07/05/23 07/05/23 [captioning made possible by democracy now!] amy: from new york, this is democracy now! >> just now bombing, shooting cut destroyed anything comes in their faces. amy: the jenin refugee camp is reeling after israel carries out its largest military operation in the occupied west bank in

over 20ears. we will get a update from inside the camp. then to france where thousands have been arrested in a week of nationwide protest after video capture the police killing of nahel merzouk, a 17-year-old teenager of algerian-moroccan dissent, during a traffic stop in a paris suburb. >> imagine if that had been my brother. we are not safe here. we should be safe with the police but we are scared of them. that is not normal. amy: then as the supreme court blocks biden's student debt relief plan, we will speak with astra taylor about what is next. >> we are not going to let the supreme court have the last word . president biden announced within hours of the decision that he is going to pursue another legal

pathway to the higher education act to cancel student debt. amy: as the supreme court allows a wedding website designer to turn away same-sex couples, we will speak to the head of the interfaith alliance who says religion is not a license to discriminate. all that and more, coming up. welcome to democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman. israel says it has withdrawn from the occupied west bank city of jenin following a brutal two-day raid thakilled at let 12 palesnians in jin anone in ramlah. scores more were injured. it was the worst israeli attack on theest bank itwo decade thousands are taking part in a funeral procession today for the victims. jenin's mayor lamented the u.n. has "failed us" d accusing israel of war crimes. the raid came after over a year of deadly israeli military attacks. this is an injured elderly

resident of jenin speaking while the assault was still ongoing. >> they arettacking armed peop. they use planes and rockets. this is not supposed to happen in a cp. nothing isafe in t camp. they dug it up with bulldozers. why? amy: meanwhile, israel launched air strikes on gaza earlier today in response to rocket fire from the besieged enclave. on tuesday, israel's far-right police minister itamar ben-gvir called on civilians to carry guns after a car ramming and stabbing attack in tel aviv claimed by hamas. at least eight people were wounded. on sunday, israel announced it is buying an additional 25 f-35 lockheed martin stealth fighter jets from the united states, bringing its arsenal to 75 jets. the deal is financed through u.s. military aid to israel. france remains roiled by nationwide protests following

the police killing last week of nahel merzouk, a teenager of north african descent. some 3400 people have been arrested in recent days as tens of thousands of police descended on french streets. thousands of vehicles have been burned and homes and businesses were damaged. prosecutors are investigating the death of a 27-year-old who was hit by a projectile, likely fired by riot police, during street clashes. the killing of merzouk has thrust long-simmering tensions around racism and the french police into the spotlight. >> imagine if that had been my brother. in the streets, we refused to comply. we are not safe here. we should be safe with the police but we are scared of them. that is not normal. amy: we'll go to france for the latest later in the broadcast. in ukraine, at least 43 people, including 12 children, were injured in a russian attack in the northeastern kharkiv region. russia has accused ukraine,

aided by the u.s. and nato, of launching a drone attack on moscow, leading to the temporary closure of an international airport tuesday. kyiv has not claimed responsibility for the attack. meanwhile, ukraine has been holding emergency drills after warning russia may blow up the zaporizhzhia nuclear plant. it ithe largest nuclear plant in europe. on saturday, the ukrainian writer victoria amelina died as a result of injuries from a russian strike on a restaurant in kramatorsk last week, which killed 13 people. amelina was part of a human rights group, truth hounds, investigating russian war crimes. she was at a restaurant meeting with a colombian delegation. she was remembered by loved ones and peers during a funeral service in kyiv tuesday. >> it was important to her to travel to the occupied area together testimonies until the world about it as much as she can.

we did not only use a writer and poet in her prime, but also human rights defender. amy: this comes as prominent russian journalist elena milashina was violently attacked, along with attorney alexander nemov, while on their way to the court sentencing of a human rights activist in grozny, chechnya's capital. unknown assailants beat them, shaved off milashina's hair, and doused her in blue paint. she reports for the novaya gazeta newspaper, described the harrowing attack from the hospital where she was being treated. >> it was like a classic kidnapped. he just hasn't happened in a long time. they came, through the taxi driver out of the car, put my head down and tied my hands. they put me on my knees and a pistol to my head. amy: she was reporting and chechnya on the lgbtq community.

back in the united states, the supreme court on friday blocked president biden's student debt relief plan, which sought to cancel up to $20,000 in individual loans, adding up to over $400 billion of federal student debt. the 6-3 decision by the ultra-conservative-led court came as a major blow to some 40 million qualified borrowers as president biden announced his administration would pursue debt relief. pres. biden: the so-called higher education act will allow secretary cardona, who is with me today, to compromise, waive, or release loans under certain circumstances. this is legally sound. it will take longer and in my view it is the beth -- best path that remains for that really. amy: meanwhile, three civil rights group filed a complaint against harvard with the u.s.

department of education arguing the elite university's legacy admissions policy discriminates against applicants of color after the supreme court ruled last week colleges cannot use affirmative action in their admissions. 70% of legacy admissions to harvard are white and candidates with family ties are more than five times as likely to be admitted than non-legacy applicants. in another setback for equal rights, the supreme court also ruled friday in favor of a christian colorado web designer who refused to create websites for same-sex couples even though the state bans such discrimination. the justices were again divided 6-3 along ideological lines. liberal justice sonia sotomayor wrote in the dissent the decision was heartbreaking and a "reactionary exclusion." following friday's rulings, california congressmember ro khanna and other democrats reintroduced a bill imposing an 18-year-old term limit on supreme court justices and giving presidents two

appointments during a white house term. president biden last week said the current supreme court is "not a normal court" but rejected calls to expand it. we'll have more on the latest supreme court rulings later in the broadcast. it was another deadly independence day weekend as at least 15 people were killed in a spate of shootings across the u.s. in philadelphia, an ar-15-toting gunman in a bulletproof vest shot and killed five people and injured two boys in an apparently random mass shooting monday. in fort worth, texas, an armed attack following independence day festivities claimed another three lives. these came after two people were killed and at least 28 injured, including many children, by gunfire at a baltimore block party. at least five people were shot dead across chicago over the holiday weekend. during a speech at the national education association tuesday, president biden again called on congress to pass stricter gun control legislation. pres. biden: arming teachers is not the answer.

arming teachers is not the answer. manning assault weapons and high-capacity magazines, extensive background checks -- they are part of the answer. amy: a federal judge has blocked parts of florida's new election law, including a provision barring non-u.s. citizens and people convicted of certain felonies from collecting or handling voter-registration materials. u.s. district judge mark walker slammed the law as "florida's latest assault on the right to vote." tuesday, july 4, was the hottest day ever recorded around the world with the average global temperature reaching 62.92 degrees fahrenheit according to data from the u.s. national centers for environmental prediction. the previous record of 62.62 degrees was reached one day earlier, monday, as heatwaves scorched multiple regions across the globe. here in the u.s., millions of people have been under excessive heat warnings in the south and west of the country. meanwhile, wildfire smoke from canada continues to plague large sections of the united states. wildfires are also burning in

colorado and washington state. the international atomic energy agency has approved japan's plan to dump over one million metric tons of treated radioactive water from the fukushima nuclear power plant into the pacific ocean. the water has been in storage following the 2011 tsunami and nuclear disaster. this is iaea chief rafael grossi. >> it is not an iaea decision, the government of japan if the government decides to proceed with that, the iaea will be permanently here reviewing, monitoring, assessing the activity for decades to come. amy: the plan has drawn ire from china and south korea, as well as smaller pacific island nations, environmentalists, and a large section of people in japan. the treated water still contains tritium, a byproduct of nuclear fission which has been linked to

cancer. the u.n. security council voted tond its dece-long peacekeeping presence in mali after the country's military junta toldhe 13,000-oop internatiol force toeave. mali h suffered adly attac from armed rebel groups across its north and central regions following uprising 2012. the serity crisis has led to back-to-back coups in 2020 and 2021. in additn to the u. forces, an estimated 1000 fighters from russia's wagner mercenary group remain in li. earlier this year, u.n. repo found wagner soldiers took part in an attack on the village of moura lastear, whichilled 500 people, mostly civilians, guatemala has begun a review of its ballots from its presidential election after the party a front runner, former first lady sandra torres and her allies, challenged the results of june's first round. protest erupted over the weekend after the constitutional court suspended the certification of the results which put the

progressive candidate in second place, sending him to a runoff in august. rights groups have urged the court to respect the will of millions of guatemalans who took to the polls last month. this is a semilla attorney. >> what is clear is the slogan of the official party, supported by parties close to the ruling party, is diminished -- managed open as many boxes as possible and allow them to declare the process know and voice of the election can be repeated. amy: in brazil, former far-right president jair bolsonaro has been banned from running for public office until 2030. brazil's electoral court found bolsonaro guilty of abuse of power and fueling disinformation

in last year's presidential election, which he lost to luiz inácio lula da silva. and those are some of the headlines. this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman in new york, joined by democracy now!'s juan gonzález in chicago. hi, juan. juan: hi, amy. welcome to all of our listeners and viewers from around the country and around the world. amy: palestinians in the jenin refugee camp are emerging to -- facing widespread destruction after israel withdrew troops today following what some are calling the largest military operation in the occupied west bank in 20 years. the jenin refugee camp is home to around 11,000 people. israel attacked what it said were militants in the camp with drone-fired missiles and ground troops. palestinian health officials say the massive two-day military sault kill 12 palestians and injured at least 140 more. the head of jenin hospital reports most of the wounded were shot in thhead and cst. the israi militarylaimed it

was targeting militants, but residents of the camp say they were targeted by airstrikes and nstop grou fire. israeli bulldozers destroyed roads out of the camp and left just a single ro for ambunces to evuate the unded. doctors without borders said israeli troops fired tear gas several times into a hospital. today thousds are takg part in funal processn for the ctims. nin's limited the u.n. has of them got failed us" and accused israel of war crimes. this is 63-year-old refugee in jenin, jihad hassan. this reminds me of the 1948 not. today people left because i fear and also because the bombs taeted siblis and others. the israeli army does not differentiate. the difference is the military machines. today the military artillery stronger and heavier.

now they use drones. before they used apache weapons. i was injured in 2002 by shrapnel in my leg. amy: meanwhile, israel launched airstrikes on gaza earlier today in response to rocket fire from the besieged enclave. days before raiding the jenin , the far-right israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu and his ultranationali government announced israel would buy5 f-35 stealth fighter jets from the united states at the cost of $3 billion. in response to the raid, the white house defended what it called israel's "right to defend" itself. palestinian-american congremember rashida tlaib condemned the operation and said, "congress must stop funding this violent israeli apareid regime all of this comes as amid more th 450 attac on palestians settlers is year ale and as thousands of israelis protested monday against

netanyahu's plans to overhaul and severely curtail the powers of the judiciary. for more, we are joined by two guests. in haifa, amjad iraqi is a senior editor at +972 magazine, where his latest piece is headlined "in jenin, israel is unveiling the next phase of apartheid." and in jenin, mustafa sheta is the general manager of the freedom theater. he wrote a piece for mondoweiss titled "'the gravity of the situation cannot be understated': an eyewitness account from the israeli assault on jenin." we welcome you both to democracy now! mustafa sheta, inside a refugee camp, let's start with you. can you describe what took place over the last two days? >> thank you for hosting me. the last two days, we faced horrible and difficult situation . israel military attack on jenin.

they targeted the people, the refugees in the refugee camp. they came here to clean the yard and went to end the idea of resistance. it was a difficult situation for people who are in horrible conditions. without water. they tried to enter -- [indiscernible]

they destroyed cars, they destroyed houses. it is that collective punishment . it was very hard for the women, for all the people with the people in jenin in general. juan: why has jenin emerged in recent years such a focus of israeli repression and attack? what is particular about the jenin camp that israel so concerned about? >> home of the people are refugees. -- all of the people are refugees. [indiscernible]

the idea started from not just 2002, but for a long time. the first day it was established in 1954. refugees involved -- the invasion in 2002, and killed many people. they think by that way they end the idea of thinking about the revolution. [indiscernible] why jenin? because we are still in the same feeling.

the people want to be involved. they protect their digty. juan: you are the general manager of the freedom theater. could you talk about the significance of the work that you do and whether your theater was targeted as well? >> in fact, the freedom theater -- the idea started with a jewish woman when she came to jenin in the first intifada. to provide a space for children. later, she and her mother established the theater. it was the first in jenin. it is about finding the to talk

about -- [indiscernible] later in 2006 when we had the freedom theater again, we raised the idea what we provide a space to create -- [indiscernible]

we provide a space to be like social leaders. freedom of occupation. freedom in thinking. we have this kind of relationship. [indiscernible] amy: i want to also bring in amjad iraqi, senior editor at +972 magazine speaking to us from haifa. you have said the jenin assault

is being carried out in the context of israel's "mowing the lawn doctrine" as a means of maintaining its apartheid regime. can you explain? talk about who is behind it and the significance of the day before the attack, the u.s. approving more weapon sales to israel, bringing their total of planes to, what, i think it was 75 attack planes? >> thank you, amy, for having me. in a nutshell, the idea of mowing the lawn is a doctrine has been promoted by the israeli military for quite a while, mostly associated with army policy, vis-à-vis, the gaza strip, particularly targeting the political group hamas and jihad and other militants. the idea of mowing the lawn is essentially the idea the israel is have there is no print solution to eradicate these

groups and the idea is your in a constant cycle. this is what we have been seeing put in full force, especially since the beginning of the blockade of gaza 2007. you've seen variations of this military policy but what we have been seeing the past few days in jenin is that doctrine playing out in full force. this operation is not happening in a vacuum. the past year and a half, the israelirmy has be focusing on cities in the north west bank, targeti palestini militantand their weapo as mustafa sha describing, complete punishment of the populations, especially the refugee camps, very much in the same methodology as what we are seeing in the gaza strip. as those confrontations have escalated between militants against army and sedents and metimes cies inside rael

the army is coming under more pressure to go in. to ask ago, we saw the first time they returned to airpower through apache helicopters, whh i believwas supplied by the u.s. two or three days later, a drone strike. the first airstrikes in the west bank forhe first te since e second intifada. this is the manifestation we are saying. this is the philosophy playing out. basically, the maintenance of an apartheid regime that includes gaza and the west bank and this is the solution the israeli 30 sourcing from the political echelon to the military astonishment. juan: can you expend what has been happening over the last few weeks and months and the context of the most extreme right-wing government that israel has had in its history and the decision of the new netanyahu government to begin to accelerate more and

more settlements in the west bank? i think we may have lost the audio. let's go back to mustafa sheta. your response to the same question, the decision by the netanyahu government to begin once again, to accelerate settler expansion, to what degree has this contributed to the rising tensions there? >> i think netanyahu, he and his government failed and what is happening in jenin. i think they want to send messages to the people. [indiscernible] after the military oppression

happened in jenin and the west bank -- we were in the same position for two years. nothing has changed. they still continue to punish us, attack us. this government is not just -- still in the same condition. without any benefits for any person, any party. i expect this government will fail, will not continue. from the first eight his government was established, i don't expect something good will come of it. i don't know you heard about netanyahu's statement when he said he doesn't believe in two states. we are one state.

all of the conditions are like israel itself. amy: mustafa sheta, as we wrap up, if you can respond to the possibility the israeli government is saying they reserve the right to go back into jenin to continue this assault? and also the significance of the thousands of people, israelis, who were in the streets protesting but they were protesting against netanyahu dismantling the israeli judiciary. where there protests against the assault on the jenin refugee camp where you are? >> in fact, i expect israel will attack after to weeks, one month, we don't know. the protests and the demonstrations against netanyahu

, it is not just about jenin. that a lot of interior problems. i don't expect something to change in israel with policies. the people elect netanyahu on the right when they are still control -- [indiscernible] i don't expect some big changes with netanyahu with this. the u.s. government support israel to protect themselves. they say we support, we understand how israel protects themselves. at the same time, nobody talks about what is going on with normal people in jenin refugee camp or people of palestine.

amy: we want to thank you for being with us, mustafa sheta, general manager of the freedom theater in jenin. and amjad iraqi is a senior editor at +972 magazine and a speaking to us from haifa. then the protests over the killing of a 17 year old teenager nahel merzouk. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. we turn now to france, which has seen a week of nationwide protests following the police

killing last week of nahel merzouk, a teenager of north african descent. he was killed during a traffic stop nanterre, a suburb of paris. his death was captured on video. more than 3000 people have been arrested, tens of thousands of police descended on the demonstrations. many protesters are now appearing in court and the justice minister has called for prosecutors to seek prison sentences in some cases. we turn now to france, which -- and so we are going to go right now to rokhaya diallo, a french journalist, writer, fell maker, contributing writer for "the washington post." she is a researcher in residence at first on university. her latest opinion piece for the guardian is headlined "france has ignored racist police violence for decades. this uprising is the price of that denial."

can you start off by just describing like is taken place and talk about the simmering tension that was ignited with the killing of this young man. >> thank you so much for telling about what is going on today. first, the death of a teenager nahel who was killed in a traffic stop by the police. and what outraged people now in the streets was why he was captured -- while he was captured, you could hear the sound that showed something very threatening to them. and he was killed so quickly. also he is from the african region -- north african region. police brutality and uses.

that is why people -- many of the people who went to the streets right after his killing or people who looked like him and some of them think it could have been targeting the same way. juan: what do we know about nahel merzouk in terms of the victim himself? why do so many young people whose families came originally from north africa or other former french colonies identify with what he went through? >> yes, like there are figures who were issued by -- a body that aims to tackle discrimination. that body -- if you are young man perceived as north african or as black, or 20 times more likely to be checked by the

police than any other category. that means we do have figures. we know certain groups in the population are especially targeted and they are more likely to be checked and also to be killed. in 2017 it actually enabled more -- an easier use of firearms by the police. it has made it easier for the police to use their firearms. most of the people who have been killed are prime and immigrant background. most are north african, african. it sounds like really part of -- a consequence. juan: what has been the response

of president macron to the uprisings and disturbances around the country? >> so the response before the uprisings, his response was very uncommon, actually, because he said the death of nahel was inexcusable. he also said it was inexplicable, which i don't believe since we had figures for a long time and we know that those things unfortunately happen. what happened first, before the video was spread on social media, the police issued a report saying nahel was dangerous and he was driving towards them. the video showed us that was not the case. it also means we can think other

people have been facing the same kind of situation and if it wasn't captured, we don't know what really happened. the police at the end of the day, issue reports that fits to their version of the story, but it is not always the truth. macron said at first it was inexcusable but then he really had a hard stance against the uprising and he blamed it on the parents saying he was considering sanctions toward the parents who had their children taking part of the uprisings. amy: i want to turn to nahel's mother who has led protests through the parisian suburb calling for justice for her son. in a video published online, she said nahel was her best friend and his last words to her before he was killed were, "i love you." >> i've lost a child.

i was all alone with him. they took a baby away from me. he was still a child. he needed his mother. this morning he gave me a big kiss and said, "mom, i love you." i told him "i love you. look after yourself." there you go, he went to get mcdonald's and i went to work like everyone. one hour later, what do they tell me? "we have shot were son." what are my going to do? i lived for him. i gave him everything. i only have one. i don't have 10. he was my life. he was my best friend. he was everything for me. we were accomplices like you can't imagine. amy: in this is nadia, the grandmother of nahel merzouk. she has asked to be only identified by her first name. >> i blame the police officer who killed my grandson. that is all i'm angry with.

we have the police. we are lucky we have the police. when people were breaking things i tell them, "stop it." people should stop. they should stop. they should not break store windows. they should not ransack us. amy: rokhaya diallo, your final comment? i know -- what do you expect to see next? >> it is very difficult to know what to expect next. i wish there was a profound discussion about police brutality, racialized policing that occurs in those neighborhoods which are surrounding the big cities. it has not been part of the conversation and that is the problem. the u.n. issued a statement saying france has to deal with

the deep problem of racism, but it has been dismissed by the french authorities, by the government will stop it is not been taken into account. i have the feeling we reached an inflection point with the death of nahel, but unfortunate, it is backfiring. there has been support of the police officer we did the killing and has gathered over 1.5 million euros. that means the country is really divided. many people don't get the victim is nahel and the reason why he was killed is -- has much to do with the structural inequality in france. amy: rokhaya diallo, thank you for being with us, french journalist. we will link to your piece in the guardian headlined "france has ignored racist police violence for decades. this uprising is the price of that denial." next up, as the supreme court

blocks biden's student debt relief plan, we will speak with astra taylor. stay with us. ♪♪ [music break]

amy: this is democracy now!, democracynow.org, the war and peace report. i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. we spend the rest of the hour looking at the two major supreme court decisions that came down friday. first relook at how the court blocked president biden's student debt relief plan, which sought to cancel up to $20,000 in individual loans, adding up to over $400 billion of federal student debt. the 6-3 decision by the ultraconservative-led court came as a major blow to some 40 million qualified borrowers. president biden announced his administration would pursue a new path for debt relief. for more, we go to astra taylor, organizer of the debt collective. can you describe what took place on friday? >> this is a baseless lawsuit that absently should have been thrown out of court. that is exactly what justice

kagan says at her dissent, which i recommend everybody read. the ultraconservative majority has twist themselves into a pretzel to hear this case and in the words of justice kagan, they violated the constitution and their decision to strike down biden's debt debt relief plan. they gave part of themselves and basically said, we are nor the laws that congress has passed -- we are ignoring the laws that congress has passed and signed debt relief cannot move forward. it was a blow to anyone who cares about democracy because they actually relied on something called the major questions doctrine which is a made-up statutory interpretation it basically says week on the supreme court, can decide on anything and block agencies from serving the public good. they use this to strike down environmental regulations from the -- and now student debt relief. it is a blow but the silver lining, and it's a small one,

biden did announce what we have been calling plan b. he promised to use it called the higher education act. not whether he will use it but how. it is important the biden administration act fast because time is of the essence. juan: astra, in terms of acting fast, isn't the problem with the alternative that biden is proposing, the rulemaking process will take months if not possibly years to actually go through the required steps of that rulemaking? >> yes. the thing is, other legal experts and advocates have made clear they actually do not need to go through the rulemaking process. we have been clear at the debt collective the higher education

grants the president the authority to wipe out all student debt immediately. we wrote an executive order we have been circulating for a long time. this is something that absolutely can happen quickly. that is imperative because we need to be on the high ground here. we have seen the supreme court is lawless. again, they violated the constitution and the words of justice kagan. what we want to do is be fighting this reactionary court on the higher ground. people have not gotten the debt relief they were honest and they're counting on and that will be life-changing for people. there is no guarantee -- we're seeing all of the decisions from striking down affirmative action to gutting environmental protection. we want to fight them in a bold and robust way and debt cancellation is fully within the president's power.

congress delegated this authority to the secretary of education through multiple laws. we just want people to get the relief they're counting on and we're going to keep pushing the administration to do this the best way possible. amy: can we talk about language? you are using terms like relief and debt cancellation. you're not saying debt forgiveness, which is often used in the media. explain why. >> the debt collective rejects the language of debt forgiveness that implies debtors did something wrong, that there some moral culpability. that debtors should be begging for forgiveness. we say borrowers did nothing wrong. 43 money people have student that because they pursued -- student debt because they pursued an education which we are all entitled to as human beings. we are also entitled to medical debt relief. we want to push back on that moral framework. what we think is that it is the creditors come in this case the

department of education, that should be held morally culpable, that should be blamed for the student debt crisis. that is why we couple our demand for free public college for all for everybody as well as free health care and other vital public services. those are the public services that the supreme court is dedicated to blocking in an autocratic and very dangerous way. juan: could you talk about the impact of the court's decision last week on the financial companies, especially companies like sophia technologies that provide a lot of private student loans? >> this is the outcome that private loan servicers were rooting for. sofi filed a lawsuit to block the covid moratorium on payments, the payment -- the payment phrase that has been placed its 2024 this is something the private sector

doesn't want, something very clear and some of the lawsuit that did not make it all the way to the supreme court that in lawyers were given -- employers were given debt relief because it would give more freedom. this is something big business doesn't want. it is important to note alone servicer was invoked in the student debt cases on friday which is called nebraska vs biden and republican states basically claim to be suing on behalf of the loan servicers based in missouri and that did not participate in it. this is part of the baseless dens of this lawsuit. the loan servicer did not sue, and yet was used as a kind of prop in order to justify this decision. amy: astra taylor, thank you for being with us. we encourage people to go to democracynow.org to see her interview with david dayen of the american prospect who took

on the very issue you are addressing right now, astra. astra speaking to us from north carolina. this is democracy now! i'm amy goodman with juan gonzalez. we are going to turn now to another supreme court decision. in another setback for equal rights, the conservative majority supreme court also ruled 6-3 in favor of her christian colorado web designer who refused to create websites for same-sex couples even though the state, colorado, bans sex discrimination. democracy now! spoke to the new republic reporter melissa jeer grant friday reported that part of the lawsuit that the alliance defending freedom filed on behalf of lorie smith of colorado was fake. >> in 2016, this website designer named lorie smith, whose business is called 303 creative, she believed that a

colorado anti-discrimination ordinance that protects people from discrimination -- among other things, from discrimination based on sexual orientation -- she believed that that precluded her from entering into the wedding website business. now, she has never created a wedding website for anybody, and including a same-sex couple. so in the course of making this argument, she claimed two things -- one, that this law meant that she couldn't post an announcement on her website saying that she wouldn't make these websites for any couple that wasn't in a biblical marriage that she approved of, and additionally, in a later filing in the original case in 2016, she claimed that an actual same-sex couple sought to have her build a website for them, that an inquiry -- it doesn't seem that it was a legitimate inquiry, but it remained in the case. it came up in the district court ruling that ruled against her. it came up in their appeal. it's even been included in filings to the supreme court and was referenced by her attorneys, alliance defending freedom, who are a christian nationalist law

project. they said, "hey, she's had an actual inquiry, so this is a case that, you know, has some relevance." but before this inquiry became a subject of debate -- it hadn't really been reported out until i was able to reach the person who allegedly made the inquiry -- amy: to see our full interview with melissa gira grant, go to democracynow.org. we are joined by reverend paul raushenbush the president and -- we are joined by reverend paul brandeis raushenbush the president and ceo of interfaith alliance. interfaith alliance along with 30 other faith-based and civil rights groups filed an amicus brief in supreme court case. can you talk about what this means if a private company can discriminate against the lgbtq community, can they put a sign in the wood of a store that says "we don't serve gays, blacks,

latinos"? >> thank you for having me on. i'm delighted and frustrated this is the reason we are talking. your entering into a terrible moment where the pandora's box has been opened and we are not sure exactly what it means but what it does mean for sure is that permission has been granted to use religion as a way to discriminate against your fellow people and we are going to see how this happens. it is not in a vacuum. this is happening already went lgbtq people are under attack with religion as a pretext. this gives permission for a lot of bad behavior. what we have to say is we are in a situation where what is legal cannot be considered moral. what the law is cannot be considered just.

we have a supreme court that basically put down and adverse decision, which is bad for religion and also bad for discriminated areas like it could be race, it could be other protective groups and we just have to see how this plays out. but it is bad news for america. juan: reverend, could you talk about the alliance defending freedom that backed this suit? what do we know about it and how is it able to get this case all the way to the supreme court? >> well, this is essentially a group that works with christians using christianity as a bludgeon to discriminate. they use religious freedom in a way that was never intended. they have had other cases that they have brought and they have been successful. we are in a moment where they

saw the supreme court opportunity and they took it all the way up. unfortunately, there was very little the dissenting justices could do. pointing out the obvious, we are now in a moment -- justice sonia sotomayor who said "today the court for the first time in history granted the business open to the public a constitutional right to refuse to serve members of a protected class." that is what this law group has done and that is what the supreme court went on with. amy: reverend paul brandeis raushenbush, you are a gay baptist minister. talk about the religious community's response and also you supported the passage of the respect for marriage act. how does this decision affect that? >> i think this shows why the respect for marriage act was so important, is that it codifies the ability for families like my

own to be protected against discrimination and that our marriages are not to be dissolved. by the way, the respect for marriage act protects also interracial marriages -- which this photographer, with her fake case, could also say "i don't to photograph interracial marriages." for me, this hits me on a lot of levels. one, it hits me as a gay man with a husband and two children who, of course, this is now opens but the possibility we could go into any establishment and they can say, "we don't want to do your portrait." who knows to what extent people will be able to discriminate against my family. but it is also really bad for religion. i have to say that because people might think, oh, this is a victory for freedom of religion.

actually, i will put on my pastor had here. one of the main reasons that people are leaving the church, especially young people, they cite the antagonism that they perceive the church has against lgbtq people. this is just going to make more and more people say, who wants dad anything to do with religion or christianity? for me, that is terrible. it is the terrible understanding of what christianity is and who jesus was. it is also -- it does not reflect the fact the majority of religious people in america support antidiscrimination laws for lgbtq. this is not just the american people at large but also the majority of almost every religious community rejects the idea there should be discrimination against lgbtq people in just such waves the court has decided.

so basically, the court as representing a very small and diminishing part of the public in this decision. it is just bad for religion, bad for freedom, and bad for america -- bad for the fabric of america step it disintegrates the fabric of america. juan: what should faith groups that are opposed to this decision, what recourse -- what next steps would you recommend? >> we need to be rallying all over the country and we need to be standing up and be very loud to insist that religion should be a cause for liberation, not subjugation, a bridge, not a bludgeon. we have to say just because this law is the law does not mean it is moral. we had to stand up and say, if you're doing this, you are not representing a good religion, or representing bad religion. it is very important everyone stand up and be very clear about

where they stand on this law. amy: reverend paul brandeis raushenbush, thank you for being with us, joining us from massachusetts, president and ceo of interfaith alliance. that does it for our show. [captioning made possible by democracy now!]

(sophie fouron) we're in the middle of the channel. but is it the uk, or is it france? actually, france is just a stone's throw away. you see it on clear days. you think you might be in france when you just look at the signs on the british channel islands. they're british, but they're not english. it's an important difference. they're known all over the world for being a tax haven. and it's one of those islands, very rare, that in the summertime, you see more people in suits than in shorts.