every day at 12:00 eastern here on msnbc and my friend maya wiley from the center of social inclusion. that's all for this evening, the rachel maddow show starts right now. we have some breaking news from the "new york times" about a key detail about how the shooting at the naval yard in d.c. happened. the times reporting tonight, the apparent shooter aaron alexis, tried to buy an ar-15 military style semi-automatic rifle from a virginia gun store last week because he was stopped from buying that particular kind of weapon because of a state law that prohibits -- while he was at that gun store, he did test fire the ar-15, he expressed interest nit. but because of that state law,

apparently, he instead purchased a pump action, what they call a law enforcement style remington shotgun and ammunition. and it is that loaded shotgun, officials believe that alexis brought with him into the navy facility. he useded that shotgun to shoot one or more police officers immediately inside the facility. and then he took handguns from police in order to continue his assault. so he had the shotgun and two handguns, is the best understanding now of what he was armed with. he tried to get an ar-15 and could not get it from that particular shop in virginia. that's breaking from the "new york times." here's something else interesting that came out late today. you'll recall yesterday pretty much as soon as authorities named aaron alexis as the shooter, aaron alexis, age 34 of ft. worth texas. it was the ft. worth texas police department, that released

this arrest record from the time alexis was arrested there in 2010, he was arrested for discharging a firearm inside his apartment in ft. worth. other than just the weapons charge and the arrest itself, what was particularly of interest was the upstairs neighbor. saying in that police report that she was terrified of him. that was the first police report that came out very early in the day as soon as we learned he was from ft. worth. then a few hours later, yesterday afternoon, it was the police department in seattle, washington saying they too had a police report from arresting aaron alexis, this happened in 2004, when he shot out the tires of a construction worker's car. he confessed to police officers that he had done it in what he described as a rage fueled blackout. he said it did it because he felt that the construction workers on the site next to hiss home had disrespected him.

what seemed particularly interesting about that, again, beyond just the arrest itself and the weapons charge itself. what was particularly interesting given yesterday's events was this young man's father telling the seattle police department at the time that his son had anger management issues, as well as the claim by both father and son that the younger mr. alexis had been part of rescue efforts on september 11th in new york city and that he felt he might have been scarred or stressed in some way by that experience. we still do not have any confirmation as to whether or not aaron alexis actually did take part in 9/11 rescue efforts in lower manage hat tan back in 2001. but nbc and the "new york times" reported that alexis was a part-time clerical worker at the burlington community college. he was there from february '01

until february '03. the ft. worth police report and the seattle police report, there were some interesting details. the fact that they were arrest records themselves was an interesting part of figuring this puzzle out. now we have another one that is very recent and very strange. it's from newport, rhode island from just a few weeks ago. officer number 364 said that he and his partner, another officer got a call at just before 6:30 in the morning last month, it was august 7, a wednesday morning. they were called to the marriott hoe tell in newport, rhode island on what they call a harassment report. upon arriving on the scene, aaron alexis said that he was a

naval contractor who had floeng from for work. he explained to the officers that he got into a verbal am ter indication with an unnobody party in the airport. he believed that the individual who he got in the argument with had sent three people to follow him and to keep him awake by talking to him and sending vibration into his body. he stated that he first heard them while talking to them through a wall while at the residence in in middletown. he then packed up and went to a hotel at the navy base, but this there he heard them talking to him through the walls, through the floor andthrough the ceiling. he then moved to his third hotel and he is at the marriott. the reason he has called police to his third hotel of the night to report harassment is because at this third hotel of the night

that he has been to, he said that the three individuals were speaking to him through the floor. then he stated that the voices were coming through the ceiling. then he stated that the individuals are using some sort of microwave machine to send vibrations through the ceiling, penetrating his body so he cannot fall asleep. police officers taking that report, at 6:00 in the morning on a wednesday this mast montpa they did not take any action. they told him to stay away from these people. they told him they could call the newport, rhode island police if those people actually showed upd and somebody could see them. it was two officers who respond to this guy at the hotel. one of those officers wrote up

the narrative of what happened, which i just read from. but when they came back and filled that that report, the sergeant read this report, of this pretty obviously hallucinating guy who moved three times in the night and called police to tell them about the microwave machines. the skergeant sees that he's calling himself a naval contractor a and decides to alert the navy. based on the naval base implications and the involved suspect was hearing voices, i made contact with on duty naval station police. i had vised the naval station police of the report and of the claims by aaron alexis. i then faxed a copy of my report. they said they would follow up and determine if in fact he was a naval base contractor. it turns out he was a naval base contractor.

this report about him having paranoid delusions, so motivating to him that he was calling police and staying up all night and moving three times in a night to three different hotel rooms, this happened apparently while he really was traveling for work, to various u.s. navy installations as a contractor for the united states navy who had a security keerns and had passed a background check in order to be there. since then he has worked in stafford, virginia and of course at the navy yard in washington, d.c. the company what employed him to work on those navy m installations said that had they known about the mental health implications in his background, quote, that would be a black flag, we would not have hired him. but they did. after the newport, rhode island

police encountered an obviously delusional man, and that police department notified the navy that they had contractor on their hands with serious active mental problems and they faxed them the report and even after naval station police said they would look into it, apparently no one did, or if they did, nothing happened. nothing triggered anything on his employment as a contractor. nothing triggered anything in his security check or background check, none of the arrests, none of the misconduct problems that he had while he was in the navy, which the navy, you would think might know about. none of his known and documented mental health issues, none of his weapons charges, nothing. nothing happened. and now less than six weeks after newport, rhode island police called the navy to tell them they had a guy on their hands who thought he was being screamed about through the

microwave, six weeks after utterly -- 12 people are dead and so is he. and now here is tonight's lead on "the washington post's" main story. the headline is, broad review of government security check system launched. revel lagss that aaron alexis was twice able to pass the government's security check system despite a history of arrests, mental illness and shoothing incidents has now triggered a discussion into how background checks are conducted. the system already under scrutiny in the wake of nsa contractor edward snowden's leaks of classified information. remember, ed snowden was also a military contractor. there are 4.9 million people who hold security clearances in our country. that's according to the director

of national intelligence. and you'll remember, director of national intel jenls is a job we didn't used to v but which do now, the hugely expanded world of intelligence makes up a huge number of those security cleeshss, especially for contractors like edward snowden. but the bigger bun is defense. as compared with the rest of our government and the budget that's spent on it and the proportion of its work that is done by contractors. so much of what we do in national security now is done by contractors, that you know who has the job of deciding whether or not contractors get security clearances? you know who has that job? contractors. contractors clear other contractors in terms of their security clearances. a private firm apparently called first advantage, checked out aaron alexis as recently as july for his clearance, despite the arrests, the weapons charges,

the shooting incidents, the mental health issues, he apparently came up clean, got his pass, got his contractor job, got into the navy yard and presumably did what the voices in his head told him to. if our national security state is too big to run well, then it is too big to rung. edward snowden only stole secrets. aaron alexis stole a dozen like lives. what's next? in the industry. i set goals and worked hard to meet them. i've made my success happen. so when it comes to my investments, i'm supposed to just hand it over to a broker and back away? that's not gonna happen. avo: when you work with a schwab financial consultant, you'll get the guidance you need with the control you want. talk to us today. [ engine revs, tires squeal ] [ male announcer ] since we began,

mercedes-benz has pioneered many breakthroughs. ♪ breakthroughs in design... breakthroughs in safety... in engineering... and technology. and now our latest creation breaks one more barrier. introducing the cla. starting at $29,900. ♪

where would you go?iving away a trip every day. starting at $29,900. woman: 'greece.' woman 2: 'i want to go to bora bora.'

man: 'i'd always like to go to china.' anncr: download the expedia app and your next trip could be on us. expedia, find yours. [ male announcer ] not all toral-b pro-health toothbrushes have crisscross bristles that remove up to 90% of hard to reach plaque. feel the difference. oral-b, trust the brand more dentists and hygienists use. oral-b.

can you see a light at all? >> i can see a light, yes. >> it's got a flashlight down here, which i wouldn't obviously need. but it would be handy for kim if she ever wanted it again. >> the iowa republican legislator, a and the iowa republican governor changed iowa law so that being legally blind ask no longer a barrier to not just buying a weapon, but to getting a permit to carry one in public. we're not talking about the specially shooting ranges set up for the blind and the vizqusual impaired. we're not talking about that specialist highly regulated shooting set up for the blind.

we're talking about a guy at the mall with a holster on his hip and a red tipped cane in his hand. when the doyes moines register d their big feature about gun laws in iowa. the point of that story was not that this loophole had been found in the -- the point of the story was it was all right happening. local sheriff's are prohibited from saying no to anyone who's blind who seeks this kind of permit. so they've been giving these permits out to blind people. at least three so for in iowa. because why not? that caused consternation around iowa and around the world. iowa legislators and the governor feel now about their guns for the blind law getting all this attention. and it turns out, they don't even really remember doing it.

quote, some iowa law makers now say they were confused about or can't recall their specific intentions when they voted to approve a law that grants blind people permits to carry guns in public. that's one group in iowa, one group that's confused that they did this or don't remember doing it. their efforts to fix these loopholes were, quote, unsuccessful. so that's group two. they knew something was wrong but they did it anyway. the law did pass nymph. there are now blind people getting gun permits in iowa. and there is a third faction in terms of how lawmakers feel about this. and this third faction includes iowa governor stone branston. that third governor says the law is working just fine and no changes are needed. all sides, though, agree on one thing, there's little chance that serious consideration will be given to changing iowa's gun permit law. so some people did think it was

problematic to give blind people gun permits. they tried to fix the law, but it didn't work. some people think it's fine to give blind people permits, including the state's republican governor. some people cannot even remember doing this or they find the entire thing confusing. we give blind people guns? we voted for that? i don't even really remember that. those are the three groups, but all of those groups definitely agree that this definitely will not be fixed in iowa. . while the thing gun thing has gotening a lot of attention from comics and others who marvel at things like this about our country. but the iowa sheriff's who rejected had to give gun permits to -- the same law has required them to okay gun permits also for registered sex offenders. people who are convicted of sex crimes who are banned from whole

swabs of public and private activity that's considered to be too dangerous, too threatening for somebody who's a sex offender, but they can now carry guns in public. the blind thing is not getting fixed and neither is the sex offender thing, none of this is going to be fixed in iowa. this is similar to the situation they're facing right no indiana ip. in october of last year, republican governor bobby jindal was very happy to make a case for an nra amendment in louisiana a fundmental right in the legal sense and that sounds awesome, right? the constitutional amendment was supported by the governor, it passed. turns out, though, it has the practical affect of basically nullifying or at least putting at risk, all laws related to guns in the whole state of louisiana. including those they did not want to get rid of. if you are a convicted felon,

you're not supposed to have a gun. most people don't have a problem with that law. even the gun rights lobbyists are not out there saying more guns for murderers, more guns for convicted ra eedis eed rapi doesn't sound good. but this law siz if you are a rapist or a murderer you ought to be able to have a gun, the louisiana law that says a felon shouldn't have a gun was struck down by a lower court judge because of this new constitutional amendment written by the nra and supported to bobby jindal. governor bobby jindal says he doesn't want convicted felons to buy guns. he's not in favor of murderers and rapists getting guns. he says it was all a misunderstanding. he said he didn't know this

constitutional amendment might do this to his state. now the chips are falling where they may. in north carolina last night shlg the winston-salem city council voted to change it's local laws to allow guns on winston-salem's city play grounds. they don't want it, but a new state law signed in july by the republican governor in north carolina t same day he signed the state's new abortion restrictions, signed another law that day that basically forces every city and town in the state of north carolina to allow guns on their playgrounds, even if they do not want to, even if they do not think it is right for their city or towns. state republicans are forcing them to with this new state law. north carolina is about to enact a new state law basically bang banning gun buy backs. they'll offer some sort of cash payment or maybe a gift card or a bag of groceries or something

as a sort of gun amnesty. so if you have a gun laying around, if there's some gun in your life that for some reason you do not want, at one of these buy backs, you can hand it over to is local authorities. maybe you get something in return, maybe you don't and they just agree to take it no questions asked. but it's a way for local law enforcement to get unwanted guns off the street. the new law that's about to go into effect in north dakota, blocks local law enforcement from taking guns off the street with these kinds of programs. they are no longer allowed to destroy the guns they collect. they are allowed to sell them to local gun shops so more people can buy them, they go back into circulation, back out on the streets, right? but the point is, they have to be put back in circulation, so they are not off the street. because any local community who thinks it's got too many guns on the streets and wants to remove them, they are now banned from

doing that in arizona and now in north carolina. and that's pretty much how things have been going in the country, ever since the sandy hook elementary school massacre in newtown, connecticut las year. pro gun laws gain ground. within six months of newtown, yes, five states did pass laws strengthening some gun restrictions, but twice that many states passed laws weakening gun control. republicans have long advocated making it easier for some people to get guns. but their ability to do that in states they control have actually been accelerated by the murder of those first graders in newtown, since then there's been five other mass shootings, yesterdays was the fifth. santa monica college, four dead, manchester, illinois five dead, including two kids plus the

gunman. and federal way washington, herkimer, four people shot plus the gunman. those are all since sandy hook. before newtown, it was accent signing systems in minneapolis. seven dead, kbvr that, it was the chic temperatu the -- before that it was that seattle cafe, six dead, oiko university, in oakland, california, seven dead. the i hop mass shooting in carson city nevada, before that, five dead. in tucson, the gabby giffords shooting, six dead. and, and, and, a and. the fbi definition of mass murder in which a killer takes four other people's lives,

wlov whether or not the killer takes his own life in the incident. most of those i just mentioned are not famous. whenever there is one that is shocking enough or big enough to be famous, it rises close to becoming a policy matter, close enough to becoming a policy matter that leaders do get asked about it. after yesterday's mass hooting which the fbi siz was committed by a young man who was acting alone. after that one, that one is big enough and famous enough to rise to the level that our leaders get asked about it. president obama was asked about it tate. he was asked whether we should stop hoping whether this kind of thing will ever get any better. >> are we condemned to live in a country where massacres are just part and parcel of our daily existence? >> we don't have to be. and the overwhelming majority of the american people understand that there's some common sense gun safety laws that we can put

in place that could prevent some of this tragedy from happening. it's not going to prevent all violence, it's not going to prevent all gun violence. but initial reports indicate that this is an individual who may have had some mental health problems, the fact that we do not have a firm enough background check system, is something that makes us more vulnerable to these kinds of mass shootings. >> the president speaking tonight on telemundo. the last effort to strengthen the gun laws after newtown did not pass. senator harry reid said it would not have the votes to pass if it came up now. senator joe manchin said he would bring up that legislation or something similar to it if hi had any hope. that said, one republican senator, the appointed senator from south carolina, tim scott,

did tell tim stanton of busby today said i do understand that this person from the navy incident suffered from mental illness. perhaps we will have an opportunity to look at that. perhaps the fifth mass killing since the one in december will nak the difference. so far what's happened is that the democrats hearing on stand your ground laws and gun violence, that was put up for a day because of the massacre at the navy yard. but texas governor rick perry's simultaneous photo-op of him touring a gun factory in maryland, that was not put off. but it is very frequently inappropriate, it is very frequently the wrong tragic moment to discuss gun violence. because that's something we have to be really sensitive about and not talk about too much.

joining us now is john stanton, washington bureau chief at buzz feed. thank you for being here tonight. you had a piece in buzz feed today, talking with members of congress about the prospect of their being any national policy response to this latest gun massacre, it seems like the answer is basically no, or is it thoroughly no? >> i think it's thoroughly no. i think republicans have more of a chance of abandoning attempts to re -- >> when tim scott told you that there maybe is an opportunity to do something on mental illness, what do you think he meant? >> well, i think he was talking about, there is this narrow possibility that the parts of the manchin-tomby bill, there is

a chance they may be able to broker a deal there. harry reid said he will bring up that narrow piece of it. there are some republicans out there that believe this is an issue that needs to be addressed. at the same time, i'm not sure that will last very long. shortly after sandy hook, there were lots of republicans that made some sorts of noises about maybe being open to some kind of expanded back ground check or strengthened background check and they quickly backed off on that. if republicans feel pressure and if democrats are unable to feel pressure on them, which is sort of what's happening now, you can see that momentum would operate very, very quickly. >> do you see any possibility in washington that we're actually going to move backward toward more lax gun laws than we did in the united states. i'm struck by the fact that everybody seems impressed that we had a handful of blue states and in the case of colorado, sort of a purple state, move

toward sort of senseless gun legislation, gun reforms after sandy hook. but twice as many states moved in the opposite direction. do you see any indications that federally they'll move in the opposite direction? >> i don't think that the democrats in it senate would agree to any of that and president obama would vito any bill and that would be no chance of -- the federal government not doing anything is sort of enough at this point for them. they can pull back these laws to the state level, so long as the federal government isn't stepping in, that is essentially a weakening of the law in and of itself for them. as long as they have the status quo in washington, they're winning that sort of battle. >> john stanton, washington bureau chief for buzz feed. thank you for your time tonight, john. just ahead on the interview tonight, nasa space shuttle

commander, husband of gabby giffords mark kelley will be joining us, stay with us. [ female announcer ] it's simple physics...

a body at rest tends to stay at rest... while a body in motion tends to stay in motion. staying active can actually ease arthritis symptoms. but if you have arthritis, staying active can be difficult. prescription celebrex can help relieve arthritis pain so your body can stay in motion. because just one 200mg celebrex a day can provide 24 hour relief for many with arthritis pain and inflammation. plus, in clinical studies, celebrex is proven to improve daily physical function so moving is easier. celebrex can be taken with or without food. and it's not a narcotic. you and your doctor should balance the benefits with the risks. all prescription nsaids, like celebrex, ibuprofen, naproxen and meloxicam have the same cardiovascular warning. they all may increase the chance of heart attack or stroke, which can lead to death. this chance increases if you have heart disease or risk factors such as high blood pressure or when nsaids are taken for long periods. nsaids, like celebrex,

increase the chance of serious skin or allergic reactions, or stomach and intestine problems, such as bleeding and ulcers, which can occur without warning and may cause death. patients also taking aspirin and the elderly are at increased risk for stomach bleeding and ulcers. don't take celebrex if you have bleeding in the stomach or intestine, or had an asthma attack, hives, other allergies to aspirin, nsaids or sulfonamides. get help right away if you have swelling of the face or throat, or trouble breathing. tell your doctor your medical history. and find an arthritis treatment for you. visit celebrex.com and ask your doctor about celebrex. for a body in motion.

hello. >> hello. >> how are you? >> i'm going to go to the gun store and buy a gun today. >> okay. >> because i want to demonstrate to everybody that will be watching how easy it is to get a universal background check. >> background checks. >> honey, i'm going to buy a gun. mark kelley and gabby giffords,

made that video so they could make a point about getting a background check isn't making it impossible to buy a gun. still the whole process only takes a few minutes. >> today we're going to demonstrate what the whole process is and how relatively simple it is. >> this will not be my on. gun. i've got a 9 millimeter ruger, a hunting rifle, a shotgun, a .25 semi-automatic pistol. very small. hey, you don't have that colt .45 anywhere, do you? i wanted to buy that colt .45 that was here. >> two important things. >> are you under indictment for a felony? have you every been convicted of a felony, no? are you a fugitive?

are you an unlawful user connected to marijuana? are you subject to a court restraining order? no, have you been convicted of any court of any misdemeanor for domestic violence. no. >> okay, appreciate it. thank you. >> five minutes and 36 seconds, that is how long mark kelley spent in that arizona gun store waiting for his background check so he could bring home a new gun and show it to his wife, former arizona congresswoman gabby giffords. two years ago today after the mass shooting in tucson, gabby giffords and mark kelley announced that they were forming a new organization. a nonprofit and a superpac called americans for responsible solutions. founded on the principle that it is okay to use guns and support gun rights while also changing policy to try to combat the

misuse of guns. they started that group in january, two years after gabby giffords was shot. since then they have been on the road for their cause. they began by testifying before a u.s. senate committee, pushing for background checks. over the summer, they took their case to seven states in seven days, sort of a whistle stop tour, that included mark kelley going through another background check. making the point that you can be gun owners, even gun enthusiasts and still support refortunatelies for gun safety. they also stopped at a shooting range, where congressman giffords fired a gun herself for the first time she was shot and so grievously wounded in 2007. she can no longer fire with her right hand, but seems to go okay with her left one. the debate of -- people who hate

guns versus people who love guns. that's the way the beltway media casts the debate most often. that's the way that both sides like to pose the reform. but that is not how the debate is cast for people who are on the side of the debate that want gun reform. last year mark kelley called on new jersey governor chris christie for young verse sal background checks in new jersey. the former native tells the governor of new jersey i would like to think we share in the belief that we must fight gun violence and also -- mark kelley and gabby giffords did not get much of what they wanted from the governor. the go for suggested it, the legislature passed it, but when it got to chris christie's desk, he changed his mind and decided to veto it. but however many roads end that

way in this debate. however difficult it is and however many set backs there, there's also a -- the newtown parents, the newtown action alliance, 40 meetings scheduled, talking to anyone who will talk to them in congress, not giving up. yesterday the debate thrust back upon us, again, by another mass shooting, the fifth one since newtown. something like the 14th since congresswoman giffords was shot in that mass shooting in tucson. and gabby giffords and mark kelley were back again, crossing the lines of this debate. if you had another mass killing in america. captain kelly writing, gabby and i are holding the victims of today's mass clur at the washington navy yard in our prayers and we know that will -- as the hours and days pass, americans should match their anger and sadness with gratitude

for the sailors, marines, police and first responders who are acting with courage today. gabby and i have been there. in times like this it is the ultimate affirmation to have a nation behind you. and as proud members of the navy family, we take note of the tragic fact that this terrible attack on men and women who dedicate themselves to keeping america safe did not occur in a war overseas, but in a mass shooting here at home. captain mark kelley joins us live for the interview next. [ tires screech ]

♪ [ male announcer ] 1.21 gigawatts. today, that's easy. ge is revolutionizing power. supercharging turbines with advanced hardware and innovative software. using data predictively to help power entire cities. so the turbines of today... will power us all... into the future. ♪ always go the extra mile. to treat my low testosterone, i did my research. my doctor and i went with axiron, the only underarm low t treatment. axiron can restore t levels to normal in about 2 weeks in most men. axiron is not for use in women or anyone younger than 18 or men with prostate or breast cancer. women, especially those who are or who may become pregnant and children should avoid contact where axiron is applied as unexpected signs of puberty in children

or changes in body hair or increased acne in women may occur. report these symptoms to your doctor. tell your doctor about all medical conditions and medications. serious side effects could include increased risk of prostate cancer; worsening prostate symptoms; decreased sperm count; ankle, feet or body swelling; enlarged or painful breasts; problems breathing while sleeping; and blood clots in the legs. common side effects include skin redness or irritation where applied, increased red blood cell count, headache, diarrhea, vomiting, and increase in psa. ask your doctor about the only underarm low t treatment, axiron. vietnam in 1972. [ all ] fort benning, georgia in 1999. [ male announcer ] usaa auto insurance is often handed down from generation to generation. because it offers a superior level of protection and because usaa's commitment to serve military members, veterans, and their families is without equal. begin your legacy, get an auto insurance quote.

usaa. we know what it means to serve. the atf background chk form. >> is this the kind of thing you think folks at gun shows -- >> it doesn't take long to fill out? >> we'll hope he passes. >> this is the moment of truth. >> it took how long? >> that long. >> congratulations. >> congratulations. that was mark kelley, advocate for gun safety reforms, buying a gun in new hampshire this summer.

demonstrating his belief that as a gun owner, going through a background check ask not toovp to fact. joining us tonight is captain mark kelley, he is the husband of former congresswoman gab yell giffords. captain kelley, thank you very much for being here. >> you're welcome, rachel. >> you've obviously served as an astronaut and an aviator in the navy. i want to ask you what you thought about yesterday's shooting at the navy yard in d.c. >> i served in the navy for 25 years and to see something like that happen to your navy family, that really hurts. also, it's about a block from where gabby lived in washington, d.c. there seems to be so many of these mass shootings that they can touch people, multiple ones can touch people in different ways. she lived very close to where that building was. >> one of the things we have

been trying to make sense of statistically in trying to understand this problem in our country, is why it seems like we're getting increased frequency of those mass shootings. they have existed to a certain extent. but in the last few years, mass shootings have taken place and very large scale mass shootings. do you have any insight as to why we're having more of these than we used to? >> mental health and the roll back of mental health care in this country certainly has to be part of it you. pointed out that we have had more mass shootings i think since 2007, when you think of shootings that included 12 or more people, so a higher number, 12 of them have occurred in the last six years. we have seen an increase, it's substantial and it's something that we really need to address. we need to have an honest

conversation about why this is happening. we need to look at the data and the metrics like we do at nasa when we have a problem. we follow the date to an answer. we haven't done that with this issue and we have got to stop yelling past each other and we need to come up with some common sense solutions. >> we spoke with john stanton who's the washington bureau chief for buzz feed on earlier today, he had on the surface some very depressing reporting, but also some very provocative reporting today with some senators about there could be new national policy to address mass shootings and gun violence. he came up with some results that seem very pessimistic, in terms of producinging traditional gun control type measures. it seems like there's a little bit of a ray of hope on mental health issues. maybe in a way that might be less of a hot button, particularly for republican

senators? what do you think about that. >> there should be and our organization has been working with congressional staffs and members of the senate and the house as well on this. i mean the mental health piece of this needs to be addressed. it could be addressed separately from the larger issue like background checks or magazine size. i mean we need to have conversations about both of those. but i think, you know, especially after -- in the case of what happened at the navy yard, when you have another shooter that clearly had some mental health issues, we need to address that, and we should do it now. we have got to stop just shouts past each other on this issue like we do on so many others. >> on the issue of the character of the debate, which you just referenced there, you and your wife have done a lot in your advocacy, especially over this past few months to try to, i think get rid of this false sense that you're either a gun owner or a gun grabber, that you're either a gun lover and you don't want any restrictions or you're a gun hater and you

want everyone's guns taken away. what do you think people need to understand about the falseness of that divide? >> well, i think people, you know, everybody should understand that most gun owners like gabby and i are responsible people, we often get a back ground check and in some cases, some people who buy from gun shows do not get background checks. what i worry about, rachel, is that when we have one mass shooting after the next, i mean we're just nine months since newtown where we had 20 first graders murdered in their classrooms, the national response has been nothing. and then we have had a couple more mass shootings since, including what happened at the navy yard. you know i think it puts responsible gun owners in a really bad position. and in this country, i think upwards of 65% of the people do not own guns and they're going to start thinking badly about all gun owners.

so i would hope that the gun lobby, including the nra at some point would see this and see that, you know, there is -- you know, we can have it both ways. people can enjoy ways. people can enjoy second amendment rights at the same time we can keep guns out of the hand of criminals and dangerously mentally ill. >> captain mark kelly, thank you very much for your time tonight. i know you don't accept a ton of in the view requests. thank you. >> you are welcome, rachel. thank you for having me on the show. >> thank you very much. we'll be right back. ...so you say men are superior drivers?

yeah? then how'd i get this... [ voice of dennis ] ...safe driving bonus check? every six months without an accident, allstate sends a check. silence. are you in good hands? i get out a lot... except when it's too cold. like the last three weekends. asthma doesn't affect my job... you missed the meeting again last week! it doesn't affect my family. your coughing woke me up again. i wish you'd take me to the park. i don't use my rescue inhaler a lot... depends on what you mean by a lot. coping with asthma isn't controlling it. test your level of control at asthma.com, then talk to your doctor. there may be more you could do for your asthma. we need a new recipe. hmmm. let us consult the scroll of infinite deliciousness. ♪

oh! perfect. [ wisest kid ] campbell's has the recipes kids love. like easy chicken and cheese enchiladas. so good! can i keep this? you already have it at campbellskitchen.com. nice. [ blows ] [ gong ] m'm! m'm! good! [ male announcer ] some things are designed to draw crowds.

others are designed to leave them behind. ♪ the all-new 2014 lexus is. it's your move.

>> hurry, hurry. 13 shopping days left until the self-inflicted crisis in washington. except this time the crisis is so big and self-inflicted not even republicans are supporting the republican whose are planning it. that story is next. ng out of pipe. sfx: birds chirping.

it's been that way since the day you met. but your erectile dysfunction - it could be a question of blood flow. cialis tadalafil for daily use helps you be ready anytime the moment's right. you can be more confident in your ability to be ready. and the same cialis is the only daily ed tablet approved to treat ed and symptoms of bph like needing to go frequently or urgently. tell your doctor about all your medical conditions and medications, and ask if your heart is healthy enough for sexual activity. do not take cialis if you take nitrates for chest pain, as this may cause an unsafe drop in blood pressure. do not drink alcohol in excess with cialis.

side effects may include headache, upset stomach, delayed backache or muscle ache. to avoid long-term injury, seek immediate medical help for an erection lasting more than 4 hours. if you have any sudden decrease or loss in hearing or vision, or if you have any allergic reactions such as rash, hives, swelling of the lips, tongue or throat, or difficulty breathing or swallowing, stop taking cialis and get medical help right away. ask your doctor about cialis for daily use and a 30-tablet free trial. i dbefore i dosearch any projects on my home. i love my contractor, and i am so thankful to angie's list for bringing us together. find out why more than two million members count on angie's list. angie's list -- reviews you can trust. ♪ don't tell mom. don't tell mom. don't tell mom! don't tell mom. okay. don't tell mom. don't tell mom.

don't tell mom? yeah. the best stories you'll ever tell start with, don't tell." don't tell dad. start yours in the new santa fe. from hyundai. does your dog food have? 18 percent? 20? new purina one true instinct has 30. active dogs crave nutrient-dense food. so we made purina one true instinct. learn more at purinaone.com hing, helicopthierhis hibuzzing, andk engine humming. sfx: birds chirping sfx: birds chirping >> bad news for unchecked disease and for the bankruptcy business. for the second year in a row, the proportion of americans who do not have health insurance is down thanks to government programs. the proportion of americans who

are uninsured has dropped again. more americans have health insurance. yea. or, this must be stopped. depending on your political persuasion. in the house of representatives last week, republicans voted for the 41st time to defund health reform. 41 times. since they have been in charge, take 41 times divide by 2 1/2 years, carry the three. that means they repeal obamacare more than once a month. wow, well done, you guys. how is that working out for you? now for good measure. house republicans are gearing up for lucky 42. the 42nd time they think will be the charm. this time it will be different. maybe this time it will be different. because this time, even republicans are starting to ridicule each other about this thing they keep doing. even the rather paleolithic, super right-wing conservative page of "the wall street journal" has joined the chorus of hecklers, heckling the

republicans. >> here they go again. they describe the shut down plan as the a campaign that captured the imagination of conservatives this summer. their demand is that the house must pair the must pass bill to fund the government with defunding obamacare. they say, we have often supported backbenchers who want to push gop leaders in a better policy direction most recently on the farm bill. when the editorial page of "the wall street journal" is calling you out for reckless right-wing

radicalism. it is probably a soon to leave your keys at the bar and get a cab ride home. who knows if house republicans are going to sober up before government funding actually does run out on october 1st. we could be heading for a self-created stay tuned to msnbc, we will be live all night crisis. closing time is coming. the end of this month. they have to sort this thing out. the clock is tick. watch this space. now time for "the last word" with lawrence o'donnell. thank you for joining us tonight. >> the conservative editors of "the wall street journal" are now just absolutely terrified by john boehner and eric cantur. >> we can't blink in the face of adversity. >> we are for freedom. >> god bless the tea party. [ cheers and applause ] >> tea party people are tearing this place apart. >> you guessed it. a manufactured republican