t there. - one serving of cheese is the size of four dice. one serving of cereal, a baseball. and one serving of fruit, a tennis ball. - you know, both parties agree. our kids can be healthier... the more you know. we asked why are you awake. producer john tower has your answers. >> i got mark, he writes, i'm up way too early because i had to satisfy a craving for a double steak burger with cheese. >> don't watch "cheech and chong" movies at 3:00 a.m. hope it was worth the drive. be careful. what else we got? >> we got kim, she writes, who is this? i'm up trying to figure out if this is barnicle with a face lift. >> oh kim. i'm much taller than barnicle. although we're both sort of like

angry irish guys. not a bad day. enjoyed it. i'm brian sullivan, catch my show on cnbc 2:00 eastern time, cheap plug, get paid somehow, not getting catch, watch my cnbc show we'll regale you with tales of the stock market. thanks for having me on, john, by the way. thanks for everything who watched. i'll be back tomorrow. you know what, i don't know if i can do the show this morning after what i just saw. >> that was an engelbert hummel impersonator on our show. >> of a new generation. >> goes down here. >> ask him to stop by on his way out. >> like him better with a tie. >> um -- >> showing a lot of chest hair. that's all i'm saying. >> disco. >> engelbert humperdinck or john travolta.

>> although italian porn, going to triple the -- >> thank you, brian sullivan, i think. not. >> good at what he does. >> good morning. monday, august 20th. >> go macon next time. >> i think that was like casual and sexy. >> i don't know if you knew it or not but he's tall. he will tell you, he is tall. >> with us on set national affairs editor for "new york" magazine and msnbc political analyst john heilemann, hello. msnbc and "time" magazine -- >> keep looking for the chest hair to come through -- >> senior analyst mark halperin and former "new york times" columnist now a distinguished fellow, my god, at the center for public policy and advocacy, bob, my god. >> bob, welcome back. >> great to be here. >> okay. so there are good days for brands and there are bad day for brands. >> okay. >> what would you say, mark hall perrin, is one of the

worst -- think of a brand, when did a brand hit a iceberg? can you think of like -- i don't know -- i guess the titanic, whoever built the titanic for that brand. >> it was a bad day. >> in 1912. >> for brand titanic. >> exactly. >> when the cars started blowing up, that was a bad day. for the pinto i guess it was. >> oh the tylenol thing. >> tylenol, not good. not good. >> new coke. >> new coke. >> toyota. >> toyota. exactly. the brakes -- >> start giving out? brakes don't work. >> the accelerator. >> yeah. >> right. and then you find out -- >> look. it's chesty. >> come on, man, wear a tie. he has a tie. he has a tie. >> what? >> he didn't wear it. >> cnbc, i have to sleep with a tie. >> do they charge you for like buttons? >> where's your tie? i brought one in. they said don't wear a tie. way too early for the tie.

>> notice joe has his top butnd. >> buttoned travolta. >> [ inaudible ]. >> we don't want to see any more than we have to. >> [ inaudible ]. >> thank you, brian. >> brian, that was great. >> that was awesome. look how tall. look how tall he is. >> try again tomorrow with clothes on, okay? >> you're like naked. >> just for you i'm going to wear a snuggie. >> i love it. >> thank you. >> oh, wow. >> he's tall. >> we start this morning, mika, with the story of a political brand. >> that's -- >> that's just not -- just -- >> they had a rough weekend. >>s. >> there's crisis management and crisis management and damage control. we're talking about the senate race, where in missouri republicans have been gearing up to unseat democratic incumbent claire mccaskill. >> that was supposed to be an easy thing. >> until now. >> claire down ten points, easy.

nothing to it. >> she was in jeopardy. >> gone. >> in trouble. msnbc, future contributor. >> yeah. >> i mean it was bad. >> it was bad. >> it was a bad outcome for her. >> yeah. >> until this morning the republican candidate representative todd akin, he's backing off from these comments he made in an interview yesterday when he was asked to explain his no exceptions policy on abortion. take a listen. >> abortion could be considered in a case of tubal pregnancy or something like that. what about in the case of rape? should it be legal or not. >> it seems to me, first of all, from what i understand interest doctors, that's rare, if it's a legitimate rape, the female body has ways to shut that whole thing down. let's assume maybe that didn't work or something, you know, i think there should be some punishment but it ought to be in the rapist and not attacking the child. >> oh, my lord. i mean you read it on the paper, mark halperin. >> oh, my god. >> oh, my god. >> what happened?

>> and then you see his lips move and those word comes out. >> it -- >> who thinks -- the thing is, yeah, he's a politician, who things that way? >> what doctors are he talking to? >> is it too late to throw mama from the train and have the new republican primary? >> today is the birthday of ben he bolt, president obama's press secretary, happy birthday, ben. >> happy birthday, ben. >> that is a gift that will have rever bragss beyond this -- that single race although that's an important senate race. republicans probably can't get the majority -- >> how do you back off from that? these comments drew an immediate response from senator claire mcskas kill. >> i bet. >> democratic opponent. >> saying thank you, first of all. secondly i'm keeping my townhouse in washington. she was very elegant. >> i'm going to be shocked and stunned and deeply saddened. >> here's her comment. it is beyond comprehension that someone can be so ignorant. >> that's a good word for it. >> about the emotional and physical trauma brought on by rape.

the ideas thatted to akin has expressed about the serious crime of rape and its impact on victims are offensive. congressman akin issued a statement admitting he misspoke, followed up on twitter to be clear all of us understand that rape can result in pregnancy and i have great empathy for all victims. i regret misspeaking. >> all right. you know, so john heilemann, i mean, it's shocking, but republicans keep doing this. republicans had delaware two years ago and they decided to go with a candidate who was clearly going to lose. they had a clean shot at nevada, and they clearly went with the most unelectable person, we had been warned by leading press reports that todd akin was the only candidate that would give claire mccaskill an opportunity at winning and here we are.

this is a republican party that does not want to win the majority. they do not want to win the majority. they want to keep shooting themselves in the foot. >> yeah. look, reminds you of the statement that rings in my head is the texas gubernatorial race where he was up by 20 points over ann richards and rape was like the weather you might as well relax and enjoy it, nothing you can do about it and quickly lost the 20-point lead and ann richards went on to win the race. it is the rule i think in republican primaries more or less that the most conservative candidate wins republican primaries. and -- >> with the exception of tommy thompson last week. there was a change. wisconsin voters decided they wanted to actually win. >> right. >> republicans decided in wisconsin. a shot of winning. >> and i don't want to say -- look, we have seen the tea party is -- proudly triumphant walking around saying you thought we had a big year in 2010, thought we were gone, now we're back. and this is, to some extent,

don't want to totally denigrate the tea party, the case as i said, generally in the republican primaries if you're a republican primary the most conservative candidate, as long as you have enough money to compete you win that race. >> i actually have moderate republicans that are big spenders, have driven me crazy. if i can get a conservative that is a small-government type, i'm happy. but there is a rule that we conservatives follow for a long time, the bill buckley rule, you elect the most electable conservative. the person who is the most conservative and who is electable, is the one you put on the ticket. that's the part of the equation that we're losing over the last three years and it's killing -- it's making harry reid the majority leader. >> that's exactly right. and the danger for the republican is conservatism is fine, no problem at all, this country is a moderate to

conservative country. i wish it was more liberal. >> right. >> the problem are these extremists on the right or the wackos on the right, and then you were talking at the top of the show about brand and the republican party is in danger of losing its brand. this is a country that does not -- >> hold on. you say that and there are people at home going he's a liberal, you know what, look at the polling numbers. you can look at every poll, bob, over the past three years. the republican brand has taken a serious, serious dent. >> yep. and the party, i don't know what the party can do, it needs to do something about that. the other thing is, as liberal as i am, i don't -- you do want a viable two-party system in this country. you want two robust parties that can go at it and then come together in the end to come up with some solutions. we don't have that right now? >> in response to akin's

comments the romney/ryan campaign released a statement reading governor romney and congressman ryan disagree with mr. akin's statement and a romney/ryan administration would not oppose abortion in instances of rape. >> mark, let me ask you, is that enough? is that what -- do they need to condemn it more harshly or is that enough? >> i think it's a surprisingly rapid and good first step. i think they'll probably both have to answer about it. love to see what happens with akin and other republicans. but that was a pretty clean for a sunday night, a pretty clean turn around to distance himself from it. >> so, when they ask mitt romney, is he going to go into his shell or go i think it's a stupid thing to say and he's apologized for it. let's move on. >> let's hope that that's -- he's as forceful as possible but there is, as you know, a problem for congressman ryan which is that he was a cosponsor with akin of a bill that is not -- of a bill to try to redefine rape in the view of the left or view

of many people in the center, too, where they said medicaid recipients would only be able to get money for abortions that fell under forcible rape. forcible rape itself is kind of -- this is i think what akin was trying to say, when he said legitimate rape. he's trying to refer to a bill he sponsored that tried to put a specific definition on forcible rape. many sane people would say all rape is forcible rape and there was a lot of outcry about that bill when it came out. they were spo co sponsors and happy birthday ben lebolt an issue that obama campaign is going to use going forward, regardless of what mitt romney says, they're going to be pointing out pretty aggressively paul ryan is very far to the right on a lot of cultural and social issues. >> paul ryan, does he believe in the exceptions or is he -- >> i believe he previously did not but the statement last night suggested like bill hunt and several others -- >> he will support the exceptions. he didn't support the exceptions. >> previously. >> he has been to the far to the right on abortion as you can be. >> wow. >> and the -- obviously the obama campaign has big lead with

women, especially professional women. >> well. >> and they are going to be pushing this hard. >> the war on women will be back. >> about to get bigger. >> you know, maybe if rick santorum could talk about this for a couple weeks -- maybe they could have as big a lead as democrats have with hispanics. >> two things about it. one is we all condemn what he said. there's a lot of politics here. what he said was ignorant and -- there's a political opening but we should be clear and condemn what he said as unacceptable. the democrats were planning to make abortion a huge issue, already have ads on television about abortion, and so this opens up a very tough terrain, not just for paul ryan but governor romney who doesn't want to be talking about this. >> bob, what this is, again, i'm a conservative, you're a liberal. >> right. >> i think we can both say this is what happens when people are tied up like by these stupid

ideological bonds. >> exactly. >> where they -- they're worried about -- am i going to be radical enough. there's so many times where democrats will say something and republicans on the other side will go what are they thinking? how could they be that stupid. they're playing to their base. and here akin is doing it. >> too ideological, is that y lose touch with the real world. >> yeah. >> this guy makes this statement and shows he has no conception of how horrible rape really is, the kind of -- >> what do you think this guy's wife said when he walked through the door that night? >> oh, my goodness. >> what do you think she said to him? >> i don't know. the kind of thing i wouldn't want to be hearing from my wife. i can tell you that. >> there's one other point here, another political point, one more issue that republicans don't want to be talking about. the republicans in my view ought to be talking about relentlessly the economy and jobs. boom boom boom. that is what the american people are concerned about and where obama is vulnerable. and now we have this array of

other issues that we're talking about and that's a problem. >> you know, another issue they should talk about. >> i know. >> israel. >> no. >> i'm serious. the republicans are on israel, you know, the president's got a low approval rating and i don't know if you knew this or not, but you know, a lot of republicans will actually -- >> travel there. >> take a pilgrimage, apec, very good. >> throw themselves into it. >> they -- they do. because we love israel. >> yes. >> we are -- >> they will just -- >> we're zionists and we have a zest for life. we republicans. >> yes, you do. >> we're marching to zion. beautiful zion. we're marching. i'm sorry. go ahead. >> maybe when you do that -- >> strip this story down. >> strip it down. >> the sea of galilee is a holy site where it's said in the bible that jesus walked on water. according to politico it's also the scene of a potentially embarrassing incident involving a group of freshmen u.s. congressmen, night of drinking

and dip in the sea. >> what are we doing? >> during a congressional fact finding mission. >> great. i don't know what facts you're trying to find. >> more than a dozen sources tell politico that about 20 people enjoyed a late night dip while fully clothed. >> can i have advil? anybody have advil? a long political season. karen, do you have advil? seriously, this is monday morning. it's not even 7:00 monday morning. >> republican congressmen kevin yoder of kansas dropped trough. took off all his clothes. >> kevin, what are you doing? >> here's what he does. >> what's he do? >> the statement is amazing. >> it's amazing. >> the statement is amazing. >> this is great. >> insane. >> i respect him for this statement. >> it reads -- >> it's so great. >> reads itself. >> todd akin faxed in suggestions. >> exactly. >> you know, ironically, this is one of these scenes where it's

like serendipity, be they were like siblgts there listening and the band vladimir putin through in jail was playing in the background. >> what are they called? >> i forget but we'll talk -- >> you can't say that on tv. >> big animal rights group. >> you can't. >> we'll leave that to "the new york post." >> "the new york times." >> so listen to putin now. >> i'm not saying it. >> i'm not saying it. >> i would be happy to say it. >> i know you would. i've already been ordered not to say it by somebody at home. >> after dinner, i followed some members of congress in a spontaneous and very brief dive into the sea and regretly -- >> the holy spirit was talking. >> jumped into the water without a swimsuit. it's my greatest honor to represent the people of kansas in congress and -- >> can you put that in past tense please. >> any embarrassment for my colleagues and constituents i apologize. >> the first draft of the statement had a line in it taken out that said, it was the manshevits talking. >> according to politico the fbi

briefly looked into the incident questioning a staffer to ensure there was no immore behavior. the article goes on to say -- i'm not surprised by this next section. >> i mean eric cantor, who is very close to apec and he's very -- of course he should reprimand him. >> i'm sure he did. >> he did. >> i'm sure he did. >> reprimanded the group next day saying they were distracted from the mission of the trip and -- >> just a tad bit. >> politico -- >> that's the thing about skinny dipping it does tend to distract. >> especially when you have the daughters of other members there. >> in the water with you. >> fully clothed. >> and she was fully clothed i know. not talking about her. talking about them partially disrobe org completely disrobing in front of the daughter of another congressman. >> oh, my goodness. >> classy. >> but counselor, here's the politico story doesn't answer why is the fbi interested. >> that is a good question. why is the fbi interested? >> i don't know.

>> they were drinking. >> i didn't understand. i mean is it -- could we have our -- >> pac research team. >> tell us. >> i was reading that going what's the federal offense here? stupidity. >> the kind of thing jay edgar would have been all over. >> there's a certain level of global stupidity that rises to a level of a crime, don't you think? >> maybe so. >> you think if any political event -- >> call michael isikoff at home and wake him up? >> i guess so. so, here is -- here is -- yet another republican story bang bang. >> yep. >> ryaeince priebus, call home. >> this is bad news. >> not a great sunday. >> so, what does mitt romney do on the campaign trail when he's asked about -- >> they're going to new hampshire. >> when he's asked about the sea of galilee thing. >> oh, god. he could really do well, actually. he could be human.

>> and akin and then they ask him to talk about the russian group that got thrown in jail. >> talking about -- >> the riot. >> the riot. >> meow. >> i will say you know exactly what george bush would say in this situation if he were candidate for president. >> what's that? >> do a sister soul party and my party needs to can its act up, isn't what we're about, talking about real thing. >> this is easy. >> george w. bush. >> yeah. >> exactly. >> the thing is -- this -- >> this is easy because it's kind of a joke story compared to the akin story and you don't have a running mate who has associations with the -- with these characters. if there's a problem, one of the problems that romney has by putting ryan on the ticket it does associate him more with a very unpopular branch of congress and a party, the public opinion polling on congress in general, congressional republicans is horrible. he's taken on water by being associated with them. he has a great chance to say these guys are a bunch of idiots. >> he doesn't do that.

bob herbert, that's one of my great frustrations with mitt romney is, you know, i said a couple years ago when glek glen beck was calling the president a racist who hates white people, want to run our party run our party and condemn this and move forward. look at the examples george w. bush set and barack obama set. george w. bush had the majority leader of the senate say something about strom thurmond and then backtracked but bush killed him. bush killed him immediately. said you're dead, get out of the way. with his actions. you knew it. it was over. barack obama throws anybody under the bus that gets in the way of his ambition. and sometimes he throws everybody under the bus. we can talk about reverend wright, we can talk about some personal things closer to the table here. but he throws people under the bus. immediately. mitt romney needs to do that today. >> one of the reasons it's been so easy for the obama

administration and democrats to define mitt romney is because romney does not get out there and clearly define himself. after all this time, much of the public has no idea what romney really believes in. he was a moderate governor of massachusetts now. he's running like a hard right candidate for president. and he is not taking these difficult stands. i agree with you completely. >> and the reason he doesn't, bob, is because he's afraid because he's not a true conservative. >> yep. >> a true conservative can say todd akin you're an idiot, sit down and shut up and we'll let you know when we want you to talk again. you're hurting the cause. you're going to help re-elect harry reid. shut up. mitt romney can't do that because he'll go what will the conservatives think of me. >> not a good conservative and he's not a good politician. he doesn't understand politics well enough. >> he needs to grind some people's political bones to dust today. he needs to kill those congressmen who were taking off

their clothes in the sea of galilee. >> that's the one. >> and go after akin. i need advil, ellen. i -- >> coming up -- >> some days it's tougher to be a conservative. >> just two or three, not 12. >> we'll talk to senator claire mccaskill. >> i'm very tall. >> about the race and maybe those controversial comments. also the secretary of the u.s. air force, michael donnelly will be here, editor of salon.com joan walsh and the editor and chief of "cosmopolitan" magazine kate white. mike allen takes us inside politico's ebook, "obama's last stand a chronicle of the president's erhee election team and a struggle to find -- >> apparently there is angst inside that campaign according to politico. >> there is angst. >> going with each other and yelling. >> tough -- >> sometimes they tear off their clothes and they jump into lake michigan naked. it's just awful. speaking of naked and jumping

into lake michigan who do we go to next? >> here's bill karins with a check on the forecast. >> i haven't gone skinny dipping in at least a month. >> oh. >> keep it -- >> and guess what, we know that. you know why we know that. >> why? >> you put it on facebook page. >> recognize your pool? >> see. that's what i love about him. okay. that's enough from you. read the weather. see i told you. >> good morning, everyone hope you enjoyed your weekend. things did change a little bit. you notice, temperatures for the most part were only about 70 to 75 throughout the big cities in the northeast. cloudy this morning, definitely greeted to almost a fall-like morning. the worst travel, we have rain moving through eastecarolina ra to fayetteville, some of the light rain towards virginia beach too. quiet monday morning. we're going to see temperatures on the coolish side from buffalo to albany. there's a slight chance of a shower new york city, philadelphia to d.c. and baltimore. but it's going to be more hit and miss variety late this

afternoon. middle of the country, another gorgeous day for you from st. louis to kansas city, minneapolis to chicago, still stormy in the southeast, florida will have some afternoon storms today. the big story over the weekend all those bad forest fires out in the west that continues to be very hot from phoenix northward. salt lake city up into idaho. starting off your monday morning here on "morning joe." nice start to new york city. kind of cloudy, kind of cool. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. [ male announcer ] when this hotel added aflac

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this is the plan that revolves around you. introducing share everything. unlimited talk. unlimited text. and a single pool of sharable data that powers up to 10 devices. the first plan of it's kind. share everything. only from verizon. add a smartphone for just $40 monthly access. 28 past the hour. time now to take a look at the morning papers. "the new york times" more than a dozen lawyers who took on big tobacco, i told you this would

happen, in the late '90s are setting their sights on the food industry. 25 cases have been filed against companies like pepsico, heinz and general mills, alleging food makers are misleading consumers by incorrectly labeling products and ingredients. >> lots of luck, fellas. >> it begins. >> whatever. >> you think that's a good thing? >> you know what, somebody should come up with a better solution, perhaps america ought to like help themselves become more aware. >> let them help themselves. >> they won't. >> keep the trial lawyers and bureaucrats out of the way. >> trust me. >> "the wall street journal" -- >> reading all the papers. >> disappointing returns, some of groupon's investors are giving up on the deal of the day since going public last november groupon has lost more than three quarters of its stock market value or roughly $10 billion. >> basically it facebooked, from the sea of galilee za get, the seattle times, an update on nasa's $2.5 billion mars rover

curiosity spent the weekend blowing up space rocks with a laser. in my backyard too. along with the martian countryside and just in case that wasn't impressive enough, the $2.5 billion science experiment is expected to begin moving its wheels for the first time in the coming days. >> "the boston globe" several airlines looking to boost profits by pushing cheaper seats closer together. >> come on, man. >> premium seating with more leg room will still be available but like in flight meals and checked baggage you'll have to pay for it. terrific. >> that's tough for us tall guys, isn't it, brian? >> "the los angeles times" mark david chapman, the man that shot john len mon -- i read this yesterday -- 32 years ago. >> wow. >> i am old. is scheduled to meet with the new york department of corrections board this week. chapman pleaded guilty to second-degree murder in 1981 and sentenced to 20 years to life in prison. this is chapman's seventh parole

meeting. hopefully seventh of about 17. with us now, the chief white house correspondent for politico, mike allen. he's here with this morning's playbook. i'm reading the screaming headline, mike. >> lots going on. >> i'm on the edge of my seat. the obama campaign royaled by conflict. i got your flash, i'm sitting there and, of course, we're watching my family we're all sitting around and we're -- >> flash. >> eating corn chips, and we're watching the wonderful world of disney and flash, comes the sea of galilee creaming headline. >> naked. >> from the bulletin, the bulletin. like walter cronkite, you know. guess he wouldn't break into the wonderful world of disney. breaking into the waltons on a saturday night. but you -- the sea of galilee thing, this is not good for the republican brand, is it? >> it's not. people calling it the gop gone wild and it's time when people don't trust congress, people don't like congress, and here we

have 20 lawmakers and aides showing terrible judgment in one of the most sensitive parts of the country. the leaders who were on the trip, the number two house republican eric cantor and number three house republican kevin mccarthy stepped away from this dinner, but underscoring the problem with it are the lame excuses that some of the members gave to our reporters john breshhan and jake sherman who called everyone who was on the trip that they possibly could. some said, this will probably make the sea of galilee gazette, some said they went in because of the religious significance. >> amen. >> of the waters. this goes with the -- >> after they had communion by drinking a lot of wine. >> right. little bigger cups than we have at redeemer arlington. some said they were hot and tired. >> yeah. >> some of the more honest and said we'd been drinking. >> you know, this is -- and mark

halperin, this is, you know, a lot of people hear this story and go oh, gosh, liberal media and democrats will jump up and down on this. mark halperin, this is so bad, for the republican party -- they talk about the republican brand yet it's been really hurt over the past five, ten years. the conservative brand still pretty darn good. 40% of americans tell gallup they're conservative, twice as much as say they're liberal and still conservatives out there who don't believe republicans think -- believe what they're saying. here you have a group of republicans, these freshmen, supposedly the most conservative, going to a sacred, religious site for evangelicals, this is the holy land, and basical basically -- i won't even say the word, messing all over this holy site, and that reverberates

from church to church, from pew to pew, family to family, preacher to preacher, and they -- you know what, because i know, these are people who voted for me and people i still talk to a lot. five, ten years, they're like these republicans i guess i'll vote for them, but they don't believe in anything. doesn't that compound this problem. >> you're making the case it's a bad idea? i'm i'm making the case this is more of an internal crisis than -- forget the news coverage. >> yeah. >> the republican -- and eric cantor knows this. you have to talk to republicans in synagogues and republicans in pen coastal churches, this is an internal problem. this isn't a media problem. this is a base problem. they have offended their base. for. >> for 48 hours the press will drive this. there's lots -- you see video of the site and see everybody took pictures. then two interesting questions about what happens next. one, is there criticism from the

right? are they denounced by pasters and religious figures on the right as having done something improper. >> let me tell you what, that's irrelevant. it's irrelevant whether national preachers come out because i know what preachers in the pew will say, what sunday school teachers will say, trust me i know. they don't need to hear from pat robertson to know this is a party that doesn't respect their values. that's what eric cantor has to get ahead of and needs to scald these people politically. >> the other issue, you're right in terms of the base, national political issues most stories die after 48 hours unless the opposition makes a big deal. the president, for instance, could come out and denounce this. we'll name what will nancy pelosi say about it? all that could drive this into the fall. >> all right. mike, politico's new ebook? >> by the way i have to say quickly, a lot of times people say this is small, i can tell

you the second republicans knew they had lost 2006, was the mark foley scandal and that's when republicans on the hill all quietly said to each other, it's up. every -- and that was something that, again, should not shape a national race. but it was just one more sign of a party out of touch and at that point everybody threw up their hands and said -- >> forget it. >> not our year. >> politico, the ebook, mike, is "obama's last stand" shows there's frustration to say the least inside the campaign. >> yeah. mika, it does. goes to the very top, glen tlush out with obama's last stand edited by jon meacham with an introduction by the great evan thomas. pulls back the curtain on what's going on in obama land. one of his discoveries is that the president himself was extremely upset when vice president biden spilled the

beans about gay marriage on the "meet the press" taping. the president agonized about this, his team worried about how it will play in north carolina a state they need, got last time, having the convention. he had a chilly meeting in the oval office where vice president biden said he was really, really really sorry, but also he felt the president's aides have shoved him under the bus, there's also a great moment of obama competitiveness, in coral gables, runs into a republican friend working for senator marco rubio, of florida, when he asks if marco rubio may run this time the president says, tell your boy to watch it, he may get his -- kicked. >> wow. p. >> okay. >> there's a quote. >> mike allen, it doesn't seem right coming out of his mouth, does it? >> the president? >> talk about that -- >> get some soap here. >> that russian group. >> thank you so much for being with us. >> have a great week. stay tuned.

and stay on politico because they actually, the russian band thrown in jail, they are going to be reviewing every one of their albums later today. coming up next. >> bill karins with sports. >> he's already insulted me and now doing sports. he is facebooking. >> all right. stop that. we shall return on "morning joe" stick around we'll be right back with bill karins and sports. e a♪ [ male announcer ] 6 years old. then 7. going on 11. in the blink of an eye, they're all grown up. marie callender's homemade tastes are another great reason to sit down and savor every last moment. ♪ because time flies... right before your eyes. marie callender's. it's time to savor.

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what's going on here? >> going to mess this you. >> skinny dips in my pool and now doing facebook and sports. this is a reward and punishment thing. what's going on here. >> reward for me, punishment for you. >> yeah. >> go ahead. >> works out pretty well. >> thanks for not -- we didn't include any of the highlights the jets game because there weren't any. >> tim tebow. >> it's going to be bad. >> did not do well. they say he's not a good practice quarterback. not a good preseason quarterback. >> going to be a long year. >> mark sanchez, oh, my lord. >> i know. >> i'm in charge here. >> bill karins here with sports. >> i'm in the huddle and tell them what to do. i'm in charge. it's ugly. >> don't just like turn into a different person. >> we don't have many highlights. that's why they let me do this. two baseball highlights. least amount of sports weekend we've had. longest game in major league baseball this season. pirates/cardinals, six hours, to find a winner of that game.

doubleheader in that time. 17th innings, garret jones, weak ground ball off the pitcher's mitt. game could be over. top of the 17th, get three more outs. that's it. runner on third. high fly ball. not going to be a play at the plate. we are going past the 17th. >> oh, my lord. >> let's bring it past the 18th to the 19th inning. please. end this game. that's a deep fly ball. this one should be out. looks like we're going to end it here. pedro alvarez home run to deep right. leaves the yard. it will end up being the end of the game. final three outs. as i mentioned, six hours long. five people left in the stands for that one. >> so they ran out of position players. and actually so out of 38,000 people who started watching the game, guess how many ended up watching the game. >> not many. >> 9,000. hearty stayed there. >> would you stay there six hours. >> day time game? >> made it 16 innings once at

yankee stadium. >> dedicated fans love their pirates and cardinals. >> my transition to the red sox/yankee game in case you missed it. >> trying to help you out. >> getting uglier by the minute. >> think ichiro was a good decision by the yankees. >> into a-rod's juice. really? >> five home runs on the year going into this. he had six all of last year. >> two last night. upper deck, seriously. >> that was out of anywhere. >> look who he's hitting against. josh beckett who you could hit a home run against this year. >> stop it. >> beckett has lost seven in a row. >> yankees take two out of three in the series, win 4-1. red sox are now four games under .500, that is it for their season. >> is there a requirement when you come to new york you immediately dip into a-rod's stuff? like immediately get juiced. >> list is getting long of ex-yankees. >> everybody in new york seems to dot juice. >> did you see the melky cabrera, saga -- the fake

website he set up to try to prove that he -- >> a-plus for creativitcreativi execution. >> fay vincent said major league baseball needs to get their act together. it's unbelievable. >> coming up next, the secretary of the u.s. air force michael donnelly here for air force week in new york city. keep it right here on "morning joe." [ male announcer ] count the number of buttons

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. at 48 past the hour here with us now, secretary of the air force, michael donely, in new york city for air force week. very good to have you on the sets they morning. he knows my brother. >> you know evian? >> i do. >> you survived. >> he was perfect. >> ian brzezinski worked for

you, and still standing. >> the republican in my family. >> very ugly thanksgiving. let's talk first of all a lot to talk about this morning, talk about sequestration. we're looking at some pretty massive cuts to defense. indiscriminate. what's your biggest concern? >> well, this was intended never to happen. and it would have significant impacts on our defense forces and we need the congress to act to take this threat overhanging the defense budget and other parts of federal spending off the table before the end of the year. >> you know over the past decade, it seems like the army, marines have been in the headlines, air force and the navy not so much. but now we're moving to another phase with drone wars and the air force may be stepping up playing a much more significant role. >> our air force has been tremendously busy in the last ten years. let me give you an example, last

march we were still operating in iraq. >> right. >> supporting the war in afghanistan. we've been supporting special operations forces in running down terrorists around the world, at the same time we were doing those things we responded quickly to a crisis in japan with humanitarian relief to our japanese allies after the earthquake and tsunami. stood up an operation over libya with coalition partners from europe and elsewhere in a air centric campaign over libya and supporting presidential movement in south america at the same time. air force operations globally on four or five different continents. >> mika, all of this is one of the reasons why new york wants to recognize the air force. this is, of course, air force week in new york city. >> putting a face on it and before we get to that, just give us a sense of some of the shortages within the air force

as well. i'm speaking particularly of drone pilots. >> well, we've -- this is an area of our air force that has grown over the last several years and a great success story for our air force. after 9/11 the number of remotely piloted vehicles in our air force could be counted on a couple hands. >> right. >> now we're pushing 300 aircraft in our inventory. we've created new career fields for pilots, for sensor operators. we've built up the intelligence support that's behind it that makes that system work. it's been a great success. >> what is exactly a drone pilot since it's an unmanned plane, but i see here that there is -- that the air force is struggling to fill a shortfall of more than 300 drone pilots. >> they'll need thousands in the next few years. >> what does a drone pilot do? we refer to them as remotely piloted aircraft because they are anything but unmanned. each aircraft supported by a pilot, sensor operator and

intelligence mission commander, plus hundreds of people behind that. so it is not completely unmanned in any sense of that word. >> yeah. >> so -- >> tell us about air force week. i was looking at this portrait, this puts a face on the men and women. >> it does. >> who serve. >> it does. air force week, a great opportunity for our air force to connect with new york city and people of new york who have been so supportive of our military. reintroduce them to the airmen that are doing the work of our nation's security, 24/7, 365, over 32,000 new yorkers served in our air force today. >> 32,000. >> over 32,000. and we featured 20 of them in this document we call "portraits of courage." this is the seventh volume. it's got individual airmen stories outlining the kinds of things that our airmen have been doing the last ten years

especially. so some great airmen out here. >> air force week kicked off yesterday. >> it did. >> if somebody wants to participate this week, what can they do? >> we are centered on pier 86 and the intrepid air sea space museum and the opportunities there to meet with airmen and we also have airmen visiting other parts of the city, sporting events. we've had our thunder birds flying over yankees and mets games and we have lots of outstanding airmen at pier 86. >> fly over the jets game and drop something. >> anything would help. >> anything. >> as an old army guy, i have a soft spot for the military. with the fiscal cliff cuts looming, no one knows what's going to happen, what kind of contingency plans do you guys have? >> the fiscal challenges facing our nation and including the defense establishment are

significant. our plan is to get a little bit smaller, but to maintain a ready force under any conditions that's ready to meet the needs of the nation. our overhanging concern is that we still need to leave resources available for modernizing the air force which haseen aging over the last ten to 20 years. average age of our fighters is now 23 years, the average age of our tanker force is 49 years. the bombers are averaging in the mid 30s and higher. it's time to modernize and to recapitalize our air force and there are lots of overhanging requirements to do that and we need to have the resources to get that done. >> mr. secretary michael donley, thank you very much. >> thank you so much. >> thank you for having us. for all the support we get from new york. >> we appreciate it. 32,000 members of the air force, can you believe that. >> right here. still ahead we'll talk to senator claire mccaskill.

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oh, my god -- >> when we come back, author of the new novel "true believers" kurt andersen joins us when "morning joe" continues in a moment. [ gnome ] enjoying your holiday?

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you've been very good staying away from the putin story. want to commend you john heilemann. >> the putin story? >> the rioting. >> the rioting. >> kitty cats. >> the band that is the name that a lot of punk groups today are waking up and saying -- >> going to start a band called -- >> why didn't i come up with that. >> i heard you're going to do a revival of josey and the cats. >> we're not going to do that. >> welcome back to "morning joe." mika -- this is a big day.

>> john heilemann as you can hear and see is still here. >> joining the set public radio host, studio 360 it's called, kurt andersen author of the novel "true believers". >> great to be here. >> at the table with us. >> omaha's favorite son and apparently omaha wants to adopt a daughter. >> omaha, i went to do aen event for this book in omaha and went to my high school reunion. >> "true believers". >> 94th i think. and two different members of my high school class said to me, tell me -- make sure next you're on "morning joe"," mika brzezinski is the greatest -- >> seriously -- >> what about joe? >> no. dog meat. >> he's perfect. >> willie geist and i understand we're just basically -- >> decorations. >> valets. >> valets. so --

>> can we go back to missouri. >> oh, my lord. let's do that story again. >> the sea of galilee. >> too good to be true. >> punk bands in russia. this is quite a morning. >> naked republican congressmen or -- >> the thing about akin, he's an engineer. >> is he? that explains a lot. >> trained as an engineer, worked for ibm as an engineer. >> what are you saying? >> that guy ought to know there's not magic va beginal switch. >> excuse me? >> wow. >> you can't say -- so let's -- >> riot and talk about vaginal switch. >> i guess we're going to talk about the putin story after all. let's start in missouri. >> wow. >> it's really one of the dumber things i've ever heard. one of the more ignorant things i've ever heard on the campaign trail. >> i think it's the top. >> it may come in at number one. >> yeah. >> all right. so coming in at number one, we start in missouri and a big case of damage control in the senate

race there where republicans have been gearing up to unseat democratic incumbent senator claire mccaskill. everyone has been saying it's going to be a tough slug for senator claire mccaskill, she's in jeopardy. >> she said if this akin guy gets elected i can do it and she knew something that other people didn't know. >> she knew his ignorance knew no bounds. this morning the republican candidate representative todd akin is backing off these comments and he made in an interview yesterday. it is absolutely stunning to watch this. he was asked to explain his no exceptions policy on abortion. listen. >> if an abortion could be considered in a case of say a tubal pregnancy or something like that, what about in the case of rape? should it be legal or not? >> seems to me first of all from what i understand from doctors, that's really rare, if it's a legitimate rape, the female body has ways to try to shut that whole thing down. let's assume maybe that didn't work or something.

i think there should be some punishment, but the punishment aud to be in the rapist and not attacking the child. >> that's the switch. >> dr. nic. >> i mean, what doctor was he talking to? dr. nic on "the simpsons"? >> come on. >> that's worse than harry reid, some guy told me. doctors i've talked to -- it's incredible. i was saying this guy -- >> a legitimate rape. >> legitimate rape i think -- >> what is an illegitimate rape? >> he meant if it's truly a rape. i don't think that's the thing to focus on -- >> as opposed to what? he has, as we know -- >> first of all. >> everybody stop. >> no. let's just stop because there's a line, when does the female body know whether it's a legitimate rape or an illegitimate rape? i mean, this is insanity. >> it is insanity. what do -- what's my party doing nominating people like this? we got the witch out of

delaware, that lady out of nevada two years ago. >> yeah. >> we don't want to win the the senate. we want harry reid to be majority leader for life. >> yeah. >> what's wrong with us? >> isn't it -- you know, in the end, after a few years of bashing science and various realms, don't you -- isn't this what you get? >> no. this is sheer stupidity, nice try, but no. this is pure sheer stupidity. >> on the science committee. >> this is actually -- we're talking before, don't you really think this is more about people -- i remember democrats, you know, used to say stupid stuff like this and we would go what's wrong with them. such idiots. making this easy. >> role reversal. >> because they we were ideologically bound to their left. these guys are so ideologically bound to extremists they say stupid things. >> i think this connects. yesterday in "the new york times" one of romney's advisors said what's so great about ryan we've made the real -- we consummated the link with the

hard right. just the phrase the hard right. imagine if some obama guy said we've really got the hard left in the -- >> that's what you want. >> and you know, that's his phrase. >> this guy, this guy, introduced a bill in congress, that tried to ban federal funding for what he called forcible rape. now forcible rape i think it's possible that that's what he was referring to. his view is there are different kinds of rape. now that's not -- that's not a flub. that's a guy -- this is a guy -- >> explain something, as opposed to what date rape? >> yes. >> yes apparently that is -- that is the distings he was trying to draw. >> if you drug a woman and rape her, is that not legitimate rape? >> the point is -- >> it's insanity. >> i agree with that. this is not just a gaffe, this is not just a guy who went on television and said a dumb thing, introduced legislation that tried to codify different categories of rape. >> and you connect this to the romney campaign because? >> paul ryan was a cosponsor of that bill. >> last thing he needs.

>> massive outcry among women's groups, rightly so, and that provision was dropped from the bill. ryan was a cosponsor of that legislation and earlier today mark halperin noted ben lebolt, it's his birthday, happy birthday ben lebolt. >> the question, bob, does paul ryan and mitt romney, do they have to do more than just say we disagree with akin's comments. >> they have to come down hard, ka boom, and can't let a lot of time elapse before they do it. >> it's like george w. bush, going after trent lott, barack obama throwing reverend wright under the bus, they've got to say even if it costs us a senate seat we're going to kill this guy politically. >> makes it look like they don't care about people. the people who make comments like this and the people who are slow or weak in condemning it like they don't really care about real people in tough circumstances and george w. bush was on to something with the

compassionate conservatism. a reason why that resonated with the electorate. >> and joe, you know the thing about this, the sister soldier moments. >> right. >> something mitt romney has not taken opportunities to do. they are politically cost-free. you attack people who are the crazies in your party, you look reasonable and broadly speaking the people who are the far right will vote for mitt romney. they don't like barack obama and come out. you're going to lose any voters by attacking someone for this. >> the last time the sister soldier moment rush limbaugh, rush limbaugh wasn't running for senate as a republican nominee from an important state and b, this vile calling of this woman a slut is nowhere -- that was just an opinion extravagantly expressed. this is -- just the ignorance and idiocy that this represents is so beyond -- and so far he said i misspoke.

>> that is what's so concerning about this. it's not somebody on cable tv or talk radio. this is a guy that wants to be a united states senator and you listen to this guy say what he said, mika, and wonder what planet is he from? >> it's also so self-destructive. they had this thing. >> they were close to having this thing. >> i think he should talk to ap apec. a lot of times when republicans get in trouble we go to israel -- >> want to go to the sea of galilee. >> look strong on national defense, barack obama has a 4% approval rating a couple years ago in israel. go over there and show aipac likes you i'm strong. what could go wrong in the holy land. >> nothing. >> i mean nothing. >> oh. >>. ♪ put your hands >> no. actually, something can go wrong. >> oh not in israel. >> especially if you take off all your clothes and jump into the sea of galilee. >> if i'm a republican in israel what could go wrong.

>> politico out with a report detailing the behavior of a group of congressional freshmen during a fact-finding mission to israel. >> i bet they went to that wall where you go to -- >> looking for facts. >> to pray, right? right. they went to see where jesus delivered the sermon on the mountain. >> according to politico the night in question involved drinking. >> what? >> and a naked swim. >> who. >> in the sea of galilee. >> that's not good. >> more than a dozen sources tell politico about 20 people enjoyed the late night dip while fully clothed. they kept their clothes on. >> some did. that's good. >> republican congressman kevin yoder of kansas took it a step further dropping his swim trunks. >> i'm sorry. it's monday morning and i'm half asleep. what did he do? >> in the sea of galilee? >> why did he do it? >> naked. >> what one does. >> in the sea of galilee. >> they are freshmen. >> night in high school. >> but here's the deal, kurt,

here's the deal, i can understand if you're an old, fat, powerful chairmen of the weighs and means committee who thinks like -- who's been so corrupted by power you take your clothes off and skinny dip in the tidal basin. wilbert mills, god rest his soul. these people are freshmen, what are they doing in the sea of galilee. >> there's no stripper involved. >> daughters of other congressmen there. >> going to be sophomores -- >> they are not going to be sophomores. >> let me ask kurt. >> put no skinny dipping. >> no skinny dipping. didn't work for wilbert mills, not working here. >> no skinny dipping at holy sites. >> it's incredible. >> if they are at the green prior and out late at night -- >> come on. >> or the vatican -- >> things happen in the vatican. >> really? it's the holy land, sea of galilee, on a congressional fact finding trip. >> how does this play in omaha? >> not well. >> republican state of nebraska.

>> let me ask you quickly we'll continue this, yes or no, bob kerrey wins? >> i hope so. >> okay. >> doubt it. but hope so. >> really? >> i don't know about that. he's got a tough road to hoe. i hope so. >> congressman yoder writes in part -- >> hold on a second. let's get something straight -- this is one of the better statements i've heard in a while. >> after dinner i followed some members of congress in a spontaneous and very brief dive into the sea and regrettably i jumped into the water without a swimsuit. >> that is a line which will live in infamy. it is my greatst honor to represent the people of kansas in congress and any embarrassment i have caused for my colleagues and constituents i apologize. >> seriously, i ask, who are these people? i'm serious. >> i'm sorry. >> it was a brief dive. >> it wasn't brief enough. >> i can't imagine anybody that i ever knew in congress doing

such a thing. who are these people? this is insanity. >> it's insane. >> who would even -- i just don't -- i'm serious. it is mind boggling. i mean, when i was on the hill people were afraid to swear. i'm like come on, man. >> romney. >> not rom, but -- after my time. no, this is stunning behavior and it's -- think about the one-two punch of akin and this sea of galilee thing. >> same 24-hour period. >> for the republican party. mitt romney better be out today swinging. >> obama -- >> like joe frazier. >> obama is the luckiest politician on the planet. he's always been lucky. >> wow. >> well -- >> in the senate race, main opponents self-destruct. >> oh, my gosh. >> and mccain picked sarah palin in the presidential election. he's a lucky guy. >> wow. >> but the -- we shouldn't make these -- the skinny dipping thing is goofy and all that, but

nothing like the akin business. >> no. so in a case of unfortunate timing, the latest issue of "newsweek" features a cover story by -- >> have you read this? >> british historian neil ferguson, "hit the road barack" why we need a new president. unfortunate timing we'll see how mitt romney handles this. >> he writes in part this by picking ryan as his running mate romney has given the first real sign that unlike obama, he is a courageous leader who will not duck the challenges america faces. the voters have a stark choice. they can let barack obama's rambling -- i don't know -- >> good word. >> narrative, so ferguson, continue until they find themselves living in some american version of europe with low growth, high unemployment, even higher debt and real geopolitical decline, or opt for real change. i was a good loser four years ago, but this year, fired up by the rise of ryan, i want badly

to win. >> i hear some liberals, brooklyn hipsters snickering around this set, thoses of us that believe that barack obama is leading this country down a path of low growth, high unemployment, with disastrous economic policies that will not work but will drive us deeper in debt. guess what, kurt, we don't have na conversation because the republican party seems to always get in the way of it. if we could have a straight on economic debate, with a guy that understood or a woman that understood economic principles like thatcher or somebody that could even express it like reagan, we would win by ten points. the republican party never has that chance because -- because? >> because? >> we allow goof balls to change the narrative. it's not just now. i mean, in 2009, we had glen beck, the most dominant

republican. i could go year by year. >> been without the extreme -- >> getting in our way. >> without the extremes of glen beck or whom ever. the nature of political campaigns is not one that makes subtly of argument and nuance of economic macro economic disagreement. easy for us to put out there. >> right. >> you could -- >> ronald reagan -- >> ronald reagan stripped it down pretty darn well. >> you could put out a vision in clear language of where you want to lead this country where we're going economically and what you're going to do about employment which is a crisis in this country and i don't think either of these campaigns have done that. i don't think obama wants to talk about that, the republicans should be all over it but there are these distractions. that's in obama's favor. >> john heilemann, talk about -- because a lot of times people say you guys are obsessing too much on one story or two stories. when i saw both of these things hit last night, i said my god,

if i'm the candidate, and this is a week before my convention, a week after i've picked paul ryan and i'm going to have to deal with this mess, i'll tell you what i'm going to do, i'm going to start shooting politically everybody in sight. i'm going to mow akin down, mow these freshmen down, and i'm going to let america know mitt romney has nothing to do with these jackals and i want them to get out and wear sack cloth and ashes and apologize and throw themselves on the mercy of america. i will not be there to defend them. because my convention -- i mean this narrative can slip from monday to tuesday to thursday to saturday and suddenly the convention, has a huge clout over it. they've got to kill this. >> he should doxactly that and just imagine the coverage he would get and the country would see him as a strong figure. they would see him as the leader of the party. but he won't do it. >> the sister soldier moment. >> the idea of tell me why i

don't like mondays. >> oh, my gosh. >> i'm going to shoot the day down. >> take them all out. >> but -- >> from the sea of galilee? >> the pictures may come. >> to neil ferguson and you made a comment about me snickering. not snickering about the krits seek of barack obama. he says this is a courageous choice in paul ryan and i think if you think back about last week, paul ryan has taken some very clear positions, they are controversial but also not specified an awful lot of stuff you need to know to understand paul ryan's views of the world. we've talked about this before. he can't talk about the ryan tax plan when he will not specify what deductions he's going to try to deal with on the home mortgage interest deductions or the charitable deduction of the health care deduction. romney backed away in various ways from the ryan plan last week. we don't know -- when ryan was asked about what -- let's talk about these in detail -- >> you're getting involved in

details. >> i am. >> more like a mood setter for a room. we had engelbert humperdinck doing way too early this morning with a v neck, but this -- >> ryan sets the mood. >> for the party. >> for small government. >> all right. >> specific. don't -- don't look too close at it. but i will tell you -- >> don't look at the sheet music. >> tells us more about mitt romney than say a rob mort portman pick which seems safe. ryan was not safe. >> going to embrace the small government -- >> the hard right. >> as his advisors said yesterday. >> kurt andersen stay with us. >> give me the sheet music. >> we'll bring in democratic senator claire mccaskill and next editor at large of salon.com joan walsh joins the table. >> look at this. >> she and claire have both hit the jackpot coming in this morning. >> they have. >> we'll have to give joan an hour and a half. >> "morning joe" brewed by starbucks.

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24 past the hour. live look at the white house. joining us now editor at large of salon and msnbc political analyst joan walsh author of "what's the matter with white people, why we long for a golden age that never was." >> talking about republicans from congress? >> you know, joe, i want to promise you this is a todd akin-free zone and there are no naked congressmen in this book. >> you're going to gloat. >> there's no needp. >> that might be be for the sequel, but i did not deal with them. i want joe to feel safe around this book. >> yeah. >> seriously, joan, for all the times that you've sat and looked at democratic candidates, going why do all stupid people decide they want to run on the democratic ticket, we have paid you back. >> yeah. >> thank you. >> we're good.

>> we have have had a run of five, six, seven years of one self-inflicted wound after another. >> unbelievable. >> it is unbelievable. >> akin, let's talk generally about that. what kind of impact does that have on the republican convention next week if we have these rolling press stories and mitt romney doesn't get in front of it? >> maybe some pictures come out. >> maybe pictures come out. akin and the ridiculous remark about rape, there's a problem because there are people in congress including i believe paul ryan who are been trying to redefine the definition of rape. you have a bigger problem than akin as far as i'm concerned. people trying to say certain kinds of things women claim are rape really aren't. that's offensive. again when the ticket might have been making inroads with women, might have been some polls showed a little movement. >> right. >> you know, i think you're going to see the bottom drop out. >> quote legitimate rape, begs the question what is illegitimate rape? >> right. >> who draws that line?

does todd akin? >> whose mind is going there? >> exactly. >> whose mind is going there. there's that. the naked cavorting in the sea of galilee holy site for my people, you know, we all cavort periodically, i don't know. i'm not going to get too judgmental. it's ridiculous. >> the thing, i'm not getting judgmental, but do that at a holiday inn in topeka. don't go to the sea of galilee now, like i said before, this is -- this sends a message, such a message to evangelicals, who are the back bone of the party in a lot of areas, that some of your youngest, most conservative types, just don't believe what they say they believe. >> they are complete hypocrites. not larry craig, a little different thing, but don't practice what they preach. >> don't take the job seriously. >> that is the bigger issue. more reality aside, even if your

agnostic, you probably don't want your congressman or senator taking off their clothes at a fact finding mission at a holy site. it has nothing -- i mean, you know, we'll let preachers judge the guy. that's a question of judgment. >> i'm going to say my congresswoman nancy pelosi would never have. >> let's hope not. >> i can say that with firm conviction. >> yep. >> all right. let's talk about white people. >> tell us about the book. what's wrong with white people? >> that's the title. >> how is it going? >> it's going pretty good for a lot of white people. what i've been thinking about and talking to you guys about for a long time the pessimism and the growing negativity of the white working class, which has shifted from being the core of the democratic base to now the core of the republican base. and so, you know, in my research and in my talking to people over the last few years, it really struck me this group -- this is the group of people, white working class, to some extent

the white middle class has seen its standard of living fall, wages decline, they are afraid, they are genuinely in polls they are the people most pessimistic about the future of the country. and you know, some of my friends on the left will say it's racism and they don't like racial change. that's true for some. i think for a lot of white people there's a sense, a kind of longing for this golden age. >> right. >> pre- '60s golden age but it didn't really exist. >> why do you say it didn't exist? obviously you had post-war extraordinary growth and i think -- i think actually, misunderstanding what happened like 1945 to 1960, fuels so much -- or gets in the way of an honest debate. everybody wants to go back to a time that was fueled by a war that destroyed all of our competitors. >> right. there are a lot of things it was fueled by. first of all there was a golden age for some of us, there was. i realize writing this book my

childhood actually was like the dreamiest moment in the american dream where every -- >> you and kurt won the lottery. >> probably the last generation of people for whom the american dream really worked. >> and guess what? just a decade later, i won't ask how old you are, i'm 49. just a decade later i'm driving around in upstate new york in middle school and my parents -- i'm hearing my parents in the front seat asking where are the steel plants going? why are companies moving overseas? opec. everybody has an idea this just started in 1991 -- >> '90 -- >> this has been going on like -- >> but i think, i mean. >> this was like -- get off your reagan kick. this was the early '70s. >> everything changed. i say this in the book, everything changed in 1973. it's an astonishing year. >> 1973, jeff sacks has a statistic and i want you to go into this, this is the tipping

point economically for us. 1973 average wages have declined for men. >> yes men. >> since 1973 in real terms, every year since 1973. talk about '73. >> 1973 a bunch of things came together and then they were building. deindustrialization and outshoring, we got into that at various points later in the '80s or '90s. this was happening, it was beginning in the '60s and '70s. you had the beginning of these good jobs going away. the other part that i wonder if joe and i would agree on this when you talk about let's talk about what happened after the war, we came out of the great depression and we came out of the war and we were terrified in a lot of ways. we wanted to build the biggest middle class in the world. we thought that was the key to prosperity and to stability, right? >> right. >> so one place where you and i, republicans and democrats kind of break down here, is that i really want to tell the story of how government worked to build that middle class. government made decisions from the new deal from social security, making it easier to

join unions, now whether you like unions or not, they helped create the rising -- >> i say all the time, by the way, the union i think it is a great crisis for the american economy that private sector union membership is down to about 7%. >> it is. >> what does that mean? that means manufacturing jobs are gone. that means all the factories up and down the coast of new england are gone. >> right. >> we need to put them back if 20%, 25% are private sector unions and we have sane workforce rules means we have a strong middle class, right? >> absolutely. we also made decisions, we have the gi bill, built public universities, subsidized mortgages, guaranteed mortgages. here's where it stops. >> what about dwight eisenhower. >> the interstate system that got us to the subways. >> post-sputnik decides to invest in science. gives us a generation of scientists, mathematicians that take us to the moon 12 years later. >> republicans did that,

democrats did that together. >> nothing bad. >> but here's the bad part. a lot of people were left out of that golden age. a lot of these programs i've described to you, either did not prohibit discrimination, going back to social security and the new deal. they either did not prohibit discrimination against black people and other nonwhites or they actively abetted it. so that they were leaving people who weren't white out of the golden age. >> so bob herbert from let's say 1945 to 1965, golden age for whites, not so until lbj. >> i grew up in the era that joan was talking about. i'm a kid of the '50s and '60s, that's when i came of age, and the thing that i think -- i think a lot of ways it was a golden age because even though so many people were left out, the sense in the country was that we were moving in the right direction, so you had the civil rights movement. >> right. >> you still had the labor movement, you had the anti-war movement, people thought things

would get better for them and i think that's one of the fundamental differences with now the pessimism that she's talking about. >> right. >> now is a real debilitating drag. >> yeah. >> but there's also, i find, a divide in a lot of my -- i tell the story through the story of my family which really rose from poverty to the working class to the middle class to upper middle class in my dad's generation. and so white people got a certain kind of help that black people didn't necessarily get. and so i find that black people and other nonwhite people actually see that super structure of government support, the scaffolding that lifted us to the middle class, they know they didn't get all that help. you have white people saying wait, i didn't get any help. that was the garden of eden and i worked hard on my own, which they did, my grandparents worked like dogs, but this divide where i'm saying -- >> joan, please, don't say you didn't build your own business. that starts a new thing. >> here was the difference, the

difference between these universal entitlements like social security, gi bill, that everybody thinks that's what everybody gets. i wasn't -- i didn't get any special help versus welfare. >> right. >> and government. >> that has been the -- driven so much of that exactly the political -- >> not only that. you know, you have the whole government situation and the government supports, but the critical thing in that era was that people worked. even poor people had jobs. work was easy to come by and education was affordable. so if you had a family that didn't have a lot of money, but they were working every day, they could send their kids to college and those kids would have a better life than their parents had. >> that is the difference there. that the jobs were there if you wanted them. >> yep. >> we talked to colin powell and he talks about how he walked i guess -- in the bronx, he decided he wanted to work in a store in the bronx as, you know, carrying crates an kept working there and led to something else. the jobs were there. >> that's the economic

conversation you were talking about that we're not having the big economic conversation. the big economic conversation we're not having is that change from industrial america to post-industrial america, where jobs really weren't sent overseas because there wasn't a free global market to where it is we're not having that conversation and no easy left, right solution to that. >> two things too, a lot of people, this is -- don't want to get into a long debate here, but you hear about the 1% and 99%, everybody talks about george w. bush's tax cuts only that simple we'd abolish them tomorrow. you have i.t. creating the huge divide between the haves and have nots and you have productivity, we're more productive as a country ever than ever before. >> but -- >> that's leaving more and more people behind. >> it's also -- >> out of work. >> the amazing thing about productivity as productivity rose in the '40s, '50s, '60s, and '70s wages rose. something is happening in the

relationship between management and workers well, can talk about days about what that is why are workers not sharing? >> when robots take their jobs the investors get their profits. >> it's not only that. >> i've got to get the exact statistic, as a politician i keep adding millions of jobs every year, but something like 1993, if we were just as productive as we were in 1993, something like 20 more million people would be working today. that's how much sort of i.t. revolution has -- and, you know, we talk about atm machines, last time you've been to a teller. >> self-checkout. >> they're going to have self-checkout. >> i won't do it. >> how many people will lose their jobs. >> ring a bell and ask for help. >> say you want that, yes, swipe it on the ipad and, you know, how many people does that put out of work. >> every day. >> and then we're all doing more. i want do less. >> i want to do less too. >> you know what i want to do, hang out at giants games and guess which members of the field

are on steroids. >> i will hurt you. don't talk to me about that right now. >> the new book -- >> we need a prediction, the giants and dodgers look like they're into a classic pennant race. what's that going to look like? >> a classic pennant race a lot less fun without melky cabrera. i am in mourning. >> at least you can look back at the glory days of barry bonds. >> the golden age. >> we'll be right back. this happy couple used capital one venture miles

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mark halperin, information -- >> jack is coming up. >> information that todd akin could be bumped from the race but tomorrow is the deadline. >> agrees to step down they could replace him as the nominee and i think today you will see enormous pressure from some republicans, privately the question is anyone publicly like mitt romney or john cornyn say they should go. >> what you're hearing and i'm hearing from republican strategist, never show weakness. >> republicans are not downplaying this. not just for that key senate race but the party brand overall we've been talking about. they are going to move to try to deal with this in a dramatic way. >> and claire mccaskill would not be happy. >> she would not be happy. >> coming up next, national columnist john fund joins us to talk about our voting system and why he says it's easy to steal elections. wish i would have had this book

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. 45 past the hour. welcome -- >> grand ole opry. >> back to "morning joe." here with us national affairs columnist for the national view john funds co-author of "who's counting, how fraud steres and bureaucrats put your vote at risk." >> if republicans get a chance to tell akin to exit the race to get somebody different for the general election, the deadline may be tomorrow, should they do it? >> it's not going to happen. things don't move that quickly. he's staying in, spent millions to get this nomination, he's going to say i can recover, memories are short. >> really? >> mitt romney? should mitt romney try to push him from the race? >> only if he would succeed and he won't do that because he won't succeed. >> okay. >> there's that. okay. coming up senator claire mccaskill. >> hs who's count iing

judges got involved, lawyers got involved, they're going to be 10,000 lawyers on both sides scrutinizing this election. you no longer have to win with a margin of victory. you have to win with a margin beyond -- >> if you have everybody watching you say sloppy, but seems to work, right? except for 2000. >> there was that. >> we've had other problems. the washington state governor's race, minnesota senate race which was very important because it was going to determine whether the democrats had 60 votes in the senate when they got 60 votes in the senate with al franken's victory that gave us obama care. these close races, if it's close enough all of these irregularities loom large and

have enor nous consequences. >> give us examples of -- i'm sorry. >> i want you to go. >> voter fraud or -- >> kurt will tell us people are here to watch you and not us. >> just in omaha which confuses me. voter fraud. >> two examples. one is from the republicans infamous republican clerk in wisconsin who forget to report 14,000 votes in that close supreme court race in wisconsin that was going to decide whether walker's reforms remained, that was bureaucratic bungling beyond anything, still in office, should have been bumped or forced to resign. dale franken race, we know 1100 felons voted illegally in that race and the margin was 312 votes. they've prosecuted people, 177 people have been prosecuted and convicted of voting illegally in that election. 66 more in the pipeline, dozens more investigated. we may get to the point in the

al franken race more convicted -- >> you don't like to see things expand but isn't the solution to these issues putting more money into this process, hiring better people, more people so there's integrity of the system. >> we need more imagine native approaches. something like 65% of our poll workers over the age of 70. we have to train a new generation, should have high school and college kids encouraged to get credit and paid for working at the polls. we do need better electronic voting machines. some concerns about software and transparency. >> all this costs money, right? >> yeah. but it's pennies and i'm not opposed to actually -- 40% of the country believes their votes are not counted accurately or fairly. that is a level of nonconfidence in our system which is toxic. >> that's true. >> but do you think -- i mean obviously in the laws, perhaps, in pennsylvania and elsewhere we've seen this ideological political move from the right to

make voter i.d. logs and so forth, is it in your view primarily a question of bungling incompetence, old poll workers or some concerted -- >> look. >> chris mathews himself said o >> himself. >> he he said there was massive voter fraud when i was growing up in philadelphia, there still is today. >> i think what you do is you call rendell and tell him whether you need 300,000 or 400,000 votes. >> rendell was one of the better things and tried to stop some things. >> just joking. we love him. >> we do have a problem here. i think there's a conflict of visions. i think what chris dodd said when he passed the help america act, he said we need to make it easy to vote and hard to cheat. we're americans, we can do both. the problemcy think politics does get in the way here, and here's what i suggest. if there are a few people, and i think it's only a few people who lack a voter id, let's get them

one. andrew yourngs the former mayor of atlanta, told me we are doing people a favor by getting them id. the law in pennsylvania was upheld by the court because there were several safeguards. even if you didn't have an i.d., if you signed an affidavit saying i'm too poor to get an i.d. and i can't get one, your vote would still be counted if you signed the affidavit. >> the book is who's counting," john fund, thank you so much. >> we appreciate it. >> when we come back, i still don't know. >> roger bennett returns with the "morning joe" football frenzy. >> what he says. >> we're going to be talking about a very pathetic liverpool site. this is just sad. >> we'll be right back. ♪

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oh, my god. >> five past the hour. >> if it's the sex pilateses, what does that mean? >> it means that espn soccer analyst and anlis roger bennett is here. >> it means the season has begun in ernest. man city versus northampton. >> like an old friend. over nine months, we english are so pasty faced because we never see the sun until may. manchester city they ended the season in fabulous style. last kick, last day last season.

started off as they finished, playing a team of minnows and starting well but struggling. this is southampton. that's ricky lambert, 6'3", half muscle, half steak and kidney pie. one to watch for the season. what do they do? they went up and did it again. >> people are going crazy. >> stephen days laces the ball in. unbelievably these newcomers are 2-1 up against city. >> we're not watching football anymore. we're watching a workers' revolution. >> this is a workers' revolution. >> manchester city wouldn't let down. the french man wishes muslims around the world a happy post ramadan. manchester city restored order in unconvincing fashion, 3-2. it is what we call in england a real clencher of a game the. manchester city showed they have further budget for personalized shirts. what other team ---ing. >> roger you know, i've been

suffering with liverpool since 1947. >> red sox and liverpool. >> even through the thatcher strikes. they were lean years -- >> one day you're going to show people your liverpool tattoo. >> it keeps getting worse. it just keeps getting worse. >> they have a new coach, brendan rogers. meant to take them in a new direction. he it did, unfortunately, it was backwards. >> that was an amazing -- >> this guy's nickname is mup t muppet. >> look at this goal. >> even the staff at the waldorf would love that one. it goss worse for liverpool. 3-nil. a real flashing. the only good news, this red sox soccer team, red sox not so bad after all. >> i'll tell you what, the alcoholic, they're getting rid of him, right? andy? >> andy carroll, he's lost a lot of weight. this is a strike they paid a lot of money for.

>> $50 million. >> the skinnier he gets, the more he looks like one of the models in those robert palmer videos. maybe he's got a future as a supermodel. >> let's talk about van percy and rooney, the two best most productive strikers last year. now on the same team. >> they are united. this is it. that's his new dad, sir alex ferguson. >> arsenal football club never trade players to manchester united. he chose to go to them. it would be like tom brady joining the jets, aaron rodgers joining the bears. even benedict arnold would have said i can't do that. >> van percie, sort of an attitude. >> the big question is whether the two players can support each other and not just -- we'll see this afternoon. they kick off their season 2:5 espn2. >> you'reverton. >> take the afternoon off work,

america. >> we always do. roger, thank you so much. >> kurt andersen, thank you, as well. >> when we come back, the republicans are -- well, they're in trouble. we'll be talking about skinny dipping in the sea of galilee. >> that's the good news. that's next on "morning joe." oa! [ male announcer ] it made a big splash with the employees. [ duck yelling ] [ male announcer ] find out more at... [ duck ] aflac! [ male announcer ] ...forbusiness.com. ♪ ha ha! marie callender's gives you a way to make any day a special occasion. new mini cream pies for one. real whip cream and a cookie-crumb crust. marie callender's. it's time to savor.

♪ good morning. it's 8:00 on the east coast, 5:00 a.m. on the west coast. >> what time is it in the sea of galilee? >> what do you think it is. >> it's naked time as you take a live look at new york city.

back with us john heilemann, mark halperin and bob herbert. >> we start this morning, mika, with the story of a political brand. they had a rough weekend. >> there is crisis management and there's crisis management. and damage control. we're talking about the senate race. >> wow. >> where in missouri where republicans have been gearing up to unseat democratic incumbent senator claire mccaskill. >> that was supposed to be an easy pickup. claire down ten points. it's easy, nothing to it. >> she was in jeopardy. >> gone. >> she was in trouble. >> msnbc future contributor. i mean, it was bad. bad. >> it was a bad outcome for her until this morning. the republican candidate representative todd akin, he's backing off from these comments he made in an interview yesterday when he was asked to explain his no exceptions policy on abortion. take a listen. >> if an abortion could be

considered in the case of say a tubal pregnancy or something like that, what about in the case of rape? should it be legal or not. >> first of all, from what i understand from doctors that's really rare. if it's a legitimate rape, the fee pail body has ways to try to shut that whole thing down. i think there should be some punishment but the punishment should be in the rapist and not talking the child. >> oh, my lord. you read it on the paper, mark halperin. >> my god. >> oh, my god. >> what happened. >> and then you actually see his lips move and those words come out. who thinks that -- the thing is, who thinks that way? >> who are the doctors he's talking to in. >> what doctors? is it too late to throw mama from the train and have a new republican primary? >> today is the birthday of ben lee bolt, president obama's press secretary. happy birthday, ben. >> happy birthday, ben.

that is a gift that that will have reverberations beyond that single race. that's an important senate race. >> how do you back off from that? these comments drew an immediate response franchise senator claire mccaskill, his democratic opponent. >> saying thank you, first of all. secondly, i'm keeping my townhouse in washington. >> she was very elegant. >> third, i'm going to be deeply saddened with this comment. >> here's her comment. it is beyond comprehension that someone can can be so ignorant about the emotional and physical trauma brought on by rape. the ideas that todd akin has expressed about the serious crime of rain and its impact on victims are offensive. congressman aikenlarity issued his own statement admitting he misspoke during the interview and he followed up on twitter. to be clear, all of understand that rape can result in pregnancy. and i have great empathy for all victims. i regret misspeaking. >> all right. you know, so john heilemann, i mean it's shocking.

but republicans keep doing this. republicans had delaware two years ago. and they decided to go with a candidate who was clearly going to lose. they had a clean shot at nevada. and they clearly went with the most unelectable person. we had been warned by reading press reports that todd akin was the only candidate that would give claire mccaskill an opportunity of winning. >> yep. >> and here we are. here we are. i mean, this is a republican party that does not want to win the majority. they don't want to win the majority. they want to keep shooting themselves in the foot. >> yeah. look, it reminds you the precedent that rings if my head is clayton williams in the 199 ot texas gubernatorial race where he was up over ann richards and said rape is like the weather, you might as well relax and enjoy it and quickly

lost the lead and and richards went on to win the race. it is now the rule i think in primaries that the most conservative candidate wins primaries. >> with the exception of tommy thompson last week was a change. wisconsin voters decided they wanted to actually win. republicans decided we want to have a shot of winning. >> i don't want to say look, we have seen -- the tea party is proudly triumph fal right now walking around saying you guys all thought we were gone. now we're back. and this is to some extent, i don't want to totally denigrate the tea party but it is the case, generally republican primaries, the most conservative candidate, as long as you have enough money to compete, you win that race. >> i actually have moderate republicans that are big spenders, bob herbert have always driven me crazy. if i could get a conservative in there that is a small government type, i'm happy.

but there is a rule that we conservatives have followed for a long time, the bill buckley rule. you elect the most electable conservative. the person who is the most conservative and who is electable is the one you put on the ticket. that's the part of the equation that we're losing over the last three years. and it's killing -- it's making harry reid the majority leader. >> that's exactly right. the danger for the republican party is this. conservatism is fine. no problem at all. this country is a moderate to conservative country. i wish it was more liberal. but the problem are these extremists on the right or the whackos on the right. you were talking at the top of the show about brand. the republican party is the in danger of losing its brand. this is a country. >> you say that. and there are people at home going you know what, he's a liberal. you know what? look at the polling numbers. you can looking in every poll,

bob, over the past three years. the republican brand has taken a serious serious dent. >> and the party, i don't know what the party can do, but it needs to do something about that. the other thing is, as liberal as i am, i don't -- you do want a viable two-party system in this country. you want two robust parties that can go at it and then come together in the end to come up with some solutions. we don't have that right now the. >> yeah. >> in response to aiken's comments, the romney/ryan campaign released a statement reading governor romney and congressman ryan disagree with mr. aiken's statement, and a romney/ryan administration would not oppose abortion in instances of rape. >> mark, let me ask you, is that enough? do they need to come out and condemn it more harshly or is that enough? >> it's a surprisingly rapid and good first step. i think they'll both probably

have to baens it. we'll have to see what happens with aiken and other republicans. that was plit clean turn around to try to distance themself from it. >> another issue they should talk about, israel. >> no. naked congressmen. >> the republicans on israel, the president's got a low approval rating, and i don't know if you knew this or not. but you know, a lot of republicans will actually. >> travel there will. >> take a pilgrimage, apac very good. >> and throw themselves into it. >> they do because we love israel. we're zionists and we have a zest for life. we republicans. >> yes, do you. >> we're marching to zion, beautiful zion. that's a bad -- go ahead. >> strip the story down. >> let's strip it will down. >> it the sea of galilee is a holy site where it's said in the bible that jesus walked on water. according to politico, it's also the scene of a potentially embarrassing incident involving

a group of freshmen u.s. congressmen, a night of drinking and a.jump in the sea. it happened during a congressional fact finding mission. i don't know what facts you're trying to find. more than a dozen sources tell politico that he about 20 people enjoyed the late night dip while. >> can i have some advil. >> they wore their clothes. >> it's going to be a long political season. karen, do you have some advil? seriously, this is monday morning. it's not even 7:00 monday morning. >> republican congressman kevin yoder of kansas dropped trou. >> kevin, kevin. >> took off all his clothes. here's what he does. >> what's he do? >> the story breaks. >> the statement's amazing. >> it's amazing. >> the statement is amazing. >> it's great. in fact, i respect him for this statement because it's so great. >> it reads itself, this statement. >> todd akin faxed in some

suggestions. >> by the way, ironically, this is one of these things where it's like serendipity. they were sitting there listening and the band that vladimir putin threw in jail was playing in the background. >> what are they called? >> i forgot. they're a big animal rights group we'll leave that to the "new york post." >> here's what he writes. >> i'm not saying it. >> i'd be happy to say it. >> i've already been ordered not to say it by somebody at home. >> after dinner, i followed some members of congress in a spontaneous and very brief dive into the sea and regrettably, i jumped into the water without a swimsuit. >> oh. >> it's my greatest honor to represent the people of kansas in congress. >> could you put that in past tense. >> and any embarrassment i've caused for my colleagues and constituents, i apologize. come on. >> the first draft of the

statement had a line that said it was the manischewitz talking. >> according to politico. the fbi briefly looked into the incident questioning a staffer to ensure there was no improper behavior. the article goes on to say, i'm not surprised by this next sectioning. >> eric cantor who is very close to apac, what, of course, he should reprimand him. >> i'm sure did he. >> did he. >> i'm sure did he. >> eric cantor reprimanded the group the next day saying they were distracted from the mission of the trip. >> just a tad bit. >> and politico -- >> that's the thing about skinny dipping. >> it does distract, especially when you have the daughters of other members there. >> in the water with you. >> fully clothed. >> she was fully clothed i know. i'm talking about them partially disrobing or completely disrobing in front of the daughter of another congressman. >> classy, some classy. >> but counselor, here's what the story doesn't quite answer.

why is the fbi interested? >> that is a good question. >> why is the fbi interested in this? >> i don't know. >> they were drinking. >> i didn't understand. i mean, could we have our -- >> crack research tell us. i was reading that going, what's the federal offense here? it's stupidity. >> the kind of thing j. edgar would have been all over. >> global stupidity that rises to the level of a crime, don't you think? >> maybe so. >> can you think of any. >> call michael isikoff at home and wake him up. >> i guess so. so here's -- here's yet another republican story. bang-bang. >> yep. this is bad news. >> not a great sunday. >> so what does mitt romney do on the campaign trail when he's asked about. >> they're going to new hampshire. >> when he's asked about the sea of galilee thing?

>> oh, god, he could really do well actually. he could be human. >> and then aiken and then ask him to talk about the russian group that got thrown in jail. >> talking about. >> the riot, okay? ing. >> meow. >> the animal rights activists. >> you know exactly what george bush would say if he were a candidate for president. >> he would do a sister so ja on his party and say this isn't what we're about. we should be talking about real things. >> you're talking george w. bush. the thing is -- >> it's kind of a joke story compared to the akin story. you don't have a running mate who has associations with these characters. if there's a problem, one of the problems romney has by putting ryan on the ticket, it does associate him more with a very unpopular branch of congress and the public opinion polling on congress in general on congressional republicans is horrible. he's taking on some water by

being associated with them. he has a great chance to say these guys are a bunch of idiots. >> bob herbert, that's one of my great frustrations with mitt romney. i said a couple years ago when glenn beck was calling the president a racist. i said you want to run a party and condemn this. you can move forward. look at the examples that george w. bush set and that barack obama set. george w. bush had the majority leader of the senate say something bandage strom thurmond and then he backtracked, but bush killed him. bush killed him immediately. he basically said you're dead. get out of the way. with his actions. you knew it. it was over. barack obama throws anybody under the bus that gets in the way of his ambition. and sometimes he throws everybody under the bus. we could talk about reverend wright. we could talk about some personal things closer to the table here. but he throws people under the

bus. immediately. mitt romney needs to do that today. >> one of the reasons it's been so easy for the obama administration and democrats to define mitt romney is because romney does not get out there and clearly define himself. after all this time, much of the public has no idea what romney really believes in. he was a moderate governor of massachusetts. now he's running like a hard right candidate for president. >> right. >> he has not taken these difficult stance. i agree with you completely. >> and the reason he doesn't, bob, is because he's afraid because he's not a true conservative. >> yep. >> a true conservative can say todd akin, you're an idiot. sit down and shut up. but you're hurting the cause. you're going to help re-elect harry reid shut up. mitt romney can't do that, because he'll go what are the conservatives going to think. >> he's not a good conservative and he's not a good politician. he doesn't understand politics well enough. >> coming up next, senator

claire mccaskill will be with us. >> i think. >> i wonder why she's on today. >> i think the fact that this woman is so dedicated. >> she's awesome. >> to making sure that procurement and military -- i mean. >> she is. >> she's a fiscal -- she's fiscally sound. we're going to talk about nothing but that. the debt's the biggest issue. >> she does need to talk about todd akin. >> we're going to talk about debt and procurement. >> and government reform. >> saving money. that's all we're going to talk about. i'm excited about it. let's be laser focused on this one interview. >> senator claire mccaskill. but first, bill karins with a check on the forecast. >> good morning, mika, joe, you guys. hope you had a wonderful weekend. let me talk about what's going to happen in the tropics. not a lot of bad weather to talk about. this could be interesting especially if you're involved with politics. the next storm out there in between africa and the windard islands would become isaac.

the general motion of that storm is going to be like this over the next couple days. it's going to take probably till about sunday to be anywhere down here from cuba to florida and the bahamas. by the way, on monday, there's something going on in tampa. the republican national convention. and our latest computer guide has it very close to there on monday. we'll have to see how that plays out over this next week. that would be a very disruptive storm if that happened. as of what's happening in the u.s. right now, eastern north carolina getting some light rain. that's about the worst of it. a pretty quiet morning. we'll see showers and thunderstorms typical garden variety including areas of florida. the rest of the country looking nice and quiet. we need the wet weather. especially in the winter mountain west. washington, d.c., very strange cool weather pattern, especially considering how hot of a summer you've had. enjoy it while it lasts. you're watching "morning joe," brewed by starbucks. there are a lot of warning lights

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stand, don't stand ♪ >> if an abortion could be considered in a case of say a tubal pregnancy or something like that, what about in the case of rape? should it be legal or not. >> first of all, from what i understand from doctors, that's really rare. if it's a legitimate rape, the female body has ways to try to shut that whole thing down. but let's assume that maybe that didn't work or thing. you know, i think there should be some punishment but the punishment should be on the rapist and not talking the child. >> that is representative todd akin's explicable ignorant

remarks yesterday. so, mark halperin, you said earlier, the republicans could replace him but have to do it in the next 24 hours. as june fund said, he doesn't think it could happen. can't mitt romney say we're not going to support you and we're going to go after you every day. i'm going to have a sister soldier moment every day on your had ed. get out. >> it's a delicate balance. if he makes that threat and akin stays in the race, then they may be losing the senate seats. that's the difference between a majority or not. and in addition, i don't think mitt romney wants to talk about abortion every day. they want to put this behind him. >> he's going to have to if audakin is the republican nominee. >> he can try to ignore it. >> lots of luck, fellow. >> john cornyn, mitch mcconnell. this is a very delicate moment. this is not a low key thing where republicans are saying this is media bias. george allen running in virginia, proactively put out a

long statement this morning condemning it. >> the question is, whether they have the political smarts to be aggressive, but yeah, lose the senate seat. lose the white house. let's -- balance that out. >> but as mark points out, it's delicate i think partly because the congressional wing of the republican party is going to be gauging in a debate like that how much it actually thinks mitt romney is likely to win. if the calculation is that they're very pessimistic about romney's chances their attitude might be -- >> this hurts everybody. >> i agree with that. >> this hurts george allen in virginia. scott brown in massachusetts. this hurts every candidate. >> because as we've seen, the obama campaign is very good at dominating news coverage with issues that it wants to drive. this is not an issue that mitt romney is going to be able to ignore one way or the other. the obama campaign is going to keep it in his face for every day that goes forward. so that also plays in the balance how you deal with this.

it's not something you can try to hush hush on because he's not been very good on that on other issues. >> there's another element for republicans. if the reporting is right they have to get him out in the next 24 hours, congressman akin has said things in the past. the fear for republicans is he'll continue to say things. >> and sponsored legislation. >> this is the most damaging for the national ticket that connects this to paul ryan. and it's just, they've got to the get him off the stage if. >> if they knew they could cleanly get him out of there and have another nominee, they'd take it in a missouri minute. they can't do that. what's the best play? romney denouncing him, governor romney and paul ryan are doing a joint interview with wmur in new hampshire today. i'm sure he'll be asked about this as well as the skinny dipping in israel. and it's a big moment. some republicans are saying, on twitter and elsewhere, this is

an opportunity for mitt romney if he takes it. >> but if he goes halfway like he's done in the past, he's going to get run over. >> every day he is still out there is another day where as you just said joe, another day where people will ask the question why was paul ryan a cosponsor of a bill with akin that was not quite as bad as this language but pretty close to it, forcible rape and legitimate rape are not very far apart. it would be the same thing in akin's mind. >> the last thing the romney/ryan ticket needs bringing up this issue. >> look at the calendar. this is a week before your convention where you have to define mitt romney. we've been talking about it for months. republicans have been talking about it for months. strategists have been talking about it for months. romney has to define himself in this convention. he's coming off the sea of galilee and this missouri deal. seriously, the sea of galilee deal and missouri deal, i feel like we're doing a cameo for the

campaign part 2. it's unbelievable what they're doing. by the way, let's bring in right now the woman re-elected last night from the st. louis. democratic senator from missouri, senator claire mccaskill. >> not funny. >> claire, that's all right. we don't have to smile. we understand the position you're in right now. >> you know what he said was unbelievably ignorant. >> and offensive. and by the way, everybody has said that universally. >> stop laughing. >> claire mccaskill, good to have you on the show this morning. >> good morning, everybody. >> what do you want to talk about? >> you want to talk about something else? >> procurement, because you're really good at that. >> there's a lot to talk about in in race. i do think it's important for missourans. i know there's a lot of chatter nationwide about what congressman akin said. i know you all are talking about this in the contempt .presidential. for the state i love, i hope this is a moment where everyone

who hasn't been paying close attention, this statement is kind of a window into todd akin's mind. and as someone said on set, if you really look at his record, you realize that while this is jaw-dropping and stunning, i spent ten years as a prosecutor in the courtroom and did hundreds and hundreds of rape cases. held their hands, cried with them. and that's why for me, this is incredibly painful because it shows how many people are out there, sometimes in very important positions, that just don't understand the trauma and don't understand what it means. so for me in this race, i want to make sure that this is a moment where missourans can take a close look. he was elected by the republican primary voters, by a wide margin. and i know there are people that are out of the mainstream that really support todd akin.

but for most missourans, i hope this is a gut check moment when they say this is not somebody we want speaking for us on the floor of the united states senate. >> do you think congressman akin is fit to be a senator from missouri and would you like to see him step down and be replaced so missouri voters have another choice besides doing a general election? >> it's not my place to decide. it is the people of missouri. i think the people of missouri have to make this decision. and on that note, it would be radical, i think, to say to the voters and the republican primary, they had a hotly contested three-way primary. todd akin won by a comfortable margin and was supported by many very strongly, i mean, he has some passionate supporters in the republican party. >> you say it's not your say. but you did get involved in the primary yourself because you wanted todd akin to win, right? >> well, i certainly beban to try to point out to the independent voters of missouri that his positions were so far

out of the mainstream. but there were also other candidates in the race that were working on disqualifying todd akin. there was a lot of ads run by one of his primary opponents about what a big earmarker he was. so i really think that for the national party to try to come in here and dictate to the republican primary voters that they're going to invalidate their decision, that would be pretty radical. i think there could be a backlash for the republicans if they did that. >> there have been reports he spent $2 million to help get todd akin elected. is that true? >> i spent about -- i didn't spend anything near that. i spent some money in the primary against all three of them. >> but you didn't spend 2 million on ads specifically talking about todd akin? >> no, i didn't. no, my campaign did not. >> who did? >> well, there was. >> are those air reasonious reports? >> by the way, this is irony.

there was some super pacs that spent some money during the republican primary. but if you look at the amount of money that was spent, that is a mere drop in the bucket compared to the fact that i have been the number one recipient of super pac money in terms of negative ads, been on the air since last october about i think "the new york times" reported $13 million worth of negative ads most of which is anonymous money that has been run against me in missouri for months on end. >> john heilemann. >> i'm sorry, mika. >> senator, you made the point that this is not just a gaffe on his part. >> right. >> this is reflective of a series set of positions that you think are way outside the mainstream. can you talk a little bit about that and tell us what this connects up to in his record that you'd like to point out? >> well, there's a number of things. and we're talking about some of them right now in the campaign. he wants to abolish the minimum wage on a related top pick back when he was in the state

legislature, he had a hard time really getting comfortable with the notion that we would make marital rape illegal. he indicated at the time that he thought that that could make for messy divorces. and so there have been a number of things that you know, this is a very, very, very, very, very, very conservative person. and obviously, one of the architects of the ryan budget. and of all of the problems that represents. he wants to do away with school lunches. he wants to do away with the minimum wage. he wants to do away with all federal involvement in education including pell grants and any federally backed student loans. you can go down a long list of things where i don't think this is somebody that most of the moderate republicans in this state can support. >> and you had said that the comments that he is now backtracking from are a window into his mind. what is that window revealing in

your -- >> well, this is just somebody clearly who is i think you know, i mean, i don't probably need to explain how wrong his statement was. and by the way, he may be acting like he's backtracking but he didn't say he was wrong. all he said was, he now is acknowledging that someone can become pregnant when they've been raped. what he said in his statement was that it was rare and that there was something in the women's body that could shut down a pregnancy because if it was a legitimate rape. i mean, he hasn't said that that's a wrong statement. he hasn't apologized for that statement. and he doubled down on the notion that not only should rape victims not be entitled to interpret a pregnancy, the morning after he was nominated, he was given an opportunity to talk about the morning-after pill. and he said, he did not think that a rape victim should be allowed to take the morning-after pill. which science tells you that, of course, that is not terminating

a pregnancy. that's just a megadose of birth control that prevents a pregnancy from occurring. >> senator claire mccaskill, thank you very much. and we'll speak to you soon. >> a couple of things. >> thanks, guys. >> a couple things. craig shirley, conservative, well-known conservative in washington, d.c., says that the republican party is has now transformed itself into the party of intoxication, intolerance and idiocy. i second that and mitt romney and paul ryan must separate themselves from. >> and step above it. >> from that today. and john sent this from the "new york times." mr. akin, 65, won the senate republican primary this month with strong support from missouri's religious conservatives but he was also helped by miss mccaskill whose campaign spent nearly $2 million on ads portraying mr. akin has an ultraconservative, it was a clear attempt to bolster his candidacy in the conservative primary.

>> i agree with that. >> that's "the new york times." so you know, it seems to me, seriously, if you want to win and you're a republican, you got one choice. you got to be tough. drive this guy from the race. and mitt romney's the only guy that can do that. there are no party bosses in washington, d.c. >> i think mitch mcconnell and john corn incould play a role. >> john's going to do what -- if mitt calls him up and says i feed your help. tell your guy he's getting no more support. karl rove can call him and say -- karl rove, my god, all the money that he's invested in this race. you know how angry he is at this idiot. >> it's just as important for the senate majority as it is for mist romney. >> john fund said it could never happen. why not? >> they need to all lock arms on this, senate leadership and mitt romney and the super pacs. the reason claire mccaskill was in jeopardy, there was a ton of

outside spending in the primary. she was going to get outspent because of a lot of republican groups coming in. if those groups and the committee and mitt romney all get together, there will be no question around this table. >> we all nope if george w. bush is the nominee and karl rove is a political operative, akin is announcing his retirement today at lunch today. rove would never put up with this, never ever. is this not a real challenge for mitt romney to problem what kind of leader he is? >> the guy just won a competitive primary. the voters spoke. >> with her help of $2 million according to "new york times." >> it's not just a challenge. it's a test. this is a test of all of those guys of the leadership of the republican party. >> without knowing karl rove, i know where karl rove would stand on something like this. i mean, this is a nightmare not just for missouri but candidates he's supporting across the country. you do what you do...

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♪ >> so you know, mark, one of my favorite times of the year is when the academy puts out their nominations. best actor, best actress. so we had one this morning. >> we don't want to downplay the seriousness of congressman akin's remarks and we don't question senator mccaskill's absolute umbrage at what he said, but that was an extraordinarily disciplined

performance. she didn't smile once. she came more in sadness than anger. when i asked her if she thought akin was so out of bounds he be replaced on the ticket, she said, oh, no, the voters have spoken. >> you know why it was disciplined, because it was real. >> but seriously. >> this woman could be a campaign manager for presidential campaign. she's an extraordinaire political talent. >> claire's fantastic. >> we love her. >> she's my favorite senator. >> it would have been equally real if she had expressed abject giddiness. >> she was in danger of losing the seat and now she's going to win. >> she's pretty happy this morning. >> she's going to win. if you don't think she's not doing cartwheels off camera, you don't know the -- you don't know politicians. >> i bet you $40 she discussed the appropriate tone with her political advisers. >> see, that's where -- i was with you all with this and having fun but i disagree. she knows what she's supposed to

do. she's that good. you guys might be able to talk about it a little bit because you all are a little. >> the brilliant kate white is editor in chief from cosmopolitan. she's brilliant. >> i'm so excited. >> if she hasn't signed you, she wouldn't be here. we would say perhaps the stupidist editor in the history of magazines but she's brilliant. >> the author of the upcoming book "i shouldn't be telling you this, success secrets every gutsy girl should know." >> going to be great. >> will you come back with your book? >> absolutely. >> every day for a week? >> i want to talk about helen gurl gurley brown and let's get to the point where we need to self-correct a little bit. first her contribution. she passed away last week. >> i think certainly just in terms of the magazine industry, enormous contribution, cosmo is still number one. and in 64 countries around the world. >> wow. >> but for young women, think

women who were cosmo readers in the late '60s and '70s after she took over would say her message despite controversy was very empowering. it basically said if you work hard enough, you can get what you want in life. >> and about sex. an she brought it to the table. >> yes. that's milwaukeed sometimes, and yet, when you're in your 20s and first of all, she was talking to women who had believed that you shouldn't be having sex if you weren't married and if you were, you should be ashamed of it basically. basically she said no, that's fine. you're entitled. i think she introduced a conversation about sex for young women. >> i think made it okay to talk about and read about. >> because they're not getting that information from any other sources, not necessarily from the friends or the parents and you need that information to have a healthy sexual relationship with a partner. >> isn't it ironic, mika, when you talk to women now, back then she was talking about how it was an empowering for women, young

women to be able to have sex just like men. now sometimes you know, it's empowering for young women to say no. >> what do you think. >> to go counter culture. that's counter culture today. >> yeah. >> my assistant just did a piece for the october issue on being a virgin because she said i haven't met the right guy yet. there are women comfortable today to say i'm not just going to get rid of my virginity. i'm going to pick the right partner. >> do you think so many years later after helen gurley brown came onto the is taken, we do need to pull back a little bit? what are you seeing in young women, especially your readers? are there any concerns that you have? i know that's probably a difficult line to walk. >> i do think young women feel when we polled them about the hookup culture, a lot of them say they wish it didn't exist. you know, i think they would be happy with a little bit of a

retro approach where you don't feel pressured to have sex with a guy on the first date or before he asks you out again and that there was, you know, a little bit of a different approach. and when we polled them, that's what they say. >> when i talk to women about the last book, it was sort of like when i would say don't forget to get married, my advice, not somebody else's, but they would look so relieved, 20 somethings, like oh, is that okay to say, i want to get married. >> no, i think you say in your book so well about how there's a window and i think today, what's sad for a lot of women in their 20s and early 30s, they don't really feel ready yet and haven't met the right partner than window is so small for them. now we know even though there were the stories about have a baby in your late 30s, the ideal time is between 20 25 and 3035 in terms of fertility. >> can we talking about mou

great mika's column is by the way? >> it's so authentic and she says it like it is. young women today are far more interested than when i got to cosmo 14 years ago in this information because the stakes have changed. it's not so ease. they need this kind of information. >> it's about work. but also your book, you're going to be writing about what young women need to know also in the workforce, right? >> right, because and this is what helen got at too, we want relationships, too. we don't just want success. we want to be loved and we want fames perhaps. and that's a really tough balance to find sill. >> got to manage those relationships. >> when's the book coming out? >> september. >> very good. you'll be back. >> you're coming here, right? >> yes. >> i look at the magazine in the airports you know. >> yeah. >> get surprised, don't you? >> like those cover lines. >> every issue is the sex issue. by the way. you don't have to call it the sex issue in july. every issue. >> stop it, grandma.

the new issue of cosmopolitan" is out now kate white, thank you. we'll see you back in september. [ male announcer ] while many automakers are just beginning to dabble with the idea of hybrid technology, it's already engrained in our dna. during the golden opportunity sales event, get great values on some of our newest models. this is the pursuit of perfection.

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>> welcome back to "morning joe."