new yorkers, are they open to reconsidering him? he's taking a poll. so i guess he will find out and we will, too. how about this, do you want this person making governmental decisions when you're not watching? that's my standard and that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "politicsnation" with al sharpton starts right now. thanks, chris, and thanks to you for tuning in. tonight's lead, the right all wrong, a crucial day at the supreme court where it looks like the defense of marriage act may be on the ropes. it's a discriminatory law that turns gays and lesbians into second-class citizens. and as i've said many times,re rights, you have to be consistent about defending those rights and speaking up when they are violated. but the increasing possibility that gays could have federal marriage rights is driving extremists on the right into a

fury. they are resorting to vial language, petty attacks, and absolutely repulsive arguments, simply because they are opposed to gay marriage. just listen to rush limbaugh. >> there is a gay mafia that has inflicted the fear of death, political death in the republican party, for example. if same sex fits the bill of the contract, then everything fits the bill. and at some point, who's to say you cannot have sex with a child? at some point. >> come on, rush. even for you that's ugly stuff. conservative eric erickson tweeted about gay marriage. you're not in love with your neighbor when you're cool to him staying on the road to hell. so much for loving that neighbor. the rights later starved the moment, resorted to mentioning

relations between animals. >> marriage is between a man and a woman. no group, be the gays, be the namla, be the people who believe in beastiality, it doesn't matter what they are, they don't get to change the definition. it's not something against gays. >> oh, no. of course not. nothing against gay people. you just compared their relationship to beast yalt. the right knows their arguments are tied and that's why their logic has just become more and more absurd. >> if love becomes a definition of what the boundaries of marriage are, how do we define that going forward? what if if someone wants to immigrate to this court from a country that allows multiple spouses? >> beware of gay marriage, it will lead to immigrant polygamists. it's almost laughable as these

statements are. >> it's as if we're second-class citizens now because we support the traditional biblical definition of marriage. >> the same idea of same-sex marriage is the death of capitalism. >> there isn't that much interest in marriage. there isn't that much interest in marriage and monday nothing ga me. >> a few people want to have their way of doing sex affirmed by everybody else. >> the right is on the wrong side of history when it comes to ending this discrimination in our country. it is not a wonder they are in a furry about it. joining me is governor ed rendell. thank you both for coming on the show tonight. >> thanks for having me. >> governor rendell, let me start with you. what do you make of the right's rhetoric on this issue? >> well, it's the last gasp of group of very bitter people and

they've run out of good arguments. yesterday in the supreme court the lawyer actually argued that two 55-year-old's who wanted to get married, heterosexual 55-year-old's could pro create, could produce a baby and that's one of the reasons why they shouldn't throw out prop 8. ludicrous. does anyone think a 55-year-old man and woman is going to have a baby? their arguments are pathetic, don't make any sense, and all it's doing is destroying the republican party when republicans hue the line. the best thing they can do is let this happen, let it go away as an issue. they should support gay rights in many other fields because it's not just gay voters. it's independent voters. it's thoughtful suburban voters, it's college-educated voters. it's evangelicals under the age of 35 who look at the republican party and look at the republican

kmen state a commentators and they think they are bigoted and discriminatory. >> i think you're right. drew, don't you think it's really sounding like desperation? some of this stuff is so far-fetched, it just -- desperation is the only way you can explain it. >> yeah. we follow this stuff every day and have been following it every year and i have to say that they are taking the same old lies and turning them up to 11. i wish i could tell you that the clips that you just played were the only clips that were available but that's not true. we have all sorts of people seeing those same things. one of my favorites was one of the anti-gay leaders who helped push prop 8. he's pushing this idea that gay people don't want to get married at all. this is just a nefarious plot to destroy marriage for everybody, that it's going to be the death nell of capital licism. this is for very structural reasons in the party that they can't help themselves.

>> now, governor, you know, let's go to bill o'reilly, for example, at fox news. he's claimed that gay marriage would lead to many things. he said that it would lead to plural marriages, to people maryi marrying goats or ducks or dolphins. he even said it would cause the abolition of marriage. but then o'reilly last night sounded very differently on gay marriage. listen to this. >> the compelling argument is on the side of homosexuals. that's where the compelling argument is. we're americans. we just want to be treated like everybody else. that is a compelling argument. and to deny that you have to have a very strong argument on the other side and the other side hasn't done anything to jump the bible. >> that was o'reilly last night.

but listen to rush. >> do you think they are bible thumpers that watch fox because last night you're marginalized and being a bunch of bible thumpers. >> it's not enough to go get my popcorn because we're seeing rush limbaugh take a shot at bill o'reilly and they are going to fight about this issue, o'reilly clearly taking a different line and saying that you got to have more to deal with this issue than bible thumping. and all of a sudden rush limbaugh becomes the defender of the bible thumpers and

sarcastically goes after bill o'reilly. >> well, this is all music to our ears but i think o'reilly is the most pragmatic of the right-wing commentators and he understands where the push is on this issue. and he's right. you better hope this goes away as fast as it can be. if you're a suburban new york or congressmen, you want this to go away as fast as you can. there's no reason for it. it's hateful. it's discriminatory, and hopefully the supreme court will do away with it. but i will tell you, rev, republicans don't seem to learn when the national republicans are trying to get issues like this and abortion put to the

back burner, when state legislatures, they go ahead and push extreme legislation. i just sit back and enjoy it. >> drew, you at right wing watch, you monitor and watch what is going on with the evangelicals. what are their next moves after the arguments are over? >> that's the really big question. and i think that people are waiting to see. we've heard things like tony perkins say that there's a possibility of a revolution in this country if the supreme court upholds same-sex marriage equality. the thing i think that is really fascinating is the members of the gop elite, the power brokers on the far right, who are pushing as far as they can to the trends that they are talking about. you have mike huckabee saying that if the gop goes soft on marriage, they are going to run

away from the party. evangelicals are going to run away from the party. now, i don't think that they are really going to give up on politics and stay home, but what i do think is that every republican on capitol hill hears that loud and clear. >> yeah. >> so if they are looking at the possibility of a divisive nasty gop primary, they are going to remember that maybe they need to hold the line on this issue. so the gop is between a rock and a hard place on this. i'm not sure what they are going to do. >> governor, the politics on this -- i'm over time and the politics of this, will the ruling of the court energize the base of the left or the right depending on how they rule? i mean, either way you run the risk of really energizing a base turnout in the midterm election based on this decision. >> yeah, you do, rev, and to that end maybe the republicans

would benefit by the court throwing out all these acts and saying that there's a right to same-sex marriage but, again, in the long run there are republicans who are in moderate districts that have won and they are in big, big trouble if this becomes an issue. they want 14 to be fought on taxes, on spending. they don't want it to be fought on social issues. they will get crushed. >> well, let me say this. beyond the politics, beyond the trying to find out who is ahead and who is not, there's a thing called right and wrong. you and i should ask ourselves, do we want anyone deciding what we will believe is right and wrong between us and consenting adults? and if you and i don't want others telling us how to live our lives, then maybe we ought not get to historical and try to

run others. in a new interview, president obama reveals more on this progressive push and why the country is with him. plus, america, we have a george w. bush sighting. we'll tell you why the gop might be crying foul. and sarah palin is out of hibernation and loaded forebear. oh, what could go wrong? look what mommy is having. mommy's having a french fry. yes she is, yes she is. [ bop ] [ male announcer ] could've had a v8. 100% vegetable juice, with three of your daily vegetable servings in every little bottle.

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for a second straight day, big crowds gathered outside the supreme court as the justices heard arguments over marriage equality. in 1996, the federal law that defines marriage between a man and a woman. that kind of blat tapt discrimination is unacceptable. it's a basic question of equal rights, applying the same law and standards to everybody. we have to win this fight and it looks like we might. joining me now is jeffrey rose, a law professor at george washington university and legal affairs editor of the new republic. jeffrey, you said the most dramatic moment in court today was when justice elena kagan revealed that lawmakers passed the 1996 law to make a moral judgment against gay people. take a listen. >> is what happened in 1996 -- and i'm going to quote from the

house report here -- is that congress decided to reflect an honor, a collective moral judgment and to expect moral disapproval of homosexuality? is that what happened in 1996? >> does the house report say that? of course the house report says that. >> and then the attorney defending the law shrugs it off like it's no big deal. why was that such an important moment, jeff? >> it was a remarkable moment. you can hear on the clip a gasp in the courtroom. it was even louder when you were sitting right there because the attorney was saying this law was passed to expect the democratic process and just as kagan said, no, we want to express moral disapproval of homosexuality. the supreme court has said that moral disapproval is a constitutionally i am permissible purpose. so in some sense the gig was up

because it showed all of these innocent respects given for the law. the real reason and the lawyer had to backtrack and said, even though they said that, they didn't mean it. and as the other justices were pressing him, he found it hard to solidify a single rational reason to have access to 1,100 laws that provide benefits from social security benefits, sick benefits, the ability to be buried in the military cemetery. justice ginsburg was so i am patient asaid you' patient and said you're creating separate categories, skim milk marriages and regular marriage. >> in effect now, they would really have to vote against this saying it was i am permissible

to uphold this law, right? >> judges like scalia says it's a perfectly fine reason for laws a and scalia said that ends the moral legislation, won't be able to ban prostitution and terrible things and scalia i'm sure would be happy to solidify it as a state function. anthony kennedy was troubled by aspects of this law, he was especially concerned on intrusion of state's rights, the power to define their own idea of health, safety, and morals, and he's very likely to rule against the law in question. >> let me go back to your question about skim milk

marriage. justice ginsburg talked about the restrictions this law put on same-sex marriage. it was in that context she made is the statement that you referred to. >> for the federal government then to come in to say no joint return, no marital deduction, no social security benefits, what kind of marriage is this? the state said there are two kinds of marriage, the full marriage and then this skim milk marriage. >> and i hear there's a reaction from the crowd when justice ginsburg compared what she called the real marriage or the skim milk marriage. very, very poignant point. >> it was very poignant because the court spent an entire hour

and justice ginsburg cuts to the heart of the case. imagine you have a sick spouse of a validly married couple. why would you create this separate category? what possible reason could you have for denying all of these benefits that would create such inequality and that kind of exploded the case because all of the reasons given, that it would promote procration did not deny these benefits. that was a relieved form of laughter as much as anything else. >> but isn't that the bottom line to this whole argument, is not whether one is pro gay or an gay or moral problems or not, the answer is whether we're going to have different standards and different definitions for people? it's just that simple, jeffrey. >> i think it is. in this case it is even simpler. the question here is, once the

state validly rec fognizes a ga marriage, what reason could they have forgiven to the spouse in the heterosexual marriage and because the state couldn't come up with any reason, liberal people don't like the power of the federal government think it's an intrusion on state's rights. >> very interesting. people want state rights on everything until it's bias and want everyone to live according to their will rather than according to what is fair in a society with one standard for everybody. jeffrey rosen, you've been a great guide for us on the court this week. thank you for your time and thank you for being on tonight. >> thank you. it's been a real pleasure. >> ahead, a brand-new interview reveals the president's

progressive push. plus, sarah palin is not going away. she's got something big brewing. and karl rove better watch out. glenn beck and michele bachmann with an over the top conspiracy theory. run, michele, run. that's next. copd makes it hard to breathe,

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michele bachmann's defense and in true beck fashion, it's a huge conspiracy. >> we have been sold to radical islam. it has infiltrated and we've documented it since george bush was in office. it's not just this guy. it was the last guy, too. and we knew it. the minute we saw george bush standing in a mosque saying, you know what guys, islam in a religion of peace. we knew something was wrong. you see what they are doing to michele bachmann? michelle back man is under all kinds of ethics' investigations now. why do you suppose that is? she's evil. yeah. uh-huh. she is uber clear on what's going on. >> one second he's talking about radical islam and the next, an ethics investigation into michele bachmann? it's making people think beck's

saying bachmann's ethics probe is just a plot coming from radical islamists. how does that make any sense? congressional investigators are looking to allegations of improper payments to bachmann's presidential campaign. now, we don't know the facts and she deserves a fair investigation. but one thing should be clear, radical muslims respect behind a house ethics investigation. but don't tell that to this fearmongering team. >> he's connected with radicals, islamists, communists, and socialists. >> it appears that there has been deep penetration in the halls of our united states government by the muslim brotherhood. >> i want to he show you a little bit of some of the laws being passed here in america. >> just wait if sharia is adopted or utilized by justices in the united states. >> yep, sharia law everywhere.

you look and who can forget this bogus theory? they claimed hillary clinton's former top aide was connected to the muslim brotherhood. >> you say anthony weiner's wife is -- has connections to the muslim brotherhood. now, this is important because she works for hillary clinton. >> well, she is the chief aide for -- to the secretary of state. all we did is ask, did the federal government look into her family associations. >> oh, no big deal. you know, all we did was ask if her family had terrorist connections. there is absolutely nothing to back these claims but this rumor gained so much traction it was picked up in the middle east and pelted with tomatoes when

visiting egypt because of it. right-wing fearmongering has real dangerous consequences. did beck think we'd let him get away with this latest ridiculous claim? nice try, but we got ya. a talki. this ge locomotive can tell you exactly where it is, what it's carrying, while using less fuel. delivering whatever the world needs, when it needs it. ♪ after all, what's the point of talking if you don't have something important to say? ♪ if you don't have something important to say? ♪♪ ♪ ♪

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vo: expedia helps 30 million travelers a month find what they're looking for. one traveler at a time. expedia. find yours. two months into his second term, two months into the president's push to fill the progressive promise, on gun control and equal rights for emp. and a brand-new poll shows the president's favorability rating stands at an impressive 57%. and in a new interview, the president is talking about his push for equality. >> i think that not only is it right and fair but consistent with our constitution to recognize same-sex couples. it doesn't mean that everybody has to agree from a religious

standpoint about this issue. it does mean that it is very important for us to remember we're a nation in which everybody is supposed to be equal before the law. i've known a lot of same-sex couples who are committed, raising kids. for them to be treated differently i think is not fair and i think an increasing number of americans are okay with that. my hope is that the court reaches these issues and that we end up living in a country where everybody is treated fairly. that's what i think is the most important thing about america. >> that's the most important thing about america, is what the people in this country want. and the president won't stop fighting. joining me now is ben, former press secretary for the obama campaign and patricia murphy from citizens jane politics. thanks to both of you for being here tonight. >> thanks, rev, for having me. >> trish, it does seem that the

president is ignoring inside the beltway crowd and pushing hard on some of these very tough issues. >> well, yeah. he's also doing, i think, what a lot of these interest groups wanted him to do, which is complete a lot of unfinished business from his first term. he was able to get health care across the line. he was able to start to deal with the economy, start to bring down the unemployment rate, but there were a number of interest groups in washington and you have to put latinos at the top of that list who were frustrated by the progress and gay americans, frustrated by the lack of progress. in his inauguration speech, president obama laid out the case, i'm going to finish the job i started and i think that is really what he's doing and i think he knows, i think his team knows. he doesn't have a lot of time to do it. he's going to get into other people's elections cycles from a year from now. this is the time to move on the immigration reform. the supreme court will make moves on gay marriage. there are things that people wanted him to do, voters wanted

him to do and in his first term he didn't get them done and he's moving forward to do that. republicans, in the meantime, seem to be setting up road blocks to issues. i think they do that at their own peril. >> you were inside the campaign. you saw the president campaign on these things and the american public backed him and so far he's being backed even as he embarks on doing this. on immigration, 72% support it. 10% say they don't support them. today he talked to immigration. but he was pressed for a timetable as patricia talked about, there was some people in the latino and in the gay

community -- he pushed for a timetable on his moves on immigration. listen to this. >> we're seeing a strong commitment to finally solve this problem in a way that strengthens our border security, make sure that there's a pathway to citizenship, a pathway so that people can live out their dreams and make sure that they have a better life for them and their kids. i'm concerned about the people whose lives are going to be impacted by it and i want to make sure that they have the capacity to move forward and live out the dream of immigrants that has driven this country for so many years. that's my number one priority. >> now, he's been able to move a lot of republicans and you have seen from the campaign a year ago that ended in just november and now there has been some movement and those that were anxious and progressive,

including yours truly that's been pushing him, now have to say, well, maybe his way that seems to be too slow and deliberate has picked up some allies because it's been less confrontational than some of us like. >> he will with, that's right. he's asked the gang of eight, the coalition of senators, he made those principles cleared during the campaign but he's itt a much better chance of passage. here's the good news. it's a political imperative for the republican party to pass comprehensive immigration reform. they can't afford 7/10 of h hispanics in 2016. you see those republicans who got a stake in 2016, whether it's marco rubio, whether it's rand paul or jeb bush entering in favor of comprehensive

immigration reform. they know the party's got to do it and it's a political imperative. in terms of the big ticket items and it's very strong chance of passage and if it comes and filibuster on gun reform and democrats say he's flip-flopping. watch this. >> one of the things we can do is improve the quality of the federal database. right now a lot of states and local jurisdictions are not reporting criminal mental health barriers and the federal database is not as good as it should be. that would be a commonsense improvement. >> now, that's what he said then. now he wants the filibuster

moving forward on any gun reform. so he was making an argument for background checks in effect before. now he wants to filibuster. interesting, patricia. >> i think that ted cruz's fo t voices one that could cause the party some real headaches going forward. he is somebody who is extremely conservative. extremely conservative but he has a tone, a tenor that is very sharp. dianne feinstein said, i went to sixth grade. i don't need a lecture on the constitution. his own relationships within the senate do his own cause a lot of harm and when you look again and absolutely remarkable document. 97 pages of them looking at themselves and saying things like young voters roll their eyes at the republican party. they think that this is a party that is out of touch, that is mean-spirited, that does not care about him.

that's republicans talking about republicans. they've got a lot of healing within their own party to do before they can go forward but a voice like ted cruz i think is going to make that more difficult for the more moderate republicans to do. it's a loud, strong voice and those are the types of voices breaking through for the republican party. >> that's right. >> he's an example of the problem within the party. >> is ted cruz the perfect opponent for the president on these types of issues since he is so polarizing and fits such a stereotype of extremist that is way off the charts and to the american mainstream? >> well, you've got the establishment republicans in the party calling cruz a wacko bird. >> right. >> that didn't come from democrats. the people competing to be the face of the republican party today are people like rand paul and ted cruz. in that autopsy report that patricia talked about, i don't think that moderated the party

to bring it back into the mainstream with these filibusters that is certainly not the way that they are going to get out of being called the party of no if they are filibustering things like background checks that has supported 90% of the american people and a majority of nra members. >> thank you both for your time tonight. >> thank you so much. >> thank you, rev. >> still ahead, former president bush turns up at a basketball game and you will never guess who is by his side. and todd legitimate rape akin gets turned into a law & order episode. the gop's problems are now a must-see tv. stay with us. [ male announcer ] you know that guy that's got a ham radio in his basement. he can talk to china, mongolia and all the koreas and he eats velveeta shells and cheese. so who are you calling amateur? liquid gold. eat like that guy you know.

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. america we have a george w. bush citing. yes, it's very rare but the former president was spotted at a baylor university game. there he is hug ging the mascot. there he is, kept star, the same ken star who spent years

studying president clinton as the independent counsel. being looking like they had a great time. turns out, we're about to see a lot more of george w. bush. next month is the opening of the george w. bush presidential library of southern university. the 24-acre site includes a library and museum and public policy institute. just what the country needs. more public policy from w. it opens to the public on may 1st, which happens to be the 10th anniversary of president bush's mission accomplish speech. all i could say to that is, wow. joining me now is wayne slater, senior political writer for the dallas morning news and co-author of bush's brain, how karl rove made george w. bush presidential. and dana milbank, a washington post political columnist. thank you both for being here

tonight. >> hi, rev. >> nice to be with you. >> wayne, we saw another glimpse of president bush. it's rare. how big a problem is the -- is he going to still be for the republican party? >> well, i don't even want to suggest that being seen with the lady baylor's basketball team is a negative. it's going to win the women ncaa. this is a problem because he's largely stayed out of public sight, which is a happy note for some members of the republican party who would just assume that he stay in the background. so every time he's seen publicly as he was with ken star who represents a number of democrats that very partisan political period during the clinton administration, every time he's seen publicly, it's only a reminder to voters, including republican voters, of the bush legacy, whether it's spending the war, katrina, or mission

accomplished. >> now, how much of this is a problem, as you see it, dana? i mean, and his appearances, what will it mean? >> well, reverend, i think he can salvage everything if he shows up for the library opening wearing the flight suit and perhaps popping out of an aircraft just to remind us of the good old days. it's a problem for the party in the sense that, look, every former president in the glow of distance, people forget the bad things, it becomes more pop are popular. he's around 46% in the polls which makes him the least popular of living former presidents, for obvious reasons, and as more time passes, maybe that will get better, but it's going to take some time for that to happen. if jeb bush is running for president, that's going to thrust is brother in the news all of the time. the republicans would like to still ignore him. that's why he wasn't in evidence at the convention and other

public forums for republicans. but you can't really keep this guy down forever. >> well, i mean, the presidential library, let's talk about some of its details, wayne. it's a 226,560 square foot center. it has a freedom hall, which has a 67-foot tower with a glow in the dark lantern. there's a decisions point theater named after the president's book and a life-size oval office during bush's two terms in office. that's how the library is going to be. this is why we don't see much of george bush lately, though. watch. >> well, look -- >> why is that? you told the american people you have any more information if you know he is dead or alive? >> i don't know where he is. i don't spend that much time on him, to be honest with you.

>> those weapons of mass destruction have got to be somewhere. >> we must stop the terror. i call upon all nations to do everything they can to stop these terrorist killers. thank you. now watch this drive. had. >> those are the things, wayne, that makes republicans nervous, that you just don't know what bush is going to say and you just don't know how he's going to come across and those are just dpexamples of the most sensitive and bizarre things and he was president then. >> he will with, i know one thing, reverend, that video reel will not -- definitely not be playing at the library but when it opens on the 1st. it raises a more fundamental question about the post presidential expression, how do you in a library like this and

the museum and the displays talk about the war, a pre-emptive war that's lasted now a decade. how do you talk about the spending that this administration did, that the republicans even folks in the republican party aren't very proud of, the increased deficit or the economic downturn or katrina, as i said, or these other episodes, how do you cast those in a positive light, which is what a presidential library does, without simply reminding voters in the future all about those things that happened in the bush administration that many voters and certainly many republicans would like them to forget. >> dana, though, a decision's point theater? >> well, it's better that the strategery theater. look, it's good in our line of

work because it keeps some of those glorious moments in american history alive. that's why the jeb bush candidacy could be so interesting to us. i mean, think about it. jeb bush, the poor guy actually was the more serious bush, a potential presidential candidate. his brother got there first. he crashed the car and now the brother is asking that he can get the keys. >> well, i thank you both for being here tonight. i just want you to know, when bush came in we had 23 million jobs created. he left us, we lost 646,000. president clinton left us with $280 billion surplus. bush turned it into to $11 trillion debt. maybe that's why it's so hard to forget w. ahead, todd legitimate rape akin goes primetime. that's next. [ male announcer ] what are happy kids made of?

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read from the headlines, the gop's downfall is now must-see tv. law & order svu's episode sounds eriely familiar.

>> it's nearly impossible for a victim of legitimate rape to become pregnant. >> legitimate rape. a national kocontroversy. i know why i've hearded that before. >> if it's a legitimate rape, the female body has ways to shut that down. >> that just about killed their chances in the 2012 election. so they ordered a political autopsy on what went wrong. well, our very own crime unit has also been working the case. take a look at the evidence we've uncovered. >> the democrats said we had a war on caterpillar and every media outlet talked about the war on caterpillars and then we'd have problems with caterpillars. >> even when life begins in that horrible situation of rape, it is something that god intended

to happen. >> this is the latest plampg in the so-called war on women, entirely created by my colleagues across the the aisle for political and north dakota took the country for women rights. signing a bill for banning abortion at six weeks of pregnancy, before many women even know that they are pregnant. he also signed a bill meant to shut down the last remaining abortion clinic in the state. we don't need a gop autopsy. we don't need a csi unit to figure out whose fingerprints are all over this crime. republicans claim they are trying to reinvent their brand