dressed in body armor arrived in the suburbs of damascus to inspect the sites of is theed chemical weapons attacks that killed 355 and injured at least 3600 last week. but according to a u.n. spokesman as the inspectors arrived on the scene, their vehicle was deliberately shot at multiple times by unidentified snipers. the u.n. team continued the inspection later today, visiting wounded people and collecting samples, but regardless of the results it seems that the u.s. and others are poised for military action and soon. according to the "new york times" on sunday a senior obama administration official said there was, quote, very little doubt that president bashar al assad military's forces had used chemical weapons against civilians last week and that a syrian promised to allow u.n. inspectors to access the site would be too late to be credible. over the weekend president obama met with his top military and national security advisors who presenced him with a detailed set of military options including a possible cruise

missile attack. the president also spoke with british prime minister david cameron and french president francois hollande to discuss possible responses by the international community. at home members of congress on both sides of the aisle were calling for military action. >> i do think action is going to occur. certainly a red line for us has been the use of chemicals against people. that has occurred. we need to obviously respond to that, but i don't want us to change our overall policy. >> i think we connect. i think we should act. i think we should act for humanitarian purposes and i think we should act because it's in our national interests to act. >> senators john mccain and lindsey graham released a statement. what exactly those actions are will remain subject of debate but it is clear the red line has been crossed. last week mohammed sala dean a syrian reporter on the scene after the attacks in ghouta told

the new yorker when he arrived he saw four huge pits in which trucks were transporting the body of the dead. he estimated that he saw about 400 corpses. at the hospital according to the same eyewitness, there were so many syrian suffering symptoms of poison gas the doctors could not treat them all. i want you to pass a message to the u.s. leadership. america has great power and influence and can make a difference. we are suffering. it has been too long. joining me today, washington bureau chief of "the huffington post" ryan grim, vice president of demows, heather mcgee, senior fellow on the council of foreign relations ed husan and benjamin wallace wells and from cairo is nbc news foreign correspondent ayman mohyeldin. to you first, seeing as you are in the region. the complexity of what is happening in syria i don't think can be overstated in terms of how many regional actors this pulls in. tell us if you will about the reaction in the region right now as the u.s. signals we may take

a more aggressive stance on syria, although what that stance is in specific we do not yet know. >> well, the reaction really has kind of fallen along the same fault lines that the conflict it itself has shaped out over the course of the last several years and that really involves both the allies and the opponents of the syrian regime. on one hand you have gulf countries, gulf arab countries like saudi arabia, united arab emirates and qatar and others, pushing for international intervention. that doesn't necessarily mean military intervention but the criticism is the u.s. has not done enough and should do more to push for international intervention against the syrian regime to create the tipping point the rebels have been calling for. when you look at the allies of the syrian regime including iran and hezbollah they, too, have been sticking to their old playbook, they support the syrian regime and have warned any type of military intervention would lead to a military war that would not end

favorably to the united states or across the region. given the fact that you already have foreign military interference inside syria on both sides, whether the rebels or syrian government with its allies and proxies, this is a situation that could easily spill over the borders of syria into neighboring countries and something the united nations and humanitarian organizations are preparing for. they've added more assets in the region for what their calling a worse case scenario should military intervention happen in syria. >> ed, the conflict as amman says, brings in regional actors and dynamics maybe people don't understand. iran very involved in this. the au saudis are involved. a short guide to the middle east was printed as a letter and i will read it because it underscores the complexity here. assad is against the muslim brother hood, muslim brotherhood and obama against general assisi, which means they are

against the muslim brother hood. there's a lot happening here. >> it's very, very complicated. and the last thing the united states should be doing is getting involved in yet another conflict and yet another muslim country with complex arab players and iran as you say as well as russia, hezbollah, the turks. this is a proxy war being fault by all. this is a challenge for the european nations, the arab nations and turkey to work together and the united states should stay away. on the question of the chemical weapons and the attack there is still no clear evidence that the regime was behind this. chemical weapons had been used by the rebel forces in the past and it could be rebel forces using it again. we have no evidence either way in the absence of evidence, iraq war teaches us we should not be hasty going into another nation and precipitating further

warfare. >> why do you think the seeming confidence from the white house that this is actually the work of the assad government and it would also push back on your notion that this is not the time and place for the u.s. to intervene, richard haas, who also is a council -- at the council on foreign relations says that this is -- that the use of chemical weapons, i mean we've talked about red lines, but does mark a -- there is a reason for the u.s. to get involved in the western powers to get involved. he writes the reasons for a strong response transcends syria. it will be a very different 21st century if weapons of mass destruction come to be seen as just another type of weapon. basically this het seths a precedent if we don't do something. >> richard is right but the assumption the regime has used chemical weapons. if we follow richard's line of argument and it's established it wasn't the regime but the rebels and al qaeda elements that used weapons of mass destruction or chemical weapons, then we're in the position of attacking al qaeda and the free syrian army. it's essential we establish who is using chemicals we're. we haven't established that fact.

>> i don't mean to keep going back and forth in the volley. your first point this is so complicated we shouldn't get involved and yet another war in the middle east with sort of a muslim element, would that be up ended by any evidence that -- >> the europeans have a responsibility to act here. the arab nations do and turkey does. responsibility to act doesn't mean that it always has to be the u.s. we're encouraging a culture in the middle east of dependsy on the united states every time there's a conflict there and there are other global players who have a responsibility to burden some of that including china russia, the eu -- >> who at this point seem completely unwilling to do anything, the chinese and russians specifically going by their behalfer on the u.n. security council. to ed's point about the responsibility of the u.s., the president met with susan rice, samantha power, the new u.s./u.n. ambassador, joe biden, john brennan, martin dempsey, the inner circle, called the situation troublesome. the options are limited. i think folks are saying cruise missiles from nearby navy ships

may be one lead option. but in terms of will and political power to do something and political sort of -- any kind of impetus from -- to do something, i'm not clear that the president really has much in the wheelhouse in terms of being able to call on some sort of outrage from the american public, though i think as an american the situation over there is outrageous and untenable. >> right. he doesn't. i think the latest poll had something like 7% of people wanting to get involved with this, which is, of course, a legacy of iraq. the evidence that we might be inching towards something like that, is that the talk about how reluctant we are to do it is increasing. whenever we're sharing with the world how reluctant we are to attack something, you know, you can pretty much count on it, we're going to attack something pretty soon. we've been reluctant for 00 years and going to -- 200 years and going to war pretty freak lent. >> 200 years of reluctance. >> using chemical weapons is in

an international war crime and passing law -- international laws against the use of chemical, biological, nuclear weapons by some countries, was one of the great progressive achievements of the 20th century, but it deserves an international response. that doesn't mean united states just goes in and blows up a few things and all of a sudden everyone is deterred for the 21st century using chemical weapons. >> nor do i think the president -- if you look at libya as any kind of example, i don't think the president would go in by himself. it's an theatrical to who he is on the foreignp policy level at this point and there's something to be said for the point that dexter filkins makes in "the new yorker," he writes what can america do? it's not unreasonable to ask whether even a well intentioned american effort to save syria might fail or such might pull america into a terrible quagmire but how much longer are we going to allow those questions to prevent us from trying? >> i think we've seen a shift. the front page of "the washington post" with the bodies including the center of one that looked like maybe no more than 2

years old was clearly a moment that we'll look back on and know this war just got a lot more real for people. back in the end of may there was a poll that asked would there be more support for intervention if chemical weapons were used and the numbers went from the low 20s to 58%. now i think it will be interesting to see if people start feeling new polls now. i think the president needs to feel like he has the support of the american people. i think with all of the issues that are going on right now it has not been front of mind, obviously, in most -- around most kitchen tables in america. i think if we start to see more images like we saw on the front page of "the washington post," you will start to see some moral, you know, we still believe we're superman actually. >> and i think we americans, i believe we are compassionate people. we focus a lot on negative parts of this country, but you see women and children being gassed to death and the pictures of those children on the front page of national newspapers, the american response is to say this

must end somehow. the question is how. i wonder, ben, to what degree does the president allow this to be part of his -- i mean a big part, foreign policy could end up being a huge part of his second term legacy. >> and this is a moment when presidents tend to look to make those big, you know, big second term achievements. one thing that's difficult for me about this moment is, you know, the red line feels a little bit legalistic. you understand the legal case for differentiating between chemical weapons and, you know, conventional weapons, but we've been watching for two years as tens of thousands of people have been killed on both sides, sure, but the documents of atrocities by the government and pro government militias are substantial and really long-lasting. and so obama establishes this red line, you know, and, you know, a year ago, and it looks now like sort of a concession to a limit on american capacity to actually go in and do something and now he's sort of up against

it a little bit. >> yeah. >> i think that the distinction we drew at the beginning of this segment also where the u.s. shouldn't do something, but, you know, it's incumbent upon the europeans and the turks and other countries in the gulf to do something is a little bit false. it comes down to the question of something, you know. it's possible for there to be a u.s. intervention that is not, you know, throwing cruise missiles at government installations with no support as ryan and heather sort of pointed out and i think what obama is looking at here is likely to be some sort of team effort as you've seen all along. >> do you gis disagree with that? >> short of a u.s. invasion or troops on the ground you are not going to separate fighting factions inside syria. if a u.s. presence on the ground means greater international support, then let's talk about that. but nobody is seriously contemplating having troops on the ground. without troops on the ground you're not going to separate the fighting factions. back to my international point and that is, why would assad want to use chemical weapons in

the northeastern suburb of damascus, under his control, to kill only, forgive me for being so cold, about 1,000 people where killed 5,000 people every month for the last 16 months without using chemical weapons. >> jeffrey goldberg made the point he's doing it to flout international authorities and say there's nothing you can do. >> i don't think he can play that cheap game because he's responded by repeatedly saying the u.s. should not be getting involved because this will not be a picnic. we can't have it both ways, one hand trying to flout the international community and on the other hand putting out messages of fear. we still don't know who committed the atrocity and unless we have the full facts we're going to be doing a repeat of iraq, blowing threats out of all proportion and talking about weapons of mass destruction and not knowing where the chemical facilities are and then putting u.s. blood and treasure at risk once again. >> i think we -- the -- the spector of iraq looms incredibly large over syria but what we've witnessed in the two and half

years, 1.7 million refugees, 100,000, conservative estimate dead, pictures of women and children gassed to death, by who we don't know, but we are not going in there because we think -- i think the reasons for going into syria are different than going into the reasons for going into iraq which were largely based on lies. but i -- the intelligence gathering piece i think in specific is one of the the igs that may hold us back. amman, i want to get more one question in to you. in terms of how and where the u.s. sides, i think we've done a very adequate job of explaining the complexity of the situation, but edward lutsvoc in "the new york times" writes a decisive outcome for either side would be unacceptable for the u.s. an iranian backed restoration of the iranian agreement would increase iran's power across the middle east.

at this stage, stalemate is the only viable policy option left. that is, i think, a fairly dramatic assessment of where the u.s. needs to go which is to press, he says, for stalemate. what do you think of that? >> it's pushing for a stalemate from a political end may be an objective, but you got to keep in mind if it doesn't bring an end to the killing of innocent syrians to the people who are suffering to the humanitarian crisis it has created across the region, then everybody loses. there's an irony in all of this which is over the course of the last two years, the stated policy of the united states and others has been that they don't want this conflict to spread beyond syria's borders, they didn't want what was happening inside syria to affect its neighbors. ironically two years after inaction from the community, every country around syria has been affected by it and it seems that circle continues to widen. a stalemate may appear on the surface as a solution but the bottom line at the end of the day is so long as syrians continue to suffer it will

affect the region. >> nbc's ayman mohyeldin thank you as always and thank you to the council on foreign relations, thanks for your time. after the break tens of thousands descend on the washington mall to pay tribute to the calls of civil and human rights, the march on washington and where dr. king's dream stands today. that's next on "now." [ male announcer ] this is claira. to prove to you that aleve is the better choice for her, she's agreed to give it up. that's today? [ male announcer ] we'll be with her all day to see how it goes. [ claira ] after the deliveries, i was okay. now the ciabatta is done and the pain is starting again. more pills? seriously? seriously. [ groans ] all these stops to take more pills can be a pain. can i get my aleve back? ♪ for my pain, i want my aleve. [ male announcer ] look for the easy-open red arthritis cap.

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50 years ago i stood right here in this spot, 23 years old, had all of my hair and a few pounds lighter, so i come back

here again to say that those days for the most part are gone. but we have another fight. >> that was georgia congressman john lewis at the lincoln memorial on saturday. acknowledging america's hard won civil rights battles and sounding a word of warning for those that lie ahead. congressman lewis is no longer facing police night sticks as he did in selma, alabama and no longer being arrested at demonstrations as he was some 40 times before. but lewis stressed that the fight is not yet over. >> i gave a little blood on that bridge in selma, alabama, for the right to vote. i am not going to stand by and let the supreme court take the right to vote away from us. >> in an interview with congressman james clyburn, the former civil rights activist cautioned against giving into the tranquilizing drug of gradualism. i don't think there's an urgency

of what's happening now. i don't think people see the correlation between today and 50 years ago. while we are commemorating i hope we're not celebrating. clyburn's words have not fallen on deaf ears. on thursday attorney general eric holder announced the department of justice had officially filed suit against the state of texas for discriminatory voter i.d. laws and while 29 other states will push forward with voter suppression efforts the symbolism of this fight led by this attorney general during the administration of this president in particular should also not be forgotten. history tells us that the magnitude of the moment is sometimes lost on the people living through it. in the "washington post," robert kaiser explains some 50 years ago wednesday, his very own paper missed the mark. the post published two dozen stories about the march, kaiser explains. every one missed the importance of king's address. the words "i have a dream" appeared only once in a wrap-up of the day's rhetoric on page a-15 in the fifth paragraph. i've never seen anyone call us

on this bit of journalistic malpractice. perhaps this anniversary provides a good moment to cop a plea. we blew it. coming up, officials are calling it the highest priority fire in the country and say it poses every challenge there could be. a live report on yosemite's massive out-of-control rim fire just ahead. time for the business entre prer nur of the week. darp is the co-owner of the california based off the grid survival supply store. in a post-9/11 world it caters to people who want to prepare for disasters of all kinds pfr he says the store supplies the tools to give people a sense of control over the unknown. for more watch your business sunday morning at 7:30 on msnbc. usua l please. usua thank you very much. ok guys, i'm back. i need a template of a template. oh my gosh. i've never even seen this record,

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plays a key role throughout our lives. one a day men's 50+ is a complete multivitamin designed for men's health concerns as we age. with 7 antioxidants to support cell health. one a day men's 50+. raging wildfires are burning across the west and one has put the city of san francisco in a state of emergency. right now 50 major wildfires are burning in ten states. the most threatening blaze called the rim fire is tearing through parts of california's yosemite national park. more than 3,000 firefighters are battling the flames in scenes that are as apoc ka lippic as dramatic. the fire has scorched 225 square miles roughly the size of chicago and moved within two

miles of the reservoir that provides the city of san francisco with 85% of its water. joining me from california, is nbc's jay gray. jay, what is the latest in terms of containment of this fire? >> hey, alex. you can see the smoke here, it's building and has been throughout the morning. the good news on containment, it's doubled overnight. the bad news, it's only to 15%. still a lot of work for more than 3600 firefighters here on the ground to do. they've got quite a battle ahead. >> jay, we know that 4500 homes are threatened, it has put 2.6 million people in san francisco in peril and also concerns about the electricity that goes to san francisco. can you give us a little more on that? >> yeah. you talked earlier about the flames, about two miles away from the hetch hetchy reservoir in the yosemite national park. that's the area that provides 85% of the drinking water and a lot of the electricity through hydro electric units to the city

of san francisco. firefighters have been able to hold it off to this point. they've kept everything at bay. they'll continue to do that, but it's still such a concern that governor jerry brown has declared that state of emergency in san francisco. watching it very closely. >> nbc's jay gray, thank you for the update. stay safe out there. after the break it is one thing when average run-of-the-mill tea partiers call for president obama's impeachment but it's another thing when one of the republican's established as well. next on now. [ male announcer ] at hebrew national, we're so choosy about the cuts of beef that meet our higher kosher standards that only a slow-motion bite can capture all that kosher delight. and when your hot dog's kosher, that's a hot dog you can trust. hebrew national.

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in the white house? >> you know, if i could write that bill today -- >> do it. >> excuse me. it would be a dream come true. >> the gop's outrage over benghazi, the irs and obama care, has reached fervor pitch. representative kerry bentivolio seen there is the latest in a recent space of republican congress members calling for the impeachment for the president of the united states. but bentivolio for 19 years before being elected to congress owned a santa claus impersonation business, that's part of that, isn't the only one calling for president obama's removal from the office. here is the senior republican on the chief oversight committee of the -- the head of the house oversight committee -- the chief oversight committee of the senate, just trying, it's monday, tom coburn, let's take a listen. >> what you have to do is you have to establish the criteria that would qualify for proceedings against the

president. and that's called impeachment. i don't have the legal background to know if that rises to high crimes and misdemeanors but i think they're getting perilously close. >> they are in the company of self-described wacko bird and senator ted cruz who last week told a crowd why the gop has not impeached the president is a good question. the ranks of the impeachment posse include representative blake farenthold who knew that the effort would probably have the votes to pass the house of representatives never minding the fact there doesn't happen to be any evidence of president obama committing any impeachable offenses. but it could still pass the house. ben, you know, like the train has left the station and to some degree, is this just an inevitable outcome of a party so whiffed up with fear? >> what's amazing about both of those particular moments you showed from the town halls is

that both coburn and bentivolio are trying to like calm the crowd, you know. they think of themselves in that moment as taking the more moderate position, and say you may be going crazy calling for impeachment but there's some procedural things we have to do, there's a process here and maybe this doesn't quite rise to the level of impeachment, though i would love for it it to. we have a situation this summer without obama care being quite so acutely on the table as it was, all of these representatives are going home to their districts and hearing the consequences of the fear they've been whipping up for years and that's put them in this weird position. >> but nobody ever steps out there, ryan, and says, guess what, obama care isn't against the law. in fact, it is the law. it was upheld by the supreme court. they are trying to placate the rowdy right flank it might be worth a memo to say by the way no crime has been committed,

setting aside the possibility of getting an i78 impeachment through the senate. he hasn't done anything wrong. >> it would be interesting to see them lay out a bill of particulars if they had one that had a high crime or dismeaner that was in there. they would have to go somewhere where they don't want to talk about which is american citizens getting killed by drones. >> you compare the furor for impeachment under the bush administration, if you think about it, and there has been some articulation of what exactly they think are the faults here, the appointment of federal appointees like the cfpb and the national labor of relations board over a recess that because the house had gone into full obstruction mode didn't allow there to be a recess at all in the house and senate and basically the president was trying to get over

obstruction and should be impeached. the implementation of obama care -- >> which again, was passed through the united states congress. >> these are things that are trying to govern the means of the nation and the things that people might actually say, were breaking the law in terms of nsa spying, were not warrantless wire tapping like was done in the bush administration with no cries of impeachment from the right, but things they have to say they support. >> look, maureen dowd goes out there and says it this weekend, and i am readying myself for the conservative arrows as i read the words of maureen dowd in the new york times. the race thing, which is a very, you know, people will argue about this, but the amount of hatred that is focused on this president is not just about legislation. >> right. it is -- there is a thread

from -- there was a nice piece in the "new york times" about this, the same birther crowd that is just fundamentally not accepted the legitimacy of this person being the president of the united states and it is not a very far drumming from he was not born here, he was born in kenya and therefore to let us get him out of office in any way possible. >> ben, your colleague at "new york" magazine jonathan chait has a good metaphor. they says they are not ready to impeach. on the otherhand they have little doubt that impeachment is merited. it's a bit like the way the feds thought about al capone in the '20s. his guilt was assumed. the puzzle merely how they could go about nailing him. did obama commit mail fraud? is that a way to get out of office? isn't that what they got capone for? that speaks to the thing in the ground water. >> there's this kind of curious aspect of washington theater logic basically, where there's never any room for sort of a small to medium sized scandal.

>> yes. >> there's no room to say yes, something went wrong at the irs, like we need to, you know, figure out who is responsible and not do that again but it doesn't rise to the level of impeachment. we don't have to talk about it two and a half years. there's almost this yale gor rhythmic logic any time anything gets in the blood stream it has to go huge or die. >> go big or go home. one of the reasons we're talking about this isn't just because focusing on insanity in parts of the far right is worthy of discussion, but also because of the fight that is looming in the fall, right? and i think this is representative of a larger inability by some of the moderate elder statesmen of the republican party to stand up to the conspiracy theorists, birthers, far right wing conservatives ready to shut down the government. if tom coburn is now saying the white house is getting peril hisly close to impeachment what does that say about what's going to happen in the fall and anybody's ability to round up the frogs in the wheel barrow

has john boehner -- >> tom coburn is probably the closest thing the president has to a friend among senate republicans and so here is -- >> full stop. so what does it mean now that tom coburn is suggesting impeachment? >> will, i mean i don't think that they're thinking very far. so, you know, they got nervous about the government shutdown. they said let's not shut the government down. and instead, they said, well let's worry about -- do it on the debt ceiling instead which shows you just a lack of any forethought. they're so panicked about what's going to happen next week they would like to make it ten times more difficult for themselves two weeks later. you can't tie obama care to the debt ceiling but they're so nervous about what's going to happen around the government shutdown they're willing to -- we'll deal with that problem when we get to it. >> every crazy idea, whether it's a conspiracy theory or a plan to shut down the government for greater leverage, has to be entertained, right? this is part of what robert costa described in the national journal as wink wink theater which is the dance that they

must -- one must do to rally the republican caucus? >> and what's interesting about that is it's getting closer and closer to the center of establishment. one of the things we saw today, ted cruz saying he's not going to endorse john cornyn for re-election. john cornyn is the second most conservative member of the u.s. senate, you know, and ted cruz is the vice chairman of the national republican senatorial committee whose job is to, you know, to endorse and give resources to candidates like john cornyn and yet there's such a fear from even the center of the republican establishment about this, you know, being created on fringes and affects every decision being made. >> meanwhile back in american homes across the country, look at, for example, you know, the effect this i is having on the ability to respond to the economic recovery, b, to put out bold visions where we need to go. the student debt crisis is something massive and really

deserves like a full airing and the president was basically only able to say, we're going to come up wait new rating system and try to -- i mean his hands are so tied and the future is suffering from it. meanwhile we're playing impeachment games. >> constugs aolly if they impeached him could he run for re-election in 2016. >> ask bloomberg. >> new york's attorney general files a multimillion-dollar lawsuit against donald trump. not surprisingly trump is somehow blaming president obama, that's next. [ male announcer ] these days, a small business can save by sharing. like carpools... polly wants to know if we can pick her up. yeah, we can make room. yeah. [ male announcer ] ...office space. yes, we're loving this communal seating. it's great. [ male announcer ] the best thing to share? a data plan. at&t mobile share for business. one bucket of data for everyone on the plan, unlimited talk and text on smart phones. now, everyone's in the spirit of sharing. hey, can i borrow your boat this weekend?

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university. scammed what is new york officials say happened to those who enrolled. new york attorney general eric schneiderman is suing the donald for $40 million claiming the for profit school engaged in deception at every stage of consumers advancement to programs and caused real financial harm. tuition at the so-called university ranged from $1400 for a three-day seminar to $35,000 for a, quote, personal mentorship. the lawsuit alleges students were encouraged to take on debt to pay for the supposedly elite programs. this morning, trump responded in his typically demure style. >> i've done really well in real estate. really imparted a lot of my knowledge to other people and i really think that, you know, we have a great school. >> the corporate birther has also has a theory about the lawsuit. it's all part of an elaborate plot concocted by, quote, light weight attorney general eric schneiderman and wait for it, president obama. >> this is not a good guy. this is a real political hack

and everybody knows it. he meets with the president on thursday night, he sues me on saturday. it was terribly drawn suit, incompetently drawn suit and they, obviously, did it very quickly but probably obama, maybe this is a mini irs, maybe we have to get the tea party after these people because this could be a mini irs. >> see how he's doing that. one big conspiracy. other than a load of conspiracy theorys what did students at trump university walk away with? >> does this school grant degrees? >> no. it grants knowledge. >> it appears that what donald trump calls knowledge the state calls a scam. no-charge scheduled maintenance. check. and here's the kicker... 0% apr for 60 months. and who got it? this guy. and who got it? this guy. and who got it? this guy. that's right... [ male announcer ] it's the car you won't stop talking about. ever.

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the entire view with the new york times this weekend the 88-year-old supreme court justice ginsburg said of the current zourts, quote, if it's measured in terms of readiness to overturn legislation this is

one of the most activist in history. she said she wasn't going to retire because president obama, a democrat, was in office. she was going to retire on her own sweet time. worth mentioning she has bat ltds pancreatic and colorectal cancer but her health is not, shall we say, sterling. >> it was i think really revealing interview this weekend to have a sitting justice say of her own chief justice is this is one of the most activist courts in history and doing it in a judicial way, right, to say, only on the willingness to overturn legislation, but also you can see that this is one of the most corporate friendly courts since the era which is a little bit legal nerdy, right. but the idea we have workers, consumers, you know, patients all of whom have sort of run in the buzzsaw of the roberts court which some people are calling the corporate court is something that's a whole other way of looking at the legacy of the court?

>> in the piece for which the justice is interviewed she seems aware of sort of the ultimate agenda of the roberts' court and i'll quote from the piece, some commentators have said the two voting rights decisions are an example of the lone game chief justice roberts seems to be playing in several areas of the law including campaign finance and affirmative action. his lone dissent in the case may suggest she is alert to the chief justice's apparent strategy. >> we're seeing tactics at the court going on at different levels. one way in which justice ginsburg may be sort of right on the moment is that in her, you know, not just giving herself over and saying i'm retiring now, stepping down, let obama appoint somebody to replace me, she's joining a moment in which progressives feel queasy about the obama administration and saying i kind of trust myself, you know, as frail and as limited in time as this may be, more than i must trust whoever the -- may trust whoever the obama administration sends up.

>> justice ginsburg for justice ginsburg. another leak from edward snowden, the nsa bugged the u.n. building in new york as long as with 80 embassies and consulating around the world. they say the surveillance program has little or nothing do with warding off terrorists. according to documents obtained by the german newspaper an nsa agent writes about cracking the coke to access u.n. communications and proclaims, listen carefully to this one, the traffic gives us the internal video teleconferencing at the u.n. yeah. yeah. that's the end of that dispatch. do you think i read this and i thought, i think this is a fairly big deal, what the nsa is -- we have heard already in some of these leaks about the u.s. spying on other foreign governments, but the notion that we are tapping into the video teleconferencing at the united nations would seem to be another shoe in -- how many shoes can drop, how many legs on this caterpillar but your thoughts? >> probably the clearest sign

yet that snowden is playing an international game here. he knows that he's locked in a confrontation with the united states and so he's been selectively alienating the united states' partners saying hey, guess what, they spied on the uk, germany spied on you, huge story in germany and it's riling up anti-american sentiment in germany which then translates to support for snowden. a lot of what he's doing here i think is playing politics and he's tackically trying to keep himself from chelsea manning's fate. >> i mean -- >> right. okay. >> the new york -- we also learned this week, is working with the "guardian" to publish more of snowden's leaks and that's also -- that sort of takes us to another level too. "the guardian" had been the major outpost for snowden updates and now that "the guardian" is under fire from the british government having to destroy computers in their offices, they have partnered with the "new york times" having "the new york times" implementer on snowden's leak changes the

dynamic in terms of how the administration responds or doesn't? >> right. playing an important role in this. it's important. it's been a little bit of an embarrassment we had a british newspaper being the one to tell us about our sort of dirty laundry. it's going to be an interesting moment to see what exactly "the new york times" is able to come out with. >> but you know, i also want to know how much this changes things. we hear about changes with the fisa court and transparency there and the court has released more of its decision making -- >> a page -- >> yeah. the court's next to to be on instagram. bob corker on fox news said i would imagine there's members of the intelligence committee themselves don't that don't fully understand the gamut of things taking place. >> one thing we've seen, the apparatus built for spying on punitively terrorists is so much bigger and more powerful than any terrorism network that it could possibly dream of targeting that there's just, you know, the institutional inevitability we see more and more of these things like the

u.n., like the u.n. spying and therefore that, you know, maybe incrementally more and more people get a little worried and upset as you heard with corker there. >> and maybe congress then pushes for greater access. >> maybe. >> i mean we'll see. we're supposed to talk about miley cyrus and her twerking, but i kind of want to talk for one moment about donald trump who said trump university grants knowledge to people and your thoughts on attorney general schneiderman's lawsuit? >> i think it's great. i think you can look at a lot of schools in new york that are for profit schools. i could rail about the donald for a while but this issue is bigger. "the huffington post" has done a lot of great reporting an for profit schools. institutions, for profit companies, billionaires are taking advantage of the aspirations and dreams of people in this economy, right. you've got community colleges being cut, $25,000 a year public tuitions, and there are these schools that say, we'll take you all, spend a lot of money on marketing, more money on marketing than instruction as

university of phoenix i believe does, and there's got to be someone and i think it can happen at the state level to say there's a stop to it. it's actually making people worse off than when they started. >> did you feel bad when you paid $1400 for a three-day seminar for the donald. >> i did the $35,000 mentorship. >> like republicans go big or go home. >> and i am now, you know, my world view is collapsing to find out that donald trump could be involved with something that's a little shady. >> look who's talking. >> yes, ben, i was going to ask you about do we have the miley cyrus we can start playing as ben makes his final comments on this. >> oh, i was just going to say, you know, it's a testament to the weakness of the elite media that for 30 years we have completely failed to destroy donald trump and there are still people out there willing to give him $35,000. >> is that inappropriate or not? >> yes or no? >> this is is the first -- >> completely open. >> totally blew my mind.

>> was that a yes or no, inappropriate or not, miley cyrus. >> staged and -- i mean, you know, not inappropriate. >> before we go, ryan, inappropriate or not? >> kind of weird. >> kind of weird. >> not on miley, i put it all on him. >> wow. >> on robin thicke. >> it's the same thing as in his video. >> probably robin thicke and president obama and attorney general eric holder. let's be real about it. they concocted that twerking plot. thank you to ryan, heather and ben. that is all for now. ari will be in for me tomorrow at noon eastern when joined by richard wolffe, jonathan capehart, find us at facebook.com/now with alex. "andrea mitchell reports" is next. at humana, our medicare as sit down with you and ask. hanging out with this guy. he's just the love of my life. [ male announcer ] getting to know you is how we help you choose the humana medicare plan that works best for you. mi familia. ♪ [ male announcer ] we want to help you achieve your best health, so you can keep doing the things that are important to you. keeping up with them.

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