telling us to follow jesus because judgment day is coming. where madonna was aciconoclasti. he said, i figured out what you are, a damn republican. them is fighting words. he grew up a seven day adventist. more than that, he group up in the first generation to have gospel widely dispersed in popular music which is a big reason why the co-mingling of the spiritual and secular are common in his music often combined in the body of a song. take "a door" one of his greatest blads. he describes a sex scene described being watched by angels in heaven crying tears of joy. spiritual and sex cry within a moment for him. prince sees the love of fwgod a sex coming from the same source and demanded the freedom to have god and sex as he demanded identity freedom rather than having race and gender be defined boxes separately. he wanted to be black and white, male and female, questioning

what it means to be black and male, breaking the rules around identity to gain personal freedom and tell us we have the freedom to be whoever we choose to be. that's a decidedly liberal conception of identity, i think. prince's music and career is layered in deep. in a prior life i was a music journalist and felt like getting back to that for a minute and exploring one of my favorite artists and someone who mattered a lot to my generation. check it out. "i would die for you" is available tomorrow. available right now on a tv set near you, the "martin bashir show." >> thank you, toure. good afternoon. it's monday march the 18th. the republican reboot is under way. wait for it. wait for it. >> there's no one reason we lost. >> way too many people believe republicans are anti-immigrant. >> our message was weak. >> anti-woman. anti-science. >> we weren't inclusive. >> anti-gay. anti-worker. >> there's a long list of them. >> the list goes on and on and

on. >> buck up or stay in the truck. buck up and run. >> i'd say, if i did run for office and win, i'd serve out my term. >> if standing for liberty and standing for the constitution makes you a wackobird, chen count me a proud wackobird. >> cpac had to cut back on its speakers this year by 300 pounds. >> barack obama, you lied. >> i think it's about dignity and respect. >> so this go-round, he's got the rifle, i've got the rack. we begin with the republican party facing a serious case of the mondays. after a weekend carouse iing at cpac, no doubt downing a few in honor of st. patrick, today came the reckoning with the

revelation of their own autopsy on what went badly wrong in 2012. this morning, it fell to rnc chair, reince priebus to give his party an uncompromising look in the rearview mirror. >> our message was weak. our ground game was insufficient. we weren't inclusive. we were behind in both data and digital. and our primary and debate process needed improvement. >> yes, mr. priebus presided over the party for all of that and he remains in charge for the release of the savage and scolding document, "the growth and opportunity project." gop. get it? a blistering report based on 52,000 voter contacts. and the respondents apparently didn't mince their words. >> focus groups described our party as narrow minded. out of touch. and, quote, stuffy old men. >> by the way, it's reince

priebus' birthday today. happy 41 years to you, young sir. back to stuffy old men, and as therapists like to say, admitting you have a problem is is the first step. and if packaging is partly the issue, former florida governor jeb bush pointed out, there's not a lot of love for gop policies, either. >> all too often, we're associated with being anti-everything. way too many people believe republicans are anti-immigrant, anti-woman, anti-science, anti-gay, anti-worker, and the list goes on and on and on. >> oh, it certainly does. and if that weren't enough, in what's perhaps the gop's biggest challenge, many republicans right now are anti-each other. case in point, keynote speaker an rising star, senator ted cruz. taking on party elder, john mccain. >> we did have a certain eminence greze of the republican party describe rand paul and me

as wackobirds. if standing for liberty and standing for the constitution makes you a wackabird, count me a proud wackabird. >> everyone's favorite, rand paul, did win cpac straw poll, by the way. when it wasn't those two wackobirds, it was an angry bird, ann coulter, going after chris christie. >> cpac had to cut back on its speakers this year by about 300 pounds. >> stay classy, mrs. coulter. remember, republicans are working hard to win over women voters. after all, they gave the longest speaking segment of all at cpac to freedom-loving, soda-drinker, sarah palin, who lobbed a verbal spit ball right at bush's brain, karl rove. >> these experts who keep losing elections, keep getting rehired, raking in millions, buck up or

stay in the truck. buck up and run. the architects can head on back to -- they can head on back to the great lone star state and put their name on some ballot. >> rove responded that he didn't think it would be a very good -- he would be a very good candidate because he is, quote, sort of a balding fat guy. buck up, karl. take a big gulp. you have a long week ahead. we are joined now by msnbc political analyst, former senior adviser to the president, david axelrod live with us from phoenix, arizona. good afternoon, sir. >> martin, good to be with you. >> it's been suggested that you and your team were responsible for defining mitt romney and the republican party over the course of last year. in fact, both mr. romney and mrs. romney have complained that they were negatively defined by the president's campaign. but don't the events at cpac

this weekend prove that if anyone's responsible for the ugly, noninclusive brand, it's the party, itself? >> yeah, i think mitt romney's problem began with the party whose nomination he was seeking. he made so many accommodations to try to get that nomination. you know, self-deportation, i'm going to kill planned parenthood, and so on. that he literally walled the party and himself off from a lot of voters in the general election. this, i heard chairman priebus say today that they're a big tent party, and in the sense that it's kind of a circus right now, he's probably right, but, boy, those divisions are really easy to see between the establishment republicans in washington and, perhaps, in some of the state capitals and these grassroots republicans represented by cruz and by rand paul and some of the social conservatives. so they've got some deep

problems and it's not just about whether they had enough technologists but whether they had the right ideas to win a national election. >> right. how can a party re-brand itself when its best known annual conference showcases the most ignorant and barely concealed race racism in the form of the contribution by sarah palin on saturday calling the president a liar was just the beginning. take a listen. >> more background checks. the idea, mr. president, should have started with yours. he's considered a good politician which is like saying bernie madoff was a good salesman. >> mr. axelrod, she also said the president is an expensive waste of time, appearing in his own reality television show. is this what psychiatrists call projection? >> well, she also said he should walk away from his teleprompter and she read the line from a

teleprompter. the whole thing was sort of surreal, but i think the important thing to note is how well she was received here in what is sort of the citadel of the grassroots of the republican party. and that sends a strong message to chairman priebus and others trying to heal the wounds of the party that they've got a lot of work to do. when she ridicules background checks for guns, she's taking on an issue 92% of americans support and she got a big hand for it in that room. that tells you the gulf that exists for the republican party. the problem they have to solve, how do you nominate a candidate who can be elected in this country? if that's the position they're going to take, then they're going to have a hard time doing that. >> this scald republican autopsy or coroner's report includes a great deal from focus groups who found the party as, i'm quoting here, "scary, narrow minded, out of touch and a party of stuffy old men." david, you're the expert. where do you begin?

>> expert on being an old man? >> no, no, i didn't say that. >> i plead guilty of that. >> in analyzing the wellbeing of political parties and actually winning elections. you are something of an expert, sir. >> i heard rove's comment and i really can relate to the pudgy old man characterization he had. but in terms of the republican party, look, you know, jeb bush made probably the most meaningful speech at the cpac meeting. you quoted some of it. he said much of what was in that republican report. the fact is nobody there mentioned in any great length immigration reform which is something the report said republicans should embrace in order to win the election. nobody there dared talk about it. they didn't talk about -- they talk in this report about how we have to embrace civil rights. it's important to young voters. republican, independent and democrat. no, not one person was willing to take on the issue of gay marriage, which is, of course, the central issue they were

implying is driving some young, a lot of younger voters in this country. so they have massive problems. the other problem is that when you look at this report, what they're trying to do, and jonathan martin in "politico" wrote a nice piece about this today. they're suggesting structural changes that will make it much harder for insurgent candidates like the rand pauls or the rick santorums to challenge for the nomination by shortening the process by condensing, by aggregating primaries so that you have to cover a lot more territory. by eliminating caucuses and conventions as a means of nominating candidates by a state. all of those things would give establishment candidates a much better chance to win the nomination and may give the republican party a better chance to win a national election. but they're courting a rebellion among their own troops and you saw some of that at cpac on the weekend. >> we've been watching it, sir, throughout the week. the president has been battling

republicans over a way forward for the nation's economy. has the president, do you think, lost any leverage following the sequester? which some commentators are suggesting has not been anywhere near as bad as the president, himself, warned it would be? >> well, i think that the steps that he took in 2009 and 2010 and beyond have been great steps, and the american, in terms of bringing the country back, and the american economy is a resilient economy. but it was never the case that the sequester was going to on day one drag the economy down. and, you know, the concern is over the next six months and over the long term. one projection of one of the, i think macroeconomics said they expect to see 700,000 jobs lost as part of the sequester. that's going to be over time. so the wise thing to do would be to find a sensible replacement for the sequester in the coming months. and i think that's what his

efforts are going to be placed. and hopefully he'll find partners on both sides of the aisle to do that in the coming months. but let's be honest about it, it's a difficult environment because you have a very, very locked in, particularly in the house, a very locked in republican majority that is resistant to any kind of new revenues to help solve the problem. >> david axelrod, sir, thank you so much for joining us this afternoon. >> always good to be with you, martin. next, the supreme court hears another case aimed at restricting voting rights. stay with us. >> is he right that we don't have an immediate crisis? >> we do not have an immediate debt crisis, but we all know that we have one looming. >> so you agree with the president on that? >> the american -- yes. ♪ baby, baby don't leave me we've all had those moments. when you lost the thing you can't believe you lost.

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laws designed to combat voter fraud are popular with one particular demographic, the one that lost the white house in november. today, those forces are arguing before the supreme court that an arizona voter fraud law is so important its stringent documentation requirements so necessary that we should forget that federal law trumps state law. indeed. to understand, just how popular these laws are with conservatives, watch how the crowd at cpac responded to south carolina governor nikki haley when she mentioned her own state's voter fraud law. >> every election in our state now requires photo i.d. before you vote.

>> joining us now is democratic congressman elijah cummings of maryland. welcome, sir. >> it's good to be with you. >> what is your response, sir, to hearing the crowds cheer like that for voter i.d. laws? because that line about voter fraud got a bigger response even than her line trashing the affordable care act. >> first of all, martin, i believe that voting is a right. and it's something that is afforded to all of our citizens and we should not be doing anything to prevent people from voting. and i think the arizona law is -- that is what it's about. and, of course, nikki haley is talking about the same thing. an effort to not stomp out voter fraud like they claim they're doing, but it's an effort to make sure that there are tremendous hurdles that are put in front of voters to jump over, and basically stops them from

doing what citizens have a right to do already. >> but congressman, that was -- >> i think it's sad. >> congressman, that was the longest applause on anyone on the day she was speaking, on basis that she was proudly promoting voter i.d. >> well, we know, martin, that the republicans know that america is not buying what they are selling. and so what they've decided to do is to make sure that they block the person doing the buying. and that's basically what this is all about. and they know good and well that the motor voter law that we're talking about here, the national law that trumps the arizona law, clearly the intent of a congress was to make it easier for the voter to be able to vote. and they are making it harder. when you can simply send in a postcard, under the penalty of perjury you say you have a citizen and you're qualified to

vote, then they want to put something on top of that, to then say that you have to produce all of these documents to show that you're a citizen of the united states, martin, come on. i mean, that's just another way of blocki ining people from vot. and i tell you, i'm so glad that nancy pelosi has appointed a committee, a task force, to address this issue. >> right. >> and hopefully we'll be able to come up with some solutions. because the thing that we've got to do, and i thank you so much for bringing this up, martin, we've got to have pushback against these things. these kinds of laws, and these kinds of efforts. because they are not going to stop. because they can see that this is their only way to possibly win elections. >> well, congressman, to your point, and just to prove that we're not here spouting knowledge sen nonsense, but it's on the basis of fact, let me show you what governor haley's state election committee discovered last year

when it looked at supposed incidents of, quote, dead people voting. on 207 votes it examined, about half were the result of clerical error. for instance, john smith jr. votes but a poll worker marks him as john smith sr. the second most cited reason was error on the part of the state's dmv. the only dead voters were three people who voted by absentee ballot but then died before the election. in other words, sir, where is the voter fraud that governor haley is talking about? >> i think almost -- >> it's nonexistent. >> it's nonexistent, and, martin, if you look at all of these states that have put forth laws to make it harder for people to vote, mainly through voter i.d., we see just a lack of any kind of fraud taking place. they're supposed to be trying to stomp out or trying to prevent. and clearly, martin, this is

unpatriotic. i mean, folks get up and they salute the flag and sing the national anthem, but at the same time they turn around and try to take the most basic right that every citizen has and that is the right to vote. and i think it's very, very sad. and very unpatriotic. >> can i finish, sir, by referring you to another event at cpac, in addition to nikki haley? there was a cpac panel on race. an attendee said some very controversial things. for instance, that slave owners provided slaves, quote, food and shelter, and that's nothing to apologize for. what was your response, particularly as the gop says it much now engage with african-american voters, to a comment like that? >> i think the gop has made it very clear and through comments like that, and i realize it was only one person, but i know that there are others who feel the same way. i think they've shown why it is that it's very difficult, it not

impossible, for them to attract african-americans, hispanic, and other voters, minority voters, to vote for their candidates. nobody wants to vote for a party that is against them. and talks about them like that. now, let me say this. again, i understand that that may have been one person, but it seems to me, martin, that you would have had somebody at the leadership of that cpac convention, some of our politicians that spoke, rand paul and others -- >> sure. >> -- should have gotten up there and say, wait a minute, we do not stand for that and we're not going for that, and we have a major problem and that person should not have been a part of what we're doing. maybe you heard it, but i haven't heard anybody say that yet. so it's quite insulting and quite unfortunate. we have no room for that in today's society. diversity is our promise and not our problem. >> congressman elijah cummings, as ever, sir, thank you for joining us. >> thank you.

coming up, the most egregious examples of racism on display at cpac. their big tent is getting oh so small. stay with us. >> i'm sorry, but we're not disrespectful to anybody. look at what these focus groups have got these poor guys believing. look at this. our party is narrow minded, o. out of touch. not out of touch. we are in touch with the founding of this country. we are in touch with the greatness of this country and its people. i'd like one of those desserts and some coffee. sure. cake or pie? pie. apple or cherry? cherry. oil or cream? oil or cream? cream. ♪ [ male announcer ] the sound of reddi-wip is the sound of joy.

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for lgbt americans and all americans. >> that, of course, was hillary clinton announcing her support for same-sex marriage in a human rights campaign ad. this formal endorsement comes as a new abc news/"washington post" poll finds a record 58% of americans now favor the legalization of same-sex marriage. and while the republican party takes a long, hard look at their fail wrure to be more inclusive minorities, it seems their oversimplified solution can be found in a single line in today's gop autopsy report. "we need to campaign among hispanic, black, and gay americans and demonstrate we care about them, too." a stop, perhaps, but indeed the grand old party would be wise to heed the advice of secretary clinton. >> i believe america is at its best when we champion the freedom and dignity of every human being. >> well said, ma'am. stay with us.

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speeds relief to your worst cold symptoms plus has a decongestant for your stuffy nose. thanks. that's the cold truth! from lady liberty's gun rack and more whacobirds at cpac to the never ending gop autopsy. here are today's top lines, snap, crackle and pop. >> more background checks. then the idea, mr. president, should have started with yours. >> i'm not remotely cool enough to be sarah palin. >> step away from the teleprompter. >> thbat crap crazedy. >> should have seen what todd got me for christmas. it's a met that rack for a hunting rifle. >> what am i going to do with a gun rack? >> he's got the rifle, i've got the rack. >> don't like it? >> big gulp, sir. all right. >> shoot, it's just pop. >> the palin liberty pose looks strikingly similar to lady liberty. >> these experts who keep losing elections.

>> if i did run for office and win, i wouldn't leave office midterm. >> certain eminence greze describe rand paul and me as wackobirds. >> that was inappropriate. >> count me a proud wackobird. >> it's not an immediate problem. >> we don't have a debt crisis right now. >> you agree with the president on that? >> yes. >> they're going to take 10% out of your bank accounts. it's happening in europe. could it be happening here next? >> we were playing footsie debating each other 23 times, they were getting the job done. >> the face of the republican party needs to be the face of every american. >> i believe the marriage is the union of one man and one woman. >> we're associated with being anti-everything. >> the talk about raising revenue is over. >> the caricature becomes true. >> anti-immigrant. anti-woman. anti-science. anti-gay. >> narrow minded, out of touch. stuffy, old men. >> white guys from below the mason-dixon line. >> this is the name of the panel discussion. are you sick and tired of being called a racist when you know you're not one?

>> party that parachutes into communities. >> if you get called a racist often enough to be sick and tired of it, you might be a redneck. >> the obama campaign. the relationships were deep. they were authentic. >> let's get right to our panel now. angela rye, political strategist and principal of impact strategies. jonathan capehart is an opinion writer for the "washington post." ea steve kornacki, my colleague and co-host of "the cycle." at the top of the gop coroner's report, sorry, autopsy, it says, we must recruit more candidates who come from minority communities, but it's not just tone that counts, policy always matters. how well do you think they dress policy toward minorities in this publication? >> very little to not at all. if you look at the latino vote, there seems to be an acknowledgement immigration is a problem for the republican party. >> you would have thought so after 74% of latinos voted for this president and 94% of african-americans voted for the president. and 91% -- sorry, 71% of

asian-americans voted. >> immigration covers, you know, basic -- does not cover nearly all of your problems. >> indeed. >> right there. but what i'm really struck by is i can think back decades to moments like this in the republican party when there have been frank and blunt acknowledgement from party leaders that, hey, we have a problem appealing to nonwhite voters. i heard newt gingrich say this at the end of the reagan presiden presidency. heard ken melbin say this in 2005. he said, we've learned we're not going to do this again from now on, we're going to every corner of the country, going to talk to every voter. the common thread is they never seem to have anything it say when they embark on these cross country exhibitions to talk to everybody. >> jonathan, one of the biggest stories coming out of the weekend and cpac was a forum on race that descended into racism, led by k. carl smith of frederick douglass republicans and got into a heated debate with one of the attendees about race and diversity. take a listen.

>> when douglass escaped from slavery, 10, 20 years after he escaped from slavery, he wrote a letter to his former slave master and said, i forgive you for all the things you did to me. >> just to repeat that, john, the attendee said slave owners don't need to be forgiven because they gave slaves food and shelter. this may be an isolated incident, but does it not speak to a larger problem for republicans? >> you think? i mean, the idea -- >> i'm only asking. >> -- that slavery was some beneficial program to help these poor wayward africans who were stolen from another place and brought here to help build this country? it's ridiculous and emblematic of the problem the republican party has. now, look that was one person at one event at a sliver or a sizable faction of the republican party. but the fact that no one around there sort of challenged the guy

or shushed him or did something to challenge his facts, to me, is quite stunning and just shows just how far the republican party has to go to make itself even remotely hospitable to african-americans and people in color of general. in general. >> john, i think there was an attempt to challenge him, actually. but angela, moving on, ironically, the title of that tea party forum was "trump the race card: are you sick and tired of being called a racist and you know you're not one?" why do some conservatives refuse to admit they may have a problem with minority voters, angela? >> martin, i think they really don't know. i mean, look at today, we have this report that they've unveiled. this announcement from, you know, the gop chairman saying, we're going to pour money into these communities for an outreach plan that's going to cost us $10 million. and, yet, right before that, there's cpac where all of these crazy, rhetorical, you know, very, very, very hateful

messages are coming out of a conference, and i know, i've been getting tweeted, that the gop is not cpac, and vice versa. however, you can't not acknowledge that all these folks aren't in some ways tied to the party. the grand old party. yet here we are with the same grand old or not so grand ideas. and then on top of that, you have their very last listening session, martin. in brooklyn, last week, two days after this child loses his life to plain-clothed police officers and priebus is in somebody's church in brooklyn and doesn't even acknowledge the issue. you want to know why you can't reach minority voters? you're not speaking to our issues. you're not speaks to the problems of our everyday lives. you're not speaking to the fact racism really exists. you deny it and wonder why we don't want to vote for your candidates. >> do you think that's fair, john, as an assessment of rein krer ce priebus? he's conducted this autopsy. >> it's a fair assessment of where the party is. in a bit of fairness, in the gop autopsy, the coroner's report,

as you call it, they specifically say this is, we don't deal with policy, that was not our job. our job was to look at, you know, other sort of problematic mechanical things. but that being said, if they don't do something on policy, then the party's never going to -- the party is never going to get out of the rut that it's in. >> steve, let me read to you a comment first reported by "salon." one of your employers. that got a lot of traffic over the weekend. it was by bush's former attorney general mike mukasey who was on a panel about islam. here's what he said. "the vast majority of the world's 1.4 billion muslims adhere to a view of their religion that agrees on the need to impose sharia or islamic law on the world." he goes on to say that both the obama and even bush administration were too soft on islamists. does it disturb you that that comes from the mouth of once the top enforcement officer of this

nation? >> well, yes, and it speaks to, you know, sort of the problem we're saying this report does not really get into policy. there's a reason they don't get into policy. if you get into policy, this is the sort of thing you have to say. >> how can he possibly make a claim like this about such a vast number of people? >> the entire tone from the right since 9/11 toward islam, toward muslims has been on par with this, roughly speaking. that's because it's sort of -- there was an appetite for that among the conservative base. and there's so much pressure in the party right now. it's a dysfunctional party in so many ways because there is so much pressure to conform to, you know, where the base is on a question like this. and if you don't, if you speak, if you stand up to this sort of thing and you're a republican officeholder, it endangers you into a potential republican primary. that's the lesson every republican officeholder has taken from the last few years. kind of extrapolate that to the chairman of the party doing this report. the chairman of the party is not really -- he's not elected by the public but he's in place, elected by the party. if he starts challenging the

assumptions prevalent among the party base in report, he's going to be out of a job. there's no wiggle room on policy to expand the republican pertar to appeal to nonrepublicans because you'll be punished by republic chance in primaries. you'll lose your joobzb as a republican. >> angela, if there's no wiggle room to be in the factual universe as opposed to this kind of offensive racist stuff, where do they go? >> they better wiggle in a different direction. look at the fact edge today the president nominated tom perez as the next secretary of labor. that's his pick. then you have folks coming out right after that, this brilliant man who spent a lot of time focusing on voting rights. he's been a huge champion in the civil rights division of doj. they're out saying he's not going to support his nomination because of a black panther case he wasn't even in office for yet. their messaging is wrong. they should wiggle more to the

middle. >> angela rye, jonathan capehart, steve kornacki. thank you all. next, the president on his women at the white house. stay with us. [ male announcer ] research suggests cell health plays a key role throughout our lives. one a day men's 50+ is a complete multivitamin designed for men's health concerns as we age. it has 7 antioxidants to support cell health. one a day men's 50+. it has 7 antioxidants to support cell health. ♪ ♪ no two people have the same financial goals. pnc works with you to understand yours and help plan for your retirement. visit a branch or call now for your personal retirement review. [ kids ] yes! it's better to be fast to not be bitten by a werewolf

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[ female announcer ] ask your doctor about lyrica today. it's specific treatment for diabetic nerve pain. to hear more patient stories, visit lyrica.com. it's been a busy day at the white house. a new labor secretary, an event to mark women's history month, and preparations for the president's trip to israel. for more now, let's bring in nbc news white house correspondent, kristin welker. what are the expectations for this trip to the middle east, and which subjects are expected to dominate the president's agenda there? because, you know, we have syria, but there's also the ongoing anxiety about iran and a nuclear weapons. >> reporter: right. certainly a lot of ground to cover, martin. i think that one of president obama's goals will be to really send a strong message to prime minister benjamin netanyahu as well as the people of israel and other people in the region that he stands firmly with israel.

as you know, the president and the prime minister have had a somewhat rocky relationship. so it's partially to smooth over that relationship. the president has taken some criticism, particularly during the last presidential campaign, that he wasn't a strong enough ally to israel. i think part of it will be to smooth over that perception. but i think you will see the president reiterate the fact the united states will do whatever is necessary to make sure that iran doesn't get a nuclear weapon. of course, that is a big concern for israel and will also sort of reiterate the united states will try to continue to isolate syria and to make sure that at some point assad does step down from power soon. so i think those are two of the key issues you're going to hear him talk about. also, martin, this is not just a trip to talk to the leaders. according to a recent poll in israel, 10% of israelis view the president favorably. so i thing hek he's going thereo to send a message to the people of israel that he does, in fact, stand with them and change that perception that they have of him

and the united states. martin? >> nbc's kristen welker, thank you so much. the reminder nbc news and msnbc will have comprehensive coverage of the president's trip throughout the week. next, the nra reveals its true masters. stay with us. hey, our salads. [ bop ] [ bop ] [ bop ] you can do that all you want, i don't like v8 juice. [ male announcer ] how about v8 v-fusion. a full serving of vegetables, a full serving of fruit. but what you taste is the fruit. so even you... could've had a v8. twenty-five thousand mornings, give or take, is all we humans get. we spend them on treadmills. we spend them in traffic. and if we get lucky, really lucky, it dawns on us to go spend them in a world where a simple sunrise can still be magic. twenty-five thousand mornings.

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as much attention is focused on the nra's opposition to gun law reforms in this country wayne lapier rrrers and fellow lobbyists are pushing for more guns globally. a united nations treaty that aims to reduce international arms trafficking. the treaty would require countries to determine whether weapons they sell would be used to commit serious human rights violations, terrorism, or transnational organized crime. and those kinds of limits would

be bad for business, of course. joining us now for more on this, from washington, former house judiciary counsel, democratic strategist, julian epstein, and msnbc political analyst, jonathan alter, a columnist for "bloomberg view." julian, with thousands of lives at stake all around the world, 150 countries are coming together to try and prevent arms trafficking, but they won't succeed if the nra has anything to say about it, i guess. is that right? >> thousands of lives is an understatement, martin. >> forgive any. >> according to international human rights organizations, about 2,000 civilians a day are killed by war criminals. that is the equivalent in just two days of more lives lost than in the world trade center. and as you point out, over 150 companies are pushing for this ban on the transfer to war criminals of light and heavy armaments. you know, the republican party who you have heard say many times that the u.s. should be playing a leadership role, particularly when it comes to human rights issues and right to life issues, all of that stuff

suddenly is out the window. why? because the nra is representing the interests of gun manufacturers who have about a third of the $70 billion market. you know, during fast and furious, we heard the nra saying that the whole scandal was about, or the alleged scandal was about the doj allowing guns to get into the hands of the most evil people in the world. this just shows the nra is not a coherent organization with any coherent policy views. it is a direct mail internet scam operation looking to bilk the obama haters of their hard-earned cash. >> okay. john, i want to play something that nra president david keen said at cpac this weekend. take a listen to this, john. >> for many of us, the republican party is the vehicle that we've chosen to accomplish to accomplish our political and policy goals. >> he says the gop is the selected vehicle for achieving the nra agenda.

that makes the nra sound rather like a parasite on the host body of the republican party, doesn't it. >> it certainly has been in recent years. it used to be there were an awful lot of democrats who also had 100% nra ratings. that's no longer so much the case. look, as julian said, the world right now is bedeviled by what are called failed states. these are states where the government doesn't have enough authority to maintain security and protect people's lives. and what happens in these fails states is that you get war lords a and other groups that kill an awful lot of innocent people through this $100 billion a year weapons business, international arms trades. so the world is trying to get together to do something about it. what's standing in its way? a relatively small, grossly overpublicized group, the national rifle association.

apparently there are only about 1 million of their 4 million members who even believe any of this sufficient. so that's a tiny number. that's a million compared to, say, 16 million members of president obama's organization. a million, that's way, way less than 1% of the american population. why should they have a stranglehold over issues of war and peace in the world? it is time to confront them and defeat them and remove them from their dominance in our politics. >> i think all of us would say hear, hear to that. julian, to an issue much closer to home, "the new york times" today reports on the nra's efforts to fight legislation that would mandate the surrender of firearms in domestic violence situations. i guess their answer is a good woman with a gun despite all the research that counters their argument, is that right? >> right. all of the research shows the that in domestic partner

disputes, if the partner generally more often than not, the male partner, has access to a gun, the likelihood of the female partner being killed by that gun is, you know, somewhere between 10 and 20 times -- i think the actual figure is 12 times greater. the data on this important. "the new york times" is important today because it accounts chilling stories. the thing that ties these two stories together, martin, this really shop-warn argument by the nra about the second amendment. we need to dispose of that once and for all. the supreme court in the heller case said the second amendment does not apply to the kinds of things that are being considered in this international treaty case. dangerous weapons, what they call dangerous and unusual weapons like short-barreled shotguns, automatic weapons. and it does not apply to people that would use them for illegal purposes like the kind of cases we're talking about in domestic abuse. and it is an argument that if anybody just takes the time, if you don't believe me, just go

read the heller case in 2008. it's very, very simple. the court says the second amendment applies to an exceedingly narrow number of cases. handguns inside the home. >> julian epstein, jonathan alt alter. i'm afraid we've run out of time. thank you, both. >> thanks, martin. >> thank you. >> and we'll be right back. it's monday. a brand new start. your chance to rise and shine. with centurylink as your trusted technology partner, you can do just that. with our visionary cloud infrastructure, global broadband network and custom communications solutions, your business is more reliable - secure - agile. and with responsive, dedicated support, we help you shine every day of the week.

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