mohammed: iranian president ebrahim raisi is on an african tour, hoping to forge new alliances. as iran's academic struggles -- as iran's economy struggles under western sanctions, what can africa offer? and does iran have any influence on the continent? this is "inside story." ♪ hello and welcome to the program. i'm mohammed jamjoom. some have called it a new beginning for relations between iran and african nations.

the iranian president is visiting the continent to increase trade and economic ties, with stops in kenya, uganda, and zimbabwe. it is a different approach for a country that for years has focused mostly within the middle east and parts of asia. but faced with u.s. sanctions, it appears tehran is now increasingly looking elsewhere to diversify its economy. but are there other factors at play? we will get to our guests in the moment, but first, this report. reporter: a warm welcome for iran's president and congress capital. it's a rare tour for ibrahim raisi, marking the first visit to africa by an iranian president in more than a decade. ♪ u.s. sanctions have isolated tehran for years, and trade deals in africa could lead to new business opportunities and new alliances. >> none of us are satisfied with the current volume of trade and the ongoing economic exchange

between iran and kenya. reporter: iran exported more than a billion dollars worth of goods to nations in africa last year, from petrochemical products to food and medicine. now it is aiming for more. iran stepped up its diplomatic approach after the u.s. reimposed sanctions in 2018. when former president donald trump ditched a nuclear pact. now, iran's foreign policy appears to be shifting again. after restoring diplomatic ties with saudi arabia in march, it seems to be expanding its economic and political reach beyond the region. some analysts say less tension with neighbors is leading to more attention abroad. raisi visited venezuela, cuba and nicaragua last month to increase trade and economic ties in latin america. >> displayed imperial

aggressions and sanctions imposed by the u.s., venezuela is still standing. it is extending its hand to iran old and new world. reporter: iran has described africa as a continent of opportunities. tehran is now hoping r aisi's visit will lead to new prospects. ♪ mohammed: all right, let's go ahead and bring in our guests. in nairobi, ngala chome, senior analyst at sahan research, a think-tank focusing on security and development in the horn of africa. in tehran, ali akbar dareini, researcher at the center for strategic studies. in miami eric lob, associate , professor at florida international university and number of the trustees of the american institute of iranian studies. a warm welcome to you all and thanks so much for joining us today on "inside story." ali, let me start with you today. tehran has called this three-country tour of africa a new beginning in relations with

the continent. what kind of new relationship, new beginning is president expecting, and what did he open to achieve with this trip? guest: president raisi's visit to africa is in line with his administration's efforts to create new alliances with the non western world in the current era of transition in international relations from the unipolar world to a multipolar system. it is also in line with his look to the east policy, of expanding economic and political relations with the non-western world. iran is looking for closer relations with africa, to diversify its economy, and defeat sanctions. one way of defacing the sanctions is to increase iran's international presence, improve

cooperation with the love western world -- with the non-western world. this can help iran get out of isolation, and defeat the sanctions. the western nations -- the raisi administration looks at africa as a continent of opportunities that had been largely ignored by the previous rouhani administration. the previous rouhani administration's top priority was to get the sanctions lifted. and his team was influenced by the now liberalism school of thought that assault to solve iran's problems through negotiations -- that are to solve iran's problems negotiations with the west. but it proved to be a disaster -- sanctions were not lifted by the united states. but the raisi administration has adopted a new strategy of trying to thwart and nullify the

sanctions, while keeping the path of diplomacy open, in case there is a way to revive the j.c.p.o.a.. mohammed: sorry to interrupt you, i do want to get back to you in the moment and ask you more about the issue of the sanctions and the j.c.p.o.a. but first i want to go to eric. i saw him reacting to what you had to say. i also want to ask you, iran's president visiting the continent to boost ties with kenya, uganda and zimbabwe, from your vantage point, how different is this approach for a country that has for years, focused mostly on opportunities within the region? guest: we actually do see some continuity here. we should note that president racy is visiting -- president raisi is visiting kenya, and even predating the revolution, kenya has been the second largest trade partner for

prerevolutionary iran and the islamic republic, after south africa. this relationship really is formulated in kenyan exports primarily of tea to iran in exchange for oil, carpets and chemicals. so there is a lot of continuity in terms of the trade relationship between iran and kenya. even with zimbabwe and uganda. less with trade. they are much smaller trade partners than kenya, but iran in the past has engaged in economic activities there, notably in both zimbabwe and uganda. it has set up automobile and tractor factories to boost its production there. as well as worked with uganda on its fisheries and other sectors of agriculture, livestock, and industries. so there is actually a lot of continuity on the economic side to this visit. mohammed: ngala, you heard ali

talk about the fact that the iranian economy has been struggling under western sections. what can africa for a run at this stage? guest: i agree with ali that there is some continuity. but there are also some nuances and contexts to be paid attention to. one is iran's only sense of isolation. it is still facing u.s. sunshine, but also looking to repair relations with african countries such as egypt and morocco and closer to home in the horn of africa, seeking to play a larger role in a region where other gulf sort of middle eastern countries have come to play a larger role in development projects, but also in areas such as security and defense cooperation. in the discussion the president of iran had today with the

president of kenya, a lot of it seemed to have centered on the traditional areas of trade investments. less spoken about was the issue of security, which has also seen other governments, middle eastern countries such as qatar, the uae more recently, coming to play a role in all of africa. can you be one of the frontline states in somalia's war against al-shabaab. it would have been very interesting if that particular issue is not discussed during today's meeting. we suspect this is also part of the conversation, even though it was not public. mohammed: ali, we were speaking about the impact western sanctions were heavy on iran, and also talking about the fact that former u.s. president donald trump pulled out of the

j.c.p.o.a. the fact that iran has stepped up diplomatic outreach in the last several months, how much of that does it speak to how big of a problem the sanctions have been, and how much concern there was about the fact that the u.s. full data the nuclear deal -- foldout of the nuclear deal? guest: sanctions have been hurting iran for a long time. the administration's top priority is to defeat the sanctions, and one we have that is improving relations with the non-western world. the tour of africa represents a major strategic shift in iran's foreign policy and this shift has been caused by two key global developments. one was the u.s. withdrawal from the j.c.p.o.a. and their imposition of sanctions. the other is a shift in a world

power. there has been a major shift in the global balance of power. the unipolar system has gone away. and the united states can no longer dictate its policies on the entire planet anymore. so this creates more room for developing states and more room to breathe and more options. president raraisi's tour of africa is a major change, because iran, at the same time, has adopted a new strategic direction to complement the african economy to improve business for the benefit of the two sides, and at the same time, show to the international community that iran has other alternatives, even if the sanctions are not lifted. mohammed: eric, you heard ali there talk about the fact that

what president raisi is doing now is a break with what former iranian president have done when it comes to foreign policies. how does what he is doing now compare or contrast to what former president hassan rouhani did when it came to foreign policy? guest: i would agree that it is a major contrast. i had published an article with a colleague at the university of tehran, where we detailed president rouhani, as was said earlier, his disengagement from africa and focus on particular ly leading up to the negotiations further j.c.p.o.a. or the iran nuclear deal in 2017, it really focused on the west, and on trying to alleviate sanctions through that process. the disengagement also culminated with disengagement on the african side as well, where arab gulf states, namely saudi arabia and the united arab arab emirates went on a diplomatic offensive, offering assistance,

particularly to the states of the horn of africa which is a very strategic location on the red sea, during that year many civil war, and convince them to cut ties with iran in 2016. so this is an important shift for the raisi administration and for iran, in terms of trying to build relationships on the continent. mohammed: ngala, how much influence does tehran have accredited the continent at this particular moment? guest: one often missed area i feel, when it comes to the relationship between tehran and african countries like kenya, where i am, is the cultural sphere. we all know that islam is practiced in africa, mostly sunni in east africa.

but in recent years, especially since the 1980's, there has been an increase in shia islamic schools of thought but have been sort of sponsored by charities, muslim charities. there is not quite a figure that i could put, but there has been an increase in shia schools in kenya in recent years. one area where one may argue that iran has not been playing a larger role, is in the creation of the availability of employment opportunities, where many young africans have found opportunities for work in god states -- in qatar, in the uae, and in saudi arabia -- in gulf

states. but iran, the name of iran seems to be missing in this growing economic relationship between africa and the middle east. i think this could be one area that could form part of the discussions that raisi is going to have with a number of african presidents. mohammed: ali, it looks to me like you were reacting to some of what ngala was saying there. would you like to jump in? guest: i disagree with part of what he said. under the raisi administration, iran's new strategic direction is largely aimed at economic and strategic cooperation with with african states. while iran is an islamic republic right now, i don't see

ideology playing a much bigger role in this now. the priority is economic, technological, and trade cooperation with african states. iran is exporting just $1.2 billion to africa. this demonstrates the depth of iran neglecting this continent of opportunities. iran's foreign trade had been taken hostage by the j.c.p.o.a.. the previous rouhani administration entirely neglected africa. now under this new strategic direction, iran is reviving its policy of boosting relations with africa. and the two sides have a lot to offer. africa is a good market for iran's knowledge-based companies , engineering services, dam

building projects, transportation, fishing and car production exports, agricultural experts. so there is a lot that iran can offer, and at the same time, import part of its needs from africa. that had been neglected under the rouhani administration. under the raisi administration, iran is trying to rectify that, and at the same time, defeat the sanctions. mohammed: eric, i can see that you want to add to some of what ali was saying. but first, ali was responding to some of the points he made earlier, so i just wanted to see if you wanted to add to that, ngala. guest: i would agree with ali. a lot of the focus has been on building diplomatic relationships and especially around trade and investment. it is very promising, these

newly look for partnerships. it does make sense, because raisi was elected on a platform of fixing the economy at home. president william ruto was also selected on a similar platform, but they have both faced information. the currency of kenya has depleted in terms of value, similar to the iranian currency. so it makes sense that both of them would come around this economic issue. but i am basically saying is that, one area that is often overlooked and where iran might have longer historical influence is in the cultural sphere. if you look at how the chinese,, build their relationships across the continent, as they built their relationships through economic partnerships, also are channeling cultural items, such

as the learning of the chinese language, setting up of chinese schools has been part of the diplomacy. i think iran could continue emphasizing this software, cultural relationship as well. mohammed: eric, you have been waiting patiently to add your comments to what is being said. we go ahead. guest: i would certainly agree that economics and trade and commerce are certainly at the forefront of this initiative, and given that africa represents 2% to 3% of iran's global trade, there is a lot of potential in that relationship. on the flipside, there is also the geopolitical component of this, where these countries could be nonpermanent members of the un security council, and of course they sit in the un's general assembly, on the iaea board of governors, and they can

potentially influence votes for iran. not to mention the fact that both zimbabwe and uganda have uranium deposits. so there is some value there in terms of the cultural, ideological realm, i would say that iran is going to be pushing on two levers. given that again, this is a christian and sunni-majority continent, they will be pushing on the anti-colonialism card, which it often does when it visits these countries to try to galvanize elites and citizens during these visits. secondly, it will also seek to make inroads in in the small shia communities of these countries, particularly in kenya and uganda. mohammed: eric, i want to ask you particularly about one of the countries that have come up in this discussion, that is saudi arabia and the role that the reestablishment of diplomatic ties that iran has now had with saudi arabia is playing in all of this. the fact that the diplomatic ties between both countries were restored in march, is that one of the reasons why we are now

seeing iran seeming to expand its economic and political reach beyond just the immediate region? guest: i'm glad you brought that up because i was thinking about that very point. not only is there a rapprochement or detente between iran and saudi arabia, but there's also a ceasefire in the works in yemen, which was one of the reasons why the continent became so geopolitically or strategically important and tense between the competition between iran and saudi arabia. so, given these developments, it may actually give african countries geopolitical current capital to reengage iran, and to feel that they don't necessarily have to choose sides between iran and arab gulf states like saudi arabia and the uae. mohammed: the fact that diplomatic ties have been reestablished between iran and saudi arabia, how much has that allowed iran to be able to go

beyond its traditional foreign policy goals? guest: a lot. the raisi administration's policy of "look to the east" is primarily designed to boost iran's overall deterrence capability against the west. and africa is playing an important role. to achieve that, iran needs to expand its international presence, de-escalate tensions with regional states, and pave the way for better relations with the non-western world. and that is happening right now. the mediation by china, iran's improving relations with brics, and iran's membership in the shanghai cooperation council, all speak of iran's new strategic direction. the raisi administration has

been pursuing the resistance discourse in its foreign policy. that means trying to defend iran's national interests, and giving concessions in return for concessions. not providing concessions without obtaining concessions. at the same time, the raisi administration has been saying all along that the world is not limited to the west. this is a reference to the previous rouhani administration's policy that its foreign policy was largely confined to negotiations with the west. the raisi administration wants to create a balance in iran's relations with the outside world and one way of doing that is to improve relations with asian,

eurasian, latin american, and african states. this is what we are witnessing right now. mohammed: mm, ngala, i want to ask you more specifically about kenya. when it comes to kenya's foreign policy, how is this visit being perceived by members of the government, by members of the opposition and by the citizens? guest: canyons foreign policy has historically had a very strong economic impulse. from the time of the -- movement, to the post-1990 world. therefore, a lot of what has happened today -- it was widely expected that a lot of the discussion with center around opportunities for trade and investment. the kellianne president adult there would be a car model that would be manufactured in kenya from iran. a lot of the discussions were centered around economic, trade

relations, investments, and information technology as well. but like i have said earlier, kenya is also one of the frontline states in the ongoing war against somalia's al-shabab. other middle eastern countries have also come to play a huge role in addition to the tradition of western countries playing a role in that sphere. in this case, i am referring to the united arab emirates and turkiye. therefore, for me, in my view, i think iran may be seeking as well to play a role in security-defense partnerships as well. mohammed: sorry to interrupt

you, but we are starting to run out of time. i want to ask one final question to eric, eric, i saw you nodding your head to some of what ngala, was saying. this attempt by president raisi to reset relations with african officials, do you think it will be successful? guest: it could be successful. like i said earlier, i think one of the pathways could be this dialing down of golf tensions within the continent and giving some breathing room to these countries to reengage iran. i think there is some flexibility and potential to work with them. at the same time, i wouldn't necessarily be overly optimistic in terms of what africa could do for iran and vice versa, given the limitations that sites have. for that reason, despite raisi's stated he stored policy, we are seeing iranians in a more subtle

level, reengage in the united states and working out a formal agreement to try to bring sanctions relief in exchange for nuclear limitations. mohammed: we have run out of time. we will have to leave the conversation. thanks to all of our guests ngala chome, ali akbar dareini, , and eric lob. and thank you too for watching. you can see the program again, anytime, by visiting our website, aljazeera.com. and for further discussion, go to our facebook page. that is facebook.com/ajinsidestory. you can also join the conversation on twitter. our handle is @ajinsidestory. from me, mohammed jamjoom, and the whole team here, bye for now. ♪

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