now where's the snooze button? good evening, americans, and welcome to "the ed show" from new york. if it's sunday, you know john mccain is running his mouth about benghazi. congressman darrell issa wants to take everything behind closed doors now all of a sudden. and a former bush secretary of defense sets the record straight and comes forward and has some interesting words to say about hillary clinton. this is "the ed show." let's get to work. >> look at the mouth on this one. >> no kidding. >> i would call it a cover-up. >> i think that's nonsense. >> it just doesn't seem like there is a cover-up. >> and i think the american people will think it's nonsense. >> i would call it a cover-up in the extent that there was willful removal of information. >> our intelligence committee will have a report and i hope we will put some of these things to rest. >> it's really about one thing and one thing only. >> secretary clinton -- >> secretary clinton -- >> secretary clinton --

>> and my concern is, when hillary clinton's name is mentioned 32 times in a hearing -- >> secretary clinton. >> secretary clinton. >> everyone knows this is just a partisan witch hunt. >> that is a very mean and hurtful thing for my colleague to suggest. >> hillary clinton's not a target. president obama's not a target. >> oh, that's a dandy fish. >> well, darrell issa is on a fishing expedition. i think he's going to get skunked. you know, there's a really bad case of benghazi fever going around in this country, and right now it seems like the only people who have it are conservatives for some reason. you know, you can't tell me that the driver of this story, the big driver of this story and these congressional hearings, it's only about four dead americans. of course, anytime we lose servants across the world, it's a horrible thing, like 4,000 in iraq, but i think the benghazi thing is nothing more than a republican effort to smear hillary clinton and the obama administration. and the proof is in the sunday morning talk shows this morning.

john mccain comes out complaining about, what, a government cover-up? >> they're in the midst of a presidential campaign, the narrative by the obama campaign is that bin laden is dead, al qaeda is on the run, not to worry about anything, and here comes this attack on benghazi. for the present spokesman to say that, well, there was only words of technical changes made in those e-mails is a flat-out untruth. i like mr. carney. but that's just not acceptable for the present spokesman to say that to the american people when we now know, any reference to act of terror, any reference to al qaeda were removed from those talking points and it was done as a deputy's meeting just before susan rice -- >> would you call this a cover-up? >> but what did president obama say? we'll get to that in a moment. mccain also wasted in time in going after the former secretary of state.

>> do you blame hillary clinton? >> i think that the secretary of state has played a role in this -- >> do you think she had a role in those e-mails? >> she had to have been in the loop in some way, but we don't know for sure. but i do know that her response, before the foreign relations committee, who cares -- remember when she said, "who cares how this happened?" in a rather emotional way. a lot of people care, with respect to the secretary of state. >> so in a course of a few minutes, john mccain went after the president and hillary clinton. meanwhile, republicans are also targeting ambassador thomas pickering. pickers put together the state department report on benghazi, on that attack, but it wasn't good enough for the republicans. >> the review board report was not a substitute for adequate congressional oversight. and there were already questions raised, i have respect for ambassador pickering, but there were already questions raised, for example, eric nordstrom said that there were key decisionmakers that weren't

interviewed by the arb. mark thompson, a top council terrorism official that was asked to be interviewed was not. i was interested to hear that they did not probe secretary clinton in detail, because obviously she was the decisionmaker at the state department. >> luckily for america, senator dick durbin was standing by to set the record straight. >> thomas pickering appeared on your show this morning. i wish he would have appeared at the hearing last week. he asked to be there. he should have been there. he's the most respected diplomat in washington. he, together with admiral mullen, went through a lengthy review of the security aspect of this. they came up with a recommendation for changes, which were accepted by secretary clinton and president obama. unfortunately, this has been caught up in the 2016 presidential campaign. this effort to go after hillary clinton. the reason she wasn't interviewed was she didn't have any direct-line responsibility for the decisions that were made. but they want to bring her in, because they think it's a good political show. and i think that's unfortunate. >> darrell issa, the guide of

this fishing expedition, appeared on "meet the press" this morning. he was sitting alongside ambassador pickering, who was not impressed with the congressman's misinformation. >> now, ambassador pickering, his people, and he refused to come before our committee -- >> that is not true. >> well, we'll get to ambassador pickering -- >> we have it in writing, we have white house correspondence. it may not have been the ambassador's decision, but it was the white house's decision. that has been reversed. we're inviting him on monday along with admiral mullen to come and to go through with his papers a private deposition. >> i said the day before the hearings, i was willing to appear, to come to the very hearings that he excluded me from. the white house told me -- >> please don't tell my excluded you? >> we were told the majority said i was not welcome at that hearing, i could come at some other time. >> this is typical darrell issa. you see, he is, of course, head of the house oversight committee, and they are very selective in who steps forward to give testimony.

you might remember when issa invited an all-male panel to talk about women's health issues. sandra floouke was off to the se and never invited. formally, i think robert gates made the most relevant point of all of this today. gates said benghazi critics had a cartoonish impression of military capability. >> we don't have a ready force standing by in the middle east, despite all the turmoil that's going on. >> getting somebody there in a timely way would have been very difficult, if not impossible. to send some small number of special forces or other troops in without knowing what the environment is, without knowing what the threat is, without having any intelligence in terms of what is actually going on, on the ground, i think would have been very dangerous and personally, i would not have approved that, because we just don't -- it's sort of a cartoonish impression of military capabilities and military forces. >> so there you have it.

who do we believe? i mean, we've got different players on all sides, don't we? getting help to benghazi would have been close to impossible. gates also blew up the whole controversy. here's what he had to say about former secretary of state, hillary clinton. >> i worked with secretary clinton pretty closely for 2 1/2 years. and i wouldn't want to try and be somebody to -- trying to convince her to say something she did not think was true. >> you don't think she would do that? >> no. >> the direct question is, do you think hillary's lying? mr. gates says, no, that's not hillary. i've been around her long enough to know better. here's the bottom line. it's like two corporations. one corporation buys another corporation, okay? and we've got to get the press release correct, because we certainly don't want to offend anybody. i think there's a little bit of that hear with the state department and the cia. if it's a terrorist attack called out there, there's going to be criticism of the cia, why

didn't we know that this was coming? if it's not worded properly, there's going to be criticism spread everywhere. but here is the bottom line. you take out hillary clinton, you have a whole different story. you have a whole different modus operandi for the republicans. get your cell phones out. i want to know what you think. are republicans using benghazi to hurt hillary clinton's chances. in 2016? text "a" for yes and "b" for no, or go to our blog and we'll bring you the results later on in the show. joining me tonight, katrina vanden heuvel, bob shrum, and contributor for the daily beast and "washington post" columnist, e.j. dionne. great to have all of you with us tonight. best panel on sunday is right here. katrina, darrell issa, they have had nine hearings on this. now he wants to take mr. pickering to testify behind closed doors, give deposition behind closed doors.

what's wrong with mr. pickering coming out and talking to everybody, like all the other folks did? >> nothing wrong. i think today what we saw on these sunday talk shows was, again, what we've seen over the years, which is a great disconnect between what the elite, the politicians inside the beltway are talking about, and what people in this country are caring about. and darrell issa and the republicans are not interested in sober fact finding. there is a role for sober fact finding, but they are seeking an issue, ginning up the base, fund-raising on benghazi, and they're driving delusional conspiracies. there is a lack of history, context, and fact that if we are going to talk about benghazi, we deserve. one is that america embassy's consulates, military compounds have been targets for many years. many years. there were 64 attacks during the george w. bush era. the republicans have cut security at embassies, 300 million, just in 2012. the other factor is we have a major report by ambassador

pickering. 29 recommendations. the question is, what do we do now moving forward about the unaddressed security needs in libya? how do we fund those? and sure, let's have more discussion. but darrell issa and the republicans are not in a position to do what this country needs in terms of any sober fact finding. >> we are down to talking points. that's where the right wing is right now. e.j. dionne, do you think presidential politics played into these talking points as the right wing is accusing the obama administration of backing off on the word "terror," making sure that al qaeda was not included in the talking points, and -- because, of course, that would have made president obama look weak going into an election that he couldn't keep us safe, and they didn't have their eye on the ball. your thoughts on that? >> well, first, ed, welcome back and happy mother's day to wendy and to katrina too. >> thank you. >> it's good to have you on the air again. look, i think anything that is issued from the government of the united states, from an kpeskt agency during an election, the election's on everybody's mind and would it

shock me if electoral concerns are in the back of people's heads? no, it wouldn't. but i think you've got it right when you say that this was primarily a bureaucratic turf battle between the state department and the cia. and one of the reasons they got shrunk and shrunk and shrunk is the more you took out, the less you offended one side or the other. but i think what needs to happen here is the administration is caught with republicans determined to do anything they can to make benghazi a scandal, a big deal, a conspiracy. how do you fight against that, when there's no conspiracy, and when there's no fundamental scandal, what you want to do is put everything out fast. i hope ambassador pickering testifies and i hope they insist that he testify in the open. i think hillary clinton showed the last time that she was a great witness. i think they have to sort of flood the zone with facts and say, there is no conspiracy.

when four american diplomats are murdered or one american diplomat is murdered, that's a big deal. that's why they appointed the pickering/mullen review. but there is no sort of hidden agenda here, and they should try to push this aside as fast as they can. >> well, they want mr. pickering now to come forward behind closed doors and give deposition. because darrell issa says he doesn't want to make it a show. really? they've already had nine hearings. the right wing wants this story to stay around as long as possible, to tarnish hillary clinton as a national candidate. no doubt about it. bob shrum, here's a clip of darrell issa. why don't you respond to it. here it is. >> what did secretary of state hillary clinton fail to disclose or fail to do that makes her a target for you? >> hillary clinton is not a target, president obama is not a target. >> isn't this an effort to take downhillry in 2016, bob? they're political opportunists.

>> sure, this is all about fear of the hillary candidacy in 2016 and resentment that president obama won in 2012. the republicans have been down this road before. it's sort of out of their playbook. they tried this during the campaign. mitt romney tried the benghazi attack in the second department and got smashed for it. if you think back 20 years, there was a concocted non-scandal called white water that was supposed to bring hillary clinton down. it certainly did not. and i think when she hears all of this, it makes her more interested in running in 2016. finally, i think if the republicans believe the way that they're going to beat hillary clinton is by banging this drum, then they're really crazy. if you talk to ordinary people about this, they can barely follow any of the details. and the reason for that is, and it reflects with what both katrina and e.j. said, the reason is, there's nothing there. so you have to keep grabbing at little pieces of straw, and out of those little pieces of straw,

try to weave something that can convince people, but you can't. >> well, here is a sound bite that the right wing doesn't lean on at all. the president, not long after the attack, came out and said this -- now, they're hung up on talking points. this is the president the day after the attack. >> no acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character, or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for. >> what is more important when the president uses the word "terror" or what's in a talking point memo, so to speak, that's going to describe what people should be saying on talk shows? katrina, your thoughts on that? the president the day after used the word "terror." >> well, let's think of the other words being used right now, like "cover-up." e.j.'s right. this was probably in the fog of war with all kinds of intelligence coming in, a bureaucratic knife fight between the cia and the state department with an election in the backdrop. but the larger fundamental question is, the united states

is intervening in parts of this world, which are roiling with extremism, with forces that we don't have control over. and if we're going to engage in those parts, and that's a fundamental discussion, which, by the way, the congress has had little oversight or say in, and which they could play a useful role, then we need to be prepared with security, with wisdom about how we engage and intervene, and the whole issue of terrorism, there's a semantic fight underway about whether this was -- >> it goes back to the conversation, do we have a war on terror? remember the bush years. >> exactly, exactly. here's the problem, if the sunday talk shows continue to be driven by the conservatives, by the right, by john mccain being the most frequent guest on those talk shows, how do we change the dynamic in a more productive way, as e.j. suggested? >> i don't score at home, but i will tell you, i think it's 9 out of 12 sundays mccain has been out on the talking heads. it might have 8 out of 12, but

anybody playing baseball would like to have that home run record. katrina, stay with us along with bob shrum and e.j. dionne. we're coming right back. remember to answer tonight's question there on the bottom of the screen. share your thoughts with us on twitter and @edshow. coming up next, the drums of war are beating loudly again. john mccain says that we should go to war with, quote, them. senator, who's them? can you be serious? i don't think so. and nothing says happy mother's day more than gushing about your mistress on national television. so much for family values, republicans. we'll be right back here on "the ed show." stay with us. this is for real this time. step seven point two one two. verify and lock. command is locked. five seconds. three, two, one. standing by for capture. the most innovative software on the planet... dragon is captured.

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welcome back to "the ed show." we have some breaking news out of the city of new orleans, louisiana. police say a shooting at a mother's day parade has left 12 people injured on frenchman's street. the associated press reports that three people are in critical condition, three suspects were reportedly involved, but so far, we do not have a motive. we'll keep you updated on this

story as details continue to come in. but now back to our other top stories here on "the ed show." i wish i could say that the other big topic on the sunday shows this morning was health care, social security, but it wasn't. instead, the republican hawks spent this morning reassuring america that we won't go to war in syria. >> nobody is calling for military action in syria. no one. there are some great options, and adam, i think you know those, and this is not something we should be arguing about. >> no boots on the ground, no american boots on the ground. >> this new amateur video shows mortar explosions near syria's capital, but we don't know which side is doing the shelling. senator john mccain says he knows who the good guys are and we don't have to worry about it. >> we can provide them with a safe zone, we can provide them a place to organize inside syria, we can give them the heavy weapons that they need -- >> who's "them." who's "them." >> well, i know them, i've met

them, they're there. >> but how do you keep out good rebels and bad rebels? you've got al qaeda rebels -- >> thank you. martha, these are legitimate questions you're asking. >> well, here's another legitimate question. >> i think that caution, particularly in terms of arming these groups and in terms of u.s. military involvement is in order. >> well, what should we do? >> well, my question back to you is, why should it be us? >> and here's my question. if the united states commits blood and treasure in syria's civil war, will it actually help? >> i think in all of these countries, including syria, syria, libya, both artificial creations of colonial powers. for us to think we can influence or determine the outcome of that, i think, is a mistake. i thought it was a mistake in libya, and i think it is a mistake in syria. we overestimate our ability to

determine outcomes. >> let's return to katrina vanden heuvel of "the nation," bob shrum, and also e.j. dionne. e.j., is there any history out there that says, if we go into syria, there's a real good chance we're going to get a successful outcome? when are we going to learn our lesson? >> well, i think it was very significant that on the shows today, advocates of intervention went out of their way to say, well, we don't really want to put boots on the ground. and i think that's because even the hawks realize that there is no stomach in the country right now for massive intervention in the middle east. and i think you have a lot of people who are, if you will, the old republican realists, people like former secretary gates, people like richard haass, president of the council on foreign relations, who are saying, you can't just intervene a little bit, turn a few dials, and then get an ideal outcome. >> do these republicans know what they want? a no-fly zone take resources to

enforce. bob, your thoughts on this. do the republicans really know what they want when it comes to syria, or are they just using it as a crutch to blame obama for something else? >> first, they're using it as a crutch to blame obama, because they'll go after him on anything. secondly, e.j. is sblault right. we're not in a position here where we can do these things that john mccain seems to think are so easy. i loved it when he said, we can create a safe zone for them. what are we going to do? ask assad if he'll just keep his people away? the fact is mccain has become a bitter old crank who never sees a war he doesn't want to get involved in. i think he's feeling the pressure from, he doesn't ware about the polls, but he knows what the polls say. the polls say that americans don't want us heavily involved. so he's trying to come up with euphemisms and other ways to talk about our involvement. >> katrina, what should our commitment be? what should the united states do? what can we do? you've got hundreds of thousands of people who have been killed in this civil war, it's not our

war, but what can we do? >> we can understand that syria is a humanitarian nightmare and we can double down on humanitarian aid. but without a political agreement, without a diplomatic agreement, we won't be able to resolve the humanitarian nightmare. i think president obama has been rightly cautious. maybe the use of red lines was a mistake, but don't compound that mistake by taking reckless military action, which he won't, but he's been cautious. and i think those pounding the drum beats for war should be the first to go. it's very fortunate, as e.j. said, that the majority of americans, after the disaster in iraq, the loss of human treasure, of treasure, understand we don't need more military misadventures to be kind in the middle east. so i think president obama and his secretary of state, john kerry, are wise to reenlist and reengage russia, to bring in the united nations as best they can, to work as hard toward a diplomatic, political outcome that will lead the humanitarian suffering in that country.

>> you bring up a great point about the russians. do we really know what their intentions are, e.j. dionne? are they an honest broker in all of this? >> i don't think they're an honest broker, not at this point. i mean, we really need to push them to pull away from assad, which seems to be what we're trying to do. i mean, if we want to do anything, it does seem to me we want to figure out, can you, in any way, strengthen forces in the opposition that might bring about a more acceptable government after assad? but that's a very tricky thing to do. i think we probably are trying to figure out how to get arms to the right people, but in a coalition like this, the anti-assad coalition, it's not clear where your arms would end up and in whose hands would they end up? we've had that happen to us before, where our arms end up in the wrong hands. and that's why obama shouldn't have drawn a red line, as katrina suggested. that creates a real problem. we like to strengthen better

forces there, but there are limits on what we can do. that's why secretary gates said what he said. >> the president did said red line. so i guess in the talk circuit, there's all kinds of mistakes going on about this. it is a very complex situation in syria. there's no doubt about it. it's not our fight, we don't have the resources. we have things at home we've got to take care of. great to have you with us. thanks so much. >> thank you. from cleveland to camden, and all across the country, the conversation on violence is missing the mark. our real talk panel digs in. and the real story behind america's newest symbol of freedom. stay with us. [ male announcer ] in your lifetime, you will lose 3 sets of keys 4 cell phones 7 socks and 6 weeks of sleep but one thing you don't want to lose is any more teeth. if you wear a partial, you are almost twice as likely to lose your supporting teeth. new poligrip and polident for partials 'seal and protect' helps minimize stress, which may damage supporting teeth,

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care for your partial. we replaced people with a machine.r, what? customers didn't like it. so why do banks do it? hello? hello?! if your bank doesn't let you talk to a real person 24/7, you need an ally. hello? ally bank. your money needs an ally. welcome back to "the ed show." tonight in "ask ed live" the question is from viewer bill king. will scott walker, chris christie, john boehner, or darrell issa ever agree to a

sit-down to talk with you, ed? >> well, you know what, i'd love to sit down with each one of them individually and do an interview, but you have to understand that they don't have to talk to me. they've got plenty of conservative media out there, most politicians go where they know they're not going to be challenged on issues, and if they are, they give a patented answer. i would put an invitation out to any one of those gentleman there were mentioned in that tweet. i would love to sit down and visit with them and i'd ask them some very basic questions. medicare, medicaid, social security, education in this country, health care for all. why can't we get there? and why is it that they believe, and i believe that the men that you mentioned, they believe that the middle class needs to serve up a little bit more and protect the rich. i don't think those are tough questions, but for some reason, republicans have a hard time answering them. we got a lot of response on that. i'm going to take some more questions next week when we're back here at saturday at 5:00. we'll be right back on "the ed

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welcome back to "the ed show." on may 6th, the nation celebrated the rare happy ending in decade-long search for three missing women when amanda berry, gina dejesus, and also michelle knight were found in a neighborhood in cleveland, ohio's west side. as the healing begins for those three women, many americans have been asking, how in the world could this happen? how could these women have been held hostage for ten years, just three miles from where they were abducted? the community asked questions

about the intensity of the search for these women. this is a working class community. the neighborhood where the girls were found is predominantly hispanic. one out of every five houses is vacant. students in the area generally attend lincoln west high school, which has a graduation rate of just 46%, which falls below the cleveland school district's average of 56%. neighbors claim to have called police to report suspicious activity at the home of the women's accused kidnapper, ariel castro. the cleveland police department denies receiving such calls. exchanges in a town hall in cleveland on thursday got heated. >> i have a sister that's missing. and it seems like second district doesn't care. she does drugs, she was doing drugs, when she was -- when she did disappear, she had started going to church and kicking the drugs off. but still, i'm not getting any

help for our sister that's been missing, none. >> but police are frustrated as well. >> there's 2,900 missing persons a year. i don't have that many officers that i can follow up one person, and i would love to. if i had them, i would gladly do it. but i don't. right now i have 21 missing persons still active in my district, okay? so that one has to handle 21 cases. so they're overburdened a little bit. >> well, that police officer said it pretty well, don't you think? what this story brings to light is an issue that goes far beyond seymore avenue in cleveland, ohio. you see, across the country, missing people of lower socioeconomic status are less likely to get the resources and attention typically given to victims from better-off communities. in 2012, it was reported that more than half the cities with the highest violent crime rates cut law enforcement budgets. cities like oakland, california, camden, new jersey, where boots

on the ground are seriously needed. republicans love to boast about cuts to the public workforce, police, firefighters with and teachers bear the brunt of budget cuts. these are public sector jobs, necessary to prevent crimes and respond to crimes. and they've been slashed in neighborhoods that need them the most. joining me tonight, our real talk panel, ohio state senator nina turner is with us, sharnell hearing, minority whip of the virginia house of delegates and chair of the democratic party of virginia, and wisconsin state senator, lena turner. great to have all of you with us tonight. thanks for coming back on "the ed show." nina, let me ask you first. is there a response bias, i guess you would call it? do people of color and lower income areas, do they get the same law enforcement resources that other areas are in town get? your thoughts on that? >> well, it's clear, ed, by your intro, that certainly they do not. and it is really sad, it is

abysmal. and my heart and thoughts and prayers go out to the families of gina, michelle, and amanda. but it is quite unfortunate and we shouldn't tolerate it. i mean, right here in the state of ohio, the last biannual budget that we had, the government slashed local government funds by more than half. we're talking about hundreds of millions of dollars that would go to keep police officers employed. in cleveland, in 2011, for example, they swore in 40 cadets and had to lay them off right after swearing them in, because the mayor of the city of cleveland had to adjust his budget by $35 million because of budget cuts. on the federal level, we need to invest more money in community policing, ed, in order to have vibrant communities, we need more training, we need more accountability, and we need more police on the streets. we used to have many police centers here in the city of cleveland, when i was on the cleveland city council, but those dollars were cut on the federal level. we've got to bring back the relationship between neighborhoods and police and make sure that we know that

there are no throwaway neighborhoods. just because folks are poor does not mean that they do not deserve the same high-quality service as anybody else. and we need to have firm conversations about this and put money towards those efforts. >> lina taylor, how do we fix it? what should the approach be for communities? >> i think there's no question that senator turner hit the nail on the head. when you look at justice reinvestment initiatives, where what we do is create that reconnection with policing and communities where you target where your needs are, you try to make sure that you're looking at what are the triggers. so, for example, in our state, we lead in the nation in incarceration, and we know our triggers are mental health, so you have to fund the services that you need to -- >> you have to fund the services. >> and you go through all of these cuts and the attack on public employees, you know, you're not going to have the resources to do what you've got to do. sharnell hearing, how big a

fight is this? why is it that the democrats always seem to be willing to resource and it's always the republicans, and i don't mean to broad brush here, but we've got examples in your state of virginia, in pennsylvania, in ohio, in indiana, in michigan and wisconsin. it seems like these states have republicans that just can't wait towait to get to services like this. >> that's true, ed. what they like to do is talk about big tax cuts. we have somebody running for attorney general here in virginia, ken cuccinelli. he just rolled out this huge tax cut. but localities are saying, wait a minute, if you're going to do this huge tax cut, it's going to cause us to raise our property taxes to keep the level of services. i'm lucky i'm from alexandria, virginia, we have an excellent police department, but it is what nita talked about. it is a matter of resources and priorities. and if you do not have those resources and priorities set to protect our children in this nation and in our states,

unfortunately, we're going to see tragedies like this. and it can be helped, it can be stopped, but we've got to make sure that our party is set in the right direction, so while it may be a good bumper sticker to say, let's cut taxes, that has real life effects. and it fantastaffects families. >> charniele, do you think there's a bias in response, neighborhood by neighborhood, depending on resource? >> i think -- it appears that way and i do think it's totally economic. i did read a report in new york, where there was a response quirk to a missing woman who was, you know, from a more affluent area than a woman who was poorer. but, you know, i hesitate to blame the police, because there is -- this is my concern. they all want tad a good job. i just spoke with my chief of police recently. they want to do a good job. and they're just strapped for resources. >> nina, how big an issue is this going to be in the next election in ohio? i mean, this is -- all

neighborhoods deserve fair and equal resources. i mean, it would seem to me that people would understand that. >> yeah, it's going to be a very big issue. just recently here, we had two ohio house members introduced right to work. you know, 2011, you were on the ground here in ohio, pushing back against a tax against public sector workers and private sector workers and trying to take away their collective bargaining rights. you would have thought the gop learned their lesson, but no, they did not. and they were trying to push that same kind of legislation here in the state of ohio. it makes no sense. and we are debating a budget right now that still does not fund local government funds to the level that we need, to have a rigorous police department, to have police on the ground who have relationships, saving communities are about relationships, ed. this is going to be a big deal in 2014 and we have to decide in the city of cleveland and in the state of ohio, do we want to live in a city or a cemetery? do we want to live in a state that is vibrant for all folks or one that only takes care of the ultra-wealthy? the voters of the state of ohio will have an opportunity to weigh in in 2014, and i believe

that they're going to change families and future of all socioeconomic backgrounds, who deserve to live the american dream. >> as we've reported, there's been another mass shooting in america tonight. 12 people have been reportedly injured in a shooting at a mother's day parade in norris. i've got to ask you, lena taylor, and both you, lena, and nina, you're in the middle of the country, ohio and wisconsin. do your constituents want the federal government to do more on firearms? lena? >> you know, there's no question that all over the nation, that they want that. that what we want is to see that there is some effort to try to address the issues that are affecting communities. and it has to be balanced. there's no question about that. but i don't think the background checks was going too far. and the fact that congress was not able to move in that fashion, even though people all over have stated that that's something that they believe is important, and it frankly, was an easy bipartisan step that should have been made. so there's no question that in my community, that that's

something people are concerned about. >> state senators nina turner and lena taylor and also delegate sharnell hearing, great to have you with us here on "the ed show." tonight in our survey, i asked you, are republicans using benghazi to hurt hillary clinton's chances in 2016? 99% of you say yes, 1% of you say no. coming up, mark sanford hikes his way into our pretender segment. find out why the congressman-elect should not have done an interview on this particular sunday. stay tuned. people join angie's list for all kinds of reasons. i go to angie's list to gauge whether or not the projects will be done in a timely fashion and within budget. angie's list members can tell you which provider is the best in town. you'll find reviews on everything from home repair to healthcare. now that we're expecting, i like the fact that i can go onto angie's list and look for pediatricians. the service providers that i've found on angie's list actually have blown me away. join today and find out why over 1 million members count on angie's list. angie's list -- reviews you can trust.

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and in our pretenders segment tonight, mark sanford took a break from the appalachian trail to give an exclusive interview on his return to politics. good for him. only fox news sunday would celebrate this very special mother's day with a man who broke his wife's heart and wanted your sympathy. commenting on his campaign, sanford described the earliy

hardship of possibly running against his ex-wife and mother of his children for the congressional seat. >> i don't think there would have been anything more harmful to our four boys than having a former, you know -- i mean, a mom and a dad -- still a mom and a dad, but a former husband and wife run against each other. >> the most harmful thing he could have manage, to his sons would be an honest election? sure. much more than painful than the deserting them and their mother to carry out an affair, or professing his love to his mistress in the national media, even calling her his soul mate. jenny sanford could tell you a lot about that herself. >> it ripped me to up to think that he wanted to go be with his lover is just gut wrenching. >> did he ever call you his soul mate? >> not to my knowledge. >> in his campaign, marred by violations of his divorce agreement, mark sanford has reemerged newly engaged to the

arran argentinian mistress, and he believes resolved. but if he keeps pretending he's a family man and the gop can keep pretending they're all about family values. marjorie, i can't stand you. you're too perfect. even the inside of your dishwasher sparkles. okay. so i'm the bad guy for being clean. you said it. ladies, let's not fight dirty. cascade kitchen counselor. see, over time, finish gel can leave hard-water film on your dishes and dishwasher. new cascade platinum's triple-action formula not only cleans your dishes, it helps keep your dishwasher sparkling. so we're good?

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here it is. standing 1,776 feet tall, one world trade center takes its place as the tallest building in america. this building stands as a symbol of hope and pride. it's only fitting that union workers ep hadded put the last piece on the freedom tower. >> how about those guys from local 40? guide it into place and then bolt it together so it doesn't go anywhere and below me here you can see members of the trade, some union member here's who have been so much a part,

savannah, of this building process over the last 6 1/2 years. there will be applause, there will be tears shed when that moment is reached in a little while. >> you know, it is amazing what american workers can do if given the chance. there are thousands of other unfinished projects out across this country. american roads and bridges are in terrible shape. our schools are crumbling and republicans have blocked every effort to do anything about it. in this, i think, it's utterly embarrassing. in the month of april, the united states of america created zero manufacturing jobs. while the rest of the economy you have to admit is picking up, hey, the news continues to be negative for manufactures. in the past 12 months nearly 10,000 manufacturing jobs have been lost. why? other sectors of the economy are doing well. the service industry. the financial sector. the energy sector. what about manufacturing? everything's going well, but you see, corporations are turning their backs on unions because they don't want to pay the wages, and this affects the

manufacturing sector. of course, tight money on wall street. here's one of my favorite charts. union jobs go away it drags middle class wages down for everyone. this crusade to kill unions does nothing to help our nation, and i believe we cannot rebuild america's great american middle class without a recognizing the value of organized labor. and when you get in a philosophy about, okay what are we going to do to rebuild the middle class? what's your philosophy? aye asking, what's your philosophy. my philosophy. pay people. do we have to ship everything overseas? we can do it. we need to reinstill that heart and desire for america's economy that those who have need to invest in american workers, and we'll see this economy really take off. it takes more than just a formula. it takes a heart, a desire and a belief. i believe in organized labor. i believe that everybody should have a voice at what they do.

wham they do in the job place. joining me, john nichols, national correspondent of a magazine. >> relatively similar view. the fact of the matter i believe that trade unions don't just make sure people get paid well but get decent benefits, they also make sure the people are trained, and that they get the skills. especially in the building strads. i loved watching that completion at -- >> real symbolism there. isn't there? >> oh, remember, a lot of trade unions have died on 9/11. not just firefighters and cops who we know about and it's so important, but also members of hotel and restaurant employees up in windows of the world. service employees and others. and i think that this was a heart and soul effort here, but remember, the reason that these folks could do this job was because in new york, they've got a strong building trades council. they train people, plumbers, pipe fitters, teamsters, all of these people get special

training, laborers so they're ready to go do the job and can do a project nobody else can do. >> why are we seeing a lack of investment in american workers? i mean, the numbers are what they are. i mean, you mean this country can't add one manufacturing job in the month of april? zero? >> look, the problem in america, ed, right now is that we have moved towards a paper economy. we've got so many people who think that they're doing fine, everything's okay if the stock market goes up a couple points, but the fact is, that at the end of the day, we've seen what happens with stock market booms and busts and bubbles. what we need is a strong manufacturing economy that can see us through the ups and downs and see communities all over this country. remember, factories help small towns get through. >> no doubt. the progressive movement in this country as very well aligned with labor, very well aligned with the middle class, in your state of wisconsin, paul ryan recently gave a speech to the

american enterprise institute staying progressivism is arrogant and condescending. >> paul rhinyan comes from a ci that has lost a tremendous number of manufacturing jobs. when he talk answer arrogance, i've known paul ryan, covered him for years. i don't understand where he's coming from. it's far more arrogant from a representative to vote for free trade deals than make it easier to ship jobs overseas. i think it's arrogant for a representative from janesville, wisconsin, to be out of touch with the need for industrial policy in america that reinvichts in manufacturing. >> a player in 2016? >> sure. she smart, capable, and in many ways more appealing. >> but his philosophy is flawed. >> yeah. >> because the way he thinks, and the way wisconsinites are and folks in the middle of the country where the middle class has been, you know, rising because of labor, what built this country, he's not in step with that. he calls that movement arrogant

and condescending? >> paul ryan's hometown didn't vote for him for president of the united states. important to remember. he happened to have a pretty well congressional district so won his seat. in the presidential race, lost his hometown, home county, even home precinct. >> wins re-election, why aren't we hearing conversation about the employ free choice act? if was there in 2008. it's vanished. >> look, i think that this, we should be critical not just of republicans but democrats. recognize that i do not think that democrats in washington wrapped their heads around the need to, you know, shore up the middle class. one of the ways to shore up the middle class, good paying union jobs and they don't have to claw their way into union representation. that it can be done easily and functionally. >> john, great to have you with us tonight. thanks so much. >> pleasure. >> john nichols, washington correspondent of "the nation." that's "the ed show."

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