just before the quake the birds rushed about and grouped themselves together. they remained huddled during the quake. during the quake, all deer ran out of the barns and appeared agitated maidly after the quake. the female elves began alarm calling until they were found by their keeper and kept near the keeper for a short time. quake. during the quake, all deer ran out of the barns and appeared agitated immediately after the quake. the female elves began alarm calling until they were found by their keeper and kept near the keeper for a short time. the giant pandas did not appear to respond to the earthquake at all. pandas on the west coast, we're

impressed with that. i made that part up. details of what happened during yesterday's quake. best new thing in the world today. that's it for us. sorry ed. good evening americans and welcome to the ed show tonight from new york. presidential hopeful rick perry has added to his poll numbers recently. but in his home state of texas, he's been subjecting from the state's education budget and it's brutal. as school districts consider raising tactics, governor perry flip-flops, this time on the institution of sales tax. lots on the table tonight. it's the ed show, let's get to work. >> education is a priority. >> that was last year. this year, rick perry cut education funding by an unprecedented $4 billion. and budget cuts means job cuts. this from the guy who's running on job creation? republicans will do anything to prevent taxing the rich, but when it comes to taxing the middle class and working poor, they're all for it.

bob shrum is here with the proposed tax increase. >> mitt romney is flip-flopping again, this time about whether terrorists should be housed on our soil. >> i don't want them on our soil. >> rick perry has created an absolute mess for public education in the lone star state. if he becomes president, i'm convinced he'll do the same thing to every school in america. school districts open this week, $4 billion underfunded. never happened in the state before. class sizes are bursting at the seams and children are playing the price big time. the texas observer reports, it's the first time since 1949 the state has decreased funding for education. back in 2006 perry ran for election as an education

governor. >> public school funding, student achievement and standards are all up. i'm proud of texas schools. since i became governor, education funding has raised. we passed a teacher raise in the largest merit pay program. we accomplished a lot, but we can still do more. we're directing schools to spend at least 65% of their money on classroom instruction. education is our future and my highest priority. >> all right. is it the truth? education isn't perry's top priority any more. now he's laser focused on becoming the leader of the free world when it comes to gutting public education to pay for tax cuts for the superrich. perry comes from the same flock as walker, kasich and christie. last september he was asked if he could assure public schoolteachers that they wouldn't face cuts. >> can you assure the educators of this state that public school spending will not be cut in the next session? >> i think so. i go back to 2003.

it's a priority our state is still rolling. as a matter of fact we put $1.8 billion more into public education in the 2003 legislative session for the following bi annum than the previous bi annum. education is a priority. >> well, this is what local texas news looked like four months later. >> today public education cuts started at the very top. the texas education agency began laying off employees. >> texas school districts are tightening their budgets. >> hundreds of aisd teachers and staff members learned today they're out of a job. >> perry requested state agencies find a way to shave off another 2.5%.

and that's directly related to the layoffs we are seeing today. >> perry violated the trust of the public schoolteachers in texas, and ultimately it will damage the next generation. perry loves to talk about his jobs record. but $4 billion in cuts will cost thousands of public schoolteachers their jobs. the cuts will hit every kitchen table in the lone star state. to cope, some districts are implementing fees for riding the bus or attending preschool. prekindergarten. many are considering tax increases. where is the deal here? rick perry's refusal to raise taxes has made once again middle class texans shell out more money to put johnny and sally on the school bus. the texas tribune reports. in the teller independent school district just north of ft. worth students will ride the bus, they'll have to pay $185 each per semester.

now, let's do some math here folks, a family with three school aged children will have to pay over $1100 a year to put them on the bus to ride to school? this kind of money is devastating for poor, middle income and lower class families. it's hard to come up with $185 a semester per kid when you earn $7.25 an hour. i'm sure there's a few folks like that in texas. that would be working 51 hours a semester, just to cover your kid getting on the bus p.m. larger class sizes, less money per pupil, you know what it's going to do? it's going to make it harder for children to graduate. those facts mean nothing to perry, because he's all about

the ideology. when perry gets confronted with the facts, you be the judge. he has no answer. >> why does texas continue with abstinence education programs when they don't seem to be working? i think we have the third highest teen pregnancy rate in the country? >> abstinence works. >> we are the third highest teen pregnancy rate among all states in the country. the question or point is, it doesn't seem to be working. >> it works. maybe it's the way it's being taught or the way it's being applied out there. the fact of the matter is, it is the best form to teach our children. >> can you give me a statistic suggesting it works? >> i'm just going to tell you, from -- i'm going to tell from you my own personal life, abstinence works. >> that piece of video says it

all, doesn't it? perry only cares about himself and his political future. he's the new normal in texas and the republican party. tax cuts at all costs, warp social priorities, and i guess you could say blank stares at the camera. his attack on public education is dangerous. a dangerous recipe for this country. he would end public education as we know it, and create a generation of minimum wage careers. america, i don't think can afford this guy. the bottom line here is, in texas, property taxes pay for schools. what happens in the poor school districts? they stay poor. what happens in the wealthy school districts? they have a better chance of seeing their kids succeed. you ask yourself the question tonight. is that the america you want your kid to grow up in? is that the america you want to see your grandkids navigate through? is rick perry really the guy when it comes to public education? it's a sweet commercial, but there are a lot of teachers telling a different story.

are school children suffering because of republican priorities like tax breaks for the rich? a for yes, b for no to 622639 you can always go to our blog at ed.msnbc.com and make a comment. i'll bring you the results of the poll later on in the show. let's bring in jim moore author of the upcoming book adios. why rick perry will make america miss george w. bush. the television commercial was filled with facts, they were positive, but it doesn't seem to be matching up with the story being told by educators in the state. decipher it for us. >> one of the things that we are number one in is the number of people over the age of 25, and the percentage of the population over the age of 25 without a high school diploma. rick perry's been governor for ten years, you can't say that's not my fault. this guy is a guy who's gone and

said, i have to take $4 billion out of the public school system to get pressures down on the local tax district. you were talking at about the way this whole thing works in texas. we fund it with property taxes. he's claimed social security is a ponzi scheme, but what he's done with education is a shell game. he's able to say i'm cutting the budget, not increasing taxes, but it puts the downward pressures on to the local school districts. they either have to fire teach hes, the estimate is 100,000 teachers or they have to increase taxes. we have to have teachers, we have to have schools. rick perry can walk away and say i didn't do it. >> 100,000 teachers. >> he can walk away saying, i didn't raise your taxes. it's a slick way of passing the buck, no question about it, is

this a bigger and a grander scheme on the part of the governor of texas? how does he really view education? and how should it be in america? >> i think his view of education is basically that it's do what you can with what you have. and the state will help out a very small amount. look, this guy has been pushing charter schools, private schools, he's been pushing christian schools and saying to people, i want you to get your kids into these school systems. how can you say that out of one side of your mouthing and turn around on the other side of your mouth and say, i'm for education. he's urged people over and over to take their kids in public and private events and said, get them into private schools, that's where it's going on, charter school program in texas allows almost anybody to become a charter school owner and operator. >> they got loose rules down there? >> i'm sorry? >> they have loose rules when it comes to developing a charter school?

>> it's almost like a signature loan. create a charter school, and pay yourself whatever you want and rent the buildings and charge the building rental off to the state tax money that comes in for each student. it's a major exam. >> it is. great to have you with us tonight. i appreciate your time. let's turn to tina. she's taught history in government in texas schools for 20 years and is now the president of the san antonio affiliate of the association of texas professional educators. welcome tonight. these cuts, how real are they? what does it mean to classrooms? >> the cuts are very real, ed.

they're affecting the classrooms in the class sizes have increased. the elementary school and throughout the high school and so forth. they've also -- they're also going to affect the teachers. as you said earlier, they're going to lay off quite a bit of teachers. a lot of districts were created this year. not cutting a lot of teachers, they did do that. the next few are not going to be safe, they're going to make a lot of cuts. the commercial that perry was paying throws out all these numbers that he's put into public education in texas. what's the truth? >> i'm not going to get into what he said and what the truth is. i think you need to ask him. however, we are in a big shortfall. we have a $4 billion shortfall, we can't tap into the $9 million rainy day fund.

we can get into that, we can tap that and help the schools out. if they do tap into that, i assure you we won't be in a situation. the rainy day fund was made for these situations for education. >> well, the rainy day fund. why won't he do that? this would shore up a lot of problems. >> it sure would. and everyone has asked him, we've had many people stand up to him, write to him, write to the legislatures, they had three choices, one was to raise taxes. the second one was to tap into the rainy day fund. and the third was to cut spending. they chose the latter to cut spending. we feel that. >> do you think this is what texas residents want? do you think this is what americans want? >> no, i don't. and i think they need to keep calling and making their voice known and heard. >> when you look at a teacher who has 40 more students per day in some school districts, what does that do to their attitude? >> well, it makes it hard. it makes for a long day. their attitude is, it's hard to deal with, however, most teachers in tell as are doing the best they can. like i said, you have the cuts coming.

and they're going to do their best to keep their jobs, and that's not the right thing to do in raising their class enrollment. they're going to do the best they can. most of them are coming in with a positive attitude. >> would rick perry be good for america? would he be good for public education in your opinion? >> public education? his goals and what he's done in texas, it's very sketchy. i can't say yes to that. >> okay. >> i can't. >> tina, thank you for joining us tonight. i appreciate your time. remember to answer tonight's question at the bottom of the screen. house speaker john boehner thinks a majority of the economists agree with republicans on taxes. i hate to be the bearer of bad news, but they do not agree with you. senator john mccain and lindsay gram met with moammar gadhafi less than two years ago. pledging their support. now they criticize president obama for not moving fast enough to get rid of him? g ] [ female announcer ] it doesn't have to be thanksgiving

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if you haven't read my book get a copy of it, read it. >> he may live to regret his demand. since then, many people have gotten a copy of his book. there was the suggestion is that social security may be unconstitutional. then he suggests the possible repeal of the 16th amendment, which allows congress to levee an income tax. perry calls it the great milestone on the road to serfdom. and said the 16th amendment was the birth of wealth redistribution in the united states. perry's camp says we can't undo more than 70 years of taxation. perry may be running away from his statements, but it's nothing compared to how congressional republicans are sprinting into the other direction on taxes. more on that next.

and later, this man is becoming the posterboy for republican overreach. john nichols tells us how scott walker has energized democrats as he's travelled across the nation. it's salonpas. this is the relief i've been looking for. salonpas has 2 powerful pain fighting ingredients that work for up to 12 hours. and my pharmacist told me it's the only otc pain patch approved for sale using the same rigorous clinical testing that's required for prescription pain medications. proven. powerful. safe. salonpas.

when it comes to taxes, republicans are developing a pretty consistent strategy. whatever the reality is, just say the opposite. on his website this week, john boehner highlighted a report

from the national association of business economists claiming that a majority of economists surveyed believe spending cuts are the key to reducing the federal deficit, not job crushing tax hikes. the report clearly states the exact opposite of what boehner claims. out of all the economists surveyed for the report, only 12% said the deficit should be reduced by spending cuts alone. the remaining 88% said at least some amount of tax increases are necessary in an overall deficit plan. but there is no surprise, the republicans love playing the opposite game with taxes. as we reported the other night, congressional republicans who complain about job crushing tax hikes are opposing president obama's proposed extension of the payroll tax holiday. that would amount to a tax increase on 46% of all americans, most of them poor and middle class. even radical anti-tax lobbyist grover norquist says he needs to wait to see the final

legislation before weighing in on this tax hike. make no mistake, a tax hike is just that, a tax hike. if the republicans tell you anything differently, believe the opposite. let's bring in bob shrum tonight. is this a fight that president obama must see to the finish? is this something that he can really put out there day after day to fight for this payroll tax holiday, and is it a winning issue for him? >> it's absolutely a winning issue. the republicans have a wonderfully republican idea. a tax increase of 1,000 to $2,000 a year, but only on people and incomes of $100,000 a year or less. they hate obama more than they hate taxes. the fact that he's proposing this is the reason they're going to oppose it. these people represent the march of the economic morons. they've been telling us the way to create jobs is to have less money in the economy. they only care about tax cut

when is it affects the rich. remember how they talked about that waitress george w. bush did in 2000 who was going to get a tax cut? she got the equivalent of a diet coke a day. wealthy people got hundreds of billions of dollars in tax cuts and the country got a huge deficit followed by a huge crash. >> these republican legislators, these representatives and senators are home doing town halls. how can they stand up in front of people and maintain their credibility when they say they're against tax increases when they won't sign on with something like this. >> they won't be able to maintain it if the president gets out there and makes a big proposal on this, and big fight on this, all of this empty

rhetoric about job crushing tax increases. under bill clinton we had a top rate of 9.5%. it's when we began the bush cults we went into big deficits and ended up losing millions of jobs. i think the president can make this case on fairness. these folks can't read, if you read the report from the national association of business economists they say we have to have tax increases as part of the package. either they can't read those numbers or they're simply lying. >> what do you make of grover norquist saying he needs to see the legislation? >> he wants to be for tax cuts, all tax cuts all the time. so it's pretty hard for him to oppose this bill when could propose a tax increase. at the same time, he wants to get along with the republican party. you have a republican party who hates the president more than tax increases. norquist maybe has a little more consistency from the attitude of boehner, eric kantor and the rest. they want to take this money out of the economy, because they want to see to it, that the economy's in bad shape next year, they hope they can stall the recovery, so that they can ride the power on economic ruin. wait to see the final legislation before weighing in on this tax hike. make no mistake, a tax hike is just that, a tax hike. if the republicans tell you >> he wants to be for tax cuts, all tax cuts all the time. so it's pretty hard for him to oppose this bill when could propose a tax increase. at the same time, he wants to get along with the republican party. you have a republican party who hates the president more than tax increases.

norquist maybe has a little more consistency from the attitude of boehner, eric kantor and the rest. they want to take this money out of the economy, because they want to see to it, that the economy's in bad shape next year, they hope they can stall the recovery, so that they can ride the power on economic ruin. >> do you anticipate any of the republican candidates to come out in favor of this? i mean, romney loves to say he's the job creator. perry talks about what kind of jobs he's created down there. it would seem to me this is something they would be on safe territory if they stepped up and said they were for it. >> romney's fallen apart as the front-runner, all the new polls show perry moving well ahead of him. romney is not going to do anything to offend the tea party folks. trying to cow tow to him so far hasn't worked.

the tea party folks, leadership, who in essence are really conservative republicans, who don't care about those ordinary middle class folks -- there are members of the tea party who do, the leadership is exploiting those people. they really care about tax cuts for the wealthy. maybe jon huntsman will do it. he's already so popular for telling some of the truth, that he probably has nothing to lose. >> so far, i think hunts man has been dry toast except when he's gone after the other candidates in recent days. bob shrum always a pleasure to have you with us. one of rick perry's cronies shooting for a job in congress. his new campaign video compares welfare recipients to donkeys. mitt romney went on fox and flip-flopped again. this time it was about terrorism. to keep in balance after 50,

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welcome back to the ed show, and thanks for watching tonight. here's how the dance goes in texas. they're going to be getting four more congressional seats in 2012. which means we'll have four more texas republican candidates to deal with, like this dude, roger williams. he was rick perry's secretary of state for a few years, now he's running his daddy's car dealership and gunning for a seat in the congress. until recently, he seemed like a typical anti-government tax cutting texas republican who thinks president obama is a socialist. . he's kicking up the crazy a

little bit, the centerpiece of his campaign is a video where he refers to himself as the donkey whisperer. he claims the video is aimed at democrats in general, it sounds like he's making fun of welfare recipients. >> all these guys want is more shelter, more feed, and yet the government's making it harder on me, they're taxing me to death. when i don't build it, they think i owe it to them. all you guys want is a handout. he don't have something in it, and you're getting mad again. years ago we had this problem. it's a hassle to get them to do anything. these donkeys don't live in the united states of france, they live in the united states of america. if i can get obama out of health care, will you accept that? i can get these teeth fixed. i can get them fixed. >> all geared toward low information voters. he either thinks all democrats

are lazy and want a handout or he's comparing welfare recipients to donkeys. i can see the rick perry influence, can't you? john mccain and lindsey graham have been quick to criticize president obama's strategy on getting rid of moammar gadhafi. they met with the libyan dictator just two years ago, pledging their support. what happened? wisconsin's recall summer is just the start for progressives. will the white house take notice of what's happening? john nichols of the nation late he in the show. [ grandma ] relationships are life... if you don't have that thing that fills your heart and your soul, you're missing that part of your life that just fulfills you. ♪ [ male announcer ] for us at humana, relationships matter too.

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our air power. but just 18 months before they met with gadhafi to show their support. in august of 200, the three senators met with gadhafi as well as his son. according to documents released by wiki leaks they offered to help gadhafi get c-130 transport aircraft and equipment needed for his own security. quoting from the document, senators mccain and graham conveyed the u.s. interest in continuing the progress of the bilateral relationship and pledged to try to resolve the c-130 issue with congress and defense secretary gates. they even gave gadhafi advice on how to handle bad public relations as a result of the pan am bomber coming home. let's bring in national affairs correspondent for rolling stone

magazine tim dickinson. i appreciate your time now. this criticism that these senators were laying on president obama comes after they were meeting with moammar gadhafi just months before. what do you make of that. what should we take from the story? >> all this is going down the memory hole. gadhafi was our man in north africa. the signature of success, diplomatic success of the bush administration, we scared saddam and scared him straight. the bush policy and the obama policy was one of engagement, one of offering inducement to get gadhafi to live up to his commitments to give up his wmd and crackdown on insurgents, we call them rebels today in benghazi and eastern libya. that was part of the effort. there's plenty of hypocrisy to

go around, but certainly the three amigos went off to gadhafi's rather and had a grand ole time conveying what you were saying. in the hopes of sweetening the relationship. far from standing up for american families who lost loved ones in the lockerbie bombings, they were offering public relations advice to gadhafi on how to play it cool when the bomber came home, so the americans wouldn't get upset, and the relationship wouldn't be jeopardized. >> let me ask you. what would motivate a united states senator to serve up pr advice to somebody like moammar gadhafi. >> again, this is somebody who had been our enemy, mortal enemy, and now is an important strategic ally in the region. he was cracking down on the

insurgents where a lot of people were going from there into places like afghanistan and iraq, and injuring our troops. this was an important relationship. this all switched 180 degrees once we went to -- the arab spring went into progress. it went from let's all meet with gadhafi at his ranch to, the mind wouldn't mind if we blew up gadhafi, would they? this is all bizarre. it's one thing to say, we think we ought to be more aggressive, obama in waging this war and going after gadhafi once they've committed to it, once it works out. once the tripoli seems to be falling without any real bloodshed, the kevetch, basically they said, thanks nato, thanks to the brave libyan people. we're sorry the american president is a pansy. it's deeply bitter partisanship. >> let me get this in. just five months ago, senator graham criticized the obama

administration's strategy for helping the rebels. here it is. >> the strategy's confusing to the american people only 21% believe president obama has a clear view of how to handle libya. it's demoralizing to our allies, particularly people often the ground we're trying to help. i think it's encouraging to our enemies. this strategy is going to lead to a stalemate. >> where do they stand tonight? >> they want to criticize obama for leading a successful campaign, with a minimum of blood and treasure. it's baffling to me you couldn't embrace this as a good outcome. >> tim dickinson, rolling stone magazine, good to have you with us tonight. thanks so much. consistency is not one of mitt romney's strengths, but this time his flip-flopping went too far. psycho talk is next. r livingsocial,

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and in psycho talk tonight, mitt romney's flip-flopping

continues. now he's changing his tune about whether terrorists should be tried on u.s. soil. the last time he ran for u.s. president. he had this to say about trying terrorists. >> i'm glad they're at guantanamo, i don't want them on our soil. i don't want them in our prisons, i went them -- >> pretty clear position, isn't it? and he doubled down on it earlier this year when he called president obama inexperienced and naive, when he wanted to try terrorists in the united states. but wait, he sang a different tune about the lockerbie bomber who's hiding out in libya. >> you think they should hand him over to whom?

>> the united states of america would be my first choice. we would try him here and see that justice is done. this is a person responsible for the lives of hundreds of people. >> in 2007, romney didn't want terrorists on u.s. soil. but now the u.s. is the first choice to try a terrorist who blew up an airplane killing hundreds of people. romney tried to weasel out of his flip-flop with the following statement. should the law change and allow other forms to be used, governor romney would explore those options as well. pretty weak stuff, don't you think? for a guy who wants to be president of the united states? the bottom line is, if the american justice system is strong enough to try a lockerbie bomber, it's strong enough to try the terrorists being held in gitmo, don't you think. and after saying president obama was naive for wanting to try them on american soil, is pretty sleazy psycho talk. democrats all across the

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libya in turmoil, a hurricane targeting and bearing down on the east coast. fortunately with all that's going on in the world, the gang at fox & friends found time for this. >> if you want to win the 2012 race you need one thing. here it is. great hair. >> the scientific data is undeniable. the guy with the best heroins. guess peter funt providing the analysis. >> obama versus mccain. >> well, you know, that was a bit of history being made as we all know. 2008 the first time americans elected an african-american haircut. >> mccain is old news. fortunately the current crop of

republican candidates as bush might say, they're not follically challenged. >> we have two guys on the gop, i mean, with serious beautiful hair. rick perry and mitt romney. >> well, i mean -- >> you cannot get -- it's superman hair, is what it is. >> no kidding. >> will rick perry's superman hair prove to be obama's kryptonite? >> if it comes down to health care versus hair care, gosh, obama could be in trouble, huh? >> that was hilarious. >> how do you top that. >> you know what, donald trump you have to get back in this race, all the scientific evidence is right there with you. john nichols of the nation will try to top all of that next. or creates another laptop bag or hires another employee, it's not just good for business --

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it's been one heck of a summer for progressives all across this country. it's not all bad news. in fact, outside of washington, d.c., it's quite the opposite. people are fed up with the republican overreach. that's plain and simply being told to those on the campaign trail. last year's midterm elections ushered in governors like walker and kasich.

governors who started slashing services and really went after collective bargaining rights the moment they could. those republicans are now experiencing the backlash from the recalls in wisconsin to the special elections in maine. progressives have been fighting back and they are winning. winning on economic issues and winning in rural areas. places where democrats experienced big losses in the last election cycle. if this kind of momentum keeps up, well, it could mean big implications in the 2012 election. president obama, are you listening? i think he is. time now for john nichols to check in with us tonight. washington correspondent of the nation magazine. good to have you with us. i want to focus in on wisconsin if i may. because governor walker made an interesting comment the other day that not many people picked up on, he was talking about the recall effort. he said that we keep hearing from the white house that they're not for it. did i hear that correctly? and what is he talking about? does that mean he's hearing from the white house that president

obama and his team don't want to see a radical governor get recalled? take us down that road, what's the story? >> sure. look, the first thing is, i can assure you that the obama white house is not in regular conversation with the scott walker state house. and so that's the governor doing what he has a tendency to do, which is sort of take the partisan spin and add a little bit of his own salsa to it. >> we keep hearing from the white house that they're not for the recall.

that's a pretty clear statement that there's been some communication. >> i don't buy it. i think that it is again the governor playing games politically. but i can tell you this, there is a lot of internal debate in wisconsin about when and how to do a recall of scott walker. remember, no matter what you've heard from all the national spin and the spin of the walker supporters, the reality is, that governor walker's approval rating is dramatically lower than that of president obama. he is down in the mid-30s. governor walker's got a real problem. if there is a recall, he's very, very vulnerable. the question is, do you go immediately or later? >> i see a sea change taking place. i sent it out there when we go to the midwest quite often. you have been out and about, what i laid out before going on this interview is your work in the nation magazine. what are you seeing, what are you hearing, what are you feeling on the ground? >> it's pretty remarkable, ed. i think this is one of those stories that an awful lot of the national media that doesn't pay attention to the states is missing. i think some of the political class in washington is missing this. across the country, not just in wisconsin. but in new hampshire, in maine, in other states across the country where there have been special elections and, of course, the recall elections in wisconsin where democrats have

been in the field running often in very republican leaning districts, but running on economic populous messages. challenging the attacks on labor, supporting public education. supporting local services. saying that billionaires and big corporations ought to pay their fair share of taxes 37 when that message has been put out, democrats aren't just winning, they're winning by dramatically improved margins. what i found across the country i looked at the special elections recall is a number of places where democrats not only improved on their 2010 numbers which they needed to. they have to do better than 2010, there were cases where democrats were improving on 2008 numbers. they were doing better than in the obama landslide. >> what makes you think this momentum is going to last more than a year.

we have quite a ways to go before november of 12. there will be a big turnout for the general. but what makes you think -- i guess i see the republicans doing nothing on jobs, so i don't think the economy's going to get a heck of a lot better. these cuts by these radical governors, we have to keep this in the news, because this is what people are really concerned about. i think that harry out there would be the perfect candidate for president obama to go up against because of what he's done in texas. they emulate what the republican philosophy is all about. can the progressive's momentum maintain for that long? >> it's a choice that the president and national democrats have to make. when i talked to state-based and local democrats across the

country. he asked them that exact question. they said, these issues aren't going to go away, unemployment is not going to go away as an issue in 2012. and neither are these concerns about local schools, about public education, public services. about whether we're going to have a middle class. it is how these fights and issues are articulated. the president and national democrats need to learn the language of wisconsin and ohio and maine, where democrats are taking economic popular messages into the field and winning. >> we're going to ohio with the ed show, and i'm looking forward to it, because senate bill 5 is really part of everything we have been talking about, and they want to recall it. and they have over 1.3 million signatures to get it on the ballot. it's going to be a heck of a story next month. and then the following month up to the november election. dick cheney is out with an exclusive interview with nbc saying his book will have heads exploding in washington. what can we anticipate that he's going to reveal that's going to make our heads explode if we're in the nation's capitol? >> well, look, you know, the one

thing to remember is that everyone's out of washington for the break, for the recess. my sense is, the only thing that would make anybody in washington surprised coming from dick cheney would be the truth. he very rarely goes near it, the fact of the matter is, that former vice president cheney is trying to sell a book, so he's saying, this is going to have all -- >> even after all the money he made with halliburton? even after all the millions he's gotten, he's concerned about selling a book? i find that interesting. >> it's a funny thing about wealthy people, they like to get wealthier, the one thing to remember about dick cheney is, he is desperate to remain in the limelight. he's not just trying to sell this book to make money, he's trying to get that prime time