time for the republicans to match it. if they really want to partner in growing this economy, they'll act. that's "hardball" for now. thanks for being with us. "politicsnation" with al sharpton starts right now. thanks, chris, and thanks to you for tuning in. tonight's lead, history's repeating itself. and guess what? it's on the president's side. 48 years ago today, president johnson signed establishing medicare and medicaid. signing the social security act into law. over the years, it's strengthened our safety net and has saved millions of lives. today the president spent that monumental anniversary defending his own health law in going right after republicans who are standing in its way. >> rather than keep our focus on what should be our priority, which is growing our economy and

creating good middle class jobs, we've seen a certain faction of republicans in congress hurt a fragile recovery by saying they wouldn't pay the very bill the congress racks up in the first place, threatening to shut down the people's government if they can't get rid of obama care, wasting the country's time by taking something like 40 meaningless votes to repeal obama care is not a job plan. that's not a job plan. >> to repeal obama care is not a jobs plan. and shutting down the government to attack obama care, that makes no sense. but don't take my word for it. just ask certain republicans. >> shutting down a government is a suicidal political tactic. >> i don't look at that as very courageous. most of us see through it and realize that these people really just taking themselves out of the debate. i think it's a silly effort. >> do you think the republicans have the courage to do that?

>> frankly, probably not. >> i think it's the dumbest idea i've ever heard of. as long as barack obama is president, the affordable care act is going to be law. >> you heard him. the affordable care act is going to be law. but that hasn't stopped the farthest on the right from running to the floor with more garbage talk today. >> the american people deserve not to have this law implemented and enforced. >> i'm hearing that this law makes it harder for people to create jobs. this bill is going to make it harder on the middle class. >> this isn't working, and congress should defund it. >> make no mistake, what they say does not matter. the law is here to stay. it has been and it will be. if you need any more proof than today's anniversary should do it for you. 48 years ago, lbj faced the same

headwinds in fighting for medicare. back then, it was another gop hero trying to tear the programs apart. it was ronald reagan. and he sounded an awful lot like those who are trying to defeat the health care law today. >> this was simply an excuse to bring what they wanted all the time, socialized medicine. >> the model for socialized medicine has already been tried, and it failed. >> from here it's a short step to all the rest of socialism. >> we can continue down the path towards european socialism. >> he will wait for the government to tell him where he will go to work and what he will do. >> the government telling you what you must do. >> guess what, republicans? medicare is not going anywhere. and neither is the president's health care plan. joining me now is congresswoman

jan schakowsky, democrat from illinois, and "washington post" dana milbank. thank you both for being on the show tonight. >> thank you, reverend al. >> congresswoman, when will the gop learn? when will they learn the health care law is here to stay? >> well, this is really back to the future. you're right. the republicans were against it, against medicare. ronald reagan was the chief lobbyist against that at the time. and now no one would think of repealing medicare. i don't know when they will ever learn. but you know, reverend al, this isn't just about politics, that's for sure. 129 million americans have a preexisting condition, and the discrimination against them is going to go away in january. what a relief that will be for millions and millions of americans. >> dana, you know, they despise health care so badly that they're telling uninsured people not to sign up for health care

coverage. there is a reuters report that quotes -- i'm quoting saying republicans and their allies are mobilizing a counter-offensive to dissuade uninsured americans from obtaining health coverage. i mean, that's a lot of despising something to tell uninsured people don't sign up for coverage for their own health. >> right. and we keep asking ourselves why are they doing this. in fact, if you count all the senate votes to appeal obama care, they're up to 67 by my count. and all these other extraordinary efforts. there was a hint as to why just yesterday a group of 50 conservative groups wrote a letter to the house republican leadership pleading with them to have this showdown. shut the government down if necessary to get rid of obama care. and the justification was if they don't do it now, the benefits, the entitlements are going to start kicking in next year. and the presumption is the program, like medicare, will start becoming popular when people realize all the things

that are in it. if they want to stop it, they have to stop it now before people realize what is in it. >> you know, congresswoman, they're trying to change the public positioning on this. there is house republicans that are circulating a memo suggesting that lawmakers hold media tours with local business leaders, bashing obama care. but i'm quoting the memo. make sure the participants will be 100% on message. while they do not have to be republicans, they need to be able to discuss the negative effects of obama care on their employees. now that coupled with the fact that right-wing media has given the gop a platform for their campaign to defund health care law, listen to this. >> there is going to be a big push by conservatives to use this as an opportunity to defund

obama care. >> either you republicans get off your backside and stand as a bald contrast to obama care and make a courageous stand or get out of the way. and we'll -- >> trying a ground game of gop lawmakers touring around media tours. they have the sky attack from the right wing media. they are really trying to shoot this law down that's helping people. >> it's absolutely incredible. i think it's a kind of malpractice. this law is going to help businesses, small businesses in particular, but really, it creates more options for middle-sized and large businesses as well. and certainly for ordinary americans, this is really just such a blessing for people to be able to finally get insured. tens of millions of people. and it's like before medicare came in. half of all seniors had no

insurance. and now all of them do. all of us do. and so it's really a wonderful program. and now americans i think are starting to ask what does this mean for me, rather than this sort of abstract policy discussion about obama care. and the majority of americans would rather fix it than repeal it all together. so even there, the republicans are on the wrong side. and one more thing. there are members of congress who are saying they are going to refuse to help people who come to their offices and want help to enroll. amazing. >> you know, and when i say that they're doing this, dana, for a law that is helping people, you know, another day, another good news about the health care law. maryland, maryland is now reporting that its health insurance premiums will be lower than expected. a 21-year-old nonsmoker will be

able to buy health insurance that costs as low as $93 a month starting october 1st. i mean, is this what the gop is really worried about, the huge success of the program? >> well, i think that's why you have these 50 conservative leaders saying you got to fight it now before all these benefits kick in. that's exactly what they're worried about. look, there is going to be good news and there is going to be bad news as any program is implemented. and the good news here is obvious. all the people who needed coverage are going to be getting it. the republicans, the congresswoman's colleagues, republican colleagues in the house, they're saying -- their formula this week is stop government abuse. but i think the real formula of the house republicans are employing right now is stop government. and it just seems whatever it is they need to say no to it right now with everything they have, even if that means shutting down this government on october 1st. >> congresswoman, do you feel that there are any republicans that are among your colleagues

in the congress that are trying to move to some kind of common ground here and make sense out of this and try to avoid closing down government and encourage their fellow republicans not to do that? >> well, you certainly played some of the clips of republicans that are worried that there will be a backlash if they decide to shut down the government. and reverend al, i want to remind people that october 1, they can start signing up for obama care. they can actually enroll. and people that have questions about it should go to health care.gov, which is a really usable site that will give the facts, not the politics, just the facts about what will be available. i think fighting this law, threatening to shut down the government is really a losing political strategy for the republicans. >> congresswoman jan schakowsky, and dana milbank, thanks for your time this evening.

>> thank you. coming up, president obama calls our gop lawmakers for caring more about their job than yours. >> if folks in washington really want a grand bargain, how about a grand bargain for middle class jobs? how about a grand bargain for middle class jobs? >> plus, it's happening again. a new secret plan to take down the president's agenda is revealed tonight. the memo that a group of right wingers doesn't want you to see revealed tonight. and bill o'reilly has been taking some personal shots at me. tonight my open letter to him. it's optimistic, and it celebrates our great country can. and what is on your mind? send me a question or comment. e-mail me. friend or foe, i want to know. "reply al" is coming. i think farmers care more about the land

than probably anyone else. we've had this farm for 30 years. we raise black and red angus cattle. we also produce natural gas. that's how we make our living and that's how we can pass the land and water back to future generations. people should make up their own mind what's best for them. all i can say is it has worked well for us. but, dad, you've got... [ voice of dennis ] allstate. with accident forgiveness, they guarantee your rates won't go up just because of an accident. smart kid. [ voice of dennis ] indeed. are you in good hands? i'to guard their manhood with trnew depend shields and guards. the discreet protection that's just for guys.

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talk about what should be the number one concern for everyone in washington. creating jobs. >> even before the financial crisis hit, we were going through a decade where a few at the top were doing better and better, but most families were working harder and harder just to get by. nobody who works full time in america should have to live in poverty. i'm going to keep on making the case and fighting for the fact that we need to raise our minimum wage, because right now it's lower than it was when ronald reagan took office. >> the president also proposed a new grand bargain with republicans in congress. he'll simplify the tax code if they invest in jobs. >> if folks in washington really want a grand bargain, how about a grand bargain for middle class jobs? how about a grand bargain for middle class jobs. so i'm going to try offering some of the serious people in both parties should be able to

support. a deal that simplifies the tax code for our businesses and creates good jobs with good wages for middle class folks who work at those businesses. >> but republicans like john boehner and mitch mcconnell rejected the president's proposal before he even gave his speech. it's a plan that could create jobs, but republicans are only interested in creating gridlock. joining me now is nia-malika henderson and james peterson. thank you both for joining me. >> thanks, rev. >> good to be here. >> james, now republicans are even refusing to compromise to create jobs? i mean, won't voters remember that? >> i hope so. i hope the voters also remember the fact that the republicans are accusing the president of taking this plan to the media. actually, he is taking this plan to the people. and if we can go into some kind of time warp to go back 10, 15 years, this corporate tax rate as well as infrastructure

spending and jobs around infrastructure would be considered republican plans. so the idea that all of the sudden before the plan and the details even get out that they can reject it goes to this sort of gridlock that has been the modus operandi for the congress for the last five or six years. >> you know, nia-malika, the president took it right to the republicans. he is not pulling any punches. watch this. >> for most of this year, we've seen an endless parade of distractions and political posturing and phony scandals. if washington spent as much time and energy these past two years figuring out how to grow our economy and grow our middle class, as it spent manufacturing crises in pursuit of a cut at all cost approach to deficits, we would be much better off. we would be much better off. i don't want to go through the same old arguments where i propose a new idea and the republicans just say no because it's my idea. >> i mean, nia-malika, are the

gloves off? it seems kind of straight forward there. >> indeed. what he is clearly trying to do, he is trying to frame this debate before it actually happened. interesting that he went to a very red state, corkers, about corker's own backyard. corker had been in some ways a partner to the president, at least more of a moderate in terms of considering some of the president's plans. it doesn't look like that is going to happen this time. he already came out and said that he was skeptical of it. but i think it's smarter of the president to go on the offense. we'll see what happens. congress folks are going on recess. they'll be back in their own neighborhoods. they'll probably be having some town halls. it will be interesting to hear what comes out of that, what sort of complaints constituents are having. everybody knows the middle class is hurting. a pew poll shows 85% of people who consider themselves middle class are worried about staying in the middle class. >> you know how professor peterson, the disparity in

incomes and the income gains over the last three decades, i mean, it's really telling. look at this. the blue line showed that over the last three decades, the poorest 20% in this country had income gains of 16%. but look at this red line. during the same period, the top 1% enjoyed gains of 281%. i mean, this kind of disparity ought to alarm everybody across-party lines. >> it really should. it's one of the greatest challenges facing our nation in the 21st century. it's a problem that president obama has presided over. but it's not one that he started. and it looks to be getting worse and worse. income inequality is at record levels. interesting about the president's comments and how he is positioning this particular move to try to get this plan put in place. you notice there have been sort of organized protests across the nation around fast food wages. >> right. >> so it's interesting for the president to try to tap into

that and say hey, we've got to get an adjustment to the minimum wage. if it's not a living wage, let's at least adjust for inflation, and that will go a long way towards beginning to address the income inequality. the concentration of the wealth at the top 1%, and this is a global thing, but it's also here in america is one of the most striking, one of the most profound challenges facing us as a nation in the 21st century. >> you know, nia-malika, one of the things that concerns me, though, is when you look at the words and the war on the poor that it seems that the right has launched. look at this. >> if people are feeling that they're not being paid adequately, then they've got to find a job some place elsewhere the business model pays higher wages. >> it's not that there are jobs that americans won't do anymore. it's just that americans don't want to work. the entitlement society is too big. we have the numbers yesterday. 101 adults in this country get federal assistance of some kind.

>> what we're trying to say is mediocrity should be rewarded there is no responsibility on you to do anything. we'll make sure that corporate america keeps paying you more than you really should earn. >> see, this is what concerns me. because with this kind of talk, i mean, how can we expect them to pass any legislation that will help americans? >> it's certainly a dangerous tone, this antipathy towards americans, this sense that americans are lazy and they don't actually want to work. it certainly runs counter to what we know about americans, the people who built this country. we have a fight going on here in d.c. where walmart wants to expand their company here, but the d.c. city council is very much pushing back, asking for a living wage of $12. we'll have to see what happens with that. is it better that they pay 8 bucks an hour or have no jobs at all? so it's a fight. i think we're going to see a long, hot summer of working class folks really standing up

for themselves. it's almost a replay of, you know, sort of operation zero, ground zero. >> nia-malika henderson and james peterson, thank you both for your time. >> thanks, rev. >> thank you. still ahead, exposing the gop secret plan to take down president obama's agenda. the right-wingers are caught red-handed on this one. we have the memos to prove it. plus, my open letter to bill o'reilly. he has gotten a lot of things wrong. and i'm correcting the record tonight. stay with us. [ male announcer ] if you suffer from a dry mouth

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to fox news host bill o'reilly, they're just a punch line. >> al sharpton and the grievous industry strike back. that is the subject of this evening's talking points memo. >> grievance industry. that's how bill o'reilly boils it down. the frustrations and the hopes of millions of people who feel that too often the legal system is stacked against them, everything from racial profiling and police brutality to unequal sentencing, including death sentencing. since he is so far off base, i thought i would take time tonight to offer this open letter to bill o'reilly. maybe he'll learn, even learn something different. because having a grievance and fighting to change it, that's not an industry. it's one of the finest traditions in this great country, and it dids back to the earliest days of the united states. the idea was so important to the

founders that they put it in the first amendment of the constitution. quote, the right of people to peaceably to assemble to petition the government for a redress of grievances. in 1848, women gathered in seneca falls, new york, to demand equal rights as citizens. they said that, quote, women do feel themselves aggrieved, oppressed and fraudulently deprived of their most sacred rights. they were aggrieved. and they got together as americans to make their voices heard. in 1963, reverend martin luther king jr. wrote his letter from a birmingham jail that he hoped white clergy members would serve as the channel through which our just grievances could reach those in the power structure. that same year, the new york sometimes called the march on washington the greatest assembly

for the redress of grievances that this capital has ever seen. dr. king later reminded us that the history of americans, the history of confronting injustice, even if it makes some people uncomfortable. and he told us we wouldn't have to wait long for progress. >> how long? not long. because all through the moral universe is long, but it bends towards justice. >> america has been bending towards justice for over 200 years. along the way from the beginning until now, they have always been people without the ability to rise above their own narrow interests and petty score settling. the founding fathers considered people who looked like me to be just 3/5 of a person. my ancestors in south carolina were slaves, and it took a civil war to set them free. from seneca falls, it took 72

years for women to get the right to vote, a long time. people just considered it normal for women not to get to vote. but the arc of justice bent in the right direction. it took 100 years for the civil rights movement to send jim crow packing. the grievances we faced in america have changed over time, just as the country has changed. but today there are still deep injustices that we must address. our criminal justice system too often treats millions of americans differently because of the color of their skin. right here in new york city, under the stop and frisk policy, the police stop more than half a million people last year. 87% of those that were stopped were minorities. but 89% of the stops resulted in no arrests, no summons. they were just people whose rights were violated for no legal reason. the night trayvon martin was

killed. they let his shooter walk free without even conducting an investigation. they just took his word for it. if the police in sanford had acted justly, maybe trayvon martin's parents wouldn't have had a grievance and called me and others to come publicize their demands for the arrest and a proper investigation. i know even the president of the united states wants the stand your ground laws reexamined. >> for those who resist that idea that we should think about something like the stand your ground laws, i just ask people to consider if trayvon martin was of age and armed, could he have stood his ground on that sidewalk? >> america is the greatest country in the world because we have the freedom to challenge our nation to be even better. we're always striving to form a more perfect union. we've long passed moved un --

moved past unfair tariffs and 3/5 of a person, beyond denying women a right to vote and beyond the control of jim crow. now we must fight against criminal injustice and economic inequality. we fight for equal rights for all americans, for gays, for new immigrants, for women to earn pay for equal work. sure it makes some people uncomfortable. but this country has always evolved because people stood up, addressed the problems of their time, and fought to change them. that's the greatest of america. now you know, bill. sincerely yours, reverend al. joining me now is martin luther king iii. thanks for being here, first of all, martin. >> thank you, rev. >> you know, protests over injustice is a key part of our history and of yours personally.

>> it certainly is. and in fact that is part of what we're doing on august 24th as we reenact the march on washington. my dad always used those techniques. he also had a public policy agenda that he had in place that would ultimately create laws that would provide change for our nation. >> and he was always denigrated and called names. you know, the names that he called into stuff he had to endure, our stuff today is petty. the first thing they did is try to act like he was involved in some industry. they indicted him for income tax, said he was stealing money from the organization when it ended up totally being untrue. but always go after your character rather than deal with what you're trying to raise as an issue. >> well, that is certainly very true. what dad did, of course, is use the laws of the land to be exonerated. and they had to of course go through a court process. >> that's right. >> unfortunately, in america, the justice system has many

challenges. when we look at 59% of those in jail being people of color, we've got to find a better way to address justice for all, to have a more inclusive system of indigent defense. a number of things have to happen. but it takes people being on the streets. not nonviolent street heat i should say. >> and at the same time, we are all for correcting people, and we do in terms of their personal behavior and family and all that. but that does not justify dealing with the unequal system in terms of the justice system and other things, whether you're well-behaved or not, whether your family is correct or not, we see the plight based on a racial inequality. >> well, yes. i would say certainly, unfortunately, that is where we still are. >> right. >> we're a much better nation. we got to move to higher ground. we have to operate at an optimum level. we're not operating at the level that we need to as a society.

and certainly even in our own community, there are things we must do. so i think the responsibilities with the government and within our own households. >> you know yesterday president obama met with some of news the civil rights leadership to discuss the supreme court ruling on the voting rights act. which you have fought all your life helping reauthorize. your father helped to set it in the first place. and the president said yesterday, when you think about it, this is small bore stuff compared to the lynches, shootings, and killings that happened 50 years ago. ultimately, this is within our power to change. martin, are you hopeful we can change and maintain the teeth of the voting rights act, august 24th and other efforts are trying to do? >> i'm certainly convinced that we can. we've got to get some movement in congress. and obviously there have been hearings already. but we've got really some monumental work to do. i think that when people of all

ilks and all walks of life come together, blacks and whites and latinos and hispanics and people from every walk of life come together on the 24th, when the nation sees that there is great interest, and the fact that nobody should ever be having an issue voting in 2013 and beyond. we should have theoretically done that. but unfortunately, those teeth taken out, we've got to find a new way to ensure that everybody can participate in the process. >> you talk about everybody. when you look at even across racial lines, look at the the income inequality in the country. since 1978, workers pay only increased by 5.7%, yet fee increase has been 726%. this is across the board. this is unbelievable. it brings me back to your father's last effort was the poor people's campaign. economic inequality across all racial lines. >> yes. and absolutely. i think that that's another issue that we've got to

constructively find a way to address, because the disparity certainly should not be that great. certainly one may understand why a ceo may make more than an employee. but when you're talk 700% is almost abysmal. it is beyond belief. we can and we must do better. the only way that changes, though, is americans have to come together and engage in action. >> you know, when we talk about the criminal justice system voting of course, the criminal justice system is also paramount in what we're raising this year. you know, whites and blacks use marijuana at the same rate, but blacks are four times more likely to be arrested. these are the kind of disparities we have to address. >> still, we still know, you and i and others have filed around racial profiling. profiling is very real. it's something again, i think sensitivity, diversity and human relations training is something

the police departments need, as well as corporate america, as well as the governing structure. those are the kind of things that hopefully begin to help us understand cultures. when we understand cultures and people, maybe we won't just target a certain group. the reason why the prison populations are so high with african-americans because we've been targeted. that is not right. >> and it also is still gender-based. women still only earn 77 cents to a man's dollar. all of these issues we must continue to stand up and fight for until we make it right, a more perfect union for everyone. >> well, that's why we are calling for the march on washington. it is not just a commemorative march. it is a march with real action -- and a real action-oriented agenda. i would like to say oh, we made it, reverend are. this is just symbolic. no, it's real there are real issues. people have suffered all across this nation. we can and we must, and we are a better nation than the behavior we're exhibiting. >> martin luther king iii, i'm

glad that you are here tonight. and you heard my letter to bill o'reilly. i remember, you made it possible for me to be kind of close with your mother. she used to tell me al, you've got to be bigger than your critics. grow. how you fight back and use bad language. so she hopes sees i'm getting a little better. i'm not there yet, but i'm getting a little better. martin luther king iii, thank you for being here tonight. coming up, a plan to destroy the obama agenda is revealed. you don't want to miss this. [ male announcer ] what do you get when you take 100% whole grain brown rice and wheat and bake it with real sweet potato or savory red bean? a new line of triscuit crackers with a delicious taste and a crispier crunch. brown rice triscuit. a new take on an old favorite. thto fight chronic.ste osteoarthritis pain.h. to fight chronic low back pain.

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dizziness or fainting may occur upon standing. take the next step. talk to your doctor. cymbalta can help. we're back with a top republican school official who gets an f in fairness. while pushing right wing solutions to education reform. tony bennett became a conservative star by privatizing schools, handing out vouchers, and cracking down on teachers pay when he was athe head of the schools in indiana. but now a report he was caught cooking the books at a charter school that just happened to be run by a rich republican donor. the ap obtained e-mails showing that last year this charter school originally got a c grade, potentially hurting the funding it would get from the state. so tony bennett stepped in to

personally fix it, telling his staff to change the grading formula to make sure the school would get an a grade. why would he do it? maybe because the school was founded by a rich republican named crystle dehann, who in the past had donated $138,000 to bennett's campaign. even a school kid can see this adds up to something pretty fishy. the right wing attempt to undermine our public school system. did mr. bennett and his rich gop friends think we wouldn't notice how he failed our school kids? nice try, but we flunk you. ♪ [ male announcer ] ah... retirement. sit back, relax, pull out the paper and what?

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it's happening again. mother jones has revealed a secret right-wing plan to destroy president obama's agenda. it's known as groundswell.

the magazine obtained documents revealing a, quote, 30 front war seeking to fundamentally transform the nation. and bring down the president. members include jenny thomas, wife of supreme court justice clarence thomas, allen west, and a top aide for senator ted cruz. their strategy includes hyping scandals, crafting anti-obama messaging, coordinating with conservative media, pressuring moderate republicans, and collaborating with gop lawmakers. these far right activists have had meetings with top republican lawmakers like speaker boehner and darrell issa. this is money and the power rubbing off on congress. but if we shine the light on it, maybe we can make a change. joining me now, david corn. thanks for coming on the show,

and great reporting. >> good to be with you, rev. thanks for having me. >> can you tell what's kind of influence does this group have on lawmakers? >> well, let me give you the basics first. we at mother jones have got hundreds of pages of their internal documents. we made them public, put them online a couple of days ago. and groundswell is a coalition of right wing groups and activists led by jenny thomas, as you said, and others, who get together on a weekly basis to put together strategy and messaging points so they all can speak together in unison and try to change the political narrative, you know, from a far-right perspective. they have aides on the hill, people who work for senator sessions and ted cruz and some of the tea party members in the house side who constantly are coordinating with them and sending them requests for information and for advice and for help. how can you help us on the debt ceiling showdown. we want to ask gina mccarthy,

the epa nominee a few weeks ago, a few months ago back, some questions. what should we be asking her? >> they do actual strategizing and research for a lot of the things to really try and stop the president's agenda and try to stop things from moving forward? >> that's what they're doing. it's exactly the agenda that you would think they would have. and they try to come up with these very nifty messaging points to win the narrative. they think they lose the narrative again and again to the left and to progressive groups. so they spend a lot of time thinking what is the right words we can use. and one exchange of what one set of memos that we posted, they talk about, you know, when you say conservative republican tea party, to minorities, that connotes racism. so we need a different name for ourselves. we should call ourselves frederick douglass republicans. one problem is they spelled frederick and douglass wrong. they --

>> this whole frederick douglass republican was a phrasing they wanted to use to mock, not that they had any commitment to what the historic frederick douglass was all about. and on the line, they didn't even know how to spell the names right. >> a lot of what they do is about marketing, bullet points, messaging. and they really believe that there is nothing wrong with their policies. that they just have to put a different icing on the cake. they have a long exchange trying to figure out what they should call their voter identification efforts. they concede again that people hear that and they think the republicans and conservatives are acting racist and they're trying to dilute the black vote. and so they say maybe we should call it voter rights, election integrity, and all these other phrases. but the core is there. >> election integrity. how long has the group been meeting? when do they start meeting? >> they started meeting earlier this year of february, march. one other interesting thing that we haven't mentioned yet, they

see obama and progressives, people like you as the enemy, but they also see another enemy, and that's karl rove. these guys are so far to the right, they think karl rove is an enemy of conservatives. >> wow. >> and they have a secret project. they call it -- they call it the karl rove project to undermine rove by getting people to stop making donations to his superpac, by making him in their words, toxic to the grassroots. >> now one of the people in the group, a central figure in groundswell is jenny thomas, the wife of supreme court justice clarence thomas. i mean, is there a conflict of interest here when justice thomas has to then go and rule on cases involved in these very same issues? >> well, jenny thomas has gotten what some criticism as has clarence thomas in the past because she was a lobbyist against the obama care, making money trying to make -- repeal the law. and then her husband votes on it. she ran a group that benefitted

from the citizens united decision. so she could have made tens if not hundreds of thousands of dollars off that decision. repealing voting rights, abortion, gay marriage. >> and she is on this group that is actively strategizing against it. that's not a conflict, david? >> and some of these groups actually involved may be bringing cases to the court, doing friends of the court briefs. it's very, very close. i mean, for there to be an official -- an official conflict, this is really sort of walking the line. i will tell you one thing that most americans don't realize. there is a code of conduct, an ethical -- an ethics code for everyone in the federal judiciary, except supreme court justices. they don't apply these rules to themselves. but congresswoman louis slata later this week is going to introduce a bill that will make this code of conduct apply to supreme court justices. >> we'll see how much the

justices of the supreme court applaud that as further transparency in government. david corn, great reporting. we'll be watching and monitoring this group and your reporting on it. thank you for your time. >> people can see all these documents at motherjones.com. thanks a lot. >> all right, david. up next, friend or foe, i want to know. "reply al" is next. new kellogg's raisin bran® with omega 3 from flax seeds. plus plump juicy raisins. flax seed? who are you? i still got it. [ male announcer ] invest in your heart health with kellogg's raisin bran® cereals. apply cold therapy in the first 24 hours. but not just any cold. i only use new thermacare® cold wraps. targettemp technology delivers a consistent, therapeutic cold to stop pain and start healing.

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it's time for "reply al." keep sending me all your questions. friend or foe, i want to know. peggy writes, i was wondering. how can it be that congress can still get paid even though they refuse to do their job. good question, peggy. i think if they had the same criteria you and i had, not getting paid if they didn't work, we wouldn't have the gridlock that we have.

scott says what cause have you lent your support to that you're most proud of? you know, scott, i've fought a lot of causes, fought a lot of battles. you know what i'm most proud of, january 12th, 1991, i was lead agnone violent march in brooklyn, new york, benson hurst. a young male had been killed. a young man ran out of the mob and stabbed me, tried to kill me. i confronted the fact that now i've got though know what i really believe. i came up in the aftermath of dr. king's life, and i preached forgiveness and nonviolence. and i fought with myself to forgive that young man that stabbed me. i ended up going to court testifying that i forgave him and asked the jury to give him leniency. the judge gave him nine years in jail anyway. he wrote me from jail and thanked me for forgiving him. i got enough strength to come to

visit him in jail. he cried and thanked me. the most proud of i've had in life is the battles i've had with myself to make me become a person that can practice what i preach. because gandhi is right. the change you seek must begin with you. and if you know you change and evolve -- i'm not there yet, but evolving -- you'll be most proud of that. thanks for watching. i'm al sharpton. "hardball" starts right now. the weiner circle getting smaller. let's play "hardball." good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. it's time to get to the heart of the matter and why the weird pieces of the story, why we care. in fact, why i care. you can say all you want about all politics being local, but the role of mayor of new york