehud barak, filmmaker woody allen, former treasury secretary and harvard president lawrence summers, and the famed linguist noam chomsky. chomsky confirmed to "the harvard crimson" that he knew epstein, writing in an email to the paper -- "like all of those in cambridge who met and knew him, we knew that he had been convicted and served his time, which means that he re-enters society under prevailing norms." chomsky also wrote --

"i've met all sorts of people, including major war criminals. i don't regret having met any of them." epstein was arrested again in 2019 after "the miami herald" revealed he had sexually assaulted and trafficked women and girls for decades. he died of an apparent suicide in his new york jail cell in 2019. and protesters and mourners gathered on a subway platform in lower manhattan wednesday calling for justice for jordan neely, a 30-year-old unhoused subway rider and black man who was choked to death monday while he was suffering an apparent mental health crisis. he was reportedly yelling and complaining of hunger and thirst but had not physically attacked anyone before three other passengers tackled him on the floor of the train. an unnamed former-marine held

neely in a chokehold. his death has been ruled a homicide. this is a protester speaking yesterday from the broadway-lafayette subway station. >> a lot of us are closer to the homeless than millionaires. seeing someone treated like that, i'm scared for those who are unhoused, who are at risk of being homeless, whose rent is overdue. it is really scary to see homeless people being murdered. amy: and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman in new york, joined by democracy now! co-host nermeen shaikh. it is great to have you back. nermeen: thank you. good morning. welcome to all of our listeners and viewers from around the country and around the world. amy: we begin today's show looking at how the israeli government is using an experimental facial recognition system to track palestinians and control their movement. the findings are part of a new report by amnesty international

titled "automated apartheid" and reveals an ever-growing surveillance network of cameras in the occupied west bank city of hebron and east jerusalem, two cities in the occupied territories where israeli settlements are expanding within palestinian areas. in hebron, a program called red wolf is used at military checkpoints to scan palestinians' faces and add them to vast surveillance databasest. this is clip from a video accompanng the new report. >> imagine you are a palestinian person from a small village in the occupied territory. you have not registered at a checkpoint or been contained. you have not given consent. let's say you visit a sick family member in hebron so you pass a checkpoint. a little yellow light flashesn the guard's screen.

that cam has taken a little picture of you and compared it to othermages and tabases. it has not recognize you so it has taken a picture and put you into a system without your consent. a giant system so from now on any check point in the cupied pastinianerritoriesr in isranows you a. scan by other databases a at masse scale wiout your consent. skip over to the next time you pass by checkpoint. u pass thrgh the turnstile and a border guard you have never seen before on the other side says, hey, matt, how are you doing day? you alize y're ihe syst. you hope to god that little light behind beyond your contl turns re amy: tre are scalled biomarkers are added to the surveillance network. this is another clip from "automated apartheid" featuring a researcher and advisor on artificial intelligence for

amnesty international. >> israelis stted having competitions of who could take the most pictures of the palestinians and run it through the tabase andind a matc is referred to as facebook for palestinians. it is dehumanizing to be treated as if you're part of a videogame game. amy: the report follows amnesty international's major report last year that laid out how israel is subjecting palestinians to the crime of apartheid under international law. this is k ridge university professor saul devoe. >> there are compelling and disturbing parallels between the situations under apartheid south africa and israel-palestine. i think the dferences are also important. the system oppresses dishe never fully operational and ceainly the sort of high-technology claims for hopes

of the apartheid government that ntralized gw -- capture all useful information. simply could not -- was not sustainable usg the technology at the te. how terrifying -- this was paper copies, not digital. a surviving into this period were digital capacity, artificial intelligence is so much more advanced, that gives the israeli state far more control. amy: the israeli newspaper haaretz published an editorial wednesday in response to amnesty international's report that read, in part -- "there is no other way to describe this system except as 'biometric apartheid.' in the case of palestinians, not only are they not asked for their consent, the data collection is done without their knowledge." for more, we go to london where we are joined by matt mahmoudi, the lead researcher for amnesty

international's new report called "automated apartheid: facial recognition entrenches the oppression of palestinians." matt, welcome to democracy now! can you continue to layout what you found? >> thank you for having me. what we found is effectively a system of facial recognition, in particular in hebron, that follows experimentation against palestinians. under the ruling of the civil administration h2 which is a sub unit under military rule, so to say. what we are seeing is how facial recognition experiments are being used against palestinians under the auspices of protecting sub 850 israeli settlers that are illegally present in the area. such that palestinians who relied previously on knowing a soldier when they're passing by checkpoint, now have to rely on

an algorithm that has collected their biometrics without their knowledge and consent, being able to recognize them. should it not recognize them, they suddenly find themselves in a conundrum in which they might be held back at thcheckpoint, a soldier will ask t match their id to a facial capture that has already been takenuch thathey can coinue to teach the facial recognition algorithm to recognize them in the future. in et jerusalem, we cse alert trends in which surveillance begets illegal settler activity andllegal ttler activity begets surveillance. are seeg how surveillance has been increasing following the crackdown on t ptest that came as a result of the convictions of seven palestinian families from shah gerard i 2021. we have seen areas that are of profound significance to palestinian communities that surveillance has been ramping up illegal settler activity has also been ramping up. we are saying this as a part of

a coercive environment meant to force palestinians out of areas of strategic interest to israeli authorities, and that is what we're are saying effectively facial recognition is augmenting , reinforcing, entrenching aspects of apartheid such as the aspect that speaks to restrictions on freedom of movement -- which is the basic right of palestinians in order to access things such as housing, education, or medical care, as well as the environment component which is instilling a chilling effect on palestinians and stopping them from being able to resist introducing a fertile -- making or dangerous to do so. nermeen: could you explain when the surveillance technology was put into use in the occupied territories and whether there is any indication that israel plans to expand the use of this technology? >> to speak of the two systems

in particular that we had under investigations, just to say the 2000 system which is a network surveillance system used in east jerusalem and the red wolf system, we can speak to how the 2000 system was put in place at the turn of the millennium. it only in 2017 2018 further investment by israeli policemen the system was now capable of facial recognition. we initially started with sub 400 cameras that were networked to the thousands that are able to perform facial recognition on palestinians who at times we have seen are pulled out of crowns and identified simply for participating in protest. we have seen in places like h2 and hebron the rampant use of experiments -- surveillance has been part and parcel of the experience in have written since the initial division in 1997 between the areas of hebron.

since 2015, there's been surveillance cameras placed virtually everywhere in streets. in 2021, we started hearing about reports of an app called blue wolf being used against palestinians in hebron where effectively soldiers were raiding homes, picking on palestinians in the streets, and registering their faces into this database that contains further information on palestinians in an effort to automate the process of being able to identify the in future on the streets. the app we wolf incentivizes military units for being able to capture as many bases as possible and makes it nearly inescapable for palestinians to come across surveillance. red wolf is just the latest on a slew of those that of used on palestinians. we believe there is a high risk of the tool plugging into the database that has already been curated by blue wolf such that information might be presented to a soldier at a checkpoint that really a palestinian passing through may have no idea

exists on them in the first place. nermeen: matter, could you tell us a little about where this technology comes from? the u.s. is reportedly the second largest exporter of the surveillance technology, and particular face recognition technology, and china is the number one exporter. what did you find about the origins of this technology? >> while we know themobat 2000 system and red wolf system don't have explicit origin in terms of the developer as far as the software is concerned, we know about some of the companies that are supplying the cameras from the cctv cameras, that are plugging into the 2000 system in places like east jerusalem. there's been a number of reporting done by various partner organizations of powers leading up to this velvet what we found an hour report that in particular the chinese surveillance manufacturer as

well as security thathe dutch owned surveiance manufacturer are particularly present in east jerusalem. canvassing to be increasing over the last two years alone in tandem with the legal settler activities. i want to point out in one city we're saying biblical excavation projects in the city of david sites followed by settler activity which is taking over demolished palestinian homes and housing them and then inserting surveillance to further restrict palestinians from resisting their illegal activity there. there security and vision are at risk of being complicit in inrnational crimes and less they make explicit plan for the removal of their products and make it clear what their human rights do usual -- due diligence and business relationships have been with israeli security

forces in the area. amy: matt mahmoudi, you talk about the effect this has on the right of free will -- freedom of expressions and the right of assembly? you have this kind of surveillance going on. >> it is important to note the palestinians are still resisting the occupation, still resisting apartheid. but we have seen in places like hebron where palestinian groups have been effectively under house arrest with cameras outside, making it very difficult for them to engage in their normal activities. in east jerusalem, we're seeing postings participating in protests, both following that crackdown on the shaikh gerard as well as following the killing of sharinn abu akley. this incentivizes people and inserts a sort of environment of fear which makes it very difficult or at least very costly for palestinians to engage in protest and

resistance. we had a number of reports from our witnesses and interviewees who spoke to the feeling every time they have to cross the street, not even to participate in protest but to go and grab coffee with someone, the neighbor, family members, data think about where the surveillance cameras were and what risks could be increased in order to participate in just aspects of social normal living. in hebron, we had testimony that spoke to how this form of militarization and surveillance has nearly killed all aspects of social life. nermeen: you have also documented the widespread use of a network of cctv cameras. could you talk about the links between the use of this facial recognition technology, how that works together with this network of cctv cameras? also, the effect of now the quite -- news of facial

recognition technology, for example, smartphones, which is now quite widespread? >> absolutely. to speak to the network surveillance that we are seeing in east jerusalem, the mobat 2000 system was put in place at the turn of the millennium but it was only with facial recognition technologies in 2018 -- 2017 and 20 any camera capable of capturing faces, most produced over the last 10 years that are capable of capturing videos, would be able to plug into a software base system that sits on a computer which can effectively run spatial recognition on those cctv cameras. we have made it clear most cities are just one software upgrade but we from being able to have ubiquitous facial recognition capabilities.

you are dealing with the double-edged sword of both having the technology that we see as being fundamentally incompatible with international human rights law while also having it apply in the context that is fundamental against international law, which is to set the context of apartheid in the context of illegal annexation. as for the quotidian nature, it is important to note the differences between the systems that we are speaking about here. facial recognition that you might find in your phone is what we call one-to-one facial recognition which is a match that is made upon you having a known and consented to your face being captured and stored locally on your phone for later recognition such as you can log into your self system. you might think of it is what some call facial recognition for authorization. it is sometimes applied to

buildings. you will walk into a space you have already registered your face to your profile and it will recognize you and allow you entry. her facial recognition for mass surveillance or identification, what we all call one too many facial recognition, we are dealing with the system that relies on curating the large-scale database without your knowledge and consent, usually scraping millions of images off of, for example, social media or just in the context of hebron, for example, through soldiers going around the streets and taking pictures without their knowledge and without consent. those feet into this database that is then being used together with facial recognition algorithm that determines who the people that are being displayed, in particular ccd footage, are. because they depend on these large cell database, we consider them by designed to be incompatible with the right to privacy because they are by design technologies of mass surveillance. amy: what is the final

recommendations of amnesty international on what you call automated apartheid? >> we are calling for the immediate end to facial recognition technology, for a ban on the deployment of the technologies come in particular for companies that are providing tools that can be used for facial recognition to immediately seize the sales of those in the context of the palestinian territories. we are also calling on the state of israel to dismantle it system of apartheid against palestinians and we believe by stopping facial recognition we are taking one step toward weakening apartheid. amy: matt mahmoudi, thank you for being with us, lead researcher for amnesty international's new report "automated apartheid: facial recognition entrenches the oppression of palestinians." we will link to the report and the 20 minute video that goes along with that. next up, we speak to an afghan

women's rights activist who served in the afghan parliament as well as a greek refugee advocate who is trying to help scores of afghan families, including a group of afghan women parliamentarians who have been stuck in greece from more than a year and a half. stay with us. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: "bizness" by tune yards. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. u.n. secretary general antonio guterres is warning afghanistan continues to face the largest humanitarian crisis in the world today. he made the comment earlier this week during a two-day u.n. summit on afghanistan that was held in doha. >> it is difficult to overestimate the gravity of the situation in afghanistan. it is the largest humanitarian crisis in the world today. the current ban is unacceptable and puts lives in jeopardy. amy: the meeting in doha ended without any formal recognition of the taliban, which was ruled afghanistan since august, 2021. u.n. officials have repeatedly

criticized the taliban's intensifying crackdown on afghan women and girls. a recent report by the u.n. special rapporteur on afghanistan warns the taliban has normalized systemic violence and human rights abuses against women and girls and says it may amount to gender persecution, a crime against humanity. this is u.n. special rapporteur richard bennett. >> the taliban's intentional and calculate a policy is to repudiate the human rights of women and girls and to erase them from public life. it may amount to the international crime of gender persecution for which the authorities can be held accountable. the cable it if effect of the restrictions on women and girls has a devastating long-term impact on the whole population and it is tantamount to gender apartheid. amy: we are joined now by two guests. jumana abo oxa is a project manager at the greek refugee

project elpida home. she is in washington, d.c., where she is meeting with biden administration officials and lawmakers in an effort to seek help for 82 families who evacuated from afghanistan but have been stuck in greece for over a year and a half. we are also joined by farzana kochai. she is an afghan women's rights activist who served as a member of the afghan parliament. she is joining us from winnipeg, canada. we welcome you both to democracy now! farzana, if you could start off talking about this meeting in doha. were you invited to the meeting? what about the possible recognition of the taliban consenting to legitimizing it? >> thank you. no, i was not invited. i have not been part of the meeting or anything about it.

trying to recognize the taliban, everyone knows it is like a huge mistake. like, no one wants to be part of that anyway. no way. no one. it is a huge mistake. it is a huge advantage of women and human rights, and everyone in afghanistan. taliban, no one else. i have not been part of that. following the meeting, i think it was not to recognize -- has not ended in a way. we need to talk about what is going on inside afghanistan and cap together and find a way. nermeen: what you think the risks are of recognizing the taliban government?

there is not a government in the world that recognizes the taliban whereas when i first came to power in 1996, there were three countries -- pakistan, saudi arabia, and the uae -- that did recognize the taliban. what do you think the risks are? do you see any possible benefits to recognizing the taliban government in the sense of potentially releasing funds and more assistance given the grave humanitarian crisis there? >> everyone knows, like, how it would be for the civilians, for the people, for the nation, for the progress in the country when we do not have recognized and legitimate government, which would have diplomatic relations, which would have responsibility to the world -- the people inside afghanistan, which would be committed to some

responsibility and some commitment outside/inside afghanistan. of course we know how important these things are. these are crucial things. but the risks, like the risks you asked about, recognizing taliban as a legitimate government. we all know where they came from. they killed afghans and allies for 20 years to take power. we know -- this should be enough to know how dangerous it could be for everyone to start a war, take a people for 20 years, millions of people, to destroy the country and claim power. it should not be a normal way of giving power. we cannot normalize this. how responsible taliban are for the values we share in our current time. like the democracy, the human rights, women's rights, education -- drug trafficking.

other things we are concerned about. especially the human rights and women's rights and a people could have their civil rights -- and how people could have their civil rights. the taliban are not providing people the opportunity to practice their rights and what they have -- it is like the risks are huge. how are we paying as a nation, the afghans and how our country is being destroyed from development we do not have a legitimate government. we also think about it is an option to legitimize the taliban in a way that they came, in the way they practice, the way they hold the power, the way they govern, the way they do the

things inside afghanistan. the risks are huge international community, the region, and the afghan people. it is a huge thing to be -- recognizing a terrorist group who are killing the people and is -- who do not believe in human rights and women's rights and democracy and freedom of speech. we as global citizens, a global nation, as part of in international community, we all agreed on and we believe those are our values. we stay on those values and we fought for that and we are fighting for them, but how to give up? like, the risks are clear. nermeen: can you talk about your own decision to leave afghanistan when the taliban first came to power in august 2021? you said explicitly you wanted

to stay. what happened, you are a member of the national sibley in afghanistan. are you still a member? what is your status now? could you explain what happened and what made you leave? >> when the taliban can come as a person in the power, part of the power, like, motivate people to stay or to be brave and not give up. we all had to run. i stayed and i was speaking about so loud that i would stay and we need to stay. this is our country and we need each other. we can't all leave. it is not an option. around 40 million people, half of them women. where should we go?

at least some of them are educated and had jobs, occupations which they believed they fought for that so hard. i said i would stay. but dings would -- the option of living and active life for women like me that are active and not willing to give up everything and just the inside the walls and sit in the house and do nothing and not speak about things, how life is, how things are good or bad in a way. so when this option was taken from me and i was warned again and again this is not going to happen to you, that you stay inside afghanistan and do whatever you do -- like, could be an interview that we are having right now. it is a huge crime inside

afghanistan while i was there. i was speaking to international media. because of my past activities and my stand against terrorist groups, including the taliban, and awareness and speaking on the values i was working for so it was like two things that made me high risk. i was taking the risk. i was willing to take the risk. everyone takes a risk when they're doing something good in a country like afghanistan, in a war country, conflict zone. the thing is, when i was not able -- i was not able to give up on the values and the things i believe needs to be worked for. it is important, it is essential for our society and we cannot give up and we cannot choose

another path or another way, to come together and legitimize the taliban and say the taliban are now good, taliban has changed. it is not real change. i could not do that. i could not lie. i was not able to do the truth, like to say the truth and speak up and be active or have a job or have any sort of connection to media or the people we were working on. and -- amy: farzana, i know the taliban disbanded the national assembly. do you consider yourself still a member of the afghan parliament, even if it has been disbanded? >> it is not important if i am a member of parliament or not. i have never been so much into the power. like, but the thing is, if i am not -- any other thing coming

from the taliban, why should i accept something about my stopping a member of parliament or not? like, do the taliban have laws? do they have any constitution? do that for parliament? do they have anything? do they have a legitimate government? i can't allow taliban to decide about who am i. i can't. i believe we are in exile. we are not -- we do not have a government. we do not have a parliament inside afghanistan. i truly feel responsible for what was doing, continue to do the work. amy: we're going to also talk to jumana abo oxa, whose project manager at the greek refugee project elpida home. now in washington, d.c. trying to deal with the fact you are representing some 82 families, a number of women parliamentarians from afghanistan who evacuated from

afghanistan, like farzana, but have been stuck in greece for a year and half? what is the issue? >> thank you for the invite. our organization elpida home has been founded by our founder is an american philanthropist. after the fall of kabul august 2021, he had evacuated over 1000 afghans to different countries. in greece we have received around 400 people. of those, we had 80 women parliament members and the family. 80% of those have already left stop however, the 20% left is still in greece. we have different applications for different people, we have applications to the u.s. -- there are four different

applications to the u.s. and we have applications -- each has a timeline. for canada, most of the parliamentarians -- the 20%, according to canadian sources, it is under security screen. it has been more than 18 months that these people have been in greece. we have been hosting them, providing them with assistance on everything from a medical comment -- medical, support and finding jobs, trying to help kids go to school. different other services that we provide. however, they are stuck. that is why i am in d.c. and will be in new york to try to push for the expedite of the visas of the families we are hosting. i know it is very important for the security checks and

screenings. however, these people are stranded. they are in limbo. there's nothing clear for them for how long they will stay. they are already stressed and depressed from becoming refugees outside their countries. however, the stress of not knowing when -- if they will move on to the destination country is also making it worse. we are seeing a lot of depression, self-harm, increased problems within families. we are trying to do our best in order to make sure these families move on to the final destinations and they start their new lives there with their families. nermeen: if you can say little bit more about what you understand -- you are saying canada has been the easiest country and the fastest for afghan refugees to go. what is holding this up now? what kinds of security clearances are these afghan

parliamentarians, former parliamentarians, required now to submit to? >> i wish i knew. we have been asking. it is not just for canada, it is for the u.s. as well. for canada, we had 80% leaving who had applications and 20% are still under security screening, which we are not aware of what is happening. but for everyone else, it is the same. we have lots of cases who are -- the people hosting our parliamentarians, doctors, ministers, judges, human rights activists, women's rights activist. all of these people are well-known and have strong links with either the american government or with foreign avenues. history is clear. we see how many applications are processed and some are stuck.

just before receiving the visa, it gets sent back to their country, to the country for additional reviewing or additional papers. there are a lot of delays happening. a lot of frustration because nothing is clear. amy: jumana abo oxa, we will continue to follow this story, project manager at the greek refugee project elpida home. and from greece to lobby the biden administration officials to accept afghan women parliamentarians and their families and others who have been leg wishing in greece for the last year now. and farzana kochai is a member of afghanistan's parliament and a women's rights activist. next up, a victory for greenpeace and free speech, a slapp suit brought by a canada logging company that threatened the future of greenpeace has been settled. stay with us.

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amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. we end today's looking at a major legal victory for greenpeace and free speech. the giant canadian logging company resolute forest products had sued greenpeace in the united states and canada after the group exposed the company's irresponsible practices. a california judge recently dismissed a seven-year $100 million lawsuit against greenpeace usa that threatened the group's existence. the logging company had filed a slapp suit against greenpeace. slapp stands for strategic lawsuits against public participation. corporations have been increasingly filing slapp lawsuits against activists in an attempt to silence critics. last year, the group earthrights international released a report documenting how fossil fuel companies have filed 93 slapp lawsuits over the past decade. for more, we are joined by deepa padmanabha.

she deputy general counsel for greenpeace usa. we don't have that much time, but if you can lay out for us what the slapp has meant and what this victory is all about. >> good morning, an. it is really great to be here in this moment to talk about the victory can a victory not only for greenpeace but for the movement. what this lawsuit attempted to do was silence our advocacy work and send a chilling effect to all advocacy organizations, activists, and anyone who dares speak truth to power that corporations will gauge these illegal activities in order to silence them, to shut us down. what is important for viewers and listeners to know is it means we are doing something right. these are desperate attempts to silence the work you're doing because the movement we are doing on the ground, the work we are doing to draw attention to abusive corporate behavior that

threatens our planet and communities, this work is successful. what corporations have to do to continue business as usual is dig into their toolbox and file abusive lawsuits that are actually not intended to win on the merits but that are intended to sit apart o movement. what thi victo does is send a message to corporations that your attempts silence us ll not on be unsuccessful in the courtroo but they won't be successful in the movement. this lawsuit has brought us together, brought groups that historical have not worked tother to rely send a message these cporations that we are going to come together and your attpt to silence us will only ke us louder a embolden our campaign nermeen: could you explain the details of this lawsuit and whether you were surprised at how common it is that the judge ruled in your favor? >> this lawsuit was brought by one of canada's largest logging companies. it was about trying to

intimidate us from speaking out about this corporation's unsustainable forestry practices. this case was filed back in 2017. what was most -- 2016. what was most disturbing about the lawsuit is the company was alleging claims under the racketeer influenced and corrupt organizations act, or rico. these were laws designed to go after the mafia organized crime. what resolute was alleging was greenpeace and its campaign to protect the forest and draw attention to them company's unsustainable forestry practices that this campaign constituted organized crime. the thing about these lawsuits is there much more common than we know. fortunately, greenpeace has the resources to bring attention to this, to engage in the local battle but most -- legal battle but most slapp lawsus are brght againseveryday pple who e trying t protect clean

drinking water we recognize this suit was a slapp and cognize th nate of it and we knew we had to fight this lawsuit head on because most of the peoplwho face this pe of lel intidation d't have the resours tfight. so the near filing of a lawsuit at ts time to too often has the intended pact of sincing. soe took on is fightot just f greenpeac b for everyone who dares speak truth power and we knew we had to win this in the courtroom and for the movement one impoant thing know is what we do celebrate this victory come our battle is far from over. we face a massive lawsuit filed by energy transfer, the operators of the dakota access pipeline, who allege greenpeace orchestrated the entire indigenous land movement at standing rock sioux stop very similar allegations brought originally by the same law firm and we know this attempt to bring ric althougho he was

dismissed in the energy transfer case,, they attempt at destroying movements, destroying our ability to resist come to exercise our first minute rights to free speech, to protest, to assembly, there very much under threat in this lawsuit which was set to go to trial in july 2024 is another real existential threat the movement should be paying attention to. one other thing that is interesting to note is while energy transfer alleges greenpeace is a criminal enterprise, it is the energy transfer subsidiaries that have been convicted up environment of crimes. there is a bit of irony to what they are alleging. amy: deepa padmanabha, thank you for being with us, deputy general counsel for greenpeace usa. a judge has thrown out the $100 million slapp sued the canadian logging company waged against greenpeace usa. that does it for our show.

a very happy birthday, denis moynihan! democracy now! is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed captioning. e-mail your comments to outreach@democracynow.org or mail them to democracy now! p.o. box 693 new york, new york 10013. [captioning made possible by democracy now!]

♪♪ (indistinct man speaking over radio) ...uh, that's the appropriate direction,