a brutal attack near a military base in london being called an act of terror just hours from when president obama will speak about terror. ahead of the president's speech, his administration revealing publicly for the first time that four americans have been killed in secret drone strikes overseas. attorney general eric holder saying in a letter to congress, at least one of those killed, quote, posed a continuing and imminent threat of violent attacks. the president is expected to reveal more on the government's secretive drone program to call for more transparency. also, closing guantanamo bay, something that he has pledged to do time and time again and yet

the prison is still open. >> to close the detention facility at guantanamo. we have succeeded on delivering a lot of campaign promises that we made. one where we have fallen short is closing guantanamo. i wanted to close is sooner. we have missed that deadline. it's not for lack of trying. it's not surprising to me that we have problems in guantanamo, which is why i campaigned in 2007 and 2008 and when i was elected in 2008 i said we need to close guantanamo. >> well, the president's speech comes as british authorities piece together the mission behind a brutal attack. a british soldier ambushed with a machete outside his barracks. here's british prime minister david cameron. >> this country will be resolute

in its stand against terrorism. we will never give in to terrorism or terror in any of its form gls this follows new revelations that tamerlan tsarnaev may have murdered three people before he targeted a finish line. that's the early start on this thursday. national investigative respond micha michael isikoff and amon. calling it a counterterrorism speech for the history books that the president is going to give. during this year's state of the union address he discussed this very issue, saying that a range of capabilities against terrorism with the use of the latest information, we affirm that drones is a clear part of that. we got this information yesterday. what does admittance of that say about u.s. strategy, do you think? >> well, first of all, we'll have to see if the speech lives

up to the hype that "politico" is giving it. clearly it has been known for years now that drones have been a major part of our counterterrorism strategy. in fact, the principle weapon we've used against the al qaeda core in pakistan, if a close reading of what we got yesterday from attorney general holder suggests that the president is tightening up the standards for those drone strikes. using the same standards that they would use if they were targeting an american citizen, which is that the terrorist target has to be a continuing imminent threat to the united states. now, there's a lot of wiggle room in how you define that but we do know from documents, which we reported on just yesterday, that the agency as has been amply discussed, uses these

signature strikes where they go after military-aged males and other identified militants whose identities and even nationalities they don't know. if you applied this standard that attorney general holder is laying out in this letter, they wouldn't be able to do that. so this could mean a curling back or curtailing or even an elimination of these signature strikes which have been quite controversial. >> this will be the first time that the president discusses drones at length. he's expected to discuss why the use of drones is necessary, legal, and in his mind here, just. the drone use in the middle east, pakistan, for example, faces wide criticism. what might the response be about what has been developing over the last 24 hours and what the president might say? >> well, i think following up on michael's point, it's going to depend on how this is a shift in u.s. policy on the way that drones are used. there's a lot of domestic

considerations when drones are being us autoed when it comes to americans towards their country but there's no doubt that it raises questions about international law and the use of drones that violates the sovereignty of other countries, the collateral damage that it causes in many of the cities and villages in yemen and pakistan that we have seen in the past. there's going to be those in the middle east that watch this to see if this is more for domestic political consumption in the united states or only about americans overseas or will this produce a tangible shift in the way that the united states is conducting drone strikes in the worst part of the world but also has caused tremendous civilian casualties. >> as part of this, michael, you reported in a piece just yesterday that some of the information, the fbi was not even aware of. >> right. i mean, if you want a real example of the secrecy that surrounds this program and just how absurd it gets at times, we

have the disclosure yesterday that jude mohammed was a north carolina resident, 22-year-old who had been under indictment was killed in a drone strike. i spoke to somebody close to his family today who said that the family had heard from pakistan from his then pregnant wife in pakistan that he was killed in this drone strike in 2011. november of 2011. so the fbi had jude mohammed up on its most wanted list as of yesterday saying he was in pakistan. it's not clear that the fbi knew that the cia had killed the guy they were looking for and the killing took place more than two years ago. so it does show when the government is this secretive about policies, you know, one hand of the government doesn't even know what the other hand is doing.

>> they definitely have high walls there. ayman, also expected in the speech, guantanamo bay. the transfers from gitmo could be announced today. what kind of attention will that get given the hunger strikes and forced feedings that are happening at gitmo? >> it's going to be welcomed on many fronts. the families of those detained at gitmo without charged, having to deal with what they have dealt with over the past several years but more importantly for the governments particularly in a country like yemen which has gone through its own evolution in recent years, countries like egypt and many others. they are going to welcome the fact that the united states is going to release these nationals of theirs that have been released in guantanamo. more importantly, not only from the country that will be receiving some of their citizens back but also from human rights organizations that have really stepped up the pressure and campaign against the u.s. government for guantanamo. and more importantly, it really,

in some cases, will undercut some of the recruitment tools that have been used by extremist groups across the region to try and recruit more followers into that ideology saying look at what the united states is doing to these people? you must carry out attacks. and certainly that is going to be a step back for that ideology, if indeed the u.s. can successfully close down guantanamo as it has promised to do the last couple of years. >> recent development, the boston bombings, the man killed in florida had spoken to authorities before his death there. you've done a lot of reporting on this. he has ties to the tsarnaevs. what may come of this? >> well, i think the first thing will come of it is what were the circumstances surrounding him t getting killed yesterday? here we have an unarmed individual meeting with three armed law enforcement officers, one from the fbi, two state troopers. exactly what happened in that room and why they thought -- why

the law enforcement officers thought they were under attack or threatened there to cause lethal force, that is under an investigation by an fbi response team. i think there are a lot of questions surrounding that. that said, what we've been told is, this guy was about to sign a confession that he and tsarnaev were involved in this unsolved triple murder back in 2011. we don't know exactly what he said or what the evidence is, but suggesting tsarnaev's ties and activities were a lot broader and malicious than we even knew, even after the boston marathon bombing attack. >> and that remains outstanding. a nexus of headlines as the president comes to the microphone to speak on

counterterrorism. michael isikoff and ayman, thank you. coming up after the break, we'll talk about the terror attack in london. knife-yielding men hacking a british soldier to death. president obama will visit moore, oklahoma this weekend to view the tornado destruction. we'll get a live report from craig melvin. plus, a major vote from the boy scouts. and drone dilemma, is the overseas targeting of americans justified in certain cases? @thomasroberts or go to my twitter page. to more efficie. ♪ wireless is limitless. are you kidding me? no, it's only 15 calories. [ male announcer ] with reddi wip, fruit never sounded more delicious. mmm. [ male announcer ] with 15 calories per serving and real cream,

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>> investigators today are trying to find answers to what led to a gruesome attack in london. two men allegedly killed an

active british soldier. there's one of them standing in front of the camera after driving their car into him and then stabbing the soldier with several large knifes or machetes. after that attack, one of the men approached the crowd asking them to take video of him. that's what you saw earlier. this is part of that. this footage shows that he make as long political statement with his hands still covered in blood and taken down later. british prime minister david cameron spoke about the attack. this is what he said. >> the people who did this were trying to divide us. they should know something like this will only bring us together and make us stronger. >> jim cavanaugh, a former atf special agent and terrorism analyst, jim, thank you for being here. you just hear the layers of this story. we're learning the two suspects were under investigation. nevertheless, what do you make of it? >> well, clearly this looks like

it's some inspired actors, maybe two ak actors and we'll have toe what the british police uncover but maybe they are not connected too deep into al qaeda. it's interesting to see how this unfolded and some of the things that people have not yet talked about. these guys were very suicidal. when you think about it, they are waiting for the police and they know that the police are going to arrive. if you look at that video that you just showed from the itn -- >> uh-huh. >> if you look to the right, right at the beginning, you can see the second suspect. he's in the right and has a brown coat and he's talking to a woman. that shot shows both suspects on the street. they are both waiting for the police and they are going to know that eventually that the metropolitan police are going to arrive and armed officers are going to arrive. when they do arrive, they charge the officers. so these guys were deeply radicalized. they know that they are probably going to be killed today and, of

course, they are attacking british soldiers which is an al qaeda-like motif. >> radicalized or just psychologically sick and deranged? >> i agree, richard, that this sometimes goes hand in hand but what this guy is spouting out is remove your troops from our country, you'll never be able to do what you want. he's believing the al qaeda poison that there's a war between the west and muslims which is baseless, as the prime minister said. and that's what al qaeda is almost trying to push to divide us. the muslims know -- >> i'm sorry. let's talk about muslims. along that line of islamic extremists here, one of the men reportedly saying god is great. when you look at the community there in britain, 2 1/2 million saying we condemn this, what's the story line behind this?

>> that's absolutely right. the point is that its muslims versus the west which is categorically untrue. al qaeda has a poison. one of the great religions of the world, they rejected wholeheartedly. you hear it all the time. i had a friend that said, people expect muslims to walk around 23 hours a day preaching that they are not for terrorism. of course they are not. and they reject it. these guys are outliers. we saw it at the shooting at the recruiting station where the guy was radicalized in tennessee. so it happens. it's this radicalization, inspired-al qaeda ilk that does this kind of thing. we'll probably see more of it and it needs to be interrupted at the action phase. they went in there and were able to take these two guys down.

you see that happen all the time. >> jim, that yields more questions, as you are saying, jim cavanaugh, thank you for your perspective today. >> thank you. severe thunderstorms hitting moore, oklahoma, just days after an ef-5 tornado hit that town. first, our producer's pick comes from thompson. what did president obama look like at his high school prom? "time" magazine exposing pictures from the 1979 senior prom photos. they are kind of blackmail worthy. for more, go to thomas roberts facebook page. we'll be right back. [ male announcer ] frequent heartburn? the choice is yours. chalky... not chalky. temporary... 24 hour. lots of tablets... one pill. you decide.

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oklahoma, where one of the youngest victims is being laid to rest. it's the first of several funerals being played in the next few days. president obama will travel to the area on sunday. it's unsure if he will attend a memorial at first baptist church in moore. today's cover of "the oklahoman," honors the 26 people killed in sunday and monday's storms, listing their names and many of their picture, including the youngest victim, 4-month-old case futrell. thomas roberts was on the ground with the owner of a daycare center where they all survived. >> how did they survive? >> the restrooms. they are in the core of the building. >> they are intact inside? >> all but one. all but one. this is a miracle in itself. we had all of those bathrooms that were full of kids and then miss kathy had this quiet little

voice that came upon her and said move the 3-year-old bathroom. >> craig melvin is in moore, oklahoma. i was talking with a reporter about four hours ago. the sky is the same, probably lightning. as you know, as the sheetrock gets wet, the insulation gets wet, it gets three to four times heavier? >> reporter: yes. that's one of the many problems. the sky is just as dark and ominous as it's been all morning. we can tell you that the rain has stopped. thunder, lightning, flash flood warning in effect until 9:45 for moore, oklahoma. that makes it very difficult to get out and pick up and clean up. in fact, we have not seen -- we haven't seen a single person in this parking lot. yesterday we saw lots of business owners, homeowners as well who have been given the all clear to go back and cyst through their belongings and get valuables.

that has not happened because the weather has been that awful. the first funeral is happening right now, antonia candelaria, she died holding her friend, another third grader, another 9-year-old named emily. they died in that elementary school. two more funerals are being planned for tomorrow. as you mentioned, richard, a number of funerals over the next few days here in moore. but right now, again, the focus is on the cleanup. the focus is on the recovery. because between 12 and 13,000 homes damaged or destroyed. it's going to take a great deal of time. >> craig melvin, thank you so much. still in the mourning phase and recovery phrase here in moore, oklahoma. do you have a message for the people of moore? we were inspired by this project from a first grade class in florida. grab a piece of paper and marker

and upload yours. upload on thomas roberts facebook or twitter pages. he's at @thomasaroberts. teaching tools for success, and fostering creativity. these programs are empowering people to lead positive change, and helping them discover how great a little balance can feel. through initiatives like these, our goal is to inspire more than three million people to rediscover the joy of being active this summer. see the difference all of us can make, together.

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i have not done anything wrong. i have not broken any laws. i have not violated any irs rules or regulations and i have not provided false information to this or any other congressional committee. >> and that is all the hearing had heard from lois lerner. the irs employee at the heart of the agency's scandal spoke to lawmakers before pleading the fifth, a move that irritated even democrats. take a listen. >> her attorney has written to the committee to inform us that she intends to invoke her fifth amendment right against self indiscrimination. of course, i am disappointed that we will not be able to ask

her questions today. >> well, this morning, congressman darrell issa, the chair there, says the committee is obligated do bring lerner back to testify and he's trying to work with her attorney to make that happen. mitch mcconnell had this to say. >> it's now clear that this was about much more than one or two employees going rogue at some far-flung office out in the administrative lands as was first suggested. the facts we have seen so far point to something more systemic than that, and it really shouldn't surprise anybody. >> joining me now is john barrasso of wyoming. senator, good to see you. >> thank you, richard. >> can lawmakers compel lerner to testify even though she's pleaded the fifth here from making her statement? do you believe her when she said she did nothing wrong and didn't break the law? >> those are two separate

things. i'm a doctor. i'm not a lawyer. and i've been focused on the fact that this health care law is, for the most part, being implemented through the irs and we need to get to the bo the tomorrow of this. we see the irs appears to be playing favorites. you have republicans and democrats very concerned about this. people want answers. it's an investigation that is going to continue. we're going to continue looking for answers here. >> senator, first things first here. let's talk about lois lerner. do you believe she did nothing wrong? >> well, there's a difference between doing nothing wrong and breaking the law. this investigation is going to continue. clearly someone did something wrong. the irs has been playing favorites. we know it's been going on for a long time and people, i believe, have been intentionally misleading congress. >> do you agree with chairman issa, should he compel her to testify, even though she made her statement and pleaded the

give? >> once you've made a statement, you've started to talk and i don't know how you can plead the fifth after getting out your side without then answering questions. the american people want to hear what happened. the american people, whether republican or democrat, are very offended at what happened with the irs playing political favorites. the irs shouldn't be doing this and now when you have the irs having such an instrumental role in the upcoming health care law implementation that everyone is going to have to go through the irs regarding their health care, that is a big problem for the irs and the upcoming health care law. >> i want to play some sound for you this morning from "morning joe". >> when you plead the fifth after you claim that -- >> i understand. >> just to be clear, you don't need to plead the fifth if you have done nothing forward and -- >> that's not true.

that's not what the fifth amendment says. >> i know what the fifth amendment says. >> you're asserting the opposite. >> what's your sense here? is there a danger of going too far? >> well, i'm a doctor. not a lawyer. the american people want answers and when someone from the irs shows up and says, i've plead the fifth, i'm not going to answer your questions, i think that raises more questions in the minds of people who have to meet deadlines with the irs, have to supply information under the threat of the irs tyranny. they have to supply questions and information, i think the irs has an obligation. to answer openly and honestly. this is going to continue. this investigation is going to go on. people are going to ultimately find out the truth. >> and it is continuing. big news coming out of capitol hill, as you know. the controversy swirling over this, immigration reform. the senate gang of eight.

their proposal making it off the committee, now going to the full senate. you say you won't vote for it in its current form. immigrants have been taken out, much to some supporters' dismay. what will it take you to get the vote on the current immigration reform bill? >> what i've said is that i believe this immigration bill should be debated, discussed on the floor. it should not be filibustered. there should be an open debate. we know that the current immigration system is broken. i'm a big supporter of legal immigration. that's how our country was built. there are issues about border security, about workers, about how to deal with those folks who are here now in this country, who are here illegally. we do need to, i believe, modernize a broken immigration system. >> those who are undocumented have contributed to this building, as you say, of this country as some will answer to

your statement about it being built on legal immigration. i've got to get this in here, senator. oklahoma, moore, we know that thousands have already applied for fema relief. you voted it against the sandy relief bill that passed the senate in january. what are the odds of other things loaded on and ought to be what the specific bills are today in terms of what expenses need to be paid? clearly i believe that there may be enough money in fema right now to deal with this without additional legislation. we're going to find that out. >> senator john barrasso, wish we had more time. thanks for stopping by today. >> thank you, richard. another scandal rocking the most prestigious military academy, accused of planting a

hidden cameras in a locker room, he faces indecent acts and dereliction of duty. mcclendon has been sent to upstate new york. kristen gillibrand was asked if this is a cultural problem within the military. >> i think when you have these cases occurring over and over again and there's no response and there's no accountability for these kinds of crimes, it allows the culture to continue. >> 26,000 military members may have been assaulted in 2012. the obama administration admits u.s. drone strikes have killed four americans overseas. our gender panel weighs in on that and how they play into his counterterrorism strategy. drones are the topic today.

is the overseas targeting of americans justified in certain cases? answer on thomas' facebook or twitter page. we'll be watching them. no, not at all. how many of these can we do on our budget? more than you think. didn't take very long, did it? summer's here, so are the savings. that's nice. post it. already did. more saving. more doing. that's the power of the home depot. get memorial day savings, like 4 bags of miracle-gro® garden soil for just $10. available out there. i knew devry university would give me the skills that i needed to make one of those tech jobs mine. we teach cutting-edge engineering technology, computer information systems, networking and communications management -- the things that our students need to know in the world today. our country needs more college grads to help fill all the open technology jobs. to help meet that need, here at devry university,

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for the here and now. that's the wonder of streamlined connections. that's merrill edge and bank of america. coming up in the next half hour, the boy scouts debate and then vote later on whether to drop openly gay scouts. my next guest is right on the front lines of this very debate. eagle scout author of "my two moms" and activists zach wahls. you made a moving speech to minnesota lawmakers about your two moms, as many of us know. yesterday you addressed the council meeting. what was your message and do you think is resonated here? >> our chief focus is making sure that scouts know that discrimination is not one of scouting values as it tells us

to be friendly, kind and discriminating against gay youth is none of those things. >> a u.s. editorial read," parents tend to deny you should not be denied the benefit of scouting. it's not about adults. it's about what is best for young people." what do you think? >> you know, we obviously are going to call for full inclusion for moms like mine but we do see that this step forward is absolutely important to getting to fuller quality and we are glad to be a leadership supporting a ban on youth but we want to help take this step as they continue to go forward and include all parents who want to be a part of their son's scouting experience. >> zach wahls, thank you for stopping by. >> thank you you guys. killing americans overseas by remote control. and red china goes green, not out of concern but out of

nels t necessity. those are today's topics. "mother jones," and editor-in-chief and corey dade is a contributor at theroot.com. the obama white house admitting that four americans have been killed overseas by u.s. drones. just one of them specifically targeted there. what will this mean for municipal plans, i.e., domestic plans to what some estimate is thousands of these drones in the united states? >> that's right, richard. if anyone has any doubts about whether or not aerial droens nee coming to the u.s., think again. the faa is on an accelerated path to license as many drones as they can. they are estimating by 2020 we could have as many as 10,000

dron drones circling the u.s. the problem is when a disclosure comes forward about the deaths of americans by drones overseas, it gives just more bad pr for this effort domestically. and one of the main sort of adopters of drones will be police departments. and so in urban areas, large cities, the use of police drones is setting up all kinds of issues about illegal search and seizure, privacy issues. in seattle, for example, the controversy around the drone idea led the mayor of seattle to actually nix the plan. this has a broader ramification domestically. >> judd, to you on this. how does this make sense for the obama administration as the president steps forward today to make a wide reaching speech on counterterrorism, drones a part of it. >> what i think he is really

trying to do today is to lay out the constraints on this kind of power. we've seen an extraordinary use of drones over the last few years and according to reports, we'll have to wait to hear him speak later this afternoon. but according to reports, he's going to curtail this very significantly and really apply the same standards, both to foreigners and u.s. citizens and say only if you are actively planning and posing imminent threat to the united states. ending the so-called signature strikes where, based on a profile of that activity, they have been striking people in foreign countries. so potentially very significant. >> and as you noted in the pregame when we were talking on air, the big message also is that they are admitting to the use of those and these deaths. i want to switch to a second topic that you pitched to us and go to indicate. you've done a good amount here of reporting on abortion bans. the house today will be holding

a hearing on a d.c. case that might affect this very issue nationally, these abortion bans. what are they deciding? >> so today the house judiciary committee is reviewing a bill from trent frank from arizona that would ban after gestation. this is relevant this week because on tuesday a judge out in the u.s. ninth circuit said that arizona's own ban was unconstitutional. there are 12 states that have passed the 20-week ban. this is the second time it's been deemed unconstitutional. it's a direct challenge on roe which said abortion should be legal until viability. a judge stead was unconstitutional in arizona and then at the same time they are trying to impose it on the district of columbia as well. >> the graphic shows three states and there are various durations based on the states.

arizona is 20 weeks but north dakota is six. where might this all end up? in the supreme court, i guess that's what you're saying, all of these multistate efforts that might get appealed to the supreme court? >> this is exactly what anti-abortion legislatures are trying to do, they are trying to challenge roe and get a hearing before the supreme court. we had north dakota pass a six-week ban. they just keep rolling it back as far as they can, just to test the limits. so far we have had two of those 20-week bans thrown out. the supreme court level, unless there's a conflict between the circuit courts, right now we have not seen that. what is clear is that the legislatures are trying to make it a national issue. >> i want to shift to environmental issues, judd. you're saying this is a hot topic. china, according to "the guardian," unveiling the most

sweeping carbon emissions plans, affecting 638 companies, constituting 38% of the country's emissions. the question, though, is what does that mean for the united states? >> well, with all of the news going on this week, this could be the biggest news by far because it would really represent a very aggressive move to c to cap carbon in china. we hear about warming, all of the pollutions that breeds as well. people can't breathe in china on some days and they realize there is no economic growth if you can't go outside and get to your job. for the united states, it could really put pressure on the obama administration and on the united states in general to step up and match china if they do follow through and put in to place a real carbon cap on their emissions. and this could be a landmark move by china that could spur greater action. >> yeah, if you look at beijing, places like indonesia, that

picture that we had on air a second ago, that is exactly the way it gets sometimes, which begs the question here. is it the citizens of china saying, hey, we can't function in this? >> well, i think it's two levels. both the citizens are i saing we can't function in this and the government is saying we can't function like that either. there's 1.2 million premature deaths in the country due to air pollution. if they are talking about building domes over playgrounds so children can go outside and play, that's a clear public health crisis. i think they realize they can't continue to be an expanding economy and live like that. >> yeah. certainly health issues have economic ramifications there. thank you so much. i owe you another one next time, corey. we ran out of time today. up next, jodi arias' media blitz. how the family of the boyfriend that she murdered is reacting. [ female announcer ] doctors trust calcium plus vitamin d

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moments from now in arizona, jurors in the jodi arias trial will begin the sentencing deliberations. life or death for arias, who faces death by lithal injection for the 2008 murder of her ex-boyfriend, travis alexander. that does not seem to be fazing arias at all who has been giving interviews to several national and local news reporters, including nbc's diana alvolal. >> i'm not a person who lies all the time. i got in a situation and said some things that were untrue because i was afraid. now it's like every word out of my mouth is untrue. if that were the case, then i don't think there's a single person on the planet that's

never told a lie, not that i know of. >> joining me now is wendy murphy, a former prosecutor, wendy. all right so diana was able to speak to her. you've been able to speak with her. also to travis alexander's family. excuse me, yesterday. what is their reaction to jodi's media blitz. she's speaking to so many different reporters here. and are they asking why she is able to do all of these interviews? >> well, jodi arias is a piece of work and i i don't particularly care that she's doing these interviews, even though she's tremendously offensive and hurtful to the family. she comes across as particularly sociopathic, narcissistic. in other words the kind of person who should be put to death because she has no conscience and no heart. i didn't speak specifically to a member of travis alexander's family. i want to be clear here. but i did have contact with them. because their spokesperson was saying yesterday, that they were rightly distraught by not only

her media blitz and the arrogance of it all. but fact that in those media appearances, she continues to disparage travis alexander. >> why is she able to do these? >> as a constitutional matter, the sheriff there says he has no choice, he's doing it because she has a right to do it. here's an interesting issue. i told this to travis alexander's family and i offered to represent them for free. i've been doing this work for 20 years for victims for free. because there are rights of victims in arizona that are constitutionally guaranteed. and it's the predominant right there is the right of a victim in this case, the family of the homicide victim is the victim as a matter of law. they have a right to be treated with respect and dignity during the entire process. including right now. and that includes the comments that come out of the mouth of a defendant or in this case, a convicted murderer. so i told them that they have a right to file a motion in the court to ask the judge to shut her up. because she is not providing you

know, in my opinion, the judge is not providing enforcement of the right to respect the dignity. >> did they say they're going to do it? >> we'll see. for now what we know, richard, is that jodi has been shut up. she did her blitz and now she can't speak again and that's terrific. if she's put to death, which i think if they vote for death, which i think they will, then this is a moot issue but if she isn't. if the jury hangs, i will do whatever it takes to help this family file the right motions. >> i've got to ask you this quickly. neither jodi's parents took the stand. she had a friend who was supposed to testify. she backed out. why is no one standing up for jodi arias? >> i'm so glad you asked me this question. everyone on tv has been saying it's so weird that the mom is sitting in the courtroom and she's not testifying, the siblings. here's the deal, i did a little research. it is weird but it is tactical and there's a very interesting law review article about this called the tactical ineffective assistance of counsel in capital trials, i have it posted on my website, wendymurphylaw.com.

here's the short of it. the ninth circuit, the federal court that will ultimately decide if she does face death has reversed 13 cases, 13, where the defense attorney didn't call mitigation witnesses during the sentencing phase. this is tactical planned and disgusting. >> for the appeal. thank you so much, trial attorney, former prosecutor, wendy murphy, thank you, have a good thursday. that wraps up things for me. thomas is back here tomorrow, on his way back from oklahoma reporting live. now alex wagner is up next, what have you got for us? >> pivot points, we'll preview the president's major speech this afternoon on u.s. counterterrorism policy, including targeted drone strikes and the prison at guantanamo bay, "the new york times" mark ma zeti, jarnd berstein and richard wolffe join the conversation. and immigration tug of war. and which naysayers are willing to play political roulette? plus actor penn badgley will be

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proem makes a play for transparency and rule of law. it is thursday, may 23rd, and this is "now." this afternoon, in a speech at national defense university in d.c. proem will tackle an issue that has sparked furious debate and raised questions for which there are no easy answers, american counterterrorism policy in a post 9/11 era. there are several items on the agenda.

worked tirelessly to forge a durable legal and policy framework to guide our counterterrorism efforts. i recognize in our democracy, no one should just take my word for it that we're doing things the right way. >> while the president will argue that the use of drone strikes overseas continues to be necessary, legal and just. a new classified policy guidance signed by the president will according to "the new york times" sharply curtail the instances when unmanned aircraft can be used to attack in places that are not over war zones. countries like pakistan, yemen and somalia. the speech comes in response to calls for greater transparency over the targeted killing program and a mid rising international condemnation of u.s. covert actions as well as outrage over the deteriorating situation at guantanamo bay. where 103 of the 166 detainees remain on a hunger strike that has lasted over two