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tv   The Last Word  MSNBC  August 1, 2013 10:00pm-11:01pm PDT

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now, on that, we can agree. now it is time for "the last word" with lawrence o'donnell, have a great night. ariel castro was guaranteed today by a judge that he would spend the rest of his life in prison, and in circumstances probably better than the prison he created for the girls he trapped in his home for ten years, including the now 6-year-old girl who was born there. after one of the victims and
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family members of the other victims told the court of their suffering, ariel castro stunned the courtroom by not only speaking before his sentencing but by opening up the window into the defensive and self-justifying and lying mind of a madman. >> trying to get it out. maybe before that i -- this family, eventually i -- after i held jobs, i always worked, what i'm trying to get at is, people are trying to paint me as a monster, and i'm not a monster. i'm sick, i didn't -- the sexual problem, i -- eventually i married.
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i had four children. lived my own life, [ inaudible ] i believe i am addicted to porn. to the porn that really -- also, i just don't realize that what i'm doing is wrong.
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i know it is not an excuse. i'm not trying to make excuses here, because i know when i told -- i'm not -- uh, i been in this position for a long time, 25, 30 years. i don't think i can handle that. i did a very good job, then i started slacking off. trying to get fired, because i knew it was too much, this job is too stressful. and coming home to my situation. and i just couldn't juggle -- >> castro went on the ramble from a description of his sex life when he lived alone to that impulsive moment of his first kidnapping.
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>> i was -- at that time i was -- i continued to practice the art of masturbation and pornography. and it got so bad that i -- at least two or three hours a day. and when i was finished i would just collapse. when i think of the first victim, i didn't even plan it that day. it wasn't something that -- was like i did it in advance and i thought about it. i didn't do that. that day i went to family dollar, and i heard her say something about she needed to live somewhere.
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and i reacted to that. when i got out of there that day, i didn't say i'm going to try to find women. that is not my character. i'm not a violent person. had a family -- i do have value for human life, because every time i came home i was so glad of the situation -- and my daughter, she never saw any violence going on at the house, your honor. anybody can testify -- i -- >> the judge pointed out to castro that some of his statements were inconsistent with his guilty plea to repeated counts of rape and imprisonment of his victims.
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>> you said that you are a victim and that you may have been a victim in the past in your childhood. i don't know, but from the time of majority, you have not been a victim, you have been a victimizer. >> joining me now, marcia clark, and linda fairstein, former chief of prosecution of sex crimes. linda, i'm struck by his need to tell us that he is not a monster. he says i'm not a monster, i'm sick. and you heard him go through a bunch of defensive characterizations of himself. is that typical in your experience of defendants like this who know they are guilty of what they did. but feel that there are certain parts of it -- parts of that story, anyway, that they want to soften. >> well, yes, it is entirely self-serving, and marcia is
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saying the same thing over and over again, every time he says i am not a monster, he describes conduct that is monstrous, this man drove a school bus for years. those children were exposed to that. every time he said i didn't mean to hit my wife, but her conduct made me do it. gina got in the car because she wanted to get in the car. the most self-serving and just horrible, horrible repetitive denial that all of these things were willful acts and willful acts, exactly, of a monster. >> marcia clark, i was fascinated by that moment that i would have actually liked to hear more from him when i picked up the first victim. i didn't plan it that day.
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it was not something that he set out to do. he said he just heard her say something at the store and then that triggered whatever this madness was will him. when he embarked on this, and that is what is so psychologically fascinating, the triggers, why did he not do this particular crime before? why was this the moment and why was this the girl? >> i wouldn't be so quick to believe him if he says he didn't plan it, it was in the moment, and she says this one thing and he went off and did it. i wouldn't personally buy that at all. it is really typical of pedophiles and this type of predator in general, to try to disclaim any kind of premeditation, to try to disclaim any real responsibility. so if you notice all of these statements, as linda, i'm sure has seen throughout her career, these statements are all going through himself making him seem like the victim. as the judge pointed out. he says he has no responsibility, i'm an addict,
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and then shift the blame to the victim. as linda pointed out. you see that with domestic violence all the time. the woman made me do it. something she did and said. always it comes down to the victim who somehow inspired the conduct and made him do what he did. and in this case, something she said at the store made him do it. i think that is just the typical way that they avoid responsibility. in my opinion, it is most likely true that he was planning this in his mind or in his fantasies for quite a long time before he finally acted out. that he had many things in his mind that he was dreaming about, fantasizing about, plotting, even if he didn't have concrete plans this idea was a seed that had been growing inside him for quite sometime before he acted out. >> that was a very good point, marcia, that a lot of what he said was not believable. i didn't catch that point that you just said, that actually sounded credible to me when he said it.
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but i see what you are saying. the one thing that nobody is buying, the crazy comments he made about these people he imprisoned. and he talked about, well actually, that sex was all consensual, when in fact he already pled to rape for that sex. but i want to hear more from him, his version of an apology, which was another extraordinary part of his statement today. let's listen to that. >> i don't know why -- i mean, with everything going on -- i had a job and a home. and i -- i had everything going on for me, your honor. i have been working and providing. i just hope they find it in their heart to forgive me.
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we have a lot of family live -- living in that home. that -- everything that was going on was not -- the truth -- [ inaudible ] and gina -- is -- she had moments. a person that has been tortured doesn't act normal, doesn't act withdrawn and everything. on the contrary, she was happy. michelle, from day one, no one missed her.
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i never saw -- but -- i feel -- when they questioned, when they questioned my daughter, you know -- that is okay. but they should question me, i'm her father. if they would have questioned me -- they would have seen -- it would have ended right there. >> linda fairstein, so much to react to from his personal psychiatric observation of the victims, what he thinks is their moods, which is just madness to listen to.
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the statement, why didn't the fbi question me? he is trying to blame the fbi for the girls remaining in prison because they didn't question him. >> he is trying to blame everybody for what his conduct was all the way. and as marcia said, i'm entirely skeptical, this was not his first chance to abduct girls, whether it was fantasy. they will be able to examine this case, and rape her repeatedly, and then bring two more women in. so the tip of the pathology, it is just shocking to hear him claim these things and claim it to the world. >> this is the way he gets to go to sleep at night.
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as he says, hey, i see the girls out there, they seem to be perfectly okay after their captivity, so how bad could it have been? >> yes, and so this is the thing that is interesting, lawrence, you're so right. there is a fascination to the delusional quality of the story he tells himself. but they do this, in my experience, they tell themselves these stories about it, it was consensual, the girls enjoyed it. they wanted it. all the things they tell themselves, they truly believe it. and even if they were confronted with evidence to the contrary, they would say that you're wrong, that you misperceive, that you don't understand these girls, these victims. they tell themselves these stories and truly believe it. which is why he was so open with his feelings about the case at the sentencing. you wouldn't expect anybody at the sentencing to be so open and he truly believes it is the
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truth. and believes he himself is the victim. so he doesn't feel any compunction about speaking this way. because there is no conscience as we perceive it. he has no understanding. >> marcia clark, linda fairstein, thank you for joining me on this very troubling coverage of this case. thank you for your guidance. coming up, the woman who survived being in captivity gives a statement. it is extraordinary. next. [ beeping ] ♪ [ male announcer ] we don't just certify our pre-owned vehicles. we inspect, analyze and recondition each one, until it's nothing short of a genuine certified pre-owned...
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before ariel castro was sentenced to spend the rest of his life in jail today, we heard from his three kidnap victims,
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two victims had family members speak for her, amanda berry's family spoke for her, and gina dejesus faced down her captor. >> i would like to tell you -- [ inaudible ] i cry every night. i worry about what would happen to me and the other girls every
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day. days never got shorter. days turned into nights. nights turned into days. the years turn into eternity, i knew nobody cared about me. you told me that my family didn't care. even on holidays, christmas was more traumatic,. nobody should ever have to go through what i went through or anybody else. not even your worse enemy. she never let me fall, i never let her fall.
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she nursed me back to health when i was dying from his abuse. my friendship with her is the only thing that as good out of the situation. we said we will some day make it out alive. and we did. you took 11 years of my life away. and i have got it back. i lived 11 years of hell. now your hell is just beginning. i will overcome all of this that happened. but you will face hell for eternity. from this moment on, i will not let you define me or who i am. i will live on, you will die a little every day. as you think about the 11 years, and the abuse you inflicted on us. what about you hypocritically going to church every sunday, coming home to torture us?
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you don't deserve anything, you deserve life in prison. i can forgive you, but i will never forget. >> joining me now is dawn hughes, a clinical psychologist. dr. hughes, the victims were used by ariel castro today, their attempts at their own recovery, some of which has been public, he used to say look, they seem to be getting along just fine, it couldn't be that bad. >> well, as your guest alluded to earlier, certainly this individual was a sexual predator. and we know they engage in denial, and minimization and rationalization. he exhibited all the characteristics, i'm not a violent guy. he is exhibiting the typical sexual predator behavior.
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>> and i want to go to what beth serrano said about speaking regarding amanda berry and why amanda berry doesn't want to talk about this. >> she does not want to talk about this day, she has not talked about it. she does not want other people to talk about these things. the main reason she doesn't want to talk about it is because she has a young daughter. she would love her to be the person who doesn't suffer. that will not control anything for a long time. please let her have control over this, because she can't protect her daughter. she will do anything to protect her daughter. >> amanda did not control anything for a long time. please let her have control over this. that is the challenge that these -- >> very important, very important. i mean, the hallmark of trauma is that helplessness and the lack of predictability and lack of control. to be involved in litigation is stressful for these people to go and relive it, usually involves
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a lot of psychological stress and anxiety. so many victims try to avoid talking about it, so they don't feel the pain and level of stress. so it is very important they make their own choices in their recovery, and that is what these women are choosing to do. >> and the different choices we saw today are not surprising. one decides i'm going to go into the courtroom and speak, and confront him. i'm going to remind him of what he is denying. >> sure. >> and two others say no, either i can't do that or i don't want to do that for the reasons amanda berry said. >> and we can't paint all trauma victims with the same brush. i mean, everybody comes into it with their own experience and their own way of healing. and part of us as a community, and us health professionals have to respect that. >> something that was very important was said.
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today is the last day we want to think about this. let's listen to that. >> today is the last day we want to think or talk about this. these events were not a place in our thoughts or our hearts. we will continue to live and love. we stand before you and promise you that our lives that we live will be not as a victim but as a survivor. >> i want to get into a piece of this that is truly extraordinary. where castro is concerned about having some kind of relationship rights with the child that he conceived in captivity. he had this exchange with the judge about it. let's listen to this. >> mr. castro, you are to have no contact with the victims, don't send letters or phone calls or have others contact
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them. >> are you referring to my daughter? >> yes, she is a victim, subject to three counts of endangering a child. so by law, she is a victim. >> i heard the last words, but if i -- [ inaudible ] >> if i am supposed to have no contact with them -- >> astonishing. and the daughter he is talking about is the one that he says, if you asked her would say he is the greatest daddy in the world. >> but this was a young, young girl who was raised in captivity who likely witnessed multiple types of abuses of not only her mother but the two other women. probably was engaged in some other activity perhaps that we don't know about.
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that is a traumatic experience for the child, somebody who is a sexual predator, perhaps a psychopath, exhibiting these signs, you don't want him to have contact with a child, who is developing and hopefully recover this mess that she found herself in. >> this is strange, if you take out the content and listen to the guy talk about, the work history, this guy could be anyone. you can see why he went years without anyone suspecting he was this guy. and we heard all the shock from people who knew him when he was first caught at this. they -- nobody thought he could possibly be capable of this, which i suppose is typical. >> right, they don't walk around with horns that say "i'm a predator." that is why we have to be aware of the signs and symptoms that we can teach young children and adults to be safe. in no way did these girls have any culpability in this.
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but they do roam among us. coming up, edward snowden is a legal resident of russia for a year at least. he left the moscow airport for where he is going, and how long he is going there, we don't know. and in the rewrite, the budget committee and testimony being tripped up. why the poor in this country shouldn't be ignored. it didn't really go so well for republicans and paul ryan on that. you know throughout history,
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away mitch mcconnell's senate seat, giving her a 45-43 advance over mitch mcconnell, who is also facing a 51% disapproval rating in his own state. that is an absolutely devastating poll result for any incumbent senator. up next, edward snowden is at an undisclosed location in russia tonight, where he can now legally remain for a year. and he has been offered a job by the russian rip off of facebook. to fight chronic osteoarthritis pain. to fight chronic low back pain. to take action. to take the next step. today, you will know you did something for your pain. cymbalta can help. cymbalta is a pain reliever fda-approved to manage chronic musculoskeletal pain. one non-narcotic pill a day, every day, can help reduce this pain. tell your doctor right away if your mood worsens, you have unusual changes in mood or behavior
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in the spotlight tonight, edward snowden's new life, today, edward snowden was granted asylum by the russian government for one years, according to snowden's lawyer. he will live in an undisclosed area, and has already received job offers, from one job that was basically a rip-off of facebook. over the past weeks, we've seen the obama administration show no respect for international or domestic law. that is of course, the standard hysterical overstatement that is part of every edward snowden statement. snowden continued. but in the end, the law is winning. i thank the russian federation for granting me asylum in accordance with its laws and obligations.
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the kremlin's spokesperson is actually trying to get away with the lie that the decision to grant asylum had been made by immigration officials following the law. not but russian president vladimir putin. the white house today said it is extremely disappointed with the russian's decision, and is "evaluating the utility" of president obama's september trip to moscow for a bilateral summit. >> he has been charged with three felony counts. and he should be returned to the united states as soon as possible where he will be accorded due process and protections. this move by the russian government undermines a long standing form of cooperation, a
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cooperation that has recently been on the upswing since the boston marathon bombings. >> joining me, steve clemens, washington editor at large. we have predictions from john mccain, saying now is the time to fundamentally rethink our relationship with russia. lindsey graham, something similar. but this is not coming from the republican side of the aisle. chuck schumer says that russia has stabbed us in the back. and each day that mr. snowden is allowed to roam free is another twist of the knife. given russia's decision today, the president should recommend moving the g-20 summit. now steve, that is very harsh language coming from a liberal democratic senator and his
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reaction today. >> well, i think that we're going to see a number of reactions along those lines. but the fundamental reality is that russia is a member of the permanent five in the nations. it is a nation with a lot of nuclear weapons. it is a nation that has a significant share of oil and natural gas reserves. we have to continue to deal with russia, and russia will continue to be a consequential relationship. it is a nation we have to deal with. and i think that one of the mistakes as you and i talked about previously that the white house has made is that to a certain degree they are the ones that has kept the edward snowden story in the news each night and continued to create incentives, if you will, with a russia that has its own strategic objectives and doesn't always get what the united states has gotten from it. this needs to be thought out. and while this is a time that many people are posturing and
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saying things with a lot of bravado, at the end of the day russia has the deal with the rest of the world and each other. >> and at the end of the day, they have to deal with the olympics, they did say they have to obviously evaluate whether there can be a one-on-one summit. but jay carney was asked an interesting question today. asked if he thinks that snowden did the nation a favor by exposing these programs. and as you said there are plenty of people who think snowden did do the nation a favor in exposing these programs. and also committed a criminal act in the process. but listen to jay carney's answer, he doesn't answer the question if did snowden do a favor. listen. >> when you take an oath to protect the secrets of the united states, you're bound to protect them. and there are consequences if you don't. >> what do you make of jay carney not even going to a real answer of that question, of did
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he do the country a favor by opening up this debate? >> i think that jay carney knows that obama, the presidential candidate running in 2008 may very well have been a supporter of snowden telling the truth about a national state of security out of control. and now president obama sitting in the oval office has a different set of ideas of protecting secrets. but the bottom line is, the white house and obama have been too slow on delivering really on the government and the transparency that they have talked about. you know, you have dick durbin saying to president obama saying that the fica court was rigged and was completely a blank check for the establishment. when you have dick durbin making that kind of comment means the white house is in fragile
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territory. >> steve clemens, thank you for joining us tonight. thank you. coming up, sister simone is in the rewrite tonight teaching the republicans and paul ryan's budget committee a very important lesson. and later today is the first day of same-sex marriage being legal in minnesota, in rhode island. the rhode island legislator, one of them pushing for it to be legal, will join us tonight from day one of his wedding. ence andf the american people, we've been able to clear away the rubble from the financial crisis. we started to lay a new foundation for stronger, more durable economic growth. but we're not there yet. what we need is not a 3-month plan or even a 3-year plan. we need a long-term american strategy: job security with good wages and durable industries.
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a good education. reducing poverty. reducing inequality. growing opportunity. i'm going to keep pushing to make high-quality preschool available for every four-year-old in america it's time for the minimum wage to go up. (cheers) but i won't be able to do it alone, so i'm going to be calling... on all of us to take up this cause. good jobs; a better bargain for the middle class... and the folks who are working to get into the middle class; an economy that grows from the middle-out. that's what we need. (cheers)
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staples has it. stock up for the year now and get 15% off school supplies through september 21st when you buy a back to school savings pass. staples. that was easy. it has been a bad week for the most recent losing vice presidential candidate who will never be president. paul ryan is chairman of the budget committee, which sounds important until you understand that the budget committee does not actually write the budget for the united states of america. the budget committee simply passes recommendations on the budget. those recommendations are then left to the house ways and means committee or the house appropriations committee to accept or reject. it is those committees, not the budget committee, that actually has the power to actually write the bills that become law. and until this week, when the house appropriations wrote the funding bill for house and transportation this year, they followed paul ryan's recommendation.
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the leadership recognized that paul ryan's vision for the funding was on its way to defeat on the floor because more reasonable republicans have decided that they would vote against it. and so the house leadership simply pulls the bill from the floor, rather than suffer a public defeat, thanks to paul ryan's budget recommendations. and then yesterday, chairman ryan held a budget committee hearing where he wanted to show how reasonable it is to cut back on other spending, especially spending that affects the people who struggle the hardest in this committee. paul ryan voted for the house farm bill which was full of agriculture socialism for people who don't need the government's help to stay rich. but was the first farm bill ever passed in congress that did not include any funding for food stamps since the modern food
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stamp program was invented. and in paul ryan's recommendation that has already passed the congress but has not been written into law, paul ryan cuts food stamps dramatically. which ryan's republican acolytes think is no problem, because of course charitable giving can simply make up the difference. enter sister simone yesterday to rewrite the house budget committee's understanding on the scale of food stamps versus the capacity of charitable giving. in this scene, republican reed ribble, yes, that is his real name, plays the part of the school boy who has a lot to learn about math and the size of the problem of hunger in america. and sister simone campbell plays the part of the patient and loving teacher she has always been. >> i'm struck by the church
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reaching out to government to do something that is so directly their nature. christianity is all about serving the poor, reaching out to orphans and widows and meeting that need. what is the church doing wrong that they have to come to the government to get so much help? >> well, i think it is more a reflection of the dimension of the issue. last year "bread for the world" which is an organization that debates on the issue of hunger in our country, figured on the house republican budget, the cuts in food stamps alone, that was last year's budget would cause every church, synagogue, mosque, house of worship in the united states alone, just on that issue alone to each raise $50,000 every year for ten years to replace the amount of service that was being cut. we have a limitation in our capacity to do that. because at least the church --
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>> your capacity is the same as our capacity. i mean, it is the same people. >> it is the same people, but i believe that when you look at where -- and this comes out of our teaching in -- within our church tradition. is that justice comes before charity. and that everyone has a right to eat, to realize their human dignity. and therefore, there is in our position, a government responsibility to ensure everyone's capacity to eat. we do the charity part, which is the reaching out. the love, like tia, the story that i told. love and care makes a difference, but the issues are so big. and some of it -- there is not sufficient charitable dollars there, we supplement. we have a corner stone of federal money, private money, and good old fashioned -- generosity.
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i yield back the time. >> and yield he did, and he did not dare to venture a word of argument from sister simone's direction, proving once again, once a catholic school boy always a catholic school boy. hey! did you know that honey nut cheerios has oats that can help lower cholesterol? and it tastes good? sure does! wow. it's the honey, it makes it taste so... well, would you look at the time... what's the rush? be happy. be healthy.
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rhode island legislator who fought to make same-sex marriage legal is getting married tonight. the very first day of marriage equality in rhode island. he will join us next. chances are, you're not made of money, so don't overpay for boat insurance. geico, see how much you could save. bjorn earns unlimited rewards for his small business. take these bags to room 12 please. [ garth ] bjorn's small business earns double miles on every purchase every day. produce delivery. [ bjorn ] just put it on my spark card. [ garth ] why settle for less? ahh, oh! [ garth ] great businesses deserve unlimited rewards. here's your wake up call.
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is your cholesterol at goal? ask your doctor about crestor. [ female announcer ] if you can't afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help. >> you may kiss the bride! >> the mayor of minneapolis officiated at the first legal same-sex marriage in minnesota at 12:01 this morning, when same-sex marriage became legal in that state. this is the first couple who got married in minnesota today. >> we are married. and we have protections and privileges and rights that we didn't have before.
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and we have always felt loved and supported, but we never had that. >> 42 couples scheduled their weddings overnight in the minneapolis city hall. weddings are going on in st. paul, and around minnesota even at the mall of america's chapel. the same is true in rhode island tonight, where marriage equality also became legal at midnight. county clerks began issuing marriage licenses when their officesed at 8:30 this morning, minnesota and rhode island bring the total number of states where the marriage equality is 13. one person getting married tonight is frank perry, perry and his partner, tony caparco, have been together for years, frank is also a member of the state legislature and helped to get the marriage equality signed into law. joining me now is rhode island state representative frank ferry, and his spouse from the site of the wedding tonight.
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now, frank, technically, you guys were already married. you got married in canada in 2006. so why do it again now in rhode island? what additional legal benefit does your rhode island marriage have? >> hi, lawrence, good evening, what we're doing is celebrating the long journey that rhode island has taken to get to this point. we were married in vancouver in 2006. we were on a cruise for our 25th anniversary. we had not planned on getting married. it was about a health problem that i had that helped us determine we should get married for our protections. there was no family, no friends, and so this is bringing it home and all the hard work that everybody has done. >> and tony, the speaker of the house of rhode island, you got him to officiate at this marriage on the first day of legal same-sex marriage in rhode island.
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it really is a big event for this state, isn't it? >> it is absolutely a big event. it has been a lot of work. it has been a long road. and the speaker has been instrumental in accomplishing this for the gay community. and frank, at the state house as a legislator working with the speaker has just been instrumental in this happening, along with the support of many, many other long-term advocates who have worked so hard for this. it is just an exciting day for us. and the speaker is thrilled to be officiating in our ceremony. >> we have only 13 states that have made this legal. but a new gallop poll shows if there were a national referendum on this, 32%, nationwide, would vote to legalize same-sex marriage. only 43% would vote against that.
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and we know that that opposition number is just getting smaller by the day, by the year. frank, what is your political vision as an elected official yourself as to where the country is going, 13 states tonight. how many do you expect in the next five years. >> well, i don't have a crystal ball in front of me. but i know the train is out of the station and it is going. it is not stopping. it is not coming back. we've seen it here in new england. we know how so many people are opening their minds because of so many couples like themselves, people who live their lives, being open and honest, and that is what is driving this. with the help of the president's support and many legislators, this is going to happen. how many will be in five years? i don't know, there is a lot of opposition. it will take some time in other states, i don't know, at least five or six. >> tony, how difficult was it to accomplish in rhode island, from
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where you were sitting in the grand stands, watching frank work and watching your own work on this? >> we have been working on this for 15 years, before frank was a legislator we both were advocates for gay rights and marriage equality. and once he became a state legislator, he spear-headed that. and i am just so proud of the work he has done there. and i supported it in any way i could. and i joked that i made us the most visible gay couple in politics in rhode island to put a face on it. so that the other legislators, when they were voting on legislation that affected us, would have to look us in the eye and know that they were voting against tony and frank. and i tried to put a face on it with frank. and i hope we accomplished that.
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>> frank ferri, and tony caparco, one of the first couples to be married day one on same-sex marriage in rhode island. thank you for joining us. >> thank you, lawrence. >> up next, "hardball" with chris matthews. monster. let's play "hardball." good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. let me start with this. it's a ghastly story, more ghastly than most can imagine. three women kept captive in the dark for over a decade, again and again raped, chained to walls. they escaped this may after one of the captive women broke through a storm door on that street and flagged down a neighbor. well, today the monster who did this, ariel castro, was sentenced to life in priso