rupert murdoch getting divorced for the third time. "the new york post" known for its headlines so john tower has some of the best responses. >> good ones. unhitched from the murdoch. silver fox. rupert's on the prowl. still death do rupert. get it. and our favorite, divorce corp. >> nice. we get the mockup and everything. the one i liked, this from david, murdoch trading in for a newer model. have a great weekend, everybody. time now for "morning joe."

♪ good morning. it's friday, june 14th. welcome to "morning joe." it is friday. >> it sure feels like june 14th outside. >> i thought last night was -- >> outside. >> soaking it up, the middle of june. this is god's month, remember. isn't that what -- episcopalians say. >> this is god's month. >> yeah. >> the first gin and tonic month. >> exactly. have you seen john meacham's episcopalian calendar? it's 5 5 and raining. >> yep. >> i want to go home. i want to go home. i want the sunshine state. it is so cold up here. middle of june. 55 degrees. >> get the mayor on it. >> well, he is on it, you see,

because he's on the cutting edge of everything. he's addressing the issues that affect our future. instead of sucking milky ways in his mouth. >> i could stand a little global warming right now, actually. >> wow. >> willie, i want global warming. i want it to be hot again. >> oh, wow. you're going to get that. >> no -- >> you're going to get that. >> can't afford to get on my plane and fly south. go to the south of france. speaking of south and -- >> joining us on set, what? pulitzer-prize winning historian jon meacham. that's speaking of the south? and senior political reporter for politico maggie haberman. nice to have you back. >> nice to have you back. >> speaking of the heat, the miami heat. i thought they were done. >> a lot of headlines were written. last night 33 points, attacking. dwyane wade had a huge gauge. kind of dormant in the playoffs, 32 points.

>> jeb bush tweeted late last night, welcome back, wade. >> definitely back. the big three got it going. the series tied at 2-2. they lose that, they're down 3-1 with another game to play in san antonio and the obituaries are being written this morning, but now we have a new series. >> did you see the deck collapse? >> oh, my gosh. >> 24 people hurt, some of them seriously. >> also down in miami, right? >> it was at a sports bar on biscayne bay. there's a deck, outdoor deck. >> oh, my gosh. >> about 100 people out there. >> oh, my gosh. >> place called shuckers. falls right into the water about halftime as people are watching the game. a bunch of injuries. nobody killed that we know about yet. one of the witnesses said the water was shallow enough they could stand in, which i think was good news. they did have to wade through all that wood and the furniture. a couple serious injuries. >> they said they heard crunching on the deck and then the pillars fell down. but yep, some serious injuries right before halftime actually and it just obviously got

overcrowded. >> more on that in sports. a lot of news to get to, including major developments in syr syria. new polling from gallup shows just how far congress has sunk. >> how are they doing? >> well, they seem to be working their way back. working their way back. >> one thing they'll never do -- >> instilling confidence in america. >> maggie, you're a new yorker, right? >> one thing people from congress should never do is what the late great ed koch, how am i doing? >> don't do that. >> they should not. >> it's not a positive. >> somebody did it for them. >> don't ask don't tell. public confidence is just at 10%. >> they're in double digits. >> it's the lowest level of confidence the poll has found for any institution ever. >> ever. >> like ever. >> ever. those surveyed have higher confidence in --

>> you're in trouble actually, when you always have these polls we're showing right now and have the high water mark and it's usually like 50 or 60. you start at 30. >> yeah. >> and you still look like you're dropping like a led zeppelin. it's bad. >> it's bad. those who have surveyed higher in this category confidence are banks, big business, and hmos. >> hmos. that's not good. >> what do we do there? >> historically people have never liked congress, but jon, this group, they take the cake. >> that's not good. >> not good. >> from that perspective. >> let me give you a key. >> a pulitzer of that. >> a few examples. as chester arthur -- >> if you a chester arthur quote i'll give you $100 right now. >> where's my mustache comb? >> is it true? >> oh, yeah. >> mostly false. almost always. >> oh, my god. okay. >> speaking of congress, what else do we have?

>> speaking of congress, there are some leaders there. senator joe manchin in the senate is pushing back at an ad from the nra that criticizes west virginia democrats their position on guns. the 30-second clip which we showed you yesterday links manchin to president obama and new york city mayor michael bloomberg. look closely. >> remember this tv ad? >> i'm joe manchin. i approve this ad because i'll always defend west virginia. as your senator i'll protect our second amendment rights. >> that was joe manchin's commitment. now manchin is working with president obama and new york mayor michael bloomberg. concerned? you should be. tell senator manchin to honor his commitment to the second amendment. >> wow. in a statement yesterday the senator wrote in part, quote, the washington nra can spend $100 million on ads against me. it still won't make what they say true. if they were honest with their members, they would see that my bill not only protects the second amendment rights, it

enhances and strengthens them. unfortunately, nra leadership in washington has lost its way and is more concerned about political power than gun rights and gun safety. what's so fascinating about this is, for the people that were -- maggie, the people that were involved in the negotiations and really knew what was going on, almost all of the background check bill was passed by the washington nra. >> right. >> and they were working with manchin and they were working with toomey and they drafted it. they were not going to score it. the washington nra -- i say the washington nra, three people up there, in my opinion are taking this organization so far away from what it's supposed to be and from its -- what its 4 million members want, but they were dealing with joe manchin. they were dealing with pat toomey. they were going back. they came up with a deal that the nra said we're not going to score. we're good with this. so you guys put that out. we won't score it.

suddenly larry pratt and gun owners and said we're the real second amendment rights people. so if that's larry's position, larry's been consistent. you can't attack larry for hypocrisy because i've known larry, this is larry's position. always been his position. but for the nra to now act shocked that joe manchin was pushing a bill that they helped draft with him. >> yeah. >> is pathetic. >> and i think not surprising. i think this is the kind of advertising you're going to see against manchin, see against other people who are part of crafting this legislation, and for me the question is how much money mike bloomberg puts in to defend manchin, what this looks like from help from the other side. he's done a lot in terms of hurting the democrats who voted against it. i'm curious to see what it looks like now. >> i think you will find a lot of people in west virginia coming out and supporting joe manchin. joe manchin is going to fight back. and by the way, joe manchin is fine. this guy is an extraordinarily

popular figure there. it's the nra who is not fine. the washington nra, this is -- we should say, this marks the sixth month day of the newtown shooting and that horrific tragedy and we've seen unfortunately the failing of congress, the weakness of the white house, we've seen unfortunately i think the overreaction by so many people. i think the nra most shamefully. the washington nra. these three people. and you look at that ad yesterday that reminded you of all the overreaches that they have made right after the newtown shooting, putting out a video game that 4-year-olds could use to shoot weapons. making one horrific mistake after another. actually targeting president obama's little children in an ad. yesterday, you look at this and people -- people called me up and said, what do you think of -- what do you think of -- do

you think that they may have shaded that ad to make barack obama look more ominous and black? you know, i usually pick up the phone and call and respond. it's so obvious. look at his hands. it looks like he is a coal miner from west virginia. >> note to the nra, people don't do this anymore. >> this is a question that answers itself. you don't have to call me up and ask me if i think the washington nra -- put that back up -- the washington nra shaded barack obama's hands. why don't we just look at this picture. you can do this at home. and just compare what they've done to barack obama's hands and the side of his face to every other picture you've seen of barack obama. listen, i have been critical of those on the left when they have

used race and it's happened -- it happens every election to race bait. i'm going to be critical when people on my side on the right do the same thing. this is an example. look at the hands. look at the side of the face. you don't have to call me up. you just need to find out who produced this ad for the nra, who approved this ad for the nra. >> the nra. >> but which three members, which of the three members that have hijacked the nra from its 4 million members, good men and women, law abiding women across the united states of america, who is responsible for that? don't call me. call them and ask who did this. any questions on whether somebody may have shaded that with photo shop? >> unless they caught them at the one press conference where he had a vacation beard, that is not -- >> and was in shadow. >> and he had vacation -- vacation beard on his hand too. >> the -- >> only i grow hair on my

knuckles. nobody else does that. >> that's true. >> that's my gig. >> and the problem for the nra is, people in west virginia don't buy the argument that joe manchin is anti-gun. he has an a-plus rating with the nra. when he put out this legislation for newtown for background checks he put in all those stipulations that would be against federal law to keep the information on the background that you have checked. by penalty of jail time. 15 years, something like that. so this -- you can use these images and it will create a stir nationally, but inside west virginia they know joe manchin. he was their governor. he's for guns. >> people know what you've done. they know your background. >> you used the right word, overreach. this is the jack booted thugs of the moment. >> explain that for people. >> right after oklahoma city, a in that era of '94/ '95 -- >> waco -- >> talking about atf, ruby ridge, waco. >> right in that period, there

was a fund-raising letter i believe laperriere signed it that referred to federal agents as jack booted thugs. george herbert walker bush then resigned. >> norman schwarzkopf as well. >> general schwarzkopf resigned. >> a great man. >> a moment where you saw a shift in the nra that had already shifted in reaction to the riots and the urban unrest in the late '60s. >> wonder what wayne lapierre does when joe manchin goes out and films another commercial and says i've been with your second amendment rights and who has been side by side with me, wayne lapierre this is what he said about background checks a few years ago and wayne lapierre says the same thing and joe manchin would never do it, but when the word leaks out how involved the nra was in negotiating the background check bill, which they were, they were all over it, and then they're running ads for a bill that they were working with toomey and manchin and others with to pass

it, it's another example of this overreach. so we have huge news coming out of syria. >> yeah. >> the red line has been crossed. >> officially. >> what's going to be done? >> the united states has concluded that pro-government forces in syria have used chemical weapons against the opposition, crossing that so-called red line that is now drawing america more directly into the conflict. the obama administration says there is evidence that forces loyal to president bashar assad used saran gas a handful of times against rebel fighters, somewhere between 100 to 150 people were reported killed in those attacks. those numbers could change. now for the first time the u.s. will begin sending small arms and ammunition to rebel groups via the cia. there has been considerable pressure both abroad and here at home for the white house to take a tougher approach. today's "new york times" reports, quote, the president's caution has frayed relations with important american allies in the middle east.

that has privately described the white house strategy as feckless. still, vocal backers of u.s. action in syria praised the decision. >> i applaud the president's decision. 93,000 people dead later, over 1 million refugees of the countries in the surrounding region erupting into sectarian violence. >> joining us now in washington, diplomatic correspondent for "the washington post," ann gerren covering this story. how much do we know, reading about exactly how much the chemical weapon use that we know about and the deaths in syria, how much do we know in terms of what has been done against the people there? >> well, the white house outlined at least four instances of gas use, probably saran gas used this year and the allegations are that it may go back further than that.

and this was, indeed, the red line that president obama set last year for some kind of american action. exactly what happened to the rebel fighters is a subject of both intelligence and scientific examination and the white house said they have evidence of both natures really detailing the use, including the tests on a body and a live surviving victim. >> you know, ann, we're hearing the state department is really pushing forward, trying to get more decisive action. there is some restraint in the white house, some push back from that. you also, of course, have two humanitarian hawks that just got appointed to being ambassador of the united nations and also the head of the nsa. what kind of impact are they going to have in moving the

president's white house closer to where the state department is? >> well, there's been a division within the administration predating even the arrival of the two officials you mentioned, sam power and susan rice, but the real issue right now will be whether the administration goes further than this fairly limited action of small arms and ammunition, and goes full on with what the rebels are asking for which is first anti-tank weapons and also more importantly to them, anti-aircraft weapons. the consensus in the national security community is that at some further action is possible bit by the united states, even this action was considered a surprise by some, but that anti-aircraft weapons are probably still a long shot for the rebels because of their potential to be diverted for use

against civilian aircraft. >> all right. ann, thank you so much for being with us. we really do appreciate it. >> thank you. >> thank you. >> willie, the president has talked about the red line being crossed, he's been pushed to go into syria for some time, at least more aggressively with aid. the red line has been crossed. i think we need to expect, we're going to see some military action of some nature, right? >> that's what it showed in that document and there are also reports including on the front page of the "wall street journal" of at least a limit nod fly zone, which is another thing the rebels have asked for to create space that would be enforced presumably by american and coalition jets. >> they're considering it. i think ben rhodes was actually knocking that report down yesterday. it's not really clear what we're talking about. we haven't heard directly from the president yet. the red line has been crossed but it's been crossed about 150 people we're talking about compared to the 93,000 people who have died in this situation overall over the last two years. >> right. >> it's not -- small ammunition

what we're talking about in terms of the rebels. not talking about boots on the ground. this is being described by a lot of people not just critics of the administration, but people who are synthetic to the administration as sort of the absolute minimum we can do and there is concern that it will not be enough. it won't do anything to sort of tip the balance of power away from the regime. we'll see into which means more involvement and deeper involvement will be inevitable at this point. >> coming up on "morning joe" we'll talk to former president bill clinton about this and chicago mayor rahm emanuel and john mellencamp and author steven king. up next top stories from the politico playbook. bill karins with a check on the forecast. >> good morning to you, mika. thank goodness we live in the northeast. everyone down there in florida is complaining it's too hot and too sunny for them. did this for joe. it's 83 right now and sunny in pensacola. >> killing me. >> 83 and sunny. the northeast as joe was mentioning at the top of the show feels almost like an april-type morning out there.

temperatures are in the low 50s. it is windy, it is rainy, as the big storm from yesterday exits to the south. the good news is this storm will be long gone by the weekend. things will improve. it's an ugly morning, boston, prove dense, to new york city. the u.s. open outside of philly will improve, we have tons of severe weather yesterday down there in the carolinas. it was hot in denver and colorado. the fires continue to burn. that's a big problem out there. today warm and breezy. today's forecast we're not going to have too many issues in the middle of the country but as we go through the weekend, east coast, congratulations, a beautiful day for you. as we go through father's day just storms, ohio valley, st. louis, looks like down to little rock. overall, a pretty nice father's day forecast, considering what just happened yesterday and the weather we're dealing with out there today in the northeast. new york city, it will improve slowly as the day goes on. i think you'll see that big yellow thing in the sky eventually. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. i'm the next american success story. working for a company

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24 past the hour. time now to take a look at the morning papers. the hamilton spectator, new research shows that men pay be the cause of menopause in females. >> of course. >> let me think about so many different lines i could say right now. >> yeah. >> the study says that because men have a preference for

younger women as females grow older, they developed a diminished chance of reproducing. >> i don't even understand that story. the "new york daily news" is next, the production company filing a class-action lawsuit against warner chapel music for the rights to the song "happy birthday." the song is worth millions per year as the company collects royalties every time the song plays on tv, film or stage. the lawsuit claims that warner chapel should not be allowed to collect a payment on a song that, quote, belongs to the public. >> rupert murdoch is back on the market after 14 years of marriage, the news corps chief executive is filing for divorce from his wife wendi. the couple said their relationship, quote, has broken down irretrievably. this comes two years after wendi defended her husband from a pie attack during a hearing -- >> it's a great moment. >> on the british hacking scandal. >> everybody was cheering for her. we wish both of them the very

best. >> yeah. >> very best. that was a great moment. take him out. >> the "dallas morning news" major announcements for airlines in the u.s. american airlines plans on adding more seats to fi few of their planes which could mean less leg room for passengers because really if you fly around these days, mika, the biggest problem is way, way too much leg room. >> exactly. you're like laying out full sprawl. >> it's just -- >> full sprawl in the plane. my knees are upper my chin. >> crunched in a fetal position and still can't get into the seat. san francisco chronicle a parking -- >> a desk, drag me out to come -- >> not talk about our meeting. >> come to the show -- >> i don't want to talk about our meeting. >> hide under my desk in a fetal position. >> at a parking spot in san francisco, sold for a hefty price tag of $82,000. only on the market for two weeks, the spot is not far from the san francisco giants stadium.

real estate experts say the space could be rented out for up to $450 a month. >> back to the "usa today," mini restaurant chains around the country trying to find ways to lure in customers for father's day offering free food for dads. >> oh, gosh. >> father's day traditionally not as popular for restaurants as mother's day. restaurants giving away free food including the spaghetti warehouse, tcbi and even hooters. >> hooters is -- >> what? they're giving away food, willie. don't look at me like that. >> giving away food -- >> caught the end of that. >> so let me explain the whole story. >> what's that? >> for father's day, willie, they're going to have free meals for dads, including at hooters. >> oh. >> that's what i was saying. free food. >> what's wrong with them? >> the sunday issue of "parade" magazine -- >> wear tight t-shirts an serve up dinner. >> do they really? >> that's the stupidest thing i've ever heard.

>> "parade" talking to former members of hootie and the blowfish, including singer country music star darius rucker, who has never -- >> whose family is taking their dad to hooters for father's day? >> listen, let me tell you something -- >> what? >> when little kate scar bro comes up with an idea why do you have to knock it down? >> kate did not have that idea. don't bring her name into this. >> john meacham is googling middle tennessee hooters. where's the closest one. >> google maps. >> to politico with us the chief white house correspondent mr. mike allen. hey, mike. >> happy friday and happy flag day. >> yes. happy flag day to you. we've got one of your own at the table with us here, maggie haberman. >> good morning, mag. >> let's talk about hillary clinton. a piece up, making her public return, appearances at the clinton global initiative and a new campaign for young kids that involves her, president clinton and chelsea as well. >> yeah. this is fascinating. secretary clinton is developing

a domestic side of plunging into issues that include early childhood education today. t the clinton foundation, renamed as the bill, hillary and chelsea foundation is announcing a partnership with a group called next generation where they will start too small to fail, focus on education for kids 0 to age 5. they're going to fund research in this area. do outreach to caregivers and parents and schools about how those youngest kids can do the best. yesterday speaking at clinton global initiative's cgi america in chicago, where we're going to hear from president clinton later, secretary clinton made it clear that she could be talking about these domestic issues, including jobs, education, and going to do her work through the non-profit foundation. so secretary clinton both stepping up on these issues faster than people thought and

also going broader than people would have thought given her most recent job. >> this is a great initiative, such an important time of life, 0 to 5. i hesitates to inject politics into it. you've covered hillary a lot. where is she right now in her thought process? >> i think when she tells people she hasn't made up her mind i think that's true. i think she hasn't. i think they are planning accordingly. everything is moving as if she is running. i think people who are around her, a lot of people working for her, assume she is running. i think the thought process is she has to get in a domestic policy conversation. this is a fairly easy way to do it. these are issues ha she cares about. you hate to be political about children, our children's ages, this is the reality. these are issues she is concerned about, talked about them a lot, she gets to work with her daughter on them and i think that's a big deal for her. in terms of her thought process, i think mike is right, she is coming out much earlier than people had expected. this whole, you know, she's

going to take six months off and do this and that, she's doing the book and a ton of speeches you're going to see a very engaged hillary clinton over the next year and a half and then we will have a clear sense of whether she's running. i think you should assume that's where everything is headed right now. >> this is hillary clinton taking time off. book, thesis and -- >> it's much easier. >> mike allen, thanks so much. have great weekend. >> happy father's day, willie. >> thank you very much. coming up a wet day for tiger woods at the u.s. open. how he did in round one. some people wondering if he might be hurt. sports is next. out there owning it.

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choose double miles or 2% cash back on every purchase every day. what's in your wallet? [ crows ] now where's the snooze button? [ crows ] in parks across the country, families are coming together to play, stay active, and enjoy the outdoors. and for the last four summers, coca-cola has asked america to choose its favorite park through our coca-cola parks contest. winning parks can receive a grant of up to $100,000. part of our goal to inspire more than three million people to rediscover the joy of being active this summer. see the difference all of us can make... together. foour neighbors.... and our communities... america's beverage companies have created... a wide range of new choices. developing smaller portion sizes and more.. low and no-calorie beverages... adding clear calorie labels so you know... exactly what you're choosing... and in schools, replacing full-calorie soft drinks...

with lower-calorie options. with more choices and fewer calories... america's beverage companies are delivering. all right. time for a little sports. we talked about it briefly at the top of the show. highlights, game four of the nba finals. miami in san antonio trying to avoid falling into a 3-1 series

hole. spurs come out hot. tony parker sharp, despite the hamstring strain. some people wondered if he was going to play. he did. spurs led by as many as ten at one point in the first quarter. erases that deficit in the second. dwyane wade hooking up with lebron after a turnover. jump ahead to the fourth quarter. in a fairly tight game, lebron takes one of his six steals, that's d. wade actually, and goes the length of the court for the throwdown looking like the 2006 mvp. wade finished with 32 points coming back. lebron, 33. chris bosh matching his playoff high with 20. the heat ride the big three to tie the series at 2-2 now. one more game in san antonio before two more back in -- >> that was a huge statement. >> lot of people waiting for lebron, what was he going to do. came out aggressive and scored 33 points. and dwyane wade scored 32. they're back and the series tied. golf, eyes remaining on the skies of the u.s. open as the --

they try to finish the first round and complete round two in pennsylvania. tiger his round delayed and cut short because of that weather. he was 2 over on the 11th when he called it a day because of darkness. some concern about his wrist. some people suspecting he had an injury. the three-time champion of the u.s. open insists not an issue. phil mickelson's cross-country red eye trip did not affect his play. he scored a 3 under 67 leaving him one shot off the lead. cross-country trip, he was at his daughter's eighth grade graduation, flew in and landed a couple hours before his round. luke donald finished withist three straight birdies. has to navigate the toughest part of the court today. baseball marathon game between the a's and yankees in oakland yesterday. bottom of the 18th inning, tie game, bases loaded for oakland, rookie nate freeman comes up with a broken-bat single to left off mariano rivera. the latest rivera has ever

pitched in a game, 18th inning. that's the winning run. the a's sweep the yanks in oakland. orioles hosting the red sox, first of a four-game set. bottom of the 13th inning there. tie game, two men on, chris davis bloops one to left, falls in for a base hit. baltimore wins 5-4. by the way, they're in second place. the yankees in third place. red sox still tied for the best record in the american league. to the nfl, according to patriots owner bob kraft the signing of tim tebow may be about more than just football. kraft told reporters yesterday, quote, for me personally laying tim tebow on the team he's someone who believes in spirituality. he's very competitive, works hard, but the fact that spiritually is so important to him is very appealing to me. we don't know if tebow will play in a patriots jersey or how much he'll play, the web is flooded with merchandise. he's the most popular selling jersey and the new addition to the patriots' website, official gear, tebowing patriot.

the new t-shirt. still ahead, mika's dad, dr. zbigniew brzezinski discusses the new development in syria and frankly -- >> he's recommending that they send me to syria. >> no. >> like rambo. a one-man wrecking crew. >> with a bb gun and one of those heats that have -- a tassl on top. i don't know what he's trying do. >> and a cut away. >> you know. >> and a target. target on my back, actually. >> also -- chuck todd. my friend chuck todd as well. up next mark mckinnon joins us for the must-read opinion pages. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks.

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with an adjuster. ted is now on hold with his insurance company. maxwell is not and just confirmed a 5:30 time for tuesday. ted, is still waiting. yes! maxwell is out and about... with ted's now ex-girlfriend. wheeeee! whoo! later ted! online claims appointments. just a click away on geico.com. [ banker ] mike's younger brother, kevin, had his college degree, his first real job, and needed to establish his credit history so he could rent a place of his own. mike helped kevin find ways to build his credit -- like any good big brother would do. now kevin has his own place, he's building his credit history, and mike has his apartment back -- for the most part. so i may be able to do this. yeah. [ female announcer ] let's talk about ways to help you establish and build your credit history. when people talk, great things happen.

♪ president vladimir putin released a video of him speaking english which is pretty rare for him. this video is real. look what he's put out there. >> ladies and gentlemen, i am delighted to greet members and guests of the general assembly of the exhibition bureau. >> sounds like borat after a couple. rosetta stone cd was like, tell my family i love them. >> 43 past the hour. live look at the white house on this friday morning. beautiful. joining us now former adviser to george w. bush and columnist for "the daily beast" and co-founder of no labels, mark mckinnon. >> just look at him.

>> i don't know what he's wearing and i like it. i like it a lot. >> you're a happy guy. >> how are you feeling, mark? >> i'm feeling great. >> your president that you worked for, his approval ratings up, up in about 48%. beats 23%. why is that? >> because he -- >> when you get away from the heat of the moment and begin to reflect and think about the character of the man. i think his character has been proven by the way he's performed out of office and that he's kept a low profile, been humble, keeping his head down. not interjecting himself into politics. >> what do you think about the poll that says george w. bush is more interested in american's privacies rights than barack obama? little part of you that did a dance when you heard that yesterday? obviously -- these are silly polls. >> yeah. >> they're ridiculous polls. it's just we heard for eight years that george w. bush was the devil and that he hated the constitution and he was a nazi and he was a fascist and this

and that and now, of course -- >> turn. >> democrats say, you know, we live in dangerous times. of course republicans are being -- just conservative talkers are being raging hypocrites on the other side when they said these were the most noble of programs and now darkly warning these are -- these are going to infringe on your most pure constitutional rights. >> you can literally -- >> that's why it's important as president not to pay attention to public opinion polls and why you see two presidents in a row sort of given what their jobs are, carrying on the same sort of policies, whether they're popular or not. >> want to know what you guys think of this. president obama is going to make his first extended trip to sub-saharian africa this month. >> that's great. >> and apparently the price tag is going to be huge. "the washington post" estimates the trip could cost between 60 and $100 million based on secret service documents, hundreds of presidential bodyguards will be

sent to senegal and tanz knee za, military cargo planes will air lift 56 support vehicles, fighter jets will fly giving 24-hour coverage over the president's air space. the president and the first lady considered taking a safari. and "the washington post" which has a pretty extensive article on this front page, writes, quote, it would have required the president's special counter assault team to carry sniper rifles with high caliber rounds that could neutralize cheetahs, lions or other animals if they became a threat for balance george bush and bill clinton made similar trips. george w. bush brought his daughters along and they went on a safari. and in a statement obamas's national security adviser ben rhodes said the cost of the trip is driven by the secret service, not the white house. does anyone feel this is over the top or jaw dropping? >> nope. >> the world we live in. >> didn't think so.

>> it's important that the president goes -- >> i think it's really important -- >> goes to africa. >> absolutelyp. >> and it's important that the secret service does what has to be done to keep him alive while he's in africa, right? >> absolutely. >> so i'm -- i'm just -- so i wonder, i mean that's one of the top stories in "the washington post" today. i wonder what point is? >> i think -- >> in the time of sequestering i guess. >> i think they got the memo from what i can tell. >> they're not going to do the safari. they came out and said they're not going to do the safari for appearances, otherwise where would you suggest they trim back on his security? >> i -- glen beck warned us of this, right? >> i know. >> you let this guy get elected president, the cheetahs will get away with murder. the cheetahs win here. we back down and who wins? willie? >> the cheetahs. >> he was right. >> can we read something -- >> cannot let the cheetahs win. >> never. give a cheetah an inch -- >> i like this.

>> he'll run a mile -- >> mark mckinnon's speech in "the daily beast" why i'm working with hillary? >> what? >> huh? >> as a republican, i never expected to be working with hillary clinton. but because i've been through the partisan microwave so many times, i care more these days about problem solving than scoring political points which is why i helped co-found no labels. and i care more about what works than who wins. recently as i've reflected on almost 30 years of working on this issue, after the billions of dollars that have been spent on hundreds of programs and pilots that have been tried, that we have made remarkably little progress or worse, we've gone backwards. i was shocked to see while some remarkable and innovative charter schools representing very poor students are sending out almost 100% of their students to college, nearly three quarters of them are dropping out. why are you working with hillary? >> a couple things are

happening. one is that over the last ten years or so at a time of diminishing sources the constituency that has been left behind is kids. they have nobody working for them. they don't have a lobby. >> right. >> too big to fail doesn't, but our kids who are really too small to fail don't. but at the same time what's interesting is that there is significant new research and science -- i started reading this, david brooks started talking about it a year or two ago and it really caught my attention that gives us insight into just how much you can do to shape and change kids' minds from 0 to 5 and so from a conservative point of view it seems to me, makes so much more sense to invest time and attention and resources early. >> right. >> and fix it then rather than spending so much more money later. i got involved with the next generation, a lot of great smart people working on this issue, a year or so ago. a few months ago, secretary clinton began to think about what she's going to be doing, these are issues she's been

thinking about and working on forever. >> you don't think it's political what she's doing? >> this goes back to her roots. when we talked to her about the new science and research she said this is fantastic but we knew this a long time ago. i'm glad to see it being proven out now. >> that question is being asked, she can't do anything without people -- >> of course. this is going to be viewed through a political lens. i think this is very authentic. it goes to her roots and what she cares about. >> she knows this stuff. she really understands it. >> mark, stay with us. up next a british man calls 911 when he's unhappy with the looks of his date. >> well, date is i think -- why don't we just -- why don't we just -- i'll -- escort is more accurate. he sent her on her way and she was angry. willie's news you can't use coming up straight ahead. want t. ♪ our business needs more cases. [ male announcer ] where do you want to take your business? i need help selling art. [ male announcer ] from broadband to web hosting

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it is time for the news you can't use. where else would we begin but with british 999 calls. >> what? >> their version of 911. >> okay. turns out there was an unsatisfied customer not happy with the quality of the service he was receiving from an escort we'll call her. >> calls 911. >> booked the date on-line and when he met her he thought the descriptions didn't match the real thing. seems like that's a call for the better business bureau. here's the phone call from great britain. >> yeah, hello. can i have the police please? >> okay. yeah, what's happened, please? >> well basically i need police assistance.

>> no. you need to tell me what's going on sir. >> here we go. okay. then. when it's called -- i think she's calmed down. she's got her knickers in a twist over something or another. >> something obviously happened? >> what happened is basically this woman, she's like basically advertising in the newspaper for like, you know, like private services like massage and stuff, yeah. >> yeah. >> and basically she's like misdescribed herself and she's like misrepresented herself, yeah. like because obviously she thinks i owe her a living or something be you know what i mean? >> okay. >> okay. >> why didn't you come out to a shot of mika on that one? what was that directing? >> i guess maybe he feels i'm -- i misrepresent myself? what? >> first thing i notice how polite their 999 operator is. >> what's that about? >> friendly and pleasant.

>> how can i help you? >> what the heck. >> that shows the perils of the welfare state. >> there it is. you're going to hate this story. >> i am. >> like you think i like the last one? >> well, actually, i think by your standards this is even worse. check this out. this is the world's most extreme burger as far as we can tell from a wendy's -- >> oh, my god. >> this is a wendy's in manitoba, canada, called the t-rex burger. nine patties, cheeseburger, two pounds, four ounces, 3,000 calories, 200 grams of fat, 6,000 milligrams of sodium. costs about 22 bucks. when the wendy's corporate god got wind of this they shut that down. they ordered the local franchisee to stop making the t-rex. for obvious reason, wendy's neither condones nor promotes the idea of anyone consuming nine patty hamburgers in one sitting. they sold like two or three of those per day.

>> people bought them. >> did you see the price for a combo? >> throw in a fry. >> need fries with that? >> absolutely. three bucks more. >> for more fries. >> i don't know why anyone would eat one. >> maybe for a family. >> think about what's -- >> you want the combo. >> break it down with the family. i don't know. family of six. i don't know. >> i could say so much but that is insanely stupid i can't believe somebody would buy that. >> don't call 999. >> i will not call 999 about that. that was -- >> that was something. >> coming up next, "the washington post's" eugene robinson and david ignatius and david gregory will help us raise the bar on this conversation. >> we need that. oh this is lame, investors could lose tens of thousands of dollars on their 401(k) to hidden fees. is that what you're looking for,

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before i do any projects on on my own.st at angie's list, you'll find reviews written by people just like you. i love my contractor, and i am so thankful to angie's list for bringing us together. angie's list -- reviews you can trust.

♪ spurs coach gregg poppovich is one of my favorite characters in the nba. this guy doesn't have time for nonsense, certainly isn't going to reveal inside strategy and tonight a gold star for his supporting award in this award for excellence in reporting. >> lebron james nine straight to end the quarter what are you asking for from your defense on him? >> i can't tell you that. >> okay. >> oh, my lord.

>> top of the hour. look at this. when is the weather going to lift? >> come on, man. it's incredible. live look at washington. welcome back to "morning joe." mark mckinnon and jon meacham with us. >> i'm dreaming of -- >> joining us, pulitzer-prize winning columnist "washington post" and political analyst eugene robinson. >> last night, mika -- >> i'm not done. >> 55 degrees and raining. >> yes, it's cold. ask david ignatius, columnist of the "washington post" about that. he joins us too. >> can you -- too cold. >> it is. >> too cold, 55 and raining. they're complaining in pensacola, it's 83 and clear. too much sun. you get all that sun, willie, they tell me, my family, i call them up and they tell me disorienting. to be that sunny all the time and forget. >> blinking in the light. >> you forget like what day. >> almost whiteout conditions, where to look. it's too nice down there.

i'm so glad to be here. 55 and raining. we have news today. let's -- david ignatius, "financial times" headline says it all, the united states concluded syria has used chemical weapons. add that with the fact that over -- up to 100,000 syrians have been killed -- >> red line. >> has the red line been crossed in a way that is going to move this president more decisively to action? >> yesterday was the day that we had the official announcement, red line crossed, as the white house said that yes, after very long review it had concluded that chemical weapons were used in at least four instances inside syria by the regime, but they didn't say precisely what they're going to do about that. it's my understanding the u.s. will move now with many of its allies, france, britain and others, to arm the syrian opposition under general idris

who's viewed as more of a moderate. i was told late last night that a part of this military supply program toward the nonlethal side will be done overtly, but there will be a covert side of lethal weaponry that could include some heavy weaponry. the rebels say they can't stop the 72 tanks without major anti-tank weapons. they would like anti-aircraft weapons and that's the issue that will be bargained over hard over the next few days. >> eugene robinson, lead story, the u.s. plans to send aid to the syrian rebels. should we? >> well good question. is it too late is the question that i would have. and i guess we need to know more about the specifics. i'm not sure what it's intended to do. is it intended to punish assad

for crossing the red line? is it intended to help the rebels stop the advance of the government forces who are creaming them at the moment and who are blasting them in aleppo and, you know, that battle could be effectively over, it seems to me, by the time the aid starts arriving. i'm kind of unclear as to exactly whether this is the first step in a much greater involvement in this conflict or if it's something less. >> so on that, david gregory, how clear are our options in terms of how heavily involved we become at this point? >> what has president obama said. he wants to figure out how the united states uniquely particularly makes a difference. if the united states puts its thumb on the scale with lethal aid to the rebels that means something. talking about air strikes that means something. diplomatic pressure means something as well.

but i think all of this is an attempt to do one thing in the short term and that's to deal with atrocity in syria. 90,000 killed in this fighting in this targeting by assad of his own people and now crossing this additional threshold into the realm of using chemical weapons. i think the united states wants to do something to try to deal with that and to try to force others into the arena. i still believe that what the administration is doing based on people i'm talking to is trying to build a -- kind of an escalator here of action that is not necessarily military action but much more diplomatic to put pressure on assad to leave, get other allies involved in owning the problem after the fact. even if he leaves there is still a great deal to manage in syria. >> david ignatius, it's willie. help me understand and help our viewers understand the significance of the red line as it pertains to chemical weapons. i guess the question is, why does it matter how people are

being killed, if 100,000 people have been killed without chemical weapons, what if that number went up and up and up and chemical weapons were never used, why wouldn't there be a red line somewhere within that space? >> willie, that's precisely the question a lot of syrians ask. they say 70, 80,000 syrians died and you didn't do anything and fou because chemical weapons have been introduced and you think there's a wider threat because of their use now you're coming in. it's not us you care about but your own interests. i suppose the part answer would be we have to put our interests first. the introduction of weapons of mass destruction, chemical weapons into this volatile region is seen as a threat. it's a threat to israel, syria's neighbor to the south. it's a threat to regional stability. it crosses what is a red line in international relations and the hope is the u.s. can convince russia, which is the crucial backer of syria's president bashar al assad, this is enough. this crosses your red line too

and you need to join with us in the coming days and diplomatic efforts. but for the moment, in terms of numbers of deaths, it's a small increment. in terms of kind of weapons, yes, this is something new. >> mark mckinnon, we've gone through a decade, obviously, of war. we are exhausted. 93,000 people killed since the fighting began in syria. many say that estimate may be low. it is hard to imagine the united states standing by and doing nothing, had we not had the preceding ten years of warfare where americans are just exhausted by it. i just -- i mean, get ready for the books to be written when the stories of the atrocities filter out in the coming years about how the united states stood by and abandoned the syrian people. >> well, i mean, i thought it was interesting what eugene said and what others are saying, we have -- it's difficult to make these decisions and as you said sort of conditioned on what's

been happening over the last several years. people are saying, is it too late? >> right. which again, i -- so -- 100,000 people are killed. assad is going to keep killing. it's not like these people are going to back down. jon meacham, i don't know how this guy ever -- what's allowed? >> forces him out. >> how many people did milosevic kill? we want to talk about war criminals you slaughter 95,000, 100,000 of your own people, use chemical weapons and you're not a war criminal? >> but sometimes 101 helps the most. ignatius -- can you define for us what our national interests aside from the humanitarian part of this is? >> well, syria's key backer other than russia is iran and the u.s. is seeking in various ways to contain iranian

influence. i note another important point about what's being done now in terms of arming the rebels. i've heard officials say that what we're doing in part is arming them for the second war, that will take place in syria once the regime is toppled. this regime is weak. i traveled in syria. i don't think it can hold on. there will be a second war between the more moderate forces that we're now supplying weapons to and very extreme and some cases al qaeda-backed jihadists in syria and so these weapons, this assistance to the moderates, can help them in the second war for control of the future of syria. i heard a fascinating report yesterday that first battle between these moderate forces and the al qaeda-backed group was taking place yesterday in an area near damascus. there's a taste of what's to come. the second war for control of the opposition. >> joe, can i speak to your point? i think partly this outrage,

this idea that, well, why did the u.s. abandon syria, is predicated on this belief that somehow the united states uniquely can solve this problem. i mean, our iraq experience told us that only when we are all-in for a decade can you achieve some level of calm that may or may not hold if you look at the level of violence that's in iraq right now. >> right. >> so i think part of what defines our national interests is both the implosion and explosion that occurs in syria and the rest of the region. you have secularists fighting the islamists now in turkey which was a beacon of kind of a democratic model in the modern middle east, in the modern, you know, general area. and i think, you know, and iraq. and as david said, the influence of iran. this sectarian struggle, i think the question for government including our own is how do you make a difference without going in there and trying to own the

problem. >> now, you know, the problem is here, though, david, we are -- the united states of america, we are the irreplaceable player. right? >> if we get involved, things happen, if we don't they don't. we saw the united arab emirates canceled a meeting they had of the arab states because the united states was not going to be involved in that meeting. they were afraid factions would break down. i've been urging restraint for many, many years. your father talks about the united states being that irreplaceable player, but, you know, the same people that -- a lot of the same people that supported intervention in bosnia and kosovo when there wasn't a direct national interest, that was humanitarian aid. that was a humanitarian situati situation. now we're saying we shouldn't get involved in syria and there is a lack of consistency there. >> david said talking about

being all-in for a decade a lot of people don't take that lightly. we'll have former president bill clinton on shows today. he has recently been quoted as saying really stinging words about the president if he doesn't get involved, but there are perils, david gregory, to getting involved. >> right. well i mean clearly. i mean in blood and treasure and then in the ultimate ability to influence events. and i think that's partly where the administration is. i don't think this is unique to president obama's administration. i think any administration, republican or democrat, looks at the region, looks at the massive shifts in the region and says what role does the united states play precisely, especially after the experience in iraq? >> mika, one question, though, that i still have is, how does this new aid affect that awful tally that keeps rising by 10,000 a month at this point. >> my instinct is it doesn't. >> how does this bend that curve

in any way and if we're going to provide these arms to the forces, where is that going to happen? is there going to be some sort of safe haven where they can be trained to use the heavier weapons and what sort of trainers are going to be involved? there's a lot of questions about the extent of this involvement and exactly how it's going to be done. >> david ignatius, quickly, to follow up on what's in our national interests, is it not much easier to say that involvement in a syrian conflict like this is more directly in our national interests than say bosnia or kosovo, if you're just looking at military strategy. we've got two real enemies in the middle east. you've got iran and syria and syria is sponsored by iran? >> i think there is a much more obvious and immediate reason for the united states to care about and get involved in this war,

but to take up gene robinson's point, gene is describing precisely the slippery slope. the initial aid that we will give to general idris' forces will almost certainly not be enough to overcome ba shash al assad or the extremists. you've got to do more. we're in it now. our credibility is at stake. as we know from our history over the last 50 years, it's very easy to go down that slope toward a kind of leveled involvement that the american people didn't understand they were getting into in in the first place. that's why i think the president really has to level with the american people about what he's doing here. >> and, you know, mika, before we send the first troop in or involvement, we have to look back at our history since world war ii. kosovo -- not kosovo. start with korea. and certainly, you know, didn't end well. vietnam, the same. you can look at both of the iraq

wars. look at afghanistan. it's always inconclusive and it's always -- it's always unfortunately -- >> expect to have to do. >> a lot more and costs more and blood and treasure. >> david gregory, thank you very much. who do you have on sunday's "meet the press"? >> we've got senators saxby chambliss and mark udall on the fight over the nsa leaks and surveillance program as well as, of course, the continuation of this debate on syria. >> great. and david ignatius, eugene robinson, thank you as well. have a great weekend. still ahead, we're going to talk live with former president bill clinton, chicago mayor rahm emanuel also joins the discussion. up next, i'm already stuttering, dr. zbigniew brzezinski and chuck todd join the conversation. >> chuck makes me stutter too. >> you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. one ordinary family goes big...

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joining us now from washington, former national security adviser for president carter and author of strategic vision, america and the crisis of global power, dr. zbigniew brzezinski. hi dad. thanks for coming in. >> good morning. >> with us from the white house, nbc news chief white house correspondent and host of "the daily rundown" chuck todd. >> chuck, this morning, the white house is waking up, the president waking up to screaming headlines in "the new york time times", "financial times," wall street jurm, "washington post" about how syria has crossed the red line. what are you hearing this morning about the white house response? >> well this is all -- think of this as a little bit of a core -- being choreographed. they have the announcement yesterday and i know there's been some questions, why is it being done by a staffer, why didn't the president himself make this? well, in three days, the president leaves for the g-8 and now the g-8 that's going to take place in northern ireland is essentially going to be focused

on all things having to do with syria, some, you know, obviously -- the g-7 is in one place, the 8th member, russia, in another, and you should expect to see the president himself address this more, possibly some announcements that include a coalition like announcement, you know, maybe it's -- maybe it's something more, the no-fly zone had different aides say different things about whether they would do something like that or not. there's some that wants some form of that. wouldn't work the exact same way it would work in libya, but that is in the midst. of the consultations who will take place with the uk, france, the more active partners. here part of this, joe, is designed to try to convince russia, hey, look, these guys, assad is killing his own people, stop supporting him. withdraw and let's start this conference and have a political solution.

>> okay. so dad, what are our options? what are the options looking ahead to the g-8 and what do you think that the white house strategy should be? >> i think our posture is baffling. there is no strategic design. we're using slogans. for example, assad has killed 93,000 people. they have been killed in what is now a civil and sectarian war and the killing is by both sides. we have been supporting surreptitiously an airlift back in 2012 to help the rebellion, without really taking a public position as to why we're doing so. we then set some sort of conditions that are a red line and then the statement by the white house confirms that the red line has been crossed, but does so in a somewhat ambiguous fashion as to when and how.

it all seems to me rather sporadic, chaotic, unstructured, and directed. i think we need a serious policy review with the top people involved, not just an announcement by the deputy head of the nsa, that an important event has taken place and we'll be reacting to it. the fact of the matter is, that we are threatened by sliding into a sectarian civil war in which both sides are very brutal, which can evolve into a larger regional war in which we'll probably pit against iran as an alley of syria. the impact of that on international economics, on our well being, in fact, on our budget, we are running the risk of getting involved in another war in the region which may last for years. i don't see any real strategic guidance to what we're doing. i see a lot of rhetoric, a lot of emotion, a lot of propaganda, in fact. >> chuck todd, dr. brzezinski

talked about a policy that's sporadic and chaotic and talked about being unstructured. after the last segment where we had some wonderful writers and columnists and thinkers, willie and i turned to each other and said that segment tells us in the words of the great playwright william goldman, nobody knows anything. this is -- it is chaotic, it is chaotic right now and i'm just wondering, what is the white house plan to clarify the path forward? >> well, that's the problem. they don't see an end game. the only end game that they see that's viable is somehow that russia agrees to this -- there's some sort of political solution and assad somehow agrees to leave. now, assad is now winning the war. he wasn't winning it three, six months ago. and i think you're also seeing this is a product of an

administration, you know, a lot was made and i'm sure you're going to ask president clinton if president clinton sort of disagreed with this policy. by the way, john kerry has hinted he has disagreed with the president's policy here in not so many words about a month or so ago when he implied, you know, there is some, you know, there is some things that could have been done six months ago, nine months ago, implying, you know, that maybe it is too little too late. but there's been an internal divide on what to do here and it's my understanding that the president looks at what happened in libya, looks at iraq, looks at sort of these interventions and says, you know, the end game here is not clear and if the end game is not clear, you can't really -- you can't really fully get involved. look at what happened. i mean let's look at benghazi. forget -- let's take the politics out of it. benghazi was this unstable place that was unsafe which was, of course, the city we went in to

protect. >> right. >> to try to topple gadhafi. >> right. >> and you know, libya, look how it's turned out. what's the syria end game after assad leaves and until somebody can give him an answer that's why i think he's being hesitant. >> dr. brzezinski, i hear your skepticism on intervention here. i wonder what you think the american standard should be for humanitarian intervention. president bill clinton has said not getting involved in rwanda is perhaps the greatest regret of his presidency. where do you think america steps in? what's the moment where we cannot afford to sit on the sidelines any longer? >> america steps in when it's going to be affected or where it's going to prevent a dis disaster. look at the successful or messy interventions. bosnia was a successful intervention. why was it successful? because the opponent was totally isolated by neighboring countries that wanted to be part of nato and were supporting us

and we had a free hand in effect in leading with the situation. we dealt with it decisively and, in fact, created a situation in which several countries now replace yugoslavia which was a communist dictatorship and which are now individually joining nato but the european union. what hasn't worked as well was the attack on iraq, which was based on false assumptions and which has created a situation that is very unstable and continues to deteriorate. the intervention in libya by the british and the french with our backing hasn't worked out too well and the french and british haven't been very effective. we are now pointed towards something, somewhat similar but more dangerous in syria, because syria's interlocked with iran, that poses dangers for the global economy, that will affect the interest of japan and china. we should be building an international coalition to impose some sort of a solution. we should be seriously

negotiating with the chinese and the russians, involve the japanese as well because they're influential. so are the indians incidentally who are dependent on energy. that is the response that might have some effect. instead we're engaging in mass propaganda portraying this as a democratic war. who is fighting for democracy? ca ta tar and saudi arabia are fighting for democracy? this is a war waged by both sides. i repeat 93,000 were killed in a civil war, not just by the syrian regime. there are two sides to that struggle and neither one is waging it in a particularly attractive fashion. the risk is it will escalate and slip out of our control, not like the one we had in bosnia. we have to be more strategic, more determined and the leadership has to be more directed from the top down involving the president and his top, top foreign policy advisers. not by some casual communiques,

worded in a vague fashion because we don't know whether these incidents which killed 100 people or 150 people, preceded or followed obama's so-called red line. and why did the president issue that particular red line? on what basis? with what strategic concepts in mind? this what is is baffling about this whole thing. it's a tragedy and it's a mess in the making and one that can enlarge, involve turkey perhaps also in this problem and turkey is having internal difficulties. i do not see where the united states right now is trying to accomplish. >> all right. dr. brzezinski, thank you so much for being here. >> dad, thanks for coming in. >> greatly appreciate it. chuck, thank you. we'll see you at "the daily rundown" coming up. who will you be talking to? >> i've got ron johnson going to be on. he just had an interesting meeting with some other senators with dennis mcdonna talking about the budget. going to get a debrief on that. >> thanks so much. >> all right. >> appreciate it. coming up musician john

mellencamp and author stephen king behind their new musical. and steven spielberg says hollywood is going up in flames like the end is near. we'll tell you what he's talking about.

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up next, innovation nation. >> can you hold for one second? speaking of innovation, there are moments in time when worlds collide and when those worlds collide remarkable things happen. thomas roberts comes with a bit of breaking news. >> this is the cronut. a pastry to end all pastries. >> can you explain? >> this is the marriage of a doughnut and a croissant. >> i thought that was illegal in new york state. >> not yet. >> thanks to the new york state legislature. >> i won't disappoint. >> going to have a kronant. >> i won't hurt it. i'm apparently hurt dunkin' donuts feelings when i hurt the doughnuts -- >> i cut it for you -- >> no, that's thomas' 11:00 show. >> no. there's two more. >> thank god. >> these are dragon eggs. i got three.

>> are you sure you don't want to try it? >>. i don't want to try it. it looks really good. >> grew up outside of paris. >> i don't want to take it away but i will. >> like dragon eggs, i only got three. >> dragon eggs. >> eat it. >> oh, my god. look at this. >> no. >> chew it. >> thomas. >>. >> oh. >> it's good for you too. .

okay. legendary director/producer steven spielberg is predicting the end of the film industry as we know it. >> brian is back. >> hi. >> he told the package at ufc's film school there's going to be an implosion or big meltdown where three or four maybe a half dozen mega budget movies are going to go crashing into the ground and that's going to change the paradigm. >> of course, it was, mark mckinnon, a paradigm created first by the remarkable movies that steven spielberg made. "jaws" the first huge summer blockbuster and go through, you know, "close encounters" "e.t.," et cetera. >> it may be tough for steven spielberg budgeted films. i think for consumers there's such a disneyland of content available now and people -- content providers like net flicks and others are providing

original content so consumers have a vast array of options now and i think tv is producing great drama at a relatively small cost. >> no budget. low budget. >> huge budgeted films and "superman," what, is coming out this weekend. >> "man of steel" seems like every one of the summer blockbusters costs hundreds of millions of dollars and if it fails, then man, the companies go down with it. >> they're not making them for us anymore to be honest with you. they're making them enough to be star studded enough to play in china and overseas. i love film and movies but i don't think i have bean to the theaters in two years. i was hoping for man of steel -- i would like something to be compelling. playing it so safe the movies aren't smart enough for most people. >> yeah. go ahead. >> speaking of innovators the issue of "national journal" is a special report on 50 innovators from around the country and what washington can a learn from them. joining us from washington the

magazine's executive editor adam curbner. >> adam, congress is sitting at 10% approval rating. what's the first thing they should do? >> they should look to what's happening in the rest of america and while there's a great deal of innovation, stagnation and partisanship in washington, what we've found when we selected ten categories from exports and health care and energy and providing manufacturing and financing, infrastructure projects, we chose the ten categories where america still has some really important challenges ahead of it. >> let's get specific. what can the government learn from mcdonald's? >> this is a great story. >> mcdonald's does have a great story. they found that they had employees, latinos, some immigrants who were not on the fast track to promotion and advancement that they could be or should be, because they were being held up by language

limitations. rather than waiting for washington and policymakers to device programs to help in work force training they devised their program english under the arches turning a ton of people, giving them training for the english on their shifts, writing performance reviews, managerial tools. >> wow. look at those numbers. >> that's amazing. >> 91s% graduation rate. 95% of their employees now graduate and increase their wages. that's fantastic. what can the government learn from the ymca? >> the ymca has a fabulous program. they devised a program to combat diabetes, to target people, middle-aged people and seniors who were at risk, people overweight, who didn't have great diets, and they wanted to teach them to adjust their lifestyles. really simple solutions. park at the edge of the parking lot so you have a longer walk to get to the mall or the supermarket or whatever. and this program was being

evaluated against drugs to treat and prevent diabetes and the results were so overwhelming in favor of the ymca's plan that the study authors had to cancel the study because it was unethical to keep going, to keep people from access to the ymca program. >> wow. that's unbelievable. john? >> adam, is one of the themes here that big things don't necessarily have to cost a lot of money? >> big things do not have to cost a lot of money and they don't have to come from the top either. they can come from small places and big things are being born from the ground -- from grass roots from the dinos of innovation happening. this is a dispatch from america that works. >> it's a smaller world out there. the idaho is typical of what technology needs to do to work for us. tell us about that one. >> idaho was finding that in their high schools, that they were having trouble getting access for rural kids to ap classes, college courses, and it was limiting their ability for sort of upward mobility and their chance to compete with

more elite students in urban centers. they basically networked, got broadband, all out through satellite and laid down fiber optic cable into schools in rural idaho and in that way kids there are now taking courses from major universities and major city centers and no longer at a disadvantage because of their geography. >> this is incredible. we'll be looking for the new issue of "national journal." i love the mcdonald's story and these other concepts and how social media plays into this and technology, we had the woman on yesterday who started selling dresses on facebook and now has a multimillion-dollar business. innovation coming our way. >> it's exciting. >> still ahead, president bill clinton and rahm emanuel from the global initiative in chicago. rock and roll hall of famer john mellencamp and thriller legend stephen king team up on unlikely projects and what is ahead. up next, we take a fun look back at "morning joe's" best and

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yeah. you know what? i just got this tweet. >> yeah. >> i guess i am a little off today. >> what's that?

>> it says the reason -- shaggy says the reason women don't rule the world is because of cranky hens like @morningmika. >> why are you cranky? >> how long have we been doing this show? >> um, i think about -- i think about 70 years. >> feels like it. >> actually, it was -- >> 70 would be on the -- >> it was actually -- it was about six years ago that we first started. you know, we celebrate because phil officially let us do this i think in august or september of 2007. >> yeah. >> but it was about i think six years ago now that we first actually -- i walked in the office, got the keys off phil's desk and unlocked the studio. >> you stole the keys? >> i stole them. >> we did the show while he wasn't looking and it turned out well for us. >> it did. we're still here. good lord. in this business, be that's saying something. the best moments and biggest guests of "morning joe." >> while america was sleeping,

history was made. ♪ ♪ dance to the music dance to the music ♪ >> good morning and welcome to "morning joe" it's 6:00 a.m. on the east coast. >> is there not enough news coverage like this. >> you have changed the debate in america. >> what makes you so great? >> the same thing that makes you great, joe. >> i enjoy the show so much and watch it several days a week. >> i watch it all the time. i got to get my blood going in the morning. >> i think you all do this better than anybody in television. you guys got the morning thing down. >> i think it's the best political affairs show on television. because you've got time and you've got guys that know what they're talking about. >> the fifth anniversary --

>> no way. >> -- of your show. this is a proclamation. >> look at this. i love it! >> you going to come in here, tom? >> no, this is it, kids, thanks a lot for promoting the show. >> every time i see you on "morning joe" i see you doing this stuff. >> does this hurt? >> did you practice? >> no, i've never done it before. is there anything, anything at all, on capitol hill that you guys can agree on? >> we agree on watching "morning joe." >> your show is on every morning actually. ♪ ♪ walk this way ♪ >> even though i'm republican. >> i love you! ♪ >> so i'm so happy that you're

part of the a-list of the '80s. >> i have chastised people for not starting their day right here. >> you actually agree with each other a good bit but you try to keep it quiet. >> why is this the end, why won't you give us more? >> i could join a panel somewhere. >> joey says hi. >> hello, joe, hello, mika, hello mike. >> hi, joe, how are you, joe? >> i don't understand how you can be "morning joe" brought to you by starbucks because when i see you, you seem more like evening joe brought to you by jack daniels. >> i'm a fan, 6:00. >> great segment, everyone. you nailed it. >> appreciate it. >> nailed it. ♪ who are you ♪ i really want to know who are you who who who ♪ >> i was coming on this morning to ask you to be my running

mate. >> i'm in tv until you die. >> you find your mandate for the next four years? >> the first order of years will be to get the deficits under control. >> we're still talking s.e.c. football. ♪ >> i think first dude up there in alaska todd palin all to take levi down to the creek and hold his head under water until the thrashing stops. >> you went to him and you said, push the tapes. it wasn't the cover-up to illegal actions. >> henry kissinger told me, pat, lord knows what i said to get out of that office at certain times. everybody knows what we got to do now, why doesn't the president lead? >> yes. >> i'm not sure how you go out and acquire an international superstar, but cnbc did it. >> time to talk to international superstar erin burnett. >> sorry to be a wet blanket. >> you just report.

♪ all right, billy's all right they just seem a little weird ♪ ♪ surrender surrender but don't give yourself away ♪ >> whether we're talking about politics or fashion or when we're talking about for policy, we try to do it like the industry does it. >> the most fun we have when we do this show is when we take it on the road. we think it's really important when you're going to cover politics to do it with dignity and gravitas. >> welcome to a special sunday edition of "morning joe" we're, of course -- hell, i don't have to tell you where we are. >> pretend like you're working. pretend like you're working. crisis, cut, economic, crisis, scare everybody, go! >> it might be 9 degrees outside but it's always warm and sunny in the hawaii tropic zone restaurant. >> fashion. >> we cover fashion. >> we cover fashion, but guess what it's not that hard. >> mika is impressed with your

jacket, she says you look very good. >> she's my satorial adviser. >> dump your purse. >> oh, no. >> talk about way too early. >> stop it. >> stop it! >> you need some moisturizer on those calfs. >> it's a good looking penuela, my friend. >> oh, my god, look at this. he's putting it in your hair. >> you have a white spot on your gut you might want to take care of that. >> oh. >> look at you. >> this is a "gq" day. >> i think what separates our show from any other show, we're not afraid to say on the air i love you. >> first bill karins who really should retire. >> he never gets it right. bill karins a man who can put a little bit of meat on his bones. god, that was a horrible forecast. >> i'm a little uncomfortable right now. >> yes, you should be. i learned we should have rethought of this about this "way too early thing."

>> p.j., it's your fault. t.j., what did you do wrong? t.j. has destroyed our show now for eight years. >> we like to cover popular. >> we love it. >> i get a real kick out of it. >> "access hollywood" and lindsay lohan. >> i'm done with the paris hilton story. >> just do the news. >> okay. >> paris hilton lead story. >> what a statement. that is a statement about the state of journalism in our country. >> you have changed the world, mika. >> dr. phil betroid. >> how are you talking about that? >> how that impacted, we'll never know. >> we're not talking about charlie sheen. >> what is foreign relations thoughts about charlie sheen. >> i love cooking segments. >> can i have another snickerdoodle waffle? >> this is so important that we're not going to break for lunch, i break into my pocket. >> brown sugar, coconut oil,

salt. >> that's what i'm tasting. >> what are you doing! ♪ ♪ go that way [ male announcer ] citi is over 200 years old. in that time there've been some good days. and some difficult ones. but, through it all we've persevered, supporting some of the biggest ideas in modern history. so why should our history matter to you? because for more than two centuries, we've been helping ideas move from ambition to achievement. ♪ and the next great idea could be yours. ♪ i don'without goingcisions to angie's list first. you'll find reviews on home repair to healthcare written by people just like you. with angie's list, i know who to call,

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welcome back to "morning joe." back with us on set we have jon meacham and maggie abraman. we've got a lot of news to get to including major developments in syria. new polling from gallup shows how far congress has sunk. >> how do they do it? >> you would think they would be working their way back to build confidence in america. >> maggie, you're a new yorker, right? >> yeah. >> one thing people from congress should never do is what the late great ed koch, how am i doing? >> don't do that. >> it's not a positive. >> somebody did it for them. >> don't ask, don't tell. >> there you go. >> right. >> public confidence in congress is at just 10%. >> they're in double digits, it's good. >> there you go. hey. >> that's the way to look at it. it's the lowest level of confidence the poll has found for any institution ever. >> ever. >> ever. >> like any ever. >> hey.

>> those surveyed have higher confidence -- >> they say you're in trouble actually, mika, you know, when you always have these polls that you are showing right now and they have the high watermark and 50 or 60. you start at 30. >> yeah. >> and you're still dropping like a led zeppelzeppelin. it's pretty bad. >> the higher category of confidence are banks and big business and hmos. >> that's not good. >> hmos, what do we do there? >> historically people have never liked congress, but, john, this group they take the cake. >> it's not good. >> thank you for that perspective. >> let me give you a key. >> do you get a pulitzer for that? >> let me give you a few examples as chester arthur -- >> oh, god. >> if you have a chester arthur quote -- >> almost always.

>> speaking of congress what else do we have? >> speaking of congress there are some leaders there, senator joe manchin in the senate is pushing back at an ad from the nr that criticizes west virginia democrats their position on guns the 30-second clip which we showed you yesterday links manchin to president obama and new york city mayor michael bloomberg, look closely. >> remember this tv ad? >> i'm joe manchin, i approved this ad because i'll always defend west virginia. as your senator i'll protect our second amendment rights. >> that was joe manchin's commitment. but now manchin is working with president obama and new york mayor michael bloomberg, concerned? you should be. tell senator manchin to honor his commitment to the second amendment. >> wow. >> in a statement yesterday the senator wrote in part, quote, the washington nra can spend $100 million on ads against me, it still won't make what they say true. if they were honest with their members they would see that my

bill not only protects the second amendment rights it enhances and strengthens them. unfortunately nra leadership in washington has lost its way and is more concerned about political power than gun rights. and safety. and what's so fascinating about this is for the people that -- maggie, for the people that were involved in the negotiations and really knew what was going on, almost all of the background check bill was passed by the washington nra. >> right. >> they were working with manchin and they were working with toomey and they drafted it. >> right. >> and they were hot not going score it, the washington nra, i say the washington nra, there's three people up there that are taking this organization so far away from what it's supposed to be and what it's 4 million members want but they were dealing with joe manchin. >> right. >> they were dealing with pat toomey, they were going back and they came up with a deal that the nra said we're not going to score, we're good with this.

you guys put it out, we won't score it. and suddenly larry pratt and gun owners came out and said we're the real second amendment rights people. so, if that's larry's position, larry's been consistent. you can't attack larry for hypocrisy because i've known larry, this is larry's position, it's always been his position. but for the nra to now act shocked that joe manchin was pushing a bill that they helped draft with him. >> yeah. >> it's pathetic. >> i think not surprising, right? >> right. >> i think this is exactly the kind of advertising you're going to see against manchin, you're going to see against other people helping to craft this legislation and the idea is how much money mike bloomberg puts in to defend manchin what this looks like in terms of help from the other side, he's done a lot of hurting the democrats who voted against it, i'm interesting to see what it will look like in terms of backup. >> i think you'll see people in west virginia coming out and support joe manchin. joe manchin will fight back. and by the way, joe manchin is

fine. he's an extraordinarily popular figure there. nra is not fine. the washington nra, this is -- we should say, the sixth month date, this marks the six-month date of the newtown shootings and that horrific tragedy. and we've -- we've seen unfortunately the failing of congress. we've seen unfortunately the weakness of the white house. we've seen unfortunately i think the overreaction by so many people. i think the nra most shamefully. the washington nra and i'm going to say these three people and you look at that ad yesterday and it reminded you of all the overreaches that they have made right after the newtown shooting putting out a video game that 4-year-olds could use to shoot weapons. making one horrific mistake after another. actually targeting president obama's little children in an ad. and then yesterday you look at this and people called me up and

said what do you think of -- what do you think of -- do you think that they may have shaded that ad to make barack obama look more ominous and black? you know, i usually pick up the phone and call and respond. it's so obviously, look at his hands. it looks like he is a coal miner from west virginia. >> yeah. >> look how dark they made his hands. >> note to the nra -- >> look at the side of his face. >> people don't do this anymore. >> this is a question that answers itself. you don't have to call me up and ask me, if i think the washington nra, put that back up -- the washington nra shaded barack obama's hands. why don't we look at this picture. you can do this at home and just compare what they've done to barack obama's hands and the side of his face to every other picture you've seen of barack obama.

listen. i've been critical of those on the left when they've used race. and it happens every election to race bait. and i'm certainly going to be critical when people on my side, on the right, do the same thing and this is an example. look at the hands. look at the side of the face. you don't have to call me up. you just need to find out who produced this ad for the nra, who approved this ad for the nra -- >> the nra. >> -- but which three members, which of the three members that have hijacked the nra from its 4 million members, good men and women, law abiding men and women across the united states of america, who is responsible for that. don't call me. call them and ask, who did this. any questions on whether somebody may have shaded that with photoshop. >> unless they caught him at the one press conference where he had a vacation beard -- >> and was in shadow. >> -- that was not an original photograph. >> and he had vacation beard on

his hand. only i grow hair on my knuckles, nobody else does that. >> that's true. >> that's my gig. >> the problem for the nra is people in west virginia don't buy the argument that joe manchin is anti-gun. he had an a-plus rating with the nra, when he put out this legislation after newtown for background checks he put in all the stipulations that would be against federal law to keep the information on the background that you have checked by penalty of jail time. 15 years, something like that. so, this -- you can use these images and it will create the stir nationally perhaps but inside west virginia they know joe manchin, he is their governor. they know he's for guns. >> people know what you've done. they know your background. >> you use the right word, i think, ove rearreach. this is the jack booted thugs of the moment. >> explain that if you would for people. >> right after oklahoma city, in

'94, '95. >> atf, ruby ridge. >> right in that period, there was a fund-raising letter that referred to federal agents as jack booted thugs. george herbert walker bush resign resigned. it was a moment where you saw a shift in the nra that had already shifted in reaction to the riots and urban unrest in the late '60s. >> i wonder what wayne lapierre does when joe manchin goes back out and films another commercial and i've been with your second amendment rights and do you know who has been side by side with me? wayne lapierre, this is what he said about background checks a few years ago and wayne lapierre says the same thing and joe manchin would never do it. but when the word leaks out how involved the nra was in negotiating this, the background check bill, which they were, they were all over it, and then they're running ads for a bill that they were working with

toomey and manchin and others with to pass it, it's just another example of this overreach. we've got huge news coming out of syria. the red line has been crossed. >> officially. >> what's going to be done? >> the united states has concluded that pro-government forces in syria have used chemical weapons against the opposition crossing the so-called red line that is now drawing america more directly into the conflict. the obama administration says there is evidence that forces loyal to president bashar assad used serin gas on a handful of rebel fighters, somewhere to 100 to 150 people were reported killed in those attacks. those numbers could change. now for the first time the u.s. will begin sending small arms and ammunition to rebel groups via the cia. there has been considerable pressure both abroad and here at home for the white house to take a tougher approach. today's "new york times" reports, quote, the president's caution has frayed relations

with important american allies in the middle east that have privately described the white house strategy as feckless. still, vocal backers of u.s. action in syria praise the decision. >> i applaud the president's decision. 93,000 people dead later. over a 1 million refugees in the countries in the surrounding region erupting into sectarian violence. >> joining us now in washington diplomatic correspondent for "the washington post" ann guerin has been covering this story. how much do we know? reading about exactly how much the chemical weapon use that we know about and the deaths in syria, how much do we know in terms of what has been done against the people there? >> well, the white house outlined at least four instances of gas use probably sarin gas use this year and the

allegations are that it may go back further than that. and this was indeed the red line that president obama set last year for some kind of american action. exactly what happened to the rebel fighters has been the subject of intelligence and scientific examination and the white house said they have evidence of both natures really detailing the use including the tests on a body and a live surviving victim. >> you know, anne, we're hearing, the state department is really pushing for it, trying to get more decisive action. there is some restraint in the white house, some pushback from that. you also, of course, have two humanitarian hawks that just got appointed to being ambassador to the united nations and also the head of the nsa. what kind of impact are they

going to have in moving the president's white house closer to where the state department is? >> well, there's been a division within the administration predating even the arrival of the two officials you mentioned, sam power and susan rice, but the real issue right now will be whether the administration goes further than this fairly limited action of small arms and ammunition. and goes full on with what the rebels are asking for, which is first anti-tank weapons and also, more importantly to them, anti-aircraft weapons. the consensus in the national security community is that at some further action is possible by the united states. even this action was considered a surprise by some. but that anti-aircraft weapons are probably still a long shot

for the rebels because of their potential to be diverted for use against civilian aircraft. >> all right, anne, thank you so much for being with us. we really do appreciate it. >> thank you. >> willie, the president has talked about the red line being crossed, he's been pushed to go into syria for some time at least more aggressively with aid. the red line has been crossed. i think we need to expect we're going to see some military action of some nature, right? >> that's what it showed in that document and there are also reports including on the front page of the "wall street journal" at least a limited no-fly zone which is another thing the rebels have asked for to create some space that would be enforced presumably by american and coalition jets, we'll see if they enforce that. >> they are considering it. ben rhodes was actually knocking that report down yesterday. it's not really clear what we're talking about. we haven't heard directly from the president yet, the red line has been crossed, but it's been crossed by 150 people we're talking about compared to the 193,000 people that have died in

this situation overall in the last two years. >> right. >> there's some small ammunition is what we're talking about in terms of the reshls. we're not talking about boots on the ground. this is talk ied about as sort the absolute minimum we can do and there is concern that it won't be enough. it won't do anything to sort of tip the balance of power away from the regime, we'll see. bill clinton joins us and also rahm emanuel. and a few minutes musician john mellencamp and steven king and t. boone burnett, all together. bill karins a check on the weather. >> a check on what should be a much improved forecast especially for the east coast. yesterday was a violent day with the violent storms rolling through. the storm responsible for all the mess the last couple of days is exiting the east coast and still a cold, chilly rain from boston to cape cod and cold showers down around the

mid-atlantic. that will exit and a little bit of improvement as we go through the day. the middle of the country has had a break. as we go through the weekend we'll see a chance of additional storms for you but the story out of colorado keeps getting worse. now up to 380 homes burnld with the black forest fire near colorado springs. hot and dry today. a little cooler on the fire lines as we go through saturday and sunday, notice the east coast on saturday. that is by far the most beautiful saturday you've had in a long time. enjoy that. as we get into the father's day forecast there will be a few thunderstorms rolling into d.c., philly, new york, pittsburgh, all the way up through southern new england. much of the morning is dry and beautiful but the afternoon hours in the northeast will get a few storms and our friends from areas in the ohio valley to st. louis you'll have a few isolated storms late in the day as you treat yourself and hopefully your dad to a wonderful sunday. oh, yeah, by the way, did you know it's flag day? you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks.

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♪ you can hear with those ears ♪ and you can speak with that tongue ♪ ♪ the truth looks so far away ♪ but now it's clear that was rock and roll hall of fame singer-songwriter john mellencamp performing a track from the musical "ghost brothers of dark land county."

he joins us now along with author stevening king and t. boon burnett. all three men. >> look at t. boone, he's wearing the shades. >> he's awesome. >> john said the sun never sets on the cool. >> and it doesn't. all three men are the creative minds behind this project which is being described as a gothic supernatural musical, i like it already. great to have you all aboard. >> john, this is a southern -- let's be clear, it is a southern gothic supernatural musical, and it's set down in mississippi. talk about it. the idea and where it came from. >> joe, what happened is that i owned a -- i owned a cabin and after i bought the cabin, this is a real story. >> uh-huh. >> after i bought the cabin -- >> you don't have to say that because we make the politicians say that. >> what's that? >> this is a true story. we make them clarify, but you're a musician and an artist. >> oh, i lie all the time. >> mika, this is a true story. >> this is a true story. i buy this cabin, after i buy

the cabin the people i bought it from say, oh, by the way, the place is haunted. i went, yeah, sure. so, we fix it up and i have two little boys and i think we'll go there it's, like, 45 minutes from my house, it's on a lake. we go there and it was weird. i didn't like staying there so it was -- i didn't believe in that stuff, and so they give me these -- you know, remember they used to have the private detective magazines. >> right. >> back in the '30s and '40s and you find all the awful stuff that happened in the country, anyway, they give me these magazines of this building where these two boys were in there, they were drunk, and they were fighting over a girl, one hit one over the head with the poker and killed his brother, went to get the girl in the car and drive away and they were driving real fast on a gravel road in the '40s, they lose control and die in a lake. that's the story i told steve. >> did this happen in your cabin that you bought? >> yeah, yeah.

>> t. boone, tell us about the musical side of this story. >> swampy and dark, right? it had to be atmospheric and foggy, you know. >> yes. >> smoky, so, you know, you get to play with a lot of tone. >> we didn't want to get big orchestral "phantom of the oprah" feel. we wanted kind of an american music thing, a smaller acoustic deal. >> rosanne cash, sheryl crow. elvis costello, we'll adopt him, he's done a nashville album so we can have elvis costello. >> a great range of musicians. >> t. boone was able to pull all these team together. steve and i had been monkeying around with this thing for 10, 12, 13 years. >> yeah. >> and we needed somebody to come in and say this is working, this is not working and henry was able to kind of come in and help and direct the music and

was able to stop back and go this part of the story's not working, so he really kind of came in and was able to say -- help steve and help me and he has been a tremendous amount of success. >> t. boone, how many people do you let call you henry? >> yeah. >> does john get a pass? >> no, my friends call me henry. i like being called henry. >> maybe that's why he's got the black eye. >> that might be why he has the black eye. i guess all in order here. >> this is from a small town not much to do in the evening. >> well, you got to stay busy, man. you got to stay busy. you can't sit at home on the couch watching "wheel of fortune." you got to do something. >> apparently the guy that gave me this was busier than me. >> i guess so. but we also see you, kris kristofferson. that's a great one. to get kris back out there. >> kris is one of our very best

song writers. certainly meryl haggard and chris chrkris certainly meryl haggard and chris chrkri kristoffers kristofferson, right? it's an honor to john that kris would come sing his song and elvis would sing his song and neko is one of the very best record makers and she makes the extraordinarily beautiful deep sounding records and she's a deep soul, too. >> but she did john's best song to get all these people to do it, i think. >> i think he had ten years to write them and it's, like, a greatest hits record in a way, you know, of ten years. >> yeah. >> a lot of albums, you know, albums historically is a short period of time or gathered over a short period of time but now we've got a century of recorded music behind us and you can look at an album in all different ways and this is a big, long time to put together a group of tunes. >> and the way it worked is that steve would call me up and he'd go, john, you know, i need a

song -- you know, we need a song right here. and so it's got to say this, it's got to say that. so i didn't have to worry about, you know, because when you write songs -- i think i made, like, 27 albums or something and, you know, people like to think that the songs are about you. they're not really about you. you know, they're just songs, you know? but these songs were definitely not about me, you know, there's no way that i could write, you know -- he'd call up and say we need a sexy song by anna wririg here and she'll be here in the barroom and sexy and taunting -- >> how fun was that? >> it was great. >> totally new experience for you as a songwriter. >> it was. it was fun and it was interesting and actually it was easier than writing my own material. >> yeah. >> because you're freed from -- >> well, because steve said it needs to be about this. we need to have this. but we discovered, steve and i, after about 12 years, is that steve was telling the story and

the songs were the character development. >> yeah. >> and the emotional temperature, too. because one thing that music does that story can't always do is it brings an emotional punch to the whole thing that i just am absolutely in love. when we started this thing john told me the story and i kind of did a treatment of it, you know, and said here it is. and i said to john, well, if you want to do something like "phantom of the oprah" or "cats" or one of those deals, i'm done, because you're just going to write so these people sing to each other through the thing. he said, no, no, i want to do it more like "my fair lady" people talk blah blah blah and people talk and sing -- ♪ i feel pretty -- and then i told him what we do for songs and the son of a

gun came through every time. and this was the fun for me. i could build the in and the out from the song. it was something that was different, you know, it was fun. >> closer to the truth, you have three guys down in the basement trying to build the first soapbox and it's, like, does this brake work, t. boone, why don't you try it. do you think we'll make it? steve said it best, most creative people, dig a trench and then they decorate it and then they stay in it for the rest of their life. >> right. >> this was an opportunity for all three of us to get out of our trenches, to, like, do something different. and, you know, for me, "ghost brothers" is already a success because over the last 15 years, steve king has become, like, my brother. >> yeah, there you go. >> yeah. >> and most -- i don't play well with the other kids as you can tell. >> i can tell. >> oh, definitely i can tell. >> i don't play well with the other kids. >> look at you.

>> steve and i, have we had even one argument? >> do you know what, john doesn't have much patience with people who can't pull a plow and we pulled a plow together and t. boone got in there and pulled the plow and the three of us worked together pretty well. >> gentlemen, thank you so much for be inging on the show this morning. the musical is "ghost brothers of darkland county." john mellencamp, steven king and t. boone burnett, thank you all. you're all so cool. more "morning joe" in just a minute. ♪ the place to be but you run, run, run ♪ with the spark miles card from capital one,

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it says you all are fortunate to be able to sit next to me and my joyous presence. >> what did scruggs say? >> he said, oh, i can't find curtis b. scruggs anymore. >> he said something, like, you don't put up with -- >> yeah. we can't say that! >> no. >> all right. >> it's a family broadcast. >> and we're a family, see how well we get along. >> we all like each other. >> i like you. >> i like you, i like you, i like you.

>> p.j. oir'rourkeo'rourke. >> i like you. >> would you be quiet now? >> family value was a big issue and p.j. o'rourke said the only family value in my family was secret day time drinking. >> yes! that's a family value we can all endorse. which reminds me it's time to go to "business before the bell." in kelly's house there was no secret daytime drinking. >> no. it was all out in the open. >> it was all out in the open like you, she's probably episcopalian. kelly, how are you doing? >> good morning. doing great down here. it's a friday. >> it is? >> we had quite a rally into the close because "the wall street journal" saying that the federal reserve won't step away from the punch bowl anytime soon i'm sure that's got you feeling better this morning. >> i'm feeling great. >> what punch bowl are they stepping away from? >> here's the thing going back to may 22nd, i don't know if you remember but ben bernanke testified before congress said if the data is good enough the

federal reserve could taper or exit whatever word you use within the next couple of meetings and since then people around the world had a bit of a freak-out, there's a sense to what extent is the u.s. economy getting stronger, is it strong enough to stand on its own and what is the impact across the rest of the world so we're starting to see the ramifications there. if you've been following what's happening in turkey or to some extent in other emerging markets, there's a real sense can the economies manage to do okay when investors aren't putting their money overseas looking for better returns and instead looking for returns back home. anyway, all of that said, here's what happened. we've gotten the data that's come out and good but not great and the federal reserve trying to calm some fears saying, look, we'll have a big meeting next week, they'll have a press conference and bernanke will be out there and his tenure could be winding down and they're saying don't expect us necessarily to use this meeting as the time to really begin to exit and that helped us rally into the close yesterday. and, again, is kind of allaying

some concern especially because there are some worrying things happening over in china. >> yeah. >> you have -- >> i didn't know, kelly, a little bit, there's no fear of inflation but producer prices are a little hot today. >> yes. and what's interesting actually, brian, so now we're in this world where we don't want deflation. that's one thing we don't want. >> no. >> as long as we can talk about reflation if producer prices fit into that, price levels moving up because the economy's getting better as opposed to the kind of inflation that becomes more of a problem down the road if we can stay in the sweet spot we know markets like to be squarely in the sweet spot so the because it came in better than expected is probably better than a little bit shy. >> thank you so much, kelly. >> thank you. >> more information packed into a 90-second spot. >> brilliant. >> and shactman made up -- >> from nerd looking at consumer price index, hey, those producer prices were high. come on! >> from the nikkei.

>> i thought he was flirting. >> all right. >> this is great. >> you made that up. you made that up. >> i think he's a nerd. >> when we're back at 18% for your mort and then we'll talk about hot. >> exactly. >> exactly. coming up next former president bill clinton and also mayor rahm emanuel, they'll join us live when "morning joe" returns. ♪

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♪ behind these doors america's future is being shaped. inside you'll find some of the world's most important teachers. these aren't ivy league universities. they're homes and new research shows that what happens here during the first 5 years of your child's life will make a difference for the rest of his or her life. every parent has looked into their newborn baby's eyes and seen unlimited potential. and now we know how to help them achieve that. too small to fail is all about giving parents, families, businesses and communities the tools we need to help all our children succeed.

>> well, that's an ad from too small to fail. a youth education initiative that's being promoted by former secretary of state hillary clinton at the clinton global initiative, and joining us now from chicago former president bill clinton and former white house chief of staff and current democratic mayor of chicago, mayor rahm emanuel. gentlemen, thanks for being with us on the show this morning. >> thank you. >> thank you so much, guys. mr. president, let's start with you. we've read about too small to fail. it looks like a very exciting concept and certainly is in line with what your wife is talking about for years and what scientists have started to understand that, you know, we used to say, oh, if you don't get to a child by the time they're 12, we lose them. and then it was by the time it was 5 we lose them. more and more we're learning if we don't get to them by the time they're 2 or 3 we lose so much. >> well, we do know that an enormous part of the brain's

internal architecture is formed in the first 2 or 3 years. and we know there are some things that can be done by people if they work together in tight-knit communities without regard to the income of the families, but you got to have the involvement of the parents and you've got to have the involvement of the community. and i think that hillary believes a really big difference can be made just by organizing people to do very specific, practical things and based on the experience we've had in the fight against childhood obesity, i would say she's right. she's excited about it, and we're going to do what we can to support her. >> that's very exciting. rahm emanuel, this is, of course, the sixth-month anniversary of a very tragic date, six months ago in newtown, of course, 20 young children were killed. in newtown, connecticut, while they were in first grade. you have been suffering through this sort of violence in chicago for some time. but good news on that front over

the past six months. tell us about it. >> well, first of all, it's a comprehensive strategy, not different from what basically we took a page out of the 1994 crime bill which is about putting more police on the street and getting kids, guns and drugs off the street. we've had a saturation strategy with police in particular areas with the preponderance of gun violence and we've put 18,000 kids into after-school programs and summer job activities and what we call windy city hoops. we've also -- >> by the way, mr. mayor, we're showing a full screen right now that shows chicago homicides down 34% over the past year. go ahead, i'm sorry. >> actually as of this morning they're down actually 80 fewer homicides. but the most important thing is what i call the four "ps" that also associate with what the president has talked about, one is policing, two is parenting, that is parents have to teach their kids right from wrongs, they have to have them indoors following the curfew laws that

we have here. third is prevention, after-school programs, investments in our children, because a lot of kids want to do the right things and give them the opportunity to do that, they will choose the right thing, and then stiffer penalties so when you commit a gun crime, you serve your time. and all of that has just copied what the president initiated with the '94 crime bill that actually makes sure that our police are on the street, both kids, guns, and drugs are off the street and if you do that, you'll start to see both the reduction in homicides that we're seeing in chicago, the reduction in shooting we're seeing and overall crime is down to a record low that we haven't seen since the '60s in the city of chicago, but the most important thing is involving parents in their children's lives and i've always said, you give me 50,000 active fathers in their son's lives, and you won't have to worry about how many prevention or police officers you have and that's what's missing and it's an important ingredient and when you don't have it, you have to support it with the right type of mentoring and prevention programs to keep our kids in safe places, mentored doing good activities

where they learn a lot about themselves. >> all right. >> want to ask both of you about the task force you're working on, but, first, mr. president, you've had some pretty forceful, tough words for our current president for not being more aggressive, if i can say, if i can characterize that correctly, on syria. given the news of the past 24 hours, what do you think our options should be and what would you like to see our strategy be? >> well, first of all, i think -- i've been a little amazed by the coverage of this. i just did a question-and-answer session for senator mccain's institute, and the last or next to the last question was something about syria, and i said that i didn't think we should give up on them. and now that the iranians were in there clearly overtly with hezbollah coming out of lebanon, it's an external as well as an internal fight. i think that we should support the rebel groups more

vigorously. and the white house announced that they intend to do that, and i think that they also have now made a finding that sarin gas was used on several occasions. so, it looks to me like the president, first of all, was entitled to finish his summit with the chinese president, get this finding, be briefed, and they are now exploring their options. there are some logistical complications as you might imagine in getting more support in to them and he wants to talk to our allies and see whether they can help on that, at this upcoming g-8 meeting, it looks to me like this thing is trending in the right direction now. >> you made a great point, mr. president, if the press got this right, that you've got, of course, the syrians, you've got the iranians, you've got hezbollah, you've got the russians. all of these people that are tipping the scales in the way of a government that is killing tens of thousands of people. that begs for a response on the

other side, does it not? >> well, we've got -- yeah, i think about 90,000 people have died there and, of course, there are hundreds and hundreds of thousands of refugees. and now that it's become a lot of outsiders involved in the fight, i think that the white house has made it clear that they intend to do more. they're exploring their options. and right now they don't want to talk about the details, and i don't blame them, because the less they talk about the details, the more likely they're increased assistance is likely to be effective. and as i said, they want to see what our other allies are willing to do. so, i think on balance this should be seen as a positive story, that america has the information now about the chemical attacks. they clearly know that there are other outside powers involved trying to shore up assad and his repressive tactics and the president will be given the opportunity to talk to a lot of

his counterparts at the g-8 meeting. let's see what happens. i do understand why they don't want to talk in a lot of detail about whatever they decided to do and rahm does, too, and about the logistics of getting any kind of extra assistance into them. >> right. so, let's talk about cgi america and why you're in chicago and what you and mayor emanuel have been doing -- >> because of the blackhawks. >> i saw your brother yesterday on set wearing a blackhawks t-shirt. >> very tight. >> it was too tight for a guy his age. >> very tight. >> you and i know that -- >> we're here because they played the two overtime games. >> we're actually here because the president wanted some tickets and i got them for him. it's that simple. >> there you go. maybe you can send ari a t-shirt. >> send ari a t-shirt that fits. this whole infrastructure stuff it's just a ruse! they want to see the stanley cup play-offs! but let's pretend -- >> it's actually -- >> go ahead. >> actually building a paved road all the way to the -- actually to the stadium. >> very good. >> it makes sense. >> let's talk about

infrastructure. obviously the united states you fly in from overseas to the united states and sometimes you think you're going -- you're coming into a third world country with some of our airports, our roads, our bridges. it's deplorable. >> well, here's the thing, you know, we met last year here in chicago. the president convened a group of mayors to discuss different ways to finance infrastructure, whether it's airports, mass transit systems, parks, schools, roads, water systems. there is a dire need in america, every city has it, and it unlocks huge amount of economic growth and job creation. and every mayor has not only more needs than they have resources, but they have to look at creative ways to finance it. and the president brought us together. we now have a working group of about 12 mayors under president clinton's jurisdiction and direction, and are coming up with innovative ways to meet our needs because there's not the resources coming out of washington and our state capitals to meet all the

obligations. and the cities in these respective states are the ones driving the overwhelming economic energy and economic activity. we just made an announcement at our airport for the city of chicago -- >> that's great. >> -- huge potential, it's 3,000 jobs. but when we keep o'hare in the forefront of economic and modernization, it allows the rest of the economy of the city of chicago to grow exponentially. and the president's been very helpful for all of us thinking through different ways of making these type of investments that have a multiplier effect on job creation. and we're doing it on our mass transit. when we're done in five years, every child's going to be within a seven-minute walk of a new park and that has huge potential for neighborhood economic development as well. >> that's fantastic, i like that. >> let me say one other thing about this. the one area where america which generally is more of a free enterprise, let the private sector do it country than a lot of our let's say european counterparts, even some of our asian counterparts, the one area

where we have lagged behind is in attracting private capital to public infrastructure. everything from water and sanitation systems to parks to modern airports and other transit. and rahm has really pioneered this in chicago. when the infrastructure bank which used to have a great deal of bipartisan support teamis ys be going nowhere in washington that would guarantee a good rate of return then he established in effect the country's first urban infrastructure bank in chicago. and he's got a lot of people across party lines and all sectors of the economy involved in it. and so what we're trying to do is to get other cities to do the same thing. and i think and hope if the congress takes up this tax reform issue, particularly on corporate tax reform, that they will look again at the infrastructure bank. it's a way to get a lot of private investment in to doing public infrastructure.

the investors will make money and america's economy will grow and a whole lot of good jobs will be created. >> great. >> there's no mayors and i can tell you in the city of chicago if you take an investment, we're about to build our river walk in downtown, that's going to unlock a huge amount of economic investment in office construction, residential construction, restaurants and retail, and every investment you make on a public side on an investment like infrastructure at an airport or river walk unleashes other type of investment and every mayor in this united states has an opportunity to do something without the financial support of the federal or state capitals, we have to come with innovative ways to do it and the cgi has been at the forefront of thinking of those models and creative ways to allow us to meet our obligations to our cities and our residents. >> great. jon meacham? >> mr. president, just quickly back to guns, in part of the country where you and i come from there's a sense, i think, that people are not in favor of commonsense gun safety laws.

first of all, do you agree with that premise? and how can we get that argument made in what the more conservative parts of the country about the importance of these kinds of laws? >> well, i think, first of all, i don't agree with it. i had a friend from the arkansas ozarks tell me a few months ago when i was home that he had a good friend who lived in the mountains who had 100 guns, he said the guy owns 100 guns and wished he owned 100 more and strongly supports universal background checks, he can't figure out why it's okay under the second amendment to do a background check if they buy a gun at a gun store or not online or at a gun show. so, i don't agree with that. i think what happens is if you tread on this, the nra or the gun owners of america will run an ad against you or billboard against you and say you're trying to take their guns away and then people get into this hunker-down mode where they

don't want to take a chance. but i think if you're willing to fight through this, we could make this argument. that's why joe manchin from west virginia and senator toomey, the republican senator from pennsylvania, both of them, big, big gun states, offered the bill they did. and, you know, i just remember when they didn't get their 60 votes that senator lisa mruczkowski of alaska said that she thought with a little tweaking on individual gun sales, they could bring it up again and get their 60 votes. i think if they could do that, you would see a majority support in the country. what's going on is that these organized forest groups don't want anything done because it's a big source of their money and support to terrify people living out there in the country and trying to make them think there's this big conspiratorial federal government trying to take all their guns away. i think if you could get a clear-headed vote on the issue standing alone, the overwhelming majority of americans in every

state would be for it. >> all right. thank you, guys, so much. thank you, mr. president. >> president clinton, mayor emanuel, thank you very much. appreciate what you're doing out there. okay. >> did i mention the blackhawks to you? >> yes, you did. and tell ari he maybe needs to get a t-shirt that fits. >> maybe a medium t-shirt. >> thank you very much. >> we'll be back after a break. i work for 47 different companies. well, technically i work for one. that company, the united states postal service® works for thousands of home businesses. because at usps.com® you can pay, print and have your packages picked up for free. i can even drop off free boxes. i wear a lot of hats. well, technically i wear one. the u.s. postal service®, no business too small. ♪ even if it's so wrong ♪ i wanna scream out loud ♪ boy, but i just bite my tongue ♪

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