it's when peaceful marchers were violently attacked by police as they tried to cross the bridge. the congressman was beaten in the head with a police baton and was lucky to survive. just hours before being attacked, mr. lewis talked about the march. >> we're marching today to dramatize to the nation and to the world that hundreds of thousands of negro citizens in alabama and particularly here in the black belt area, denied the right to vote. >> last year and years prior, i marched along the same route. children and the elderly, black and white.

on sunday afternoon, we will once again cross the bridge and it couldn't come at a more important time. these were the pictures just a few months ago. >> and joust yesterday, the blavng blank . >> today, the obstacles have changed. but they posed the same challenge. it's up to us to continue marching forward. to walk in the footsteps of those who came before us. thanks for watching. i'm al sharpton. "hardball" starts right now.

>> show down. let's play "hardball." ♪ >> good evening, let me start tonight with this. my kingdom for a horse. how does barack obama escape? how does he avoid personal harm when the country rises up in anger? when the army and nay vil bases stop writing checks, when the airports seize up because the air traffic controllers have been shut. i have my suspicions. not everyone fears this. to the tea party, this is a party. it already is going on now.

to the republican regulars, hey, this could work. it will make the squirrelies out there happy. feeding time at the zoo. and the democrats and president obama, how about this? would you rather you or them take some hits at the pentagon and some other program that is you could blame the republicans for or would you rather go out and sign onto medicare that hurts everyone. it makes it look like you've given the store away. maybe you're thinking i can dig the sequester afterall. i'm joined by the nation's john nichols. i'm going to test my premise with you. the reason, we're probably going to have sequestration because it's better than having to do what you don't want to do. >> i agree with that. but i think it's better in the short term. both republicans in the white

house have calculated. if they let this happen, they will be in a stronger position in two weeks going into a government shutdown, which is the next thing that happens, the end of march. the pressure is going to slowly build of out rage in the country. if we get to the point where nonessential services are also shut down, the pressure will get greater. at that point, at some point, they will have to deal with this. as it is designed now. >> you're saying it's going to be so bad, there's so much yelping and complaining that one of the two sides will have to break and say okay, i'm saying uncle. >> to come to a -- to come to a deal that would then go to the house to replace sequestration,

what would happen is the senate would pass something, laying out where they want to be, it would go to the house and be bipartisan and that point. if obama is willing to go forenough, lindsey graham has already come out and said, i'm willing to talk about ref knews. >> i'm still making the hard argument -- let me phrase it right, that both sides would rather put up with this defend spending cuts and health care and nih and all of those things that people do care about if it means they don't have to cut things like social security, medicare and medicaid if you're a democrat and don't have to raise taxes if you're a republican. what do you think is sort of the rule here and is most likely to happen and least likable? >> what the republicans would love is to have barack obama do

the job for them. mitch mcconnell indicated that. this idea that they would hand the problem over to obama and if he wanted to make the cuts in a couple weeks, they'd let him do it. it's a bad deal. there's clearly an effort here to put the blame on one side or another. >> we know that. but my question to you is what is the cutting edge? when does the president decide i can't stand the sequestration. i can't stand this government shutdown. therefore, i'm willing to do what i don't want to do. when is that going to happen? which one first? >> well, i think it happens probably for the republican side first. and i'll tell you why. it is a fight between the

washington radicalists and the base. boehner has already blinked in a situation like this and allowed for the washington rationalists to vote with the democrats to make changes. that happened in december. and we're going to be looking at a similar situation, i think, pretty quickly. and i believe air travel is going to be the center of this thing. if you start to see two hour lines at the airport shlgs, you're not going to have to wait three weeks for people to get angry. >> the president has to be very careful not to be seen with his hand in this. >> i think the president has to be a hands-on figure looking and actually genuinely trying to solve problems. trying to avoid crises. if the images that he is gaming this thing for political

advantage, that can blow up both ways. he should also be outside of washingt washington sharing the pain. he should do whatever he can to seem highly engaged. >> okay. quick yes or no, mike. you can't have an opinion of strong passion here, but i think that john just made a good point. they would rather go with some kind of revenue increase rather than take this pain. >> let's take a look at today's "washington post." i think it's fair to say, maybe a little liberal at sometimes, makes a great analogy. we have a political system that is the equivalent of a drunk driver.

in my analogy, the president should take the steering wheel and drive the car toward the destination where most maps show we need to be heading. instead, obama has chosen to be co-department. rather than stepping up the leadership since being re-elected, he has tripled the gop hot heads. there's an interesting analysis, john, of saying okay, it's the republicans problem. but the president says the president's got to grab the steering wheel. can he? can he say i'll do this if you do some of the other things. >> well, that's a terrible game.

and then the president has to express things, clearly, he doesn't think are good ideas. this is a platform to protect social security and medicaid. to suddenly start bargaining is a very dangerous game. >> i thought he was bargaining. hasn't he been saying if you guys do revenue reform, i'll do social program reform? isn't that the story here? >> he has. this is the danger of the game. >> what does he do if he doesn't deal? >> he should be out campaigning. he should be aggressively saying where the money is. there are -- when he talks about loopholes, when he talks about things that should be done with the tax code -- >> fair enough. is your position taking no

changes in social security, medicare, medicaid, none of that? it's all going to have to be revenues? >> my position is you should improve medicare and medicaid and there are certainly ways that you can get more revenues for them. but it is absurd to me to suggest that we need to cut social security benefits to say we're going to cut your cola. >> i'm not going to push you more than this one time. if you're the president of the united states and you have the house of representatives which controls all revenue, primarily, how do you deal with them if you don't deal with them? >> well, you have to deal with them. what you have to do is find that rational base within it. there do look to be 50-60 republicans that are willing to look at these issues in a way that most democrats do, or at least reasonably. they're terrified of their own base. so the challenge for barack

obama is he can't remake the republican party. >> you've got one big problem. the speaker of the house sets the schedule. suppose the speaker says we're not going to bring that up? it's not going to be a vote? what are you talking about? there's nothing to make him do that. >> i think what john is saying is we can do this and not hurt anybody. the reality is this is about pain. everything will be fine or the republican line that we're just going to get rid of boondoggles in vegas and the video games will be fine. >> her's one of the great oddities. take a good look at this map.

the united states shown here in green are the ones that pay more in federal taxes than they give back. an the states in yellow are the ones that get more. they're the law make irers that rarely rally against the federal government. the weirdness is the conservatives out there, the people that really don't like the federal government back since jackson's day, they don't like the federal government, yet, they benefit from it. when we had this big sequestration, it goes after naval bases, army bases, it usual v usually tilts to the south. >> this takes us back to the debates in the summer of 2011 when people showed up at the tea party events and said i don't want the government messing with my medicare. the fact of the matter is we have a real problem and it is stoked by a group of players who operate within the republican party. what we desperately need right

now is, frankly, a ronald reagan or a barry goldwater, somebody who will stand up to the irrational section of that party and say, look, i'm a big conservative. but we have got to be big kids. >> i would say john wayne and the panama canal. i think you'd need someone to say we got a lot bigger in our thinking. coming upright now, this party is not big enough for the two of us. that's what the national party says otherwise known as cpac or the republican party. chris christie, the one republican who actually looked good last year, as i've said before, keep it up, guys. you're doing a great job. make sure none of your popular figures show up at your event. the role of women, are they really getting a big enough

role? and, of course, the pre-scandals. i see no one has a solution to the sequester's silliness. but everyone has their lines of attack ready. here they are. >> feeling with the whielt house is like dealing with a bowl of jell-o. >> well, that's a side show. finally, let me finish with my hope that the college of cardinals selects someone who can embrace the future, not cling to the past. and this is "hardball," a place for politics. there's no subtex. just tacos. yeah, it's our job to make you want it. but honestly... it's not that hard. old el paso. when you gotta have mexican. otherworldly things. but there are some things i've never seen before. this ge jet engine can understand 5,000 data samples per second. which is good for business. because planes use less fuel,

spend less time on the ground and more time in the air. suddenly, faraway places don't seem so...far away. ♪ and we got onesies. sometimes miracles get messy. so we use tide free. no perfumes or dyes for her delicate skin. brad. not it. not it. just kidding. that's our tide. what's yours? it may be happening again. the republican party is one step closer to running a far-right candidate. that's because u.s. congressman tom latham of iowa has decided not to run for the seat of tom harkin potentially clearing the way for steve king. king suggested president obama's

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welcome back to "hardball." the one big lesson the republicans took away from the 2012 spanking was time to broaden its base. if they want to appeal to more people and why with a conservative plilt kal action conference why not invite chris christie to speak at their annual meeting? look at this approval rating up in jersey. 74%. that's in a blue state, that democrat state that hasn't gone republican in a presidential year since 1988. the head of american conservative union defended cpac.

governor christie wasn't invited last year bauds he did a great job. this past year, he strongly add voe kalted for a pork barrel bill. so he was not invited back to speak. >> i didn't know that i hasn't been invited to cpac until two days ago when i saw it in the news. yeah, apparently, i hadn't been invited. listen, i wish them all the best. they don't want to invite me, that's their call. it's their organization. it's their business. it's not like i'm lacking free invitations to speak here and around the country. it's not like i have a who i will lot of openings in my schedule. i can't sweat the small stuff,

i've got a state to rebuild. >> he had that one ready, i think. i don't think he thought of that one on the spur of the moment. you know, i have to say, michelle, you're up in new york right now. where are you right now? >> i'm in new york. >> you should have shared the media market. 11% of people watching in new york, basically. he eets big. he's big in connecticut. he's big in jersey. i'm sure he's huge in pennsylvania. why would you say we don't want your kind? >> bauds he deviated from republican orthodoxy. what's funny is it was just last year, you'll remember, when republicans, including very conservative republicans were

basically begging him. you said before that republicans agree that they need to expand their tent. i'm not sure that all conservatives do agree with that. >> yeah, i know that part. lit's stick to christie. that's a weird thing, too. there's no gay conservatives. let's go with this thing. pork barrel spending. in other word, not only adding insult to injury, they're saying they're not going to invite christie. oh, by the way, helping save new jers jersey, saving them is pork barrel. >> first of all, accusing a governor of liking pork barrel

is like accusing a ballerina of liking her toes. secondly, christie wanted relief. >> would you describe that a shot at the fact that he's a big guy? i wonder. >> well, he wanted relief for people devastated by a hurricane. we gave relief to people on the gulf coast and new orleans. >> let's take a look at the polling on this guy. and i think most politicians are lucky, and the president is doing pretty well right now. look at this guy. three quarters of the state in new jersey, and that includes a lot of deep down, regular democratic voters. and look at the numbers he's pulling. he's getting almost every

imaginable vote. >> part of the reason he's popular is because he's not the kind of conservative that cpac embraces. you know, that's why he's beloved right now. that's also why the party is angry at him. >> let me tell you about my home crowd. he's pro-life. he has the right values by their standards. he's a cultural conservative. regular family guy. he fits that mold of reagan democrat. the kind of people that switch to the american party under ronald reagan. >> but michelle has put her finger on it. it's suspicious oaf anybody who's popular with bulk of americans.

>> do you mean they don't like people that win? >> they figure there's got to be something wrong with him. >> when did that start? i mean, reagan was popular? >> it started when etiology began driving the party rather than somebody elected to office. >> yeah, there must be something. as i said, some on the right don't agree. here's charles crownhammer, a pretty conservative guy, on fox tuesday. >> he's a leading republican. >> look u i wasn't very happy with what he did in sandy. i think he deserved three months in quarantine. i have him in cpac. we should have a wide tent. >>.

>> we thaugtsd he was going to be kind. he said yeah, if we put him in stocks for three months then you can let him show up at your little meeting. what do you think here? your last thought? >> isn't that amazing? >> that's about as nice as they're going to get. what i think is that the republican party is still in the process of imploeding. there's no counter weight to cpac. there's no equivalent to the democratic leadership committee. >> that picture of them working together on the shorings of jersey was the one happy note that the american public got to see in this whole election. >> you know who wins?

the most likable candidates. chris christie is a likable guy. >> my 2k3w0d, i love it when we have okens' razor right here. up next, this week's spending cuts showdown as the fifth fiscal crisis since republicans took over the house of representatives. sibs then, we've heard colorful analogies from both sides. that's coming up on "hardball," the place for politics. with the spark miles card from capital one,

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inventive with their lines of attack during the final showdown. >> dealing with the white house is like dealing with a bowl of jell-o. >> we might as well do it now. pull off the band-aid. >> it's the section of which train will be arriving. >> you have been quote as calling this agreement a sugar quoted satan sandwich. is that how you feel about this deal? >> what i'm saying is what you see is ante thet kal. we're going to be extremely noncommitted. >> our plan b would protect american taxpayers who make a million dollars or less. >> plan b? i would call it planned befuddled.

>> our military chiefs don't have the ability to place those cuts thoughtfully. they have to go through and cut right across the board. >> wake up. use your brain for god's sake. >> i think they're nudging the potato across the table with their nose. >> everybody knows you don't like each other and you're trying to pretend you do. >> this is not a cliff. but it is a tumble downward. >> we should not have to move a third bill before the senate does something. >> i think he has to understand who is sitting on their posterior. >> up next, pope benedict has officially stepped down now and the search can begin for his successor. but the search is in crisis and it needs the next pope to right the ship. that's ahead. this is "hardball," the place for politics. crest pro-health for a week.

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here's what's happening right now. venezuela president hugo chaves is said to be fighting for his life. he has not been seen since december. he returned to venezuela on the 18th. back at home, the women's act expired in december, 2011. he did plead guilty to 16 lesser charges. back to "hardball." >> we're back, 85-year-old pope benedict made history today when he left the vatican in helicopter. it's for the first phase of his

retirement. his final tweet as pope, he said thank you for your love and support. may you always experience the joy that comes from putting christ at the center of your lives. his departure ushers the new era of church and the one billion catholics worldwide. tom roberts is managing editor of the national catholic reporter. george, you know, an more than presidential politics, we always tried to correct for the latest president. we had truman who was too much of a kansas city. we had nixon who had never been involved in politics or to washington. carter was seen as weak. what are they going to try to correct, if you will, in history in this conclave?

>> i think the cardinals are looking for a charismatic, missionary, evangelical, if you will, pastor. someone with real experience of people. someone who can present the churnl's proposal to the world with confident and good humor. and i think they're looking for a man who can hire someone, an effective cardinal secretary of state to take a grip on the vatican. who, at the present moment, is not functioning very well at all. so i think that's the package deal. >> tom, let me ask you the same question. will they go for ceo or chairman of the board sort of figure and hoping or believing that he would be the right person to pick a tough operating officer.

>> well, in this case, i agree with george. i think that they do need a pass tor -- i think all of the qualifications george laid out would mean it would have to be in the conclave of the pope. but i think somewhere short of that, it's a deeper problem in the cardinals in the conclave will confront is the question about themselves. how do they become credible religious leaders at a time when the church is really besieged by the scandal. >> it's more refleblgtive than what kind of management do you need. i think that's an essential question. >> george, do you think that -- let's just talk practical.

do they think that the church's challenge is to re-examine the concept of a sell bat priesthood? they have something to do with the challenges they put for the men to come up and give up sex for life. it obviously has something to do with the scandals. >> chris, i don't think so. the sell bat priesthood is a 2,00-year-old tradition. and i don't think anyone ought to think of marriage as a remedy for sexually immature people. marriage is not a crime prevention program. the enormous problem of sexual abuse of clergy which has scarred the churnl throughout the world is a problem of faith. it's men who have not understood and internalized the faith of

the church, made that the center of their lives and since we know, from all of the sociological studies, the sexual abuse of the young is a societal wide plague and is very hard for anyone to say that a married clergy helped solve that problem. >> well, frank bruney the other day in the new york times, tom, i want to ask you, he said the problem is unreasonable. that very few men are willing to give up sex for life whether they're heterosexual or gay or whatever. that's why you had situations where keith o'brien who was the head of the catholic church in the united kingdom, he was making overtures to other young priests. so the question is rath ir than

central discipline questions, like the priesthood, which is the celibacy issues. >> yeah, i think the celibacy issue, i don't think it's going to be part of the conclave discussion. i would agree with george that a married clergy is not going to solve that problem. the distinctive in the churng is the fact that bishops could send priests from parish to parish or even other countries and the missing link an all of the church has done to try to solve this problem is there's no account on the part of bishops. and he's still a bishop. there's nothing being done about it. so i think that the, you know, the question of celibacy is far more complex than the way that

mr. bruney talked about it. it's not a 2,000-year-old tradition. i think it's 600 years old. but the point is, it's far more complex and far more evolving of the leadership of the church than the individual accounts. >> let me ask you, journal, about this cardinal. he's a very attractive guy in so many ways. he's very american and regularly, if you will. has this guy got a shot or just thinking that he does? >> chris, i think what we used to call the super power veto, the notion that you couldn't have an american pope bauds the united states was the hyper power, as the french foreign minister once called us, i think that's gone.

there is no overwhelmings super power. that was the case immediately after the cold war. and i've said on several of our broadcasts, i don't think a north american pope is out of the question. >> you mean the quebec archbishop miegts have a better shot? >> i think a number of north american cardinals are going to get a look in this conclave. and that's something really quite striking. it shouldn't be that surprising because given the very difficult circumstances of the catholic church in europe, it's really falling through the floor boards in a number of places. catholic church in the united states look like a pretty vibrant place.

it's still a vital, vibrant can thol i678. and that's going to be attractive. up next, the big question about the way we live in this country. should people that work from home at home? it's a hot debate right now at a very well-known company. you're watching "hardball," the place for politics. where do yo? campbell's healthy request soup lets you hear it... in your heart. [ basketball bouncing ] heart healthy. great taste. mmm... [ male announcer ] sounds good. it's amazing what soup can do. before taking abilify, an antidepressant alone helped me get out from under. but sometimes...depression still dragged me down. i'd been feeling stuck for a long time. so my doctor added abilify to my antidepressant. she said some people had symptom improvement as early as 1 to 2 weeks. now i feel more in control of my depression. [ female announcer ] abilify is not for everyone. call your doctor if your depression worsens or you have unusual changes in behavior, or thoughts of suicide.

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caroline kennedy is going to become president obama's pick as ambassador to japan. the vetting process isn't yet complete. caroline kennedy along with her late uncle ted kennedy. you remember that high-profile event in 2008 in washington, the symbolic passing of the torch from the kennedys to obama. there it is. we'll be right back. [ male announcer ] you are a business pro. executor of efficiency. you can spot an amateur from a mile away... while going shoeless and metal-free in seconds. and you...rent from national. because only national lets you choose any car in the aisle...and go. you can even take a full-size or above, and still pay the mid-size price.

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she wants employees who work remotely to be physically present in the office. the decision set off a nationwide debate and struck a nerve with some. some say she's the boss, if she wants employees in the office, that's her call. others say it's a step back in tef lugs of work and life accommodation and puts an extra burden on workers. joining me is lauren ashburn of the daily beast who is former editor of usa today's vision and editor in chief of the web site hollywood life.com. let me start with you because i don't know exactly where you stand. is that as productive? as useful for the office as the person who comes in at 8:30 in the morning? >> of course it is. i'd quit if marissa mayer came to me and said you have to be in the office ef day. as a working mother, i have a

lot of different things pulling on me. and so do other working mothers and fathers. i am a much better employee -- or i was -- but i was a much better employee when i could be flexible. it's not right for everyone to be working outside of the office. is it her actual call? of course it's her call. she can do whatever she wants. its's yahoo. but i would quit. >> where's the best work? >> i'm a mother, also. and i'm also a boss. and i have a great team at hollywoodlife.com. i can tell you i've always found that it's been best for all of us to gather in the office, to be able to exchange ideas and be able to do that at any time.

when a new development comes up, we're all there. i completely understand what marissa is trying to do. they haven't had the best results. she's there to make change. so she has to do what's necessary. >> but bonnie, don't you think she's going to be losing really good

>> look at these excerpts from the actual -- and that starts with physically being together. it extends beyond just the home types. the memo continues for the rest of us who occasionally have to stay home for the cable guy, please use your best judgment in the spirit of collaboration. >> i want to go back to lauren. i've got family members with very high i.q.s. our sisters and law and people like that. >> and your wife, don't forget your wife. >> but she doesn't work from home. and they get a lot of good work.

>> it's not going to be all right. women are women's worst enemy. right? marissa happens to be beautiful, young, rich. $100 million package. she can do that kind of thing. but a lot of other women absolutely can't. and women are much more successful if you give them some leeway to take care of their children and to work. i would get up at 6:00 in the morning, do some work, get the kids up. then i would take them and -- you know, you need to have that in order to be productive. >> okay. let me -- go ahead. >> but listen, would we even really be having this big a discussion if marissa mayer

wasn't a woman? if a male ceo had come in -- let's not forget. she was pregnant and she took a lot of heat because she took the job when she was five months pregnant. and then she only took two weeks of maternity leave. so would we even be having this discussion if it was a male ceo who had issued these orders? >> absolutely not. we would not be having this discussion. >> explain to me why we wouldn't be having -- anyway. >> most companies, though, do have a policy where you have -- where employees are expected to come in to work. i think it was a more unusual policy to have hundreds that weren't there. >> the media love to build people up and then they love to tear them down. and marissa is being torn down. >> okay. this is being generalized too much. let me get back to this. one of you two just said it's a male -- if a male had done this it wouldn't be an issue. what do you mean by that? just explain why it wouldn't be an issue. >> it wouldn't be an issue at all because the male isn't normally the caregiver of all of the children. traditionally. that is changing. but here we have a woman, a

young woman who just had a baby who, don't forget, built a nursery next to her office. and now she's telling other people that they can't take care of their children in a way that works best for them and their job. >> okay. thank you, lauren ashburn-w a little edge there. a little shot with the elbow. but thank you very much. to somebody really rich, as you point out. $100 million person a year can probably take the shot. thank you, bonnie fuller, for both sides tonight. when we return, let me finish with my hopes for the next pope. he's going to need to be strong, young, and yes, i think liberal. and you're watching "hardball," the place for politics. ♪ i'd like to thank eating right, whole grain, multigrain cheerios! mom, are those my jeans? [ female announcer ] people who choose more whole grain tend to weigh less than those who don't. multigrain cheerios the battle of bataan, 1942. [ all ] fort benning, georgia, in 1999. [ male announcer ] usaa auto insurance is often handed down from generation to generation

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