voice him f praise him for giving vois to wounded warriors. >> i liked him in true romance and even in "get shorty." he had a good role there when he turned to the other side on travolta's side. we're going to talk more about this on this on "morning joe," which starts right now. are you in the mafia? >> am i in the what? >> whatever you want to call it, organized crime? >> that's total crap, who told you that? >> dad, i have lived in the house my whole life. i have seen the police go, i see you go out at 3:00 a.m. >> so you have never seen him go out on a call? >> with a .45 automatic while hunting for easter eggs? >> i'm in the business. everybody assumes you are in the mob. it's a stereotype and it's

offensive. and you're the last one i want to perpetuate it. >> fine. >> the entertainment world is reeling today on the news of the passing of james gandolfini who died up expected of cardiac arrest while vacationing in italy. what gandolfini established with hbo was nothing short of a tv revolution. david chase remembers him as a jeeps you actor and by any measurement his role as tony soprano broke ground for tv dramas. >> i came in today to tell you, in all seriousness, that i'm done. i did what you said. i gave it a lot of thought and i decided, once and for all, it's over. the truth is, this therapy is a jerk-off. you know it and i know it. >> americans found themselves rooting for a villain, a mob

boss. tony soprano killed people, but of course he was also a caring father, a loyal friend, and his emmy-award performance paved the way for a new era. "newsweek" predicted in 2001 that "the sopranos" has the rest of tv running for its life. other networks followed suit, and gandolfini and the lead showtime launched "dexter." he was also walter white in "breaking bad." thanks to walter white and james gandolfini. >> he appeared in" zero dark thirty" and nominated for a tony award in the broadway comedy "god of carnage" starring jeff daniels. in a 2009 appearance on "inside the actors studio," gandolfini was asked this question by host

james lipton. >> if heaven exists, what would you like to hear god say when you arrive at the pearly gates? >> take over for a while, i'll be right back. no, no, no. no, no, no. >> that's it. you dare not change it. it's too good. >> think of the possibilities. >> and holsted's diner in bloomfield, new jersey, the iconic location of the final scene of "the sopranos" offered its own moving tribute. a reserved sign on gandolfini's team. >> good morning, everyone. it is thursday morning, welcome to "morning joe." with us we have senior political analyst mark halperin and new york film critic here as well. and senator claire mccaskill

will be here with her first tv interview since announcing her support for hillary in 2016. also, an exclusive with senator joe manchin who responds to the nra attack ad we have been showing you with an out-of-his-own. he'll play it first here on "morning joe." but first, more reaction to reaction of the passing of james gandolfini. willie geist, your thoughts. >> there's a lot to be said, but we were talking backstage, tony and i, about the most iconic characters of the last 25 years. of this general ration, maybe the generation before that, and we couldn't come up with money more dramatic than james gandolfini. you could say james seinfeld. he was as big as it gets. you talk about his impact on television. people forget what tv looked like before 1999 when "the so

pre pranos" came along. tony soprano on tv was the first of that and he's the reason you have a lot of actors now looking for jobs calling hbo and racing to the door of hbo before they go anywhere else, because that and now other networks are where great television is made. >> it's unbelievable. >> that did not exist in 1999 when "the sopranos" came along. >> tony scott not only changed television but it changed the balance of power. i remember a column by andrew stanley in "the times" talking at when we would go to school, you would go in the morning and you would stand around the water cooler and talk about "the stain" or "jaws." people don't remember, this is a good time to talk about it. the demarcation of 1999 when "the sopranos" came on shifted

and that's when we stopped talking so much about the movies we saw and instead started talking about the tv series we saw on cable. >> people began to say, what you hear routinely now about the television shows are better than movies as far as the writing, the acting and the complexity of the character, the sort of narrative sweep. and it changed a lot or helped to change a lot about our viewing habits. i mean, i'm remembering what i was doing in 1999. i started subscribing to hbo because of "the sopranos." i heard about it and missed the first season. it's the first time i bought a tv show, i think it was then vhs. >> that's what mika was saying last night, she remembers watching it last night. she said, i sat there dumbfounded that i was paying for a channel. so i could watch a tv show. >> and the phenomenon of bing watching which gets talking about like the netflix original content and the way people watch whole seasons in a weekend.

"the sopranos" started that. one more episode, one more episode, one more episode. it is 3:00 in the morning and you're still hooked in there. it also started the criticism and the phenomenon of the recap, which is now on the internet, every single show has dozens of people coming in the morning after it airs to talk about it, to analyze it, to break it down online. that started with "the sopranos," too. a whole new way of reviewing and processing these stories. >> joining us by phone, new york times national reporter bill carter. bill, we were just talking about the dynamics between tv and movies, how it changed, but just staying in the realm of television series, this has to be up there along with "i love lucy," "all in the family," "mash" and a few other tv series that changed everything. >> there's no doubt about it.

i think you have to really look at the cultural impact because i think that has shifted focus on drama from films to tell vision. but also hbo was a movie channel and all of a sudden it was a tv channel. if they can do it, everyone thought, we can do it. it is something people watched -- it was not the same story every week. this show really got you involved and it changed how story-telling is done on television. >> all right. we are going to try to get a better connection. we have so many different angles. i don't know how -- i was just completely shocked at what a massive loss this is. when you really think about if you were asked a name, the big complicated male stars of our time, maybe his name didn't come to mind, tony, but it should have. and we realize now looking at his body of work he started it all. and that complicated, cruel but

wonderful and lovable and passionate male character started with tony soprano, did it not? >> i think so. the idea that you could have a character who wasn't just, you know, a little bit dark or a little complicated, but if you look up what he does, he's monstrous. he's always, you know, cheating on his wife, betrays his friends in the end, all of them. killing people and so on. and yet, you know, you identify with him, you relate to him, you love him. you're fascinated by him. and it is an extraordinary performance. we have been talking about the show as a large phenomenon and the writing and the directing and all that is very important, but you need to have the guy you're looking at, whose face you're looking at, convey that and make you care. >> and he did. he really did. it was also remarkable for the first time that you had a television series where, and now you hear people saying this,

well, i'll be talking to my son, and he'll say, i think what they are trying to do in "madmen" this season, this entire season, i remember saying through the second season and third season of "the sopranos" after the third or fourth episode, we are just talking at tony's psychological state. when are the bodies going to start piling up? this isn't "the godfather." but it took tony soprano and james gandolfini to be able to sit in that chair and make his counseling sessions as critical as his -- to the show, as his decision as who he's going to kill to protect the family. >> that was the greatness, it was not cartoonish. it was not an old mob television show. mark, you saw every episode of it, it was, yes, there was plenty of violence, but it was

not all about the big italian guys going out to decide how to kill people. there were layers and sensitivity. i think in the first episode he looks at lorain rocco and says, whatever happened to larry cooper? we are also in touch with our feelings and that set the tone for the kind of character he was going to be. >> incredible show with a lot of great people in the cast and directing, but he was the center of it. the father of the modern golden age of television without a doubt. and an incredible actor, i was looking last night on youtube at scene after scene, including the final scene, and the guy is perfect in every scene. such a craftsman. every scene with drama, emotion, humor, he was asked why he didn't do comedy, and he said, people didn't really ask him. but that show was really funny, brilliantly funny along with everything else. >> willie, you talked about the layers, his relationship with his children and the guys in the

show, and obviously one that touched a lot of people was the one with his wife. there was no struggle between tony soprano and his wife carmello played by edie falco. take a listen. >> the last year i have been dreaming and fantasizing and in love with furio. every morning when he would come to pick you up, i would look forward to it all night long in bed next to you. those nights when you were actually in the bed. and he would ring the doorbell, i felt like my heart would come out of my chest, he would smile and we'd talk. and then you would come down the stairs. and i felt probably like someone who was terminally ill, and somehow they managed to forget it for a minute. and then it all comes back.

>> you watch those clips, you are taken back to james gandolfini, but the cast, he wouldn't have been as great without edie falco. >> you see acting on stage but it is not that precise and intense. and the two of them, one of the great wildly disfunctional but fascinating marriages on television. and it takes -- you see kind of, in a lot of these shows, i think, the -- not just sort of the dark heroes who are the kind of magnetic center of them, but these ensembles. i think that's true on "madmen" as well and certainly on "breaking bad" where it's a whole world, family and set of associations that's organized around this fascinating and troubling and just endless and interesting figure. and to do that as an actor, i

think it's an enormous opportunity for him who had been a struggling, working actor in new york for a long time before that who didn't maybe have movie star leading man looks to get a role like this. and to be able to dig into it and extend it across all of those seasons of narratives, just an amazing thing to witness. i mean, it really does -- hearing the news yesterday just took me back to every episode and every season. you would just sit down and watch it and say, what's going to happen next? what are we going to see next? where is this going to take us? >> joining us now on the phone is author allen sepenwall who writes about james gandolfini's role on "the sopranos" in his book. the cops, crooks, slingers and slayers who changed tv drama forever. and, allen, "the sopranos" themselves and tony soprano were

groundbreaking. >> absolutely. everything you have been saying about what it meant to tell vision is true and all of it comes from gandolfini. and tony chase said tony soprano wouldn't have become the character he did if it weren't for what gandolfini did early in the series. >> talk about that specifically. what were some of the things he did, certainly the first season caught so many people's attention. people like tony scott who missed the first season, understood, we had no choice as functioning members in american society, but to tune in to the opening night of the second season. >> well, i mean, chase said originally he envisioned it as much more of a comedy and gandolfini came in and said wait a minute, this is serious now. there's a moment near the end of the pilot where christopher announces he wants to go to hollywood to write a screen play and tony is not happy about this. in the script it says tony slaps christopher lightly across the

face. and instead gandolfini picked him up off the floor, shoved him against the wall and said he was not happy. he said, this is serious, this is who this guy is and that shaped the character and the tone going forward. there were no compromises. there was always compromise and anti-heros to that point. there was always something redeemable about them, and gandolfini made no apologies for who he was. >> the pilot started with the slap and the shove. christopher was a son by him and it ended with him closing his nostrils and having christopher die that way. it is also important to point out that tony soprano was born from james gandolfini's life character. his mother was a lunch lady, his father the head custodian at the high school. he lived this, he went back to

italy all the time, italian was spoken in his home. this was not a reach for him culturally, but it was not a far reach to walk into the character, speak the language, live the lifestyle. he's a great american story to have a lunch lady mother and a father custodian and go to the heights he didn't is quite an achievement in itself. >> so many different layers of this story. and i was just reading some of the background here, this was envisioned as a movie. it could have been completely a different road. we have reactions from others hearing about the passing of james gandolfini including governor kris christie who said, it's an awful shock. james gandolfini was a fine actor, a rutgers alum and a true jersey guy. i was a huge fan of his and the character he played so authentically, tony soprano. i have got on the know jimmy and many of the other actors and can say each of them are a new jersey treasure. >> and the creator of "the

sopranos" james chase, david chase, said he was a genius. anyone who saw him in the smallest of his performance knows that. he is one of the greatest actors of this or any time. a great deal of that genius resided in those eyes. he wasn't easy sometimes, but he was my partner. he was my brother. tony scott, thank you so much for being with us. we greatly appreciate it. allen, thank you as well. you literally wrote the book on how "the sopranos" changed everything. and coming up, we have much more on this. >> yes, james lipton is joining us more on the life and career of james gandolfini. also ahead, chris matthews on the call to cut america's arsenal. we'll get an exclusive look at joe man chip's ad hitting back to the nra. and senator claire mccaskill is supporting hillary in 2016.

up next, jeremy peters is joining us for the other big stories of the morning. ben bernanke in the news in a big way, but first here's bill karins with a check on the forecast. good morning to everyone on this last day of spring. we officially welcome in summer a couple minutes after midnight tonight on the east coast. this story out there so far, this late spring season, has been the fires. they have been horrible out there in colorado and areas of arizona, new mexico. we have a high fire danger day today. red flag warnings everywhere in red. we have 19 large incident fires burning on the map right now. so this is just an area where it will be very, very dangerous. also, tropical storm barry is now making landfall north of vera cruz, mexico. it became the b-name yesterday. it will die off today. the troublesome weather is already in the northern plains just south of fargo. and later on this afternoon, minneapolis to omaha, watch out for strong storms. everyone on the east coast on this last day of spring, a beautiful day with sunshine and

low humidity. enjoy it while it lasts. it's going to heat up as we go towards the weekend. you're watching "morning joe." brewed by starbucks. nice day in new york city. i'm the next american success story. working for a company

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mika, like you said before, we'll talk to james lipton and others throughout the three hours this morning about james gandolfini and the remarkable changes he made to the entertainment industry, culture, but we also have a lot of news to cover as well. so many things going on. we've got a study out right now, 41% to 42% of small business openers are saying they are freezing, hiring because of the health care plan that's coming

into effect. of course, the president, democrats are going to figure out what changes to make there, but the really big news on the economy came yesterday. obviously, with ben bernanke. >> joining me is former treasury official and analyst steve rattner. also, we have new york times reporter jeremy peters. good to have you both onboard. we'll start with ben bernanke. he expressed confidence in the nation's economic growth yesterday saying the fed will start to rein in its stimulus program later this year. bernanke laid out the federal reserves plan, which includes tapering off its multibillion bond-buying program until the unemployment rate drops to 7%. the fed expects that to happy the middle of next year. >> that's great news, right? >> in some way. >> so that's the good news. what bad news could there be from that, steve rattner. >> i think we'll find out. >> the fed will also hold off on raising interest rates keeping

them to near zero until unemployment falls to 6.5%. as for wall street's response, this may be where things change. the markets took a dive as soon as bernanke started speaking. by 3:05 the dow fell 140 points closing the day down more than 200, steve rattner. >> i wouldn't freak out over that considering that the market is so inflated right now anyway, but we'll talk about how bernanke signaled that things are going to be changing moving forward. >> what we are arguing about here or talking about rather is defense bond-buying program where they have been buying bonds. so we have a chart that basically illustrates this. if you go back to before the financial crisis, the fed owned something less than a trillion dollars of bonds, mortgage bonds, treasuries and so on. during the crisis they have been buying heavily and now they are up to something like 3.5 trillion dollars of the stuff. in the first quarter of this year, the fed bought 80% of all

the new treasury that is were issued. this is what people call printing money, this is what the fed does when it can't push interest rates down further and wants to stimulate the economy. it got the markets going yesterday and bernanke said the time could be coming where we are going to stop buying in the fall or taper down buying in the fall and stop buying next year. why did he say this? because they have a much more optimistic view of the economy. here's a chart to give you a flavor for what the economists are looking at, which is projected monthly job growth. now, we know the economy is still not doing everything we want, but over the past year private economists have gone from predicting something like 140,000 jobs a month over the coming year and now predicting something like 187,000 jobs a month. >> that would be great. it's still below where we want to be. but the new normal is 130 to 140. if the new normal changes to 180, maybe week get over that. the 200,000 mark is what

economists say time and time again if you want to keep things going in the right direction. you have to create at least 200,000 jobs. >> it feels like that number keeps going up. it used to keep trading water but now it moved up to 200,000. >> this is not great. we'll have high unemployment for another six to seven years, but the point is the outlook is getting better with the fed making projections yesterday. so bernanke is talking about reducing the bond program. it is like taking an addict off his methadone. it's a withdrawal process. >> you don't do that. >> the bond market doesn't like that. and you can see on the next chart what's happening to interest rates because bernanke is hinting at this. he hinted at it back in early may. he hinted at it again late in may. then you have yesterday, and over this period of time, treasuries have gone from 1.6%, 1.6% to about 2.5%. and for the average american, this has consequences because

the 30-year mortgage rate has gone from 3.5% to about 4%. and it will keep going up. >> that's the politics of it all. we have lived, i mean, it's been a tough decade for so many people, but money has been free when it comes to borrowing. that's going to change on cars, on homes, on student loans, on small business loans. things are going to get even tougher. >> you know, obviously the short-term ration on the markets is one thing, but people are talking about what are the actual implications of this. is it going to stop the economic growth and the momentum the economy has had and you can't tell. but bernanke is a pretty thoughtful guy. and obviously there's reasons to do this, but i think they are going to see in a current environment because things are still pretty fragile, a lot of second guessing. jeremy, let me ask you about congress and the reaction to this. we are going to have a new fed

chair and the republican party is pretty divided on the role of the fed in general, but more specifically what kind of input do you think congress is going to have on this question of, this fed action and the identity of the new head of the fed? >> right. well, of course, when president obama nominates a new head of the fed, which will happen probably later this year, the senate will ultimately have to confirm that person. in the senate these days nothing gets done easily. when you have a government entity as divisive as the fed is, in the minds of some republicans, like rand paul, some senator republicans, i don't see this process going very smoothly. >> all right. we have other news -- >> the prospeaking of a process not going smoothly. >> president obama's signature piece of legislation is not having a good result according to a study of over 600 business owners. 41% say they have frozen hiring because of obama care. 19% said they have reduced their

number of employees because of the affordable care act. and another 38% said they have pulled back on their plans for growth because of the law. obama changes are expected to go online october 1st with a new report freezing that into doubt. the wall street journal editorial board says in part this, on wednesday the auditors at the government accountability office released the results of two investigations and optimistically conclude that it cannot yet be determined if the affordable care act will be ready for enrollment a mere four months from now. the gao's detail portrayed a blown deadline, regulatory improvisation and general chaos explains why hhs hasn't been anti-transparent. if hhs had any appreciation for basic accountability it would release the facts itself instead of going dark and running obamacare as a black-ops mission. >> okay. jeremy peters, i'm not going to ask you to respond to the "wall

street" editorial page, but let's talk about democrats. i've heard it, you have heard it, democrats in the senate especially have been frantic over the past six months worried that kathleen sebelius and hhs and the obama administration are going to respond too slowly to all the hiccups in this system. and it's going to hurt them in 2014. talk about what democrats are saying behind the scenes on capitol hill. >> well, i mean, i think that is the lingering question going into the august recesses. you remember back in 2010 what provided a lot of oxygen for the tea party movement was this fury over obamacare. people went into town hall meetings and they made a situation that was very politically hostile for the president. you're going to have that same time period coinciding with the rollout of obama care later this summer. so i think there's a lot of

anxiety among democrats if this doesn't go smoothly that this is not going to bode well for the president or democrats. republicans, meanwhile, are putting a lot of faith, a lot of stock in that obama care will be rolled out smoothly and that it will be a gigantic mess. and they are looking to seize on that and help them kind of carry some political momentum going into next year. >> well, we'll see about that, steve rattner. of course, this entire program to quote churchill, it's been a mystery wrapped in what is a riddle-wrapped enigma, something like that. bruschetta tasted great with the right wine, but it is going to be a challenge. i opposed this from the beginning. i don't say this as a republican or a conservative, i say this as a political observer talking to democrats and measuring their attitudes and their body language on capitol hill,

they're really concerned this is going to be a rocky start and that this administration is going to respond too slowly. and they're going to be the ones left hanging out there politically. >> it's interesting if you track the popularity or lack of it of the affordable care act. it was quite unpopular when it was passed. right before the election the president got it up to even or better than even, made a good case on the campaign trail why this was a good thing to do. now in the wake of these kinds of stories it is slipping back again. there's one other thing happening at the same time which was more positive, the health care exchanges are going to affect the state that allow individuals and small business to buy their health care more cheaply. >> in california we hear the california project. >> prices coming in. >> they seem to be going well. >> prices coming in cheaper and there could be an offset to that, but it's going to be messy and that's going to be tough for the democrats politically if it is. >> willie, i'm not talking about what i believe, i have been very clear for a couple years, i'm against this. so that's not new.

so i wouldn't even say it on tv because people know it, but i'm talking at what the most powerful democrats on capitol hill have been saying behind the scenes. they're worried about it. and i think that's -- this is the greatest challenge going into 2014 and they agree. this is a great challenge. >> and that's probably why the p.r. is very important for the white house, not just for the messaging because they need x million people to get on the roles of this to be solvent. they need somewhere like 30 million to enroll it in. if they don't get that, it fails. coming up next, we'll make a turn to the sports. the stanley cup finals. 11 goals scored in game four. the blackhawks and the bruins. this one going to overtime again. also, new details in the murder investigation that has been connected to patriots'

tight end aaron hernandez. he's not a suspect. we are certainly talking to him. those stories are next in sports. ♪ the secret is out. hydration is in. [ female announcer ] only aveeno daily moisturizing lotion has an active naturals oat formula that creates a moisture reserve so skin can replenish itself.

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time for some sports. this is a good stanley cup final already and we have already played four games. the bruins hosting the blackhawks in game four. bruins up two games to one in. let's go right to the third, chicago up 5-4. boston scores the tying goal there with 8:00 left. then in o.t. ten minutes in, this happens. >> he's taken on -- shooting and that ricocheting off. he tries to play it and that is blocked by bergeron. score! the blackhawks have won it! >> brent seabrooke scores the game-winning goal in overtime. the blackhawks tie the series at two games apiece as they head back to chicago. this is a great series. >> what a great series, like you

said willie before, two great towns. it's no better than this, two of the original nhl teams. >> the original six and three overtime games out of four so far. and probably three more games to go. great series. wow. some other sports news, the case involving aaron hernandez. police are questioning him in connection with the death of a man found less than a mile away from his home in massachusetts. now the local district attorney has identified the man as oden lloyd, a player for the boston bandits whose death was ruled a homicide. he has a connection to hernandez but they are not elaborating. also, hernandez shot a connecticut man after an argument at a strip club. according to nfl.com, the shooting caused alexander bradley to lose his right eye. the gun did not have the proper license. hernandez not yet a suspect in this case in boston. they are certainly talking to

him a lot and going through his home. baseball, yankees and dodgers in a doubleheader, don matingly makes his return to the bronx. the first two times the teams have played here since in 1981 world series. bottom of the six, ichiro home run to right field. then bernie wells with a pop-up in front of the pitcher's mound. he tries to make the play, he boots it and throws it to center field. >> how much did they pay him? >> the yankees win the game, 6-4. the night cap dodger rookie sensation, he goes deep in the top of the seventh. l.a. gets a little redemption here, but they are struggling this year. they win the game 6-0. the dodgers in the last game nl west. eight games out. it a games out. >> they have so many good players on that team. >> they have spent a lot of money and guys are not delivering. they had this one kid, the rookie, beyond that they are not

swinging. and i think donnie baseball is a little worried about his job in l.a. right now. coming up next, the chief political correspondent for cnn david brody is here. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. ♪ man: how did i get here? dumb luck? or good decisions? ones i've made. ones we've all made.

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and didn't know where to start. a contractor before at angie's list, you'll find reviews on everything from home repair to healthcare written by people just like you. no company can pay to be on angie's list, so you can trust what you're reading. angie's list is like having thousands of close neighbors, where i can go ask for personal recommendations. that's the idea. before you have any work done, check angie's list. find out why more than two million members count on angie's list. angie's list -- reviews you can trust. i love you, angie. sorry, honey. congestion, for it's smog. but there are a lot of people that do ride the bus.

and now that the busses are running on natural gas, they don't throw out as much pollution to the earth. so i feel good. i feel like i'm doing my part to help out the environment. 45 past the hour. here with us now for the must read opinion pages from washington, chief political correspondent for cbn news, david brody. good to have you on board this morning. i got a must read from "the washington post" i'm going to read in just a moment, but first

anger directed at the federal government and the irs was enough for hundreds of americans to gather in protest yesterday in the nation's capital. the audit irs rally was to paint the government enemy number one. it did not stop them from implicated the nsa and the epa with government corruption. notable speakers include senator ted cruz and rand paul along with representative dave camp and michele bachmann and conservative pundit glenn beck. tea party organizers called the rally their largest event since 2010. >> and, david, as dana mill writes in "the washington post," marco rubio is also a target. this is the republican party going into the 2014 elections and trying to take the white house back. right now it has a little bit of

intermural battling going on. >> there's no question about that. and the front lines of that intermural battle, to a degree, is rubio and rand paul. i mean, if you looked at their speeches the other day at the freedom and faith coalition down in washington, d.c., they both talked a kind of different brand of christianity. you know, rand paul talking more about that libertarian, we are not going to send any sort of money overseas to any folk that is are persecuting christians. and marco rubio saying as christians we have a place in this world as america. we need to kind of go in and fight evil. the good verse evil battle, the ronald reagan mentality. there really is a microcosm of what's going on in the gop. >> isn't it fascinating to watch the fact that marco rubio over the past six months has been moving a little bit left, a little bit right, and right now he finds himself at this moment on top of the fault line that is -- i won't say splitting the

republican party because every party has these intermural battles that we are talking about, but marco seems to be, have one foot on both sides and it seems like he's getting torn from both sides now. >> well, i think you're absolutely right, joe. and i think this is part of the danger and the potholes ahead for marco rubio. look, there's a lot of vitrial spewed to marco rubio, especially from folks down in florida. they are not happy and it is not just immigration, but they start to see rubio as the gop main establishment figure, a big part of the tea party's mojo. and who can benefit from this? here's rand paul, let's be honest, he has been very shrewd, very politically smart and not tone deaf at all when it comes to how you role out certain issues and how you, in essence, frame any of these issues.

and look, the privacy issue, nsa, doj, the tea party targeting, all of it setting up very well for rand paul if he plays his cards right. >> jeremy, let me add ted cruz to the mix along with rubio and rand paul, how are tray treated by more experienced senators in the republican party on capitol hill now. you think about barack obama in 2008, he was endorsed and supported by a lot of democratic senators, are any of those three young republican senators sort of catching on with being seen by leaders by the older ones? >> you have people like john mccain who famously called the tea party senators the wacko ones. but on the other hand, you look to the leader of the senate, mitch mcconnell, who showed great difference to rand paul. he's, of course, in a very -- he's in a re-election battle and the thing he fears the most is looking too far apart

ideologically from this rising star in the republican party. >> david brody, let's talk really quickly about i think jimmy bringing up a great point, you have mitch mcconnell who certainly is not loved by tea party members. he tried, in fact, to defeat rand paul in the primary election in kentucky back in 2010. he came up short and he realized he had to make a political marriage of convenience. if you're john mccain, maybe you can call a lot of these hard-charging tea party members wacko birds, but if you're interested in getting re-elected in places other than arizona, that may not be the smartest thing to do. >> well, that's right. let's remember rand paul is one of the folks associated with the paul family. he is very close to rand paul and is running mitch mcconnell's re-election campaign. there's some smartness to coin some sort of word out there on both sides. i mean, mitch mcconnell's start to dip into the tea party world

and rand paul, quite frankly, smart enough to kind of have jesse benton as kind of a bridge, if you will, to leadership. rand paul is very interesting because he is starting to play his cards right within capitol hill and outside capitol hill. it is a fine line for sure. and it's something that quite frankly i think rand paul can get away with. why? because he seems to have more of that tea party street cred and can get by with more on capitol hill. >> marco rubio is found if you go too far toward the establishment and actually try to work too much inside washington and actually get things done, then suddenly your street cred collapses and people say nasty things about you at capitol hill rallies. >> yesterday when his name was announced, he were booed like he were harry reid. think about that for a minute.

this guy -- >> i would rather not. >> hold on. >> no, but this guy was, you know, the great hope for the tea party. he was the tea party senator and now is being booed at their rallies. >> jeremy peters, thank you. david, thank you. >> david is profiling me tonight. >> he is. it's going to be great. he could cut me up into little pieces. >> the industry word is it's a bit-piece. did you hear the story about george zimer, the man who founded men's wearhouse? >> you'll like the way you look. >> he's the founder. >> he's iconic. thrown out on his well-tailored coaster by the board at his own company.

we'll explain that story next. i am an american success story. i'm a teacher. i'm a firefighter. i'm a carpenter. i'm an accountant. a mechanical engineer. and i shop at walmart. truth is, over sixty percent of america shops at walmart every month. i find what i need, at a great price. and the money i save goes to important things.

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oh, yes, willie, it's time for decades. this guy has been selling us -- >> i don't want to hear this. >> if you have gone to a wedding, you have rented a

tuxedo from this guy. >> where do i go? i go to men's warehouse, right? >> you're going to like the way you look. i guarantee it. i guarantee it. i guarantee it. i guarantee it. >> you're going to like the way you look, i guarantee it, said george zimmer far the last quarter century. he's the founder of the men's wearhouse. now he's been fired by the very company he built. >> firing the founding? >> you can't do that. >> the company shares fell 6% during trading yesterday and zimmer told cnbc he expressed concern to the board of directors about the company's direction and for that was thrown out by the board. he said, quote, over the past several months i have expressed my concern about the direction of the company. the board has inappropriately chosen to silence my concerns and termination as executive officer. >> willie, who would fire this guy? who would fire steve jobs? >> he's the man. oh, yeah, he was fired. >> and george zimmer, you can't

do that. they better bring him back. >> they won't survive. >> the workers were trying to get him out and he wouldn't go gracefully so he went less gracefully. >> what are they going to do without that face and the voice? he's getting paid for four years and they can use it forever. george zimmer, icon. next up, you won't let me speak. kris matthews is joining the discussion. also, james lipton. and the new yorker ken auletta on the passing of james gandolfini. back in a moment. let's get the ball rolling. in parks across the country, families are coming together to play, stay active, and enjoy the outdoors. and for the last four summers, coca-cola has asked america to

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are you in the mafia? >> am i in the what? >> whatever you want to call it, organized crime. >> that's total crap. who told you that? >> dad, i have lived in the house all my life. i have seen police go with warrants, i have seen you go out at 3:00 in the morning. >> you have never seen doc go out at 3:00 a.m. in the morning on a call? >> with a .43 weapon? >> it's offensive. and you're the last person i want to perpetuate it.

>> fine. >> the entertainment world is reeling today on the news of passing of james gandolfini who died unexpectedly of cardiac arrest vacationing in italy. what james gandolfini established with hbo was nothing short of a tv revolution. >> david chase the creator of "the sopranos" remembers him as a jeeps you actor and his role as tony soprano broke ground for tv dramas. >> i came in today to tell you n all seriousness, that i'm done. i did what you said. i gave it a lot of thought, and i decided, once and for all, it's over. the truth is, this therapy is a jerk-off. you know it, and i know it. >> americans found themselves rooting for a villain, a mob boss. tony soprano killed people but

he was also sometimes a caring father, a loyal friend. his emmy-winning performance paved the way for a new era. >> "news week" said in 2001 why "the sopranos" has the rest of tv running for its life. other networks followed suit and hbo and gandolfini, they brought on "madmen" with walter white in "breaking bad." >> mark halperin is still at the table. we have ken auletta and from washington the host of msnbc's "hardball," chris matthews. we have a lot to get to. senator claire mccaskill will be here since supporting hillary clinton in 2016. also, an exclusive with senator joe manchin who responds to the nra attack ad we showed you here with an ad of his own.

he'll play it first here on "morning joe." first, we are talking at the death of james gandolfini and ken auletta, you can go back through tv history, "i love lucy," "all in the family," "mash," "the sopranos," these shows changed television and popular culture. >> i think it did. look at what's happening today, people who used to be in the movie business who aspire to make movies now aspire to make tv series because they have more freedom to do that. >> chris matthews, give us a sense, first of all, of your thoughts. he was 51 years old. vacationing in italy with his family at the time of his passing. it hit us all like a ton of bricks. >> yeah, and the italian thing is that he died in italy. so much about being an italian

head of the family. i like the way you did that, joe, the way you put that together, i was thinking except for "i love lucy" we have a guy trying to hold a family together. whether it is archie or whoever trying to hold things together, they are always coming apart on them. maybe it is his fault in some cases, but with the kid with a mouthy problem, the wife is not happy, the crazy russian who disappears, ralphie, he's trying to hold it together and he has a heart that you keep rooting for. then the cute bar girl that gave him the bred that time and he throws it in the trash can and saids, bread? then he knocks off the guy who beat her up. so there's something there that you root for. you're right, joe. >> there's a line of demarcation in television. in 1999 when this show began, i think it's easy to forget what tv looked like before 1999

because we have become so accustomed to shows like "the sopranos" and "madmen." these did not exist before "the sopranos" came along. >> you think of hbo, they were movie channels and now have original programming, which is amazing. but great literature or a great novel is about complexity. you get into the complexity of a character and how interesting they are. and all the surprises, there's no mythology. they are real heart-beating things with tony soprano. look at the characters today, i mean, he is complicated. sometimes sympathetic and appalling. >> james gandolfini, he really changed the way we look at tv. tony scott was here last hour and talked about the binge viewing, so many of us will watch an entire season and this is something netflix picked up on and saved their entire

corporation because they understood it, but the sopranos started it. people talked about these shows and then you went to hbo or on demand. mika was talking last night how she was shocked the first time and said, wait, i have to pay for a tv channel just so i can see the show that everybody else is talking about? this really did, it not only changed television, but it changed media and the way we looked at our entertainment. >> yeah, you had three choices. you had abc, nbc and cbs. and very few exceptions people are now going to shotime and amc because they are really good. look at the bill i can't thing netflix did. they gave away to their subscribers, to people already paying for no extra cost, a fabulous series "house of cards." and people ran out to spend the whole week binging on them. i watched them slowly but sometimes my wife and i would say, let's watch two tonight.

one more. the writing was so good. i remember bob wright asking us all, how can we find writing this good and catch up? a lot of people said, it is blue material. it is in a way. and the language used obviously is, but it is just different and better. i think the writing quality, you would think at some point would stampede the broadcast networks into getting better writers. >> so let's show james gandolfini reacting to one of james lipton's famous questions from inside "the actor's studio." take a look. >> if heaven exists, what could you like to hear god say when you arrive at the pearly gates. >> take over for a while. i'll be right back. no, no, no. no, no, no. >> that's it. that's it. you dare not change it. it's too good. it's too good. >> think of the possibilities. >> all right. joining us on the phone, james lipton, creator and writer and host of "inside the actors studio." it is good to have you on this

sad morning. james gandolfini was not the typical leading man when you look at him physically. you think of like don draper, and then you look at gandolfini, he's bald, heavy, he's not chiseled. mr. lipton, he somehow transcended all of that with his presence, did he not? >> not only with his presence, a lot is being said about his appearance. he was technically an extraordinary actor, but he was on "inside the actors studio" where he talked about him a lot. his episode was one of the most technic and valuable episodes in 19 years. remember, when he talked about acting, he gave the students a lesson. he was with me for four or five hours and he was a lesson in acting. he was a student of school and was coached in every single one of his episodes of "the

sopranos" by a teacher in our school. but he gave our students that night pure gold and it was technically what you would expect from somebody like, say, pacino or from any actor who has mastered his craft. that was the astonishing thing about him. he made it look easy. all great actors make it look easy. people thought, that's james gandolfini, he's not acting. yes, he was. and he was acting brilliantly. he was an amazing actor. >> mark halperin, you got to watch more tv than most people got to, what was it about him that made him larger than life? why was he so well liked by the actors and actresses he worked with? >> he was a very nice man, he was a very shy man. if you have seen his episodes of "inside the actors studio" you would know he's very shy and very decent and very generous.

that was clear from the first moment, but there was something else about the show. i think chris matthews put his finger on it. what is the most valuable word in television? the most valuable word in television is family, "family guy," and "modern family." here was a show about two families. he had a personal family that abused him and a mob family where he was the abuser. that was the extraordinary chemistry that worked great for that show. and it is part of its secret. and he was able, because of his technical skill, to handle both sides of it. you felt such compassion for him. when he was abused, when nobody treated him well enough, and then you were terrified by him when he took over with his other family and abused other people, that was the chemistry of the show. it was family in a different way

than we had seen it before. >> chris matthews has a question for you, mr. lipton. chris? >> talk about the technique, i'm thinking when i look at him and think back on him now, that sort of italian movie from the '60s fatigue he had, the board of the -- it showed in his eyes. they weren't bedroom eyes, they were eyes of i've been through too much of this. how does that fit in to the technique? is that him or the actor? >> what you're talking about is that i think he was an exestential hero. that was very much him, but at the same time he was creating every single minute that character tony soprano had. i go back over and over again to the fact that the man was a sublime actor. and i think he should get credit at that now at this moment when we have lost him. he was one of our best actors and he did it technically. he would study every show with

susan astor from our show. the night before they would shoot, he would go over his scenes. he was a member of the actors studio. by the way, he was a made member of "the actors studio" and the studio accepted him based on his work on "the sopranos" and we joked about that. i said you're the only made member of "the actors studio." >> there's a danger in any mob show of the dangers becoming sort of cartoonish versions of mob guys, forgive the term, he had a subtlety and humanity. did you talk to him at all on how to maintain control of that character without it turning into sort of a characterture caricature of a mob show? >> we talked about that for hours and it all went back to

working the night before and the actions of the character. what he was doing was bringing to life what the writer had written and what the director had asked for. that may sound dull, they may sound like a rather flat answer, but it's not. it has everything to do with the success of his work and the success of the show. yes, he possessed it in himself, but he possessed many things of himself. take a look at his movie "the mexican," who did he play? a gay hitman. he created that and was able to do anything he had his mind to because he was so technically strong and because he was so well prepared. two years he studied with the sanford meissner school. and that eclipses one. and we know their names and admire them out of meissner. and that, i think, is the remarkable thing about him. and the thing we have to remember is that when an actor

is very, very good, when an actor is wonderfully trained and combines it with a great natural talent, what we think we'll be watching is that it was easy. it makes it look easy and that's desentive. yes, he was tony soprano and tony soprano was james gap dofl kn gandolfini, but the movement between him and the character was extremely smooth and only well trained actors are able to do that. >> ken, it's really a simple formula if you want to change television. just have a genius like david chase, team up with a genius like james gandolfini. then you look at the cast, edie falco, i have not seen "the sopranos" in a couple years. we have been showing clips and it took my breath away how

remarkable they are. lorain brocco, we can do down the list. michael imperial, jamie lind singer, it was an extraordinary cast. and david chase, beyond brilliant, and yet at the end of the day it comes down to that one guy you're looking at that carries it all on his shoulders. >> i think it comes down to him and david chase. david chase crafted these characters. and the thought that you have a mob boss who is a neurotic who goes to see a shrink is unbelievable. >> it's fantastic. we were just watching a scene where he walks in the door and sits down with the shrink. and for, i don't know, maybe 10 to 12 seconds they just stare at each other. it was fantastic. i remember that scene. >> chris matthews, it really was. it was so subtle. and yet -- it was pitch perfect. and i do agree, i think it was a perfect partnership between

david chase's kinset and james gandolfini. extraordinary television. >> yeah, we are watching this, it's the genesis as you said, joe. and i think what we're seeing is people trying to match it. and certainly don draper, we watched it every weekend. i find the show blossoming with all the complexity of the character you root for but know he's not a good guy it seems. and you look at kevin spacey's portrayal of the character on "house of cards." the standard, the gold standard of television, especially on cable, i also think on network tv, i think you're seeing standards risen there with "the good wife" which keeps growing and growing. it is going on forever and getting better all the time. what this show is say television can beat the movies in quality and there's no excuses using standards like, you know, decency to prevent good storytelling, although it does seem for some reason that the cable networks are doing more

because maybe they are less chained up with a lot of decency standards. >> yes. and there was obviously no shortage of troubles when you watch "the sopranos" between tony and his wife carmella. she's played by edie falco. take a look at this scene. >> the last year, i have been dreaming and fantasizing and in love with furio. >> what? >> every morning when he'd come to pick you up, i would look forward to it all night long, in bed, next to you. those nights when you were actually in the bed. and he would ring the doorbell. i felt like my heart would come out of my chest, he would smile and we'd talk. and then you would come down the stairs. and i felt probably like someone who was terminally ill and somehow they managed to forget

it for a minute. and then it all comes back. >> wow. >> i just -- i don't know, i found the whole show, and every relationship in it, james lipton, transfixing. >> i agree with you. there was a rather famous transfixing moment in that episode with him when i suddenly had a thought and said to him, by the way, have you, james gandolfini, being an analysis. long pause and he said yes. and i thought that was a very interesting answer and a surprising one. and when i asked him about the choices that he makes of projects, i said, what's the most important thing? and he said to me, six words, the writing, the writing, the

writing. he was a man who had great respect for craft, for other people's craft and who had respect for his up. >> james lipton, thank you very much. ken auletta, thank you as well. chris matthews, stay with us if you can. politics to cover as well. joe manchin unveils his new ad here on "morning joe" pushing back at the nra. that's straight ahead. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. ♪ i'm the next american success story. working for a company where over seventy-five percent of store management started as

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remember this tv ad? >> i'm joe manchin. approve this ad because i'll always defend west virginia. as your senator i'll protect your second-amendment rights.

>> now joe manchin is working with president obama and new york mayor michael bloomberg. concerned? you should be. tell senator manchin to honor his commitment to the second amendment. >> we found that ad to be physical. i found it physical. >> if you look at it, it looks like president obama burned the tip of his hand. >> i didn't think people did that anymore. that was the nra ad in west virginia hitting against joe manchin's stance on background checks. here with us now from capitol hill, the democratic senator from west virginia. joe manchin with an exclusive look at the ad. i thought it was not done anymore. it was highly inappropriate. >> joe manchin, before we start this, we'll talk about this offline. so many of your childhood friends are members of the nra, so many of my childhood friends

are members of the nra, people that grew up in the southern baptist church are members of the nra. you can say the same thing. your beef is not with the nra, it's be two or three people in washington z.c., right? >> right. it's the washington leadership. joe and mika, if i can before i get started, say happy birthday to the state of west virginia. >> yay! >> we are 150 years old today. and happy birthday to my wife, gail. >> no way! >> i've never forgotten her birthday, thank god. they both happen on the same day. >> i can see how that might help. that's good. >> no doubt about it. so you decided to respond to the nra attack ad. and we'll show that response in one second. i think that's galling to me, and you probably can't say it, but a lot of reporters have been telling me about this, is the washington leadership, these three people, four people in the nra in washington, d.c., lobbyists in washington, they

are attacking you for supporting a bill, putting a bill together that these reporters in washington tell me they helped draft with you and pat toomey! so they are attacking you for a bill they helped put together! >> joe, here's the thing, i haven't changed. they're trying to say joe manchin's changed. i haven't changed. i'm the same joe manchin i've always been and people back home know me. the bottom line is the leadership of the nra in washington has changed. in 1999 background checks were good. and you know what? i haven't changed, 4 million nra members i believe haven't changed, but the leadership has changed. we need to question and call them and tell them, why have you changed? >> wane lapier, a big supporter of background checks. in fact, you weren't the one that's changed. we'll look at your new ad and then take you to chris matthews.

>> okay. >> i'm joe manchin and i approve this message to bring common sense to washington. i'm a lifetime nra member, but i don't walk with this administration or special interest group. west virginia, you know me. i haven't changed. and you know i've always fought for our gun rights. i believe we can protect the second amendment and make our community safer. i think most of the law-abiding gun owners agree with me. call the nra and tell them to support criminal background checks. >> chris matthews, i think the nra screwed the wrong person, what do you think? >> i'm with you. i'm with the senator because background checks are logical and i would think any gun owner would want to have a background check just to proteblt himself and his family from criminals with guns. my question is, where do we go from here? you have four democrats off base on this bill. you have the republican party in lockstep on this bill. how do you get to 60? and what can you get done in our

lifetimes to restrict gun ownership to people who should have guns? >> well, chris, common sense, you know, common sense is not that common in washington. but the bottom line is, you can't make wrong right. this makes so much sense. as a law-abiding gun owner, i'm not going to sell my gun to a stranger. and all the law-abiding gun owners won't sell it to a family member who is not responsible. so it makes sense if we go to a gun show or through a commercial transaction online, i want to know who is going to buy my gun. it just makes sense to all of us. the only thing they use against me is this, we just don't trust government. well, i'm sorry, if you don't trust to get involved and make it better, don't just sit and curse the wind. and they just don't want to get involved and want it as paranoia going on and i'm not going to stand back and let this small group of people distort the facts and law-abiding gun owners that are good people who have the right to the second amendment. and the bottom line is we are

not going to do wrong with it, but we don't want the wrong person to get the gun. 75% of west virginians believe like i do. >> mark halperin here, but with the passing of james gandolfini the performance of you in that ad could be right up there. >> it is actually not acting because he's been doing it -- can i just say, that's why mark halperin with the nra leadership -- >> i have not gotten any casting calls. >> it just debuted. >> that's why the three or four people in washington, d.c.'s office made such a mistake going after a guy -- you know why it looks natural? because it is natural. because he grew up hunting and fishing in west virginia. >> i wasn't talking about acting so much as screen presence. sir, what are republican senators saying to you now about this issue? the ones not voting with you but are sympathetic?

>> my centerist position, i work on all sides of the aisle, these are all my friends. they know it's right, too. and i'm just saying, listen, if i can do it in west virginia and can tell you that you have to go home and work it. you can't back off it. if you know it is right, what other purpose do we have here? why do we policymakers have to be involved in the public process when we are afraid basically to engage? i'm not. i'm not afraid to engage. and what's my consolation? the worst they can do is defeat me and send me home to my family and the state i love, west virginia. that's a pretty good consolation. >> it just keeps getting better. >> good luck with that 17% sending joe manchin home because the overwhelming majority support background checks in west virginia. >> 75%. >> let me tell you, if we can save one child, one family member of going through what the newtown family members went through, just one, then this is more than worth it. and that's the sacrifice i have to pay as a politician, not to get re-elected because of that,

that's the smallest price i can pay. i will do it every day. >> it is willie geist. you mentioned newtown and i remember you sitting where steve rattner was the monday or tuesday after that terrible friday in connecticut saying i'm for the nra and a lifetime member of the nra, i have an a-plus rating in the nra but we need to stop talking about unreasonable solutions. and you couldn't get anything done in congress on guns. if not in the weeks and months after the most horrific incident that we could ever imagine inside an elementary school, what gives you hope change will be brought about after that now in the coming months and years? >> willie, this is not going to go away. you know what's funny, the day i went on the show on "morning joe," we scheduled that for the week before. my staff said, maybe you shouldn't go on. i said, listen, this is part of who we are and our culture. we have to change and if we can make it safer we have to step up

to the plate. if i can't do it coming from a gun churl and living with guns all my life and loving them, then who can? but with that being said, i truly believe there's enough people looking for ways, and i'm trying to give enough comfort level for basically defining or redefining something to give me comfort. i'm not going to create any holes in the background checks. i think we need to strengthen our mental approach to how we help mental illness. there's so many things we can do. and i'm wide open to talking to all my friends, republicans and democrats, to see if they can find a comfort level. i just need some help basically really basically educating the constituents throughout america that the bill we have passed, this is a great bill for you to use your second amendment, but if also you are a criminal or mentally insane, you may not like this bill. if you're a terrorist, i know you won't like the bill. because you're not going to be able to pick your gun up at the gun show.

>> if you're a terrorist going on youtube to tell other terrorists to come to america and to kill americans because our background check system is lousezy, you'll hate this bill. so terrorists, i'm sorry, it's going to actually make your job a lot tougher. >> so, senator, as you continue to fight this fight and get something done, mayor bloomberg's effort, with the letter he sent asking democrats or anybody not to contribute to the four democrats who are with you, helpful or hurtful? >> steve, i'm not going to second guess the mayor. i don't have involvement in their strategies whatsoever. i would just ask them and anybody else who cares of making substantial changes in our culture to try to educate the constituents. try to educate the law-abiding gun owners the virtues of this bill and the responsibility as a law-abiding governor that we have. that's all i'm asking and i need help on that end. the politics will play itself out. you know that. and elections are coming up in 2014. right now we need to reeducate

and make sure that the law-abiding gun owners, the nra members are not listening and being misled by the leadership in washington. and that's what i've said. here's another thing, steve, also, in we in washington are basically having a tail-wagging dog and the lobbyists with their big money and support or the threat of using that support against us is controlling what goes on here in washington, then we better figure out why in the world we are here. and if not, go back home and let somebody else come here to stand up and fight. >> joe manchin, we both know the overwhelming majority of the nra members are friends, are fellow parishioners, people we went to school with, state schools, by the way, in the south, they agree with you. and they don't agree with three or four lobbyists in washington, d.c. who have changed, not you, they have changed. wayne lapier has changed.

>> when i went on your show that monday morning, i didn't take a poll. i had no idea, but i knew one thing. we could do better. we could prevent at gun shows, commercial transactions, we can do something. and you know what? i wasn't felt like i was infringed upon or violated as a law-abiding gun owner and protector of the second amendment. and i went homeworking all throughout the state of west virginia talking to my friends that i hunt with, that i shoot with, and they felt the same. they basically are concerned that they don't trust government stopping. they think they will overreach. i said, they can't do that. it has to go through this process again. they just can't -- some agency can't regulate and say, we are going to do this and this now. it's not going to happen. >> it's not going to happen. there's not a next step. joe manchin, thank you so much. chris matthews, look at this commercial one more time. and give me your take. it's just pretty remarkable stuff. >> west virginia, you know me.

i haven't changed. and you know i've always fought for our gun rights. i believe that we can protect the second amendment and make our community safer. i think most law-abiding gun owners agree with me. call the nra and tell them to support criminal background checks. >> chris matthews, as you know, great political ads work when they reveal something larger about the character. and you can tell joe manchin ain't acting there. that's joe manchin. and the joe manchin that the people of west virginia know. >> i think it's really important that he's showing the timing here. i mean, one of the problems of the obama administration and maybe the biggest one they've got is timing. they just don't jump off the base when they have to. they don't move. they let the other side make its case for days and weeks and months. then they think, well, we'll get around to getting the truth out. i think joe manchin, the senator from west virginia, has learned a lesson, a very important lesson in politics. you would know, too, joe, you

have to respond and come back for your people so that your people know what you believe and how much you've got character to fight back. i think to fighting back in itself is valuable for him in west virginia, but also straightening the record out in realtime. don't let the other side keep talking and chatting over coffee and back fast until it begins to be common knowledge and acceptable through conventional wisdom. you have to buck that early on or else you'll be a victim of it down the road. and i think he can teach a lesson to obama on all the fronts we have been talking about. >> i think he'll teach a lesson to a lot of people starting with the monday after newtown. i will never forget joe manchin coming on the show speaking from the heart. there were so many people in washington who had much to lose politically as well, just like him, who hid like cowards. >> we could not -- >> hit like scared -- >> there was a history of the show where instead of having members of congress con stamt

stantly constantly wanting to be on, he said, this is who i am. >> chris matthews, thank you very much. coming up, senator claire mccaskill is joining us in her first tv appearance since announcing her support for hillary clinton in 2016. we'll be right back with much more "morning joe." ♪ woman: everyone in the nicu -- all the nurses wanted to watch him when he was there 118 days.

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up next, joe klein and rick stengel are here to unveil the powerful issue of "time" magazine. "morning joe" will be coming right back. [ male announcer ] i've seen incredible things.

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>> i'll hand it over to joe in a moment. it's our sixth annual service issue where six years ago we made the case for national service for all americans. and we've been doing issues ever since. and this year joe wrote a beautiful, lovely moving story about how returning bets are not only helping communities but helping themselves by doing work out in the community. and there's some fantastic groups that are doing it. and before i hand it over to joe, i want to mention we are collaborating with the aspen institute's franklin project headed by stan mcchrystal to basically try to bring national service on to the political agenda and in an even more powerful way than it is already. >> joe klein, the title of the article is "can service save us"? and the answer is, yes, it can. but talk about the focus of your article. >> well, what these groups, i focus on two groups in particular. one is called the mission continues run by eric reidance

who has been on this program, and the other is rubicon who does disaster relief. what they have found over the last four or five years is when veterans suffer from post-traumatic stress go out and do service, when they are helping other people, they think, they focus less on their own problems. and that over time they found that it can heal them. >> it helps them in their rehabilitation, at least in part. >> yes. and not only that, but it reintegrates them into the communities. and these people, i mean, service is in the dna of this generation of veterans. they all volunteered for the service. and, you know, they are natural leaders. >> and if i may, i think what's lacking in this generation of young people is on a grand scale. and something we have talked about on this show where we are sort of directionless and need something to pull us together as a country to give back. >> and again, that's part of the idea of national service, is

that there needs to be something that generationally that americans can all participate in. my dad was a world war ii vet, a kid from brooklyn, stationed in south carolina and hawaii. he integrated himself as an american through his military service and there isn't that rite of passage. which is one of the reasons for this article that i write about is there needs to be a universal rite of passage for americans to serve in some way, either in the military or civilian service. >> there's a hunger out there for it. last year there were like 580,000 applications for 80,000 spots in americorps. teach america takes one out of every ten aptplicants or fewer than that. when team rubicon organized after hurricane sandy, there were 350 members who organized many members who came out to help. there were times when my friends

applied to become part of work teams and were told we are full up because people really want to do this. >> president clinton talked a lot about bad service. do we need washington to be involved to make this happen? or can the private sector and nonprofit deal with it? >> i think it can be both. i think that a good part of the student loan question could be resolved by having students do service in return for their loans. >> well, in one of the things that we advocate in the franklin project advocates is the use of the gi bill to pay for a year of community service by vets when they return, which i think would be a great thing. part of the problem with the national service movement is that it has never really integrated the military and civilian service and now i think it will. >> i think the concept of being a part of the rehabilitation is so basic when you think about it, because many of our veterans do, when they go to afghanistan and iraq, it is not just

fighting, they -- help people, they rebuild. >> the reason i came to this is because i was overseas in iraq and afghanistan with the troops. and i saw them governing the towns, not just with public works funds, but finding out what the people want and building it. if they can do it over there when being bombed, they can do it over here, too. >> amazing. the new issue of "time" is "how service can save us." thank you so much. still ahead, senator claire mccaskill on her fight to stop the inexcusable rise of sexual assault in the armed forces. you're watching "morning joe" brewed by starbucks. is like hammering. riding against the wind. uphill. every day.

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coming up next, if you thought your dad was tough on the new boyfriend, imagine having this guy as a father. >> the check please. >> the young man took care of it.

>> you paid the check? >> i figured since you're always so generous, i should reciprocate. >> you're lucky you don't get your head handed to you. >> dad. >> let's get something straight. you eat. i pay. >> mr. soprano. >> no, when you have your own family, you pay. >> we're going to be talking about the life and career of james gandolfini who somehow made us relate to a mafia kingpin. what an extraordinary actor. what a sad ending. i am an american success story. i'm a teacher. i'm a firefighter. i'm a carpenter. i'm an accountant.

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are you in the mafia? >> am in the what? >> whatever you want to call it, organized crime. >> that's total crap. who told you that? >> dad, i've lived in the house all my life. i've seen police. i've seen you going out at 3:00 in the morning. >> you never see doc going out at 3:00 in the morning on a call? >> do those kids ever find $50,000 while hunting for easter eggs? >> i'm in the waste management business. everybody assumes you're mobbed up. it's a stereotype. it's offensive. you're the last person i would want to perpetuate it. >> fine. >> the entertainment world is reeling today on the news of the passing of james gandolfini, who died unexpectedly of cardiac arrest while vacationing in

italy. what james gandolfini accomplished with hbo was nothing short of a tv revolution. the creator of "sopranos" remembers him as a genius actor. james gandolfini role as tony soprano broke ground for tv dramas. >> i came here today to tell you in all seriousness that i'm done. i did what you said. i gave it a lot of thought. and i decided that once and for all, it's over. the truth is, this therapy is a jerk-off. you know it and i know it. >> americans found themselves rooting for a villain, a mob boss. tony soprano killed people. but of course he was also sometimes a caring father, a loyal friend and his emmy-winning performance paved the way for a new era.

"newsweek" predicted in 2001 that "the sopranos" has the rest of tv running for its life. other networks followed suit of course. james gandolfini and hbo's lead show time launched the twisted drama "dexter." amc has don draper and "mad men." all that thanks to tony soprano and james gandolfini. >> yeah, it wasn't just his tough guy role that won him acclaim. he appeared in a number of films including "zero dark thirty." and in broadway comedies. in a 2009 appearance on "inside the actor's studio" james gandolfini was asked this question by host james lipton. >> if heaven exist, what would you like to hear god say when you arrive at the pearly gates? >> take over for a while, i'll be right back.

[ laughter ] no, no, no. >> that's it, that's it, you dare not change it, it's too good, it's too good. >> think of the possibilities. >> and holstin's diner in bloomsburg, new jersey, of course, the final location of "the sopranos" final scene last night offered its own moving tribute, a reserved sign on james gandolfini's table. >> welcome to "morning joe." we have msnbc and "time" magazine senior political analyst mark halperin. willie geist. your thoughts? >> we were talking backstage, tony and i, about the most iconic characters of the last 25 years. this generation, maybe the generation before that. we couldn't come up with one in the dramatic category bigger than tony soprano. you could say on the comedic

side bill cosby or jerry seinfeld. you made the point on his impact on tv. people forget what tv looked like before 1999 when "the sopranos" came along. we've taken for granted shows like "homeland" and "dexter" and "breaking bad" with conflicted characters, ambiguous characters. tony soprano really was the first of that. he's the reason you have a lot of actors looking for jobs calling hbo and racing to the door of hbo. that and now other networksed on cable is where great television is made. >> it's unbelievable. >> and that did not exist in 1999 when "the sopranos" came along. >> tony, not only has it changed at the vision, it's changed the balance of power. i remember a columnist in "the times" talking about when we all grew up, you would go to school in the morning. you would stand around the water cooler. and you would talk about "the

stain." or "butch cassidy and the sundance kid." people don't remember. the line of demarcation, 1999, "the sopranos," that's when it shifted. that's when we stopped talking so much about the movies. and instead started talking about the tv series on cable. >> people began to say what you hear routinely now about how the television shows are often better than movies as far as the writing, the acting, the complexity of the character. the sort narrative sweep. and it changed a lot or helped to change a lot about our viewing habits. i remember, you know, what i was doing in 1999. i started subscribing to hbo because of the "sopranos." i had heard about it, i missed the first season. it's the first time i ever bought a tv show on i think it was then vhs. >> this idea, she remembers watching it -- we talked about this late night. she said, i sat there dumfounded that i was paying for a channel

so i could watch a tv show. >> the phenomenon of binge watching which gets talked about now with some of the netflix original content and the way people watch whole seasons in a weekend. >> right. >> "the sopranos" really started that. >> and it's still happening. >> okay, one more episode, one more episode. and it's 3:00 in the morning and you're still hooked in there. also started in criticism this phenomenon of the recap which is now on the internet every single show has dozens of people coming in the morning after it airs to talk about it, to analyze it, to break it down online. that started with "the sopranos" too. >> we have, you know, so many different angles. i don't know how i was just completely shocked at how a massive loss this is. if you're asked to name the big complicated male stars of our time. maybe his name didn't come to mind, tony, but it should have and we realize now as we look at his body of work, he started it all. and that complicated, cruel but

wonderful and lovable and passionate male character started with tony soprano, did it not? >> i think so. the idea that you could have a character who wasn't just, you know, a little bit dark or a little bit complicated. if you look objectively at what he does, he's monstrous. he's always, you know, cheating on his wife, betrays his friends in the end, killing people, so on. and yet, you know, you identify with him. you relate to him. you love him. you're fascinated by him. it's an extraordinary performance to carry that. we talk about the show as a large phenomenon and certainly the writing and directing and all of that is important. you need to have the guy you're looking at, whose face you're looking into, convey all of that and hook you in and make you care. >> he really did. for the first time you had a television series where and now you hear people saying this.

i'll be talking to my son and he'll say, you know, i think actually what they're trying to do in "mad men" this season, this entire season -- i remember sitting through the second or the third season with "sopranos" and after about the third or fourth episode, say, what -- we're talking about tony's psychological state. when are the bodies going to start piling up? this isn't "the godfather." that's the first time david chase todid it, but it took ton soprano, it took james gandolfini, willie, to be able to sit in that chair and make his counseling sessions as critical as his -- to the show as his decision on who he's going to kill to protect the family. >> and that was the greatness of it. it was not cartoonish. the show was not an old mob television show. i know you saw every episode of it. yes, there was plenty of violence. but it wasn't all about, you know, the big italian guy telling stories and deciding how

they're going to kill people. there were layers. sensitivity. i think in the first episode he looks at lorraine bracco, his therapist, and says, whatt what happened to gary cooper? it set the tone for the character. >> there were a lot of people involved in the cast and the crew and the directing. but he was the center of it. father of the modern golden age of television. without a doubt. and an incredible actor. i was looking last night on youtube at scene after scene. including that final scene. it's just, the guy's perfect in either scene. such a craftman. every scene with drama, emotion. humor. he was asked -- i read in an interview, he was asked, why didn't he do comedy. he said people really didn't ask him. but that show was brilliantly funny along with everything else. >> his relationship with his children, his relationship with the other guys in the show. obviously one that touched a lot of people was the relationship

with his wife. there was no shortage of struggle between tony "sopranos" and his wife car mella played by edie falco. let's take a look. >> the last year, i have been dreaming and fantasizing and in love with furio. >> what? >> every morning when he come to pick you up, i would look forward to it all night long. in bed. next to you. those nights when you were actually in the bed. and he would ring the doorbell. i felt like my heart would come out of my chest. he would smile. he would talk. and then you would come down the stairs. and i felt probably like someone who is terminally ill and somehow they manage to forget it for a minute and then it all comes back.

>> you watch those clips and you're taken back not just to james gandolfini but that cast. edie falco. he wouldn't have probably been as iconic and great as he was without edie falco. >> the two of them, i don't think you see -- you see acting on screen, on stage, on television, anywhere, that is that precise and that intense. yes, the two of them -- it is one of the great wildly dysfunctional but fascinating marriages on television. and it takes -- you see kind of -- on a lot of these shows i think. not just the sort of dark heroes who are the kind of magnetic center of them but these ensembles. i think that's true on "mad men" as well and certainly on "breaking bad" where it's a whole world, family, a workplace, a set of associations, that's organized around this fascinating and troubling and just endlessly interesting figure. to do that as an actor, i think

it's an enormous opportunity for -- was for him, you know, who had been a kind of struggling working actor in new york for a long time before that. who didn't maybe have movie star looks and get a role like this and dig into it and extend it across all of those narrative. hearing the news yesterday just took me back to every episode and every season, you know, you would just sit down and watch and say, well, what's going to happen next? where is this going to take us? >> joining us on the phone now is author allen sepenwall who writes about james gandolfini's role on "the sopranos" in his book. the revolution was televised. slinger, and slayers who changed tv drama forever. allen, "the sopranos" and tony soprano himself were groundbreaking. >> absolutely.

everybody was saying about what it's meant to television. all of it comes from james gandolfini. even david chase says tony soprano wouldn't become the character he did without some of the things james gandolfini did early in the series. >> talk about that specifically. what were some of the things that he did? certainly the first season caught so many people's attention. so people like tony, scott and i who missed the first season understood we had no choice as functioning members in american society but to tune in the opening night of the second season. >> well, i mean, chase said originally he envisioned it as much more of a comedy and james gandolfini came in and he said wait a minute, this is serious now. there's a moment toward the end of the pilot. you may remember, christopher announces he wants to go to hollywood and write a screenplay and tony is not happy about this. in the script, it just says tony slaps christopher lightly across the face. instead, james gandolfini picked

michael imper yolly off the wall and shoved him and said he was not happy. that really shaped the writing of the character and the tone of the series going forward. there were no compromises. there had always been compromised anti-heroes to that point. there had always been something redeemable, something cuddly about them. and james gandolfini made no apologies for who tony was. >> remember, the relationship that started in the pilot with that slap and that shove ended. christopher was like a son to him. ended by him closing his nostrils and having christopher die that way. it's always worth pointing out i think that tony soprano's character was born of james gandolfini's upbringing. he is from new jersey. he grew up in park ridge, new jersey. his dad was an italian immigrant. his mother was a lunch lady. his father, the head custod young at paramus high school. he went back to italy all the time. italian was spoke in his house.

this was not a reach for him. culturally. e i'm not talking about the mafia of course. it was not that far of a reach to walk into that lifestyle. a lunch lady father and cu custodian father and go to the heights he did. >> coming up, senator claire mccaskill. why she is throwing her early support behind the former secretary of state. first, here's the check of the forecast. >> going into the summer season, experts are predicting a horrible fire season because we did not get the rain and snow we needed. now that we're in the dry season, it is hot and the winds are howling and the fires are -- every day, we get a new big one. yesterday, we had another big fire in colorado. this one wasn't near any homes. zero percent contained now. they're doing air drops on it and everything they can so it

doesn't get larger. look at this map. 19 large fires are burning. mostly in the four corner region here. we're going to continue to watch. dangerous weather conditions in that area today. this is the seasonal drought outlook. pretty much shows everywhere in brown the drought getting the worst or staying the same. from texas to california. that's exactly where all these fires are. the other news other the last hour, tropical storm barry making landfall near veracruz. bad flooding this morning near far fargo. this last day spring, we're looking nice through much of the lower 48. enjoy it. we're iting hotter from here. summer only hours away. what's the impact of obamacare? the truth is, americans are already seeing the benefits.

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remember this tv ad? >> i'm joe manchin. i'll always defend west virginia. i'll protect your second amendment rights. >> that was joe manchin's commitments. now manchin is working with president obama and new york mayor bloomberg. concerned? you should be. tell senator manchin to honor his commitment to the second amendment. >> that of course was the recent nra ad in west virginia where the nra and washington, d.c. hit senator joe manchin's stance on background checks. he joined us with an exclusive first look at his new ad that

hit back. >> i haven't changed. they're trying to say joe margin's changed. i haven't changed. i'm the same joe manchin i've always been. people back home know me. the bottom line is the leadership of the nra in washington has changed. in 1989, background checks were good. i haven't changed. 4 million nra members i believe haven't changed. but the leadership has changed. we need to question and we need to call then and tell them, why have you changed? >> it's a good question, wayne la pierre, a big supporter of background checks. >> talk about that. >> you weren't the one that's changed. the nra has. >> i want to see that. >> let's look at your new ad and then we'll go to chris matthews. >> i'm joe manchin. and i approve this message. to bring common sense to washington. i'm a lifetime nra member. don't walk in lock step with the nra's leadership or any special interest group. west virginia. you know me. i haven't changed. you know i've always fought for

our gun rights. i believe we can protect the second amendment and make our community safer. i think most law abiding gun owners agree with me. call the nra and tell them to support criminal background checks. >> i think the nra screwed with the wrong person. what do you think? >> yeah, i just wondered -- i'm with the senator because i think background checks are logical and i would think any gun owner would want to have a background check just to protect himself and his family from criminals with guns. i guess my question is where do we go from here? you've got four democrats who were off base on this bill. you've got the republican party in lock step on this bill. how do you get to 60? what can you get done in our lifetimes to restrict gun ownership to people who should have guns? >> chris, common sense, you know, is not that common in washington. but the bottom line is you can't make a wrong right. this makes so much sense. as a law abiding gun own, i'm not going to sell my gun to a stranger. all the law abiding gun owner

also i know won't do it. you won't sell it to someone who's mentally deranged. so it makes sense if we go to a gun show or online through a commercial transaction, i want to know who's going to buy my gun. it just makes sense to all of us. the only thing they use against me is this. we just don't trust government. i'm sorry, if you don't trust it, get involved and let's make it better. don't just sit and curse the wind. at the don and they just don't want to get involved. i'm not going to stand back and let them, this leadership, a very small group of people, distort the facts. law abiding gun owners are good people. the bottom line is, we're not going to do wrong with it. but we don't want the wrong person to get the gun. 75% of west virginians believe like i believe. 75%. >> mark halperin. >> i will say with the passing of james gandolfini your performance in that ad may be right up there with our leading

the thespians. >> he's been doing that -- >> he looks good on camera. >> can i just say why, mark halperin, why the nra leadership -- >> i got three casting calls. >> it's why these three or four people in washington, d.c. office made such a mistake going after a guy -- you know why it looks natural? because it is natural. because he grew up hunting and fishing in west virginia. >> i wasn't talking about acting so much as screen presence. senator, what are republican senators saying to you now about this issue, the ones who aren't voting with you but might be sympathetic? >> my centrist position, i work on all sides of the aisle and these are all my friends. they know it's right too. i'm just saying, if i can do it in west virginia and i can tell you people -- you have to go hope and work it. you can't back off of it. if you know it's right, what other purpose to we have? why do we ask policymakers and be involved in the public

process when we're not afraid -- we're afraid basically to engage? i'm not. i'm not afraid to engage. the worst they can do is defeat me and send me home to my family and the state i love, west virginia. >> all right. now let's take a look at some of the morning papers. >> "the new york times," the hpv vaccine appears to have reduced the rate of infection in teenage girls. the virus has reportedly dropped by more than half in girls and women age 14 to 19 since the vaccine was introduced just seven years ago. still, some health officials believe not enough teen girls are being vaccinated. there are concerns the virus is developing a resistance to the vaccine. hpv is a common cause of cervical cancer. >> from the "new york daily news," an unemployed teacher from texas returned a $20,000 fine to chase bank after she found a bag of cash in the

middle of the road. she received a $500 gift certificate for her honesty. >> "washington post," dunkin' donuts is rolling out a plan to offer gluten free doughnuts and muffins. the chain joins other industry names to provide more choices for customers with dietary restrictions. the new options do not always mean fewer calories. >> i hope that doesn't mean my munchkins are going to taste any different in the morning. in the "new york post," christina tori, daughter of the former yankee manager joe torre, made an unusual catch yesterday. was walking down a street when she saw a 1-year-old boy hanging from the awning of a store front in brooklyn. when the child fell, christina torre was there to make the catch. >> the baby was struggling. all of a sudden, it slipped and was dangling and holding on with its hands. i was actually still talking to 911 and i said he's falling and i just put out my arms and

literally, it just -- it was effortless. luckily, he just landed in my arms. i feel quite lucky this i was just in the right spot and was able to catch him and he's alive. >> oh, my gosh. that's unbelievable. >> listen, she literally saved a life. i mean, i'm sure -- >> i'm glad joe torre played catch with her when she was young. >> the parents, by the way, and the baby was taken to lutheran hospital. the parents obviously could face charges here. who could let a child crawl out on an awning and almost fall? >> unbelievable. from the "l.a. times," the los angeles school district awarded apple a $30 million contract to supply each student with an ipad. the tab lelets are going to be provided in 37 schools and students will be able to take them home. they'll be preloaded with educational software and block inappropriate contact. the l.a. district, the second largest in the country. big news for apple.

>> $30 million contract. when i was a teacher in 1994, i always said, when are they going to stop taking notes with their hands and just use stuff like this. >> they're going to have donkey kong on there? >> i hope so. >> that's educational. >> that's very educational. >> actor jeff daniels will be here in our newsroom to discuss the media's role in american politics. and ceiling mirrors in rvs. >> i don't understand how you, jeff daniels, rvs, mirrors on the ceiling, pink champagne on ice. i don't know how it all goes together. i know this, you and russell brand and that very inappropriate interview where he talked about you ovulating while in his presence, over 5.5 million hits now on youtube. what did you two do together? i leave the set for one day. wow, unbelievable. >> you shouldn't have left. >> it would have been different. >> it was a great segment. >> where were you? >> it was a great segment.

classic. >> people don't think so. >> t.j. had to come out with a water hose after and hose them down be down, it was just terrible. >> i think he was making fun of me. >> no, he wasn't making fun of you. he was doing something else. i think he was in love. coming up next, we're going to do a segment. water hoses aren't going to be required. senator mccaskill joins us live. that's right, senator, it's a safe, nonrussell brand zone, just for you.

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♪ 33 past the hour. here with us now from capitol hill, democratic senator from missouri, senator claire mccaskill. good morning. apparently you're ready for hillary. >> yeah. it was interesting how this kind of blew up the other day. it doesn't seem complicated to me. she is by far the strongest most capable most qualified candidate for president of the united states. and i am part of a lot of group of people. big huge group of people that really wants her to run. it seemed like coming out

publicly and stating the obvious that we all want her to run was an important thing to do right now. >> no precursor to something you might know about whether or not you'll run? >> you know what, no. she did call me after this all happened the other day. we had a great conversation. i'm not going to talk about what we said. but i think she's got a big decision to make and i think she's in the process making it. i think the more people that are out there urging her to run, i think it will help grow the grassroots effort. we all know, we saw in 2000 and in 2012 what a difference it makes if people feel invested in not just the big power brokers in washington. not senators and congressman. but everybody in this country feeling invested in who the future leader will be. >> mark halperin, hillary clinton, when you think about, for example, jeb bush's mother talking about we don't need another bush or another clinton

or whatever. there is that issue. but hillary clinton, again, transcends that. because there would be another reason obviously that everybody might be getting behind her. beyond her ideology and her record. but the fact that she would be the first woman president of the united states. >> there's no question. you find that all across the country. even among some republicans. would say you look around the country right now who in the next 20 years is a woman in position to do this. secretary clinton is head and shoulders above. >> how do you pass that up? >> you mentioned grassroots. let me ask you about big money. what you did the other day was endorse a super pac. so far have not been about grassroots, they've been about big money. are you willing to and plan to help raise million dollar checks, hundred thousand dollar checks for this effort? >> listen, i just came out of a vortex of pressure in terms of raising campaign cash and it is -- it's terrible. and i'm not excited about

spending a lot of my time just trying to get big donors. i don't think really what this effort -- i don't think that's what this effort is about. if you look at what this group is doing, they're doing an awful lot of social media. they're really trying to build a strong database of volunteers. they have volunteers going out and showing support for secretary clinton wherever she goes in the country. this is really about building an effort from the ground up. they'll be plenty of time to raise serious campaign money. both sides will do it. they'll both do it under the current laws. i'd like to see those laws changed. i'd like to see all the money identifiable and without this secret behind closed doors cash being spent on campaigns. i think secretary clinton adegrees with that also. >> senator mccaskill, we're all appalled by the numbers when compa comes to the military sexual assaults. maybe in congress it's not a

gender issue per se but just talk about why you did not vote for senator gillibrand's bill and the comb pla i plications o >> first of all, there's been a lot of misunderstanding about the numbers. it is a serious problem we've got to address. but the numbers that have been bandied about are now how many sexual assaults there's been. it's been an anonymous number that has been collected on unwanted sexual contact. >> you're talking about the -- just for clarification, you're talking about the 26,000 number? >> correct. that's unwanted sexual contact. that could be somebody looking at you sideways and saying something about how nice you look in a sweater. we need to hone in and get the real number first. secondly, we need to support the victims. we need to change the system so it is more supportive of the victims. we need to take commanders out of the role of overturning jury verdicts. but we can't remove the accountability of the commander. anybody who thinks what we did is coddling the pentagon doesn't

understand the ucmj. we've created a crime of retaliation. i firmly believe, this is an honest disagreement about which is stronger for victims, i believe there is less chance of a victim being retaliated against when the commander remains in the process at the beginning. because if the commander's not in the process at the beginning, then that woman goes back into that unit and the only one who signed off on her case going forward is a bunch of outside lawyers that nobody knows. as opposed to the commander saying this case needs to go forward. and the good thing about our version is if the commander says no, it goes straight to the top of that military service to a guy or a woman in a suit, not a uniform. so the appeal is to the civilian head of a military. not to the uniform part of a military. so i think it's a great hybrid that will do a better job of protecting victims and take the commandering out and the quality of the military service and all

of this other irrelevant junk that was getting in the way of a day of justice for victims in the military. >> so let me follow up by asking because it is so complicated. i think you've pinpointed one problem when you bring up the word retaliation and fear of retaliation and how to mitigate that. but wasn't one of the issues and one of the reasons behind taking the whole thing, these cases out of the chain of command, would be so women feel like they can come forward? >> well, women now have -- and this is one of the things we've done in the bill. we've made sure every victim can immediately get their own legal advice and their own counseling. and you do not have to go to the military -- to your commander or to anybody in your unit to report it. there's a safe space now to report. and in the criminal investigation is done by the outside criminal investigators and the prosecutors, then the prosecutor in kristin's version,

the prosecutor said this is too hard to file, it's over. if our version, if the commander says no, then it goes up to appeal to the cillian head of that military. but in this instance, the commander could say yes when the prosecutor says no. by the way, that has happened more frequently than the opposite. so the problem we have right now is not commanders saying no to cases going forward. the problem we have now is victims getting the help, getting the assistance. getting the information. getting the protection. and making sure commanders can't come in after the fact and nullify a jury. >> thank you for shedding light on this. we will continue to cover it. both you and kristin have been leaders on this. >> by the way, she and i are both focused like lasers on the same goal. anybody who tries to drive a wedge between us doesn't understand how hard we're working to do the best job possible. >> that's what i was going to point out. can i change topitopics, just f

second? something less serious, is that okay? >> yeah, i'm nervous. >> claire, what's your favorite russell brand movie? >> who is he? >> i'm not speaking to you. after you did that little warm-up that we won't need a fire hose. introduce me as an old cow next time, scarborough. >> i'm not saying that, i'm just saying -- i don't see -- >> that's kind of what you're saying. >> that's not what i'm saying! oh, my goodness, i'm just saying you would show more restraint and discipline than mika did. what? you can say it. i can't. >> you look great. >> fabulous. >> there you go. take that, joe scarborough. >> no, i couldn't say it. i was just looking. i couldn't say it because you know i'm a man. if i say it, it's inappropriate. >> claire used to not like me but i think she does now. >> i always liked you, i just was irritated by you. >> now she's irritated by me.

it happens. but that really hasn't changed. that's just a constant throughout time our viewers can take note of. thank you so much, claire. thank you for doing great work on this issue. >> thank you very much. >> we'll be in touch. call us any time. up next, good news about the economy. fed chair ben bernanke. still led to a global sell-off. cnbc will break it down for us. the secret is out. hydration is in.

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in parks across the country, families are coming together to play, stay active, and enjoy the outdoors. and for the last four summers, coca-cola has asked america to choose its favorite park through our coca-cola parks contest. winning parks can receive a grant of up to $100,000. part of our goal to inspire more than three million people to rediscover the joy of being active this summer. see the difference all of us can make... together. best-selling author vince flynn has lost his battle with cancer. known for his political thrillers, he was first diagnosed with prostate cancer in 2010. among his fans was former

president george w. bush who called his cia novels a little too accurate. flynn spoke about the inner workings of the government when he joined us here. >> people feel like the fbi and cia hate each other. they don't. there's elements within both organizations that hate each other. 10% maybe. but by and large they work well together. they're after the same thing. but you will get the occasional really aggressive person who wants to make a name for themselves in washington which we've never seen that before. and they just -- they go after it. >> such a sad story. vince is survived by his wife and three children. he was only 47 years old. >> now a little more on the loss of james gandolfini. we have a statement from edie falco who played tony soprano's wife car mel la. she says this, i am shocked and devastated. he was a man of tremendous depth and sensitivity with a kindness and jgenerosity beyond words.

i consider myself very lucky to have spend ten years as his close colleague. my heart goes out to his family as those of us in his retend family hold on to the memories of our beautiful time together. the love between tony and carmella was one of the greatest i've ever known. >> and their chemistry was nothing short of extraordinary. the clips we saw today just breathtaking. let's go now to brian sullivan at cnbc. brian of course the markets were shaken yesterday. by ben bernanke's good news. tell us about it. >> yeah, it is good news. i'm glad you framed it that way. the federal reserve really causing stocks to drop yesterday and futures indicating they'll do drop today because he indicated they'll pull back next year on their bond buying program. resumes us to a sense of

normalcy, if you will. because the fed is saying the economy is doing well enough that it doesn't need the fed's medicine necessarily janymore. while stocks drop and we look at that and say if stocks are down it's a bad thing. we have to get off the fed's bond buying program at some point. the fed does see this as being a time where things are getting a bit better. facebook making a mystery announcement of some kind at 1:00 eastern time today. some people say it may be be a news reader. others say it may be a video gram. also jobless claims came in. a little higher than expected. about 14,000 more than the estimate. i want to say on a personal note because of the flynn story. four years ago this week, my best friend, the close et thing i've ever had to a brother, passed away from geoblastoma. it was a brain cancer. he had no insurance. cancer sucks.

let's fight this. let's beat it. it's awful. if anybody from the family is watching, guys, i love you, i miss your son. >> thank you. we appreciate it. up next, big changes on the way to a company that brian and joe know quite well. men's warehouse. i guarantee i know this company well. i don't understand. news you can't hear straight ahead. [ female announcer ] the best thing about this bar it's not a candy bar. 130 calories 7 grams of protein

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50. really, for decades. if you've ever gone to a wedding, you've rented a tuxedo from this guy. where do i go? i go to men's warehouse, right? >> you're going to like the way you look. i guarantee it. i guarantee it. i guarantee it. >> you're going to like the way you look i guarantee it. for the last quarter century. he's the founder of the men's warehouse. now he's been fired by the very company he built. >> what? firing the founder? you can't do that. >> it happens. >> the company shares fell 6% during trading yesterday. zimmer told cnbc he expressed concern to the board of directors about the company's change of direction and for that

was thrown out by the board. he said, quote, over the past several months i've expressed my concern over the direction of the company. the board has inappropriately chosen to silent my concerns. >> willie, like who would fire this guy? who would fire steve jobs? >> he's the man. >> he was fired. >> george zimmer. you can't do that. they're going to bring him back, i guarantee you. >> they better bring him back. >> whoever's trying to get him out and he wouldn't go gracefully and he went less gracefully. >> what will they do without that face, without that voice? >> he's getting paid for four years. they can use it forever, right? i want peacocks. peacocks? walking the grounds. in tuscany. [ man ] her parents didn't expect her dreams to be so ambitious. italy? oh, that's not good.

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that's three new paper shredders. [ boris ] put 'em on my spark card. [ garth ] boris' small business earns 2% cash back on every purchase every day. great businesses deserve unlimited rewards. read back the chicken's testimony, please. "buk, buk, bukka!" [ male announcer ] get the spark business card from capital one and earn unlimited rewards. choose 2% cash back or double miles on every purchase every day. told you i'd get half. what's in your wallet? all due respect, you got no [ bleep ] idea what it's like to be number one. every decision you make affects every facet of every other [ bleep ] thing. it's too much to deal with almost. in the end, you're completely alone with it all. >> i'm sorry you feel that way. >> this is the course i've

chose. and those of you that are not with me on it, well, that makes me sad. and it will be dealt with in time. >> welcome back to "morning joe." the great james gandolfini. what have you learned? >> i learned i thought claire mckam mccaskill didn't like me but i apparently irritate her. >> we apparently all appreciate james gandolfini for the same reasons at the same intensity level. he will be missed. >> two things. one is, he was type cast but yet he did so many original things. for me, the greatest thing is he didn't quit. he didn't get success till his 30s. he did not quit trying to be an actor. which is the biggest lesson to take out of it. >> remarkable actor. i learned this morning that three or four people who are lobbyists in washington, d.c. picked on the wrong nra member, joe manchin is pushing back. and he's pushing back hard.

and he's going to prove that he's the guy who has remained consistent as a lifetime nra member. it's the two or three lobbyists who have actually changed their positions on background checking. >> it's not hard to do an ad when yeaou say. >> exactly. it's "morning joe." stick around now because we got peter alexander in for chuck todd. peter. >> have a good day. just an hour from right now, the supreme court could hand down some major decisions on issues like same-sex marriage and affirmative action. we'll have a full preview on what you need to know about what's likely coming up. that is straight ahead. meanwhile, more breaking news from capitol hill. the gang of eight's immigration plan gets a bipartisan boost on border control. we're going to talk to one of the key players involved. tennessee's bob corker. and home drone. the outgoing fbi director turned some heads saying the bureau has already used