i'm thrilled to see him fighting for the working class. he needs to take it to the next level. i'll tell him how. >> stop complaining. stop grumbling. stop crying. we are going to press on. >> the president's jobs offensive is gaining steam and the american people are responding. >> would you please raise my taxes? >> radio host mike papantonio and john madison on the growing support for obama as plan. what's the republican plan to bring manufacturing back to america? rick santorum has his ideas and i have mine. i'll interview the candidate tonight. and bill o'reilly's crusade to keep his taxes from going up. it's a major snag. three years ago, he was agreeing to paying his fair share. >> what say we go up to 20? >> 20's okay. not 25. >> you and i agree. >> great to have you with us tonight, thanks for watching "the ed show" on msnbc. president obama, i think he's on

the move and he's definitely turned the corner. there is fresh evidence on that again today and a trend is clearly emerging. president obama wants to be a fighter for the middle class. he's saying it a lot now. i love it. the working class. i've said the president should name names, and he did that on the ohio river just last week. >> part of the reason i came here is because mr. boehner and mr. mcconnell, those are the two most powerful republicans in government. they can either kill this jobs bill or they can help pass this jobs bill. and i know these men care about their states. they care about businesses. they care about workers here. i can't imagine that the speaker wants to represent a state where nearly one in four bridges are classified as substandard. >> and this was only a few days after the president called out the speaker for political gamesmanship. >> so the speaker says, we can't

have it, my way or the highway, then basically says, my way. or the highway. that's not smart. it's not right. if we're going to meet our responsibilities, we have to do it together. >> and just last night, the president hit back again. directly at the republican accusation that he is engaging in class warfare. this is what he said at a dinner hosted by the congressional black caucus. >> if asking a billionaire to pay the same tax rate as a janitor makes me a warrior for the working class, i wear that with a badge of honor. >> and the president was fired up and he was clearly calling on his base to stand with him. >> i expect all of you to march with me and press on. take off your bedroom slippers. put on your marching shoes. shake it off. stop complaining.

stop grumbling. stop crying. we are going to press on. we've got work to do. cbc. >> and this turn continues. then today the president took another golden opportunity to state his case. at a california town hall, a man in the audience stood up and asked this. >> my question is, would you please raise my taxes? >> that man went on to say that he would like to see the country invest in things like bell grants and infrastructure and job training programs. his name is doug edwards, a former google executive. if this country can make a hero out of a phony like joe the plumber, shouldn't the media be talking about this guy? we should certainly be praising a man who has done well and wants to live in a country where the less fortunate have a real opportunity to succeed the way it used to be. here is part of the president's answer to that question. >> so often the tax debate gets

framed as, class warfare. america's success is premised on individuals, entrepreneurs having a great idea, going out there and pursuing their dreams. and making a whole lot of money in the process. and that's great. but as you just pointed out, we're successful because somebody invested in our education. somebody built schools. somebody created incredible universities. i went to school on scholarship. we benefited from somebody somewhere making an investment in us. >> well, the president is clearly ready to defend what the democratic party is supposed to stand for. and he is sounding like a fighter again. at a fund-raiser in woodside, california, this weekend the president said this. has anybody been watching the debates lately? you've got a governor whose state is on fire denying climate change. you've got audiences cheering at the prospect of somebody dying

because they don't have health care. and booing a service member in iraq because they're gay. that's not reflective of who we are. and at a seattle fund-raiser the president nailed republicans for their attack on government. he said, an approach to government that will fundamentally cripple america in meeting the challenges of the 21st century. the republican approach would fundamentally cripple america? that's pretty strong language. i've been on the road the last two weeks, worked in six different cities. my take? these congressional republicans, they're not fooling anybody. they see this president out there trying to do something about jobs in this country, in the meantime, the do-nothing congress is doing nothing about jobs. because of the obstructionists over on the right. but mr. president, take it up just a little bit more. start referring to the speaker of the house as the jobless speaker. or the do-nothing speaker. because i sense that the people out there who supported you, mr.

president, they love that kind of talk. they love this fight. they want this fight. they know who's standing in the way of making america's economy better. they understand the auto loan, they understand the stimulus package. they are passionate to see you fight. and you know what? i would say a month ago we couldn't have put a series of sound bites like that together of president obama. tonight, we can. there's no doubt he has turned the corner. in fact,think he's rewriting the manual of the 1948 harry truman campaign. and i think it's going to work. republicans, if you have any moderate bones in your body at all, step to the plate and do something about jobs. because only 8% of the american people right now think that you ought to go back and continue your job with your good salary, your health care, and your pension. all the things the republicans have been trying to take away from middle classers in this country. get your cell phones out.

tonight's question, will president obama's new aggressive stance win over independents? "a" for yes, "b" for no, go to our blog and make a comment, we'd love you to do that. we'll bring you the results of the poll later on in the show. let's turn to host of the ring of fire radio show and sirius xm radio show joe madison, two of the best in the business, no doubt about it. a month ago we couldn't put a series of sound bites like that together, joe madison, what's happening here? tell us what's going on. >> let me tell you, you missed one sound bite. i was at the convention center in the speech. and it was really interesting. the conservative talk show echo chamber tried to suggest that he somehow embarrassed the congressional black caucus base and the people who were there by saying, quit complaining. what the sound bite that you're going to have to find is where

he lists a string of accomplishments. i mean, it was just one after another. and then he said, in the spirit of a dr. king, in the spirit of the labor movement, look. we've got to get out here and fight. in other words, start calling the people who are blocking this and doing nothing. that's what that sound bite was about. that's why the people stood up and cheered. because what they had heard that they hadn't heard in a long time, ed, was all the accomplishments that were there. >> sure. >> that's the real sound bite. >> you know, i was out in indiana on saturday night speaking. they get the auto loan. they know it's not a bailout. >> right. >> they know it saved millions of jobs and it's the untold story and we try to bring it up as often as we can. >> i'm in detroit today. >> yeah. >> you know, you want to talk about they get it.

oh, they get it here in this city, yes. >> they do get it. mike, what do you make of the turn by the president. it's the campaign season? >> well, he is energizing his base, ed. it's not that he's just talking about the positives. he's doing what he has to do this time around. look, last speech he gave, i heard him talking about the idea, the day one republicans are cheering that perry is executing texans. day two, the republicans are cheering that americans who can't get health insurance are dying of cancer. day three, republicans are booing iraqi veterans because they're gay. he is on a tear. and i got to tell you something. it's not just him pumping up his positives. he understands that american voters respect and they believe in a fighter. they don't want a gandhi, they're tired of this idea that obama is a gandhi. he's changing that image. i think truthfully, he's always been a fighter but we haven't seen that side of him. he's cornered now, he has to be a fighter, and they want an fdr.

they want a truman. they want a kennedy. obama has always been a great three-point shooter from the point. now you know what he's doing, ed? now he's moving up underneath the rim, he's moving up underneath the net, he's throwing elbows and knees. republicans aren't used to it, they don't know how to react to all of this. >> gentlemen, i really believe that the president is going to have to tell the people who supported him in 2008 that this is about power. the democrats have always been about people and opportunity, but at this point, it's about power. because i don't want to see a rerun of the last four years. you know, i don't want to see a rerun, i want to see a president come out and saying, this is what we're going to do on health care. this is what we're going to do on taxation. this is what we're going to do to fix our treasury. this is what we're going to do for the war. then give me the votes and this is what we're going to do. i think he's going to have to be far more definitive in moving forward saying, i realize now you can't negotiate with these people, it's all about power. joe madison, what about that? >> i did want to make one correction. he's not really that great of a

free throw shooter. but he's practicing. but here's what's going on, guys. he is really not in full -- if you like it now, he's not in full campaign mode. if you notice, he's not going after these guys who are debating each other. he's going after washington. >> he's running against the congress, there's no doubt about it. he's set is the scenario to run against the congress. on the same side, joe, and i want you to answer this, i don't want did see a rerun. i think the president needs to say, i'm going to be different in dealing with the republicans. i realize now it's about power. i think that's the next step. your thoughts. >> oh, there is no ifs, ands, buts about it. you're looking at a party who protects the top 2% that controls, what, two-thirds of the wealth of this nation? he knows exactly what he's doing. and i think what he's got to do is energize us enough.

and here's my main concern. we can't sit back, like he said, with our bedroom slippers on and not get out here and take on this congress. >> mike, will he be a different president the second time around? would president obama be different dealing with the republicans next time around? what do you think? >> he realizes he has to be. it's an easiest time -- this is it. if he's going to be re-elected, he can change this country. he's out there right no now, out of the beltway, out of that echo chamber, shaking hands with americans. he's hearing things that people are surprised, that he's surprised to hear. he's hearing that americans were disappointed that he didn't fight a little bit harder, at least they perceive that he didn't. >> here's the president tonight at a fund-raiser. here's what he had to say in los angeles tonight. here it is. >> america used to have the best infrastructure. that's what made us an economic super power. and right now we've got millions of folks who are out of work and

ready to get on the job. let's put them back to work right now rebuilding america. by the way, these are ideas that are traditionally republican and democratic ideas. researches -- republicans used to love to build stuff. i don't know where suddenly they decide that's a democratic idea. >> mike, what do you think of that? >> well, he's right on his message. look, they don't want to see amy vanderbilt, miss manners. this is the best of obama, we're seeing it. if his advisers will let him be himself and get away from the amy vanderbilt, miss manners image, he is going to hurt the republicans these 86 few months. >> he used that line at the congressional black caucus. he said, they used to love to build roads. you know, what happened? now they don't want to build roads. but you know what i think happened? was the debt ceiling debate. i think he saw, you know, darn it, finally, he got it.

he finally believed that mcconnell, limbaugh, and boehner -- >> the whole crowd. >> they don't care. they will bring the economy down just to get him out of office. and i think the american people are saying, we're not going to go for that. we are americans. >> mike, joe madison, great to have you guys with us tonight, thanks so much. remember to answer tonight's question, we want to know what you think on our poll tonight. only two republican presidential candidates have had the guts to come on "the ed show" with a real liberal. one of them's coming back for more. former senator rick santorum will join me a little later on the program. rick perry loses to the pizza candidate from the sunshine state. stay with us. [ carrie ] i rememy first year as a teacher, setting that goal to become a principal. but, i have to support my family, so how do i go back to school? university of phoenix made it doable. i wouldn't be where i am without that degree.

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before. the red line is the income growth for the richest 1% of americans since 1979. look at that. the blue line, income, is the average wage growth over the same period of time. it's almost totally flat. the average wage earner in america isn't making much more than he or she was some 30 years ago. it's the graph from "mother jones." the wealthiest americans, they're up 240%. i guess you could say these are the job-creators over here. the wages aren't doing anything, are they? i've been begging any republican to come on this show -- i'm not trying to be a jerk, just come on the show and provide some answers for the middle-class americans who are down here. how can they know the truth about this chart and still promise tax cuts for the top 1%? well, one republican has answered my challenge. presidential candidate rick santorum was on the show two weeks ago, the last night of the tea party debate, and he said he

would get americans back to work by cutting corporate tax rate and bringing american jobs back from overseas. i'm all about it. what i want to know, what is his plan for any of the republicans, for that matter, for the 99% who have barely seen their incomes go up over the last three decades? i guess you could call it trickle-up economics. does any republican candidate really have a plan for the middle class? and why is it that the republican candidates, they never talk about the middle class? president obama's talking about the middle class. an some other members of congress are talking about the middle class. maybe we can get rick santorum to talk about the middle class next. ♪ when the things that you need ♪ ♪ come at just the right speed, that's logistics. ♪ ♪ medicine that can't wait legal briefs there by eight, ♪ ♪ that's logistics. ♪ ♪ freight for you, box for me box that keeps you healthy, ♪

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i do not believe that state, federal or local workers, unions, should be involved in unions. and i would actually support a bill that says that we should not have public employee unions for the purposes of wages and benefits to be negotiated. >> well, this shouldn't surprise you but i don't have a lot in common with anyone who thinks that we should get rid of public employee unions. now, we might not agree on much but senator rick santorum is not afraid to come on the program and talk about the issues and i appreciate it. the former senator from pennsylvania joins me tonight from his home state. rick, i appreciate your time very much. you know, i just want some straight-talking answers. i'm not here to dun you tonight, this is not an ambush, okay, or anything like that. but i need -- >> hey, ed. i'm packing. so don't worry. i'm ready.

>> that's good, i'm a firearms owner too but i won't use it here in this interview. tax cuts for the wealthy. we've had tax cuts for the wealthy. where are the jobs? why haven't we had the job creation that everybody wants if all the breaks have gone to the top income earners? basic question. >> yeah, well, i would say that what we need to do, and this is why i propose the tax plan that i have, is to do something to create that wealth that's being generated, as you saw in that chart, by those who are the creators, the innovators, the folks that are, you know, driving this economy. and the problem is that too many of the products that have been invented and created and -- by the steve jobs of this world and others, are not being made in america. so you're not seeing the wage growth. i talk about when i was growing up as a kid in butler, pennsylvania, 21% of the workforce was involved in manufacturing. now it's 9%. and as you know, if you want to -- if you want those higher-wage jobs, then you're going to have

to do it in something that's going to make something, that's going to create real wealth. so my plan is to get manufacturing going again in america. >> i'm all about it. >> some manufacturing jobs here -- i know you are. and that's why i think we can get bipartisan support for what i'm doing. >> i just don't hear any other republicans talk about manufacturing whatsoever. but back to the point. you can't raise taxes on the job creators. that's what we hear from every republican. well, we haven't rated taxes on the job creators. so where are the jobs? >> well, i would say what we need to do is to be competitive in getting those jobs back to america. and if you look at what china and indonesia and mexico have done, they've created sort of sweetheart deals for manufacturers to go there. in addition to low labor rates, in addition to litigation -- no litigation -- >> but senator -- >> in addition to regulations -- >> i think a fair point that needs to be made -- you're saying the same answer again and i get that. the point that is we have given -- we need money in the treasury. whether we expand the tax base

by creating more jobs, we need more money in the treasury, no question. but we have given breaks. and the republicans to a "t" say you can't raise taxes on the job creators. why aren't they investing those tax breaks into american jobs? it's easy to do. all you got to do is create something. why aren't they doing that? >> well, obviously they invested a lot of those monies in jobs for a long time. we had 3%, 4% unemployment rates. so they were. but as you point out and as i agree with you, that what we need to do is create -- revitalize that sector of the economy that creates real wage growth. we've had people stock in the bottom couple of quinn tiles and we need to create job growth -- excuse me, growth in wages by bringing back this manufacturing sector. so i would say that the overall policy is a good one, except that we haven't focused on where we need to if we want to create the kind of -- wage inflation,

if you will, that we need to create a vibrant middle of america -- >> senator, we've been through reagan's tax cuts, we have been through bush 41, bush 43. okay? we saw 22 million jobs created during the clinton years. okay? so since the 1980s, okay, now we've got president obama as the second democratic president. the point being here is, the economic plan for the republicans to continually give the tax breaks to the top, can't you admit it just hasn't worked and we've got to do something different? >> well, i would say that it certainly has worked in a lot of respects. we had very low rates of unemployment. we had record low rates of unemployment for quite a long time in this country until we had the catastrophe that was caused in large part by the housing industry, fannie and freddie -- >> which was deregulation, which republicans push a lot of -- >> no, no, it wasn't deregulation, it was fannie and

freddie holding assets they shouldn't have been holding, which we need to have less being held by these folks. i was one of the people that sign adler back in 2005 and 6 and said we better reform these institutions or we're going to have a meltdown, and that's exactly what happened. part of it was government regulation and government markets that caused the bubble and caused the loose lending practices that lent to the problems. >> it was deregulation that took us to where we are in the housing market, there's no question about that, and we should have never had that regulation leave us in 1999. finally the next thing -- >> no, we -- >> you know, we keep -- >> we had a lot of regulation that forced a lot of the folks who should not have been buying homes to get those homes -- >> the job market, senator, what's hurt the job market is the outsourcing of jobs. and through all of these debates -- >> i agree. >> we have not heard any republican candidate say outsourcing in any of these --

>> excuse me. >> that's where america is right now. excuse me. >> the profits at the top are going overseas -- >> that's what i'm talking about. >> the profits are going overseas and nobody's got a plan to bring it back. i did hear you. >> i have a plan to bring it back. and it's to create an atmosphere in this country where manufacturers can get a good return on their investment. that's the plan i'm putting forward. >> if you were the nominee, would you run on a platform to make the bush tax cuts permanent? >> oh, absolutely. i think we just need to keep the rates -- we need certainty in the environment right now. >> okay. >> we can't be looking at folks saying, we're going to increase taxes on job creators. let's keep the tax rates where they are and focus in on one particular area, which is manufacturing. let's create a zero percent corporate tax on manufacturers so we can bring those jobs back here to this country, allow the folks who did -- >> senator, appreciate it. you're on that subject, there's

no doubt about it. >> that's what you want me to talk about, you asked me to come here and talk about how -- >> that's good, i appreciate it. but you just said that you would go along with the failed economic policy to continue to give tax breaks to the wealthiest americans. and the majority of americans don't agree with that position. i've got to point that out. i'll have you back again if we can, i'm out of time, i've got to run. former senator rick santorum with us here on "the ed show." scott walker took his anti-public education act to congress today. rush limbaugh doesn't think president obama is authentically black. the drugster back with us. [ male announcer ] heard this one?

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in "psycho talk" tonight, rush limbaugh likes to see he's color blind. anyone who listens to his radio show for five minutes knows that's hogwash. here's what he had to say today while he was congratulating pizza king herman cain for winning the straw poll. >> we could be on the brink of an historic election. herman cain goes on to win the republican presidential nomination. and then goes on to be elected president. herman cain could be our first authentically black president. stop and think about that. >> oh, i'm thinking about it, rush. and you're full of it. president obama was authentically black enough for you when you spent the last four years taking racially charged

shots at him. >> we have to bend over, grab the ankles. bend over forward, backward, whichever. because his father was black, because this is the first black president. >> how do you get promoted to the barack obama administration? by hating white people. obama america, white kids get beat up, black kids cheering right on, right on, right on, right on. the triple-double oreo. it's a biracial cookie. it isn't going to be long before it's called the obama-oreo. barack obama the magic negro. how many votes did obama get because he was black? shocking number, folks. if obama weren't black he'd be a tour guide in honolulu. >> those comments, just the tip of the iceberg. limbaugh has made millions by spewing racist garbage. for him to say president obama is not authentically black is outrageous "psycho talk." o'reilly still whining about his taxes.

eric boehlert will help analyze his latest temper tantrum. and rick perry's embarrassing debate performance on thursday was just the beginning of a long losing weekend for the texas governor. conservatives are saying he's done. i don't think so. ♪ ♪ [ dog barks ] [ birds chirping ] ♪ [ mechanical breathing ] [ engine turns over ] ♪ [ male announcer ] the all-new volkswagen passat. a new force in the midsize category. ♪ a whoa.orce in the midsize category. whoa. how do you top great vacations? whoa. getting twice the points on great vacations. whoa! use chase sapphire preferred and now get

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welcome back to "the ed show." rick perry's self-destruction continues. it all started during last week's republican debate when he gave answers like this one. >> is it the mitt romney that was on the side of against the second amendment, before he was for the second amendment? was it before he was before the social programs from the standpoint of he was for standing up for roe versus wade? before he was against roe versus wade? he was for race to the top? he's for obama care, now he's

against it? >> all right, not so hot. perry followed up on his disastrous debate performance with a big loss in the florida straw poll. he spent more time and money in florida than his competitors. but still only got 15% of the vote. former godfather ceo pizza man herman cain won the straw poll, i was surprised at this, with 37%. the folks on fox, here already writing perry's political obituary. >> perry really did throw up all over himself in the debate. at a time when he needed to raise his game. perry is about one half a step away from almost total collapse as a candidate. >> really? you think so, mr. hume? he's still leading the republican field in a new nationwide poll coming in at 28%, 7 point arizona head of mitt romney at 21%. and that takes into consideration the event that took place the other night. joining me now is jim moore. he is a "huffington post" contributor. "why rick perry will make

america miss george w. bush." steve kornacki, political columnist for salon.com. is it history for rick perry? is it over for him? >> i wouldn't go that far just because of the poll you just showed there, he's still up. i'm really curious to see another poll when it takes into account not just the debate or so but the week or so that's followed it. you look at that clip you showed in the debate, you look at the result from florida, i think both of those are very strong signs that at the very least we could say, this guy is totally failing to live up to his potential. because the promise of the rick perry candidacy to republicans was, he could pull off that line, he could confront mitt romney on these crimes against conservatism, he could speak for the base. instead he flubbed it. the promise of rec perry was all these second-tier conservative true believers, the michele bachmanns, the herman cains, the rick santorums, they go away because now the base has somebody.

>> jim moore, okay, so he stumbles in a debate. the fact is he's got a southern strategy which would be much stronger than mitt romney. where are we right now with the perry camp? >> it turns out the straw polls are nothing more than silly entertainment. i don't know of any straw poll that's ever been very rat accurate in terms of predicting a president. those several hundred people who gave that victory to herman cain heard a very great speech from him at that convention. but in the wake of perry's poor performance. then they melted away into a population of florida which gives a large lead right now to rick perry. i think the important question to ask is where would these disaffected perry voters go? we know they aren't going to romney. they've already left michele bachmann. herman cain will get some of them. are they going to rick santorum? not likely. they might be disaffected temporarily, i think. but eventually, they end up coming back to rick perry because he has their basic, hard-right conservative values. >> steve, is this now the opening for chris christie of

new jersey? >> it's interesting, i don't think chris christie will run at the end of the day. i'm talking about all these symptoms of why it's failing for rick perry, here's another one. the promise of the rick perry candidacy was, we were going to stop hearing about chris christie, stop hearing about how there was room for a savior, for a white knight -- >> he can't control if conservatives are meeting with him. >> right, they wouldn't be meeting with him. bill crystal throwing his name out. the network is pushing for chris christie to jump into this then because they're not happy with rick perry. >> if rick perry was getting it done as a candidate the way he was supposed to be, bill crystal wouldn't be saying, i want chris christie in this race. >> don't you think some of that is they can't control this guy, this guy is a radical tea partier. >> it shows the deficiencies with rick perry and the republican base that have come to light, immigration is one of the chief issues here. >> immigration is a problem for him. again, go back to the base. they're going to look around and see where romney is, see where

cain, eventually going to have to decide, who do we turn to? somebody that we like on the broadest number of issues? or toss him out just because of this question of immigration? he fumbled that. he should have explained his position much more clearly. because it hurt him. but i don't think they're going to toss the baby out with the bathwater in terms of perry. >> i think there's one other thing to consider him. we've now seen six or seven polls in key 2012 battleground states in national polls that have shown rick perry significantly underperforming against barack obama. compared to mitt romney. polls that show romney basically even with obama and perry running 7, 8, 9 points behind. i think that's a serious consideration -- >> you think the republicans will match that up and make that determination -- >> when you look at the mood of the republican base, i know they're very conservative but they are furiously anti-obama, as you've seen. if it comes down to, we're going to let this guy get a free pass for a second term, i don't know if they'll do that. >> romney can't win the

nomination, that's the problem. romney cannot win in the south because of his religion and because of the way he has waffled on a number of major, significant issues. >> john mccain four years ago -- >> actually, rick perry i thought did a good job of stumbling because that's exactly what mitt romney's been doing for five years, stumbling all over, falling all over the place. great to have you with us tonight. wisconsin public schools are under attack and scott walker peddling his anti-education plan right here in the big apple. i'll take him to school in "the playbook." just one phillips' colon health probiotic cap a day helps defends against occasional constipation, diarrhea, gas and bloating. with three strains of good bacteria to help balance your colon. you had me at "probiotic." [ female announcer ] phillips' colon health.

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in my "playbook" tonight, the most anti-public education governor in america came to the big city to brag about his record. this afternoon wisconsin governor scott walker took part in nbc's "education nation"

program. walker's participation in the event drew intense opposition from people in the badger state. an activist from sun prairie, wisconsin, wrote an open letter to nbc's brian williams urging him to question walker's record. williams asked walker about the letter. >> of all the people here today, you were the only governor who was the subject of a social media campaign aimed at us. including this open letter sent to us. i got several copies of this, it's posted on the web. and they all begin, mr. williams, i was shocked to learn that you are featuring governor scott "teachers are thugs" walker on your program. i'll spare you most of it, you can read it on the web, none of it will surprise you. one paragraph in here reads "walker cut $1.6 billion from

wisconsin's public education budget over two years even as he passes out tax breaks like candy and increases public funding to private and charter schools. most districts in the state had to deal with these cuts this year by posting our top commodity, experienced teachers into early retirement, and get short-term balance in hiring new, less-expensive teachers." governor, knowing what you know now, having been through what you've been through in wisconsin, won't this mean for years to come, a deeply suspicious, antagonized teacher workforce? >> no, i think in the end, september 1st was a key date for us. september 1, my two sons go to public high school in state of wisconsin, went back to school just like kids did all across our state. in the end, what people saw in our schools was in the most part, they were the same or better. >> the same or better? the author of that letter joins us now.

heather dubois bunon. what's your response to governor walker's answer right there? the same or better after cutting $1.6 billion from the budget? >> i'd agree that our schools are the same or better because our teachers are the same, and just as good as they always have been. dedicated to the students, dedicated to the education system of wisconsin, and unlike our governor, actually engaged in the act of education. what is not the same or better, however, is the state of education in wisconsin. and the budgets with which the teachers are forced to negotiate a new way of approaching the struggles they have to face in the classroom every day. therefore, facing all kinds of cuts across the board and walker's refusal to acknowledge those is just disgusting. >> is he trying to abolish public education in wisconsin? >> i don't think he's trying to abolish it entirely.

but i think that he is definitely trying to disinvest in it at the expense of the majority of our students as he invests extremely heavily in private and charter schools. >> how in the world can you make $1.6 billion in cuts and expect to have the same product? how can the people of wisconsin expect to have the same public school system? >> you can't. it's not going to happen, ed. making these kind of cuts forces the school districts to compromise so many things in so many ways. and the costs of this on our kids will be seen for a generation to come. >> he says that they gave school districts the tools for reform. what is that code for? >> tools is walker's code for cuts. he talks about tools and he talks about jobs. scott walker is a tool job. someone who talks about both

things all the time and produces neither. >> will he get recalled, in your opinion? >> he'll definitely be recalled. and as soon as possible. i think that he does not have the support of the people of this state. and after writing to him myself for so many months and being ignored and seeing the shocked look on his face as mr. williams kindly read him the letter that i wrote, just goes to show he's not really interested in hearing from his constituents. if your boss sends you an e-mail and you don't reply, your boss sends you 50 e-mails and you still don't reply, you're fired. scott walker works for us and he's not doing your job. >> thank you for joining us tonight, i appreciate it very. coming up, o'reilly gives a history lesson and gets it wrong. so, how was school today ?

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>> oh, poor bill o'reilly, he's still whining about his taxes and he's now attempting to rewrite history to help his cause. here's a dandy for you. o'reilly wants president obama to follow president kennedy's example by lowering taxes for the mega wealthy. o'reilly's point is misleading. economic conditions were much different back then. there was little debt because president eisenhower kept taxes high. republicans used to approach this whole tax thing much differently. when kennedy came along, he lowered the top tax from 91% to 65%. today the top marginal rate is at a historic low of 35%.

the warren buffett rule would raise the top rate to clinton-era levels. it would also probably raise capital gains taxes. that's taxes on investment income. in one of his rants last week, o'reilly brought up his opposition to raising capital gains taxes. >> now you want to up the ante on my winnings. but you don't say how much because the stock market will go nuts if you do. with all due respect, the tax the rich deal is bogus. >> turns out o'reilly already negotiated a hike in his capital gains taxes three years ago with a guy named barack obama. >> listen. if you raise the cap gains tax that's going to inhibit investment. i won't buy as many stocks and many more people won't. >> if we went up to a prohibitive rate you're right but look -- >> i'm not going with those odds. >> let's say i go up to 20. >> 20's okay. not 25. >> you and i agree.

>> then o'reilly was willing to pay 5% more on his capital gapes taxes in 2008. now he's crying about having to pay his fair share. i thought you in a no spin zone. joining me, eric boehlert. that clip of him agreeing to a tax increase doesn't look good for old bill o'reilly, does it. >> no, last week he was saying if obama raises taxes he was going to quit his show, which created this outpouring of good will among liberals everywhere who were hoping it would be a win-win. this week he's saying kennedy -- more recently saying do what kennedy did. he moved it from 90 to 60. how is that going to help him? >> flip by the big guy. >> flips all over the place. the idea that we're having bill o'reilly as the face of the public tax debate in the united states, he's representing conservatives, the media elite who makes $10 million a year, he's going to represent the common man, kind of comical. >> is he and that network on a

mission to sell america that a tax increase for the wealthy would be a terrible idea? >> oh, yeah, absolutely. they worship at the altar of big business. it's beyond that, they worship at the altar of millionaires now. it's not the old conservative philosophy of big business. what's good for gm is good for main street. it's much more radical now. >> roger ailes admitted, every other network has given their shows to liberals, we are the balance. fox news has gone from fair and balanced to we are the balanced. >> he's saying, we are part of the mainstream. if fox news embarrassing the birder movement which it did is mainstream, i guess they're viewing things from the john birch society. he's trying to spin it saying, we're pulling back, we're going to be more mainstream now. >> o'reilly said he'd pack it in if the taxes go up. >> that's right. >> is it showmanship or is he thinking about getting out of it?

>> we can only hope. >> the bush tax cuts are going to expire at the end of 2012. so willow riley be on the air in 2013? he'll be hit with that. >> he'll just flip-flop. he's never going to walk away. the idea if his taxes went up, he'd quit, that's fantastic. >> on one hand he used to be for it. now he's against it. >> that's right. >> i wonder what happened to him. anything happen that might have changed his position on that? >> just doing the usual spin, i think. >> eric boehlert, media matters, good to have you with us tonight. that's "the ed show." take me to your leader. let's play "hardball."