sequester for themselves. they are now free to travel across the country. >> thousands of flights were delayed this week because of the sequester. >> how come you didn't tell us about this beforehand? >> majority of our employees including these eventual workers would have to be furloughed. >> how come you didn't tell us about this beforehand? >> air traffic controllers and airport security will see cutbacks. >> is anybody not going to stand up and call his bluff? >> i hope and believe the republicans will allow the sequestration will go into effect? >> the impact of this policy won't be felt overnight, but it will be real. >> the flames after catastrophe. >> we will preserve the spending reductions of the sequester. >> it's going to be very painful for the flying public. >> is the president exaggerating? >> absolutely. >> let's be clear, it's less than 2% of your budget. >> it's a lot of money. >> i don't know whether it's going to hurt the economy or not. >> but it will be real. >> how come you didn't tell us about this beforehand?

>> purposely making air travel difficult. >> not a word. >> let's deal with all the adverses consequences of the sequester, not just those who affect the powerful. ♪ fly me to the moon ♪ let me play among the stars ♪ let me see what spring is like ♪ >> it is a busy friday and we're watching developments on multiple fronts this afternoon. nbc news has obtained exclusi exclusively a detailed government analysis of the bombs used at the boston marathon. with further evidence the bombers drew considerably on instructions from al qaeda's online "inspire" magazine. in syria, credible reports on the use of chemical weapons are prompting a flurry of questions for the white house on the president's stated red line. meeting with king abdullah of jordan this afternoon, the president said the ongoing crisis is being treated with fresh urgency. >> i've been very clear

publicly, but also privately, that for the syrian government to yutilize chemical weapons on its people crosses the line that will change my callous culous i the united states approaches these issues. this is not an on or off wife. >> we'll have much more of that ahead. we begin with a remarkable countdown to the weekend in washington and congress working with unheard of expediency to fix the problem of sequester-induced flight delays. just in time to get out of town for another week-long recess. yes, earlier today, the house swiftly passed the reducing flight delays act of 2013, 361-41. the same bill that literally flew through the senate last night. it allows the faa to move money between accounts so it can stop the furlough of air traffic

controlle controllers. great. nobody likes flight delays. least of all people who travel frequently say members of congress, michele bachmann, for one, is absolutely thrilled. >> it's high time the faa, mr. speaker, have the flexibility they need to have on closures of any air traffic control towers. it is my hope that st. cloud, minnesota, and airports do remain open. they're vital. >> st. cloud is mrs. bachmann's district, of course, which helps to explain why we are seeing this incredible trajectory from problem to solution in just a matter of days. when business travelers are inconvenienced, when members are delayed getting out of town for their latest week off, something must be done. the white house was pressed today about the sudden air traffic exemption. >> the delays are a problem for not just business travelers and members of congress, but for many americans.

and that's a real negative consequence of the sequester, but your point is excellent and we call on congress to show as much concern for others who are being harmed. >> jay carney said the president will sign the bill despite calling it a band-aid on a serious wound. you know who else could use a congressional band-aid? cancer patients. but, well, they're out of luck, because among the unlucky americans who will certainly feel the aftermath of congress' indecision, are millions of cancer patients who depend on medicare. medicare providers of community-based cancer care, with more than 80% of patients receive their care, will begin experiencing cuts of extreme proportions." services for those cancer patients are apparently not essential enough to warrant emergency action by lawmakers. and the same goes for many, many

others. >> 70,000 children will be kicked out of head start. nothing in this bill deals with them. 4 million fewer meals on wheels for seniors. 600,000 people dropped off wic. nothing there for them. >> our military families that will lose the support because we've got the sequester all on the shoulders of those who believe -- >> gentleman's time has expired. >> slash and burn. >> absolutely, slash and burn until it's your turf, your runway and you've got a recess coming up. congress, first-class travel without delays. with us now from capitol hill is congresswoman jan schakowsky, democrat of illinois. good afternoon, ma'am. >> good afternoon, martin. thanks for having me. >> without wishing to be impolite to you, personally, how does it feel to be the member of a body that won't do anything that might reduce the 32,000 people who die each year from gun violence? that can't find any way to

resolve the issue of 11 million undocumented immigrants? that will happily see 4 million elderly people lose their meals on wheels? but if you delay a congressman at the airport, then legislation passes at twice the speed of sound. are you proud to be a part of a body like that? >> well, what was particularly galling about this debate is that somehow the republicans seemed to act like it was political manipulation that these flights were delayed and there are no real life consequences to the sequester, that you can cut billions and billions of dollars in the way of a meat ax from the budget and nothing at all happens to inconvenience them or anyone else. and you're absolutely right. you know, i voted for that because i think that we don't want the airlines to be delayed and we don't want traffic controllers to be sequestered. i mean, to get furloughed.

but what about those children? you know, in indiana, martin, they're having a lottery to figure out which children are going to be kicked out of the head start program? >> yes, i read that. >> yeah. it's also -- >> you know, ma'am, it's hardly surprising that the american people would rather contract gonorrhea or the ebola virus rather than show any respect for congress when it's perfectly obvious that members will only take action when it affects them. i mean, this is the most shameless self-serving political body of any democratic nation. isn't it? >> well, i certainly would agree that picking on this one, as jay carney called it, a band-aid to put on a very big problem, is ridiculous. and, yes, it is somewhat self-serving, although, you know, the important part of our economy is that the airplaneses fly and they fly on time. so i'm not totally unsympathetic to that, but i am -- i voted against the sequester because it

would do exactly these broad-scale things. the department of defense is affected. u.s. department of customs and immigration is affected. the epa. all of the functions of government. and we're doing this one little thing? okay. i'll do it. but we have to get rid of the sequester. and it is not a fake government political thing. many of them voted for it. >> indeed. but you see, when the president proposed the american jobs act two years ago, an act, by the way, that would create over a million jobs. >> correct. >> an act that would increase gdp by at least 1.5%. in a nation where the majority of our bridges and roads are now substandard. nobody would give it the time of day in congress, but you make a member wait for his flight and they shift $250 million around so that air traffic controllers don't have to be furloughed. what are we supposed to think of

the united states congress when the self-serving nature of that decision today is obvious to everyone? >> well, now i think the american people may be getting a better look at the priorities of the members of congress, the 535 of us who decide priorities, sometimes based on our own self-interests, yes. that is absolutely true. and the american jobs act, as you pointed out, would address the real deficit that we have in this country. that's the jobs deficit. and if we put more people back to work, actually, we would end the economic deficit because people would be able to pay taxes. they would get off the government support programs, and our economy would be rolling again. so the choices that we are making here today are absolutely absurd. today was another example. >> but can i also mention to you, ma'am, earlier this week,

we featured in video a 99-year-old woman called frances haskell who told a reporter that her only meal of the day come the via meals on wheels, and that 99-year-old woman is about to lose that provision. and nobody in congress displays a scintilla of interest in her predicament and yet we have the decision today. >> there will be 4 million meals -- i don't know about mrs. haskell -- but i know there will be 4 million meals that are lost to people who depend on those every single day in order to have some nutritious diet. it's just -- it's inexplicable to me. i look sometimes and i think, who are these people? that they would do that when we don't need to? this is self-inflicted and we

don't need to do it. or other inflicted. >> indeed. to be fair to you, congress wovm, you were delayed earlier this week when we hoped you'd join us to discuss a bill that would create thousands of jobs for police officers. that bill that you're proposing. in the light of what happened in boston, that seems like an imminently sensible proposal, but i have to ask you, ma'am, is there any possibility a sensible bill like that would ever pass through this house? >> it's hard to explain why we wouldn't want more of the first responders in our communities given what happened in boston. that we wouldn't appropriate the kind of money to create these good jobs, these well-paying jobs and these essential jobs in our community. i really can't explain it, but i think, martin, that it has very little chance of passing. i've been actually accused in a

very derogatory term, oh, all you want to do, up to hire more teachers and firefighters and police officers. well, that's exactly what i do want to do and i think it's a good thing. >> it absolutely is. congresswoman jan schakowsky, thank you so much for joining us. >> thank you, martin. next, the war on islam, the war on an american's rights. stay with us. and now we have essential sli duct tape over the mouth of this terrorist and we can't use him to link together this treasure-trove of information and the people who are hurt the most are the people watching your show. >> i couldn't agree more. her viewers are being hurt. stay with us. the capital one cash rewards card gives you 1% cash back on all purchases, plus a 50% annual bonus. and everyone but her... no. no! no. ...likes 50% more cash. but i don't give up easy... do you want 50% more cash?

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on the day that the surviving boston bomber is transferred to a prison medical center at ft. devins outside of boston and the "boston globe" reports a harrowing account of the carjacked victim, tsarnaev, new information has come to light. nbc news obtained fbi analysis of the bombs which points to a level of technical skill that may have gone beyond merry reading the instructions in one particularly al qaeda-link the magazine. the report says the construction and fragmentation of the bombs suggests the brothers constructed their explosives by reading "inspire" magazine, an online al qaeda publication. in particular, the piping used in their pipe bombs correlates to instructions found in that magazine. the report goes on to detail that the brothers used a low explosive that is consistent with commercial fireworks as

well as small metal bbs and nails affixed to cardboard. however, it does not appear the brothers learned everything about bomb making from "inspire" magazine. in particular, some of the triggers diverged from the magazine suggested design. for analysis, we turn to jim cavanaugh, retired atf special agent and msnbc analyst. good afternoon, jim. >> hello, martin. >> hearing that information, what does it tell you about these brothers, their knowledge, their capabilities? >> well, you know, i think us in the bomb business when we look at this case, we see that they could be started with "inspire" magazine and certainly could move along a while. i think a lot of us probably feel, like i do, that there may be some practice here and there could be some instruction here, even hands-on instruction. i would venture to say that probably they practiced at least the triggering mechanism if they

didn't practice a complete detonation. and, you know, this is a remote corol -- both of these bombs, maybe all three, the one at the watertown police, are remote controlled, command detonated. basically they're improvised mines, because of the roundness and the way the fragmentation is placed. >> right. >> martin, it's just an awful, vulgar thing to put this it a crowd and stand back and push the button. it's just an unbelievable act of cowardace. >> do you speculate when tamerlan tsarnaev went to dagestan for that period of six months it's possible he either met someone there who upgraded the sophistication of what he read online? >> yes, martin, i think that's probable. you know, the intelligence agencies are going to have to route that out. i think they're in the process of that right now. we don't have the answer. let's look at the facts we know. this is what we did in the police business for years. we know he started to radicalize

first. because we heard the witnesses from his neighborhood. he went over for six months. what needs to be determined, was he playing on the front porch with his father or run to these fanatics like he had radical siradicalized himself? if he did, they would have supported him, nurtured him, patted him on his back in his beliefs but also may have provided instruction, practice. all that i think is very possible. the reliability of the bombs is interesting. because they carried them a long way on foot. i think they probably soldered the connections. they had them in there very tight. this is a very determined and well-planned attack. and i think -- i'm sorry. go ahead. >> go ahead, jim. >> i was going to say, the tick tock of how they walked these bombs and placed them i find very interesting. and, you know, we can go through that if you want to, but i think it's very interesting the way they placed them and the way they detonated them.

>> see, we also learned from the carjacking victim about what appears to be a basic lack of strategy once they'd hijacked the mercedes. there's this idea that on the one hand they've produced fairly sophisticated devices. on the other hand, they're driving around in circles in boston not knowing where they're going and saying to this guy whose vehicle they hijacked, did you see what happened in boston? we did it. it's hard for us to reconcile on the one hand the sophistication and the skill, on the other hand what appears to be a couple of hapless fools. >> exactly, martin. you're exactly right. and what happened is, you've been a journalist too long. you see how they change. they change from the pressure. when those photographs come out, the pressure changed. and that's what happened. then they went into what we find most people, it's either fight or flight. what they did is fight and flight. they didn't know what to do. they kind of did both. and they're bragging, too, to the carjacked victim.

you know, we're big bad international terrorists. we did the bombing and we're bad. you know, so there was this whole persona taken on by them. last time we saw that was in the d.c. sniper. it was a similar metamorphosis of the snipers. the more it's on the news, the more emboldened they become and start making rasom demands. i see that as the same kind of phenomenon. they didn't know what to do and ran around haphazardly. thankfully the transit and watertown police stopped them. >> yeah, thankfully. we learned thursday the brothers may indeed had hoped to attack times square in new york. let me play what michael bloomberg and police chief ray kelly had to say about that. >> the information we received was that he was a lot more lucid and gave much more detailed information in the second questioning period. >> and regardless whether we believe it or not, this is the

information we get and we're going to take everything seriously. >> also in that press conference, we learned that they were carrying six explosive devices. does it tell you anything about these brothers' abilities, that they were able to construct these weapons yet they weren't able to make it out of boston? >> right. well, you know, mike bloomberg and ray kelly got to be the two most straight talking guys in the country. that's why you have to love them. they straight talk the city. that's what they're doing there. they're exactly right. these brothers, martin, the key here is they already had these bombs made. they didn't go between 5:00 when the photographs came out and whatever it was, 10:00 p.m. when they shot the m.i.t. officer and carjacked the man. they didn't acquire the materials to make the bombs and make the bombs in that five-hour window. they already had the bombs made and they weren't going to, you know, auction them off. they weren't going to sell them at the local flea market or garage sale. they were going to detonate those other bombs.

so this was the beginning of a bombing campaign or bombing spree. they were going to plant those other bombs down the road but they were interrupted by the people of boston really, the witnesses, the police. you talked about the police. i mean, you got to have cops. cops matter. >> yes. >> and they matter in times square with faisal shahzad. >> james cavanaugh, thanks for your expertise. coming up, the president addresses the worsening situation in syria. stay with us. there are numerous republicans that voted against the sequestration because we knew all of these calamities were in the future. and so it reminds me of the shakespeare line, thou protesteths too much. [ phil ] when you have joint pain and stiffness...

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stay with us. the day's top lines are coming up. >> they were talking to him and he was singing like a canary. >> yeah, he was singing like a canary, see? he was squealing like a pig, dropping a dime like a dirty rat. we had this guy dead to right, about to send him up the river to the big house, the pen, the slammer, the joint, the gray bar hotel. it was all -- it was all eggs and coffee until the chief got all hinky and gave us the double cross, the runaround, the high hat. that's what's eating me, see? i aught to fix his wagon. give him a pair of jack johnsons right in the how's your old man? [ male announcer ] you are a business pro. governor of getting it done. you know how to dance... with a deadline. and you...rent from national. because only national lets you choose any car in the aisle... and go.

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he is alive. >> he walked outside and he saw blood on a body. >> oh, my god. >> we have a victory here tonight. >> most people in watertown don't have guns. you're a sitting duck. >> if only everyone had guns and bombs and whatever the [ bleep ] they would get their hands on. >> it's a sad thing. >> he said it's sad? >> what do you think provoked it? >> being losers. >> if we put the pieces of the puzzle together, they are muslims, they are brothers, we must invade iraq. >> we need better immigrants. >> had it changed based on what happened in boston, we'll see l certainly be open to it. >> you had the time to read all 844 pages? >> actually i have read the bill. >> 99% of the muslims are outstanding americans. >> the system did ping when he was leaving the wrooits. >> the ball was dropped. >> you have the right under the constitution to resilent. >> he's got his miranda rights. >> i want to know about this wife. she ought to be in prison for wearing a hijab. >> we have "teen mom" and "dance

moms." this is jihad mom. >> between benghazi and boston, we're going backwards. >> what a massive screwup. >> some are leery of muslim students in america. >> student visas are not a right. >> should we really be teaching them nuclear physics? >> those who want to do harm only have to be right one time. >> two twisted knockoff jihadis. >> political correctness as always been the hand maiden of terrorism. >> of course they're all democrats. do you think they're voting for romney? >> somebody is going to trigger one of those homemade bombs with an obama phone. >> should be under scrutiny. >> after the president meets with the saudis, all of a sudden he's not a person of interest. just requires some press that is willing to go along with us. >> we are, beck, we're always willing to give you a hearing. >> let's get right to our panel now. joining us is my colleague, toure, host of "the cycle" and joan walsh who's editor at large

for salon.com and author of "what's the matter with white people?" toure, a third man is on the loose, according to glenn beck, he's audi, he's muslim and according to glenn beck, the white house is involved in hiding his identity. why haven't the fbi and the cia issued an all-points bulletin for the man? >> this man also kidnapped the lindbergh baby and killed o.j.'s wife. so, i mean -- >> it's perfectly possible those charges could be added to an indictment. >> extraordinarily busy. of course, we should take these claims by glenn beck extraordinarily seriously. >> we are. >> because everything that he says is correct and never lunacy. because obama hatred does not cloud the brown and make you have bizarre thoughts that have nothing to do with reality. what is he talking about? but also there's this desire i see here of using islamophobia to explain everything. right in we have this conning world that we're afraid of. we have enemies coming at us.

many are homegrown. many are like adam lanza, they don't have ideology at all. then others come from other parts of the world. if we cannot use islamophobia to explain all of them, it would be too confusing, so we have to put everything into that land. >> joan, i want you to listen to mr. beck because he says he's actually in possession of documentary evidence. take a listen to this. here it comes. >> then suddenly after the president meets with the saudis and john kerry meets with the saudis, all of a sudden he's not a person of interest and somebody goes in and tries to delete this file. they try to get rid of all of the evidence after "the blaze" reports it, they try to get rid of all it. >> joan, they tried to get rid of the evidence. >> they got rid of the evidence because they had put him on the watch list because they were interrogating him. they actually did what they were supposed to do. they were concerned about this saudi kid. then when they discovered he had nothing to do with the plot, he was a victim running away

because that's what a sane person would do, they took him off the watch list. and so the system worked and glenn beck is still spewing this. you know what's really interesting, fox, itself, debunked this. >> well, you, as always, have anticipated me because there is a slight problem. mr. brett bear of the same fox news channel looked into that document. there he is. he's waving the piece of paper and calls it, in his words, false and misleading. is it possible that the third man may be a figment of their imagination? is that possible? >> yes, the third man, they make the third man exist because they have spent so much time demonizing this president, insin waying that he either has some muslim ties and beliefs or he's too soft, he's too politically correct, that this has to go together. this whole conspiracy theory is the culmination of five years of making this man not one of us, the other, and perhaps he does have a funny name.

>> all these sort of things that we don't have to trust obama because he's not one of us. >> right. >> because he's somebody we can hate because he's not that intelligent, he's not really american. if he's lying about his basic identity, then we don't have to trust anything else he ever says. so we can foment this deep distrust of him and use it at any point. this plays extraordinarily well in the sort of michael savage, levin -- >> glenn beck was invited on to o'reilly. joan, here's the problem with all of this. according to glenn beck, there are six members of congress who are going to open an investigation into this conspiracy theory about a third man. >> i believe that -- i believe that. i'm sure we have six members of congress crazy -- i mean, louie gohmert has to be on the list. >> yeah. >> we have six members of congress. but, you know, the thing about o'reilly that's so cynical, i mean, roger ailes had the good sense to get rid of glenn beck to realize glenn beck was

becoming a terrible embarrassment to fox. and o'reilly brings him back, because i don't know, he's having an issue with his ratings and he's got to gin up the islamophobia and now give glenn beck another fox platform to spew this stuff? i mean, it's just so cynical. >> there's voters at home who will buy it. so there are senators who will push it. >> of course. toure and joan walsh. thank you so much for joining us. much more ahead. first, we'd like to say good-bye to a legend. country music superstar george jones passed away this morning at vanderbilt university medical center in nashville. known as a purist of country music, his songs about heartbreak and heavy drinking seemed to echo his own life. when he reflected on his early career, he once said this, "in the 1970s, i was drunk the majority of the time. if you saw me sober, chances are you saw me asleep." george jones was just 81 years of age when he passed away.

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turn insight into action. there's increasing pressure on the white house to offer a definitive judgment on whether it believes the government of syria has used chemical weapons against its own people. moments ago the president offered his assessment of whether seyrisyria's bashar al has crossed the red line. >> knowing that potentially chemical weapons have been used inside of syria doesn't tell us when they were used, how they were used. in many ways, a line's been cross eed when we see tens of thousands of innocent people being killed by a regime. >> the president's comments came shortly after white house press secretary jay carney withstood a barrage of questions. >> the degrees of confidence here are varying. this is not an airtight case. the fact is that we do have some

evidence. we do have varying degrees of confidence. let me clarify, we're trying to find out if there is, in fact, a credible verifiable c >> right. joining now is nbc's amon, and michael o'hanlon at the brookings institution. welcome to you both. mike, we've seen democrats and republicans press the mpresiden to take action. european and middle eastern countries, too. how long can the administration wait for a definitive judgment to quote jay carney, before the pressure to do something becomes overwhelming? >> you know, martin, it's a great question because i think the administration may have to quote/unquote do something, but it doesn't necessarily mean we're going to intervene the way advocates of a much more muscular policy would prefer. i could imagine the president saying it looks as if a small number of people were, indeed, hurt by chemical weapons, that's

unacceptable, that crosses a red line but all i can do is identify a specific unit in one place as having done that and punish that unit in some way. and he might announce this, you know, half an hour after cruise missiles have landed around that unit and taken out some of its weapons. or maybe kill ten of its soldiers. that's the kind of response i could imagine that would be a one-off. it wouldn't have to apply an american escalation in the war writ large. that's the kind of thing i'm sure the president is going to have to contemplate in the days ahead if the evidence bears out as we're now suspecting. >> yet, mike there talks about the possibility of a few people or a small number of people. we've seen 70,000 syrians killed. >> yeah. there's a bit of an irony in all this that you're focusing on chemical weapons being the red line when so much more worse has happened in terms of the 80,000 people killed. the millions of people displayed. the fact this is no longer an internal syrian civil war. this is now a regional con flig

ration that has implications for the united states, its allies and destabilized the region opening wounds we haven't seen since the iraq war. so the irony of it is that two years from when this conflict started, and the united states wanting to not interfere in an internal syrian matter, it is now not an internal matter. it's a regional one. >> there are 200 united states troops to help contain violence along the syrian border. the "associated press" reports it is met with protest. what if the reaction in the middle east if people in boots start arriving on the ground in large numbers? >> well, i don't think they are going to, martin. the 200 americans you mentioned is not really going to be able to quell in violence. that's going to be primarily a planning cell. maybe the intelligence capabilities associated with that will help us consider next steps. but you would have to go into

the thousands and probably the tens of thousands to have even a limited capability in any meaningful way and obviously need to go into the many tens of thousands to really do anything decisive. that's just not in the cards. if it ever did happen, i'm sure it would be an arab league nato joint operation where the united states would feel very strongly that our role could be pick your fraction, no more than a third of the total. or i think this administration's just not going to be interested. i think they're not interested at all in anything like that right now. but even if things get a lot worse, i don't think they're going to be willing to lead this from washington, per se. >> yet, mike, i've read a few commentators who say the question is less an the kinds of weapons assad is using against his people, rather the question is whether it's riskier to do something rather than nothing. where do you fall on that question? >> i think at this point, having declared that assad, you know, is not a legitimate leader which we did almost two years ago, having seen him, the primary culprit in the death of 75,000

or 80,000 syrians as ayman just mentioned, we have to make it clear assad will not be allowed to stay in power. right now there is some doubt. make no mistake. at least that's my interpretation. i'd be curious for yours. we say assad must go, assad will go. i see no convincing proof that's inevitable. i think we have to make it clear to the world we will escalate. we working with the arab league and nato world will escalate, and perhaps escalating to air strikes if necessary. and this will occur before another winter sets in and threatens the lives of so many syrian refugees. i think that's the right policy. done in con judge with the arab league and nato. if you don't do that, a lot of people including assad, himself, will still believe he can hold out and win. >> ayman, does assad go, does he stay? >> that's a million-dollar question. the evidence suggests he will not stay in power but i don't necessarily see it any time on the horizon. he has demonstrated the

willingness to use unlimited force to keep himself in power and if there is no international reaction to the use of chemical weapons that could mark even a darker chapter in this conflict, but i do believe not only in terms of what is unfolding on the ground, but i believe returning to the status quo is unsustainable for him to maintain power over the entire country is no longer sustainable. it already has emerged he doesn't have control of the entire country. >> right. >> so i think that there is a time limit on how long he'll be able to hold on to power. >> ayman and michael o'hanlon, gentlemen, thank you so much. >> thanks, martin. and a note. the new york police department has announced the discovery of landing gear apparently from one of the commercial airliners destroyed on september the 11th. the recovery was made between a pair of lower manhattan buildings. a site that now is being treated as a crime scene. authorities say the landing gear has a clearly visible boeing identification number. next, you can't cheat the math.

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we got a new update on the health of the united states economy today and the results offer encouraging data. with economic growth accelerating to an annual rate of 2.5% during the first three months of this year. so how will this economic news shape the political debate in washington? we're joined by jared bernstein, senior fellow at the center on budget and policy priorities. and a former top economist to vice president joe biden. jared, for the last five years, you and i have had to listen to risible nonsense from presidential candidates, from the chair of the house budget committee, who tells us the only route out of recession is to institute immediate spending cuts. today the united states economy posts a modest 2.5% in growth, while spain's unemployment is now 28% and the united kingdom managed to avoid a triple-dip

recession by less than a third of a percentage point. isn't this argument, now, done and dusted? >> well, it absolutely should be, and europe is exhibit 1 and recent trends in this country are exhibit 2. i mean, in europe, they've embraced what you're describing falls under the rubric of austerity. the idea that cutting budgets is going to somehow stimulate growth. that's exactly backwards on the theory. okay. we can argue about that, but it's also, as you've just shown, exactly backwards on the evidence. now the 2.5% from the first quarter gdp growth in the u.s. has to be taken in context with the 0.4% growth at the end of last year. so some of this is just bounceback. with these quarterly numbers, martin, you have to average them out. we're growing at a little bit below 2% year over year on average. that's really too slow to knock the unemployment rate down very far. >> right. we saw the flight delays this

week caused by the see quester. apart from that, given how sluggish the recovery really is, who in their right minds would support the sequester that is already proving to be the worst self-inflicted wound that any nation could ever conceive for itself and its economy? >> well, you certainly are not mincing words, and i appreciate that because the economic logic of what you're saying is impeccab impeccable, so there must be politics in here. i know you're shocked. look. i've always thought that at least for some policymakers, and maybe most, that they're not thinking about economics. they're thinking about an anti-government ideology which always says more cuts are better, smaller government is better, whack away at social insurance, whack away at the safety net, whack away at the discretionary spending. >> fire teachers. >> yeah. exactly. and, you know, if you're left with a problem on the economic side, i done kn't know, blame t

on the president or gosh knows what. there's not a lot of rational thinking going on here, and, again, the evidence out of europe is extremely strong and the evidence -- by the way, in this gdp report that we're talking about, one of the reasons it's so negative is because the state, local, and federal sector has been negative for about two years running. i mean, again, very strong evidence of this anti-austerity case. >> jared bernstein, as ever, jared, thank you. >> thank you, martin. next, president becomes the first sitting president to address the members of planned parenthood. stay with us. so being an advertising spokesman i have to look my best on camera. whether i'm telling people about how they could save money on car insurance with geico... yeah, a little bit more of the lime green love yeah... ...or letting them know they can reach geico 24/7 using the latest technology. go on, slather it all over. don't hold back, go on it's these high-definition televisions

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millions of low income women. joining us now, white house correspondent kristen welker. notwithstanding the president's support for women's rights from the lilly ledbetter act onwards, this was still something of a surprise. why did he choose to accept this invitation? >> well, martin, i think in mart if you remember planned parenthood has been very supportive of this president, particularly during the 2012 election. this really gave him a platform to reaffirm his support for the group but also to reaffirm and talk about women's health care and also his support for abortion rights. he really took on some of those states who have recently enacted tougher laws when it comes to abortion including north dakota and mississippi. he said, martin, and i quote "when you read about some of these laws, you want to check the calendar." that was part of his core message this afternoon. of course, martin, as you remember, women played a big role in helping him get re-elected. this is part of his core constituency for democrats. >> the white house received a

nonpolitical visitor. who would that be? and why did he call in? >> reporter: well, that was would be none other than conan o'brien, martin. i can tell you he was here touring the white house. he is going to be the headliner at tomorrow night's white house correspondents dinner. he'll be the comedian making the jokes. he was here shaking the hands of journalists like myself. i got a chance to meet him. i tried to get a preview of his speech. no such luck. he tells me it's going to be very funny, there will be a lot of laughs. this is traditionally a time for the biggest names in washington, d.c., to come together with the biggest names in hollywood as well. that has sort of evolved over the years. i can tell you some of the other guests from hollywood will include steven spielberg, kevin spacey, harvey weinstein. some say it's become too focused on celebrities. martin, you heard the term comedy is no laughing matter. i hear the president takes his

speech pretty seriously. >> he does, indeed. of course, you will be there, too. kristen welker, thank you. we'll have coverage right here on msnbc tomorrow. thanks so much for watching this afternoon. chris matthews and "hardball" is next. dogs of war. let's play "hardball." good evening, i'm chris matthews in washington. let me start with this. war. bombing people. shooting down airplanes. breaking into houses. i can think of what we mean when we so casually say, lelt's go, let's get in this thing and the rah-rah and drum beating that gets us out there killing people and getting killed again. always it's the same ones, mccain, krystol. say the name of the country and their conditioned response is war, america go to