joining me today, politico's ben white. jody cantor of "the new york times," former national communications director for the santorum campaign and the huffington post's "sam stein. the 2012 campaign may have just jumped the shark. >> i'll be happy to take him to a water ski course. we have different skills and different interests and different hobbies. >> mitt romney spoke yesterday about what may be his inner fonzi. >> people are going to get to know me better. anne says there is a wild and crazy guy locked up inside mtv. now and then i let him out. >> his comments came after "the washington post" released a story about romney's role in an alleged bullying incident in high school. friends of romney say he led the charge to pin down and cut the

hair of a younger student who was, teased for nonconforming." >> the portrayal of john is factually incorrect." sam, let's talk about this "the washington post" story. we know there's been back and forth about the timing of its publication. "the post" held it so that it wouldn't come immediately on the heels of the president's announcement about gay marriage, but has come during the same week. it does not paint a favorable picture of mitt romney in high school. >> sure they are fair. this informs the public about who he was, what his upbringing was like, how he conducted himself. is it fair to say we should judge mitt romney now based on high school years? that is a different question. as for the timing of the piece, i don't think there is anything sinister to it. i believe a lot of things happen

to happen this week with respect to the gay marriage announcement and with respect to the publication of this story. there were rumors there was another outlet working on the same piece so they probably rushed it, which is why it wasn't on the front page of "the post" yesterday. all this stuff happens in the course of a presidential campaign. why would anyone in their right mind want to run for president? s it's crazy. >> jody, we were talking before the show started about whether you can extrapolate who someone is now based on who they were in high school. i thought it was interesting how the romney campaign reacted when it first came out. this is romney on fox talking about the allegations. >> i don't recall the incident myself, but i've seen the reports. i'm not going to argue with that. there is no question but that i did some stupid things when what is in high school. obviously, if i hurt anyone by virtue of that, i would be very sorry and apologize for it.

>> the romney campaign has been trying to recruit former classmates of mitt romney to come out and vouch for his character. what did you make of the response? >> what was surprising about his response is that his classmates whom my colleague parker and i talked to yesterday said that this was a searing incident. you would never forget it. they held this kid down and forcibly cut his hair. first of all, there is a question of does he remember it? in terms of what sam was saying about whether you can judge him now, i talked to a lot of voters in the last day who say they wouldn't necessarily judge him according to his high school behavior, but they might judge the response. there are people who wanted to hear mitt romney say, boy, you know, i did some terrible things when i was younger. they bothered me ever since. we all have something we really, really regret doing in high school. i have grown and i have changed. by the way, it's a different era. the word "gay", the word

"bullying" have totally different social meanings. >> there is a lot of head nodding when you were talking about character. i thought "new york" magazine had a great assessment. the story gives the sense of a man who lacks a natural sense of compassion for the weak. his prankery singled out the vulnerable, gay classmate, nearly-blind teacher, the gay day student racing back to campus. >> it's not about what he did in high school. we all did stupid things. i went to a prep school for a while. stuff like this happened. the point is, it's a question of his honesty and forthrightness and saying, okay this was an idiotic thing i did. i'm very sorry for how i hurt this kid. this is how i changed. this is how i would deal with these things now. no one is going to buy the fact he doesn't remember it. of course you remember it. you cannot hold a person down, forcibly cut their hair and forget it.

>> if you believe the story, the classmate said it terrified him and it was a scarring incident in his life. to the point of mitt romney, and you obviously have thoughts on mitt romney. i think the most detrimental thing is it reenforces this idea mitt romney fundamentally cannot connect with the human struggle. >> right. yes. that is exactly what the story does. it brings up so many bad things for mitt romney. it's crisis management 101. come out and apologize and admit to it and say i did horrible things as a child. i was in high school. it was a mistake. i've grown so much since then. bullying is a serious problem. the movie that just came out about it, this is a serious issue in this country. we should confront it. it has no place in our society. use it as a spring board to launch something, but don't say obviously i would apologize if i hurt somebody. >> i thought the most interesting part of the whole

episode was when mitt romney went on the fox radio show and started giggling and laughing about the whole thing, of course we did something. that was creepy and insensitive. maybe he was trying to move beyond the whole episode and laughing it off was the first instinct in his body. it did strike a weird tone. bullying is still a problem. it wasn't all that long ago we were running specials on tv how gay teens were committing suicide because of bullying. obviously, it's a different generation. it still is a huge problem. it deserves a national conversation. >> again, it's one of these opportunities that mitt romney has to plant a flag in the ground and say this is wrong. i'm standing up against it. i think you're right. attitudes in the 1960s were radically different than they are now. bullying is a problem in the 21st century. the president has an

anti-bullying ads. this is an example of one. >> i don't know what it's like to be picked on for being gay, but i do know what it's like to grow up feeling like you don't belong. it's tough. when you're teased or bullied, it can seem like you brought it on yourself for being different or not fitting in with everybody else. what i want to say is this. you are not alone. >> that's part of the "it gets better" campaign. you want this to be handled by the romney campaign. should it become a democratic talking point? it has. this is a new ad from american bridge talking about it called "mitt gets worse." >> they say that you and a couple of friends cut his hair. pinned him down and cut his hair. do you remember any of this? >> you know, i don't remember that instant department.

>> and there you have it. >> i think the obama campaign is so fortunate this came out when it did. if it hadn't, we would be sitting here talking about the risks the president took with announcing his support for gay marriage and potential downside. instead they have drawn exactly the contrast they want to draw, which is that the president looks like a nice guy. he looks inclusive and politicalically courageous for taking a risk. mitt romney is an artifact of another era. he's backwards looking and by the way, he's not that nice of a guy. >> and cruel. that laugh, to your point, sam. >> to romney's credit, everything we read about him in his professional life, in his business life at bain suggested he was tolerant of gay people. this rick granel thing -- well,

he has been semi tolerant in his business and life. >> i think part of what's interesting are the cartoon characters we are dealing with here. in my mitt romney reporting, there are arrows, his life, his business, school career, his dealings at bayne. people say this was a genuinely helpful guy. there was a true niceness about him. he was incredibly eager to help people. when you talk to members of the church there are astounding acts of generosity. >> we talked about this. much of his kindness centered around the church. that's one thing he proved uncomfortable in terms of talking. it's a very uncomfortable subject of him. i would think when you have this stuff coming up, it's something he would have to address and tell the american public about. >> joe biden versus george

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roughly $13,000 a second. the guest list included barbra streisand, billy crystal, jack black, robert downey jr and selma hayek. let's talk about the gay marriage issue and how that's played out for the white house. the beginning of the week it was not so good for the president and the white house. the tide seems to have turned quite quickly and ending at a star-studded fund-raiser where hollywood made it rain -- i don't think they made it rain, but made it rain for the president. >> after years of calculated strategy and incremental statements and the obama people carefully thinking about creeping forward on this issue, this week became a wild tumble of action. it actually spilled out in this almost spontaneous way.

we don't know what the real answer is. things are changing so fast with our country's attitude toward gay marriage, we don't know how this will affect the vote in november. we see risk for the president and certainly some game. the base loves this. the number of emotional "this is the president i elected" declarations this week were overwhelming. >> and the vice president re-elected, too. joe biden, good old joe apologizing for the joe bombs saying the president said to abc biden got a little bit over his skis, which is my favorite turn of phrase for what joe biden did out of generosity of spirit. apparently the president and vice president have discussed it and all is forgiven. >> the problem was biden, as vice president, you shouldn't get credit for a major policy announcement the way biden is getting for moving obama to

same-sex marriage. that is legitimate. they planned this evolution. >> it takes a long time. >> for it to all happen in three days is remarkable. one thing that struck me was jay carney on monday during his briefing got 50 questions on one topic, gay marriage. that is the most questions in one day on one topic. they couldn't deal with it. they had to move. that is what happened. biden was largely responsible for that. i think the apology gets to the fact they were not happy. >> it's funny joe biden is apologizing for what turns out to be one of the best weeks the president had in a long time. sorry, boss, i helped you out with this. we know a little how it's going to play out. republicans are by a slim marge opposed to gay marriage. democrats are very much for it. independents break for it. i don't think there is political downside. maybe there is some.

a little he could peel off there. largely, it's a positive for him. the country is moving in this direction. he's out in front of it in a way they didn't plan how to do it. it works out to his benefit. >> this is a big question how social issues affect the vote in november. the president is in nevada today which has been hit very hard by the housing crisis. it's the number one on the state with the highest unemployment in the country. washout county in reno, nevada, who can handle the economy well? romney is getting 61% of the sample poll said that romney would be good on the economy. 33% said he would be poor. as far as the president, 52% said he would be good, 44% said he would be poor. they are handing it to romney on the economy there. whether social issues can swing them further into the president's camp. >> i don't know.

i don't know how much this affects this race, the social issues at this point. obviously, the base was excited about obama's evolution, the right was not. that's not changed. nothing changed since he made the statement on either side. if you weren't going to vote for him before, you're still not. with regards to romney and this race as a whole, what is so interesting, judge just even from the last cycle, everything is happening so quickly and so fast, and having been out on the campaign trail. from 9:00 a.m. to 5:00 p.m., the issue of the day will change three, four or five times. this is a hugely popular week for the president and for the vice president. it's going to change tomorrow. it's going to keep going back and forth. >> there is a reason when obama made his announcement he said he wanted to leave the issue to the states and explicitly said he didn't want to intervene when it

came to religious institutions and what they did. they recognize there are problems with this. it could be north carolina, could be virginia, could be ohio. on the flip side there was a great poll number where the majority of people who are opposed to same-sex marriage to begin with assumed the president supported it already. who knows how it plays out? i think it's fair to say the president's political advisors are nervous about having to move like this at this juncture. >> that's why they are doing an event on the economy. they are helping people refinance. there are low rates but nobody can take advantage of them. >> a "the washington post"/abc news poll asks to grade the economic stimulus, favorable 47%. unfavorable 48%. auto bailout, financial regulation, favorable 49%, unfavorable 44%.

it's a toss-up. he's not getting above 50% on any of these major pieces of legislation that deal with the economy. >> if i can predict one thing, i think we are going to begin to see the obama campaign tear into mitt romney's argument about the economy because his campaign really only has one central argument to the american people. if you elect me, the economy will get better. that's a big leap of faith for people to make. we know presidents don't control entirely what happens with the economy. if the obama campaign can dismantle that central argument, i think they will have done themselves a big favor. >> they'll jump on comments like i can bring 500,000 jobs a month to this economy. this economy created maybe 10 times in the last 25 years. that doesn't give him credibility on the issue how are you going to increase job creation. his answer is i'm going to cut taxes and reduce regulations. that sounds good. dig into what his policies would do. there is an argument the obama

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>> it's a train wreck. it's sad. i can't stop watching because of it. on the one hand, i think we can sit back and say why is this consuming so much legal attention because of all things to prosecute, it seems this man's been through the wringer, he paid a lot of money. he is remorseful, shamed to no end. i think he had a 2% favorability rating in one poll. it's an amazing story and gets to like how egotistical these politicians can get. >> they are fake, they are not who they say they are. they have secret lives we don't understand. they are not scrupulous in personal dealings, using money in potentially dishonest ways. >> if you wrote the script, you would laugh, it's too cliche to be taken seriously, yet it happened. >> the star performer rielle hunter has been asked.

the fact she may have to take the witness stand will increase the media scrutiny and attention to this. i don't know. is honorability a thing of the past? >> not in the south. >> this is happening in the south. >> south carolina it's different. >> this has been happening forever with politicians on both sides. it brings all the fears out. you're giving money to these people every day. you want them to champion your causes. then you find out something like this is going on. it's so sad. it's so demoralizing. it's a horrible thing or him and his family, but horrible for the country. it looks terrible. >> horrible for the child growing up in the shadows of this. >> jpmorgan's chief executive

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what do you make of this situation with jamie dimon and chase, $2 billion in losses? we talk about whether banks have quote/unquote learned their lessons here. doesn't this hold every stereotype that these guys want to play fast and loose no matter what? >> it may well. i don't know the details of the trade. we are in the midst of pitch battle right now in washington to figure out what dined of reregulation we can do. people talk about principles. unregulated markets always crashed. always produce masses losses on risky bets. if this was something that wasn't a legitimate hedge, it was more like a momentum trade, this is the kind of thing that can happen. we need rules in place to ensure that everyone understands what the rules are. i personally don't think you should be able to hedge a position you don't have. i don't think -- if you want to place a bet, we have places for that. they are called casinos.

that is not something we should do in markets open to the public. this calls attention to the fact complex, derivative transactions can be tremendously risky. you can lose a ton of money in a short period of time. this may have been a propriety trade, money lost by jpmorgan itself but points to the need for substantial re-regulation of markets that were recklessly deregulated over the last 15 years and fits onto the volcker rule of derivative training. it does reenforce the public sense that there is not an adequate system of regulation. there is not adequate accountability. >> even here where you have the volcker rule which may have prevented something like this from happening, jamie dimon pushing back saying this doesn't violate the volcker rule but violates the dimon principle. >> jpmorgan is not going to report a quarterly loss based on this. they took a bad trade. they took a trade on corporate

credit default swaps that was not wise. may lead to a couple of million ultimately. it's not going to cause a quarterly loss. isn't this what wall street does? they some time make money, sometimes lose money? >> it points out how in the global ecology of the contemporary markets we are all in the same markets. if you can lose that much money that quickly in one set of positions, you don't want to be in a situation where you have money in a financial institution and they can lose so much money so fast your investments are at risk. the volcker rule is supposed to separate propriety trading from investing our money. we don't have the completed volcker rule done. drafts are filled with loopholes that lobbyists are getting in there we need a simple set of rules. you can't play by the same set of rules if no one knows what they are. as the public demonstrated, still has not come back into the markets with the level of confidence we want.

they are not reinvesting because they have a sense it's not just a casino, it's a rigged casino and there are people with more information than they do and people engaged in transactions they don't understand. >> when we talk about the future for regulation, is it a rosy picture? you would think this would lead to more public outcry. we were talking about public support for financial regulation. it's 50/50. you have candidates running for president saying we need to repeal regulation. there was a "daily news" op-ed that ran in april talking about your task force saying it was understaffed. there weren't enough resources. are you bullish that we can cure the systemic problems? >> there has been a lot of good propaganda over the last 20 years saying regulation just slows up the markets. it's unnecessary.

the only period in world history since the modern markets started up in the early 1700s was between 1929 and 1987. maybe you didn't make money quite as flamboyantly during that period. maybe you couldn't do a butterfly straddle on the commodities market. >> i don't know what that is. >> it's a good thing. don't get involved in one. you could make money and there was a set of rules and regulations. we have to get back to a simpler set of rules everyone understands. as far as our working group goes, that is a different issue. that's prosecuting and investigating and bringing civil lawsuits that led to misconduct that did violate the regulations in effect. >> isn't that why there is little trust in the system. there has been no accountability for what happened. your working group which was hailed as a big step forward for holding people accountable for mortgage crisis hasn't done anything yet. >> working group only started

getting set up in february. march we had numerous attacks appearing. the nonglamorous work of issuing subpoenas, reviewing documents -- >> you have a clock to work with. this administration may not be in office by next year. >> there are some statute of limitations issue. the statute stops running in exchange for not filing immediate charges. it's very important to have both accountability and an enforcement of the law and public confidence that the laws will be enforced. we had a combination of both. there was reckless deregulation that opened the door to things that shouldn't be legal. and in my view things that went beyond the line that have to be pursued. people have to be sued and people have to be prosecuted. that is what the working group is doing. it has the broadest set of agencies and jurisdiction that ever existed up to now.

s.e.c. department of justice. there are hud claims being brought. hud is part of the working group on fha origination. deutsche bank had to pay $200 million yesterday. the big investigations do take longer. there are people doing work, there will be announcements about staffing coming. >> are there going to be indictments coming down the pipeline in the next two months, two weeks? >> we never comment about that. >> not even a hint. attorney general eric schneiderman, you are doing hero's work, i say. >> thank you. >> my colleague chris hayes suggested you should resign to draw attention to the lack of resources being directed your way. we hope it does not come to that, sir. we hope that you are able to proceed with all the resources necessary. we will watch your work with bated breath. >> thank you very much.

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that can help lower cholesterol? honey nut cheerios. if we don't get our spending under control and don't get our deficit under control, the people who need government the most, the poor, the elderly, they are it's ones who get hurt the first and the worst. >> that was house budget committee chairman paul ryan yesterday defending his plan to slash billions of dollars from food stamps and meals on wheels to spare the defense department from budget cuts. >> we've been talking about mitt romney's record. this is an important moment in

terms of the american political landscape. this is the republican plan for the coming years, which is to say spare the defense department and balance the budget on the poor and the working class. >> right. they are pinning themselves into such an extreme corner here with budget votes. how do we not spare the defense department any cuts? it doesn't make sense. maybe you don't want the sequester cuts to go in all at once, a lot on defense. there is probably a sensible way to trim some of that. not at the expense of food stamps, meals on wheels. they are making democratic ads for the democrats. look at what we want to do. we want to get every b-1 bomber but your grandma on food stamps will not get her food. >> the opinion is evident and acute. house budget cuts would repeal block grants for meals on wheels and tighten eligibility for food

stamps at a time when americans are hurting. hogan, we are going to have an argument about the american social compact come november. we guess distracted and pay attention to scandals of the week, but ultimately if we are talking about the economy, budgets are moral documents. i do believe that. when it comes down to it, the republican vision for america really is predicated on this notion of makers versus takers. i think ruthless as presented by paul ryan and the house republican caucus. >> i don't know that it's ruthless but it might be emotionless. that's a problem for our side on this argument. we've got to explain to people better about what we are trying to do and what we are trying to accomplish. these programs aren't sustainable. you have to stop spending, cut taxes, all the things republicans want to do. you have to understand you will lose this pr battle and lose it

for years. it will be hung over everybody's head running for office and will be a horrible, horrible train wreck for our society if we continue down this road. it's got to be presented better than what we just heard. the brutal honesty there, that's good. we need brutal honesty. to not -- to say i'm not going to cut military budget? >> to hand $8 billion to the defense department, 20 million children would face food and nutrition support. >> the most important thing that the federal government does in my opinion, is defend the nation. that's very important. where do you -- is there a give-and-take in this conversation? it appears from the ryan budget there's not. that's something people have to talk about the weeks to come that will be a huge issue. >> i will quote to you from "the new york times," i can't quote it to you, jody because you are "the new york times." this bill along with the equally

inhumane overall 2013 budget written by representative paul ryan sos their seriousness in reducing the deficit and why they should keep control of the house in november. it does opposite of both accounts and serves as a reminder of their destructive priorities. how does this factor into the 2012 congressional races? judge it's immense. the notion that this is a document of shared sacrifice is a joke. people who don't sacrifice are those who sit in the pentagon, wealthy don't see their tax rates increase. they see them drop. we saw briefly when the house first passed the ryan budget last year there was an incredible uptick of anger back in home districts, protests, et cetera. the idea they are going to do it again after seeing that -- i'm not sure i understand what the strategy is behind using that evidence and saying let's go back into the breach. it doesn't make sense to me. >> what's interesting about this vote is the vote was 218-199, no democrats voted for it.

16 republicans voted against it. virginia republican frank wolf voted against it and told politico, "i am one who thinks you have to put everything on the table." alluding to perhaps tax increases. >> are you going to quote huffington post? >> i quote the huffington post and you. >> there are some republican moderates left in the world. there aren't many, but there are few. people will reward seriousness on debt reduction. we have annual deficits. we need to do something about that. what do you do about it? s how do you spread the pain? people are willing to sacrifice if it's fair and shared. if there are some tax increases on the wealthy, a little on the middle class has to happen. you cannot put all the money to the pentagon, cut social programs and expect voters to reward you for it. >> 16 republicans actually recognize that.

between the grover norquist anti-tax pledge and current state of affairs among republicans, it's shocking. >> my guess is more would have defected if they were led by boehner and cantor. this is a toxic document. i don't understand why they brought it for vote. what was the purpose to vote on this? they had voted for the budget control. the sequester that is supposed to hit is something all these republicans support. now they are saying, we don't actually support the defense. >> republicans i have spoken with have said, nobody liked that deal anyway. >> tough. you agree to it. >> true. a big announcement. a dubious claim and a hursuit inmate. [ male announcer ] the inspiring story

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churchill downs pales in comparison to the mess of the general election this week. marriage, megalomania and mullets. what just happened? >> move forward. >> move forward. >> move this country forward. >> off to the races. president obama officially launched his campaign, but his team stumbled right out of the gate. >> men marrying men, women marrying women and heterosexual, frankly, i don't see much of a distinction. >> i don't have an update to provide you on the president's position. >> do you believe same-sex men and women should be able to get legally married in the united states? >> yes, i do. >> as you now, said his views on this were evolving. he is saying i have nothing new for you on that. his position is what it was.

>> it's an unsettled picture. >> he's not authentic any more. this latest episode in regard to gay marriage is a great example of that. >> i don't have anything more to give to you. >> who the hell wrote this script? >> while the president finally showed his cards -- >> same-sex couples should get married. >> president of the united states in the 21st century. >> i don't favor civil union or gay marriage. >> that is heartbreaking. don't suck me in your gay world. >> former governor unveiled new buzz words. >> president obama chose to apply liberal ideas of the past. old school liberals, liberalism, liberals of liberalism. >> gop hit a credit crisis. >> claiming credit for killing osama bin laden. that's like giving ronald mcdonald credit for the big mac you had for lunch. >> the president tries to take credit for the fact oil reduction is up. i like to take credit for the

fact red sox went to the world series. >> all the ownership claims started sounding a little paranoid. >> somebody out there my whole life that doesn't like me is jealous. >> if i want to wear my glasses, i'm wearing my glasses. >> they were able to go off script. >> no one ever doubted i mean what i say, the problem is i sometimes say all that i mean. >> to describe their wildest dreams. >> who is more likely to run for president in 2016, you or secretary clinton? >> i think we may run as a team. i'm only joking, obviously. >> there is a lot of truth in humor, mr. vice president. >> what does it take to run on a ticket with joe biden? >> speak softly and carry a big stick. i promise you the president has a big stick. >> a big stick? check. >> either leaning on it or wielding it. >> an unlikely pair? maybe. if we learned anything so far,

when it comes to teammates, expect the unexpected. >> come on, baby. >> big laughs from sam stein, i like it. jodi, is joe biden going to have a big impact on this race or is he going to be held under lock and key after this week? >> no. they need him in this race. joe biden will have an impact the same reason he had an impact in 2008. part of the reason they chose him. great retail politician, connects really well with independent, working class voters. white ethnic groups. he'll be out in full force. >> he's highly entertaining. >> he's good value and blue collar joe. they need him in ohio and michigan. he connects with voters that aren't in the elite maybe obama can connect with. the george clooney types in california. >> you pivot into now we'll start focusing on joe biden. who is romney going to pick?

>> that is what i was going to ask you, mike huckabee? >> that would be an outstanding pick. everything mitt romney is not, mike huckabee is. he's been vetted, folks. he's done this before. >> surprise romney pick, keith judd, west virginiian? >> expect the unexpected. thanks to ben, jodi, hogan and sam. see you back here monday at noon eastern when i'm joined by matt taibbi and jimy williams. you can find us at facebook.com. "andrea mitchell reports? . "is next. happy friday. >> thanks so much. opposite ends of the rainbow. president obama cashes in at a hollywood fund-raiser. mitt romney heads to north carolina which just approved a constitutional ban on same-sex unions. mark leibovich, ruth marcus.

texting and close ties to downing street. mart martin basheer here all next. our pick city of the day, ann arbor, michigan. saturday a 40% chance of thunderstorms. sunday looks like a great day. not just in michigan. a great mother's day forecast in the northern plains and the east coast. the travel trouble spot down here in tennessee. [ indistinct conversations ]

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that should have been theirs. that's why at ally we have the raise your rate 2-year cd. you can get a one-time rate increase if our two-year rate goes up. if your bank makes you miss out, you need an ally. ally bank. no nonsense. just people sense. gay marriage. president obama raises a record $15 million at a hollywood bash. >> we should be able to give your kids the chance to do even better than you. no matter who we are, no matter where you come from, no matter what you look like, no matter what your last name. no matter who you love. [ applause ] >> meanwhile, should he remember? mitt romney on "the washington post's" bullying report. >> i don't recall the incident myself, but i've seen the reports