trakt people who aren't interested in gluten free products. the secret coming up next on your business.

hi, there, everyone. i'm j.j. ramberg and welcome to "your business. "black friday, small business saturday and cyber monday have come and gone but guess what? there are still plenty of days left in this holiday shopping season. retail sales so far this year have been good and there are still plenty of customer dollars to be spent. so what can you do to attract customers and to stand out in this competitive time of year? international sales expert grand

car doan is the founder and ceo of three multi--million-dollar companies, he's also the author of the book "sell and be sold." eva taylor is the publisher of dd d dyimarketers.com. great to see you both. >> great to see you. >> great to be here. >> chances are you may be able to get somebody in your door right now. what can you do to ensure you can get people into your door? >> you're competing with santa claus, the greatest retailer that has ever been on this plan echlt you need to take includes and tips from him. this guy markets himself constantly. he persuades every space possible. he's relentless, and that's how retailers need to think today, like how do i get in somebody's face, social media, tv, radio, handing off flyers, whatever it takes to create omni presence for your product, service.

>> there's your next book, grant, "how to market like santa claus. ". are coupons the way to do it? >> no. i call it the right back at you strategy. that's a lot of money you can't control. you take the money and convert it into gift certificates, send mailings to your neighborhoods with letters inviting people to come to your store. that way that advertising money is coming right back to your store. i know it sounds risky, but i promise you people will not only buy the value of the gift certificate, they're going to buy more. >> how do i figure out who to send the gifts to? >> well, you know what? the united states postal service has an awesome program called every door and that way you can literally choose by mailing route which neighborhoods you want to choose. you can limit that just like

with any other kind of mailing option. you can limit it to 1,000 households or 5,000 households, you know, whatever your bucket will meet. >> what can you do so you can keep them beyond the hioliday season? >> one of the things i recommend, it's more possible than you think. a membership community to keep them coming back for more. one program i really like, if you know the book-of-the-month-club you can have 12 days of product type of program that you offer and that not only exposes products and services that your customers may not know that you've offered. i mean how often does that happen? oh, i didn't know you had that. >> is there anything special you think they can do? >> look. i think the biggest advantage for a small business owner, entrepreneurial, feet around and hands in the business is to

understand that the people you compete with are going to be taken out of the game with santa claus, the attention, the jingles, the ads, everything. people start checking out earlier and earlier in the season. the business owners actually check out and almost give up december. i hear business owners say that, december's going to be a flop for us, you know, it's going to go all to the big retailers. >> i got it. so don't check out. >> don't check out. be in the game. this is your moment to grab market share from these people that are sleeping. >> once you get someone through the door, too, the people of the -- >> love them. love your customer. you're going pay the price, okay? and i wouldn't give discounts right now. your margins are already too narrow. i would offer some free service later in the year, january, february, something they wouldn't have bought anyway, package things. >> ivana agrees because she's shaking her head. thank you so much for giving me your advice. this is an exciting year. i grew up with a retail never the family so every holiday season i knew my dad was working

very hard but i know it was an exciting time. thank you so much, you guys. >> for a small business, focusing on a niche is often the way to go. it gives you a chance to be the in humber one player. what do you do when your niche is too small. the owner of one backry figured it out. ♪ >> if you walk into the by the way bakery in on hastings in hudson, new york it seems like any other bakery. >> we sell muffins, cup cakes. >> but when you walk by the by the way bakery here, it's clear. it's not like any other bakery. >> it is so devastating to find out my son has this. he also has diabetes. but god bless all you people now that have made it so much easier on everyone that has it. >> i make sure to specify that

we're a dedicated gluten-free dare bakery. >> these are two sides of the same company, each showing off to an audience. she was a corporate lawyer fishing around for a new career. after throwing out a bunch of ideas she honed in on one. >> i thought. my town need as bakery. i wanted to do something local. it's a sleepy little village. it's lovely. i thought, maybe i'll do -- i'm going to try. i'm going to be centered in the downtown such as it is in hastings. >> the only problem is when helene ran the numbers, she realized this sleepy little town could not support bakery. so her company needed a twist, something that would inspire people, not only from her town but from all over to become customers. >> that's how the idea of a gluten-free, dairy-free bakery has evolved. finding good gluten-free food can still be a challenge and

helene was right in her assumption. while people won't go far for a typical bakery, they'll travel far for a gluten-free one. lorraine's daughter has celiac disease. >> you go stock up and buy an extra freezer. >> here's the challenge hello leern faced. she knew she could get a gluten-free audience but she needed to entice the hastings locals and gloot gluten-free to walk through the door. when you say gluten-free, you would say not very tasty i probably would have thought, well, it's better for your my health. >> this wasn't the case with helene's food. she spent ten months perfecting her recipes. >> i would bake, bite, throw out. bake, bite, throwout.

i went through 52 versions of the chocolate chip cookie to get it ride. >> well, from the very beginning, the chocolate was fabulous, really fabulous. >> so helene created two personalities if for her company. when she's selling to the gluten-free food, it's all about how she maked the tastiest gluten-free bakeries around. >> this was sponsored bibi the way bakery. >> when she sponsored a local parent/teacher event in town. >> they make a gift bag and i give a coupon that just says welcome to hastings, come in for a free treat. >> and in her store there's barely a word about her being gluten-free. >> what would happen if it said by the way bakery, everything gl gluten free. >> i think it's a small enough population i wouldn't get the traffic. >> she's got the locals who have no idea about her ingredients.

>> i would say i was eating this for quite a while, three months. they said it's gluten-free. i said, really, i didn't know anything about it. >> she's attracted those who know a lot about her ingredients. >> i'll probably get ten really good customers who will make a trip regularly for birthdays and holidays and then i'll get people who come by for casual visits. >> and she's also attracted the attention of local restaurants who want a gluten-free offering on their menu. her lemmon cake is now at red hat on the river, one of her area's best restaurants. >> the manager came in a few times just to get cup cake because we got our hair cut by the same woman. he said, you know? i bet i can sell your dessert. >> for now she's keeping her go-pronged strategy and with it she intends for by the way bakery to grow on all fronts.

>> i hope that i have several stores and that i'm in a couple of regional if not national chains and on a lot of restaurant menus. >> in the meanwhile she's making a lot of people happy. >> it tastes good, it really does. catering to a niche is all well and good when the business can sustain that. but as we just saw, sometimes you have to put in customers from outside that niche. grand car doan is back with us. also here is les mckeown, the founder and ceo of predictable success, an incubation consulting company and author of the book "the synergist:how to lead your team to great success." so good to see you. >> thank you. >> we talk so much on this show about indicatoring to the niche. that's how you can set yourself apart from the big guys but you have to size your market. and how do you do that? >> for me, i made the big mistake at 29 years old of

trying to be an idealist and save the world and it killed me. for years i was trying to deliver this particular product that i thought would change the world somehow and that's not what my clientele wanted. the people did not want what i was pitching or presenting so i would just tell people to open up your parameters like she's doing to say, hey, we have a great food here, period, but because if she did the glut e gluten-free delivery, i would walk past the place. >> like her customers. how do you balance that? >> i like what she's done. she's got a beautiful mind. she's thought this through really well. most people confuse two things, hyperlocal and niche. hyperlocal is different from niche. it's, in fact, quite the opposite. you live in a small town, you have to get as many people into your hyperlocal business as possible. if they're not getting attraction with say a bakery or

a flower shop, they try to add something nish on top like gluten, but i mean there's 6 to 7% of the population has a glunt allergy, you're in a town 106,000 people. you're not going to change the dynamics. in fact, what you're probably going to do is pull down your profitability because of the cost of servicing has become b problematic. i'm not changing niche. i'm thinking how do i change my price, my decor, to get everybody in and you say how do i service them proper will i on their own. like how she approached it. >> as i started work on the story, i found a company that makes pants. they say they make the same pair of pants and have two completely different websites. markets the same pair of pants to two totally different groups. >> right. so when that customer is looking for this thing, whatever this thing is, they get what they expected and that other clientele --

>> the hipster sees someone who looks like them. >> it's politics. >>. she's doing what the democrats did. hairks we need to focus on masses of people who show up and vote and this is where the gop dropped the ball. this is our message, that's it, take it or leave it. >> so how do you get it so you're not pulled in 29 different directions thensome. >> i get the sense that she's got a great focus and that is a fantastic point. what happens a lot when people move to niche is that they swing their focus on there and begin to lose what they had as far as momentum is concern and the other activity. >> and she said something interesting too. she said if i open another store in nok where the population is much greater, maybe i will actually make the market focus on gluten-free if that's what sets me apart and i don't need to get everyone. all right, thank you so much for the conversation. i appreciate it. free shipping offers can be

both an opportunity and a challenge to online sellers. here now are five tips on how to survive free shipping this holiday season, courtesy of ecommerce bites.com. one, a free shipping threshold can increase your added order value. if your customer yushltly spends about $30, you can offer free shipping at $45 to encourage them to buy more. two, add supported shipping. earn revenue that will help offset costs using addship.com. it helping you post transaction e-mails. number three, eliminate double shipping. you can streamline shipping by having your manufacturer or distributor ship directly to your customer. four, explore usps flat rate shipping. this option is most effective when shipping out small but dense items. and number five, you can offer free upgrades if you can't afford free shipping. upgrade customers from standard ground shipping to second day or

overnight for free. it will be a perk that customers will still appreciate, especially if they're shopping last minute. still to come, we answer some of your business questions on things like assigning territories to your salespeople and combatting negative online reviews and gives holiday gifts to employees or clients keep it in communities with these great gift ideas from other small businesses. we've all had those moments. when you lost the thing you can't believe you lost. when what you just bought, just broke. or when you have a little trouble a long way from home... as an american express cardmember you can expect some help. but what you might not expect, is you can get all this

with a prepaid card. spends like cash. feels like membership. watch out. there may be a hidden revenue stream for the stuff that you're throwing out in the trash. here's an example. there's a company which makes, as you can imagine, billiard tables. as a by-product of that he had saw duft all over his workshop. he used to throw that saw duft out. now he takes that saw dust out and turns it into pellets and that accounts for 40% of his revenue. that's what you should do. take the stuff you're throwing oat, do an internet search. tip number 11. find a market for the stuff you're throwing out. with the holiday season upon us, we know how difficult it can be to choose the right gift to

gift to your right business and co-workers. what better way for a small business owner to sep bright the holidays than by giving those people important to your company presents made by other small business owners. kol le colleen debase came with a sack of products. >> we got hundreds of submissions and we made our final pickings based on function, price, deliciousness, and also the story behind all of these products too. >> which makes the present all that more meaningful. starting wi starting with deliciousness cookies. >> they're south american coo e cookies. when she moved here she wanted to stay connected to her culture, to the people of the andes, so she makes these alfajores. we tried them and they're dlinchs. and they're individually wrapped

which is nice. >> moving on. this is unique. >> these are made from vintage vinyl records. she's a corporate refugee. she wanted to start her own business. she realized they would make cool journals and node books so her families and friends encouraged her to start her own business. >> wouldn't that be fun to write for your all of your employees if you know a band that they liked and make it really unique. >> you can make fun songs and she keeps an inventi. >> and it shows that you care about them and know them. cardholders. >> so these are avitar business

cardholders. he wanted to match up his passion for airplanes with artistic talents and started making stuff out of salvaging airplane parts. it's the wing brace of a retired general aviation aircraft. >> those are great looking. >> yeah. it can be for your your business cards or votive candle. >> do you costs? >> $35. s is and the soaps. >> the soaps are from new jersey. she has a personal trauma a few years back. her doctors recommended flour essences. they can counter negative energy and emotion. she thought it would be great to turn it into a business. she puts flower extracts into soaps and sells them. these might be fun for gifts for employees. they say fun things, don't worry, be happy, chill out, focus, focus, focus. >> you can have a different message for everyone.

>> customized, too. >> okay. the handable. this is neat for your clients. we felt this was very prakt >> caller:. it could be good if you have sales people -- what it is, it's david block and his father make these. aaron is 78 years old. he didn't want to wake up his wife, watch tv on his smartphone. i need something to attach to my phone or tablet so i don't block it. it's nice if you want to show someone if you are doing a presentation. that way, you don't drop yours. >> it's easy to hold there. >> it's fun. ift's unique. no one is going to get that. >> they come in different colors and patterns. >> finally, it looks like a rocket of some sort. >> this is my personal favorite, i have to say. this is made by two guy who is

were naval officers. they were the guys that went in and diffused bombs. when their commitment to the military ended, they decided the challenge of entrepreneurship sounded alluring after diffusing the bombs. they decided to make things out of bullets. this is a bullet. it's a bottle opener. every guy in my office tried to steal this from me. >> now you know what to get everyone in your office. >> you can use it to open a bottle of beer. see, it works. >> colleen, thank you so much. again, this is great. as small business owners, we want to support each other. what better way to do it? thank you. thanks for this contest. >> my pleasure. time to answer some of "your business" questions. grant and les are with us. the first is about the best use of your staff.

>> if i offer my people who work with me a 1099, is it better to go nationwide, give them the entire united states to work with or give them a specific territory? >> she's talking sales people. how do you divide up the territories? >> i'm going to defer to grant. whatever he say, it doesn't matter. what is much more important is pick something and give it time to work. the mistake i see people make with territories is carve them up, somebody starts to scream. sometimes it's the big dog, you do what they say. my advice is do whatever grant is about to tell you, but stick with it. >> i have done it both ways. the benefit of assigning a territory is that he then gets to develop and nurture the relationships. the downsides are unbelievable. he starts cherry picking. he gets lazy, he gets soft in the market. the way i would do it is give a

guy a territory, a guy or gal a territory, but put strict quotas on him. you have to bring new business in every year. >> why would someone get lazy? >> once you work a market over and over, you start thinking, okay, you overqualify clientele, they are not interested. i called them last year. they are with so and so. i could drop a new person into that environment without that data. >> got it. >> sometimes knowledge is power, but it can work against people. the natural inclination is to go to the path of least resis tense. >> they stop thinking creatively as well. >> the way to prevent it from happening is here, this is your territory as long as you hit this quota. a question about dealing with the competition. >> i have been in business for over 25 years and recently, i had people say horrible, negative things about my product

and my business. i wanted to stop. what can i do about it? >> it's hard right now. someone says something and it can be multiplied by social media. do you ignore it or get it face on? >> welcome to success. if you are not having people say rot ton things about you. if people are saying rotten things about you, you are doing rotten stuff. people are saying things because you are success f. >> how do you counter act it? >> set up global arts so you get a ping when something happens. then a material decision. you need somebody to help you with it. we get too concerned about our own business and reputation. make a distinction whether it's going help or not. does it harm or not? do what you can. a local coffee shop gets bad reviews off yelp.

don't get oversensitive about it. do good work. people are going to learn what your reputation is if you do good work. >> the hunting line doesn't stop. chasing a gazelle doesn't go off for a squirrel. i would have no attention on this, zero. you want screamers and haters. if you want to get successful, they are coming. if you are getting attention from the player, they are going to come take you out. number two, you are going to have a customer that is not satisfied. if you deal with people, you cannot satisfy everyone. i'm not going to be on defense, ever. i'm going to be out pleasing people, pring all the stuff i do. the new products and services. i have 100 people saying good things, one not. >> this is about hiring and training employees.

>> as i'm growing my business, i'm bringing on new people to train them so i can leverage my time and replicate myself. my question is, how do i do that without giving away my trade secrets. >> she's going to have to give away her trade secrets. >> no business is built on trade secrets. if that's what you think, you have two things, a business is broken. i have to bring people in. i have to let them know what i'm doing. i have to duplicate myself. if that's her fear, her business model is already broken. she needs to put her attention not on what she has, but what she creates. walt disney lost his first idea. someone stole it. he created something. >> there are a few tiny businesses that have trade secrets. whatever it is. the rest of us, 99% squirrels don't have that. i agree entirely with grant,

this is not an issue for most businesses. they overthink it. i would suggest for kim and other folks reverse it. sit down and write out what you think makes your business unique and distinct. start mentoring and coaching your people in how to be better at those things. if that's what makes your business good, you want everybody doing that. start playing your cards like this. >> how do you protect yourself? >> if he leaves my business and does something better with this idea that i have, shame on me. shame on me that i didn't keep him and number two, i let the door open for him to go out and build something bigger. >> i agree, it's his first. squirrel, gazelle, gazelle, squirrel. one or the other. this advice was great and helpful. if you have a question for our experts go to the website, our address is

openforum.com/yourbusiness. once you get there, hit the ask the show link. once again, the website is openforum.com/yourbusiness or if you would rather, just send us an e-mail. the address is yourbusiness@msnbc.com. to learn more about today's show, click on our website, it's openforum.com/yourbusiness. you'll find all of today's segments plus web exclusive content to help your business grow. follow us on twitter,@msnbcyour biz. become a fan of the show on facebook. we love getting your feedback. until next time, i'm j.j. ramberg. remember, we make "your business" our business. we've all had those moments. when you lost the thing you can't believe you lost.