afghanistan. the most injured of all the warriors who come home you and john tower brought to this. >> not t.j. he didn't help at all. >> t.j. was -- great job, everyone. >> if it's not -- wonderful work. >> thank you so much. it was way too early. >> "morning joe," we'll see you back tomorrow. live from ground zero. we'll be there tomorrow. now "the daily rundown" with chuck todd. >> just like the nfl tonight, the preseason in the gop campaign is over. the rivalry between mitt romney and rick perry sharpened at the fiery republican debate over

jobs, health care and social security. by the way, who would have thought that social security would become the critical issue at this stage of the republican race? this morning, who had the best night? who had the worst? where was michele bachmann? full analysis ahead. the other big story, after more than a week of leaks and rumors, president obama lays out his plan to boost the economy and create jobs. will his high stakes address to a joint session of congress be more about policy or politics? can he manage a fresh start after a bruising month. new reporting on what to expect coming up this morning. will the market rally continue? even some bears are saying it's time to buy. could be a sliver of good news before the president's speech. by the way, bernanke, we're watching the opening bell. it's thursday, september 8, 2011. i'm chuck todd. this is a special edition of the "the daily rundown" coming to you from burbank, california. we've broken down all the sets at the reagan library.

let's get to my first reading of the morning. who would have bet six months ago that the single most contentious issue that could decide the nomination would be the future of social security? the battle lines have been drawn with nancy reagan looking on. rick perry and mitt romney tossed aside the former president's 11th commandment and made it clear they're willing to fight. the scrappy exchanges started around minute five and it was on jobs. >> we created more jobs in the last three months in texas than he created in four years in massachusetts. >> texas has zero income tax. texas has a right to work state, a republican legislature, a republican supreme court. governor perry doesn't believe he created that. >> michael dukakis created jobs three times faster than you did, mitt. >> as a matter of fact, george bush and his predecessor created jobs at a faster rate than you

did, governor. >> tit for tat. rick perry proved he's not interested in being anyone but rick perry. that's a strength and a weakness. perry doubled down in a view expressed in his book that social security is a ponzi scheme. he actually used the phrase before anybody used it first. listen. >> it is a ponzi scheme to tell our kids that are 25 or 30 years old today you're paying into a program that's going to be there. anybody that's for the status quo, with social security today, is involved with a monstrous lie to our kids. >> in the book "fed up," you say by any measure social security is a failure. you can't say that to tens of millions of americans who live on social security and those who have lived on it. our nominee has to be someone who isn't committed to abolishing to social security

but is committed to saving social security. >> the republican electorate is not young. the republican electorate is very old. perry showedes willing to poke it tighter and make the case he's the truth teller. he won't roll over for politics. romney's camp made clear in the spin room that they see this issue on social security as the clearest contrast they'll be able to credibly make against rick perry. mitt romney was steady eddie, prepared to do battle but also willing to duck fights he knew he couldn't win. when put on the defensive on the massachusetts health care mandate he signed into law, he tried to move the conversation along. >> it was a great opportunity for us as a people to see what will not work, and that is an individual mandate in this country. >> i understand health care pretty darn well having been through what i went through as a governor. >> well, he ducked that one but took on the fights that he wanted to have on. one of the arguments he made on

social security, that you have to ask yourself, is this the best way to go at this is on the issue. he made an electability argument. that may play well with pundits, republican strategists whose job it is to figure out how to get 270 electoral votes, voters haven't been susceptible to arguments about electability in states like delaware, even florida, where the bill mccollum tried to make that case on rick scott. speaking of florida, florida, florida, florida, when it comes to the republican primary, is there any doubt this is the be all, end all for romney and perry when we find out which one of them is going to be the nominee. tonight as president obama lays out his jobs plan before a joint skegs of congress, the thing to watch for is tone. how aggressively will the president take on republicans in congress? tonight, the kickoff of his

re-election campaign. does the president have a few more months to govern? the white house argues none of the proposals the president will put forward tonight will be controversial under normal circumstances. they feel they have a win-win with the reasonable guy in the room approach. here's white house chief of staff bill daily on the "today" show this morning. >> the american job act which the president will speak to tonight are a series of innovative ideas that have shown almost all of them to have bipartisan support. the american people are tired of the rhetoric down here. they're tired of the inaction. congress has been gone for five weeks. it's time to get back to work for the american people. >> which president obama? will it be a fraus traited one? angry one? there isn't going to be a big idea that is doa with republicans under any circumstances, that he's not intentionally, what the white house seems to be hinting at,

throw an idea that simply starts a fight. they believe every idea they're putting out there is something they should be able to find consensus on. we shall see. tonight's speech by the president could come down to a test of numbers, not only the amount of jobs he hopes to create but how much it's going to cost. this issue of cost, vic, has been interesting to watch the white house go back and forth on. on one hand, he's saying everything he's proposing is paid for. i heard bill daly start talking about tax hikes. >> they don't want it to be about the top line figure. 300 billion was the number tossed around yesterday. i heard it was going to be more than that. it's a question of how you add up the various proposals. the president is going to walk into the chamber in a hyperpolitical atmosphere. here's some numbers he's going to have to be considering and the rest of the country is considering.

9.1, the unemployment rate, 14 million unemployed. 44, his all time approval rating according to the poll you put w. the president is in all likelihood going to call for an extension of the payroll tax cut. it expires at the end of this year. more spending for traditional infrastructure projects like roads and bridges. aid to state and local governments. incentives to hire the unemployed. the president is going to be done by the nfl kickoff. the packers and the saints. remind me when that game starts. >> it starts at 8:30. the business starts at 8:00. >> let me get you to this sound by jeff sessions. the republican on the senate budget committee. >> i don't think school buildings is the problem with

our education right now. when you don't have any money, you've got to be careful about borrowing more to spend. >> and chuck, following on what you said in the intro, part of the problem the president, the line he has to walk, does he go too big in something that is politically transparent, something that he's going to blame the republicans for not enacting and being counterproductive to the stated purpose, to spur the economy and job growth or does he go too small and have the same detrimental effect? look for some of these proposals or some of what the president is doing to be folded into the debt ceiling debate. >> very quick, vic, i'm seeing a bunch of this republican may skip the address. this republican may skip the address. is this just a handful, four or five guys or is this going to become contagious? >> i think we saw paul brown from georgia, the extremely conservative member down there saying that. their logic is they don't want

to be props in a political show. the president has stated he's going to be taking the case to the american people and try to put republicans in a box. some republicans don't want to be in that box. i will bet you that sheila jackson lee and eliot engel and other members are staking out their locations on the aisle to get in that tv box when the president comes through at 7:00 tonight. >> absolutely, mike, at the white house this morning. i hope that rain doesn't delay. >> hurry on. >> you can catch the president's speech right here on msnbc. it's been two nights of incredible political theater at 7:00 p.m. eastern. there were plenty of fireworks last night. not everyone seemed willing or able to get in on the action. jonathan martin is a senior editor at politico. jonathan, we've gone through some of the big moments here back and forth when it comes to

romney and perry. i think what was surprising and you know, we gave an opportunity early on for people that wanted to debate to decide to engage to do it. some people had plans to do that and some did not. i want to play this exchange when it comes to michele bachmann who kind of became the forgotten top tier candidate. >> is governor romney's support of an individual mandate in massachusetts, is that disqualifying? >> what i want to say is obama obamacare took over one-sixth of the american economy. with all due respect to the governors, issuing an executive order will not overturn this massive law. >> jonathan, that was as close as you saw her try to -- she said with respect to the governors. she was not interested in getting involved in the perry-romney thing. >> she didn't have any strategy to break through. since perry got in on the day

she won the aims straw poll, it became clear perry was crowding out the room. i would have thought she would have found her way into the conversation. it's offered up to her about romney and she pivots back to the same message we've heard from her for the past four months which is obamacare, obamacare. that isn't good enough. >> i want to finish up with everybody else and we'll round it up with romney and perry. jon huntsman had a plan it seemed. he's in danger where you're going to have debate organizers starting to wonder, you're not really doing any better than gary johnson. they have a debate next week. they've been invited to that. we don't know about the fox debate a week later. he seemed to decide i got to get involved. >> his folks going in wanted him to be a more forceful presence

up there, unlike he was last month in his first debate in iowa. i think he had some really good moments. much more confrontational. that unapologetic truth telling vibe came out. huntsman challenge though is he's running in a republican primary right now where the voters are in an extremely conservative place. >> he made the science argument. >> nobody applauded because the folks in the crowd are mostly conservatives. it's not where they are. i think he's got to find if there are even sororities out there for his message. he's got to do this pretty fast. like you said, he doesn't move beyond 1 or 2% in the polls, he's not going to be at these things. >> newt gingrich tried to do the same thing, which is attack the media. it's going to sound self-serving since both of our organizations, this one fell flatter in his attempt, though he was good at getting applause last night.

>> it fell flat because it came in the wake of governor perry's very aggressive response to governor romney, which didn't take that much prodding to be fair from our moderators. you know, it was kind of like metaphorically, governor perry brought a chainsaw on stage and our guys are like turn it on now and he started slashing around. >> rick santorum, here's another one, he made the decision i'll get involved and he seemed to make the most of his moments, but being a former u.s. senator helps in a way like this. you're good at talking off-the-cuff. >> he's fluent on a wide range of issues. he's trying to find his place in the race right now. his challenge is similar to what huntsman has. he has to move in the polls to keep coming to the debates. >> then there's ron paul, i had more than a few people say to me who didn't know the history of rick perry and ron paul that raised their eyebrows saying why

is he picking on ron paul? >> rick perry knows one speed. it doesn't matter if it's ron paul, karl rove, barack obama, if you mess with him, he's going to hit back. this is somebody who's not going to take any shots from anybody. if he gets one, he's going to hit back. that said, perry's folks last night in the spin room were saying that this is who he is. we can't rein him in, we don't want to. perry can mod late his message. look what happened when he made the comment about ben bernanke. he's been much more restrained about that. >> the entire, i think all of those guys on stage have -- are united on ben bernanke. they all have decided they would like to fire ben bernanke. very quickly though, we have this two way -- we have what we believe is this knock down, drag out that's coming. ron paul is never going to get out of this race. ron paul is going to be a thorn

in rick perry's side. is ron paul perry's secret weapon if he holding 10%. >> paul might be what people hope bachmann and perhaps palin were going to be. it's tough for romney to beat perry in a head to head matchup, because romney is never going to out fling perry on the right. romney needs help from someone else. >> lower the winning number. >> right to get a plurality win. somebody can do that. it might be ron paul now. who knows? >> it's time for us to get some sleep. good luck. travel safe. is perry too polarizing to make it past the debate. did the debate help anyone? republican party chairman weighs in on the debate and who really can get ahead. first a look at the president's schedule. we told you what he's doing, a certain speech that starts at 7:00.

i think even he knows you can't get in the way of the nfl on nbc. we'll be right back. boy, i'm glad we got aflac huh. aflac! oh, i've just got major medical... major medical. ...but it helps pay the doctors. pays the doctors, boyyy! [ quack ] oh yeah? what about your family? ♪ we added aflac, so we get cash! it's like our safety net... ♪ to help with the mortgage or whatever we need! so my family doesn't feel the pain too. ha! [ male announcer ] help protect your family at aflac.com. [ pigeons ] heyyy! hooo!!! but sometimes i wonder... what's left behind? [ female announcer ] purifying facial cleanser from neutrogena® naturals. removes 99% of dirt and toxins without dyes, parabens or harsh sulfates. so skin feels pure and healthy. [ female announcer ] from neutrogena® naturals.

whose non-stop day starts with back pain... and a choice. take advil now and maybe up to four in a day. or choose aleve and two pills for a day free of pain. way to go, coach. ♪ .

>> our nominee has to be someone who isn't committed to abolishing social security, but who is committed to saving social security. >> regardless of what anyone says, oh, it's not and that's provocative language, maybe it's time to have provocative language in this country. >> that was one clash of the candidates last night here in california where the two republican front runners mixed it up over social security and electability is chairman prevus.

are you concerned that the republican party is going to get too nasty that you'll need to step in and calm folks down? >> i'm not. i think it's exciting stuff. it sure does beat a speech from obama before a big game. my packers are playing tonight but we got to listen to another speech from the president who is in love with speeches. i would rather have the excitement of last night where you have real solutions and people talking about trade regulations, talking about the epa, talking about how to get business taxes down so we can employ more people in this country. you know what, as i said before, i'm a big believer in these primaries. i think having a rigorous debate and a little sparring once in a while is good too. it shows life, excitement. that's what people are talking about. i think you're going to see that, chuck as we move forward.

you're going to see people talking more about the republican primary, because talking about another speech from obama, that's not news anymore. >> before you talk this job, you were chairman of the wisconsin republican party. you just made reference to the world champion green bay packers, we'll see if they go back this year. >> you bet. >> this issue of social security, i've had a lot of people with familiarity with the ron johnson, russ feingold, the argument that romney is making against perry may not work. perry by sort of owning the rhetoric when it comes to ponzi scheme isn't going to be turning off voters the way the conventional wisdom crowd is. do you buy into that? is that what you learned out of ron johnson, russ feingold? >> here's what i learned from viously as chairman of the party, i'm not going to get into refereeing our candidates.

here's what i learned from that race, people understand that the government is making promises right now that it just can't keep. whether you're watching this and you're a democrat or republican or independent, i think there's common ground there that the government is making promises it can't keep. the question is, let's -- can we be adults and admit that first? secondly, what are we going to do to solve it? i think paul ryan and the republicans in congress offered a plan in the ten year window to tackle the issue of medicare, how we're going to fund it, how we're going to get real about what the issues are, our ten year debt window, the deficit. i would leave it at that. i think it's a safe place to go, that all of our candidates on stage last night were at in telling the american people that in regard to medicare, social security, medicaid, i think it's pretty clear that we need to start tackling our entitlement. in fact, the president, i don't know if it was four mondays ago

at one of his press conferences around midday also came back to the realization saying, look, you know what, we may have to tackle our entitlements in this country. lo and behold, that's what the republicans have been trying to do over the last several years. >> are you concerned karl rove, for instance, yesterday, seemed to express concern over the words that rick perry is using, saying the phrase ponzi scheme essentially makes it so you can't have the debate described? >> you know, charles, very intelligent, he's a big help to us too. i'm going to let all of the pundits and the smart people out there voice their opinions, but what i do think is safe ground in this country is having a serious adult conversation about what we're going to do to finance social security, medicare and medicaid. my answer to you is i think it's a good place for candidates to

be to have different opinions, to have different styles and let the american people and the republican voters and independents and whoever vote for our candidates. let them decide who is best to lead our country. right now the wordsmith and the speech writer isn't getting the job done. someone has to step up to the plate and save our country economically. . i want to ask you this about the president's speech and what's being propose and what they're sending to congress. a lot of these proposals are things that republicans have supported in the past. does your party risk looking like they don't want to try to help fix the economy if they don't sign on to some of these things that on paper are things that they've been comfortable signing on to in the past, the trade agreements, payroll tax cut, things like that? >> well, my answer is yeah, i think the republicans are certainly willing to work with the president on things that -- where there's common ground,

payroll tax, holiday. i'm not the policy guy. they're going to decide those things. in general, some of these things may make some sense. the trade agreements have been sitting on his desk for three years, the payroll tax holiday is something the republicans have talked about, getting the trade regulations square with colombia and korea. those are things we agree with. the problem is we've been through this dance before with this president. we'll see. i mean we're always saying that. we'll see, we'll see, we'll see. as you know, a speech doesn't become a bill, doesn't become policy. if he's really serious about getting the entitlements and trade agreements and regulations under control, then the republicans will be there. again, we'll see. another speech. let's just -- hey, go, packers, though. >> all right, thanks for coming on this morning. wall street is holding its breath waiting to see if yesterday's rally will continue. we're going to preview the

market next. plus is president obama in danger of falling into the bush 41 trap? with foreign policy successes but bankrupt when it comes to economic policies. i'm going to talk to a man who made that argument. he's going to join us next to talk about the president's speech. today's trivia question, which president was the first to appoint a woman to carry the nuclear football? i put it all together today, presidential trivia and football. tweet me @chuck todd or @"the daily rundown." just one phillips' colon health probiotic cap a day

helps defends against occasional constipation, diarrhea, gas and bloating. with three strains of good bacteria to help balance your colon. you had me at "probiotic." [ female announcer ] phillips' colon health.

street. for a look at the markets let's go to andrew ross sorkin for the market rundown. ben bernanke, get your resume ready, all of them seem to agree, if a republican gets in,

they're not reappointing him. >> that's the most important part. not a lot of people on wall street happy about that particular fact. for better or worse, ben bernanke does have the support of most of traders and investors out there. the market, by the way, looking to open a bit lower today. we had bad news on the jobs front, some numbers coming out on jobless claims, which were worse than expected. on the flip side of that, we had other good news on trade. we narrowed the trade deficit over this last month, so that is a good piece of news, but i think what's weighing over the market again, it's europe all over again. we're hearing it all over again. the ecb leaving their benchmark unchanged and really, it's the comments coming out of europe that's getting people worried. it's going to be another rocky

day ahead of president obama's speech. the rundown coming back in 30 seconds. >> all right. a few other stories making headlines today. mother nature won't let up. texas, one of the most devastating wildfires in the state's history continues to rage. scorching 45 square miles and claiming about 800 homes. residents in the northeast are being hit with flood waters

from hurricane irene never receded before tropical storm lee deluge. u.s. officials suggest moammar gadhafi remains in hiding. he's talking with the government of nyger about seeking sanctuary there. a judge is disqualifieded. carl lewis from running from the new jersey state senate. the ruling is being appealed but the ballot deadline is one week away. democratic leaders must decide whether or not to replace lewis. will tonight's jobs speech help president obama convince more americans he can help turn around the slumping economy? will it make the job of republican challenger that much easier? can anything he propose pass muster in the house? we're joined by democratic strategist and anita dunn.

bob, i want to start with you. you wrote a column last week for the week that -- it was right after gadhafi made clear he was no longer in power. they're still searching for him. you went through and talked about all the foreign policy successes. it was interesting last night, rick perry giving the president some kudos on a couple of things having to do with national security, almost as if he's taking that issue off the table, leaving with some republican candidates. you warned that he's channeling another -- a bush, but not bush 43. >> what i actually said was that his dilemma right now is that he could be bush 41. there's a big difference here. in january of 1992, the first george bush went before congress and gave a state of the union message that was taken by most americans as complacent. didn't acknowledge the trouble america was in.

didn't put forth any new ideas. this president understands he has to put big ideas out there. are they going to pass? listen, as you pointed out earlier, a lot of these things are things republicans have been for before. i think this is the first stage of an argument and i think the second stage of the argument will be to take the case to the country and to -- for the president to show americans in a very visible way, and it begins tonight, that he's the one fighting for jobs, for the middle class, for ordinary americans. >> you know, anita dunn, the one poll number that struck both of our pollsters was this idea that a majority told us on the nbc wall steert journal poll that they believe president obama's current setback was long term. when that hit a majority for president bush, his presidency as a policy leader was effectively over. that challenge tonight, how does president obama overcome that?

>> i think bob was exactly right when he talked about the challenges that the president faces and more importantly, the challenges that this country faces in terms of putting people back to work. last night, you saw almost a two hour debate on your network, chuck, you seem to be up early this morning, very early, in which not one new idea was put forward. the president tonight is going to present to congress a set of ideas that will put people back to work now. that will not add to the long term deficit, that our common sense ideas that both parties have supported in the past and he will effectively say to them, if you're with us, if you want to put people back to work, you can do it and we can do it now. pass these bills. let's get this done. take that case to the american people. which is what the american people want washington to do. if these guys, if these members listen to their constituents over august, what they heard was that a consensus around get to

work for us and stop playing the games. i think what you'll see tonight is that president obama will challenge this nation to basically hold their leaders accountable for putting the interests of the people, getting them back to work, getting the economy growing again, and end the partisan interests that are dominating washington. >> which president obama is going to show up? is it going to be the frustrated one or is it going to be the conciliatory one, the hey look, let's figure out what we all agree on, what i'm proposing are things we can all agree on? a fighter? which president obama is showing up tonight in the well of the u.s. house? >> the president obama that people will see tonight is the same president who has undertaken extraordinary challenges and ask the american people to join him in moving this country in the right direction. this is the same barack obama, the barack obama who is building a new foundation for future economic growth while he's dealing with the crises of the

present. that's the barack obama who can lead this country forward in the future. if you watched that debate closely last night, the one thing you didn't hear was any plan to put people back to work and get this country moving in the right future. >> bob, if i know the history of the advice you would be giving right now, you would be pushing the president to be more of a fighter, to be out there, and that's been some of the criticism i have heard from some democrats. talk about that. >> i don't have a lot of patience with the democrats who are carping at the president, because frankly none of them have explained to me how he could have passed a larger stimulus in the first place. there's nothing inconsistent with being reasonable and a fighter. jfk was reasonable and was a fighter on issues like medicare. the president has to be a fighter. i think he's got to fight for people, he's got to fight for jobs and economic growth. he can go before the congress and say here's a reasonable way

to do this. make the case and then when they don't do it, he has to take this case to the american people and present them with a choice. you know, the critique of him in 2008 from people who didn't like him and we heard it from the rnc chairman, he was all speech and no substance. if you look at his record as president, he's been a lot of substance, amazing success on foreign policy, amazing legislative record and not so much speech. tonight, he has to go back to being the speech maker of 20020. it's the beginning of a dialogue with the american people i think he can win. >> bob sh rum, anita dunn, thank you both for joining me this morning. it is very early. >> it is morning. >> at some point, you get up so early here, it's as if you stayed up late. thank you both. at the reagan library, the republican candidates broke the former president's 11th

commandment to never speak ill of a former congressman, clashing over health care and social security. then there was ron paul and rick perry cementing their texas-sized rivalry, and the surprise line that got the biggest applause of the night. our panel joins me next to break it down. first i'm back to doing white house soups of the day. it's raining, not that hot. why are we doing gazpacho? you're watching "the daily rundown" on msnbc. [ male announcer ] this is coach parker...

whose non-stop day starts with back pain... and a choice. take advil now and maybe up to four in a day. or choose aleve and two pills for a day free of pain. way to go, coach. ♪ i go to e-trade and tap into the power of revolutionary mobile apps to trade wherever. whenever. life isn't fully experienced sitting idly by. neither is investing. [ birds chirping ] and i was a pack-a-day smoker for 25 years. i do remember sitting down with my boys, and i'm like, "oh, promise mommy you'll never ever pick up a cigarette." i had to quit. ♪ my doctor gave me a prescription for chantix, a medication i could take and still smoke, while it built up in my system. [ male announcer ] chantix is a non-nicotine pill proven to help people quit smoking. it reduces the urge to smoke.

some people had changes in behavior, thinking or mood, hostility, agitation, depressed mood and suicidal thoughts or actions while taking or after stopping chantix. if you notice any of these, stop taking chantix and call your doctor right away. tell your doctor about any history of depression or other mental health problems, which could get worse while taking chantix. don't take chantix if you've had a serious allergic or skin reaction to it. if you develop these, stop taking chantix and see your doctor right away as some of these can be life-threatening. if you have a history of heart or blood vessel problems, tell your doctor if you have new or worse symptoms. get medical help right away if you have symptoms of a heart attack. dosing may be different if you have kidney problems. until you know how chantix affects you, use caution when driving or operating machinery. common side effects include nausea, trouble sleeping and unusual dreams. ♪ my benjamin, he helped me with the countdown. "5 days, mom. 10 days, mom." i think after 30 days he got tired of counting! [ male announcer ] ask your doctor about chantix. over 7 million people have gotten a prescription. learn how you can save money and get terms and conditions

at chantix.com. it's real milk full of calcium and vitamin d. and tastes simply delicious. for those of us with lactose intolerance... lactaid® milk. the original 100% lactose-free milk. >> pursuant to the power conferred upon me by article 2, section 2 of the constitution, have granted and by these presence do grant a full, free and absolute pardon on to

richard nixon. >> there you go, the daily flashback, back to 1974, when gerald ford decided he did not want to win a full term as president -- excuse me he pardoned president nixon for all federal crimes that he quote committed or may have committed or taken part in while in office. many a ford strategist will say the 1% that they fell short in beating jimmy carter had everything to do with that nixon pardon. in the most combative debate, rick perry and mitt romney placed dualing bets on where the social security would be next year. >> our seniors have the need of social security. i will make sure we keep the program and make it financially secure. >> you cannot keep the status quo in place and not call it anything other than a ponzi scheme. regardless of what anybody says oh, it's not, it's provocative

language, maybe it's time to have provocative language in this country. >> caron finny is here and kevin is here, remains a supporter not on the payroll, susan page is the washington bureau chief for america's newspaper, especially when you're traveling the "usa today." susan, i can't get a "usa today" at 2:30 in the morning in front of my hotel room door on the west coast. >> we'll work on that. we'll make an earlier edition out there. >> there was definitely style and substance disagreements not between perry and romney but between perry and a lot of folks. i waptnt to play this other response about the argument of science, climate change, evolution that rick perry made responding to jon huntsman. >> just because you have a group of scientists that says here is the fact, galileo got outvoted

for a spell. find out what the science is before you start putting the american economy in jeopardy. >> susan page, did rick perry make an effective push back at jon huntsman on the science point, there's plenty of democrats mocking perry about the galileo comment. i'm talking about a republican electorate, was rick perry effective in using galileo? >> this is my ninth presidential campaign. first one i ever got to write the word galileo in a debate story. thank you for that. i think he did not -- he was so confident when he was talking about jobs and other things. i don't think he conveyed that same confidence and certainty and clearly thought out answer when it came to the issue of climate change. even though there are lots of people in the republican party who have questions about the human role in global warming, i don't think that was an effective answer. if he gets this question again, which he will, i think we'll probably see him work on that

answer some. >> you know, kevin madden, we know your point of view when it comes to mitt romney, the romney campaign is making this argument that they can have a republican primary argument particularly on social security, but even perhaps other things like science, maybe they wouldn't put it the way he put it, but that they can have this argument. do you buy that? >> i think the argument that comes out about it is twofold. i think if you look at governor romney, he has a specific 59 point plan on the economy, and 160 page book. he has a plan for social security to make it solvent for future generations. governor perry is a wholesale indictment of social security without a detailed plan about what he would do on social security or even the economy. so what happened was, when he got off the script last night, he kind of me an dered and didn't have a lot of strong

points to make on it. the other thing that emerges is the electability argument. can we prosecute the case against barack obama on social security and the general election when you have just that indictment and no plan going forward from rick perry. >> kevin, before i go to karen, can you point to me the republican primary where the electability argument persuaded republican primary voters? >> is that for me or karen? >> it is for you, kevin. you made the argument. >> i'm sorry. >> definitely not dodging that. i thought that was for karen. ultimately, what people -- what many of these primary voters are looking for right now is someone who is going to beat barack obama. right now, i think many of them -- everybody agrees that barack obama is bad on the economy, they believe he's bad on jobs. what happens is when we get into -- when you get into the real core question you ask people in primaries and caucuses, who is going to be the

best candidate to beat barack obama, it's going to be a very powerful argument in the end. i want to play this response, one of the things the white house is counting on, is they get a clear contrast with rick perry or face mitt romney who has to move to the right. here's what mitt romney had to say about the tea party. >> are you a member of the tea party? >> i don't think you carry cards in the tea party. i believe in a lot of what the tea party believes in. if the tea party is for keeping government small spending down, helping us create jobs, hey i'm for the tea party. >> are you one of these democrats that believes a republican that either says they're a member of the tea party or agrees with the tea party is going to turn off swing voters? >> potentially, yes, even within the tea party movement, they're starting to see a bit of a fracture between those who consider themselves original tea party movement people and see a portion of the tea party

movement beingco opted by big money in washington. mitt romney's answer last night was a general election answer. he was very careful in a number of his answers to sort of try to have it a little bit both ways. not denigrate the tea party but make it clear that he wanted to be presidential and kind of more of the general election mitt romney. >> so, karen, quickly, as a democrat, were you disappointed that romney didn't take the bait every now and then in these arguments? >> no, i wasn't disappointed. that's exactly the performance that i expectedromney. all along you could tell his focus has been more on the general election or as much on the general election. the thing that i was the most surprised by is that, you know, we had a stage full of candidates talking about their love and admiration for ronald reagan, ignoring the fact that ronald reagan actually had to raise taxes several times and i'm going to say the dirty word, compromise, to get some things

done, and each one of these folks said absolutely no way would they do that. >> all right. had to equal karen's disappointment. >> all right. i've got to go to break, but when we come back, susan page, i want to talk to you about the surprising applause line of the night last night. but before break, trivia time. we ask which president was the first to appoint a woman to carry the nuclear football? the answer, it was ronald reagan. the flashback in trivia team this week. my doctor told me calcium

is best absorbed in small continuous amounts. only one calcium supplement does that in one daily dose. new citracal slow release... continuously releases calcium plus d for the efficient absorption my body needs. citracal. for the efficient absorption my body needs. let's design a vacation on a bumake it work.edia. see what anandra did? booking her flight and hotel at the same time a serious money-saving maneuver. book it! major wow factor! where you book matters. expedia.

kevin madden, susan page, and karen finney are returning. okay, toward the end of the debate, susan page. rick perry was asked about if he'd ever lost sleep at night for any of the executions that he ordered to go forward. here's what he had to say. >> in the state of texas, if you

come into our state and you kill one of our children, you kill a police officer, you're involved with another crime and kill one of our citizens, you will face the ultimate justice in the state of the texas. and that is you will be executed. >> susan page, what struck a lot of folks watching the debate was the applause that the number of executions that have taken place under governor perry got from the live audience. susan page, you've covered republican primaries, sort of red state, blue state, republican politics for a long time. explain to some of our blue state viewers why that was. >> even in blue states, i think, a majority of voters in both parties support the death penalty for the most heinous crimes. so i thought that the audience reaction, i thought was a little discomforting. but governor perry's answer on it, i thought, demonstrated his strength.

that's the kind of question that candidates. even a candidate like bill clinton would fumble or seem uncertain about. he gave an answer that 80% of americans probably agree with. you come in and kill a child or a police officer, people overwhelmingly support the death penalty in those cases. and he made that argument quite cogently. while he's going to have trouble with some of the things he said last night on that issue, i think that is going to be not something that creates problems for him. >> and very quickly, karen finney, what did you make of perry giving a tip of the hat to president obama on killing bin laden? >> i think that was part of the law and order message he was trying to send and also trying to show that he can cross the aisle and give credit where credit's due. not a bad move, but disappointing performance. >> dailycaller.com has an op-ed by my good friend jim dike about what president obama needs to say tonight if he's going to have any -- make any progress on jobs and the economy.

>> susan page? >> shameless plug for one of the hardest working journalists in washington, that's andrea mitchell. we learned yesterday she's battling breast cancer. we're all pulling for her. she's tougher than any disease. >> i was just going to say, no doubt about that. full endorsement. karen finney? >> i'm going to leave it there with susan. i completely agree. andrea is an incredible person. >> andrea, i love you. i'll see you later today. that's it for this edition of "the daily rundown" we'll see you tomorrow. from washington, d.c., senator bob corker will join us with reaction to the president's speech. you can watch the president's address right here on msnbc tonight at 7:00. coming up next, chris jansing will interview mark moreal. bye-bye.

here's a look at your business travel forecast. a heavy rain continues to push up the mid-atlantic into new england today. you notice the hurricane just off the coast too. that's katia. but that's going to be a swing and a miss. forecast today, still more airport delays likely boston to new york to everywhere in between. middle of the country will be okay, but showers in detroit and chicago while the west coast bakes in the heat. i'm good about washing my face. but sometimes i wonder... what's left behind? [ female announcer ] purifying facial cleanser from neutrogena® naturals. removes 99% of dirt and toxins without dyes, parabens or harsh sulfates. so skin feels pure and healthy.

[ female announcer ] from neutrogena® naturals. her morning begins with arthritis pain. that's a coffee and two pills. the afternoon tour begins with more pain and more pills. the evening guests arrive. back to sore knees. back to more pills. the day is done but hang on... her doctor recommended aleve. just 2 pills can keep arthritis pain away all day with fewer pills than tylenol. this is lara who chose 2 aleve and fewer pills for a day free of pain. and get the all day pain relief of aleve in liquid gels.