those questions that always follow. what was the motive, and how can we prevent an atrocity like this from happening again? that's all for us for now. coming up, "the ed show" with ed schultz. thank you, martin. good evening, friends. we begin tonight with the news that everyone in the country is paying attention to. it all unfolded at 8:20 this morning when a gunman opened fire on people at a washington naval yard. the shooting take place at building 197, home to the naval sea systems command. at the hour, officials say 13 people have been confirmed dead, including the shooter, the gunman has been identified as in 34-year-old aaron alexis of ft. worth, texas. officials say he recently began working as a civilian contractor. alexis gained access to the building using another worker's

security badge. he was reportedly carrying an assault rifle, an ar-15, a double-barrel shotgun, which has been reported and also a handgun. and many questions surround tonight. how does a man get into a military facility that well-armed? nbc news has confirmed alexis was killed at the scene of the crime. there is currently no known motive. one witness described the chaotic scene to wrc earlier today. >> this morning about 8:30, we heard what we sounded like a pop gun or gunshots going off in the building, but far away. like it wasn't very close to us. couple minutes later, somebody was running through the hallways, telling everybody to get out of the building. couple minutes after that, the fire alarms in the building went off, the automatic way to evacuate the building. i ended up on the back side of our building in an alley way. evacuated a bunch of people, pushed them in the right direction to get them out. and then it was an individual who came from the building behind us, was talking to me, basically saying that, hey,

heard there is a shooter in your building and then heard two more shots. one of them hit him, he went down in front of me and i took off from there. >> reporter: the guy you were with? >> the guy i was talking to. >> reporter: got shot. >> correct. >> reporter: and what was his situation afterwards? just moved or did you try to assess? >> he was shot in the head and it not look like he made it from i ran from there. >> reporter: police say there could potentially be one other gunman involved currently unaccounted for. an active search is under way for the possible suspect. it's important to point out, there is no hard evidence to indicate another shooter was involved. police arering on the side of caution. multiple agencies are responding to the incident but the fbi is taking the lead in the investigation. president obama was briefed on the shooting multiple times throughout the day. he spoke about the incident before planned remarks this afternoon. >> we are confronting yet another mass shooting. and today it happened on a military installation in our

nation's capital. it's a shooting that targeted our military and civilian personnel. these are men and women who were going to work, doing their job. protecting all of us. they're patriots. and they know the dangers of serving abroad. but today they face the unimaginable violence that they wouldn't have expected here at home. >> president obama went on to say, there will be a thorough investigation into today's tragic shootings. for more, msnbc's craig melvin. what is the latest on the scene? we are starting to get information about aaron alexis. he did spend two years in the navy reserves. he came into the reserves pinned in december 16th of 2009. and was prettied from navy reserves in january of 2011, just over 24 months in navy reserves. he is from ft. worth, texas.

his home of record is new york. he's 34 years old. he was killed at the scene. and this, of course, has been a day of trying to piece information together. but i think we can come to the conclusion that if he was in the navy reserves, officials do know a lot more about this man than what they are saying. what are you gathering at the scene tonight, craig? >> reporter: we can also tell you he was a petty officer, third class. and he was never on active duty. he was always in the reserves. at this hour, ed, a number of law enforcement agencies here in washington, d.c. are trying now to track his last known movements and his last known communications. they are talking to anyone who has had any type of communication with aaron alexis over the past few days. that's what we know about the gunman. we should also note that according to the police chief here in washington, d.c., he died as a result of a gun fight. there was a gun battle that led up to his death. and the officers who shot him

said that they were fairly confident, had they not, he would have continued shooting. i want to step out of the way here in southeast d.c. and show you the scene right now in front of the navy, in front of the navy yard where all of this went down, shortly before 8:30 this morning. this is the same scene that we have seen here over the past few hours. you can see just a mob of folks in front of the navy yard. what you're seeing right now are folks who work at that massive facility. they left. they're being questioned. a number of folks are being questioned. we know that, because we have talked to folks as they leave that scene and they walk of here. so investigators are there, they're talking to people who saw something, who may have heard something, who may have had any sort of connection to this gunman. they're talking to them before they release them. right now as i talk to you, i think we can pan to my left here and show you another scene here. we can pan to my left and show another scene that's become quite familiar.

buses. metro police buses -- excuse me, metro -- metro buses, dc regular metro buses, loaded with folks who work at the yard are on these buses. as well, ed, fbi agents. we have seen probably at this point about 20 or so buses packed with people. and, again, what happens is, once they're debriefed there in front of the navy yard, they're giving them free transportation back home, in and around the d.c. metro area. we're expecting another news conference here, sometime after the top of the -- sometime after the top of the 6:00 hour, maybe 6:30, maybe as late as 6:30, as well. we're told the fbi now the lead agency handling the investigation. the death toll, 13. we don't know whether that's a number that is going to rise. the number of injured at this point. we've heard numbers anywhere between 10 and 17. so, again, those are also numbers that are going to continue to fluctuate throughout the course of the evening. but this is a part of d.c.

southeast d.c. that's on lockdown as they continue to search for that gentleman you mentioned earlier. a black male, 5'10", about 180 pounds, in his 30s or 40s. at last check, they said he was wearing drab clothing. >> craig, a number of questions i have here. do we know how he got in the facility? he used someone else's identification card. are authorities there telling us how he got ahold of that? >> reporter: what you just said is about all we know, definitively at this point. that he used an i.d. badge that was not his own. i talked to someone who worked in that same facility and i asked him on our air about two, two-and-a-half hours ago, are there metal detectors? how do you get into that building? he said oh, no -- no, there are not metal detectors. there's a card swipe system that you use to get into that portion of the building. and he also did indicate that there are -- you know, this is a

massive, massive facility we're talking about. there are parts of the building that do require card access. and there are parts of the building that do not require card access. but, again, that's something that over the next few hours, next few days, we should find out a little bit more about precisely how it was that he got into the building. >> and it's been reported that some 3,000 people work in this facility. and some areas are more secure than others. is that how you understand it? >> reporter: absolutely. 3,000 folks. some of them civilian contractors. some of them active military. some of them reservists. some of them wear military clothing every day. some of them wear civilian clothes every day. some of them have weapons on their person throughout the course of the day. as a function of their job. some of them don't. so this is not a facility where seeing someone walk around in military gear would be unusual

or someone carrying a weapon would be terribly unusual, as well. >> all right. craig melvin in washington, d.c. on the scene. thanks. and to alert our viewers, we'll take any live updates or abbreviation that unfold in washington, d.c. i want to bring in msnbc military analyst, colonel jack jacobs. good to have you with us tonight. you have been to this facility numerous times. >> i used to teach at the national war college at ft. mcnair, just down the street. >> what kind of security is expected at a facility like this? >> not as much as you may expect. but it's -- there is some level of security that you have to get through. for one thing, you can't drive on to the facility unless you have a sticker identifying -- with the registration number of that vehicle registered on post. and you have to have a military or civilian contractor i.d. >> so he may have just -- he may have just had a card and gone through, shown his card, and

he's in. so he goes in with an ar-15, double barrel shotgun. i'm curious as to how that was concealed, or was it already on campus? >> well, i'm trying to think of that also. he would have to get it -- he's not going to carry it. and as a result, if he walked in, he had to have preplanned and put the weapons in there before. but if he drove on, the vehicle he was in had to have been registered on post. now my guess is, they don't pay very much attention to either one of those things. they check to see if there is a sticker on it. they don't check to see whether or not you're actually the guy on the card or the card matches up with the owner of the vehicle that you're in. because if he brought the vehicle in there and had the weapons in the trunk, and did not have a card or did not have a sticker, they would search the vehicle before he got on the base. >> now, it hasn't been reported, but are we to assume that the navy knows exactly who this guy is? i mean, if he spent two years in the reserves, which is unusual, and i want to ask you about that, wouldn't they know who this guy is, and know everything

about him? to be in the navy reserves for just a little over two years, and then was separated from the navy reserves. which is rather unusual. what about that? >> yeah, well, they should know all about him. the -- initial enlistment, i think, is three years, not two. >> so there's -- we can assume that he may have been discharged? >> oh, yeah -- well -- >> would there be a record of his behavior? >> there would be a record of his discharge, his behavior, the reasons for his discharge, whatever rap sheet he may have had inside the navy in the reserves. >> but you can say unequivocally, it's unusual that someone would be in navy reserves for two years. >> for only two years, yes. >> okay. his job, his occupation was a navy aviations electricians mate, focused on electrical systems aboard aircraft. he was in training. i mean, i think that we could -- make the assumption that being a mate, he didn't go there with the skills, he was developing these skills. >> he was a petty officer third class, which is fairly

low-ranking. >> okay. to get into the facility, are there people on the facility that carry firearms? >> yes. but typically, in a facility like that, it's not like an army post where there is an infantry division or -- where there are a bunch -- there is a marine brigade or something like that, marine regiment. most of these are office people. so the only people who are actually carrying weapons are probably only carrying side arms, and those are the guards on the gate who may, in fact, be civilian contractors themselves. and the guards in the buildings that are high-security. and they may also be civilian contractors and not military people. and they're usually only carrying side arms. it's not like you have 3,000 people wandering around with weapons. >> so on naval facilities, all military installations in this country, i would imagine the military, from the top-down is going to be reviewing all their security. >> oh, you bet. >> this is going to change. would you say that this is going to change things on military installations in america? >> yes, and probably already

has. i remember after 9/11, every military installation was first in lockdown and when he started letting people in, they would inspect your vehicle top and bottom, check and see if there was anything with a mirror underneath. check everything. and then as time went on, they got more and more lax. and you can bet they're going to start all over again now, once the worse -- >> is this a product of lax security? >> yes. at least partially a product of lax security. but, you know, this -- everybody is involved in security says the same thing. if you're -- if you have the high level of security all of the time, you'll eventually get tired of it. and you'll start relaxing. i've seen it at every military post since 9/11. it waxes and wanes. and when it wanes is when trouble happens. >> okay. what do they do at the facility? what is the naval sea command center? >> they support all naval activities afloat. and also some -- that are

on-shore. worldwide. it's -- i think it's a four-star command, very high-ranking guy. having said all that, almost all these people work in offices. >> okay. colonel jack jacobs, great to have you with us. thanks so much. we'll have more on the developing story out of the nation's capital after this. you're watching "the ed show" on msnbc. with the spark cash card from capital one... boris earns unlimited rewards for his small business. can i get the smith contract, please? thank you. that's three new paper shredders. [ boris ] put 'em on my spark card.

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many were still getting their breakfast in the cafeteria of building 197, where shots rang out on workers. here are just a few of the eyewitness accounts of the horrific violence. >> this morning, about 8:20, i was in the cafeteria, i had just paid for my breakfast. i was waiting for my friend to pay for hers. >> i was in the alley behind building 197. >> we all looked at each other and said let's stay here in the calf fear and i said no, i'm getting out. >> definitely were definitely scared and so was i. >> somebody was running through the hallways telling everybody to get out of the building. >> she told us to run, run, run. >> started calling a supervisor, started calling co-workers to see if they were okay. >> there was three gunshots straight in a row, pop, pop, pop. >> there was an individual who came from the building behind us, talking to me, basically saying that, hey, heard there is a shooter in your building. >> three seconds later, it was pop, pop, pop, pop, pop. so a total about seven gunshots

and we started running. >> and then i heard two more shots, one of them hit him, he went down in front of me and i took off from there. >> this is a nightmare. >> the motive is still unclear and information is still developing as they receive medical treatment as medical facilities in washington, d.c. joining me now is nbc analyst and former fbi profiler, clint van zandt. clint, again, another massive shooting, but this one so different in detail in the fact that it was someone with military experience of two years in the reserves. collecting information on this man should not be that tough, should it? >> no, this shouldn't be a challenge, ed. we'll be able to figure out who he is, realize his military service was all in the reserves. i heard somebody refer to this guy as a decorated military veteran. he got basically two medals, which i got and other people would get in the military if you keep breathing for six months or a year, you get those. so this is -- this guy has got a

record. two or three years ago, he got arrested. in texas, where firing a firearm in public. so there is going to be enough public information about him who his roommate described as a mild-mannered buddhist who you and i know is kind of a way of life, that would not be consistent with this level of violence whatsoever. so there was a lot to be learned yet. >> what we are told tonight from joe shannon jr., criminal district attorney in parent county, texas, aaron alexis was arrested on september 4th, 2010 by ft. worth police on accusations he recklessly discharg discharged a my arm. it was determined that alexis was cleaning a gun in his apartment when it accidentally went off. a bullet entered an apartment upstai upstairs. no one was injured. after reviewing the facts as presented by the police department, it was determined

that elements constituting recklessness under texas law were not present, and a case was not filed. so that is some of the insight into his past. very unusual that someone would be in navy reserves for just a couple of years. what brings someone to this kind of action to possess several firearms and to go into a workplace to take the lives of many and who knows how many he would have taken, had he not been stopped? >> well, we don't know yet, ed. does he have any real history? we hear him referred to as a contractor, we're told he wasn't assigned to this facility for a long period of time. and yet somehow he was able to walk in, drive in, go over the wall, or just use another person's badge that he either found or stole to get an ar-15, a double-barrel shotgun, and we're told a semiautomatic

pistol. whether that was his or whether he took it from one of the officers he shot. but he wound up with three weapons, at least two long guns that he had in that building. and how did he get that in? well, we're told there's no metal detectors. again, are you going to screen 3,000 people with a metal detector to let them in on what appears to be relatively secure facility? ed, just like we thought ft. hood was a relatively secure facility. and in this case, just like that one, the wrong person has got a gun in their hand, and commits this terrible act of murder and mayhem. >> clint vanzant, we have heard numerous accounts from eye-witness eye-witnesses. tell us about law enforcement entering an environment like this in a very unusual situation, on a military facility. what does that do? does it change anything procedurally for law enforcement? >> well, it shouldn't, because these agencies, metropolitan police, fbi, the local security

that -- civil security, armed, that is assigned to that facility, they all probably trained in the past, ed, on a shooting situation. and realize, we learned that terrible lesson in columbine, if there is an active shooter inside of a building, cranking off rounds, you've got to go for him. you can't take your time. you can't close off the building. you can't very methodically clear one floor at a time. you've got to get to the shooter, isolate him as quick as you can, stop him from shooting, evacuate the building. those are the terrible lessons that we have learned. and realize, in the last two or three years in the united states, we have averaged almost one mass shooting every month in this country. >> workplace protection is now almost a science. in the wake of situations like this, i would assume that a lot of companies and workplaces around the country revisit this, and rethink their security

measures. your thoughts on that. >> well, i do this with a number of companies. i travel around the country, and i talk to them about workplace violence. and the question always comes up, ed, if you and i were in that building, what do you do if somebody comes in, starts shooting? and basically, you have at least three options. number one, the best option is to get out of that building as quick as you can. go out a door, go out a window, tell other people to go with you. but don't wait for them. get out the building yourself. number two, is to hunker down in place. close your door, lock it, put a piece of furniture in front of it, turn off the lights, turn off the ringer on your cell phone, get under a desk and wait for law enforcement to come and get you. and ed, number three, is just like those brave men and women on that plane in 9/11 that went down in pennsylvania, if you've got no other choice, you look around, you find what's a weapon and i realize, you know, bringing a knife to a gun fight

or bringing a lamp or anything else to a gun fight. but if it's your life or this guy's, you make a decision. because your life, one way or the other is going to be based on that decision. >> all right. clint van zandt, thank you for joining us on "the ed show" tonight. appreciate it so much. we'll keep you up to date throughout the show. stay tuned. [ shapiro ] at legalzoom, you can take care of virtually

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and welcome back to "the ed show." we continue to cover the horrific shooting that unfolded starting at 8:20 this morning in the navy yard in washington, d.c., which has left 13 people dead and many injured.

numerous reports and conflicting reports throughout the day from different news agencies. and we are nailing it down here on "the ed show" tonight. and one comment that came at us at a press briefing not long ago, about an hour ago, officials at med star washington center held a press conference to provide an update on the victims brought into that facility today after the shooting. and chief medical doctor janice orlowski, took a moment to reflect on the tragedy and today's events. >> there is something evil in our society that we as americans have to work to try and eradicate. i -- i have to say, i may see this every day, i may be the chief medical officer of a very large trauma center. but there's something wrong here. when we have these multiple shootings, these multiple

injuries, there is something wrong. the only thing i can say is, we have to work together to get rid of it. i would like you to put my trauma center out of business. i really would. i would like to not be an expert on gunshots and not to be an expert on this. we are. we are do it well. very experienced surgeons. but quite frankly, i would rather they were doing their surgery on other things. and, you know, it's a great city. it's a great country. and we have to work together to get rid of this. because we just cannot have, you know, one more shooting with, you know, so many people killed. we've got to figure this out. we've got to be able to help each other. we're dealing right now with three innocent people, but my prayers and my thoughts go out to those people who have died as

a result of today. and, you know, their families and what they're going to have to go through. so i have to say, you know, it's a challenge to all of us. let's get rid of this. this is not america. this is not washington, d.c. this is not good. so we have got to work to get rid of this. >> this was dr. janis orlowski, medical director at that facility in washington, d.c. joining me now is ej dionne of the "washington post" and thomas perriello, ceo for the action fund. gentlemen, thank you for joining us tonight. i want your reaction to this. my reaction to that is that, you know, the folks who provide all the care under tremendous duress, it takes a toll on them, as well. and i thought that it was almost therapy for that doctor to step up and to be able to say that in front of the microphones tonight, and whether our

lawmakers are going to make any changes or not remains to be seen. but the fact is, workplace violence in this country is going to be under a microscope and behavior of people with firearms is always going to be under a microscope. ej, what did you make of that doctor making that statement in the heat of all of it? >> i say god bless dr. orlowski. i hope everybody in the country sees that. let's get rid of this, she said. and it's just very strange when stuff like this happens. we focus for a day, a week, sometimes longer after newtown. and then the debate gets all ideological. and if you want to just do this small thing or that small thing to make gun violence a little less likely, it becomes a huge deal, like you're trying to fundamentally take away people's rights. the most fundamental right is the right to be safe and not to be subject to this. and i have to say, ed, my sister

was in the navy and then worked as a civilian for the navy. and when her command was in building 197, and when she was in d.c., that's where she would go. and so i have a real there but for the grace of god go i feeling today for all the folks who have suffered down there. >> according to a study released in february, the united states has had an average rate of one mass shooting per month since 2009. and tom, considering the statement from the doctor making a direct plea to lawmakers, saying that we have to do this together, we all know that after sandy hook, there have been no gun legislation passed whatsoever. and i don't anticipate anything will change after this, either. but what does it say about our society when we continually now have a consistent static to put up monthly about an horrific event like this? >> the statistics on mass shootings are terrible. on average, 33 americans are killed every day with gun violence. we know that the states that

have loose gun laws have twice the gun violence rates of those with more strict laws. but we also see that d.c. can't do this alone because of the laws in neighboring states, et cetera. and the vast majority of americans think that keeping dangerous guns out of the hands of the most dangerous people is something that makes sense. i come from a family of pediatricians that have seen way too many kids killed or injured by gunshots, whether that's mistakes around the house or through gun violence. so i think doctors speak to this from a scientific perspective where they're used to seeing a problem, diagnosing it and wanting to have a prescription. and getting very frustrated with the political system that doesn't act the same way. sees a problem, tries to come up with a prescription, and applies it. and i think it's time for our elected officials to do that. >> the shooter is 34-year-old aaron alexis, who was killed at the scene in a gun battle. he was released from the navy reserves after two years, which

is unusual, according to colonel jack jacobs, who was with us earlier tonight. and he was released because of misconduct issues. now i don't know if that would have disqualified him to being a gun owner in america, or i'm not quite sure if a background check would have changed anything that unfolded today. ej, your thoughts on all of this. i'm sure the military knows a lot about this person. >> yeah, and i suspect we will learn a lot more about him. and one of the problems we have in the gun debate is we don't know all the specifics today. and i am sure there will be facts here where folks who don't want any sort of gun regulations, whether it's background checks or limits on the big magazines, might be able to take some of those facts and say, well that particular law would not have prevented this shooting. >> yeah. >> but that's not the way to look at this. i thought the doctor laid it out well, which is we're never going to create a perfect society. we're not going to get rid of all violence.

alas, human beings are human beings. but we can take steps that make incidents like this a little less likely, or maybe significantly less likely. and so i hope that we look at this whole -- in the context of all of the other events and say how do we follow that doctor's prescription? >> well, tom, it would seem to me that there may be some lawmakers who would ask the question, what is the military's responsibility to protect a facility of 3,000 people? how does a guy with an ar-15, a double-barrel shotgun and a handgun walk into a facility and start taking the lives of people, and the military not protecting their facilities? i would suspect there is going to be some lawmakers that are going to want to question that. >> well, sure. i think everyone is asking that question. but people also want to breathe and try to gather the facts on this. there's so much we don't know about who this person is, or was. and what happened in this case. and those are all appropriate questions to ask, as ej noted.

>> it would seem to me at the facility, that has been described, which is heavy -- part of naval operations, and oversight of systems of naval operations, this is pretty lax security. would you admit to that or not agree with me on that? >> i just don't know enough, ed. i would want to know more about how he accessed the facility and what happened and what access. certainly the facts you're laying out there are compelling. how would anyone get so heavily armed in this facility. but i would want to know a lot more before i looked into that and i'm sure the navy itself is asking those questions and has been all day. >> you live in washington, you're on the hill, you worked on the hill, you were in congress. do you think this will move lawmakers now that it happened in their backyard? >> you know, i think we've already had so many tragedies in this country that should have been enough to move folks. you saw that with the manchin/toomey legislation, to close loopholes that allow

criminals and others to obtain weapons. this is a fairly simple issue. we have seen the winds on this change across the country with people who consider themselves democrats, independents and republicans. and yet that wasn't enough to get it through the senate. >> yeah. >> but unfortunately, the problem doesn't go away. so i think we'll continue the conversation, and both the cultural aspect and the policy aspect of this. but we also have a lot of families that are grieving today. we have a lot of first responders who remind us that as much as we demonize government officials, these are folks risking their lives every day, whether it's the teacher in georgia or the first responders today. >> no question about it. ej dionne, does this change the dynamic at all, seeing it happened in washington? >> i hope it does. i hope it has some effect. i agree totally with tom. you can't jump to all kinds of judgments and our hearts today should be first with the grieving families. but we have had this happen over and over and over again. and i think what that doctor said resonates in a way that

maybe might not have resonateded a couple years al after newtown, where i think that people who want a real conversation on steps you actually can take that are practical here, they shouldn't give up. they've got to keep pushing. we cannot resign ourselves, which we seem to have done as a society, to doing nothing after something like this happens. and i hope congress really does take a good look at this and say, maybe we should revisit these issues again and maybe the result will be different. >> all right. ej dionne, tom perriello, great to have you with us on "the ed show". you're watching "the ed show" on msnbc. more coverage on the deadly shooting at the naval yard in washington, d.c. right after this. and if you do it. and your friends do it. and their friends do it... soon we'll be walking our way to awareness, support and an end to alzheimer's disease.

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chemical weapons were used in syria last month. the report stopped short of assigning blame for the use of sarin. an agreement strait john kerry reached to move chemical weapons out by 2014. president obama addressed the agreement earlier today. >> now, in recent weeks, much of our attention has been focused on the events in syria. the horrible use of chemical weapons on innocent people, including children, the need for a firm response from the international community, and over the weekend, we took an important step in that direction towards moving syria's chemical weapons under international control so they can be destroyed. and we're not there yet. but if properly implemented, this agreement could end the threat these weapons pose, not only to the syrian people, but to the world. >> and in other news, bill de

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for a store near you go to benjaminmoore.com/bayarea. welcome back to "the ed show." the shooting in washington, d.c., today has captured the country attention, no question about it. and it has drawn reaction from many on capitol hill including house speaker john boehner who put out a statement today saying quote, this has been a dark day and we know more of them lie ahead for the families of the victims. hoping that they find comfort and answers is at the top of our minds. president obama also addressed the shooting earlier today. >> we are confronting yet another mass shooting, and today it happened on a military installation in our nation's capital. it's a shooting that targeted our military and civilian personnel. these are men and women who were going to work, doing their job protecting all of us.

they're patriots and they know the dangers of serving abroad, but today they faced the unimaginable violence that they wouldn't have expected here at home. >> for more, let's bring in nbc news white house correspondent peter alexander. peter, the latest from the white house tonight, very unusual day today for the white house, i'm sure. >> reporter: that's certainly the case. within the last five or so minutes, the president ordered for the flags here at the white house to be lowered to half staff where they will remain until this friday at sunset. and the image is so striking when you consider that as the flags here now do fly at half staff, this time it's because of a mass shooting that took place within a matter of miles from here. we have also heard from the president just a short time ago. white house officials telling us the president did speak earlier today with the secretary of the navy, ray mavis, expressing his

condolences as well as commending the bravery of so many of the navy personnel and first responders on what took place miles from where we are. the white house has been briefed by his homeland security and counterterrorism adviser and he's asked for those briefings to continue. one other note i should let you know, in the last five minutes we're ools hearing about this tragedy from the former representative of arizona gabby giffords and her husband. i just reached out to them and they have put out a statement moments ago. remember kelly is a former navy combat pilot as well as a nasa astronaut. the statement reads as proud members of the navy family, we take note of the tragic attack on men and women who dedicate themselves to keeping america safe did not occur in a war

overseas but in a mass shooting here at home. ed? >> peter, tomorrow is another work day. is there any conversation at the white house tonight about increased security at military installations tomorrow? >> reporter: it's a good question. there have certainly been shifts in terms of the way the white house has gone about its events of this day. while they kept the economic speech on earlier today, the white house has postponed a latin music festival event that was to take place with stars like gloriaestefan and others coming. they decided to postpone that event in terms of security of military installations, we wait for more word. >> obviously comforting the victims' families is paramount in this situation, but again there's a quick conversation about where we go from here when it comes to any kind of measures of security.

any of that conversation about gun control and answering the question how does a guy walk into a facility like that with an ar-15, a double barrel shot gun, and a handgun and go unnoticed? >> reporter: the question remains. does this change where the decisions are made which is the votes on capitol hill? the white house obviously would like to see that all change, the circumstances change. they've bourn witness too many times to mass shootings where nothing was done. in many ways the white house has done all it can at this point. >> peter alexander at the white house tonight. thank you for your time tonight. now let's bring back ej dionne of the washington post and tom periello. what is the next move by lawmakers on this? tomorrow is another day and will this be brought forward, do you think, by some lawmakers that we have to go back to the same

conversation we had post-sandy hook? >> we know in dozens -- i think you see activists who stayed quiet for a long time saying that's not acceptable. they are going to push for more votes. it's the best votes of the ones you don't have to take. and i think those who want our communities to be safe are sick and tired of those votes not happening. i'm someone who was supported by the nra but i believe in common sense. this is just smns stuff when you're talking about closing loopholes on background checks in particular. so obviously we need more about the specifics of this but i imagine it will continue the public debate and a time for gathering facts and mourning. >> we stated the number of mass shootings that has taken place in this country since 2009. ej, whether or not any lawmakers step forward to come forward with a new proposal or not, this will be in the mix for 2014,

will it not? this conversation? >> i think it will. and i do think you're going to have people like senator manchin coming forward again. i've been listening to the broadcast. we will have a rational and constructive conversation about security at military facilities. we will have a rational and constructive conversation about mental health issues and how we can prevent terrible events like this. why can't we have a rational and constructive conversation about firearms policy? we should be able to talk about all these things together and not have this perverse political correctness that says if it's guns, we can't do anything. >> well, what about that, tom? >> well, i think for those on the other side of this debate who have been saying we just need more weapons and more security, keep in mind this was on a military base. and i think you see the weakness of those arguments.

we need to have this conversation and in communities around the country. you talked about 2014. it would be interesting to see whether this might have implications in 2013 where you see some house delegate races and this could be an issue in northern virginia. >> how could this not be a political issue at any moment? because we've had so many mass shootings. tom, you mentioned the number of american lives we lose every day in this country to gun violence. and of course another mass shooting would push forward the conversation of what can we do? it's a constant review in our country as to what is happening to society and what can we do to correct it all? we have to come to the stark reality that at this point, maybe nothing. unfortunately. >> i hope not. i hope people will listen to that doctor you put on the show earlier. she was a great witness. >> no doubt. ej dionne, tom periello, thanks

for being on. that is "the ed show." "politicsnation" with reverend al sharpton starts now. thank you for tuning in. tonight's lead, breaking news. any moment now d.c. police are expected to hold a news conference on today's deadly mass shooting in our nation's capital. one gunman has been identified, but another potential suspect is still at large. here's the latest. at least 13 people are dead including the suspected shooter. another dozen people have been hurt, some critically. the gunman has been identified as 34-year-old aaron alexis. he's a former petty officer in the navy reserves. police are still looking for a second possible suspect in the shooting. here are some of the emergency calls from the shooting as it happened. >> we got a report