tonight, fear on the street. the dow's big fall. what caused it and what's next? speaker boehner bragged about getting 98% of what he wanted in the debt deal. is today's drop a wake-up call for republicans to cut their obstruction? plus, 74,000 faa employees and construction workers are going back to work. but, the attack on unions is far from over. welcome to the show. i'm al sharpton. tonight's lead, the stock market's down. will it wake us up? today, the dow plunged more than 500 points. its biggest decline since october 2008. the sell off was the ninth biggest point loss ever. in the past ten days alone, the market is down more than 10%. the question is, will this be the game changer that finally

forces republicans in washington to focus on jobs and the economy? will they realize it is time to talk about creating jobs, not cutting the deficit? here to talk about it all, is democratic congressman chris van holden, former chief economist to vice president biden, jarod bernstein and maria botamona. maria, let me start with you. clearly it looks like investors are worried about the state of the economy. what's at work here? >> i think what happened today was a culmination of events coming together. for starters, europe is a mess. we have a debt situation spiralling there. and that has impacted the banking sector in europe. then the focus in the united states continues to be on jobs and we continue to see weak data. manufacturing data recently. retail sales are weak. the housing market is stuck in a slump in one area that hasn't

participated in the economic recovery at all. of course tomorrow we have an unemployment report coming out for the month of july. so basically investors sold first and thought later. because they recognize -- >> what bothers me about this maria is it looks like the companies are doing fine. they are sitting on a lot of money. major companies sitting on more than $2 trillion in cash. so what is really causing this draught? >> basically what is happening right now, companies are unwilling to spend that money, you're right. the corporate sector had an extremely strong -- >> the strongest we have seen in decades, we are dealing with unemployment. we are dealing with the republicans talking about taking way programs that will secure the the middle class and poor and you are telling me the companies are sitting on record dollars. >> absolutely. but the problem is they don't

know what is around the corner because they are upset and nervous about policies coming out of washington. they feel that given the fact they don't know what businesses will look like in six months, the rules are still being written because of dodd-frank. as we speak, they don't know what regulatory environment will look like. they know the u.s. is growing by an anemic place. they would rather grow in places like china, brazil, india w, southeast asia. they are not spending it in the u.s. because they don know what business climbate will look like because of uncertainty around policy and around demand. the demand just is not there for the economy. they are not going to hire people if they don't think the business will be there. >> well, thank you, maria bontiromo. thank you for breaking it down for us. i don't know if i feel better, but i'm better informed on why i don't feel well. now let's turn to maryland congressman chris van holden wp ranking member of the budget committee and jared bernstein,

former chief economist to vice president biden. congressman, maria just said companies are sitting on over $2 trillion and because of uncertainty, we are faced with this crisis. where ask the uncertainty come from? let's be honest. what is causing this uncertainty? >> well, reverend, the primary uncertainty right now is businesses don't know what consumers are are going to do because consumers are obviously deleveraging. they are sort of hording their money. they are worried. if you're a business, you obviously need consumers which is why we need to continue to look for ways to spur consumer demand. we have just wasted the last two months talking about the debt ceiling. talking about threatening the economy. if our republican colleagues didn't get their way. we should be looking for ways to encourage greater consumer confidence and consumer spend sngz congressman, i think maybe

you missed your colleagues. don't you understand that some of your colleagues in the tea party caucus and some of your colleagues there in the congress feel the way to inspire consumers is to cut the safety net, not generate jobs, threaten social security and throw in threatening mad med cade or medicare. that certainly makes people go out and shop and buy things. >> reverend were you're right. if there was uncertainty generated the last two months, it is exactly what you're talking about. instead of focusing on policies we can take now to try and spur greater demand. for example, the republican transportation plan that they've got under the house of representatives would cut, cut our transportation investment by 33% compared to last year. that's less money going to roads, bridges, and that means less jobs and that means less consumer demand. we need to do things that will encourage consumer demand.

the focus on the near term is actually the opposite course that we should take. we need a long term plan to reduce the deficit. but in the short term it is counter productive to make the these deep cuts. >> well, it is counter productive to say the least. jared, let me ask you something. paul krugman said that market indicators show that quote, this is his statement, washington's deficit obsession has been utterly, totally wrong-headed. would you agree that obsession with def deficit is a major driver of uncertainty? >> i think so. the fact is that there are probably a lot of people out there who thought that once we had this debt deal in place that that would actually help provide marks with the some he is notty, you know the debt deal is behind us. in fact i think what what happens was that investors woke up, rubbed their aeyes, looked around and said, this economy isn't going anywhere.

maria earlier said that people are worried about the policies coming out of washington. actually i think people are really worried about the policies not coming out of washington. we this economy and every single report, everyday, including the market tanking today is really saying one thing. it is saying we need a fiscal boost. monetary policy won't get it. we know companies are sitting on trillions in cash. we know interest rates are low. what we need is a fiscal boost to help create a bridge in the private secretarier to get off the mat. that's what the economics are saying. the politics of saying exactly the opposite and it is just another one of the self inflicted dysfunctional moments. >> we talk about companies sitting on trillions of dollars being uncertain. look at this poll about the american people feel about congress. congress has a 14% approval rating. when you have the congress of

the united states with barely one and a half out of every ten americans have approval rating that's positive, this is a real, real message to congress. >> just to be clear reverend, just to be clear, i think when they asked that poll, i think they said except for representative chris van holland. >> i thought he was 6 and 14 that got a positive approval. >> he may have been that one too. >> i think that, you know, i hate to be the guy that always brings up the people that nobody will talk for. no, i don't. i am wanting to be that guy. if you think people are uncertain with trillions of dollars, imagine someone sitting around for two years and they are 99 and can't get unemployment insurance. i will show you people that are uncertain. >> let me say one thing and then well get back to the representative. you hear all that stuff about -- look, if uncertainty is hurting anybody, it certainly isn't hurting the corporate secretarior.

uncertainty has been very good for them. what is uncertain is where is the demand coming from and we could do something about that if we had the political will. >> well, congressman, will this be a wake-up call to the republicans? i mean, will this show them that all that they have done in the last few weeks with the emphasis on deficit spending, emphasis on debt relief, they have now caused the markets to tremble. they have caused these corporate elites that they are protecting, to be uncertain. and driving the economy into the gutter? >> reverend, i wish i could say yes but i don't even think this knock on head is going to knock sanity into a lot of our republican colleagues here. they are hell bent on this ideological agenda that says cut, cut, cut is a good thing. even when you talk about cutting transportation and every american knows who help put people back to work and deal with the consumer demand issue that jared is talking about. we should do some of the things

the president proposed. for example, letting people know we will extend the payroll tax holiday. it is not my preferred approach but given the circumstance, we need to try to put more money in consumers pockets so they have more confidence at the time when this economy is weak. look, the reality is that the republican colleagues are focused on a course of action that is exactly the opposite of what we should be doing. they are putting the brakes on the economy everyday. we have limited tools but we should use our limited tools well and they are just doing the opposite. >> well, you know, i mean, jared, clearly, one of the things i think people need to understand down here in the beltway, is one of the ways, the only way you can be a consumer is you have to have money in your pocket to consume. otherwise you're just broke. i don't know how we are looking for consumers when we have no money to consume things with. >> look, consumption, consumer spending is 70%. this economy. you know, if consumers are stuck

in the mud, then so is the over all economy. if we were in europe, it would be a different story. over there it is 55% of the economy. clearly consumption is a big part of the economy. i agree of course with the representative that i'm not sure what piece of evidence could change the thinking around here. but i wonder if people like him, could get together with moderate republicans say, you know what, we've got to do something for this country. we are elected to govern, come down here and help at precisely a time like this and put extremists off to the side and maybe get something going here. >> well, congressman, how do we do that? i think that we are already mobile ooirzing and people are rallying, marchs are coming. sometimes if you can't get people to come downstairs to the restaurant in the hotel, you have to bring them room service. >> clearly this is a wake-up call. as jared said, there was an assumption that if we got the debt ceiling behind us, things

would stabilize and the mark woet show positive signs. the opposite happened. it is not because we acted. it is because the underlying forces under the economy that had nothing to do with the debt ceiling. what they today do with is the weakness in the connie con my and lack of consumer confidence and consumer demand. we've got to come together and hopefully this will be a wake-up call it take policies. one small example would be to say with respect to transportation funding, let's not cut it by 33%. we need to do the opposite. we need to get more funds out there to state and local governments. get people back to work. that will boost confidence and that will obviously create more consumer demand. but one of the things we've seen consistently in the job reports, is public employees being fired and laid off. whether they are teachers, firefighters, that's a direct consequence sf less foed ral support flowing to our local

communities. again, that's the consequence of this wrong-headed approach that our colleagues have been pursuing which is let's just cut, cut, cut, and that will be the miracle cure. in fact it is the opposite. >> they are cutting the confidence of people at the top and bottom of this country. congressman chris van holland and jared bernstein, thanks you both for your time. let me say this, the preacher in me requires i make this statement. that is, you know, it is said that, that that a man sows, that shall he also reap. it is interesting to me that many on the right quote the bible but do they understand it? you cannot sow unemployment, a no jobs bill, no way for people to make money, and think you are going to reap a rebound in the economy. you have sown p and now we are all reaping what you have sown. we need to sow seeds in the

american people. and provide jobs and income. then they will be consumers and it'll return the confidence of everybody. but people cannot have what you did not put there for them to be able to use consume and build. that a little advice to my friends on the right. ahead, 2011 days since the gavel and not one job bill. whose gavel? speaker boehner's gavel. it's time to get serious. plus, eric cantor makes a shocking admission. oi of your mone rtual wallet. it comes with a calendar

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i just want to tell you as we head into the close, we are down 514 points. the low since december 1, 2003 is the last time we were down more than 400 points. >> a worldwide panic sent markets plunging today. soeting off political shock waves across washington and across the country. will this be the shock therapy needed to jolt washington out of political dysfunction and pave the way for real action on jobs? with me now is melissa harris perry. she is a professor of political

science and columnist for the nation. also with me is peter goodman, chief business editor for the huffing torn post. he is also author of past due, easy money and renewal of the american economy. thank you both for joining me. >> thank you. >> let me start with you, melissa. we hear the mantra we have been hearing from house speaker john boehner for months now. his soundbite. washington has a spending problem. spending problem. spending problem. spending. you would think he is still saying that tomorrow given what we've seen happen today with the mark snets. >> well, speaker boehner is right, washington does have a spending problem. it was not spending enough. and it was not spending enough in the right places. i think one way it think about this is the fact for example that congress is in recess right new. they are in recess at the same time that faa workers are being laid off. i had someone send me an e-mail like at the best e-mail from

msnbc viewers. i had send me an e-mail saying, would it be okay if politicians would just give back their salaries? at this point it seems they are not doing their job. i think that's more than just a call around frustration. i think we have to recognize that really we send elected representatives to the u.s. congress for one thing really. to levy taxes. and then to spend those taxes for the common good. that is literally the purpose of the u.s. house of representatives, is to levy taxes and to take all of what we pay into individually and then to spend it for the common good. the notion that doing that is a problem in and of itself i think belies how fully this -- at least portion of the congress, is willing to rewrite the basis we are founded as a nation. >> it is almost like they are insulted when you raise the idea.

and the facts seem it really bear out what we are talking. let's take for example, peter, look at this graph. when you had bill clinton as the president, and the top wage earners i think was a little over 39%, look at the amount of jobs that were created. and when you had george bush with the lower tax rate, there's my graph, 23.1 million jobs created mr. president clinton with 39.6 higher earner tax rate. only 3 million jobs created under mr. bush with a 35% higher earner tax rate. so i mean, we can have different opinions, peter, but facts don't lie. >> unfortunately, fact -- >> we have not created jobs with tax cuts. >> no question. the problem, reverend, is that facts are not part of our political process right now.

we' we've got a situation where the republican party is composed of two pieces. you have the centrists who can be reasoned with but they decide their interest lies in sabotaging the economy, sticking president obama and democrats with the blame. and democrats do get some of the blame because when they were running the show they didn't fight hard enough. >> i agree with that. >> then you have those who just try to hijack us and push us over a cliff. who have essentially decided what they want to be able to tell the public in november is they shrunk the government. they effectively dismantled the government, dismantled the safety net and go back it a quaint sort of saturday evening post conception after tiny little government that leaves you alone while you live at your small business or farm and never mind the fact that that doesn't comport with reality. there is nobody waking up in washington in the morning saying, how are we seriously going to create jobs? at least nobody in a position to do that.

>> now, what are we going to do about where we go from here? how do we deal with this and i want to read to you, peter, an excerpt from a recent article you wrote. and i'm quoting you to you. professional econ mitts have proven to be out of touch with the extent of the wounds left by the recession. economists are particularly missing in action on the full blown epidemic of joblessness and loss wealth that afflicts minority communities. that's quite quite a statement. something i would love to have said i said it and melissa probably did say it. >> melissa has definitely said that. i have heard her say that. >> tell me about the gravity of that statement. >> i think we have been under the situation where a lot of economists who buy in the idea where they sit in a room far removed from the rest of the world and just look at data sold themselves on the idea that consumer spending, which is

jared bernstein pointed out is 70% of american economic activity, can be driven if handful of people have plan to spend. they have ignored the fact that economics is as much psychology and art as it is hard science. they haven't gotten out into the world to discover what anybody going into the field discover res. what essentially has happen said that for a quarter century or so we have a series of fantasies. we had the tech bubble in 90s. housing bubble the next decade and workers an consumers were somehow separate groups of people. >> but peter, i don't think congress understood that. melissa, martin luther king, jr. said many years ago, the paralysis of analysis and i think that's what has been part of the problem with a lot of our economists. they are so busy analyzing that they are not understanding people are hurting and it is not hitting the ground, melissa. >> i want to be a little bit careful about beating up on the

academic after all. >> i'm not nearly as careful as you are. >> i was just going to say, the reason we have these jobs is in part because we want to think about data long-term trend and in a certain way you actually don't want all of your economics work to be applied. you want some of it to be this pure thing and some people to do apply. let me take it away from the economics for just one second and good to the politics. the tea party members did not end up there by some kind of being down from a an alien planet. they were vote need office. i think one of the things we have to do is pause and take a breath and recognize that we off then get the government that we ask for. that we deserve and that we were listening or failing to listen to, when we in fact elected the thes these folks. i'm glad you brought up dr. king. there is a group of politicians making a choice to destroy

government rather than let it do the work it needed to do. that is both in the context of reconstruction and in jim crow. what that was was literally a willingness to go in and take out public infrastructure. i tell my student, think about the fact that that montgomery bus boycott was about riding bus is around in small towns, relatively small towns in alabama. go to those towns in alabama now and look at the public infrastructure in terms of public transportation. they are horrible compared to big cities like philadelphia or new york or d.c. one of the reasons is, once we got to a point where we today share with everybody in those southern cities, we were willing to just get rid of the public transportation or the quality of it all together. they gutted the public school system, stopped putting infrastructure in new public schools once they were integrated. what i see is a similar impulse that now that we are moving to a country that is majority minority to a country where more women have a voice, to a country

where gays and lesbians have an opportunity to participate as fullcy sit zens, there is a group willing to go ahead and set the ship on fire rather than let us all sail together. >> i think the problem with that is that they also, like those that you have talked about in the past, have no problem with the people that they want to put at the bottom of that ship are the people that they want to also pay for everything. they have no problem with our paying into social security. just thatter with changing when we get down the road. they have no problem with our being the ones that have to be the taxpayers and the workers. but we are going to give the breaks to the people on the top. >> and our ksh- >> people had it to pay the same fare, they couldn't sit in the same place. melissa be by got to go. thank you melissa. they jumped up the epidemic of voter fraud. we will uncover the truth.

and rick scott turns down cash that would create jobs and help the sick. but his republican cronies take money that fits their far right ideology. it is our con job of the day. [ male announcer ] this is coach parker...

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rick scott and republicans proudly turned down federal funds except for programs that fit their right wing ideology.

that's our con job of the day. florida governor rick scott and his republican lawmakers have turned down millions from president obama's affordable care act to show the opposition to the law. they rejected money for health centers. child abuse prevention programs. home healthcare. teen pregnancy prevention. and hospice programs. they refused all that money even though florida has the nation's second highest rate of uninsured. and scott didn't just pass up healthcare money. he also turned down nearly $2.5 billion for high speed rail project. that project could have helped restore some of the nine -- some of 9,000 construction jobs lost in the state this year alone. but now, florida republicans have made an exception to their just say no rule. the florida independent reports the state accepted $2.5 million from affordable care act for

abstinence only sex education programs. so government scott and his cronies turn down millions that could help the sick and poor but take cash for something that fits their ideology. the hi pock hypocrisy is staggering and our con job of the day. see if we can "stitch" together a better deal. that's a hint, antoine. ooh! see what anandra did? booking your flight and hotel at the same time gets you prices hotels and airlines won't let expedia show separately. book it. major wow factor! where you book matters. expedia. a network of possibilities. in here, the planned combination of at&t and t-mobile would deliver our next generation mobile broadband experience to 55 million more americans, many in small towns and rural communities,

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6 years ago tomorrow, congress passed the voting rights act to protect the basic democratic rights of every american. but now those rights are under assault. we've seen seven states with republican legislators and governors pass strict voter id laws, laws that seem to suppress the vote of the elderly, poor and minority voters. in other words, people bo who tend to vote for democrats. >> there has never been, in my lifetime, since we got rid of the poll tax and all the other

gym crow burdens on voting, the determined effort to limit the tran chiez franchise that we see today. >> now have the republicans that want to drag us all the way back to jim crow laws and block access to the polls to voters who are more likely to vote for democratic candidates than republican candidates. that is nothing short of that blatant. >> i myself, in my travels, have wansed and talked to people that have the real problem of how voter id has been an impet meant for them to just exercise their basic right to vote. but now the conservative editorial page of the wall street journal is weighing in. accusing president clinton of quote, doing jim crow and claiming democrats are playing the race card on this issue. the journal also claims voter fraud is a serious widespread

problem. but in the few states that track this, cases of frauds are tiny. less than a thousand of 1% of all voters. voter suppression is not a bogus issue. joining me now is alex wagner and jonathan capehart. alex, are these voter id law ace false solution to a problem that really doesn't exist? >> they are absolutely a false solution, rev. there are 20 million americans that do not have driver licenses in the u.s. of that 20 million a disproportionate share are minority, poor, elderly. this hits them in a way that disenfranchises a whole section. the thing never mentioned in this, indian is one of the states with more stringent voter id laws. as part of their case for voter

id law, tle cited 250 cases of voter fraud. further examination of those 250 cases shows not one of them would have been prevented bay photo id provision. so the notion that this is -- >> this graph, you talk about how it is an impet meant on people, you have 11% of americans don't have voter id. 18% of elderly, 25% of african-americans, 15% of the poor. this is the brennan center for justice, jonathan, that documented the percentages of people that don't have voter id. these people would be taken out of the voter roles. and not have the ability to exercise a basic freedom that was fought for in this country. >> right. the franchise as president clinton called it in the clip that you showed, you know, the wall street journal in that editorial, they talk about massive voter fraud. but there are no numbers to back

it up. now, if you know, one person tries to get over on the voting system on election day, that's one thing. but if there is massive voter fraud in all 6 these states, clearly you would expect there would be you know, numbers upon numbers of cases being filed. and in the cases that they do talk about it, they don't talk about the resolution of any of those cases. >> let me give you some numbers. jonathan, clearly i don't usually try to disagre you, but i have a number for you. look at kansas. we have a number in kansas of the amount of voter fraud that's been brought forward. 221 reports of fraud, 10 million votes cast. >> that gets -- rev, that gets to the point i'm trying to make pz. >> that's 0.00002%. >> that's the point i'm trying it make. you are showing 221 reports of fraud. but what that number doesn't tell me is how many of those

reports of fraud were proven to be true. >> 0.0002. that's how many. >> right. so go ahead, alex. go alead. >> i was saying, when we talk about voter fraud, the likelihood that someone is going to the poll and try to impersonate someone else is almost negligible. we are talking about voter fraud, it tends to be absentee ballot manipulation and multiple voting. people trying to register who aren't -- >> there is strategy, as i said in my opening of the segment, voter suppression. look at what fox news does the day after an election. they get on and they start screaming this, if you keep screaming something enough, people start believing that it is a big problem. look at this montage of fox news and what they did after an election and start screaming voter fraud, voter fraud. and new demands for recounting, the morning after allegations of voter fraud became the litany

that they use. >> new demands for recount of allegations of voter fraud. >> expect the fraud. expect intimidation. >> new concerns today about voter fraud just aahead of the mid terms. >> i mean, there is -- this is where it comes. so you've got everybody yelling voter fraud, voter fraud. and i mean, it is like, me saying, it's raining, it's raining it's raining. people don't even look outside. they just come out with their umbrella. what is so humiliating, i think to those who believe in democracy under this country, aside from suppressing, look at voting percentage of americans and compare that to a countries around the world. we aught to be doing everything we can to encourage people to vote. rather than dealing with the fact that we are voting at a lower percentage than most countries that are democratic around the world. look at this graph. canada in their last election

now, 61%, 61.4 to be exact voted. france, 84%. germany, 70.8%. united kingdom. 65.8%. united states, only 41.6% of the people voted in the last election. we aught to be trying to get everybody out to the polls, not trying to find ways to keep them from voting. >> rev, you're right. and you know, there are motor voter laws. same-day voting laws in more progressive states. but clearly, since the day after the 2008 election, there's been a push by republicans to make it so that it's almost impossible -- not almost impossible, but to make it as difficult impossible for people to vote, people who primarily vote democratic or thought to vote democratic. and you know, it is all about looking at 2012. that's what i think that this is all about.

and part of the over all strategy of insuring that barack obama who won in 2008, doesn't win in 2012. >> to say that all of this is because they just want to get rid of president obama -- >> a democratic president. >> what are you doing jonathan? listening to mitch mcconnell? thank you very much. >> thanks, rev. >> coming up, eric cantor spoke and an amazing thing happened. the truth popped out. m mr. cantor is probably sorry but it but it is amazing. man 1: send, that is the weekend. app grapgic: yeah dawg! man 2: allow me to crack...the bubbly! man 1: don't mind if i doozy. man 3: is a gentleman with a brostache invited over to this party? man 1: only if he's ready to rock! ♪ sfx: guitar and trumpet jam vo: geico. 15 minutes could save you 15% or more on car insurance.

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welcome back to the show. we will talk about some of the big political stories of day. joining me now, political columnist, steve. political reporter from the washington post. and matt lewis, con strib outer for the daily call. first question, are republicans ultimate promise breakers. is they explicitly reneging on entitlement programs for elderly americans.

check out what eric can'tor told the wall street journal. >> get the fiscal house in order. come to grips that promises have been made that frankly won't be kept for many. promises are not going to be kept. generations of americans have banked on the fact that medicare and social security will get them through retirement. they will not admit they will default on that promise. >> that quote right there gets two big issues i think and one is it gets to problem republicans were having before the whole debt ceiling issue came to a head. that's when they were proposing the paul ryan overhaul of medicare that turned into a voucher program. you saw how poisonous and unpopular that was. it cost them a special election that they should have won. if that's the language they put forward is causes them problems. but the more immediate issue is how do democrats respond to that? what cantor laid out is what the

priorities will be for the republican members on this deficit reduction commission that will be meeting and making these important recommendations in the next few months. the question is who are the democrats going to put on that commission and they will add what republicans are saying about entitlements. that is not coming out of committee. >> not only will i agree, what will the democrats do to respond and who will they put on commission. but also how will the people respond? are they going to stand by and allow what they have invested and will promise and take way from them with no kind of voice raised and pressure put on those that are just outright saying, oh, we're not going to do what we promised. >> well, i think that special election in new york was a real lit nous test and a real test many to the power of seniors as a voting block. really powerful voting block. powerful lobby. i think you will see on dem krts on that committee really stand

up and really want to take medicare and medicaid and social security in these entitlement programs off the table. one of the problems i think for democrats is that you did have while president obama really talk about perhaps putting medicaid and medicare and social security on the table during these debt limit debates. he proposed putting you know, 650 billion in entitlement cuts on table. in some kays you almost he expect that republicans will say, well president obama said these things should be on the table. that's what we will look at. >> we will see at that point whether he is saying put it on the table it end it. i think as we have heard from his representatives on the show, that they are saying that those that need them could not be heard. let me ask you this, matt, the republicans didn't get the message from that new york race, that to even bother this, to even talk about bothering these

programs, could be an ultimate third rail in politics? >> well, i think that you're right in the sense that the third rail. there are political risks to this. i think republicans are in this case, doing the right thing. we have a huge debt, a huge deficit problem. and entitlements reform frankly needs to happen. >> you mean entitlement for the poor and entitlement for the seniors? you think rich people have entitlement to tax cuts? >> no, actually -- actually reverend al, i think one of the things i would do and i think that republicans have push said means testing. and we talk about these promises that were made. i think social security, you know, when social security was implemented the average, you know, life expectancy was 57 years old. now it is much, much older. and we need to adjust that. we need to raise -- >> oh, i'm glad -- so the

problem is that y'all are breaking promises and lying to grandma, you just live to long. you should have died at 57. >> let's talk about means testing which is part of the plan. this is something i hope we could agree on reverend al. if you're a millionaire, i don't think you should be getting checks from the federal government for social security or medicare. why can't we just come together and agree on that? that people who are millionaires shouldn't be getting social security. that's the type of entitlement reform we can agree on. but dem krts oppose that. >> you know what the problem with that is, steve? i may not even have a problem with what he is saying there, my problem is you don't want millionaires to get a check but you want them not to have to pay taxes at a rate that their secretaries pay. something strange about how you want millionaires to not get nothing here but get a bigger break there. any millionaire in the world would say keep your check, even

give me any tax cuts. that makes no sense. >> it actually does make sense. because if you raise the tax rate on millionaires, you create a disincentive for them to invest and start businesses. but if you say, look, if you're a millionaire and you're not going to get social security, even though you paid into the system, then i don't think that creates any disincentive for business. >> thank you steve. i got it. if we give you your check back, and then give you your tax break, you have an incentive to create businesses that will hire people abroad and not here. that's what you do with the incentive. that's why i'm saying, this is a bunch of double-talk and hog wash. it is when this man can sit there and look in the eye of the wall street journal board and say, promises made just can't be kept -- >> if we don't have entitlement -- if we don't

reform entitlement, they're not going to be there. >> thank you all for a great panel. and thank you all for coming in tonight. we'll be right back. i'm robert shapiro.

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happy birthday mr. president ♪ >> that was jennifer hudson helping the president celebrate his 50th birthday in chicago last night. in honor of your big day, mr. president, we have some special birthday wishes for you. first, we piwish the tea party would start drinking decaf. second, we wish you could return to your job as president and stop being a hostage negotiators. third, we wish sarah palin would enter the presidential race. immediately enter. please, sarah, run, sarah, run.

and fourth, we wish fox and friends a very great ramadan this year pch. and last but not least, mr. president, i've been watching your accessories lately, we wish newt gingrich would reopen his tiffany's account and splurge on something a little nice for you. you've earned it. you've worked hard. happy birthday mr. president. i think in the middle of it all, all-americans, no matter who the president is, say happy birthday and hope that you continue to fight, that all of our birthdays might be better. even those that happen to live past 57. thanks for watching. i'm al sharpton. "hardball" starts right now.