06/15/23 06/15/23 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from new york, this is democracy now! >> the last 10 years, we have never seen such a high number of reported attacks on the health-care system as in 2022. the scale of it is just unimaginable. amy: sudan's healthcare system is on the verge of collapse two months after fighting broke out between rival military factions. we will look at the increasing targeting of hospitals in sudan

to ukraine to burma. then as russia transfers tactical nuclear weapons to belarus, we speak to professor gilbert achcar, author of "the new cold war: the united states, russia and china from kosovo to ukraine." then to south africa to talk to kumi naidoo, the former head of greenpeace and amnesty. on tuesday, he was forcibly removed from a shareholder meeting of a major bank financing the east african crude oil pipeline. >> what do we want? justice. >> when we wanted? >> now. amy: all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. in sudan, a regional governor from darfur was assassinated wednesday after he publicly blamed the paramilitary rapid support forces and allied arab

militias for the genocide of civilians. west darfur state governor khamis abakar was abducted and killed hours after making the remarks in a tv interview. reuters reports two government sources said the rsf was responsible for the killing. on wednesday, the international organization for migration said fighting between rival military factions in sudan has now displaced more than 2 million people from their homes, with more than 500,000 fleeing to neighboring countries. nearly 1000 civilians have been killed according to a local monitoring group. in ukraine, then mayor says russian missile struck two civilian industrial sites overnight, injuring at least one person. the attack came days after another attack on the central ukrainian city killed 11 civilians. elsewhere, crates military said it shot down 18 russ and -- russian drones over odesa

overnight. russia's news agency reports ukrainian artillery fire killed a child russian occupy part of the curse on region. on tuesday, russian president vladimir putin met with bloggers where he said they have been plagued by communications gear, aircraft, and drones as well as other equipment in a rare admission. the leader of belarus said tuesday he has received nuclear weapons from russia and won't hesitate to use them if his nation's security is at stake. president alexander lukashenko made the remarks in an interview with a russian state tv channel tuesday evening. >> we have missiles and bombs that we have received from russia, three times more powerful than the ones used on hiroshima and nagasaki. there more than 80,000 people died instantly. 250 thousand overall. that is from one strike. and this one is free times more

powerful. up to a million people will die immediately if god for bid this weapon were used. amy: exiled belarus opposition leader sviatlana tsikhanouskaya called on world leaders to respond to russia's first deployment of tactical nuclear weapons outside of its borders since the collapse of the soviet union in 1991. she wrote on social media -- "it creates a serious threat to regional security & sets us on a dangerous path for nuclear escalation. the world must show lukashenka & putin that it won't give in to nuclear blackmail." thousands of protesters took to the streets of cities across poland wednesday after a pregnant woman died when medical workers refused to provide her with a life-saving abortion. 33-year-old dorota lalik died of sepsis in may, three days after her water broke and she was admitted to the john paul the second hospital. the hospital has deep ties to the catholic church, and medical staff there opted out of providing abortion care, citing a so-called conscience clause allowed under polish law.

this is a protester at wednesday's pro-choice march in warsaw. >> i came here because i do not agree with women dying, but they have no choice. that doctors have a so-called conscience" of women are dying because of them and also because of the law. amy: here in the united states, the justice department has charged an active-duty marine and one other person for firebombing a planned parenthood clinic in costa mesa, california, with a molotov cocktail in march of last year. the two arrested men, chance brannon and tibet ergul, could face up to 20 years in federal prison. in related news, a new report from the center for countering digital hate finds that google made over $10 million from ads by anti-abortion groups. the google ads were for so-called crisis pregnancy centers, which aim to steer people away from having abortions while posing as reproductive healthcare clinics.

the southern baptist convention has voted to uphold the expulsion of two churches led by women pastors, tightening its restrictions on women, banning them not just from serving as pastors, but for having any kind of leadership position. the moves come after organizing by the southern baptist churches -- church's ultraconservative members. in climate news, officials in india and pakistan have ordered the evacuation of more than 150,000 people as cyclone biparjoy makes landfall in india's gujarat state. the storm crashed ashore earlier today near high tide with a storm surge that threatened to inundate low-lying coastal areas. it's just the third cyclone to hit india's west coast in nearly six decades. here in the united states, thick smoke from dozens of wildfires burning in canada settled over wisconsin and minnesota on wednesday, triggering air quality alerts for very unhealthy levels of fine particle and ozone pollution.

the air quality index topped 240 in the twin cities, the region's worst levels on record. president biden has vetoed legislation that would have rolled back a new rule limiting emissions from heavy-duty vehicles. the white house says the rule change will cut nitrogen oxide emissions in half by 2045, preventing thousands of childhood asthma cases and premature deaths every year. the bill to repeal the tougher emissions cleared the senate in with the support of april democratic senator joe manchin of west virginia and with ailing california senator dianne feinstein absent. meanwhile, the house of representatives has failed in its effort to override president biden's veto of legislation that would have blocked police accountability legislation passed by the washington, d.c., city council in the wake of george floyd's murder. 13 democrats joined with house republicans in the failed effort to override biden's veto. the d.c. law expands access to police disciplinary records and body-camera footage, limits the

use of tear gas and other chemical agents, and bans certain police tactics including choke holds. washington, d.c.'s non-voting delegate to congress eleanor holmes norton said in a statement -- "the disapproval resolution is a profoundly undemocratic and paternalistic piece of legislation. almost 700,000 people live in the nation's capital, and they are worthy and capable of governing their own local affairs." here in new york, a grand jury has indicted former u.s. marine daniel penny over the killing of jordan neely on a city subway on may 1. penny, who is white, held jordan neely in a chokehold until he died. neely, a beloved street performer, was unhoused and hungry, crying out for help when the ex-marine attacked him. the charges will be unsealed when penny is arraigned. the date of his arraignment is expected to be announced today. the federal reserve has decided to hold interest rates steady after 10 consecutive increases since early 2022. massachusetts senator elizabeth

warren welcomed wednesday's announcement by fed chair jerome powell, writing -- "the fed raised interest rates at the fastest pace in decades and it needs to maintain this pause or risk throwing millions of americans out of work." the european union has advanced a major new law that would regulate artificial intelligence as governments around the world grapple with how to respond to the possible threats of the fast-moving technology. the eu draft law includes restrictions on the use of facial recognition and mandated disclosures of data by makers of chatbots and deepfake videos. this is european parliament president roberta metsola. >> going forward, we are going to need constant clear boundaries and limits to artificial intelligence. there is one thing we will not compromise on, anytime technology advances it matched go hand-in-hand -- must go hand-in-hand with our fun and the rights and democratic style. amy: u.n. secretary general

antonio guterres recently said he supports the idea of a global watchdog for ai that could play a role similar to the international agency of atomic energy for nuclear technology. >> scientists and experts have called on the world to act, declaring ai an existential threat to humanity on par with the risk of nuclear war. amy: here in the united states, jennifer destefano, an arizona mother testified at a senate hearing this week about her harrowing experience with a deepfake scam that tricked her into thinking her daughter had been kidnapped. she said they demanded a $50,000 ransom before she got in touch with her daughter who was in fact safe and sound. >> it was my daughter's voice. it was her cries. it was the way she spoke. i will never be able to shake that out of my mind. it is every parent's worst

nightmare to hear your child in pain, knowing they are being harmed and you are helpless. the more this is an punishable, the more greeters will become. there is no depth to the people of evil of ai. amy: florida's republican governor and presidential hopeful ron desantis released an attack ad earlier this month showing donald trump in what appear to be ai-generated images hugging and kissing dr. anthony fauci. and a guatemalan court on wednesday convicted prominent journalist josé rubén zamora of money laundering and sentenced him to six years in prison in what rights groups have condemned as a trumped-up case and part of a crackdown on press freedom by the right-wing government of president alejandro giammattei. zamora is the founder and president of the investigative newspaper el periódico and has long reported on guatemalan government corruption.

the newspaper was forced to shut down in may after months of intensifying harassment and persecution. to see our interview with zamora's son, go to democracynow.org. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman, joined by my democracy now! co-host nermeen shaikh. hi, nermeen. nermeen: hi, amy. welcome to all of our listeners and viewers from around the country and around the world. amy: we begin today's show with the humanitarian crisis unfolding in sudan as the healthcare system there is collapsing after two months of fighting across the country between the army and the rapid support forces. volunteers and aid workers are struggling to keep critical healthcare running. but the sudan doctors trade union says less than a third of hospitals in sudan's conflict zones are still open and many have been targeted by fighters. those that continue to operate and face cuts to power and water, and a lack of staff, medicine, and dialysis supplies.

reports also show that since the outbreak of the conflict in april, rape survivors have struggled to access emergency contraception and abortion medication because a warehouse with nearly 50,000 post-rape medical kits has been cut off. this comes as a new report from the safeguarding health and conflict coalition concluded 2022 was the worst year of attacks against health care facilities and personnel worldwide in the last decade. the report found a 45% increase in reported incidents of violence against or obstruction of health care in conflict zones as compared to 2021, including in sudan. over half the documented attacks were in two countries, ukraine and burma. for more, we are joined in geneva by christina wille, director of insecurity insight which contributed to the new report "ignoring red lines: violence against healthcare in conflict." and we begin in houston with dr. khidir dalouk, advocacy director of the sudanese american

physicians association which is providing support to sudan's healthcare facilities and services during the crisis. we welcome you both to democracy now! we began with the sudanese doctor, dr. dalouk, can you talk about the situation? today marks two months where these bible military forces had been attacking each other, of course, the collateral damage as they say, the horror, is the number of civilians who have died or at this point seeking health care in places where many hospitals don't even exist anymore. >> good morning to you come to christina, and to your audience and viewers. as you report and correctly mentioned but it is happening is a calamity. it is a nightmare that is getting worse every day. our concern is if this continues, the conflict spreads

to neighboring states, this might break into civil war pretty soon. what is happening in darfur is a total disaster where hospitals are completely shut down and civilians are between death and caught in the armed conflict. they are not even able to fully to neighboring chad. as you mentioned in khartoum, two thirds of the hospitals are out of service, evacuated, or forced to close. my colleagues who were working on the ground, they're working in very difficult situations. it is not even calm principle. they are working with very little or no supplies. the major concern we have is their safety. health care professionals and providers are facing gunfire every day to get to work.

there completely burned out. they are not able to provide to the families because they have not had any salaries for months now. it is not comprehendible the way they are working. their safety is our biggest concern. they have been deliberately targeted since the conflict, hospitals have been targeted. almost 21 of our health care colleagues have lost their lives. a few days ago, one of our colleagues, a surgeon, he lost his life while he was on duty and serving in a hospital in khartoum. we as physicians have sworn an oath to treat and take care of civilians and military, whether it is in peace or war. me and my colleagues on the ground, we are doing our best to abide to this oath.

maybe the generals and the ose fighting, they are to defend the country and the civilians. this is a call and reminder to them, they should at least leave us to do our duty. nermeen: if you could speak specifically about what we mentioned in our introduction, namely the difficulties for women in accessing emergency abortion and reproductive rights medicine because these rape kids, tens of thousands of rate kids are accessible and this is a moment in this conflict where there have been widespread reports of sexual violence and rape and of course in sudan, abortion is illegal. >> it is very unfortunate that violence against women and rape is used as a weapon in this war. this has been the case in darfur

and the attacks going back. it is very unfortunate. we are totally against rape and using women's bodies in this war . there are no supplies period to any civilians, including women, including children. for the last two months, infants have been born and there are no vaccinations. we are going to see an emergence of infection wa -- infectious diseases that had been eradicated that will emerge because there are no vaccinations for those children. as you correctly said, there are no weight to provide for those -- no way to provide for those rape victims. the internally displaced are another group of people facing a lot of problems. we are trying to support four different hospitals in a

neighboring state. our association is operating or funding the operation of another hospital as well as nialla hospital. unfortunately, because of the blockage of the borders in egypt as well as other countries are closing up their access, there are a lot of people who are in the borders -- haifa hospital, for example, is facing a huge number of patients of people that are dying because we're not able to operate by the government. we are in organization we do our best, but it is not enough. amy: do you think that military forces are targeting hospitals and other health care

facilities? you have stated so far 11 ambulances have been attacked by strikes, that the rapid support sources have commandeered cars from the ministry of health. the significance of this as we begin to wrap up? >> well, as i said, hospitals and health care professionals have been deliberately targeted. it is very unfortunate that hospitals are used in this war as, you know, areas where the conflict is going. these two generals are not abiding by any international -- not doing any geneva conventions. i think what it is important is the ground. the impartiality of hospitals. both parties are trying to force health care professionals to say we are fighting with this party

or that party. that is not what we do. our oath is toward civilians and those who are injured. this is what we do and we want to abide to that. me and my colleagues call for the international community to act now, not even tomorrow, we have to do it now. nermeen: i would like to bring in christina wille into the conversation. if you could talk about what is happening in sudan in the context of the report that your organization has put out "ignoring red lines: violence against healthcare in conflict." talk about what this report concludes. >> thank you so much. most of all, thank you for putting this really important topic of violence against health care for discussion into your show. because it is always terrible when political conflict turns violent, and we've seen that in

sudan in the past years during demonstrations and particularly now. but it is heartbreaking to see the personal consequences for people when they can't access health care. i think you have brought up several of these issues. imagine the woman going into labor or needing emergency care after experiencing sexual violence and then you have security forces using roadblocks to prevent access. and people seeking treatment when hospitals are bombed or occupied and this we have documented numerous times ability or security forces going into hospitals, beating health workers there, arresting them, in front of patients, and this increase of the suffering for the civilians and conflict to credible extent.

and so much of these consequences could really be prevented if only health care would be properly protected in conflict. and that is such an important topic the international community needs to address more seriously. nermeen: can you speak, christina, about where these tacks are most prevalent? also, whether these attacks are mostly deliberate? >> our reports for the last year identifies ukraine and myanmar as the two countries were the whole health system is under incredible attack. in ukraine, some 11% of the health infrastructure has been damaged. in myanmar, the devastation is in so many areas, through 70 different ways from arresting health workers, from the coup government bombing its own civilians. it is really, really close to

unimaginable. these are the two countries where most events have been documented. but in total, we covered 42 countries and it is so widespread and such a common problem in conflict. amy: christina wille, if you could talk about the best practices, though it is horrible to think in conflict regions what are the best rules of war, but also the effect on health care workers specifically? use specific examples. >> there is a law of war and that is very clear that health care should be protected and health care needs to be provided to all sides in conflict. this is really something that the humanitarian community tries to do to not ask who the person that needs care is but to offer to everyone.

but the real problem is that in conflict zone sudan, like so many others, it is the conflict -- they do not respect these rules and they go on deliberate attacks on the health system and also the health workers because they're just so important in preventing further the consequences to civilians. it is so -- there are practical things that humanitarian agencies can and are doing, but one of the big concerns is that it is just -- there is no punitive for this. we have these laws, but there are never any consequences. we have very few examples of any attempt being made to actually address that the rules of law are just not respected. nermeen: before we wrap up, you said that russia's attacks on ukraine are not without precedent.

they're just different in terms of scale and intensity. the world health organization also found earlier this year the number of attacks on health care facilities and personnel in ukraine was the highest ever recorded in any humanitarian crisis. so what do you mean when you say they're not without precedent? >> we have seen it in syria, hospitals been deliberately bombed. we have seen it as far back as in chechnya in 1996 when russian forces attacked icrc-run hospitals. it is nothing, and virtually, nothing new. but we are also seeing it in many other countries and it is work to note the wagner forces in africa have also been attacking. amy: christina wille, thank you for being with us, director of insecurity insight.

we will have a link to your new report "ignoring red lines: violence against healthcare in conflict." and dr. khidir dalouk, advocacy director of the sudanese american physicians association. coming up, as russia transfers technical nuclear weapons to belarus, we will speak to gilbert achcar, author of "the new cold war: the united states, russia and china from kosovo to ukraine." stay with us. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. we turn now to ukraine and what our next guest calls the new cold war. the president of belarus has announced russia has begun transferring tactical nuclear weapons to the former soviet state which shares a nearly 700 mile border with ukraine. in an interview, belarus president alexander lukashenko warned he is ready to use the nuclear weapons if belarus faces aggression. meanwhile, u.s. defense

secretary lloyd austin has urged allies to "dig deep" to provide more arms and ammunition to help ukraine as its launches its counteroffensive against russia. austin's comment comes two days after russian president vladimir putin admitted russia is facing a shortage of ammunition, drones, and warplanes despite a sharp increase in military production. in other news from ukraine, the head of the international atomic energy agency rafael grossi is back in ukraine to visit the russia-occupied zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant, the largest nuclear plant in europe. the iaea has expressed concern that the recent destruction of the kakhovka dam could impact the plant's supply of water needed for cooling. this all comes as the u.s. state department has announced tony blinken's plan to leave friday for a trip to china, the first by a u.s. secretary of state since 2018. in february, china put forward a 12-point peace plan to end the war in the ukraine.

we are joined now by gilbert achcar, professor of international relations at the school of oriental and african studies at the university of london. his most recent book is titled "the new cold war: the united states, russia and china from kosovo to ukraine." here richly wrote an article for truth out headlined avoca washington is obstructing the path to a political settlement in ukraine." in his recent le monde piece is headlined "a cold war by any other name: there's been much debate over the definition of the term 'cold war' but one thing's for sure: we're in one now." welcome back to democracy now! if you can start off with that issue that is on the table right now, this 12 point chinese peace plan. talk about how the u.s. media and u.s. government characterized it to my talk about what you feel is being missed.

>> first of all, good morning. thank you to you and to nermeen for inviting me. it is very important to get this opportunity, especially for a book like this one, which is the kind that the mainstream prefers to ignore, as you know. now, about the chinese plan. well, that is part of an attitude that has been expressed by china actually since the beginning of the russian invasion in february last year. from the very beginning, two days into the invasion, china stated it stands for the territorial integrity of all countries, including ukraine. that was specified in this way. and yet that was completely ignored by washington. same story happens now because this plan is an attempt by china

to set principles, general principles. and they include territorial integrity and sovereignty of all countries. so that is very important principle to start with in addressing the issue of ukraine. and yet that has been shunned. and denounced as a sham, and all that. so it is deliberately there is no will on the site of washington to get china into that, and yet in the political settlement of this was without involving china and without the united nations. amy: used to even zelenskyy acknowledged what china was putting forward and while the united states says this is clearly a pro-russian plan, that even putin bristled at this point of china acknowledging the

sovereignty of ukraine. >> right. there was an amazing contrast between u.s. president joe biden -- i mean, speaking of the chinese plan in very contentious terms, and the ukrainian president himself, who actually emphasized the fact this is a positive and good starting point. since this plan, increased really negotiation and discussions between the ukraine government and the chinese government. so again, this is a matter of attitude. i think it is very deliberate the side of washington. that is part of what i call the new cold war, which has not started now. this deliberate desire to keep

china out, to keep the united states in control of everything. i mean, it does not take beijing or moscow to acknowledge or see it. indeed, i mean, very clear u.s. hegemonic position that has been the case since the 1990's. nermeen: gilbert achcar, let's go to your book in the title "the new cold war." if you could explain the features of the war, who you think the principal adversaries are, and why you believe that this situation is more comparable to what -- the global for configurations of power prior to world war i rather than that which existed between 1945 and the dissolution of the soviet union, which is of course what was termed the cold war.

>> right. actually, the expression cold war existed before the first world war. i mean come on record of that expression the first used is by the german socialist leader edward bernstein. by that expression, he meant the fact germany was engaged in an military buildup in preparation of war against france and the rest of the european rivals without yet getting into a real war. that is what he called a cold war. that is the origin, actually, the first use of the expression. the particularity of the cold war of post-1945, the one that is considered by historians to run from 1945 until 1990, 1991,

that cold war had also and ideological dimension. but the ideological dimension is not what this cold war. the cold war refers to the military buildup. in effect the united states in particular for the first time in its history cap people without wore a high level of military expenditure, much higher than what you had between the two world wars let alone what existed before the first world war, and that is what some american economists called permanent war economy. and that is a key characteristic of the cold war, whether the 1945-1991 or the new cold war that actually started after the demise of the soviet union. started first by washington. washington maintained a military

budget based on the scenario of two major wars, and that was clearly -- i explained that at that time in two articles which are reproduced in the book. they make two chapters out of five in which i said in the 1990's, i showed how the military planning of the pentagon was based on the possibility of war with both russia and china. and this will lead on the background of other provocative attitudes by washington towards these two countries into what i call the new cold war, which i identify as starting with the kosovo war due to the fact this was the first time nato as such enters into a war come a war circumventing united nations security council.

nermeen: gilbert achcar, if you could speak about that, what the involvement of nato was in kosovo, because the first and fact airstrikes that nato carried out in its history were in bosnia against bosnian serbs to prevent the ethnic cleansing of bosnian muslims that was underway then. what distinguish the two air wars from kosovo from those in bosnia? >> right. i mean, the bombings since early 1990's, the bombings in former yugoslavia remained relatively limited and were linked to the united nations intervention in that area. but the kosovo war was the first real war. that is what you can call a war

for nato. of course you had the war in bosnia and former yugoslavia. at the first real nato war was the cause of a war. that war was conducted by circumventing the opposition of both moscow and beijing in the u.n. security council. that set a pattern of ignoring, if you want to believe the international law and the united nations, that the two other countries found extremely alarming. of course, that would be repeated at a much higher skill later on with the invasion of iraq in 2003, which again was completely illegal by the standards of international law and circumvented the security council. amy: professor, in an article published earlier this year, you

wrote -- "consistent anti-imperialist must combine their support of ukraine's right to self-defense with support for a u.n.-based peaceful settlement on the ongoing war. those who call for peaceful opposing ukraine's right to get what it needs for its defense are in fact advocating its capitulation." can you talk about this? also, talk about the increasing role of china here and also in other places and how the u.s. is continually trying to counter that and the significance of blinken going to china this weekend. >> right. well, i think there are two pitfalls that progressive forces should be avoiding. one is to react to washington and nato supported ukraine are rejecting this and ignoring in

this way the agency, if you want, of the ukrainians who are fighting for their country, fighting for the population, and can see russia is targeting more and more the civilians in ukraine. ukraine has the very legitimate right to self-defense. therefore, if we acknowledge this right to self-defense, we have to acknowledge it's right to get weapons for self-defense. but this being said, i would put the emphasis on self-defense, that is i think it is right that ukraine gets weapons -- defensive weapons like into, antimissile, antitank and the rest, but the demands of escalation of the war, of enabling ukraine to strike deep into russian territory and the rest, these are extremely dangerous. they put the world at very high risk. and i would say they put also the ukrainian population a very

high risk because russia has not yet done to ukraine white it could do if -- what it could do if it wanted to turn even more violent than what it is. on the other hand, as progressives, we have to be in favor of a peaceful settlement, political settlement. it on the basis of principles -- and i think there can't be any sustainable peace for ukraine without the involvement of the united nations. i mean, without basing these on the principles of the u.n. charter, including of course the sovereignty and integrity, territorial integrity. that would mean also involving china. china would be by far the highest leverage over russia, even much more now because russia because of that war has turned more and more dependent

in some was economically and the rest on china. so it is imperative to associate china, to work with china in order to get some peace. even european countries like france and germany, major allies of the united states, advocate the involvement of china in a political settlement process, whereas washington until now has been blocking this probably also waiting to see what the counteroffensive, the ongoing ukraine counteroffensive might produce. now, you mentioned in the news that antony blinken is going to beijing for the first time since 2018. imagine that. that is amazing. well, i hope than that washington will change its attitude and try to work with

china for political settlement of this terrible tragedy. nermeen: before we conclude, i would like you to explain the longer view, historical context of what you think propelled the russian invasion of ukraine at this moment. you speak about the neoliberal policies, for example, that were implemented immediately after the dissolution of the soviet union and how that may have contributed to the rise of putin himself. and the distinction between the causes of the russian invasion in 2014 and 2022, why you see those as distinct. >> right. well, first, yes, putin himself and i was even xi jinping for china, they are in part the product of the kind of international conditions that have been created by washington.

washington in the 1990's had a window of opportunity during which as it acknowledged itself it was in the position to shape the world. therefore, it faced several options. well, instead of going for options -- peaceful options, options leading to a long-term peace and international relations and to enhancing the role of the united nations, it made the opposite choices. one of them being the choice of not only keeping nato, which was originally built as a defensive alliance against the soviet union, but to enlarge nato eastward toward countries that were previously under the soviet domination. you mentioned the neoliberal policies that were promoted and

fostered in russia by washington, by the international monetary find, and the whole set of western interest. they were absolutely destructive of russian society. the 1990's are nightmarish and therefore if you look at what happened, the very sharp drop in the standard of living of the russians to the point in the late 1990's, the gross domestic product that is the world economy of russia was equal to only the military budget of the united states. so this is the creation that created these conditions, the situation that created vladimir putin, his kind of nationalist authoritarian rule. and of course, even that rule is self has an evolution over the

years which went further and further internationalism and authoritarianism, but that was on the background of conflicting relations with washington, with the western countries, with nato. that played a real role in that regard in the same way i just said that also the kind of provocative attitude of the united states toward china created conditions under which nationalism can flourish and lead also to increase authoritarianism and nationalism as represented by china's present ruler xi jinping. there is a connection between all of that because the global conditions will create a for this or that depending on the nature development.

yes, you have this -- amy: we just have a minute to go, professor. >> right. very quickly, the two wars, the military interventions by russia in georgia in 2008 and in ukraine 2014, were meant by the russian side to block the accession of these two countries like crating a warlike situation. we cannot say the same thing of the annexation of crimea which also took place in 2014, which was meant by vladimir putin as a means to restore his popularity which had been dwindling beforehand. he knew how this could play very well with russian nationalism. 2022 invasion, indeed, is

plainly in that context. it is -- it was not to block ukraine's succession to nato because that was not on the table anyway at that point. amy: gilbert achcar, thank you for being with us, professor of international relations at the school of oriental and african studies at the university of london. his most recent book just out "the new cold war: the united , states, russia and china from kosovo to ukraine." and we will link to your most recent piece "washington is obstructing the pack to a in ukraine." coming up, we go to johannesburg south africa. why was kumi naidoo, the former head of amnesty international as well as greenpeace thrown out as a bank meeting? stay with us. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with nermeen shaikh. we end today's show in south africa, where climate campaigners attempted to disrupt the annual shareholders meeting for standard bank to protest the bank's financing of the proposed east african crude oil pipeline. it is known as eacop. the 900-mile pipeline would carry crude oil from uganda to

tanzania. france's total energies and the china national offshore oil corporation are behind eacop, working with ugandan and tanzanian state-owned oil firms. kumi naidoo, the former head of greenpeace and amnesty international and extinction rebellion activist malik dasoo were forcibly removed from standard bank during their peaceful protest. kumi naidoo joins us now from johannesburg. welcome back to democracy now! explain your protest and explain exactly for a global audience what eacop is. >> basically, standard bank, like many other banks around the world, on the one hand now recognized that we are in a climate emergency, recognizes that must change, but their actions appear to be contradictory when it comes to an increase in fossil fuel investments that we are saying as was the case as standard

bank. in particular, the east african crude oil pipeline project would see about 100,000 tanzanian's and ugandans displaced. we have already seen the signs of human rights violations. as always, it will promise there will be massive amounts of jobs. we know most of the drops are -- jobs are transient. the higher pay level will be people from outside the community. the bottom line is this is a carbon bomb. the amount of carbon that this would put into the atmosphere will be catastrophic. it is the equivalent of 9 million cars on the road for example. in addition to that, standard bank is supporting the gas projects in mozambique and here in south africa there have -- they have been supporting a project that i seen activists being killed.

essentially what we are saying, standard bank and other banks, you need to recognize your now the judgment targets are protest. we do not have time right now to go after every will, cold, gas company, deforestation. we have to follow the money and basically this might have been aimed specifically at standard bank but it is also a call and encouragement activists all over the world, let's follow the money and let's stop the flow of capital to dirty energy and find it directly into clean energy. nermeen: what are the companies that are backing this pipeline, the chinese corporation, national offshore oil corporation as well as total energies, the french company? >> total is the biggest. here's the kicker, assuming this

was ok environment environment inal terms, let's just say all of our concerns are displaced. all of this -- all of this is going to europe. it is destruction at its worst. it is colonial, it is going to potentially put investors in this project like other investors that are putting money into carbon bombs right now. activism against that is rising all around the world. the possibility of them ending up with what they like to call standard carbon assets is becoming more and more a reality. nermeen: just boil, the wealth of natural resources across the continent of africa, why so many of them and certainly the prophets, are going to europe, to china, and elsewhere but not to the continent itself. >> i think we have lost each

other. amy: can you hear us? can you hear us? >> i don't hear them anymore. amy: we are talking to kumi naidoo in johannesburg, south africa. he may have just lost the line to us. he is the former head of greenpeace international and also amnesty international. he was just thrown out of a standard bank meeting in south africa protesting eacop. let me go to extinction rebellion activist malik dasoo speaking outside standard bank's agm. >> [indiscernible]

amy: germany also held stop eacop protests in bonn, where they gathered for a cop28 preparatory conference. this year's united nations-sponsored climate summit will be hosted by one of the world's biggest fossil fuel producers, the united arab emirates. the meeting will be presided over by the head of uae's national oil company sultan al-jaber. on tuesday, the swedish climate activist greta thunberg, who recently graduated from high school, spoke at the conference. >> it is what we decide now that will define the rest of humanity's future. and whether we choose to do that or not, if we don't, it will be a death sentence to countless of people and it is already a death sentence to countless people living on the front lines of the climate crisis today. amy: on tuesday, the u.s. special climate envoy john kerry

told the u.n. security council global steps to tackle climate change must be ramped up and the world needs to more aggressively reduce its reliance on coal and other fossil fuels. >> it is now indisputable that the climate crisis is one of the top security threats, not just to the developed world but to the entire planet, to life on the planet itself. and is the crisis that already today costs countries billions of dollars each year, which we spent not even to prevent at this point but just to clean up the mess. and most importantly, it costs the world millions of lives. it is an active threat against the livelihoods and peace of people

everywhere on this planet. amy: in may, over 130 u.s. lawmakers and members of the european parliament sent a joint letter to president biden, to the european commission president ursula von der leyen, as well as the u.n. secretary-general antónio guterres demanding the removal of sultan ahmed al jaber, the head of the abu dhabi national oil company, as president of the upcoming u.n. climate conference cop28. the lawmakers, which include senators ed markey and bernie sanders who wrote one of the largest barriers has been in -- we want to thank kumi naidoo in johannesburg, south africa, former head of greenpeace international and amnesty international who just got detained along with extinction

rebellion thrown out of a standard bank meeting. that does it for our show. democracy now! is looking for feedback from people who appreciate the closed captioning. e-mail your comments to outreach@democracynow.org or mail them to democracy now! p.o. box 693 new york, new york 10013. [captioning made possible by democracy now!]

[suspenseful piano music plays] [mechanical reverberations echo] [suspenseful piano music plays] [chiwetel] the earth from space. [classical music builds] the only known planet in the universe with surface water. [suspenseful piano music plays] water is what made life and civilization possible. but the ancient water patterns on earth are shifting. no one can be sure anymore where tomorrow's water is coming from. [classical music builds]