you just ran? you know what i'm saying? >> flashlight. >> yes, ma'am. >> this is -- this is where -- >> you were questioning him about what he had said, about the evidence, correct? >> yes, sir. >> is that -- what you were doing will? >> yes, sir. >> do you recall -- at what point -- prior to you shooting him he was on you, correct? >> yes.

shot him at point blank range. he was on top of you, right? >> yes, sir. >> mob came out to help you -- can't pinpoint, that's the problem i'm having. mob is saying they saw him. >> we don't hear that. >> you recall you and investigator singleton challenged to use mr. o'mara's words, challenging him whether he was being smothered or not? >> yes, sir. >> okay.

>> do you recall watching on direct and on cross-examination, i believe on direct, apologize if it wasn't, being asked skwes about the videotaping, re-enactment. >> yes, sir. >> that occurred on the 27th, do you recall that, between the defendant, took him back out to the scene, do you recall that? >> yes, sir. >> okay. >> you were present for that, is that correct? >> yes, i was. >> you recall at some point the defendant walking as he's walking and he's -- walking the

route where he claimed he went, do you recall that? >> yes, sir. >> okay. do you recall him at some point saying that you went to look for an address and there were no addresses to the left because those were the back of the buildings, do you recall that? >> yes, sir. >> okay. >> i'm going to try on keep to you this point specifically. but do you recall -- >> told the operator -- >> i'm sorry. >> i got out of my car and started walking. still on the phone with non-sxhj i started walking.

>> okay down this way. and -- because i didn't see a street sign here but i knew if i went straight lou, that should be circle. give me the address in front. there's no address because this is the back of the house. >> do you recall that testimony, sir? >> yes, sir, i do. >> sir, do you recall -- >> didn't ask me where he went, which direction. i said i don't know. then i thought to get out and look first. >> do you recall that? >> yes, sir. >> i want to show you a photograph of the front of miss lauer's residence. is there a knew mayor cal address there in the front of the house? >> yes, there is.

>> isn't her address 1211, sir? >> yes, sir. >> stay there. so the defendant in that re-enactment when he is pointing at the back of these houses, claiming he doesn't have an address, there's an address right there staring at him, isn't that true, sir? >> yes, there is. >> that would be leading. this is still redirect. >> i will be glad to rephrase the question. when the defendant turns and points on video to this side where he is saying there is no address because it is the back of the house, right to the right, what is there? is there a house there with an address? >> yes, there is. >> for the record state's

exhibit 33. let me show you state's exhibit number 1. i'm going to put a close-up of part of that. for the record, state's exhibit 1, aerial photograph of twin lakes, is that correct? >> yes, sir. >> as you pointed out when you were used mr. o'mayor's words, challenge the defendant in that interview, you pointed out there was only lee actual streets in the whole neighborhood, correct? >> yes, sir. >> and this street that the defendant claims he did not know is twin tree lane which is the main entrance that you come in and out of that -- right here i'm pointing to, correct? >> yes, sir. >> so the defendant went -- in that interview claims he did not

know this street and didn't happen to see the address here, but -- specifically did not know this street, correct? >> yes, correct. >> okay. >> thank you, your honor do you recall also on cross-examination the defense counsel asking you about inconsistencies or consistecon si consistent cease, correct? >> correct. >> do you recall stating after he shot trayvon martin, trayvon martin put his hands up, correct? do you recall that? >> yes, sir. >> do you recall that he then

stated that trayvon martin somehow fell on the ground face first, do you recall that? >> yes, sir. >> and you recall the defendant stating he put his arms out, correct? >> correct. >> do you recall him saying that? >> yes, sir. >> now, sir -- >> do you recall, sir, that one of the first -- first person had a came out before the officer was the person, joe manallo. >> son thon. >> i'm sorry. i apologize. jonathon. showing you state's exhibit 77. do you recall the photographs

out there? >> yes. >> one of them was state's exhibit 77? >> yes, sir. >> and -- may i publish this to the jury? >> yes, you may. >> do you recall in that photograph the victim's hands being underneath his body? >> yes, sir. >> >> can someone say that was inconsistent with the defendant's statements that his hands were straight out, he put his hands out? >> that positioning, yes. >> i'm sorry. >> that positioning, as seen there, yes, it is. >> >> in that interview that you conducted, investigator singleton conducted, the department of didn't say i put his hands out and then after put his hands out i put them back in, did he? >> no, he did not. >> i think in cross-examination,

you were asked something about exaggeration, do you recall being asked about that? >> yes, sir. >> and do you recall -- i think you uttered or it or mr. o'mara uttered it on behalf of the defendant, exaggeration. do you recall what that was about? >> pertains to the defendant's statements. >> you felt he was exaggerating certain parts of it? >> among other things. >> did you feel -- i can't lead you. did you feel in terms of exaggeration what did you mean when you said he was exaggerating parts of his interview? >> how i felt based on -- >> okay. no, no. what i'm -- inconsistent. >> okay. >> you were asked specifically about exaggeration. do you feel it exaggerated the manner in which he was hit? >> yes, sir. >> regarding your interview with

the defendant on february 29, was your investigation still ongoing? >> yes, it was. >> okay. had you -- at the point that -- at that point, even further, had you gotten any results back from -- regarding the analysis of the clothing or anything else regarding that, sir? >> no, sir, i had not. >> had you gotten the medical examiner's report, examination in terms of final findings regarding that? >> no, sir. >> had you gotten anuts regarding possible dna? >> possible had you gotten results in terms of ballistics and firearms and trajectory, stippling, whatever other evidence?

>> no, sir. >> continuing coverage of the george zimmerman trial on msnbc. let's go back to the trial and take a listen. >> that was speaking to the victim on the phone at the time or right before the time this murder happened? >> no, sir. >> have you analyzed the phone records and conversations between the victim, trayvon martin, and the lady he was speaking to? >> no, sir. >> had you seen the 7-eleven video? >> no, sir, i had not. >> you also did, obviously, reports in this case, correct? >> yes, sir. >> some of the reports, you -- did you in some way write down some inconsistencies based on the statements the defendant had given you? >> prosecution continuing its questioning in the george

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but anyone can help a foster child. the redirect finished and we are going to the re-cross. the defense attorney, mark o'mara, now speaking. >> found out a person was 'rested two weeks before this event, young black male, having burglarized several homes in the neighborhood, right? >> yes, sir. >> late teens, tall, thin? >> yes, sir. >> sentenced to five years in prison for having burglarized a bunch of homes, right? >> i was not involved in that, but yes, sir. >> did you found that out and looking into everything that you were looking into to see what was going on in the neighborhood

you knew not only emanuel had been arrested would weeks before for burglarized but will were a lot of other burglaries in that same neighborhood, right? >> yes, sir. >> were you concerned he was concerned about that? >> good that cause you any concern that was involved in protecting the community, staying on -- being on neighborhood watch, would be a concern about burglaries in the neighborhood? >> one thing dab as far as my personal feelings towards his actions, the night of, little bit different. >> we will get to that in just a moment. >> talking specifically. [ audio muted ] were you concerned that he used [ audio muted ] >> not necessarily my derogatory way, correct? a slang term. >> more derogatory, sir.

>> ever for guys walk into the squad room, dinner time. [ audio muted ] anything like that? >> personally, no. >> really? >> not that -- [ audio muted ] could be viewed that way. >> okay. [ audio muted ] yes, sir. >> my concern. [ audio muted ] don't suggest that that evidence is any hatred on his behalf? do you? >> as i interpret that, that was said with a sense of urgency. s some was happening bad. >> right. because he was just running away, correct? >> yes. >> were you here for john guys. [ audio muted ]

when mr. zimmerman said [ audio muted ] loud, aggressive voice the way [ audio muted ] do you know why he yelled it at you? >> stress a point to emphasize. >> right. you heard it on tape, correct? >> yes, sir. >> how was it said on tape? >> more as. [ audio muted ] >> okay. pl frustration based uponing the fact other people in the neighborhood burglarized in the place seemed to have gotten away on occasion, right? >> yes. >> in that sense, you said that

there was no evidence trayvon martin was doing anything wrong correct? >> none whatsoever. >> you don't know that though, correct? >> no, i do not. you know whatever he play have been planning to do was not completed? correct? >> i wouldn't know. i wouldn't know. there was -- no evidencing to suggest that at all. >> massachusetts, will was a type of a tool found in the area where trayvon martin may have been hiding, wasn't there? >> approximately five, six days after the investigation into the scene. >> when you looked back and look mood the bushes and found what was it? >> it was a piece of an awning -- i believe it was a piece of a window, piece of hardware. looked like a slim jim. >> what's a slim jim? >> slim jim sl a device used to jimmy locks on vehicles primarily. >> to break into a vehicle. >> yes, sir. >> that was find few days after

this event? >> yes, sir. >> not particularly tied to this event by you, but it was there? >> yes, it glass in the bushes off of one of the residence, correct? >> and the bushes behind molanoa's residence. >> so -- would you suggest that the focus beyond how. [ audio muted ] the way mr. guy did in opening [ audio muted ] >> i can't speak for mr. guy. it was different. >> now, also asked you that -- you were questioning mr. zimmerman on the fact he was following trayvon martin, correct? >> yes, sir. >> mr. zimmerman said --

>> words along -- >> said yes, right? he said, wait a minute. were you following him? and the -- interview, his word was yes. right? >> in one -- >> acknowledged to you that he was following him at one point, correct? >> yes, sir. >> anything wrong with following somebody like that? >> that -- >> let me ask you in. anything illegal? >> objection. >> sorry. i will let him answer that one. >> repeat, please. >> anything that -- did you think there was anything wrong with him polling him to see where he's going? >> legally speaking, no. >> okay. as a matter of fact, it was -- you heard the non-emergency call, right? >> yes, sir. >> okay. it was twice on that that the non-emergency operator asked mr. zimmerman, tell me if he does anything else. >> yes, i believe so, yes. >> does that indicate he wants

to keep an eye on him? >> yes, sir. >> you said polling him is not legally improper, correct? >> it is not, no, sir. >> following polling somebody and approaching them is not illegal, correct? >> that's up to interpretation. >> if i walked up to you on the street and said hi. >> in that manner none whatsoever. >> how about what are you doing here? >> none what soer. >> how about get the hell out of here? >> nhung whatsoever. >> how about i don't like the way you are dressed? i don't like the fact have you gray on, get out of my face. >> that could be construed as confrontational. >> sure. but -- >> not illegal.

>> an illegal crime? >> no, sir. >> when the -- operator who said twice, tell me if he does anything else, then says are you following him, what does mr. zimmerman say? in your investigation, is there anything at all together suggest at that time that mr. zimmerman continue to follow mr. martin? >> at which point, sir? >> the point the officer said -- nonemergency operator said we don't need you to do that and mr. zimmerman said okay. >> i would say yes, there was. >> what -- what evidence would you have? >> end location. >> soar. >> i end location. where the incident ultimately

end. >> the fact that -- may i approach the witness, your honor? state's exhibit 139. because you know the event started where? >> the event as far as i'm concerned, started off that map. >> okay. talking about the pass cal altercation. i apologize. my understanding from -- what's your understanding as to when mr. zimmerman got to this area, what path he took. >> may i stand? >> please do. >> would you face forward? >> yes. >> my understand sing he's coming this way and he walks. okay. he walks all the way over here. he says he doesn't see him. he says he doesn't see him.

okay. and the altercation, physical altercation, started right there approximately. >> okay. great. thank you. with that as context then, do you know exactly where mr. zimmerman was when the non-emergency operator said we don't need you to do that? >> based on his statement, he was -- at his vehicle which would have been -- i believe off of that wherever he parked it. wherever he parked it on win tree -- twin tree. >> it is your understanding of the investigation that mr. zimmerman was at his vehicle when the officer said we don't need you to do that? >> when he was exiting his vehicle. that's my understanding. >> okay. then how many seconds went forward as he was walking before that conversation occurred? >> objection. >> i have -- >> not in evidence.

walking. >> sustain. >> how many seconds -- you heard the tape where you can hear him getting out of the car, correct? >> where i heard -- sound of the door being open which i interpreted that. >> got out of the car, right? >> yes. >> then you know that he was going -- walking in some direction because he said to the officer in response to are you following him, hay said yes, right? >> objection. facts not in evidence. >> facing a question. >> you know he was following him because he told the -- non-emergency operator that he was, right? >> yes, sir. >> and -- you know from the conversation that mr. zimmerman indicated to the non-emergency operator that he he cut between the buildings, right? >> yes, sir. >> okay. so -- more clear what -- parked his car somewhere in this area,

correct? >> correct. >> he's at -- >> can you face forward? >> i have to hear it again, obviously. somewhere very shortly thereafter, leaving house car, that's when it was asked -- are you following him. >> okay. and he said yes. >> mr. zimmerman indicated that mr. martin had gone between the -- buildings, he was out of sight, correct. >> yes. >> yet, you testified a moment ago pursuant to mr. zimmerman's statement he had gone down to -- >> that was his statement. as far as him having a visual on when he might have gotten out of the vehicle i really don't know. i can't say. i wasn't there. but he could have seen him at any point which way he was running. am i making myself clear? >> the jury can decide. i will walk you through a little bit more. my question while ago is whether or not had you evidence to support contention that mr. zimmerman continued to follow trayvon martin after being told

not to. do you have any evidence to support that? >> i would answer -- i have -- information, yes, that there was -- just based on where we low kay indicated trayvon and -- the fact that the altercation happened after his conversation. that's my interpretation. it was some -- >> let me ask you this. do you have anything to contradict mr. zimmerman's statement he walked the rest of the way to retreat and coming back towards his car when the interaction, wherever it was, between trayvon martin and him occurred? >> nothing tangible, no. >> go intangible on us then. what do you mean nothing tangible? in the circumstances that the -- totality of the whole thing that i'm looking at as i interpreted it, when he says follow walking behind trying to find a direction i construe that as poll.

he was trying to do something in the same direction where trayvon was going. >> trying to see where he was. >> as far as the word follow, as my report may indicate, i mean, but -- it is open for interpretation. >> as your report indicates there is nothing to suggest trayvon martin went straight down retreat view circle. he went between the buildings, correct? >> according to the statement by mr. zimmerman. yes. >> of course, all of those statements, including mr. zimmerman saying that he was attacked by trayvon martin coming from that area as well, correct? >> correct. >> and dlakt? >> months. >> lead defense attorney there

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we are seeing the recross here as the lead defense attorney, mark o'mayor a askinging the lead investigator, chris serino, if he had been there would he have stopped and spoken to trayvon martin. >> he armed himself with something that could cause great bodily injury or death by hitting the head against concrete, correct? >> yes, sir in the challenge

interview -- we go back and forth, challenge, interview, for information. again, for these purposes calling it challenge interview. mr. zimmerman stated to you his corner with it, there were people out there, quote, victimizing the neighborhood. right? >> yes, that's what he said, yes. >> do you believe his basis for that thought or even that feeling was well founded? let me ask it this way. how many burglary has occurred in that neighborhood the past four, five months? >> i don't have the exact numbers, sir. >> would you consider it to be a rash of burglaries? >> it would depend how many we are talking about. i don't know. >> limiting to the extent what you looked into it. you looked in to burgess. he was arrested a couple of weeks before. there were other burglaries you were aware of, correct? within the last few months

before this event? >> i would have to refresh may memory as far as the number to consider it a rash. a rash of burglaries. to consider it a rash of burglaries or a crime spree but i guess -- it is -- in his mind, yes. >> burglaries are what occur when the people are not at home, correct? burglary that we are talking about now are those where people are not at home when the crime occurs, correct? >> correct. >> it is called burglary or occupied dwelling, home invasion when somebody is home correct? >> yes, sir. >> that happened will as well, didn't it? >> yes, sir. >> a woman -- you were aware in your investigation a woman and her 4-month-old child had to hide in a bedroom closet while two guys downstairs took out her tv, laptop and other items. >> yes, sir. >> that was only weeks before february 26 of 2012 correct?

>> yes, sir. >> may have been months before, couple of months. >> that occurred. >> concerned the video -- i can put you back to the -- tape, my memory, tell me if i'm wrong, was that when you were -- bluffing mr. zimmerman about the idea troy vonn martin may have had a phone that was videotaping things, you certainly did it in as believable a way as you could, remember? >> yes, sir. >> you know how to get it across to him, correct? >> yes, sir. >> he seem smug as though he already made this decision about -- well, you can try to bluff me if you want but i know didn't have his phone out, was there any of that that came across 20u? >> no, sir. >> in this challenge interview that what you were looking for to see? >> partially, yes?

and none of that came across to you, did it? >> none at all. >> as a matter of fact, he seems quite interested in the fact that there may have been a videotape, correct? >> yes, he did. >> did he also say that he maybe without him mowing he hoped that the homeowners association put up another video camera somewhere in the back area? >> yes. >> he actually said to you not only do i hope that trayvon martin was somehow taping this or -- since he had the phone out or whatever, that somehow maybe it was on individual joe said -- thank god i hope -- i hope he was video taping? >> words to that effect, yes. >> he even said maybe it is being video taped from somewhere else, maybe the homeowners association put up a camera going right down that door walk that i wasn't aware of or -- for that matter, any one of the dozen neighbors may have had a video camera out, correct? >> yes, sir. >> didn't he also indicate he even hoped maybe the one person who had come out who we now know

to be john goode, maybe he videotaped it? >> i don't think he verbalized that but seemed to be very open to having something videoed. he -- yes. he seemed to be very elated in the prospect there was some sort of videotape. >> hoping that that would actually document what happened that night. >> yes, sir. >> another challenge that you did -- one moment. i believe i didn't do a complete pirouette.

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people who want to take ownership of their investments, like they do in every other aspect of their lives. back to the defense re-cross. >> this talk about the video mr. zimmerman seems not to notice miss lauer's number on the right-hand side, right? >> yes, sir. >> as he was walking you through it voluntarily going lou what up wanted him to do, right? i didn't see anything here, correct? >> yes, sir. >> had he looked to his right had he been in that correct spot, had he not been blocked by the tree, the jury sees another picture, he might see or could have seen the number correct?

>> yes, sir would he have evening them if he was walking by and -- the front door right there, is there my number on the side of that building. >> if i might carefully approach, your honor. >> state's 139. the front door here. number is sort of on this side. if mr. zimmerman had gotten to this point, looking around, doing whatever he was doing, somewhere in this point, might have a line of sight. >> misstating what mr. zimmerman said on video where he was when -- he did or didn't see. >> okay. i will clear that up.

>> by appearances yes. >> he seemed to be doing everything that he could to explain what he was doing. >> yes, sir. >> was this a situation where he was letting him run with it? were you letting him ask questions along the way? >> i believe some questions were asked for clarification. >> sure. >> and when he said as he is walking to the right of him and looking this way, car is somewhere near where he said he parked his, right? >> from what i recall, yes. >> he had the non-emergency call already known by the time he did the re-creation.

you knew an idea the series of the events, correct? >> yes, sir. >> you gnaw that he said hi gotten out of the car about here, right? >> yes, sir. >> that he was walking down that road doing something, walking, running, jogging, whatever he was doing, he was -- down that pathway, correct? >> yes, sir. >> he looked over and said i couldn't see any numbers. he looked to his left. correct? >> yes. >> did anything think to go excuse me, back up and look over this way, there is a number. why didn't you look at that number? >> no. >> did you ever do that afterwards? >> no. >> did that seem in the context he was trying to explain what happened that night what it ended up with that that was some type of active deception to you? >> i didn't interpret it as such, no. >> doesn't make a lot of sense

in your mind that he couldn't remember the name of the street, correct? >> correct. >> you questioned him about that, right? >> yes, sir. >> but did that show to you to be some act of deception on his part? >> the fact he couldn't remember the three streets, could have possibly, yes. did raise flags and concerns. >> okay. did that lead to any concern -- you addressed it in this confrontati confrontation, correct? >> yes, sir. >> you are okay with what you responded? >> that's all i could do is be okay with it. >> then you questioned about --

the number of things concerning the investigation. i want to talk to you about some of those. you had a chance to review that, correct? >> the medical examiner's report and findings were consistent with mr. zimmerman's story, were they not? >> yes, sir. >> as far as how he shot him, correct? >> where he shot him? >> yes, sir. >> the distance between the muzzle of the gun and clothing, correct? >> yes, sir. >> and there was a gap of a few inches between the clothing and mr. martin's chest. correct? >> yes, sir. >> evidencing that the muzzle of the gun was up against the chest -- sorry. up against the shirt, that his shirt was not up against his chest that there was a few inches difference? >> yes, sir. >> right. >> and didn't that support the

contention that mr. martin was hanging over mr. zimmerman and his shirt coming forward when the shot was fired? >> it did. yes. >> because -- having sfwaend -- he been standing up as i am now, his shirt would be up against the chest. >> probably. >> if i lean over my shirt is going to fall apart from my chest a few inches and that seems to be how it was, correct? >> yes, sir. >> ed does not support a contention that -- allegation that mr. zimmerman pressed that gun against trayvon martin's chest before he fired it, does it? as far as, evidence completely contradicts that type of a suggestion, doesn't it? from. >> from what i understand, yes. >> through your pressing of the gun of the chest, was there? >> not based on evidence that i read, no.

>> you saw the 7-eleven video since, right? you have seen it since? >> i don't think i have -- itself. i think that was after -- month. no. >> but have you seen it. >> i have seen stills. still photos. >> and the stills that you saw show trayvon martin in it? >> yes, sir. >> and show him the way he appeared that night? >> yes, sir. >> so -- when you say that certainly in the autopsy photograph you wanted to show mr. zimmerman, part of the challenge interview, correct? >> yes, sir. >> did you hit him with something, emotional, and to -- ground him that he had caused the death of this person? >> graphic, yes, sir.

>> that's the purpose of it, right? >> yes, sir. >> the picture of mr. martin at 7-eleven, do you agree that shows somebody at his height, whatever had a might have been, hoodie, wearing the outfit he was wearing, he did not look in the 7-eleven video to be the skinny kid you showed the picture of to mr. zimmerman, correct? >> correct. >> much larger looking individual? >> i would agree with you, yes. >> my height? or so? >> yes. >> if i was wearing a hoodie and had his shoes on, correct? >> yes. >> when you talk about relative size, i think you said mr. zimmerman, not today, but back then, wouldn't come across as a skinny kid correct? >> correct. >> when you look at the actual

height differential, there was quite a height differential, was than there? >> yes, there was. >> and, therefore, a reach differential? >> yes, sir. >> you know what that means? >> yes, do i. reach is -- measured arm to arm, sideways. >> may i have a moment, your honor? >> yes. >> the defense is taking a moment. so are we. e. a rich, never bitter taste cup after cup. 340 grams. [ sighs ] [ male announcer ] always rich, never bitter. gevalia.

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>> and that -- the defendant had made calls about them, right? >> yes, sir. >> okay. and -- i think mr. o'mara referred to it as black male, at least one of them he referred to -- do you know if the other individuals he called on was black or not? >> from what i recall research muching, yes, her. >> mr. o'mara asked you a bunch of questions about the. [ audio muted ] derogatory term and -- [ audio muted ] . mr. o'mara asked you about the words or -- that the defendant uttered. september -- sorry. february 26 at around 7:10, before he followed the victim. do you recall specifically under

his breath saying [ audio muted ] ? >> yes, sir. >> okay. [ audio muted ] >> do you read any comics? comics. >> no. >> caption where they have like a bubble, what the person is thinking. >> yes, sir. >> okay. at the time he got out of the car and was getting out of the car, the defendant said the words [ audio muted ] trayvon martin, correct?

mr. o'mara asked you a few questions about suffocating. you recall being asked questions about that, suffocating? >> yes, sir. >> defendant claims that the victim was suffocating him correct? >> yes, sir. >> okay. did you find any evidence of blood on the victim's hands? >> none that i'm aware of, no, sir. >> there was evidence that the -- defendant was bleeding especially on his mouth right here on his mustache, he had right under his most, had some blood, correct? >> yes, sir. >> may i approach the witness? >> yes, you may. >> i'm not going to hit. >> did you you can hit me. >> if i can -- and i'm hitting you, correct? weighs that the defendant is claling, suffocating, not going

to put my hand in your mouth. would you have your hands like that, just like this? or would you be fighting me? >> i would be fighting you. i would be fighting you. >> did you find any blood or anything on the defendant's hands? >> no, sir. >> you were also asked about the witness witnesses. state's exhibit 140. mr. o'mara showed you this. he asked new terms of -- i apologize. he may have shown you 139. assuming the defendant's story

is correct in terms of where the altercation had, et cetera -- >> yes, sir. >> did you have evidence that possibly he was going -- will was something going on behind these houses here? >> yes, sir. >> you were asked about the 7-eleven. i'm not aware of but what law states that an individual can't go into a 7-eleven with a hoodie? is there some law i missed? >> no, sir.