we start with news out of sanford, florida. reaction pouring in after we learned moments ago there will be no grand jury hearing tomorrow in the case of trayvon martin. the office of the special prosecutor, angela corey, issued the statement saying the investigation is ongoing but without offering any information on what that may mean for george zimmerman, the man who shot and killed the teenager in february. in response, trayvon martin's parents released a statement through their lawyer which read in part, the family has been patient throughout this process and asks that those who support them do the same during this very important investigation. what this latest development means about a possible arrest is not known. however, two weeks ago, corey told the "miami herald," quote, i always lean toward moving forward without needing the grand jury in a case like this. and as my colleague al sharpton put it moments ago, we remain

cautiously optimistic this will lead to an arrest. for more, we turn to kerry sanders who is in sanford. good afternoon. does this decision to cancel the grand jury mean the special prosecutor may have come to a clear decision on how to proceed with this case? >> reporter: i think so. and it is a gutsy move. had she gone to the grand jury, she would have political cover. while the special prosecutor was pointed by the governor, essentially she is an elected official in duval county, in jacksonville, where she is a state attorney. one-third of that communal is african-american so she must have that in the back of her mind even though prosecutors are supposed to divorce themselves of the external politics of an event taking place. taking on this on her own indicates to me that the investigation that she has had completed, not only by herself but with the fdla. the florida department law enforcement.

that the evidence they have gathered was conclusive enough for her to reach this conclusion of whether there will be charges or whether there won't be charges without going to a grand jury. now that doesn't mean that she has made a final decision. it doesn't mean she will announce something tomorrow or wednesday. it just means that she has decided that she is going to make this decision on her own and it will stick with her, whatever that decision is. >> so kerry, what expectation in terms of a decision. you say not tomorrow. are we talking about a matter of days, weeks? >> reporter: well, it could be tomorrow. i'm trying to sort of tamp down expectations that this moves so quickly. it could be tomorrow. i don't think it will be today because george zimmerman's attorneys are not in the state. they're currently traveling back to florida. so their return from the new york area means this is moving too quickly. at the end of the day, george

zimmerman and his attorneys have indicated to the special prosecutor that were there to be charges, they would turn george zimmerman in and so there would be a very polite kind of conversation that takes place between the defense attorneys, assuming they become defense attorneys. right now they're simply george zimmerman's attorneys, and the special prosecutor. so i would say that as things are developing, we are of course watching very closely as this all unfolds. but it could take days. >> and we should acknowledge that george zimmerman's lawyer, lawyers were actually on the "today" show, as you know. an nbc this morning. by our reading of florida law, no grand jury potentially means no charge of first-degree murder. is that correct? >> reporter: yeah, and i don't think first-degree murder here is ever part of this discussion. the reason is because that would have suggested that there was an

intent, a plan. if there were to be a charge, and i'm very cautious here. i don't want to suggest that there will be a charge. it may very well be that there is no charge. >> kerry, you are being cautious and that is very clear to our audience. i fully acknowledge that. >> reporter: okay. if we do a spread sheet, thank you for that if we do a spread sheet it could be something along the linings of let's say manslaughter. but there is a very difficult up-hill battle here for those on trayvon marntin's side. that is the stand your ground law. it is the prosecutor's job not just to essentially make a decision if she decides to charge somebody but to come to a decision if there are charges, a case that could be won in court before a jury. so all of that has to be considered as this is moving forward. >> nbc news's kerry sanders, insightful and cautious in sanford, florida. thank you.

for analysis of today's news, we turn to the reverend jesse jackson who joins us from south carolina. good afternoon, sir. >> to you, sir. >> one of zimmerman's lawyers told sean hannity last week and i'm quoting, we didn't have a seething town of civil unrest because of race relations. jesse jackson, al sharpton brought that to town and turned this into a racial event when it never, ever was one. i have to ask you, sir, are you responsible for turning this tragic shooting into a seething fight over race relations? >> no, we may be responsible for trying to keep it nonviolent and disciplined and focused. a homeless man was beaten nearly to death is that the beater walked away. all we really know is that

trayvon was held to be suspicious, followed, killed and the killer is still free. that is all that we really know. i hope that today, that this move by the special prosecutor means no delay. we don't know yet. >> no justice, no peace. what is justice, sir, in this case? even the united nations human rights commissioner has called for justice. but specifically a conviction on what charge would mean justice for trayvon's parents? >> well, an unarmed man was shot in cold blood. it was unnecessary. he should not have been held suspicious. he should not have been pursued. he should not have been killed. he was unarmed. that seems like first degree to me. but that's for the lawyers to finally decide. i hope that we put it in the

context of a very threatening move. since trayvon has been killed, 16 blacks have been killed by police or security officials. this is a very ugly climate. the he said center is sanford but we need intervention. not just the special prosecutor. and they must move and move now. >> isn't the problem that whatever the special prosecutor decides, so much of the evidence has been lost. we don't know if mr. zimmerman had alcohol and drugs in his body because he wasn't tested. we don't know if ballistics were assessed which might have revealed trayvon's position when he was shot. the police apparently completed their immediate investigation after just seven hours. even if this trial, if this case goes to trial, don't the police have to acknowledge some very serious failings? >> well, that's why it is difficult to even trust the

state prosecutor. because state law has given some room of latitude here in this on that and 24 and other states. i'm concerned that she moves with dispatch and not with delay. but we'll be waiting to see just what the charges are. we cannot rest until this state law, this incentive to engage in vigilanteism, that will require federal intervention, not just a special prosecutor locking up a guy. >> george zimmerman's defense team has been on television defending their client and yet also, ironically, complaining about people who are trying this case in public. for instance, here are his lawyers this morning on the "today" show. >> mr. zimmerman regret the, feel remorse for what that? he is remorseful fortune intended consequences that happened out of this incident. he believes it was justified but

he is distraught that a life was taken. >> let me start with you. when do you expect to meet with mr. zimmerman face to face? and are you getting closer to the point you think it would be beneficial -- >> was it the self-defense, was the use of force lawful. they're going back through the investigation. i think there are different forensic reports. different articles of evidence that they're going through. >> let me start with you. when do you expect to meet with mr. zimmerman face to face? and are you getting closer to the point where you think it would be beneficial -- >> i'm sorry for that repetition. might zil's attorneys wish that they had kept as quiet as their client? >> he says, that on the one hand, an unintended consequence but he felt justified. was it justified in profiling him? was he justified in dismissing the dispatcher's recommendation he not be followed?

was he dismissing it being armed when he should not have been armed? killing him and then walking away? that's an issue with mr. zimmerman's behavior, the police department's behavior and then of course the special prosecutor. i am concerned that the department of justice's role in this cannot be denied. whatever the state does, i hold with a degree of anxiety and distrust until they prove otherwise. after all, this is in effect, this behavior, this vigilanteism, it is state law. >> what effect do you think the special prosecutor's announcement today will have on the protests that have been taking place in sanford? even today, some of the protesters actually met with the special prosecutor, i understand. >> well, the protest will expand. you know, in this instance, trayvon martin, these racially

violent acts. he is the book cover. a whole bunch of pages are in this book. and this intensifying. i hope that the department of justice will convene a special meeting of leadership and look at the growing impact of these violent acts of executions. where someone assumes the authority to be judge and jury and take out these lives. again, 29 have been killed this year. 16 since trayvon martin. and then chicago, a case of a mr. morgan who was shot 28 times by police. four of them white police. and this past week. he was sentenced to 40 years because they say he shot at them. it is very smirky. but it is all over the country. i would hope all citizens of sanford are not racist. we should not get into that.

we should be nonviolent. we should be dismindy. but this case exposes something ugly in that department. >> reverend jesse jackson, thank you for joining us this afternoon. >> thank you, sir. next, the president of the united states, stupid? disrespect for the commander-in-chief. so hot right now. zap technology. arrival. with hertz gold plus rewards, you skip the counters, the lines, and the paperwork. zap. it's our fastest and easiest way to get you into your car. it's just another way you'll be traveling at the speed of hertz.

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it's back to politics after a holiday weekend. you may have been deciding between your home or the in-laws, ham, lamb or brisket, mitt romney was deciding between his multiple homes and the bigger question. long pants or short?

in the end, the republican front-runner braved the chilly waters in short pants. taking in a bit of boogie boarding this weekend near his $12 million la jolla home. yes, the one with its own lobbyist and plans for a car elevator. while mitt was enjoying some down time, his assumer pac support were readying the onslaught. super pac american cross roads founded in part by one karl rove, will begin to unleash its $200 million campaign against the president this month. while the ad blitz is just warming up, the republican rhetoric toward the president is hotter than ever. take republican senator chuck grassley tweeting this weekend. constituents asked why i am not outraged at preso attack on supreme court independents because american people are not stupid as this xprof.

that was senator grassley calling the president stupid. how about illinois congressman joe walsh calling on the president to distance himself from the muslim brotherhood. subtle as ever from mr. walsh. and not to be outdone, one congresswoman is even bringing bertha back. saying, i have doubts that it is really his birth certificate. and i think a lot of americans do. but they claim it is so we are just going to go with that. disrespect as discourse? welcome to the gop 2012. joining us now from washington is msnbc political analyst professor michael eric dyson. professor, if rick santorum complains about being subjected to mitt romney's attack ads, which he has kindly suspended while mr. santorum's child is in the hospital, how ugly is this likely to get when romney has

karl rove's american cross roads super pac behind him and he starts really going for the president? >> i think there is about to be a kind of verbal assault upon president obama the likes of which we didn't see the last time around. the intensity of which shall be quite ferocious and i think unfortunately, it will be bigoted. it will have racial sub texts. it will continue to present president obama as from another planet. and it will not regard the civil discourse that should prevail between competing candidates. after all, we're both americans. that is the president and his opponent should be able to say. >> if you believe some of them, some of them still don't believe he is an american. >> that's the point here. the doubt, the dismissal, the denial of his very citizenship. the rebirth of the birtherism. the failure to acknowledge the legitimacy to govern. all of this is a corrosive

attack upon the very basis of i think democracy in america. and for the purpose of winning an election, the republicans are willing to go to the ultimate extreme just to get their way. >> interestingly, you speak of republicans. many have been allowed to call the president the food stamp president. to hint at him being a minstrel when he sings the line of al green. his place of birth. the moment that one suggests this might possibly have a racial undertone, you're accused of race baiting. so i have to ask you, sir, are you race baiting when you seek to draw attention to these baseless and offensive attacks on the president? >> not at all. i think that white supremacy is unused to being call on the carpet. i think that people who engage in the unconscious reflex or the conscious intent to assert their position as neutral, because whiteness has been seen as universal. therefore, it is neutral. i'm calling that into question.

i have no lack. courage or intent in this regard. i have no lack of desire to call them on to the carpet so they can call me a race baiter if they want. the reality is anybody who call them into question. that's the thing i'm going to talk about you like you talk about me. everything you say bounces off me and sticks to you. the document than mainstream has been incapable of being held accountable. the moment we call attention to their racist practices, they then engage in the so-called race baiting when they've been dealing from the bottom of the deck the entire time. i think we should continue to point this out. no, i'm not being a race baiter. i'm calling attention to the vicious practices and the vitriolic denunciation of the president that have no other basis in anything except racial animus. you can cover it up with ideological dispute and republican resistance. >> or hatred for the supreme court. >> absolutely right. but at the end of the day, we

know what this is and we refuse to may your game. we're going to call out. you're engaging in subtle and sometimes very explicit discourse. we're going to call you on it. >> sir, i want to ask you a final question. these are difficult times. we've had a terrible shooting over the weekend in tulsa. we have other the killing of trayvon martin. the barely concealed racial attacks on the president. and then i want to draw your attention to the column for tacky magazine. that his former editor at the national review is described as nasty and indefensible. and where he says, and i'm quoting him. do not attend events likely to draw a lot of blacks. now, of course, none of these connected in any way. but we've just celebrated easter. are we not one nation under god? what does that mean when you read the kind of thing like derbyshire is writing. >> martin luther king used to say i go by the churches and see

what they're doing. they worship god and i wonder who their god is. they can claim oneness under god. the ridiculous expressions, not of openness and diversity. not of calling us altogether under the rubric of religion but it is did i have igd us. i think what we have to do is say that is not of god. it is the refusal to acknowledge the other person's humanity which is the mark of the anti-american i. it is unamerican. what the republicans are engaging in, the assumer pac will unleash $200 million of these ads. this stuff is just the most vicious expression of what we thought we had gone past. and all of the killings and the murders you've talked about. the refusal to treat the president with respectful this is of a piece. if this happens to a person like obama, the president of the united states of america, what happens to the average jill and joe? these people are subjected to

the most vicious form of racist belief and yet they don't have the government or the public to protect them them can't go on msnbc and defend themselves. and this is what i'm afraid of. it is the viciousness and the hinterland of america out there in the so-called center of this country where the most repugnant expressions of racism are there. so we have to continue to call them on to the carpet. >> thank you for defending those people. thank you as always. much more ahead. but first, mike wallace. we'll give him the final word. stay with us. >> he was doing what? with you. why? why? why? really? you demanded special treatment. you needed money. it is almost an embarrassment to hear this from you. what did they want you to do? why are you so reluctant? this at&t 4g network is fast.

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the president and first lady hosted the 134th annual easter egg roll at the white house. some 34,000 people from across the country showed up, this the largest public event held on the white house grounds. and nbc's kristen welker is live at the white house. i hope you got an easter egg on sunday. a lot of fun at the white house but moments ago, you asked jay carney about a same sex couple attending the annual event. specifically to set up a question about the president and a possible exectively order involving workplace discrimination? is that right? >> reporter: that's absolutely right, martin. a sim sex couple from new mexico them brought their 8-year-old daughter here for the easter egg roll. they had very serious agenda. they wanted to send a message to president obama to pressure him to sign an executive order that would ban workplace discrimination. particularly on the terms of sexual orientation.

they say that that executive order is just sitting on the president's desk, waiting to be signed. moments ago, i asked the white house press secretary about this executive order. i said will the president sign it. if so, when? he deflected the questions and said that he wouldn't comment on pending legislation. i pressed him on the issue. he wouldn't answer except to say the president is very happy to have this couple at the white house today and welcomes all of the lgbt couples here today and also, touted the president's point on such issues. having said that, the new mexico couple feels very strongly about this executive order. they've even co-opted the president's we can't wait term. and they said we can't wait for him to sign this executive order. we're still waiting for an answer. >> live at the white house, thank you. stay with us. the top lines are coming up. >> on easter sunday, it's good

to remember, if you can shadow -- if you can hide beneath the cross. there is nothing to be afraid of. this is a great campaign. we've had great experiences. some things work. >> it is very odd to me that someone would run up a half million dollars bill at a jewelry store. >> go talk to tiffany's. we're very frugal. we in fact live within our budget. we owe nothing. [ female announcer ] women have made it the number one selling anti-aging cream undeniably. it creamed unbelievably a $500 cream and now women have made regenerist microsculpting cream also unscented. women love it. in original and also fragrance-free. but when she got asthma, all i could do was worry ! specialists, lots of doctors, lots of advice...

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that's good morning, veggie style. hmmm. for half the calories plus veggie nutrition. could've had a v8. a fresh snl treatment for mitt. and no, newt, you won't be the nominee. here are our top lines, week recap. >> this week criticized

president obama saying he was out of touch will romney added the last time i saw someone that out of touch was when they wore it to a garden party. >> the ryan budget which mitt romney call marvelous ends up giving a tax break to the wealthiest people in america. my republican colleagues and congressman mitt romney are rooting for economic failure. >> it is the core of who i am. i can't remember a time when dungeons and dragons was not an important part of my life. >> just how many piercing do you have? >> we don't believe you! >> people would worry about you as president because of that. why? >> i have a great, great grandfather. he took additional wives as he was told to and i can't imagine anything more awful. >> how many blacks are there on your top campaign staff? >> i couldn't honestly answer you. >> is that. speaks for itself. >> on easter sunday.

>> i want to wish everybody a wonderful easter. my job is very simple. it is to introduce the one truly in charge as malia, sasha, and bo all know. >> if i end up -- >> i'm glad i did. this it turned out to be much harder than i thought. ? i'm going to be the nominee. i'm going to be the nominee. i hit him as hard as i can. i'm going to be the nominee. if mitt romney ends up as the republican nominee, i will work as hard for him as i would for myself. >> please define yourself using one word only. >> cheerful. >> let's get straight to our panel. in washington, karen finney, columnist for the hill and former communications director as well as political analyst. ken vogel, the chief reporter for politico and professor james peterson at lee high university.

i want to show you a photograph of mitt romney over the weekend with his son in la jolla. is that enough to woo female voters? or is this just another example of how wealth affects health? because mr. romney has no shortage of money. >> well, you know, i have to say neither picture probably hurts either one of them. they both lookage, to be honest. mitt romney was smart enough in that picture to realize that maybe he shouldn't bare his chest. so he has a body suit on. that was a smart decision. more decisions like, that he might end up actually doing much better in the election than we colonelly think he will. >> specifically, will that help him with women? >> i think it would be more likely to help him with younger voters than women voters. really, if you're going to try to turn on the women voters, you would probably go for the picture of obama. he is looking pretty hot.

and if you're young, you're thinking it is pretty cool that the guy can hang ten. >> okay, karen. mitt romney has to undo the damage brought during this nasty gop contest. or i want to suggest to you, does he just keep doing the same? or this time it's paid for by karl rove and it's targeted by the president. >> no doubt the romney campaign will rely on heavily on these outside groups including the ones funded or conceived, and funded with assistance from karl rove and ed gillespie. those groups, cross roads and cross roads gps are expected to spend $300 million mostly on hard hitting ads on president obama. that does allow mitt romney to pivot to the general election stout is part of it. an effort to humanize him. we saw additional efforts along

those lines with ann romney, his wife, fairating this video that talks about their days back at home when their children were young. that's an effort to reex out to voters who might have only seen him during this time. >> he is on the coast of a place where he lives in la jolla where he owns a $12 million mansion. i mean, is that really pivoting? i'm just asking. stop laughing. >> it's a good point. and he is out on the beach. people can identify with that. you have the picture released of him painting easter eggs. you raise a fundamental stumbling block that he will have to clear if he will be able to identify with swing voters and the voters who thus far probably have a pretty narrow perception of him. that is not going down to his benefit. >> professor peterson, american cross roads, a republican super pac, has around $200 million to spend. and ed gillespie has now joined

up with the romney campaign. so does romney in effect now have the bush hit team on his side ready to go after the president? >> well, he does. and i think you'll see other republican entities consolidating and working to support mr. romney. although we all know that a lot of republican strategists don't think there is a way for mr. romney to win, they will make a good showing and all the resources they have at their disposal, they will use to try to attack the president and show the president's record is somehow not what it is. >> karen, i have to mention night gingrich to you. >> why? >> he is beginning to draw my sympathy for the sorry state of his campaign. >> you're not sim that aies 32ing with him. >> i am trying to. he is carrying close to $5 million in debt. he admits that romney has bested him. there there be enough takers of his $50 photograph to help with his debts? >> i don't think so. i don't know that most folks would pay a dollar. sorry, mr. gingrich.

what will be interesting is the more we learn about some of these holdings and some of these other organizations like the one that filed for bankruptcy last week. a little bit of sort of three card monty in terms of the accounting practices that mr. gingrich may have participated in. i think that will be the most interesting piece on that. >> i wonder how much longer he'll be cheerful for? karen finny, ken vogue and he will mr. peterson. thank you for joining us. next from damascus to tehran to pyongyang.

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syrians fleeing the violence. despite u.n. efforts to broker a cease fire, the syrian opposition says government troops killed over 150 people in relentless shelling, and even summary executions over just the last two days. the turkish government has summoned the syrian envoy to explain the shelling across the border. michael o'hanlon is the director and co-author of bending history. barack obama's foreign policy. good afternoon, mike. tomorrow is the deadline for a syrian cease fire. but just moments ago, the u.s. state department said it sees no indication that will happen. even dismissing syrian demands that rebels laid down their weapons. does this doom any chance of peace? or at least a break in this appalling killing that's going on? >> martin, i think the best way to understand assad is that he wants to hold on to power. the question is what does he see is the greatest threat to power?

in the short material, it is clearly the insurgency. and he feels he has to defeat it militarily and it is just that simple in his mind. however, we have some hope because over the medium to long term, the sanctions that we've orchestrated against him could threaten his regime, too. if he has no more money, no way to pay off his cronies, over time, that could become a threat as well. he would like to finesse this. he would like to use just enough force to put down the insurgency, get some kind of a peace deal that obviously keep him in the presidency but maybe at least make some symbolic or minor substantive gestures toward the insurgency and then have the sanctions pressure alleviated. hs his goaltend. i'm pretty sure. in the short material, he will keep using forceful. >> do you regard kofi annan's gesture, do you think that was pointless? >> no. because i don't think there is

any good military option. and i don't think we have any quick and easy way to handle this with some kind of a libya-style intervention which means we are choosing between bad and worst outcomes. and if we can shorten this don conflict even by a few months and prevent syria from becoming the next iraq of 2003 through 2007, that will be mitigated, i don't want to say success but at least a mitigated failure compared to what might have been otherwise been. that's the only game that we realistically can play. >> to rariran, talks that are s to begin in istanbul. do you expect iran will negotiate in good faith and is that second aircraft carrier designed to send a message to tehran? >> well, the same kind of analysis i would use here. i don't think iran is going to cry uncle. i don't think they're going to give up any and all nuclear aspirations.

but if the sanctions bite hard enough, and i think they're starting to do so. iran may decide that a pause in its nuclear pursuits may be something it can live with. so it gets to hold on to most of its uranium that it has already enriched. none of which is believed to be bomb grade. it has to accept some limits on how much more it enriches and it lives with that outcome for two, three, four, five years. i can see iran doing that as a way to try to have its cake and eat i too. i don't predict that. i think the chances are against that kind of a happy outcome and it is not a perfect outcome for us even if it occurs. >> if i may stretch your fine knowledge in these areas to north korea where richard he kn know, richard engel. they say it is only for launching a satellite. the white house today called the launch, and i'm quoting the white house, a very provocative act. should we expect a nuclear test

soon after this rocket goes up, mike? >> you know, that has been an interesting line of discussion lately. i would still be surprised by it. there are things you can do in this international system that are bad and others that are much worse. the world came down pretty hard on north korea when it tested nuclear weapons and even china had to go along with tougher economic sanctions. a missile test, they can try to say it is just a civilian thing or it is our rocket launch rights or a satellite operation. even if none of that is really allowable under u.n. security resolutions. nonetheless, north korea can claim some kind of been he have len or benign purpose but they can't do that with a nuclear test and they are likely to suffer more of a consequence. i would bet against it. with the north korean regime, you can never be sure. >> we're grateful for your expertise. thank you. coming up, conservatives whine when the president points

out the obvious. first, the market wrap. good afternoon. >> good afternoon as well. investors may be none too happy. the dow jones industrial average is down triple digits. we tried to make a comeback. it did not work. this would be our fourth straight down day. what you have is a hangover for the jobs report that came out on friday that disappointed investors. the market was closed on friday in the rare times that has happened. so we are digesting that today. the dow s&p and the nasdaq are all lower. maybe the only good news that oil is also off a bit. maybe providing a little relief at the gas pump. we'll have more with martin bashir after this. [ male announcer ] if you believe the mayan calendar, on december 21st polar shifts will reverse the earth's gravitational pull and hurtle us all into space. which would render retirement planning unnecessary. but say the sun rises on december 22nd, and you still need to retire. td ameritrade's investment consultants

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with the future of health care reform in the hands of the supreme court, it may not have been surprising that president obama would speak out in its defense. unless, of course, you are a republican, in which case you

were shocked, really shocked, to hear the president make this remark. >> ultimately, i'm confident that the supreme court will not take what would be an unprecedented, extraordinary step of overturning a law that was passed by a strong majority of a democratically elected congress. >> jonathan tully is a law professor at a university. how are you, sir? >> good. how you doing? >> good wech. we saw senator grassley tweet this weekend that american people are not as stupid as the president -- his word -- but he says conservatives are not accustomed on being on the defensive. they have long experience of attacking the evils of the left and abuses of activist judges. they expect their progressive opponents to be wimpy and

apologetic. is that what's happening here? >> i'm not too sure that is what's happening. the president clearly does have a perfect right to express his views about how the case should turn out. i actually think he crossed the line a little bit when he suggested that it would be judicial activism to vote against the health care law. there are ample reasons to vote against the law. there were questions raised in this argument, and you don't have to be a judicial activist to feel the law crosses the line. there are good faith arguments on both sides. but i do think the reaction of a lower court judge in requiring the administration to submit a three-page letter was also over the line. that judge was in perfect right to demand from the department of justice a meaning of what the president said, but i think the judge went too far. you know, the fact is, every law

that is found to be unconstitutional would pass by the democratic process. the constitution is designed, in many ways, to limit the will of the majority when that will is abusive or crosses those constitutional lines. so i think that, frankly, both sides of this argument is taking it a bit too far. i would have preferred the president to use different language, because i do think that he has to take the high road. i didn't think that suggesting judicial activism was the best thing to do, but i also believe the other side has gotten a little too far beyond what the president actually said. but, you know, martin, this goes back to the controversy of the state of the union when the president, i thought, was perfectly right to criticize the supreme court over its decision in sit zeecitizens united, and lito was shown saying, no, no, no. it just shows how the tensions have reached the supreme court

in a rarefied body. >> so when you see republicans objectify what they feel is the president's aggression, when i see him, he seems very measured and very modest in his criticism. >> i don't think the reaction was warranted. he goes on to sort of remind people about judicial activism, but i think that it had gotten far beyond what his words actually said. but i also think that the president should be careful. he is -- the government is a party in the case. i don't think these are helpful things when you're trying to get a fifth vote. justice kennedy, i don't know what oral argument he was watching, because i watched all three days, and it did not seem to me to be a lady pipe cinch that they're going to uphold the law.

on the contrary, many people thought he was leaning to the vote against the law. i was surprised at how confident he was, quite frankly. >> thank you very much for joining us. we shall wait and see. >> thank you, martin. >> we'll be right back. l reduces plaque and is clinically proven to help keep it from coming back. new crest pro-health clinical plaque control toothpaste. and who ordered the yummy cereal? yummy. [ woman ] lower cholesterol. [ man 2 ] yummy. i got that wrong didn't i? [ male announcer ] want great taste and whole grain oats that can help lower cholesterol? honey nut cheerios.

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thanks for joining us, but don't move because dylan ratigan is next. dylan, what do you got? >> everybody is all worked up, martin, about the renaissance. it's an event that can happen at any time. it's marked by a global, harmonic convergence that moves twar toward the pursuit of answers and solutions and away from the pursuit of fighting and persecution of power at the expense of all human beings. i think we're actually setting ourselves up. i don't know how much worse it will get, but i have an increasing number of people that i continue to meet that point in the direction of the renaissance. you're a renan